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If the inverter has been gradually degrading then that would indicate it does have an issue. I was going to suggest switching off the solar charge controller when the battery is at full charge and then switching on the inverter and see if the problem occurs. I would suggest that if the inverter has been seeing voltage spikes and bms disconnects since it was installed then that could have damaged it. Even if you replace the inverter you would still need to ensure the bms disconnects do not continue which probably means setting the absorption voltage a bit lower say 56 volts or even down to 55.6.

Bob, my initial thought a few days ago was that the battery itself was probably not the problem. Usually it would be the inverter. Anyway, with my limited knowledge, I think your thought pattern about replacing the inverter with the all in one is an excellent idea. I would not try to fix or go into the inverter unless you want to do that just to learn, but the cost doesn’t make it worthwhile. Inverters like that are good, but only last limited time, it has met its stress limit. Aloha my friend.👍

Use a dvom to get the true voltage with a load

Does Power Queen has bluetooth that let you look at the Voltage of each cell?

My brother seriously it should have worked we literally have similar system and my Reliable cuts out at 57v. I would really love to see the measurement of each cell, that is why I went the DIY rote. If one cell isn't keeping up with the others you could have normal reading but when a load is put on it, it can't keep up. I would pop it open, why? Even a loose bolt can make a world of difference. Diy is the best it really allow you to monitor your system at the micro level plus the truth is I can't afford all them fancy equipments. Go ahead try the all in one and see what happens, it would allow you to see whether it is the battery or the inverter.

Not sure but maybe the battery is 15S and not the usual 16S and the absorb voltage is too high and you are getting a BMS over voltage disconnect.

I'm having a similar situation with a 12 Volt 1000 watt Xantrex ProSine Inverter. I think we are triggering the BMS overload shutdown and the voltage is spiking as the CC cant clamp down as fast as the BMS. This momentary spike is triggering higher than the Inverters can handle. Boosting at 14.4 Volts for 100 minutes ( It overloads the inverter about 30 mins- 1 hour in) I never see the voltage on my battery monitor go over 14.6 Volts but the Xantrex is rated for 16 Volts. The MT50 showed a spike to as high as 32 Volts!!!

Could it be that there is an imbalance so that one cell exceeds the maximum and the BMS disconnects the entire battery? if you can remove the cover and measure the cells separately with a multimeter because you cannot read the volts on the cells via the BMS? it is enough that one or some cells are too high voltage so that the protection kicks in while others are still in the flat phase. Then you can set how fast it should charge to about 5-10 Amps so that it doesn't give full charge all day when it's enough that it's full when the sun goes down

Inverter is almost certainly toast. if the battery charges to 58v it should be fully balanced unless the BMS is faulty, which is very unlikely.

The battery is not absorbing any current during the absorption phase because it has opened the charge relay. It is effectively inactive if it uses a passive balancer that only operates during charging. It's unlikely that it has an active balancer. It would help if you operated the battery according to Power Queen’s specifications, which are 54V ± 0.75V. This is the optimal range for when the charger turns off. There’s no need to push the battery to a point where the cell overvoltage protection activates.

I can say that no name breaker was disconnecting due to heat on the inside. They do not always trip the switch. I do not trust them. Blue sea is the way to go with those type. I think the fuses work as designed.

You should send the inverter in to have it examined.

Thanks for the video, have the older Epever 40a without the Lithium settings included, I have a 24v flooded setup with this same controller, the batteries are near the end of their life, will be buying 2x 12v lithium batteries that are suitable for series connection, can anyone tell me if you simply doubling the charge parameters for 24v, there is very little online about setting up the older controllers for 24v lithium. Can I ask why people setup these chargers for 12v when doing so halves the total Watts you can supply the charger from the panels, if this setup had 24v battery you would only need one controller as it would be able to use the wattage and voltage from all the panels you now have and 24v systems transfer the current from the charge controller far more efficiently.

The 24V system is perfect. The "max battery voltage" summary 28.41, 28.41, 28.41, perfect. That's what we want to see for the 48V system too, but we aren't. Looking at 26:25 into the video, that graph seems to indicate that the BMS has disconnected the battery through that whole period pretty much. The Victron is holding the voltage and then attempting to power the loads but it can't track the loads (charge controllers aren't power supplies, they can't track loads closely). I think the BMS is disconnecting somewhere around 55.1V but its hard to tell from that graph. You have to catch it while its charging (before the battery becomes full)... just as it hits the charge target for the first time each day. You can then zoom in the graph and see what voltage the battery was at just before it disconnected and kicked straight up to 56.8V. I found the guide on Power Queen's site. Lets see if youtube lets me post the url. I'll do it without the prefix. "ipowerqueen.com/blogs/blog/how-to-charge-lifepo4-batteries". The chart on that page is very clear. For 51.2V battery series, the best charge voltage target is 57.6V and the charge voltage range is 56.8V to 58.4V. Now note, THEY ARE WRONG! The best charge voltage is 56.8V, not 57.6V. 57.6V is 3.60V/cell which is unnecessary and the BMS disconnect is at the top-end of that scale (when the cells are in balance). 58.4V is 3.65V/cell and that is where the BMS would normally disconnect if the battery is fully balanced. But it is best to use 56.8V as the charge target because you don't want the BMS to disconnect and create inverter problems. So I'm still at "why is the powerqueen not balancing?". -Matt

Good Evening ! I'm catchin up on these older Vids whenever they come into the feed. TAKE CARE..

I think the inverter is toast. I’ve had similar issues with inverters where they start operating oddly aloha.

I am curious to see what you find out with this problem. Sounds like inverter to me..

Not to nit-pick, but is this really considered "balancing" or is it "calibrating"? Balancing is typically used as a term for balancing raw cells. Like I said, nit-pick.

This is super cool and thank you for sharing I'm just getting into the victron ecosystem and getting away from Schneider Electric

1) VE smart Controller is functioning perfectly. The sudden voltage indication tells us this: The Power Inverter has an internal failure; likely in the Power Supply circuit. Can you fix it? No! The circuit board is heavily populated with electronic components which require experience to troubleshoot because of difficulties isolating circuits. Probably - most likely the original fault occurred in one single capacitor located in the DC Power supply voltage regulation circuit. Now, stray voltage is finding the path of least resistance amongst the heavily populated board. That said don't waste the time and energy trying to repair it because the easiest most effective path is to substitute a known good. However, these types of Power Inverters do not usually have multiple separate boards so the user needs to replace the entire Power Inverter. Disassembly of it is relatively simple using basic hand tools. You must remove all power and wait ten minutes. Once you remove the case: Locate the the DC in circuit. Follow it closely with the eye and nose; your looking for three easily identifiable observations 1) Smell for fresh oil and or burnt smell. Often, fish oil is used. 2.) Look and feel for the thin clear oil closely. 3) Look for Carbon Tracking between the circuits/traces on the board. 4) Remove oil by wiping the board down with alcohol and paper towels. Remove all carbon tracks using a rubber pencil eraser. Replace the leaking capacitor. Hopefully the stray voltage didn't damage any diodes. The diodes and capacitors are easy to test if you are capable of removing components and soldering. 😊

Do you have a 48v charger that could provide a constant voltage to charge the battery for 24 hours to ensure it balances the cells? I'm guessing the battery doesn't have a communication port to connect a pc and view each cell voltage.

Still betting on inverter problem. Cnswipower makes great inverters.

Invaluable information. This is a tough one. The BMS is definitely disconnecting on the charge controller and the charger controller is over-volting for a second or two when that happens, then trying to follow the load while the BMS is disconnected and over-volting repeatedly while the BMS is disconnect while there is a load. So now the question is... at what point does the BMS disconnect? To determine that you have to look at the graph again but with a 30 minutes or 1 hour time frame rather than over a few days. i.e. so you can see the actual charge curve at the end, spread out in time. (and you have to do it within an hour or two of the event to get high resolution data). If you view the high resolution data each day with just 30 minutes or 1 hour resolution, and take a photo of it, we can determine if the battery is making progress or not on the balancing but more importantly we can determine exactly at what voltage the BMS is disconnecting during charging. The charge curve will look normal up until that point, going exponential near the end of the charge, but then going literally straight up when the BMS disconnects. Lets see where the BMS is disconnecting each day. In high resolution. My feeling is... I'm still not sure whether this battery is 15s or 16s but I think it must be 16s because it settles at roughly 53.0 - 53.3V or so after sundown when there's a load on it, which is precisely the voltage range where I'd expect it to be for a 16s pack. So perhaps one cell in the pack is just badly out of balance. -- When the BMS is connected and operating normally, and the battery is balanced, the last part of the charge curve just before the charge target is hit should see roughly 0.01V to 0.02V per second of rising voltage. 10 seconds to rise 0.1V to 0.2V, roughly. Assuming a 0.2C charge rate. This is why clouds going in and out or changes in the load just shouldn't be causing the voltage to rise all the way from 56.8V to 58.0V+. It should only be able to cause that to happen if the BMS disconnects prior to the charge target being reached. If the BMS is working properly, going from 56.8V to 58.0V would take about 2 minutes at a 0.2C charge rate. The charge controller should be able to react far more quickly than 2 minutes... the charge controller should be able to react within 10 seconds. -Matt

I do not see a HV spike that would trip inverter until you switch it on, Then it does some weird spikes when inverter acts up then shuts off. Starting to look more like a inverter problem , just swap inverters. if same problem than you know battery. without measuring each cell ,it is hard to say if it is a balance problem.

Would a Ground Help the Inverter any ?

I'm new so sorry if this is a dumb question. But doesn't power queens bms supposed to properly balance the cells? I know from reading if you run in series and the batteries don't have communications back and forth, but I thought one battery was a no issue with balancing.

This may be a silly suggestion. Try turning the Victron controller off. Then power the inverter on with only the battery. It would be interesting to see what happens. May be the Victron causing the voltage spike that is shutting the inverter down. Process of elimination as you will 🤙🏻

Maybe the victron is doing the over-volting? 61 v spike could trigger the inverter protection. Do you have another 48v charge controller to test with? Lower charge voltages and see if the inverter over volts. There are potentiometers in there for dc and ac voltage adjustments. They usually blob hot glue or silicone on them to keep them from moving.

is that from victron smart shunt ?

Great video

I'm dealing with a very similar situation. I have two 40 amp Tracer EP Ever CC feeding a 200 amp Ampere Time 12 Volt battery. I was Boosting at 14.2V for 100 minutes and Floating at 13.8V no issues. Then I decided to do a monthly BMS balance by changing Boost to 14.4V for 120 minutes. I came back to the system and the Xantrex ProSine Inverter was flashing green Voltage Overload and not powering the fridge. I checked the MT50s daily Battery range and it was 32 Volts peak and 12 Volts Low. I figured the BMS had triggered, rebooted the Xantrex and carried on. Now I've had the same thing happen when in Boost 14.2V for 100 minutes. I was sitting and watching it when it did it and it was a momentary surge to around 28 Volts. MT50 shows similar 28 Volt peak 12 Volt Bottom. The next day I changed Boost to 14.1V and 90 minutes. Wasn't very sunny and haven't had it happen in the last few days. I suspect it happened the second time at 14.2 Volt Boost because the battery was already really charged up from the 14.4 Volt Boost day. Now I'm thinking adjust it to 14.2 Volts 100 minute Boost when not soo sunny and 14.1 Volts 90 or 100 minutes when lots of sun... Kind of a pain in the ass to be physically changing the Boost settings on both CC all the time. The battery and systems only been in play since April. The battery did sit unopened for 20 months before I started using it

you got me looking at my Victron app history 😂

I have been on the fence about getting these batteries, but the reviews seem good, and Will Prowse says they are good. They are on sale. I can get 3 280ah chins for $1187.00 I don't think I can pass that up

You funny cats ok 😅 changing my breakers 50 amps main breakers .only using 1200 watts 12 volts system .. keep my 100 amps breakers for back up in case. Crazy .. I don’t want van go up in flames

🌴 Lemonade Aloha 🤙

Hi and how are you doing. I had a couple of those reliable inverters and they didn't last, overtime they just stop working and what alway happen is the voltage regulator malfunction are the power mosfets gives out so I just got rid of them. Well as you said it server you for couple of years.

So who is the winner? Which brand to choose? Thanks.

I’m still unclear why you’re not using the rated charge voltage of 54V for that battery. My 48V batteries reach 98% SOC at 54V, which should be sufficient. If you look at the specifications for large server rack batteries, such as the Pylontech US5000B, they have charge voltages between 52.5V and 53.5V. When the BMS stops charging, it indicates that one or more cells have exceeded 3.65V. An immediate charge disconnect could cause a voltage spike in the inverter.

Why don't you charge the battery until it switches off? And then unscrew the battery case cover and measure the individual cell voltages with a multimeter?

Man I like you found victron to be amazing. Between going to victron and away from lead acid to lithium my same panel setup is more than double it's previous power. I will keep my other controllers around if ever need as back up though.

Also can you hook up one of your regular batteries to your solar generator to expand your gas tank?

Why is your 800 wtt inverter larger than your 1600 wtt all in one solar generator?

check with @GoingOffGrid101 . He does alot of work with that brand.

I Like that You Refer back to Your Trusty 24 Volt System to Stay Running - I am Running 4 24 Volt Systems here @ Indian Creek Ranch of Southern California High Desert 🌴 💦 🌵 Aloha ⛩

With a few days of cycling under your belt you can look at the Victron "Trends" graph and see the voltage where there BMS disconnects up (because it won't look like a normal charging curve, the voltage will more or less shoot straight up and then oscillate around the charge target). Unfortunately Victron only keeps a few hours of high-resolution data, but you can still get an idea about its balancing progress. The voltage it gets to before it suddenly shoots up should (theoretically) get better and better each day when it is making progress balancing, until eventually it stops shooting up vertically at the end and just looks like the normal exponential ramp. An oscilloscope is really needed to see the BMS disconnect because the whole thing happens in about half a second... the voltage overshooting and then returning to the charge target. That process is less than a second. But will keep happening if there is an inverter load. Volt meters and the Victron monitoring display average the voltage over a second or two and can't catch it completely. Another way is to look at the "History" tab of the Victron charge controller. It shows the "max" battery voltage each day. In a properly working system that fills up to 100% that voltage will be precisely the charge target. In a system where the BMS disconnects, that voltage will be significantly higher and also vary a lot each day because of the averaging it does. In your video at 7:59 we can (barely) see the Battery "max" and it does seem to be bouncing around a lot. Though that might also be due to you changing settings. -Matt

Your batteries are full. Why are you still messing with them? If it ain’t broke don’t fix them!

I love victron

Bob , i can almost guarantee this is an internal cell balancing issue, and has nothing to do with your inverter. Best way to solve this ( and this will take a while, since the BMS only has a 200mv passive balancer that only works when charging). 1. Disable tail current 2 set charge voltage to 56 and set absorb to minimum of 5 hours If the BMS doesn't shutdown, change charge voltage to 56.8 and again absorb for 5 hours, if BMS does shutdown, discharge about 30 amps and repeat step 2 untill it doesn't shutdown anymore

If it doesn't work, why not build another 48v bank with the previous 4 batteries you had with the balancer on and try and isolate the problem to the battery, charge controller or inverter?