Just use stock Sniper Rifle and Jarate. Not only will you train yourself to get better at headshots, but Jarate is more efficient at coating enemies in piss.
OMG IS DAT A WATER GUN?! MAN UR INSANE!! Business Dummy: THAT‘S MORE TO IT!! HAH. LEMME GUESS. YOU FILLED IT WITH PISS! *Silence…* WAIT YOU DID FILL IT WITH PISS?! "Meet the sniper"
The Loch'n'Load is absolutely not a bad weapon, it's really good to the point that it's widely used in 6s by competitive players. The extra projectile speed doesn't just make shots easier to hit and harder to dodge, you can also hit shots MUCH further away. Given how direct pipes have no fall-off, it's often worth giving up rollers for this reason.
That's definitionally a crutch. You give up a quarter of your clip for pills that are easier to hit. Crutch is literally defined as a video as a weapon that's trades raw ability for being easier to use.
Yeah, SpaceGuy definitely doesn't seem the type to have actually used the weapon. There's a large community of comp players who want it banned for being too OP, and anyone who's used it in casual for more than just to get footage will have realized how an increase of range on Demoman can completely change how you play, and even allow for a more agressive playstyle
@@simonnachreiner8380 They didn't say easier to hit, they said more consistent. The other launchers fire pills with random tumble, which messes with their trajectory. This makes the Loch immune to the RNG that can fuck over other grenade launchers, on top of pills having much better range.
it lets you finally duel scouts, demo's hardest class to fight, in like max flame thrower range where scouts like to hang out and shoot, good scouts who usually see the slow pipes and just dodge move away, won't be able to dodge the LnL
A crutch weapon is always a weapon that takes less skill to use than its contemporaries, whether its good or bad. A bad weapon being a crutch is easier to identify, ie. the Liberty Launcher, which is easier to use at the cost of being worse than Stock. A good weapon being a crutch treads the fine line of "using it because you lack skill" and "using it because its a good weapon", which on paper sounds hard to define, but in practice its weapons like the Escape Plan, Vaccinator, Scorch Shot and Short Circuit that are very easy to use (yes even the Vacc. You can press R it's not hard) and are top tier weapons.
darwins danger shield is probably the biggest crutch weapon for sniper like totally the long range class needs a "screw you" item against the close range class
Yet it helps most against long range projectile spam(scorch/detonator typically). If you get caught up close with a pyro you're done for in any case, but not having to run for healthpack every 5 seconds is great
It's not a crutch, it's just dumb weapon design. If the enemy team has a pyro or 2 that keep spamming scorch shot flares/det flares at you the danger shield can help good snipers stay in the fight longer.
Big fan of the definition you give for a crutch, i feel like i always see people using it to describe weapons that are just too powerful, when obviously thats not how crutches work, they only help if you can’t walk (or aren’t good enough) otherwise they just slow you down.
The loch being forevel labeled as demo crutch weapon is so annoying to me because the iron bomber used to be objectively easier to use back when the projectiles hitboxes were larger than stock yet that weapon received no pushback from the community until years later, while the loch was dragged through the mud by dumbass Soundsmith fans.
That’s what I didn’t like about some weapon stereotypes videos, he says it’s meant to be satirical which worked for the cosmetics, but with weapons it’s hard to tell if I’m supposed to take it as a joke and not a subjective opinion, it’s why I didn’t like the black box or lock n load stereotypes
it's a weapon that allows the class that benefits the most from passive play (well, aside from engineer) to play even more passively, so it's very good
Calling the L&L a crutch is like calling the Direct Hit a crutch or maybe I’m coping because it’s my go to demo primary it’s fried my muscle memory so much.
Just a wee bit. You forfeit rollers and an extra pill for pills that are easier to hit and an extremely niche bonus against buildings. If the building bonus wasn't so niche you would be correct. The direct hit on the other hand trades the reliability of splash damage (which is a lot more reliable than roller damage) for the ability to one shot light classes if you score the harder to land direct hits.
He never even called it a crutch he talks about how other people say its a crutch and simply points out how no rollers proves it isn't a crutch but just a bad weapon overall
@@haydenhaslip2024actually, the only time I’ve ever heard of it being a crutch was from soundsmith stereotype series where he calls it a crutch in a voice where you can’t tell if he’s joking or not
I tend to devide weapons in two categories : Win more and ensurances , Win more weapons (bazar bargain , kunai , bf blaster, direct hit , phlog ,diamondback , brass beast, the ubersaw) allow you to push in winning situations even further : A bazar bargain sniper thatbis winning would be doing similarly with the stock , same for the brass beast , it just magnifies the skill gap and thebdifficulty in recovering ... Now ensurances : they will instead allow a player to achive a winning situation better (the shortstop , the solem vow , the tomislav , the rocket jumper , l'etrange , the spycicle , the cozy camper ecc. Ecc.) If you did't have that weapon your abilities to achive a winning position would get hampered and you'd be in trouble , in exchange for this you get worse habities to press on a winning situation ... Classifying the kunai and the spycicle with the same term class is ridiculus , A bad spy with the spycicle has some possibilities , of escaping a pyro , A bad spy with the kunai is fucked ... Now take a skilled spy and the roles are reversed : The kunai spy will become almost immortal , While the spycicle will hamper it a lot and force it to play gun spy ...
Blackbox + Conch + Escape plan is definitely a crutch. I equipped that loadout and after getting used to it I topscored in the casual lobby despite hardly ever playing soldier. I'm gonna keep using it though lmao.
I wouldn't call it a crutch as it's more of a synergy, these weapons are good when used together. You still have to hit your shots to get the health and need to deal damage to get the conch buff.
Spycicle user here, the spycicle is not a crutch in the slightest as the spycicles ability actually does require a good amount of skill to escape pyros in certain situations that newer spy’s won’t get the use out of there. And spycicle will save your life far more often than it screwing you out of a stab. To me I see the spycicle more as a straight upgrade to stock, as it allows you so much more escapes from pyros for little downsides.
partially agree. while i wouldn't call the spycicle a direct upgrade, you can certainly benefit from the upsides often if you know how and when to use it. and if there aren't any pyros on the other team, then it's essentially just a stock reskin.
True, spycicle can save your life and it doesn't matter if you can't backstab after it did. Because the fact you got burned mean you either got unlicky or was out of position: both meaning you didn't had the opportunity to do the backstab in the first place. Spycicle is an upgrade, but personnally i prefer not leaving a statue behind unless i wan't to "troll" the other team. Because it can make them more aware of yur presence which make it even worse for noobs too, so definitly not a crutch.
In addition, the spycicle teaches a good habit of having your gun out most of the time. This is because, it there may be situations where saving your knife and going to a nearby health pack to remove the flames is better. Having your gun out let's you control the extinguishing to when it's the most advantageous. It also means... Having your gun out. To shoot things. There are a surprising amount of times where having your gun out immediately can turn the tides in a fight in the short timespan it takes to switch to it from melee.
I mean, to many people, that's kinda why the Spycicle is considered a crutch. It's good in the hands of less skilled Spys, but useless to better Spys. It's basically training wheels for Revolver aim, which is fine on it's own, I used it early on myself; and it does help. But as you get better at Spy, the Spycicle begins to show it's weakness... since it develops bad habits in early Spys. Newer Spys struggle to get Stabs and deal with Pyros anyway. So losing the ability to stab for a few seconds, in exchange for the ability to brute force their way past Pyros is an easy out that allows them to bypass the skill development of positioning, planning and learning how to deal with a Pyro properly. Sure, it does teach you to use your gun more often as Spy, but this is something most Spys learn fairly quickly, if they don't jump to the "I'm gonna do trickstabs to be cool' mindset. Spy's Revolver is strong, but you don't need the Spycicle to make it strong. The Spycicle in general is a direct downgrade from the other options as you get better at Spy. Better positioning means the Kunai, Big Earner or YER will reward you more in the long run. And while Pyros can be a problem... but at least if you get set on fire using other knives, you can still go for a Stab as intended; and heck, if using the Kunai or Big Earner, that can save you from Pyros more than the Spycicle can; since now you got a kill, and got out with your life instead of just escaping to try again later.
I’d argue that the dead ringer definitely falls into the crutch category. Having an instant right click bail out to run to a health pack and try again seems pretty crutch indicative. I think experienced players would more benefit from the versatility and on-demand cloak from stock. Kunai is just borderline OP imo. Becoming a spy with the health of a soldier because one teammate got caught with their pants down essentially invalidates the upside of every other knife unlock. Meanwhile the downside is basically a nothing burger because whether you have 70 or 125 health, a caught out spy is almost always a dead spy. But I’m a heavy main so take my opinions with the appropriate amount of salt.
Loch-n-load is not a crutch. This take is _really outdated._ The projectile speed increase (as well as the fixed arch) allows Demo to deal 300 damage from _much_ more passive positions. Hell, even the comp scene has been arguing about it being too powerful because it lets Demo snipe people from mid-long range reliably while still having the Stickybomb launcher equipped. It is a sidegrade through and through.
@@rbfilms4752 I think the loss of rollers with an extremely minor upside makes it a bad weapon to use yea, seeing how you rarely see people use it too I think that's a fair common consensus
@@SpaceGuyOnline But that's my point: the upside isn't minor at all. Up close it helps against Scouts, which are Demo's most notoriously difficult match-up, and at a range it's the most dangerous launcher for anyone not paying attention to the Demo. For better reference this video basically says everything about the weapon in a more concise way: ua-cam.com/video/mCQL8zPysnc/v-deo.htmlsi=9BrTNw3qnjgbnUGd
Liberty Launcher lover here, The liberty launcher is great for what i like to call hybrid eagle scout, where you treat your shotgun like your primary weapon, and your rocket launcher as a mobility/backup weapon. The liberty launcher is great here, since it works like a mini gunboats compared to stock, while still allowing you to finish people off with your rockets if need be. It's personally my favourite way to play soldier and allows you to be an absolute menace of a pick class. Oh the enemy medic is spychecking and staying out of sniper sightlines? Hope they are prepared for 150 lbs of pure patriotism barreling towards them at mach 2 with the sole purpose of showing that surly german what a real blitzkrieg is.
As a fellow Liberty Launcher enthusiast, I agree! It's definitely a launcher more suited to being paired with a shotgun, especially the Reserve Shooter! I'd be hard pressed to call it a crutch, I see it as a combo tool that helps teach Soldiers not to primarily rely on their rockets to get the job done.
I feel I found my people, I also like this playstyle a lot, however I still treat it as a primary to soften enemies and deal decent damage and then finish off enemies with the shotgun, it's like some sort of combo soldier :)
Why I use the Black Box: 1: It fits the ascetic with the Battalion's Backup and are great when paired together 2: It's one of the cooler looking rocket launchers 3: I don't use stock or the original since they are seen as tryhard launchers 4: It has an australium 5: It fits my play style
Came to comment about the loch n load but glad to see everyone already has it covered. Good to see that the incredibly hard watch, 'Fixing TF2's weapons' type video is taking off!
Finally a video that explains the meaning of the word "Crutch" ❤ they carry you despite your lack of skills, like a medical crutch Although I personally don't think every single weapon should be for ultraskilled players only, it's fine imho to have more noob friendly tools that give less pros and less cons
I would 100% say the kunai is a crutch, even without the dead ringer, it completely negates the entire play style of spy as long as you can get those first 1-2 backstabs, once you’ve got the 210 overheal, you don’t gotta worry about being stealthy or strategic or anything like that, instead it rewards the player for running around like an idiot, tanking damage and getting cheese trickstabs, the dead ringer only exacerbates it
7k hour 12 year competitive Soldier main here - Black Box is literally better than stock in pubs, calling it a crutch is such lazy analysis... according to you good players won't benefit from gaining 60 HP with every clip? what?
I used to use the black box and tomislav religiously until I noticed their weakness, for tomi you will take down lvl 3 sentries much slower and brass beast absolutely fucks you over. For black box that last rocket can be make or break from a kill and you deal even less damage from one rocket jump.
There are no crutch weapons in tf2. Its a blanket term for weapons people dont like seeing other people use There are general use weapons and situational use weapons Any weapon perceived as a crutch only betrays the views of the person claiming it as such The scorch shot isnt a crutch. It just does too much for it's role The liberty launcher isnt a crutch. Its just too weak for its role If a weapon or loadout is called a crutch by someone, they are actually saying they think it's too good or bad for what they think it's supposed to do
"There are no crutch weapons in tf2. Its a blanket term for weapons people dont like seeing other people use" completely agree. I don't think the scorch shot is overpowered but it's not a crutch.
I think you're the first person I ever saw to not label the Scorch Shot as a crutch. As an old Pyro main, I appreciate it. It's an excellent crowd control tool at range, and it's at it's best when you use it for a 2 hit ranged effect. Honestly I found it really good for 2 main scenarios. 1: when there's a push with a tight group of enemies. The scorch shot's AOE is a good way to chip away at them while the heavier classes bring the pain. 2: When you have an opponent who is good at keeping their distance from your flamethrower , while still hitting you. Snipers are a good target because they can't aim properly when on fire, but a really good scout is where I find the most use because they are very skilled at keeping out of your ideal range, while still keeping their damage output up. Those are usually the players that scream the loudest about the weapon as well, at least in my experience.
When looking at a weapon as a crutch it's always important to ask "for what" what role does it make easier that's done better by another weapon with a higher potential and skill floor. You can argue that it's competing with the flaregun but the scorch shot sits in an entirely different nitch with some overlap. Aoe harassment. While the flaregun is pure burst damage
...until you realize that it does the same things as the detonator, just less effectively and more easily, making it a crutch by definition. Want to burn groups of players at chokes? Detonator can do that better if you can time your shots. Want to disable snipers? Same thing. Want to jump with flares? Scorch shot doesn't launch you as far but you don't have to budget your health as carefully. Want to flare punch? Scorch shot lets you get lazy and shoot the floor but deals much less damage than the flare gun.
@@nickenchugger The Scorch Shot is way different from the Detonator. You trade mobility for damage and consistency for speed. It has advantages, like not having to wait for the detonation before being able to switch weapons or being able push enemies away even with flame throwers that have no or an expensive airblast, and its disadvantages are that it's harder to hit airborne targets and targets behind cover. SS is active, Det is passive. Detonator timing isn't hard. And before you start flare punching with the SS you should probably just use the shotgun. Plus, with the Dragon's Fury you can deliver an instant kill combo to light classes which is a lot of fun.
@@Eimlin I've yet to get the feel for the Dragon, and I find giving up a normal Flamethrower too big and ask. As for the Det, I never found the Detonator to be all that useful, if I'm being honest.A lot of people would argue they'rre the same, as a few of you are, and I would argue that they aren't. Detonator gets one burst and a mediocre damage, and the SS gets a double tap with a surprising amount of damage if you can hit with both parts. The SS rewards accuracy, the Det rewards timing. They play very differently.
90% of the weapons that have a reputation for being a "crutch", got that rep _years_ ago when the weapon was much more powerful than they are now. This holds true for the most of the weapons listed here, and are all somewhere between hot garbage and situational nowadays. The Black Box is not good anymore and I almost never use it despite having a strange one. Spycicle and DR only get used on my gunspy load out, and I have never liked using the Kunai with the DR (and I have 1600 hours with spy). The Liberty Launcher is only good for trollier (so you can have something for sentries). And the Gas Passer is just garbage, still even with the recent buff, it is literal hot garbage. Weapons that are absolutely NOT a crutch include: The Sydney Sleeper is fantastic for staying hidden as a sniper because your teammates get the kill and thus there is never a killcam on your position. I have some cheeky hiding spots I abuse over and over with it. I've had it work so well the whole enemy team has walked right past me. As long as your ego can handle not getting the kill credit, then it is a great team support weapon. Along those lines fully charged Machina is great for getting shots _through_ your own teammates, who inevitably will jump in the way in crowded spaces. And yes, I can consistently hit headshots, neither is a crutch for me at all. I use stock rifle about 80% of the time. In all three cases, charging up to get full charge body shots is effectively the same. The Scorch Shot is like a utility hybrid between the Flare and the Detonator. You still have to hit directs to get it's best effect (the pop up), and it's area of effect is similar to the Detonator, but smaller and you have less control with it since you can't detonate it over cover. It is annoying yes, but so is the Detonator honestly. And overall, the Flare is still the better option for damage, but you lose the utility of the other two. It's the perfect example of a side grade. People that say the Kunai is a crutch must not use it much (I do, 50K on my strange one). Because the amount of times I've come around a corner and died to a wayward pipe or rocket is infuriating enough to make me want to scrap it some days. It is NOT a good weapon for new spies, just the opposite. The 200hps on a stab only nets you an extra hit from a rocket/pill, and doesn't save you from getting juggled. It's not as over powered as some like to claim. And the DR hasn't been good in around ten years. Ridding yourself of an obnoxious DR spy is as easy as going scout and equipping the milk. The only ones listed that I'd consider current crutches are the Phlog and the Razorback. And the Razorback is the only one I think needs to be removed or reworked. It's basically garbage, but I've had a snipers, completely unaware of me, back up into my stabs meant for other people (usually medics or other actually good snipers). Again, this death to random bullshit is infuriating. The big ones you left out at the Diamondback and the Frontier Justice. I want to curb stomp the creators of those two. They are both no risk, all reward weapons. So you might say they are less a crutch and more just plain broken.
I have two things to say. 1. All snipers can hit through teammates, the Machina just has a special kill icon and 2. The Frontier Justice does have risk, as you only get the crits once your biggest line of defense, your sentry, has died. I agree with you on the Diamondback though
@@dadjokesinc.2657 And the time your sentry gets destroyed is precisely the time when you'll be needing those crits most. It is bit busted though, considering the fact you can destroy your sentry and rebuild it during downtime, with virtually no risk included
@@tappajaavhowever, without crits it's a direct downgrade from stock, and even with them your still a light class with no special movement options other than some jank from the Short circuit
The loch-n-load is insane when you are using stock stickies Going from 12 damaging projectiles to 11 is not that big of a deal. The loss of rollers isnt a big deal either, most missed pipes with the stock arent going to deal any damage anyway. And in return you get range and more importantly consistency. Demos main weakness is how inconsistent his damage is and the loch-n-load helps with that. If there is a scout in your face having 1 extra pipe you can miss isnt really gonna help you, hell you might not even get to the bottom of the clip. But with the loch-n-load you have fighting chance.
5:55 as a Med player it's annoying when I pass by a Sniper, decide to give him some nice overheal him to help him out in any Sniper v Sniper fights that might happen in the next 30 seconds, and then it turns out he has the Razorback and that interaction was pointless
Not pointless it's a free Uber farm. If you aren't rolling the quickfix healing anyone with 142% health or just under full overheal halves your Uber charge rate. Scouts literally beat their faces in for this exact purpose.
Man the lock n load is not a bad weapon at least for stock demo. Hybrid knight and sticky jumper demo and obv full demoknight benefit from it very little but when used with the stock stickybomb launcher it’s one of if not the best option. You gotta understand that sticky’s are demos primary not grenades so giving up a pipe is way less impactful you’re not giving up 1/4 of your damage you’re giving up 1/12 of your total explosives in return for making the pipes more useful at the ranges where sticky’s are less useful. Also people pretend like the speed doesn’t matter when it really does like no shot with grenades is guaranteed it’s not a sniper rifle and when you’re up against a cracked scout loch can let you hit them when you might’ve missed with stock or the bomber
I agree with he liberty launcher to a point but it can actually be used in higher play to do a sort of combo soldier where you mix in shotgun blasts with the rocks and get some insane dps. It makes soldier less power and more picky than usual but he still has the means to deal with things like sentries.
One thing to note: The spycicle is arguably one of spy's weapons when specifically run with the revolver or amby and deadringer. It's a staple of true gunspy. Gives spy a little extra defense against pyros when dueling them and that extra second can be all it takes to line up an amby headshot.
The Loch n Load, a bad weapon?! You're crazy man. That projectile speed bonus is absolutely incredible for sniping people and they make your shots at close to mid range unreactable, making them practically impossible to dodge. Granted the loss of rollers are a fairly debilitating downside, but it's well worth for that proj speed bonus. There's also that damage bonus against buildings I guess, but pipes are already great at buildings, with the exception of the Loose Cannon and Iron Bomber.
The nice thing about the sleeper is that it still minis on heads, so at least the transition away from it once you actually have the skill is much easier than something like the liberty launcher
I think one worth mentioning is the Scorsman's Skullcutter, specifically in medieval mode. In base game its just the funny "-234" sword, but in Midieval mode where EVERYONE is forced to go into melee range to fight you, relying on random crits instead of playing demon smart is just a crutch.
Natasha is a crutch. Makes it easier to hit the players you’re hitting by slowing them down, but the damage penalty and slower spin-up hamper Heavies who would be happier without it.
The Sydney sleeper is a fine weapon. I don’t know why it gets lumped in as a shit weapon. No it’s good. It charges quick so you can pump out tons of damage. The jarate effect is useful, assuming you’re hitting actually important targets with it. The loch and load is ALSO a good weapon. It’s fast. It’s accurate. That’s it. Rollers are unreliable so depending on them isn’t a good idea. 1v1 fights with 3 fast pipes is really all you need.
@@Small_child_punter It's because every other Sniper Rifle with the exception of the Classic doesn't need to charge at all to pump out damage. The other problem is the duration of Jarate on hit being related to charge duration, at least make headshot hits apply the full 5 seconds promoting hitting headshots with no charge rather than waiting It out
@@SpaceGuyOnline most snipers aren’t consistent head shooters and perform better when the demand for headshots is removed. If you’re an efficient head shooter, the sleeper won’t outdo stock or the bargain. Im willing to wager the dps of the sleeper would greater outdo any other rifle on a bad-decent sniper, but not great snipers. The issue is a lot of people don’t pour much time into getting great at the sleeper. It becomes VERY annoying once you do. I feel like I remember people complaining a lot about it before this slight rework 5 years ago. Added a note on the loch and load if you wanna take a look at that.
@@Small_child_punter The point of less skilled Snipers preforming better with the Sydneh Sleeper while better, more skilled ones would suffer from using it sorta solidifies the Syndey being a crutch. I think it's an overall meh weapon, in the grander scheme of the entire game there's obviously worse ones but on Sniper specifically it falls flat on what it's trying to be and do. There's the obvious inverse argument of saying that other Sniper Rifles are just so much better which causes the Sydney to suck in comparison, mainly the Bazaar Bargan but eh. Loch N Load is in a similar boat, sure rollers are inconsistent but if you miss there's still a chance for damage potential that the Loch N Load just doesn't have. Both weapons are trying to promote or reward players with easier /harder things to do but don't push their benefits or bonuses enough to really bother using them over other weapons.
The gas passer actually got buffed in the last update. It now counts as being wet, meaning that Pyro can combo it with the neon annihilator to do a ton of damage. It also works for area denial since people will know that the gas means a pyro is nenarby and now likely has a means to hit you with a crit if you go through the cloud.
As someone who plays with ridiculous ping & lag, things like the black box are just great for me, allowing me to give medics wanting to pocket to other players who won't die from my lag issues. The lag prevents me from timing rocket jumps too so it's not like I'm concerned with giving up a rocket that could be used to get around the map. Sometimes you gotta compensate
from what i remember the crutch term for kunai originates from the original stats of the dead ringer allowing for a damage resist of what felt like 90% that lasted nearly instantly due to the player being able to refill the feign meter from ammo packs while cloaked so he always had a ringer ready, combined with the 200 hp from kunai stabs the spy was nearly unkillable
Black Box is a very curious case when you get to higher levels of play. I find that it’s useful when a medic is getting overwhelmed with heal demand; equipping the black box helps levitate the pressure for the medic to juggle less people for heals (this happens more often in pubs and even with experience medics). Additionally it helps make the soldier independent by either allowing the soldier to hold or slowly push flank (especially with a shotgun or the reserve shooter), or be a support focused banner soldier who doesn’t need to play so conservatively around health packs to get the banner benefits (except for the conch😅).
I would agree that the original implementation of the liberty launcher is a crutch, but I think post rework its not the case anymore. I stuck with it after it changed because I got so used to it before hand. I think it is a pretty slept on weapon, and its not nearly as bad as people think it is but instead has some niche but powerful use cases. For one, having an extra rocket when you are kritzkrieged is actually a huge buff even if it does 25% less. Besides that it really benefits a roaming playstyle, where you arent front lining and picking fights with other front line classes. It makes soldier really powerful at picking off the low HP backline classes as they can't outrun your rocket jumps and since you take less self damage you're usually at a safe HP when doing so. But when you run into another soldier with stock or a demoman, you basically just have to pray they are worse than you lol
sponsors are only a problem to me if its a scummy sponsor, and the way they integrate it into the video. i greatly appreciate youtubers who make the sponsor a dedicated chapter, making it super easy to skip even on mobile without sponsorblock. the only sponsors that actually piss me off are scam sponsors, the youtuber trying to be "clever" and making an "invisible segue into the sponsor" that just annoys the shit out of me, and to a certain extent the ones where the youtuber pretends that they loooove the sponsor sooo much and its the best thing since sliced bread. if its a sponsor of some inoffensive product and its made easy to skip and doesnt have some shitty cheesy segue, then im all for youtubers making money off of their great videos
but what if the sponsor is so they can make the video in the first place because they hire other people to do certain aspects of it they can't. like editing or animations. etc.?
Black Box is super when you're one of the only good players on your team, because you will be dealing damage while getting focus-fired, allowing you to tank more damage and take more enemies down before dying. This also gives you a higher random crit chance, which also if paired with banners, gives you more survivability or snowballing. To be honest, if you keep getting killed by a Conch Black Box Soldier, go pyro and airblast. If you still die, that soldier timed his rockets well and/or was smart enough to ambush you first. If he dies, your reaction time is incredible and you probably didn't even take damage in the process or/and healed yourself due to the Black Box rockets. Box + Conch has counters: mid-to-long range, airblast and overheal. In a Soldier vs. Soldier, the Black Box Conch soldier is going to be at a considerable advantage if you both start shooting at about the same time, because he will be able to survive a rocket (and sometimes even two) more. though I admit fighting black box + conch sucks to fight, because it makes it so easy to run away and survive, as well as rewarding getting random crits more.
The only weapons that are crutch in TF2 is Bazaar Bargain, Darwin’s and Razorback. Every other weapon is niche but not crutch as they don’t us single-handedly win matchups but rather have an augmented effect providing an alternative play style
I wouldn't say the liberty launcher is just a pure crutch. Yea an absolute newbie will get use out of the extra rocket and projectile speed but to be honest they would probably do better with stock. Imo experienced players can get more use out of the extra rocket and reduced jump damage. I personally use it a lot
fun fact the phlog is pyros BEST flamethrower in MvM a total crutch in everything else but if you factor mvm it falls in the same boat as the black box a crutch outside of one example
omg SpaceGuyOnline don't you know that the Neon Annihilator can now crit people soaked with the Gas Passer and that somehow makes both weapons good and totally not a gimmick?? how dare you!!11!
I don't know about other people but I actually liked the Loch 'n Load's old stats, the extra damage was more than made up for by the small clip size and lack of rollers, the only class it really penalized hard were scouts but they were always hard to hit and the Demoman had to have dead on aim to handle them. I liked its niche as a precision weapon that dealt more damage and was a bit more forgiving to aim with the speedier projectiles where unlike the other launchers you always had to be connecting your shots directly and couldn't rely on rollers and a large explosion radius to get extra damage with minimum effort, and the fact that it only had two in the clip made aim even more paramount since you couldn't fire with abandon compared to the four shots for the other launchers. It even did additional self damage to the user which made it more paramount you weren't firing wildly at close range since you are more likely to suicide. It feel like a reasonable risk vs reward dynamic, even though I usually main scout I never really found the weapon that frustrating since the Demoman had to give up a lot and be good at aiming to get those oneshots. The big changes over time have mostly just made the weapon less distinct and more boring, not to mention visually nonsensical (though I suppose that was already the case for the default launcher). Giving it an additional shot jars with the weapon's two barrel design and it just makes it stand out less since its now closer to the default launcher and gives you more padding for a missed shot, and in the meantime it doesn't even do more self damage. It mostly just makes the Demoman a bit more dangerous against engineer (something he already excels at), it feels like a weapon that doesn't really justify its existence anymore since its not distinct enough from default and if it was removed it wouldn't matter much.
I’d say the razorback’s intended purpose is purely for sniper duels since not being able to be backstabbed and not being able to have overheal make sniper duels fun
i haven't used it, but i feel like the spy-cicle is probably the direct opposite to a crutch weapon, with its downsides being a big detriment to any inexperienced player who wants to do a basic backstab playstyle. losing your knife will leave you with only the other stuff in your kit, and the big blue statues tell everyone nearby that you were here recently if you actually use it, which might not be the case with other knives. you'd get the most out of it by knowing how to use the rest of your kit as spy, so most of the time it's experenced players who will enjoy the niche benefits with fire immunity on the spy-cicle.
Used to play a lot of black box Soldier when I started playing tf2. Didn't realize I was using it as a cruthch till I started using the default loadout.
7:59 is just plain wrong. The scorch shots skill floor is so low but it’s still one of the most powerful weapons in the game even when using it wrong. It has the equivalent to no downsides as the little flair jump does less damage than the detonator while the damage penalty doesn’t mater because it can hit people twice, and with the minicrits it just straight up doesn’t work which means it’s just an annoying spam weapon you can use… without having to aim. Like a crutch.
Scorch shot is underpowered but the most annoying pyro secondary. Flare gun can just kill the person with the critical hit on hit after they're on fire instead remove some of their mobility, same with manmelter but depend if the enemy team have pyro or not instead enemy team on fire or not, Detonator can jump higher even though there is more damage taken which can lead to 1-2 extra kill with your primary. Scorch shot is just annoying with it's movement negation which other weapons have but scorch shot have damage fall-off based on distance between the projectile and the target on the explosion instead between the pyro and the target so it's risk free and annoying movement negation without any counterplay like shooting back to kill the pyro except if the enemy team equip long range weapons like sniper rifle or weapon that invalidate an entire class like Darwin's Danger shield. There is a reason why Valve buff it some years ago doesn't get backlash although i prefer rework to not do the knockback or have damage fall off (and maybe afterburn duration) between pyro and the target instead where the projectile land and the target so it remove the annoying aspect but not make it worse flaregun that is only worth using when combined with the phlog or in map that are infamous for spams encouraging strategy like dustbowl which is played often for some reason despite map design that encourage spam is recipe for worst gameplay that nobody enjoy.
I mean, didn't the definition at the start says a crutch is a weapon that also hinders experienced players? The scorch shot absolutely does not become a hinderance when you're good, and if anything becomes far better because of the pseudo-stun the knockback can provide, allowing for easy setups (e.g. with axtinguisher or dragon's fury)
It absolutely is a crutch since if you’re a serious pyro main who airblast and pull off combos a lot, the scorch shot won’t help at all as you’ll either get a lot better burst damage from the shotguns or stock flare gun or more mobilities from the det.
Surprised to see a lack of Darwins Danger Shield mentioned, when it gives the hard counter to the close range class, and definitive hard counter to the same close range class.
The liberty launcher is more of an "get in and get out" type of rocket launcher, you first bomb in and if your hp is low you blast out of battle, and more of a support tool for mobility then actual damage
I only use the Machina. It's pretty much just for how ostentatious it is. I like the sound it makes when you shoot and the sound it makes when you get a double kill. My brother who played way longer than I have said that he doesn't like it cause the tracer tells other snipers where you are, I said I like it cause it tells other snipers where I am.
i haven't played tf2 in a while (around 8 months) and came back to play because i heard bots are lowkey gone, so what a surprise it was that in my first ever match in 8 months i got called a "crotch box user" by a pyro after i managed to understand that he can deflect my rockets and i should use melee instead (because i was using the car battery thing), and then he changed to his shotgun to prevent me from using melee on him, which he misserably failed on doing since i got 2 melee hits on him, so after that i changed to my rocket launcher and got two splash damage hits on him, finishing him off before he even realised, and right now it's that part where i'm investigating what the hell does "crotch box user" mean in tf2 and judging by what i'm seeing, i think it's another gas passer in mvm type of insult made so sweats who have spent more time playing spy than taking care of themsels feel better after losing a match againts any player who hasn't done the same lifeless thing
One I'd like to mention that was called a clutch more before it's rework but I still hear called on occasionally today is the Vita Saw being a crutch for medics who can't stay alive. Before the rework, absolutely, I'd agree, but now, eh, kinda, but also no, it does require some skill to use, you can't just put it in your back pocket and let it help you passively, you actually have to try and get organs for it and while that can help, catching a stray spy or hitting a demoknight right before dying, I can't agree with it being a crutch as you need to be reliable with it and have some skill.
imo Engis crutches are shortcircuit on attack payload, and gunslinger. shortcircuit is broken when getting metal from the cart but is worse when thats not the case and when you would need a pistol instead. Gunslinger is easly a crutch because it helps with more Max HP and not needing metal managment or good positioning of your buildings but it holds you back if you could have a suprise sentry level 2 or 3 litterly anywhere. the only time where the gunslinger isn't a crutch if you use it with the widow maker and a pistol on maps where you don't have to (or can't) fall back to your level 3 or its impossible to set up.
Closest one id say is the panic attack, holsters faster and more pellets meaning more than likely to hit shots the 20% less damage never really affects the user.
My Scout balance changes. (Force-A-Nature) Fires 50% faster 20% more pellets per shot Right click to fire both barrels simultaneously, dealing two times more damage and doing 40% knockback to enemies and 40% self-knockback while airborne. Each individual shot does 20% knockback to enemies and 20% self-knockback while airborn. 65 damage at close range 30 damage at mid range 10 damage at long range Fires two shots (Shortstop) The shortstop is now a sidearm instead of a primary Fires bullets instead of pellets Fires 45% faster Right click to shove enemies away, causing 20% knockback and does no damage Mini-crits on headshot at close range 50 damage at close range 40 damage at mid range 20 damage at long range Fires four shots (Soda Popper) Each hit fills 10% your HYPE meter. Once fully charged, press the mouse wheel to activate HYPE, granting you 60% faster attack speed on all of your weapons, 40% faster reload speed, 30% faster weapon switching, 50% faster running speed, and it will only last 10 seconds. Right click to fire both barrels simultaneously, dealing two times more damage. 60 damage at close range 30 damage at mid range 10 damage at long range Fires two shots (Baby Face's Blaster) Fires 8 shots Running speed increases with each kill (just like the Eyelander) maximum kills: 4 30 damage at close range 20 damage at mid range 10 damage at long range You lose all of your speed if you die, get hit by jarate, mad milk, the gas passer, or get stunned by the Sandman. (Back Scatter) Shooting enemies in the back at close range does mini crits Fires 10 shots 20% more accurate 30 damage at close range 20 damage at mid range 10 damage at long range (Bonk Atomic Punch) Grants you invulnerability for 10 seconds Recharge for 20 seconds after it wears off Immune to all damage, debuffs, and knockback You cannot attack, capture control points, or pick up the intelligence while invulnerable. If you take damage while drinking Bonk, it will get canceled and you will have to wait for it to recharge. You cannot drink Bonk while covered in jarate, mad milk, or the gas passer Can be replenished at the resupply cabinet (Crit-a-Cola) Gives you mini-crits for 10 seconds, but you will be restricted to your melee weapon (just like the Buffalo Steak Sandvich) Recharge for 20 seconds after it wears off If you take damage while drinking Crit-a-Cola, it will get canceled and you will have to wait for it to recharge. You cannot drink Crit-a-Cola while cover in jarate, mad milk or the gas passer Can be replenished at the resupply cabinet (Mad Milk) Enemies will be covered in mad milk for 10 seconds Recharges for 20 seconds 10 health per hit on enemies covered in mad milk(afterburn damage also counts) Enemies killed while covered in mad milk will replenish 50% of your meter Extinguishing a teammate will replenish 90% of your meter Can be replenish at the resupply cabinet (winger) 15% more accurate Mini-crits while airborne Jump height increases with each kill Maximum kills: 4 50% less fall damage Fires 6 shots 20 damage at close range 15 damage at mid range 10 damage at long range (Pretty Boy's Pocket Pistol) Gain 10 health on hit Fires 6 shots 25 damage at close range 20 damage at mid range 15 damage at long range (Flying Guillotine) On hit causes 5 bleed damage for 10 seconds Recharges for 20 seconds Does crits whenever it would normally mini-crit Can be picked back up if you did not hit an enemy Can be replenished at the resupply cabinet (Sandman) Right click to launch baseball Hitting enemies in the body will slow them down for 10 seconds Hitting enemies in the head will stun them for 3 seconds Can be picked up after being launched Can be replenished at resupply cabinet Ball recharges for 20 seconds (Candy Cane) Drops a small health pack if you melee kill a spy, sniper, scout, or medic Drops a medium health pack if you melee kill an engineer, demoman, pyro, or soldier Drops a large health pack if you melee kill a heavy 20% faster swing speed (Boston Basher) On hit: causes 5 bleed damage for 10 seconds On miss: marked for death for 10 seconds (Sun-on-a-Stick) On hit: sets enemies on fire Afterburn last 10 seconds 30% fire resistance while active (Fan O War) On hit: marks enemies for death for 15 seconds(no longer marks one enemy at a time) 50% less damage (Atomizer) On hit: fills 10% of your meter which can give you infinite air jumps for 10 seconds right click to activate ability Does crits whenever it would normally mini-crit (Wrap Assassin) 50% less damage Right click to launch ornament On hit: causes 5 bleed damage for 10 seconds Recharges for 20 seconds Shatters on impact against surfaces and enemies Cannot be picked up after being launched Can be replenished at resupply cabinet
Spy-cicle saved my life many times, I'm feeling really depressed of dying due to any pyro that can just walk out of spawn and starts throwing fire all over the place while almost spinning 24/7.
Liberty launcher is more of a crutch for the trolldier then the regular soldier TBH. Just like the rocket jumper, the reduced damage and more ammo does make it viable for constant rocket jumping to find a target, but unlike the rocket jumper it actually does damage, meaning that someone who just started playing trolldier has a somewhat viable backup in case he messes up the garden.
The Spycicle imo is both a crutch and an anti-crutch (or weighted clothes if you will). On one hand, you have a knife that lets you potentially escape a Pyro more easily (honestly making the interaction somewhat fair). It's pretty easy to see why, even if actually escaping isn't and far from guaranteed. On the other, you get punished as well by being denied backstabs. With the Spycicle, you do get punished if you don't check for Pyros before going for a backstab and make yourself more obvious in front of Pyros. I personally like it because as seen with above it makes the interaction with Pyro somewhat fair, but I don't have to worry about a random stray flare hitting me while invisible.
I'd probably list the Natascha as a crutch. The slowdown effect makes tracking much easier for new players, but experienced Heavies won't really need the help and the damage penalty is extremely punishing regardless.
The Black Box is, in my opinion, one of the better designed crutches. It doesn't change how the rockets themselves function (no speed or splash increase) so using it helps you practice and get the skills to switch to other launchers. Things like the Loch-N-Load's increased projectile speed just make switching even more difficult, while the Sydney Sleeper's lack of headshots doesn't give you the feedback to practice for better snipers. Crutches should help you heal your broken skill, so you can get good enough to walk without them. They should not promote bad habits that make it hard to walk normally ever again.
calling the L&L a bad weapon is fucking nuts since It vastly outranges every other launcher by a mile (most other weapons too). requires good aim to use, hitting long shots is not easy. The smaller clip is not that much as you can 2 shot 8/9 classes and have one to spare. this isn't even mentioning that you can 2 shot every building (one for mini-Sentries, they're super easy to deal with now), and out-damage the Engie's repair rate. it's very much viable but it just differs from stock. that doesn't mean it's bad.
Ohh Kunai and Deadringer, add the Diamondback too while you are at it. The type of spies that use this set are ALL trickstabbers and/or tryhards that just can't keep themselves alive after getting a kill, that's why they resort to this set. I swear, everyone that uses these weapons, are exactly the same. I may sound stubburn, but every time I play Scout with Mad Milk, I HAVE to focus these Kunai spies, it fills me with great joy + it's a free kill. Taunting them also helps, as they'll probably end up focusing you even if that costs them their own life... which helps the team even more!
the kunai is not a crutch that compensates for skill, it compensates for one of the inherent weaknesses of spy as a class IE, its not for a guy with a broken leg, its for a guy with one of his legs cut off
The Black Box can be a crutch, but isn't one in and of itself. The extra survivability can be very useful as a roamer, especially since there will be many cases where you simply can't afford to run to a healthkit during a fight, and the stock shotgun or panic attack makes up for its downside pretty well.
Dude, you did not cook with that Spycicle part. Pyro is a death sentance to all spies, not just newer ones. Immediately extinguishing yourself is great, and you can still finish off the pyro if you have good Ambassador aim or crits on the diamondback, or you can cloak away. To quote FSOAS: "An inconvenienced spy, is better than a dead one."
I'd argue that most of the time the spycicle isn't really a crutch. If you're good enough you should be able to escape with or without the bonuses. At most by having the stock knife you might get a lone pyro who lit you from failing your first stab but I can't imagine having any of the other possible near by classes letting you go scott free since you already been discovered. Unless I guess they run at you and you trick stab 3 other people while having after burn or something.
The Kuni's argument tends to go like this: It is a stomping weapon. Therefore, only when you significantly outclass the enemy team, will you really benefit from this weapon. So it locks your skill level to being a pub stomper, with little use outside of that. A similar argument is made for the Eyelander. In most cases it stops you from doing your job. As a spy, you should be removing important targets such as Medics, and Engineers to hinder ubers and sentry nests, or a line holder enemy, typically a Heavy, Solider, or Demo. Likewise, that is what the Demo knight needs to do. But both weapons drop your health, and add on a penalty to death which stops you from making an important difference in the game. Therefore, because the Kuni and Eyelander both stop a player from growing in his role, they become handicap crutch weapons.
The Sydney Sleeper isn't a crutch weapon. It's wildly unpopular, but it's still a way to inflict jarate from, well, Sniper range - and that faster charging shots means that it's very easy to just melt classes, with whoever survives now being vulnerable to minicrits. Minicrits are so good because they effectively turn every weapon into a sniper rifle.
I don't care what does what, if I see something I can have potential fun with I'd try it, if I expect dying often as a medic I'd actually attempt vita-saw, I'd like if the weapon was reworked slightly instead of losing max hp. Maybe a vulnerability. It's underused for that reason losing max-hp
I guess you could call the change that the YER recieved a 'crutch' change, since it made the YER easier for new players to use but harder for experienced players.
Rest In Peace, Jarate splash on headshot. You didn’t deserve to be completely removed. 😔 Muscle memory is probably the biggest problem for the Loch and Load. Those faster no-tumble pills decrease close-range spread and increase Demo’s range significantly, but the price of entry to get good with it is _high_ especially for stock/bomber Demos. Nevertheless, I respect those Demos who have practiced well with the weapon regardless of how rare that is.
I’ve played TF2 for around 400 hours, I will happily admit that I use the Blackbox as a crutch. There’s just some weird disconnect in my brain that doesn’t let me rocket jump effectively.
i always used to get hate for using a black box but it was my favorite australium and my friend got me one for my birthday, damn right im gonna use it😂😂
there should be an all class melee which is crutches and what it does is double your speed and give you infinite crits with the only downside being you can't equip it if you have more than 50 hours on the game
As someone who uses the Conch I cannot stand the Black Box, there are just so many situations where an extra rocket comes in handy and far less instances where it’s healing gimmick actually pays off. Sure when it does it’s great, but it doesn’t matter if you’re down a rocket and needed another 80 damage to finish off the heavy that’s about to turn you into Swiss cheese.
@@noname-vw5qw You could only one shot scouts when random damage spread was enabled on Valve server because otherwise you could only do 120 damage at most.
![[TF2] The Item Iceberg](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ue2_mTGt4jo/mqdefault.jpg)
![[TF2] The Item Iceberg](/img/tr.png)
![[TF2] Stealth Weapons](/img/n.gif)
The crutch weapons are whatever the guy that just killed me is using
The non-crutch weapons are the ones I currently have equipped
What if... they're the same weapon?
@@tappajaavThen he’s hacking (Copium)
This guy gets it.
Real
i deadass saw someone trying to argue that using the shotgun on soldier instead of gunboats is a crutch
The Sydney sleeper might be a crutch weapon, but as a new player I only use it to cover people in piss. It’s funnt
Just use stock Sniper Rifle and Jarate.
Not only will you train yourself to get better at headshots, but Jarate is more efficient at coating enemies in piss.
@@drucy. But you get to SHOOT people to cover them with piss, which is more funni
@@drucy.counter argument, piss gun
OMG IS DAT A WATER GUN?! MAN UR INSANE!!
Business Dummy: THAT‘S MORE TO IT!!
HAH. LEMME GUESS. YOU FILLED IT WITH PISS!
*Silence…*
WAIT YOU DID FILL IT WITH PISS?!
"Meet the sniper"
@drucy. What if I don't wanna use jarate. And instead want to use the underrated smg.
The Loch'n'Load is absolutely not a bad weapon, it's really good to the point that it's widely used in 6s by competitive players. The extra projectile speed doesn't just make shots easier to hit and harder to dodge, you can also hit shots MUCH further away. Given how direct pipes have no fall-off, it's often worth giving up rollers for this reason.
That's definitionally a crutch. You give up a quarter of your clip for pills that are easier to hit.
Crutch is literally defined as a video as a weapon that's trades raw ability for being easier to use.
Yeah, SpaceGuy definitely doesn't seem the type to have actually used the weapon. There's a large community of comp players who want it banned for being too OP, and anyone who's used it in casual for more than just to get footage will have realized how an increase of range on Demoman can completely change how you play, and even allow for a more agressive playstyle
Demo mains don't even use grenade launchers anyway, too skill based
It's also harder to airblast.
@@mr.monkey354 obviously.
any self respecting demoman only uses the bottle. drink enough alcohol and you become invisible (except for your liver).
loch n load is frequently used in comp settings for its longer range and more consistent pills, so saying it only punishes good players is wrong.
A quarter of your clip for pills that are easier to hit. You really thought it being used in comp was some kind of gotcha moment?
@@simonnachreiner8380 yeah
@@simonnachreiner8380 They didn't say easier to hit, they said more consistent. The other launchers fire pills with random tumble, which messes with their trajectory. This makes the Loch immune to the RNG that can fuck over other grenade launchers, on top of pills having much better range.
@@simonnachreiner8380Isn't ti though? If it was a crutch, why would the best players be using it?
it lets you finally duel scouts, demo's hardest class to fight, in like max flame thrower range where scouts like to hang out and shoot, good scouts who usually see the slow pipes and just dodge move away, won't be able to dodge the LnL
Crutch weapons in tf2 have always seemed like a strange case to me.
#every tf2ber in existence
UA-cam videos are so much better if you skip the first 60 seconds
@@TZD11111 ikr
A crutch weapon is always a weapon that takes less skill to use than its contemporaries, whether its good or bad. A bad weapon being a crutch is easier to identify, ie. the Liberty Launcher, which is easier to use at the cost of being worse than Stock.
A good weapon being a crutch treads the fine line of "using it because you lack skill" and "using it because its a good weapon", which on paper sounds hard to define, but in practice its weapons like the Escape Plan, Vaccinator, Scorch Shot and Short Circuit that are very easy to use (yes even the Vacc. You can press R it's not hard) and are top tier weapons.
STRANGE?
CASE?
*WHERE!?*
darwins danger shield is probably the biggest crutch weapon for sniper
like totally the long range class needs a "screw you" item against the close range class
That 50% damage resist is just waaay too much
Basically if you hate the scorch shot
Yet it helps most against long range projectile spam(scorch/detonator typically).
If you get caught up close with a pyro you're done for in any case, but not having to run for healthpack every 5 seconds is great
@@tappajaav random crit pyro dead sniper not even half hp
just dodge the projectile tbf its not that hard ngl
It's not a crutch, it's just dumb weapon design. If the enemy team has a pyro or 2 that keep spamming scorch shot flares/det flares at you the danger shield can help good snipers stay in the fight longer.
Big fan of the definition you give for a crutch, i feel like i always see people using it to describe weapons that are just too powerful, when obviously thats not how crutches work, they only help if you can’t walk (or aren’t good enough) otherwise they just slow you down.
they need to add crutches to tf2 as a melee reskin now
In the russian adaptation of tf2, the pain train is called "The crutch" for some reason
@@Slanik_Bab ladies and gentlemen, we found the true crutch weapon
@@cross_byte🎉🎉🎉 👏👏👏🎉=
It would be amusing to see an engineer whack his sentry with some crutches
The loch being forevel labeled as demo crutch weapon is so annoying to me because the iron bomber used to be objectively easier to use back when the projectiles hitboxes were larger than stock yet that weapon received no pushback from the community until years later, while the loch was dragged through the mud by dumbass Soundsmith fans.
Id much rather have 1 more pipe I can miss against the scout thats about to dominate me, then use a "crutch".
That’s what I didn’t like about some weapon stereotypes videos, he says it’s meant to be satirical which worked for the cosmetics, but with weapons it’s hard to tell if I’m supposed to take it as a joke and not a subjective opinion, it’s why I didn’t like the black box or lock n load stereotypes
The Iron Bomber was beyond crutch, just flat out OP, insane how long it took to fix
@@ronjonronald6645The projectile hitbox affected
it's a weapon that allows the class that benefits the most from passive play (well, aside from engineer) to play even more passively, so it's very good
Calling the L&L a crutch is like calling the Direct Hit a crutch or maybe I’m coping because it’s my go to demo primary it’s fried my muscle memory so much.
Nah its a stupid take and inconsistent with his definition of a crutch
Just a wee bit. You forfeit rollers and an extra pill for pills that are easier to hit and an extremely niche bonus against buildings. If the building bonus wasn't so niche you would be correct.
The direct hit on the other hand trades the reliability of splash damage (which is a lot more reliable than roller damage) for the ability to one shot light classes if you score the harder to land direct hits.
He never even called it a crutch he talks about how other people say its a crutch and simply points out how no rollers proves it isn't a crutch but just a bad weapon overall
@@haydenhaslip2024actually, the only time I’ve ever heard of it being a crutch was from soundsmith stereotype series where he calls it a crutch in a voice where you can’t tell if he’s joking or not
I tend to devide weapons in two categories :
Win more and ensurances ,
Win more weapons (bazar bargain , kunai , bf blaster, direct hit , phlog ,diamondback , brass beast, the ubersaw) allow you to push in winning situations even further :
A bazar bargain sniper thatbis winning would be doing similarly with the stock , same for the brass beast , it just magnifies the skill gap and thebdifficulty in recovering ...
Now ensurances : they will instead allow a player to achive a winning situation better (the shortstop , the solem vow , the tomislav , the rocket jumper , l'etrange , the spycicle , the cozy camper ecc. Ecc.)
If you did't have that weapon your abilities to achive a winning position would get hampered and you'd be in trouble , in exchange for this you get worse habities to press on a winning situation ...
Classifying the kunai and the spycicle with the same term class is ridiculus ,
A bad spy with the spycicle has some possibilities , of escaping a pyro ,
A bad spy with the kunai is fucked ...
Now take a skilled spy and the roles are reversed :
The kunai spy will become almost immortal ,
While the spycicle will hamper it a lot and force it to play gun spy ...
Blackbox + Conch + Escape plan is definitely a crutch. I equipped that loadout and after getting used to it I topscored in the casual lobby despite hardly ever playing soldier. I'm gonna keep using it though lmao.
At least you admit it. Joke aside, I feel like the weapons themselves are not crutches, but the loadout is, if that makes any sense.
I wouldn't call it a crutch as it's more of a synergy, these weapons are good when used together.
You still have to hit your shots to get the health and need to deal damage to get the conch buff.
just because something is good doesn't make it a crutch brother
@@aaronlaughter6471 Agreed, for me personally I pair black box with buff banner since it fits my style of play
its not a crutch then, its just a good weapon combo.
Weapon reskins have always been a strange case to me ahh into
Spycicle user here, the spycicle is not a crutch in the slightest as the spycicles ability actually does require a good amount of skill to escape pyros in certain situations that newer spy’s won’t get the use out of there. And spycicle will save your life far more often than it screwing you out of a stab. To me I see the spycicle more as a straight upgrade to stock, as it allows you so much more escapes from pyros for little downsides.
partially agree. while i wouldn't call the spycicle a direct upgrade, you can certainly benefit from the upsides often if you know how and when to use it. and if there aren't any pyros on the other team, then it's essentially just a stock reskin.
Spycicle + Amby combo is an amazing counter to Pyros.
True, spycicle can save your life and it doesn't matter if you can't backstab after it did. Because the fact you got burned mean you either got unlicky or was out of position: both meaning you didn't had the opportunity to do the backstab in the first place. Spycicle is an upgrade, but personnally i prefer not leaving a statue behind unless i wan't to "troll" the other team. Because it can make them more aware of yur presence which make it even worse for noobs too, so definitly not a crutch.
In addition, the spycicle teaches a good habit of having your gun out most of the time. This is because, it there may be situations where saving your knife and going to a nearby health pack to remove the flames is better.
Having your gun out let's you control the extinguishing to when it's the most advantageous.
It also means... Having your gun out. To shoot things. There are a surprising amount of times where having your gun out immediately can turn the tides in a fight in the short timespan it takes to switch to it from melee.
I mean, to many people, that's kinda why the Spycicle is considered a crutch. It's good in the hands of less skilled Spys, but useless to better Spys. It's basically training wheels for Revolver aim, which is fine on it's own, I used it early on myself; and it does help. But as you get better at Spy, the Spycicle begins to show it's weakness... since it develops bad habits in early Spys.
Newer Spys struggle to get Stabs and deal with Pyros anyway. So losing the ability to stab for a few seconds, in exchange for the ability to brute force their way past Pyros is an easy out that allows them to bypass the skill development of positioning, planning and learning how to deal with a Pyro properly. Sure, it does teach you to use your gun more often as Spy, but this is something most Spys learn fairly quickly, if they don't jump to the "I'm gonna do trickstabs to be cool' mindset. Spy's Revolver is strong, but you don't need the Spycicle to make it strong.
The Spycicle in general is a direct downgrade from the other options as you get better at Spy. Better positioning means the Kunai, Big Earner or YER will reward you more in the long run. And while Pyros can be a problem... but at least if you get set on fire using other knives, you can still go for a Stab as intended; and heck, if using the Kunai or Big Earner, that can save you from Pyros more than the Spycicle can; since now you got a kill, and got out with your life instead of just escaping to try again later.
I’d argue that the dead ringer definitely falls into the crutch category. Having an instant right click bail out to run to a health pack and try again seems pretty crutch indicative. I think experienced players would more benefit from the versatility and on-demand cloak from stock. Kunai is just borderline OP imo. Becoming a spy with the health of a soldier because one teammate got caught with their pants down essentially invalidates the upside of every other knife unlock. Meanwhile the downside is basically a nothing burger because whether you have 70 or 125 health, a caught out spy is almost always a dead spy. But I’m a heavy main so take my opinions with the appropriate amount of salt.
Kunai spies without the buff die to random spam(both when visible and invisible) a LOT more than those that don't have it equipped
Loch-n-load is not a crutch. This take is _really outdated._
The projectile speed increase (as well as the fixed arch) allows Demo to deal 300 damage from _much_ more passive positions. Hell, even the comp scene has been arguing about it being too powerful because it lets Demo snipe people from mid-long range reliably while still having the Stickybomb launcher equipped. It is a sidegrade through and through.
@@magnum78923 But that's said nearly point for point in the video? That it isn't a crutch it just repeatedly gets called that even to this day
Really? I couldn't tell if the 9:23 segment was your opinion on it or what other ppl say about the weapon. If it's the latter, my bad.
@@SpaceGuyOnline No, but you instead resorted to calling it a "bad" weapon when it absolutely isn't.
@@rbfilms4752 I think the loss of rollers with an extremely minor upside makes it a bad weapon to use yea, seeing how you rarely see people use it too I think that's a fair common consensus
@@SpaceGuyOnline
But that's my point: the upside isn't minor at all. Up close it helps against Scouts, which are Demo's most notoriously difficult match-up, and at a range it's the most dangerous launcher for anyone not paying attention to the Demo. For better reference this video basically says everything about the weapon in a more concise way:
ua-cam.com/video/mCQL8zPysnc/v-deo.htmlsi=9BrTNw3qnjgbnUGd
Liberty Launcher lover here, The liberty launcher is great for what i like to call hybrid eagle scout, where you treat your shotgun like your primary weapon, and your rocket launcher as a mobility/backup weapon. The liberty launcher is great here, since it works like a mini gunboats compared to stock, while still allowing you to finish people off with your rockets if need be.
It's personally my favourite way to play soldier and allows you to be an absolute menace of a pick class. Oh the enemy medic is spychecking and staying out of sniper sightlines? Hope they are prepared for 150 lbs of pure patriotism barreling towards them at mach 2 with the sole purpose of showing that surly german what a real blitzkrieg is.
As a fellow Liberty Launcher enthusiast, I agree! It's definitely a launcher more suited to being paired with a shotgun, especially the Reserve Shooter! I'd be hard pressed to call it a crutch, I see it as a combo tool that helps teach Soldiers not to primarily rely on their rockets to get the job done.
the liberty launcher is real fun honestly
I feel I found my people, I also like this playstyle a lot, however I still treat it as a primary to soften enemies and deal decent damage and then finish off enemies with the shotgun, it's like some sort of combo soldier :)
Why I use the Black Box:
1: It fits the ascetic with the Battalion's Backup and are great when paired together
2: It's one of the cooler looking rocket launchers
3: I don't use stock or the original since they are seen as tryhard launchers
4: It has an australium
5: It fits my play style
Its so funny that the stock weapon from 2007 is a sweaty weapon
@@WackJack187 i use the original because quake fan
@@WackJack187 first mistake is caring so much what people think about weapons in the first place ngl
Came to comment about the loch n load but glad to see everyone already has it covered. Good to see that the incredibly hard watch, 'Fixing TF2's weapons' type video is taking off!
Finally a video that explains the meaning of the word "Crutch" ❤ they carry you despite your lack of skills, like a medical crutch
Although I personally don't think every single weapon should be for ultraskilled players only, it's fine imho to have more noob friendly tools that give less pros and less cons
I would 100% say the kunai is a crutch, even without the dead ringer, it completely negates the entire play style of spy as long as you can get those first 1-2 backstabs, once you’ve got the 210 overheal, you don’t gotta worry about being stealthy or strategic or anything like that, instead it rewards the player for running around like an idiot, tanking damage and getting cheese trickstabs, the dead ringer only exacerbates it
7k hour 12 year competitive Soldier main here - Black Box is literally better than stock in pubs, calling it a crutch is such lazy analysis... according to you good players won't benefit from gaining 60 HP with every clip? what?
I used to use the black box and tomislav religiously until I noticed their weakness, for tomi you will take down lvl 3 sentries much slower and brass beast absolutely fucks you over.
For black box that last rocket can be make or break from a kill and you deal even less damage from one rocket jump.
There are no crutch weapons in tf2. Its a blanket term for weapons people dont like seeing other people use
There are general use weapons and situational use weapons
Any weapon perceived as a crutch only betrays the views of the person claiming it as such
The scorch shot isnt a crutch. It just does too much for it's role
The liberty launcher isnt a crutch. Its just too weak for its role
If a weapon or loadout is called a crutch by someone, they are actually saying they think it's too good or bad for what they think it's supposed to do
"There are no crutch weapons in tf2. Its a blanket term for weapons people dont like seeing other people use" completely agree. I don't think the scorch shot is overpowered but it's not a crutch.
I would agree with you if Kunai didn't exist.
I think you're the first person I ever saw to not label the Scorch Shot as a crutch. As an old Pyro main, I appreciate it. It's an excellent crowd control tool at range, and it's at it's best when you use it for a 2 hit ranged effect. Honestly I found it really good for 2 main scenarios. 1: when there's a push with a tight group of enemies. The scorch shot's AOE is a good way to chip away at them while the heavier classes bring the pain. 2: When you have an opponent who is good at keeping their distance from your flamethrower , while still hitting you. Snipers are a good target because they can't aim properly when on fire, but a really good scout is where I find the most use because they are very skilled at keeping out of your ideal range, while still keeping their damage output up. Those are usually the players that scream the loudest about the weapon as well, at least in my experience.
When looking at a weapon as a crutch it's always important to ask "for what" what role does it make easier that's done better by another weapon with a higher potential and skill floor.
You can argue that it's competing with the flaregun but the scorch shot sits in an entirely different nitch with some overlap. Aoe harassment. While the flaregun is pure burst damage
...until you realize that it does the same things as the detonator, just less effectively and more easily, making it a crutch by definition. Want to burn groups of players at chokes? Detonator can do that better if you can time your shots. Want to disable snipers? Same thing. Want to jump with flares? Scorch shot doesn't launch you as far but you don't have to budget your health as carefully. Want to flare punch? Scorch shot lets you get lazy and shoot the floor but deals much less damage than the flare gun.
@@nickenchugger The Scorch Shot is way different from the Detonator. You trade mobility for damage and consistency for speed. It has advantages, like not having to wait for the detonation before being able to switch weapons or being able push enemies away even with flame throwers that have no or an expensive airblast, and its disadvantages are that it's harder to hit airborne targets and targets behind cover. SS is active, Det is passive.
Detonator timing isn't hard. And before you start flare punching with the SS you should probably just use the shotgun.
Plus, with the Dragon's Fury you can deliver an instant kill combo to light classes which is a lot of fun.
@@Eimlin I've yet to get the feel for the Dragon, and I find giving up a normal Flamethrower too big and ask. As for the Det, I never found the Detonator to be all that useful, if I'm being honest.A lot of people would argue they'rre the same, as a few of you are, and I would argue that they aren't. Detonator gets one burst and a mediocre damage, and the SS gets a double tap with a surprising amount of damage if you can hit with both parts. The SS rewards accuracy, the Det rewards timing. They play very differently.
Yea, they are. Half of the time they aren't paying attention to what hit them.
90% of the weapons that have a reputation for being a "crutch", got that rep _years_ ago when the weapon was much more powerful than they are now. This holds true for the most of the weapons listed here, and are all somewhere between hot garbage and situational nowadays. The Black Box is not good anymore and I almost never use it despite having a strange one. Spycicle and DR only get used on my gunspy load out, and I have never liked using the Kunai with the DR (and I have 1600 hours with spy). The Liberty Launcher is only good for trollier (so you can have something for sentries). And the Gas Passer is just garbage, still even with the recent buff, it is literal hot garbage.
Weapons that are absolutely NOT a crutch include:
The Sydney Sleeper is fantastic for staying hidden as a sniper because your teammates get the kill and thus there is never a killcam on your position. I have some cheeky hiding spots I abuse over and over with it. I've had it work so well the whole enemy team has walked right past me. As long as your ego can handle not getting the kill credit, then it is a great team support weapon. Along those lines fully charged Machina is great for getting shots _through_ your own teammates, who inevitably will jump in the way in crowded spaces. And yes, I can consistently hit headshots, neither is a crutch for me at all. I use stock rifle about 80% of the time. In all three cases, charging up to get full charge body shots is effectively the same.
The Scorch Shot is like a utility hybrid between the Flare and the Detonator. You still have to hit directs to get it's best effect (the pop up), and it's area of effect is similar to the Detonator, but smaller and you have less control with it since you can't detonate it over cover. It is annoying yes, but so is the Detonator honestly. And overall, the Flare is still the better option for damage, but you lose the utility of the other two. It's the perfect example of a side grade.
People that say the Kunai is a crutch must not use it much (I do, 50K on my strange one). Because the amount of times I've come around a corner and died to a wayward pipe or rocket is infuriating enough to make me want to scrap it some days. It is NOT a good weapon for new spies, just the opposite. The 200hps on a stab only nets you an extra hit from a rocket/pill, and doesn't save you from getting juggled. It's not as over powered as some like to claim.
And the DR hasn't been good in around ten years. Ridding yourself of an obnoxious DR spy is as easy as going scout and equipping the milk.
The only ones listed that I'd consider current crutches are the Phlog and the Razorback. And the Razorback is the only one I think needs to be removed or reworked. It's basically garbage, but I've had a snipers, completely unaware of me, back up into my stabs meant for other people (usually medics or other actually good snipers). Again, this death to random bullshit is infuriating.
The big ones you left out at the Diamondback and the Frontier Justice. I want to curb stomp the creators of those two. They are both no risk, all reward weapons. So you might say they are less a crutch and more just plain broken.
I have two things to say. 1. All snipers can hit through teammates, the Machina just has a special kill icon and 2. The Frontier Justice does have risk, as you only get the crits once your biggest line of defense, your sentry, has died. I agree with you on the Diamondback though
@@dadjokesinc.2657 And the time your sentry gets destroyed is precisely the time when you'll be needing those crits most.
It is bit busted though, considering the fact you can destroy your sentry and rebuild it during downtime, with virtually no risk included
Liberty launcher is also good for combo soldier (shotgun soldier)
@@tappajaavhowever, without crits it's a direct downgrade from stock, and even with them your still a light class with no special movement options other than some jank from the Short circuit
@@watergaming7543 You're trying to justify strengths of a weapon by mentioning weaknesses of a class. Don't do that.
For a second there I thought the thumbnail said Crotch weapons
this background makes your eyes hurt if you watch the video for too long
The loch-n-load is insane when you are using stock stickies
Going from 12 damaging projectiles to 11 is not that big of a deal.
The loss of rollers isnt a big deal either, most missed pipes with the stock arent going to deal any damage anyway.
And in return you get range and more importantly consistency. Demos main weakness is how inconsistent his damage is and the loch-n-load helps with that.
If there is a scout in your face having 1 extra pipe you can miss isnt really gonna help you, hell you might not even get to the bottom of the clip. But with the loch-n-load you have fighting chance.
5:55 as a Med player it's annoying when I pass by a Sniper, decide to give him some nice overheal him to help him out in any Sniper v Sniper fights that might happen in the next 30 seconds, and then it turns out he has the Razorback and that interaction was pointless
Not pointless it's a free Uber farm. If you aren't rolling the quickfix healing anyone with 142% health or just under full overheal halves your Uber charge rate. Scouts literally beat their faces in for this exact purpose.
God I fucking hate the razorback, what were they thinking with that item we will never know. It needs a complete stat change again.
This is such an accurate statement.
Man the lock n load is not a bad weapon at least for stock demo. Hybrid knight and sticky jumper demo and obv full demoknight benefit from it very little but when used with the stock stickybomb launcher it’s one of if not the best option. You gotta understand that sticky’s are demos primary not grenades so giving up a pipe is way less impactful you’re not giving up 1/4 of your damage you’re giving up 1/12 of your total explosives in return for making the pipes more useful at the ranges where sticky’s are less useful. Also people pretend like the speed doesn’t matter when it really does like no shot with grenades is guaranteed it’s not a sniper rifle and when you’re up against a cracked scout loch can let you hit them when you might’ve missed with stock or the bomber
I agree with he liberty launcher to a point but it can actually be used in higher play to do a sort of combo soldier where you mix in shotgun blasts with the rocks and get some insane dps. It makes soldier less power and more picky than usual but he still has the means to deal with things like sentries.
Thanks for the consistently creative and wonderful watches that your video are, sir Spaceguyonline
One thing to note: The spycicle is arguably one of spy's weapons when specifically run with the revolver or amby and deadringer. It's a staple of true gunspy. Gives spy a little extra defense against pyros when dueling them and that extra second can be all it takes to line up an amby headshot.
8 second bleed has always been a strange case for me
This comment being buffed had always been a strange case for me
5:29 DOCTOR IS HERE
The gas passer is good now
No
The Loch n Load, a bad weapon?! You're crazy man. That projectile speed bonus is absolutely incredible for sniping people and they make your shots at close to mid range unreactable, making them practically impossible to dodge. Granted the loss of rollers are a fairly debilitating downside, but it's well worth for that proj speed bonus. There's also that damage bonus against buildings I guess, but pipes are already great at buildings, with the exception of the Loose Cannon and Iron Bomber.
>Describes black box
>Listen to explaination
>b4nny uses it in ster_'s challenge 10 years later
The nice thing about the sleeper is that it still minis on heads, so at least the transition away from it once you actually have the skill is much easier than something like the liberty launcher
I think one worth mentioning is the Scorsman's Skullcutter, specifically in medieval mode. In base game its just the funny "-234" sword, but in Midieval mode where EVERYONE is forced to go into melee range to fight you, relying on random crits instead of playing demon smart is just a crutch.
Natasha is a crutch. Makes it easier to hit the players you’re hitting by slowing them down, but the damage penalty and slower spin-up hamper Heavies who would be happier without it.
The Sydney sleeper is a fine weapon. I don’t know why it gets lumped in as a shit weapon. No it’s good. It charges quick so you can pump out tons of damage. The jarate effect is useful, assuming you’re hitting actually important targets with it.
The loch and load is ALSO a good weapon. It’s fast. It’s accurate. That’s it. Rollers are unreliable so depending on them isn’t a good idea. 1v1 fights with 3 fast pipes is really all you need.
It’s good, rlly good. Just kinda annoying to get covered in piss every 6 seconds
@@Small_child_punter It's because every other Sniper Rifle with the exception of the Classic doesn't need to charge at all to pump out damage.
The other problem is the duration of Jarate on hit being related to charge duration, at least make headshot hits apply the full 5 seconds promoting hitting headshots with no charge rather than waiting It out
TF2 players parroting opinions to each other.
@@SpaceGuyOnline most snipers aren’t consistent head shooters and perform better when the demand for headshots is removed. If you’re an efficient head shooter, the sleeper won’t outdo stock or the bargain.
Im willing to wager the dps of the sleeper would greater outdo any other rifle on a bad-decent sniper, but not great snipers. The issue is a lot of people don’t pour much time into getting great at the sleeper. It becomes VERY annoying once you do.
I feel like I remember people complaining a lot about it before this slight rework 5 years ago.
Added a note on the loch and load if you wanna take a look at that.
@@Small_child_punter The point of less skilled Snipers preforming better with the Sydneh Sleeper while better, more skilled ones would suffer from using it sorta solidifies the Syndey being a crutch.
I think it's an overall meh weapon, in the grander scheme of the entire game there's obviously worse ones but on Sniper specifically it falls flat on what it's trying to be and do. There's the obvious inverse argument of saying that other Sniper Rifles are just so much better which causes the Sydney to suck in comparison, mainly the Bazaar Bargan but eh.
Loch N Load is in a similar boat, sure rollers are inconsistent but if you miss there's still a chance for damage potential that the Loch N Load just doesn't have. Both weapons are trying to promote or reward players with easier /harder things to do but don't push their benefits or bonuses enough to really bother using them over other weapons.
The gas passer actually got buffed in the last update. It now counts as being wet, meaning that Pyro can combo it with the neon annihilator to do a ton of damage. It also works for area denial since people will know that the gas means a pyro is nenarby and now likely has a means to hit you with a crit if you go through the cloud.
As someone who plays with ridiculous ping & lag, things like the black box are just great for me, allowing me to give medics wanting to pocket to other players who won't die from my lag issues. The lag prevents me from timing rocket jumps too so it's not like I'm concerned with giving up a rocket that could be used to get around the map. Sometimes you gotta compensate
didn't expect to hear Lunate Elf in the background, nice choice
from what i remember the crutch term for kunai originates from the original stats of the dead ringer allowing for a damage resist of what felt like 90% that lasted nearly instantly due to the player being able to refill the feign meter from ammo packs while cloaked so he always had a ringer ready, combined with the 200 hp from kunai stabs the spy was nearly unkillable
Black Box is a very curious case when you get to higher levels of play.
I find that it’s useful when a medic is getting overwhelmed with heal demand; equipping the black box helps levitate the pressure for the medic to juggle less people for heals (this happens more often in pubs and even with experience medics). Additionally it helps make the soldier independent by either allowing the soldier to hold or slowly push flank (especially with a shotgun or the reserve shooter), or be a support focused banner soldier who doesn’t need to play so conservatively around health packs to get the banner benefits (except for the conch😅).
I would agree that the original implementation of the liberty launcher is a crutch, but I think post rework its not the case anymore. I stuck with it after it changed because I got so used to it before hand. I think it is a pretty slept on weapon, and its not nearly as bad as people think it is but instead has some niche but powerful use cases. For one, having an extra rocket when you are kritzkrieged is actually a huge buff even if it does 25% less. Besides that it really benefits a roaming playstyle, where you arent front lining and picking fights with other front line classes. It makes soldier really powerful at picking off the low HP backline classes as they can't outrun your rocket jumps and since you take less self damage you're usually at a safe HP when doing so.
But when you run into another soldier with stock or a demoman, you basically just have to pray they are worse than you lol
Videos without sponsors are worthy of a comment in commemoration of the creator’s desire to make a video and not their desire for money
God forbid youtubers make any money from their job
why shouldn't people reap financial rewards from doing what they enjoy
As Dantes once said,
"It... is their fucking... JOB!!!!"
sponsors are only a problem to me if its a scummy sponsor, and the way they integrate it into the video. i greatly appreciate youtubers who make the sponsor a dedicated chapter, making it super easy to skip even on mobile without sponsorblock. the only sponsors that actually piss me off are scam sponsors, the youtuber trying to be "clever" and making an "invisible segue into the sponsor" that just annoys the shit out of me, and to a certain extent the ones where the youtuber pretends that they loooove the sponsor sooo much and its the best thing since sliced bread.
if its a sponsor of some inoffensive product and its made easy to skip and doesnt have some shitty cheesy segue, then im all for youtubers making money off of their great videos
but what if the sponsor is so they can make the video in the first place because they hire other people to do certain aspects of it they can't. like editing or animations. etc.?
Black Box is super when you're one of the only good players on your team, because you will be dealing damage while getting focus-fired, allowing you to tank more damage and take more enemies down before dying. This also gives you a higher random crit chance, which also if paired with banners, gives you more survivability or snowballing. To be honest, if you keep getting killed by a Conch Black Box Soldier, go pyro and airblast. If you still die, that soldier timed his rockets well and/or was smart enough to ambush you first. If he dies, your reaction time is incredible and you probably didn't even take damage in the process or/and healed yourself due to the Black Box rockets. Box + Conch has counters: mid-to-long range, airblast and overheal. In a Soldier vs. Soldier, the Black Box Conch soldier is going to be at a considerable advantage if you both start shooting at about the same time, because he will be able to survive a rocket (and sometimes even two) more.
though I admit fighting black box + conch sucks to fight, because it makes it so easy to run away and survive, as well as rewarding getting random crits more.
The only weapons that are crutch in TF2 is Bazaar Bargain, Darwin’s and Razorback. Every other weapon is niche but not crutch as they don’t us single-handedly win matchups but rather have an augmented effect providing an alternative play style
ong, the bazzar is just straight up good. hardly a crutch, if you can’t hit headshots, it’s bad, if you can, it’s cracked
The bazaar bargain is like the objective opposite of a crutch
Snowball weapons with almost 0 down grade
I wouldn't say the liberty launcher is just a pure crutch. Yea an absolute newbie will get use out of the extra rocket and projectile speed but to be honest they would probably do better with stock. Imo experienced players can get more use out of the extra rocket and reduced jump damage. I personally use it a lot
A man of culture I see
Yeah agreed simply by remembering 2 words, hybrid troldger.
6:37 Spy has a gun
fun fact the phlog is pyros BEST flamethrower in MvM a total crutch in everything else but if you factor mvm it falls in the same boat as the black box a crutch outside of one example
The entire sniper class is a crutch.
Wouldn’t that imply that, in the context of this video, sniper only gets worse the longer you play?
omg SpaceGuyOnline don't you know that the Neon Annihilator can now crit people soaked with the Gas Passer and that somehow makes both weapons good and totally not a gimmick?? how dare you!!11!
I don't know about other people but I actually liked the Loch 'n Load's old stats, the extra damage was more than made up for by the small clip size and lack of rollers, the only class it really penalized hard were scouts but they were always hard to hit and the Demoman had to have dead on aim to handle them. I liked its niche as a precision weapon that dealt more damage and was a bit more forgiving to aim with the speedier projectiles where unlike the other launchers you always had to be connecting your shots directly and couldn't rely on rollers and a large explosion radius to get extra damage with minimum effort, and the fact that it only had two in the clip made aim even more paramount since you couldn't fire with abandon compared to the four shots for the other launchers. It even did additional self damage to the user which made it more paramount you weren't firing wildly at close range since you are more likely to suicide. It feel like a reasonable risk vs reward dynamic, even though I usually main scout I never really found the weapon that frustrating since the Demoman had to give up a lot and be good at aiming to get those oneshots.
The big changes over time have mostly just made the weapon less distinct and more boring, not to mention visually nonsensical (though I suppose that was already the case for the default launcher). Giving it an additional shot jars with the weapon's two barrel design and it just makes it stand out less since its now closer to the default launcher and gives you more padding for a missed shot, and in the meantime it doesn't even do more self damage. It mostly just makes the Demoman a bit more dangerous against engineer (something he already excels at), it feels like a weapon that doesn't really justify its existence anymore since its not distinct enough from default and if it was removed it wouldn't matter much.
I’d say the razorback’s intended purpose is purely for sniper duels since not being able to be backstabbed and not being able to have overheal make sniper duels fun
i haven't used it, but i feel like the spy-cicle is probably the direct opposite to a crutch weapon, with its downsides being a big detriment to any inexperienced player who wants to do a basic backstab playstyle. losing your knife will leave you with only the other stuff in your kit, and the big blue statues tell everyone nearby that you were here recently if you actually use it, which might not be the case with other knives.
you'd get the most out of it by knowing how to use the rest of your kit as spy, so most of the time it's experenced players who will enjoy the niche benefits with fire immunity on the spy-cicle.
Used to play a lot of black box Soldier when I started playing tf2. Didn't realize I was using it as a cruthch till I started using the default loadout.
7:59 is just plain wrong. The scorch shots skill floor is so low but it’s still one of the most powerful weapons in the game even when using it wrong. It has the equivalent to no downsides as the little flair jump does less damage than the detonator while the damage penalty doesn’t mater because it can hit people twice, and with the minicrits it just straight up doesn’t work which means it’s just an annoying spam weapon you can use… without having to aim. Like a crutch.
Scorch shot is underpowered but the most annoying pyro secondary. Flare gun can just kill the person with the critical hit on hit after they're on fire instead remove some of their mobility, same with manmelter but depend if the enemy team have pyro or not instead enemy team on fire or not, Detonator can jump higher even though there is more damage taken which can lead to 1-2 extra kill with your primary. Scorch shot is just annoying with it's movement negation which other weapons have but scorch shot have damage fall-off based on distance between the projectile and the target on the explosion instead between the pyro and the target so it's risk free and annoying movement negation without any counterplay like shooting back to kill the pyro except if the enemy team equip long range weapons like sniper rifle or weapon that invalidate an entire class like Darwin's Danger shield. There is a reason why Valve buff it some years ago doesn't get backlash although i prefer rework to not do the knockback or have damage fall off (and maybe afterburn duration) between pyro and the target instead where the projectile land and the target so it remove the annoying aspect but not make it worse flaregun that is only worth using when combined with the phlog or in map that are infamous for spams encouraging strategy like dustbowl which is played often for some reason despite map design that encourage spam is recipe for worst gameplay that nobody enjoy.
I mean, didn't the definition at the start says a crutch is a weapon that also hinders experienced players? The scorch shot absolutely does not become a hinderance when you're good, and if anything becomes far better because of the pseudo-stun the knockback can provide, allowing for easy setups (e.g. with axtinguisher or dragon's fury)
It absolutely is a crutch since if you’re a serious pyro main who airblast and pull off combos a lot, the scorch shot won’t help at all as you’ll either get a lot better burst damage from the shotguns or stock flare gun or more mobilities from the det.
For newer players, the Scorch Shot is powerful
For experienced players, it’s a shittier Detonator
Surprised to see a lack of Darwins Danger Shield mentioned, when it gives the hard counter to the close range class, and definitive hard counter to the same close range class.
The liberty launcher is more of an "get in and get out" type of rocket launcher, you first bomb in and if your hp is low you blast out of battle, and more of a support tool for mobility then actual damage
I only use the Machina. It's pretty much just for how ostentatious it is. I like the sound it makes when you shoot and the sound it makes when you get a double kill. My brother who played way longer than I have said that he doesn't like it cause the tracer tells other snipers where you are, I said I like it cause it tells other snipers where I am.
i haven't played tf2 in a while (around 8 months) and came back to play because i heard bots are lowkey gone, so what a surprise it was that in my first ever match in 8 months i got called a "crotch box user" by a pyro after i managed to understand that he can deflect my rockets and i should use melee instead (because i was using the car battery thing), and then he changed to his shotgun to prevent me from using melee on him, which he misserably failed on doing since i got 2 melee hits on him, so after that i changed to my rocket launcher and got two splash damage hits on him, finishing him off before he even realised, and right now it's that part where i'm investigating what the hell does "crotch box user" mean in tf2
and judging by what i'm seeing, i think it's another gas passer in mvm type of insult made so sweats who have spent more time playing spy than taking care of themsels feel better after losing a match againts any player who hasn't done the same lifeless thing
One I'd like to mention that was called a clutch more before it's rework but I still hear called on occasionally today is the Vita Saw being a crutch for medics who can't stay alive. Before the rework, absolutely, I'd agree, but now, eh, kinda, but also no, it does require some skill to use, you can't just put it in your back pocket and let it help you passively, you actually have to try and get organs for it and while that can help, catching a stray spy or hitting a demoknight right before dying, I can't agree with it being a crutch as you need to be reliable with it and have some skill.
lock n load has one less pill
"Truly, the only bad weapon is the one you die to."
imo Engis crutches are shortcircuit on attack payload, and gunslinger.
shortcircuit is broken when getting metal from the cart but is worse when thats not the case and when you would need a pistol instead.
Gunslinger is easly a crutch because it helps with more Max HP and not needing metal managment or good positioning of your buildings but
it holds you back if you could have a suprise sentry level 2 or 3 litterly anywhere. the only time where the gunslinger isn't a crutch
if you use it with the widow maker and a pistol on maps where you don't have to (or can't) fall back to your level 3 or its impossible to set up.
I love eating discounted food
Closest one id say is the panic attack, holsters faster and more pellets meaning more than likely to hit shots the 20% less damage never really affects the user.
My Scout balance changes.
(Force-A-Nature)
Fires 50% faster
20% more pellets per shot
Right click to fire both barrels simultaneously, dealing two times more damage and doing 40% knockback to enemies and 40% self-knockback while airborne.
Each individual shot does 20% knockback to enemies and 20% self-knockback while airborn.
65 damage at close range
30 damage at mid range
10 damage at long range
Fires two shots
(Shortstop)
The shortstop is now a sidearm instead of a primary
Fires bullets instead of pellets
Fires 45% faster
Right click to shove enemies away, causing 20% knockback and does no damage
Mini-crits on headshot at close range
50 damage at close range
40 damage at mid range
20 damage at long range
Fires four shots
(Soda Popper)
Each hit fills 10% your HYPE meter.
Once fully charged, press the mouse wheel to activate HYPE, granting you 60% faster attack speed on all of your weapons, 40% faster reload speed, 30% faster weapon switching, 50% faster running speed, and it will only last 10 seconds.
Right click to fire both barrels simultaneously, dealing two times more damage.
60 damage at close range
30 damage at mid range
10 damage at long range
Fires two shots
(Baby Face's Blaster)
Fires 8 shots
Running speed increases with each kill (just like the Eyelander)
maximum kills: 4
30 damage at close range
20 damage at mid range
10 damage at long range
You lose all of your speed if you die, get hit by jarate, mad milk, the gas passer, or get stunned by the Sandman.
(Back Scatter)
Shooting enemies in the back at close range does mini crits
Fires 10 shots
20% more accurate
30 damage at close range
20 damage at mid range
10 damage at long range
(Bonk Atomic Punch)
Grants you invulnerability for 10 seconds
Recharge for 20 seconds after it wears off
Immune to all damage, debuffs, and knockback
You cannot attack, capture control points, or pick up the intelligence while invulnerable.
If you take damage while drinking Bonk, it will get canceled and you will have to wait for it to recharge.
You cannot drink Bonk while covered in jarate, mad milk, or the gas passer
Can be replenished at the resupply cabinet
(Crit-a-Cola)
Gives you mini-crits for 10 seconds, but you will be restricted to your melee weapon (just like the Buffalo Steak Sandvich)
Recharge for 20 seconds after it wears off
If you take damage while drinking Crit-a-Cola, it will get canceled and you will have to wait for it to recharge.
You cannot drink Crit-a-Cola while cover in jarate, mad milk or the gas passer
Can be replenished at the resupply cabinet
(Mad Milk)
Enemies will be covered in mad milk for 10 seconds
Recharges for 20 seconds
10 health per hit on enemies covered in mad milk(afterburn damage also counts)
Enemies killed while covered in mad milk will replenish 50% of your meter
Extinguishing a teammate will replenish 90% of your meter
Can be replenish at the resupply cabinet
(winger)
15% more accurate
Mini-crits while airborne
Jump height increases with each kill
Maximum kills: 4
50% less fall damage
Fires 6 shots
20 damage at close range
15 damage at mid range
10 damage at long range
(Pretty Boy's Pocket Pistol)
Gain 10 health on hit
Fires 6 shots
25 damage at close range
20 damage at mid range
15 damage at long range
(Flying Guillotine)
On hit causes 5 bleed damage for 10 seconds
Recharges for 20 seconds
Does crits whenever it would normally mini-crit
Can be picked back up if you did not hit an enemy
Can be replenished at the resupply cabinet
(Sandman)
Right click to launch baseball
Hitting enemies in the body will slow them down for 10 seconds
Hitting enemies in the head will stun them for 3 seconds
Can be picked up after being launched
Can be replenished at resupply cabinet
Ball recharges for 20 seconds
(Candy Cane)
Drops a small health pack if you melee kill a spy, sniper, scout, or medic
Drops a medium health pack if you melee kill an engineer, demoman, pyro, or soldier
Drops a large health pack if you melee kill a heavy
20% faster swing speed
(Boston Basher)
On hit: causes 5 bleed damage for 10 seconds
On miss: marked for death for 10 seconds
(Sun-on-a-Stick)
On hit: sets enemies on fire
Afterburn last 10 seconds
30% fire resistance while active
(Fan O War)
On hit: marks enemies for death for 15 seconds(no longer marks one enemy at a time)
50% less damage
(Atomizer)
On hit: fills 10% of your meter which can give you infinite air jumps for 10 seconds
right click to activate ability
Does crits whenever it would normally mini-crit
(Wrap Assassin)
50% less damage
Right click to launch ornament
On hit: causes 5 bleed damage for 10 seconds
Recharges for 20 seconds
Shatters on impact against surfaces and enemies
Cannot be picked up after being launched
Can be replenished at resupply cabinet
Spy-cicle saved my life many times, I'm feeling really depressed of dying due to any pyro that can just walk out of spawn and starts throwing fire all over the place while almost spinning 24/7.
Liberty launcher is more of a crutch for the trolldier then the regular soldier TBH. Just like the rocket jumper, the reduced damage and more ammo does make it viable for constant rocket jumping to find a target, but unlike the rocket jumper it actually does damage, meaning that someone who just started playing trolldier has a somewhat viable backup in case he messes up the garden.
The Spycicle imo is both a crutch and an anti-crutch (or weighted clothes if you will).
On one hand, you have a knife that lets you potentially escape a Pyro more easily (honestly making the interaction somewhat fair). It's pretty easy to see why, even if actually escaping isn't and far from guaranteed.
On the other, you get punished as well by being denied backstabs. With the Spycicle, you do get punished if you don't check for Pyros before going for a backstab and make yourself more obvious in front of Pyros.
I personally like it because as seen with above it makes the interaction with Pyro somewhat fair, but I don't have to worry about a random stray flare hitting me while invisible.
I'd probably list the Natascha as a crutch. The slowdown effect makes tracking much easier for new players, but experienced Heavies won't really need the help and the damage penalty is extremely punishing regardless.
The Black Box is, in my opinion, one of the better designed crutches. It doesn't change how the rockets themselves function (no speed or splash increase) so using it helps you practice and get the skills to switch to other launchers. Things like the Loch-N-Load's increased projectile speed just make switching even more difficult, while the Sydney Sleeper's lack of headshots doesn't give you the feedback to practice for better snipers. Crutches should help you heal your broken skill, so you can get good enough to walk without them. They should not promote bad habits that make it hard to walk normally ever again.
calling the L&L a bad weapon is fucking nuts since It vastly outranges every other launcher by a mile (most other weapons too). requires good aim to use, hitting long shots is not easy. The smaller clip is not that much as you can 2 shot 8/9 classes and have one to spare. this isn't even mentioning that you can 2 shot every building (one for mini-Sentries, they're super easy to deal with now), and out-damage the Engie's repair rate. it's very much viable but it just differs from stock. that doesn't mean it's bad.
Ohh Kunai and Deadringer, add the Diamondback too while you are at it. The type of spies that use this set are ALL trickstabbers and/or tryhards that just can't keep themselves alive after getting a kill, that's why they resort to this set. I swear, everyone that uses these weapons, are exactly the same.
I may sound stubburn, but every time I play Scout with Mad Milk, I HAVE to focus these Kunai spies, it fills me with great joy + it's a free kill. Taunting them also helps, as they'll probably end up focusing you even if that costs them their own life... which helps the team even more!
I miss the old Loch N Load which did extra damage and only had a clip size of 2 (aka it actually matched the weapon model visually).
the kunai is not a crutch that compensates for skill, it compensates for one of the inherent weaknesses of spy as a class
IE, its not for a guy with a broken leg, its for a guy with one of his legs cut off
Actualy useful video
The Black Box can be a crutch, but isn't one in and of itself. The extra survivability can be very useful as a roamer, especially since there will be many cases where you simply can't afford to run to a healthkit during a fight, and the stock shotgun or panic attack makes up for its downside pretty well.
Dude, you did not cook with that Spycicle part. Pyro is a death sentance to all spies, not just newer ones. Immediately extinguishing yourself is great, and you can still finish off the pyro if you have good Ambassador aim or crits on the diamondback, or you can cloak away. To quote FSOAS: "An inconvenienced spy, is better than a dead one."
I still remember the reserve shooter being considered a crutch on pyro.
I'd argue that most of the time the spycicle isn't really a crutch. If you're good enough you should be able to escape with or without the bonuses. At most by having the stock knife you might get a lone pyro who lit you from failing your first stab but I can't imagine having any of the other possible near by classes letting you go scott free since you already been discovered. Unless I guess they run at you and you trick stab 3 other people while having after burn or something.
The Kuni's argument tends to go like this:
It is a stomping weapon. Therefore, only when you significantly outclass the enemy team, will you really benefit from this weapon. So it locks your skill level to being a pub stomper, with little use outside of that.
A similar argument is made for the Eyelander.
In most cases it stops you from doing your job. As a spy, you should be removing important targets such as Medics, and Engineers to hinder ubers and sentry nests, or a line holder enemy, typically a Heavy, Solider, or Demo. Likewise, that is what the Demo knight needs to do. But both weapons drop your health, and add on a penalty to death which stops you from making an important difference in the game.
Therefore, because the Kuni and Eyelander both stop a player from growing in his role, they become handicap crutch weapons.
The Sydney Sleeper isn't a crutch weapon.
It's wildly unpopular, but it's still a way to inflict jarate from, well, Sniper range - and that faster charging shots means that it's very easy to just melt classes, with whoever survives now being vulnerable to minicrits.
Minicrits are so good because they effectively turn every weapon into a sniper rifle.
I don't care what does what, if I see something I can have potential fun with I'd try it, if I expect dying often as a medic I'd actually attempt vita-saw, I'd like if the weapon was reworked slightly instead of losing max hp. Maybe a vulnerability. It's underused for that reason losing max-hp
Manntreads are a crutch for market gardeners or, something, idk I just thought I'd add fuel to that fire.
The only crutchless gardener loadout is
-Stock Rocket launcher, Stock Shotgun, and Market Gardener
@@svovy5358 you need a market gardener to get garanteed crits?!
I guess you could call the change that the YER recieved a 'crutch' change, since it made the YER easier for new players to use but harder for experienced players.
Rest In Peace, Jarate splash on headshot. You didn’t deserve to be completely removed. 😔
Muscle memory is probably the biggest problem for the Loch and Load. Those faster no-tumble pills decrease close-range spread and increase Demo’s range significantly, but the price of entry to get good with it is _high_ especially for stock/bomber Demos.
Nevertheless, I respect those Demos who have practiced well with the weapon regardless of how rare that is.
people REALLY underestimate the sydney sleeper, pumped 30k kills into the thing.
I’ve played TF2 for around 400 hours, I will happily admit that I use the Blackbox as a crutch. There’s just some weird disconnect in my brain that doesn’t let me rocket jump effectively.
i always used to get hate for using a black box but it was my favorite australium and my friend got me one for my birthday, damn right im gonna use it😂😂
The razorback is S tier in medieval mode. Other than that, the spies will just shoot you instead.
To me the spycicle is a straight upgrade. Yea not having a knife is not a downgrade because you'd be dead anyway.
there should be an all class melee which is crutches and what it does is double your speed and give you infinite crits with the only downside being you can't equip it if you have more than 50 hours on the game
As someone who uses the Conch I cannot stand the Black Box, there are just so many situations where an extra rocket comes in handy and far less instances where it’s healing gimmick actually pays off. Sure when it does it’s great, but it doesn’t matter if you’re down a rocket and needed another 80 damage to finish off the heavy that’s about to turn you into Swiss cheese.
i still argue that the loch n load shouldve just been rverted to having two shots with the damage bonus
When you could 1 shot scouts by hitting them mid jump?
@@noname-vw5qw You could only one shot scouts when random damage spread was enabled on Valve server because otherwise you could only do 120 damage at most.
@@rickdice2444 not true you hit him mid jump knocks him to the ground and fall dmg finishes him.
@@noname-vw5qw that was before they fixed the random damage spread it used to have even then the direct hit can do the same
Looks like no-one know that scorch shot can destroy sticky bombs.