pyro stupid class Note: This video does not intend to discriminate against ethnicities and/or sexual preferences, I only wish to talk about why pyro bad. -Author
Yeah it's kinda fucking busted. Free afterburn was a terrible idea, at least with the detonator you actually have to time your det to set people on fire. The Scorch Shot is just "sit on dispenser and fire at choke"
@@doomemes1778 I think that reflects are still harder to do, even if you think they are easy and you should be rewarder more for taking more of a risk. And you can shoot your feet, bait an airblast, use your other weapons or avoid fighing your counter.
Also most flares travel at a speed of around 2000 hammer units per second, on a front closer to home for the creator of the vid, the direct hit has rockets that travel at 1980 hammer units per second. I guess the direct hit takes no skill when compared to the flare gun, detonator, and man melter. The only real flare that doesn’t take skill is the scorch shit.
@FORK Probably just you lol, if you already have experience with aiming other projectiles you can transfer that experience over to similar projectile weapons.
@@mr.absolute8556 Rocket jumping originally was an exploit in the original quake (and by extension team fortress because it was a mod for quake), the developers just decided to make it an official feature in TF2.
Soldier mains when flicking your brain on autopilot and mindlessly spamming projectiles relatively close to someone to stunlock them can be prevented with proper timing and skill:
@@goldenpengu >W+M1 with the dragons fury >Airblasting with the dragons fury also the fact that pyro has to perform a difficult tech just to break even is ridiculous
I’m not even a pyro main and I don’t think this is a good take. A shìt ton of your points are from the perspective of a soldier. Classes hard counter other classes. Spy? Practically anything thats not a medic. Engineer? Demo. Soldier? Pyro. If you know what’s gonna happen, why fight him? You can pick your fights in tf2. Don’t pick a fight in which you know the pyro will counter you.
@Mike Hawk not really. I’ll give a few examples of ways to either get out of a fight you know you can’t win, or ways to prevent yourself from getting in those bad situations Spy: can definitely pick his fights Sniper: ever fight is his fight from a distance Medic: observing your team and deciding who is going to keep you safe and be strategic and who will abandon you in the dirt Demo: seeing a scout coming after you? Sticky jump away. Seeing a heavy? Run away. Heavy: not a lot of ways to get out of a bad situation Becuase of speed, but attempt to stay out of major sight lines because of snipers Engineer: pretty much screwed Scout: you have the movement speed to get out of a bad situation. Soldier: you have rocket jumps for a reason. If you see a bad situation, you have the tools to get out. Pyro: don’t go for sentry nests, or heavy’s Tf2 is just one of those games where things hard counter other things, and only by being effective with your class and knowledgeable about your weaknesses and strengths will allow you to pick your fights
if a spy kils you as a pyro it doesnt mean pyro is any less fucking op he can literaly kill you from across the map with flares what happened to him being close range
I suppose my greatest issue with these sorts of videos is that pyro faces ridiculous scrutiny for this while other classes often fly under the radar. Have you ever wondered why so many in the casual community main soldier? Soldier is far stronger in W+M1 situations as his range is not radically restrained like pyro, and he can be just as effective in close range combat due to his immense splash damage. While the capacity to land direct hits exists, more often than not a soldier will never need to be concerned with that in casual games. In this respect, soldier remains largely unpunished for W+M1'ing due to his superior mobility and larger healthpool. However, I believe that soldier has this blind stigma that, due to having a high skill ceiling, he must consequentially have a high skill floor, when in reality soldier has perhaps the lowest skill floor while being effective and benefiting his team. NOTE: I am not saying that W+M1 is some amazing feat of geometry and calculus, but I am saying that other classes simply get a pass for it, which is quite unfair should you ask me.
@@captaingoomba6907 Yeah Scout: Equip the bonk or winger and two shot the medic before instantly dying Soldier: Abuse kritz medic or use cheaper weapon combinations Pyro: Phlog+Scorchshot+Medic go brrrr Demoman: Play on dustbowl or goldrush and spam stickies Heavy: Nothing really, while he can be unskilled they usually get killed by a sniper before they are actually effective Engi: Either build on last the whole game or go battle engi and suicide bomb yourself just to build an "epic sentry" Medic: I guess do the medic girlfriend but when was the last time you've seen that, and no, skial doesn't count Sniper: Machina+Razorback or Machina+Jarate+Bushwaka go brrrrr Spy: More suicide bombing to get a medic.
Honestly seen a lot of hate and defense for pyro I main pyro and I can say with absolute confidence that I don't care about what anyone says or what anyone feels, I'll play the class that I find fun because it's neat so I'll continue using my Detonator and Dragon's Fury along with my Backscratcher and flank on happily
I am using always a shotgun and pyromains still annoying to fight if your a pyromain i am sure why your giving your Shit on a video about a dude who uses atleast a decent class with skill requirement
@@tonivoul1971 Get better aim. Soldier is too much for even the best pyro to chew through before a few shotgun shells domes them. Clearly you are just bad.
@@blueberryslushie9868 excuses The pyro class needs no absolute skill to play with him I am main soldier with a shotgun and blackbox And trust me i met very experienced and high level players who used pyro class and destroyed the whole team Bro admit it pyro class is just too easy to play And other classes are not easy to play I use scout pretty often so i can have a couple of kills on a nooby pyro But The experienced players will end me with the flaregun delay and critical hit while i am burning Truly the pyro class a no skill class who makes other classes day disgusting
@@tonivoul1971 Every game needs an easiest class or nobody would play them. You are literally just bad at the game. If you still die to pyros, I can tell you right now that you Have bad positioning skills Don't know how to consistently hit your shots Don't know how to play the rocket delaying mindgame Panic every time you get lit on fire Walk in straight lines Don't know when to retreat And keep wandering away from your team and losing their support. ALL of this is proven by the simple fact that you are complaining here about dying to pyro. Pyro is countered by literally just being an intelligent human being and not rushing in without your team, staying calm when taking damage, dodging and weaving whenever possible to avoid flares or any other projectiles, positioning yourself away from possible ambush spots, and delaying close range rockets in a pattern the pyro cant memorize. ALL of these skills are important for EVERY situation, and will make you a better player by learning them. Pyro is the get good class. You either get good or keep dying to him. So I suggest you stop being a little crying bitch boy and start learning to play the game.
@@blueberryslushie9868 tbh when i see a pyro from a far distance i will retreat or i will cover my self from the flaregun shots From soldier i can kill more pyros as a scout and it is an enjoyment to me to see them suffer This made the scattergun an amazing gun and mad milk good Now i play less soldier if i have to take on a pyro i use scout which is more affective Even he can one shot me i can kill him from a far distance. So scout is a good class that can do something to pyro Fast speed to dodge Fast speed to go far away from him It is the only class i can use to counter him
When the soldier main gets angry over a reflect rocket and makes a video essay on why pyro takes no skill. Also as a pyro main I can agree that pyro doesn’t take much skill to play but it’s HARD to master him. Good job on the video!
...You do realize every class is hard to "master", right? It's literally called "Mastery" for a reason, because you've spent so much time doing something, that you have the perfect process embedded into your head. I will admit, this video might be a bit... 1 sided... But it should of course be noted, that all classes take a lot of time to master. Yes, even the Heavy. No harsh feelings of course, just the truth.
"but it's hard to master it" As if pressing one button into the ground on a close range with the person,make him have no chance of doing something while he's in the air and then using the flare gun that deals 90 crit damage with said range is harder than doing trickstabs
"Well yes its easy to punish mistakes stop doing them train your placement instead of complaining like a baby" -me at every player that rage for no reason
Good point but the thing is that punishing should not make a class be able to shut down completely another class for example, a scout can counter a denoman, but he can't shut hem down completly
@@nplt8392 ye but he doesnt stop every bullet coming out of his gun as long as the heavy us aware thats why sl you wouldnt think of spy in this situation
you forgot to add that pyro's airblast can completely negate an uber, something that takes a lot of time and survival to build up only to be shut down or severely set back by a pyro just spamming M2
@@concorde9065 bruh wym "just use the quick fix" why do you think stock uber exists? It's best for taking down nests, and tanking insane amounts of fire. Quick fix is not enough.
@@GhostofFarta I meant to avoid knockback, if you're taking down a nest then yes sometimes it isn't enough but in pubs flashing the constant 100 health per second on your team mates can be quite useful. They have different applications
@@GhostofFarta why doesnt the ubered being just shoot the pyro? its that simple just press m1 at the non uberd pyro and you can continue to destroy nests
i clicked on this video thinking there would be a point to all of this. It was just a sweaty soldier main complaining about a class with no real arguements except “pyro takes no skill” and a rebuttal of “pyro takes no skill” air blasting rockets is hard at close range which is where the pyro needs to be to actually do damage waiting an extra second to shoot a rocket will kill any pyro. Any competent scout will destroy pyro as long as he’s smart enough.
I hate playing against pyro, but airblasting at close range is harder than long range. The airblast takes more cooldown and soldier can just spam rockets
@@randoshmuckarias1296 not exactly. pyro has a low skill floor, but a high skill ceiling. where a class like sniper has a high skill floor and low skill ceiling.
Apparently my old comment with all the replies bugged and I could no longer reply, so I'll put everything I wanna say here. Lets talk teamplay. First off, 2fort doesn't count in this argument. TEAM Fortress 2 is not a deathmatch game. Talk of balance should be centered around game modes like CP and PL, where there are a set of lines like the front and back line that have to be considered by players in order to succeed. So lets talk about some classes and their roles and how they pertain to Pyro. Starting with the most obvious, spies. Spies will be found in the enemy lines and are the only class that should be there due to their set of skills. Those skills can DECIMATE the entire team. Even a garbage F2P 0 hours spy can suddenly land their very first backstab on your ONLY medic, while they were about to initiate an uber push. Obviously, this is bad. The heavy they were coordinating with then dies because they are now overextended without the invincibility they planned for, the enemies now have a very clear opening to push, the lack of a healer leads to more and more massively impactful deaths, the couple of people huddled around a dispenser get stickied to death, and the enemy team captures the point with the final touch of destroying the engineer's sentry. Point lost. And not only that, but this could start a roll that loses the team the entire match. If you want to talk about overpowered, a spy with nothing stopping him is overpowered. So what do you expect to stop him if your whining and complaining gets you your pyro nerfs? Pyro specializes specifically in denying the sheer game changing power of Spy. Even though he has such low DPS compared to other damaging classes, his DPS is so heavily guaranteed at close range that spies stand no chance unless they manage to outsmart, outmaneuver and outplay the pyro. And no, that is NOT a sign of being overpowered like youre about to whine about. Its a COUNTER. And spy has plenty of ways to counter the counter, both literally in the case of DR and the spycicle, and mentally in the case of memorizing pyros flamethrower range, avoiding predictable hiding spots, utilizing the loud noise of a spychecking pyro to cover decloak noise, and other such spy tricks. So we now have two classes, one counters the other, but if one is bad and the other is good, the good one will most likely come out on top no matter what, and if both are good, its intense, its suspenseful, its a test of the skill of both players, both the pyro for trying to predict the sneaky frenchman, and the spy attempting to avoid the crazed fire lover while sneaking in vital picks. I would love to see you try and twist that into a "pyro OP" crying fit. Next we have the Soldier, pretty much the main character of the comics, America loving, fought the Nazis so hard that he only stopped a few years after the war was already over, stupid as hell, and unnaturally explosive resistant. Soldier is by far the most powerful class in Team Fortress 2. Rockets hit for some heavy damage when used correctly, mastering rocket jumping makes them even faster than the Scout, splash damage exists, health that can only be exceeded by the Heavy or a demoknight with full heads, Soldier is at the top. Nothing beats the pure consistency and fun of playing Soldier. And thats not even taking banners into account. Theyre probably the most powerful secondary items in the game. But place a team against a soldier main and, of course, that power starts to show a bit too much. Nobody can stop him, the medic he will inevitably attract makes him genuinely unkillable, and crockets just hurt the soul in a way nothing else does. So what do you do? Play pyro, and learn how to airblast. But the soldier main expects that, he starts delaying those rockets. What do you do? Delay the airblast, of course. But then he notices that too. He fires his rocket instantly again, well now you have to change your timing back, and now hes delaying again, youre delaying too, the tension is palpable, until FINALLY... He fires a rocket at a timing you weren't expecting and you die. That was an accurate depiction of a fight between a soldier main WITHOUT a shotgun and a pyro main. Unlike what the whiny idiots who just wanna spam their rockets as hard as possible will say, pyro VS soldier is not a losing battle. Its an intense mindgame at best, and a trivial, sad little win at worst... Because Soldier is capable of equipping the shotgun. As many have said in many comments, the shotgun completely counters Pyro. Its consistent, it hurts like hell, and it can't be reflected back in your face. By pulling out a shotgun and knowing how to hit your shots, you as a giant wad of 200 health american muscle can more easily outdamage a pyro with the shotgun than any other class. Even missing a few shots completely will still leave you with plenty of health for you to pump lead into the pyro while he desperately tries to keep his stream of flames on you and chew at that monstrous health bar. The shotgun is honestly overkill when you can instead try to mindgame with rocket timings, but if you're bad at such timing games, the option is there for the price of your shoes or your banner. Now, you may be about to say, "Waaaahh but the afterburn will kill him afterburn unfaaaaiir". You are playing soldier. To put things lightly, if you dont have a medic worshipping your big stompy american boots, you're doing it wrong. Not to mention there is a guaranteed engie in every match, and even the stupidest engie knows to build a dispenser so they can upgrade their sentry. Even if the dispenser is off the beaten path, you should still be close enough to it if you're playing WITH your team like you should be. And if you're being a roamer soldier, well, health packs also exist, and if you can't find one, then dying to afterburn is just a part of the roamer experience, get over it, if you know how to rocket jump then you can just get back to where you were mere seconds after you leave spawn. A lot of this argument also applies to Demoman, including the mindgame of delaying pills and playing WITH the team to avoid afterburn, as well as knowing what you're getting into when you decide to roam. Now lets talk Scout. People love to bring one thing up. The disproportionate levels of effort. Yes, it is absolutely true. Pyro can deal damage easier than Scout can. But here's the thing... So can Soldier. So can Demo. Scout isn't meant to be EASY, dipass. If anything, he is the hardest class in the game. He's a speedy pick class capable of 2shotting almost the entire class roster. So dont come at me trying to whine about disproportionate effort. Here's the plain facts. Scout is a pick class. In a fight against multiple people, he is almost guaranteed fucked. He lives on the flanks and preys on anyone and everyone who is alone and helpless. Realistically, pyro VS scout should be a rarer occurrence, because any good scout knows how to prioritize targets. If a scout sees a medic or a sniper or anything else that is fucking over their teams push, they'll generally go for them rather than the pyro, as picking a fight with a pyro is too risky as Scout. Assessing the risk of picking a fight is important as scout, so generally a scout should stay away from a pyro to avoid being afterburned to death. This is why, in general, scout mostly has items that help him ESCAPE pyro rather than fight him. Mad milk will cure afterburn, but not if hes currently being burned. Of course, I could go on and on about all the characters, but that would be boring to sift through. So lets get to the biggest point. Pyro. What does PYRO bring to a team. Well, Lazypurple defines it best. Pyro is a bodyguard of epic proportions. That scout who overextended to try and pick the medic? Flamed down. That soldier who is trying to bomb the team? Reflected and flared. Pyro is a powerful class, but ONLY when he is actually amongst his team. A lone pyro will lose almost any 1v1 with the other classes that they can expect to end up fighting no matter how good they are, as long as that enemy class can hit their shots, delay their rockets, etc etc. Pyro is made to stomp out the overextenders, the idiots, the fresh installs who dont understand how the game works. But he is NOT a dominating class. Notice one thing about most pyro frag videos compared to most soldier or scout or demo frag videos. Its always single or double or triple kills. Its always an insane reflectjump into detonator jump into fire puff into axtinguisher with +attack bound to use the Schadenfreude instantly. But with other classes, its some cool airshots and an insanely huge killstreak. Pyro can get killstreaks like any other class, but he does so by staying in his team and bodyguarding, not by WM1ing into the enemies and getting 20 kills instantly without anyone shooting him back. Pyro doesn't roam the map accumulating kills, he punishes and he makes it tougher for the enemy team to successfully push his team. And without him, no team would be able to survive the spy who is going for the medic, the scout trying to 2shot the top scoring soldier, the three soldier mains bombing your sentry base and everyone around it, and everyone else on the enemy team. Pyro keeps ALL of that to a manageable level, scaring off pesky scouts, sweeping spies, and ensuring that the soldiers are punished for spamming their rockets. They are required for the games health, and nerfing them will only ruin that dynamic. The ONLY pyro item that needs nerfing is the scorch shot by taking away the exploding flare. End. Of. Story.
While I agree that pyro takes skill here's some counterpoints in my opinion #1: As much as spy v pyro is fun, there is a line, that line being when the team has had enough you having fun and decides to all go pyro, or when there's that one pybro that always knows where you are, and your basically forced to look like a dushbag with your dead ringer and spycicle screaming "I'm a little bitch" #2: Shotgun is not overkill in my opinion, any competant pyro knows to stay away from that shiny, lead pumping beast the second in comes out, why? the reasons you said, and they'll either pull out a shotgun of their own or flare shot them, which can make it really difficult when up against a really good pyro #3: Afterburn is cheeky, it's whole design is kinda meant to be that ace up your sleeve that can just barely give you that kill on your target, but sometimes that ace wins you a little too much money, and teaches you to gamble a little too hard, metaphors aside afterbun can slow down the pyro learning process as long as you are capable of dealing enough damage especially with stock, at the end of the day as long as you can strafe that scout long enough it's a guaranteed kill on the poor bostonian unless he happens to find his lucky health pack. That's it though, other than that you hit the nail on the spot.
12:25 To be fair, if you are in this scenario, u have guboats equipped, then don't deal with the pyro. Let your teammates deal with them, this game doesn't revolve around you, soldier main. Soldier is already easy enough to main, man. Don't make yourself look more stupid by overcomplicating the easiest mechanics and every game ever: "shoot at the ground, and if that don't work, shoot MYSELF off the ground, and if THAT don't work, run away"
@@aguidner7285 People say a lot that Heavys an easy class but in a game with bad teammates I've single handley had to carry my whole team. When ever a Medic gives me an Uber I feel like I earned that. For all Heavy mains it's a thankless job
As a pyro main, I see where you are coming from. In the beginning, he doesn't take that much skill. But you forget how many responsibilities a pyro has in a match. He has to spy check, reflect, remove sappers, put down ubercharges, AND still be an offensive player all at the same time. If you think about it, he is pretty balanced. He does tons of damage, has no reload time, and an airblast. But he has to get very close to you in order to do significant damage. He has one of the lowest HP levels in the game, and gets one-shot by just about anything I will be respectful, but if you're a scout against a pyro, you should know that that is not a fight you could win easily. He may be EASIER than most classes to pick up, but the responsibilities he has outweigh his mechanics.
I do have one question why do airbuses objects have to mini critic why can't they simply just do normal damage in fact why do they even have to deal with damage why can't it simply just delete projectiles in general
@@jaredmizzell869 because that is really boring, thats what the olf short circuit did it was boring af. This makes pyros skill ceiling way bigger, you can aim it at them, or other people, or rocketjump with their rockets, you can make demos detonate themselves, pipes are different with their trajectories, and its minicrits because it would just be better to play soldier against the soldier, this way if a soldier is retarded and just shoots at you from long range, you can punish that or have free rockets against others. Its minicrits so the direct shit pocketed soldier wont have a medic if hes not carefull. This whole class is designed to punish cocky players. Regular rockets wouldnt feel like a big enough incentive to switch their playstyle
@@eeeguba432 I feel like you're forgetting one more thing if Air blust was a lot more precise than I would get your point but it's way too forgiving in fact you can air blast someone behind there back
EXACTLY, half of pyro is positioning and understanding what your matchups are and "should i ambush this heavy medi combo?". Hes like scout in the way that he should pick his fights and ambush people at least on attack. he supports his team by reflecting, extinguishing, spychecking, and if the medic ubers him, clearing out chokeholds or sentry nests pretty easily
@@log-e1882 airblast is mostly timing and guessing when the soldier or demo is going to shoot, its mostly a mind game once you know how to reflect on a mechanical level. Especially if you are close enough that you have to reflect it before you can see the projectile
For some odd reason people who play FPS games tend to view the ability to aim as more skillful than mastering the movement mechanics and developing a solid sense of positioning. Even though in reality mastering keyboard manipulation and developing a sense of what's going on around you when you lack peripheral vision are both harder than learning how to precisely slide a lightweight object along a flat surface.
Wanna counter pyro? Pick Engie , build a sentry. Done. Although the Pyro is the actual weakest class in the game (being chased by Spy after) The most powerful thing the Pyro has is a Phlog and a Medic Uber. (w/o the uber ur gonna die to a sentry) And airblast a really good mechanic that forces Medics to not just w+m1 a heavy and uber him then win the game. Afterburn is quiet easy to get rid of if you are not playing on a koth map. And if you are a Scout and you dont want to die to a Pyro , dont approach. Seriously if you are dying to a pyro on 1v1 just stop pressing w on your keyboard after seeing him (If he camps in a corner , nothing much to say). And the airblast prevents the Soldier from spamming with a kritzkrieg and killing all the team. And if you dont wanna get airblasted your kritz projectiles , pick a Demo and stickyspam. When you do that Pyro's airblast is quiet useless against sticky launcher. All you gotta do is caring and knowing whats Pyro good at and being cautious.
Pyros can airblast sentry rockets to destroy sentries, and sticky spammers are easy to rush. If you could play anything other than pyro, you would know this.
the fact that i have to pick a certain class just to deal with a pyro and not just have options for the class I'm already playing is pretty stupid but, I will respect your opinion.
@@iamme2739 I'll take a look how you play with lvl 3 sentry all the time. In atack lvl2 is same if not better because of moving that gear up, there is no rockets in. Even if it's lvl3, so you probably stay somewhere to keep it save (if you are leaving 530 metal somewhere, go yeehaw and someone destroy this stupid ai, don't complain), also pyro can't destroy it from 1 rocket, almost never from 2, and in case to launch 1 rocket pyro have to take at least 32 damage. Just stop being a wall and learn game please
@@ME-wy5uv no, he has less hp than heavy (and in close range speed does not matter), less dps, and even if you do step away from him dps will go deep down to 0. Also demo and soldier can do better from feather ranges
fun fact: when pyro was first shown in Team Fortress (1999), he was made as a class for people with really bad internet. That means pyro is a spray and pray class made for people who don't play video games/Game Journalists. That's why pyro is so OP, he's not meant to go full pro, it's a "well shit, there goes my internet, guess I'll play as" class, or a "I'm gonna let my little brother play now, I'll just switch too" class.
What is more difficult? A: Press M1 at the ground 1 or 2 times and kill an opponent. B: Press M2 with correct timing (though slightly forgiving range) and aim your screen towards your target, dodging other attacks as all this is going on since rockets (except for direct hit and LL) go kind of slow.
I’m planning on doing some research and understand why pyro is such a hated class in order to make a video about sometime. This has helped see a lot of the pyro’s issue from a design perspective and from the viewpoint of other class mains. Even if this video was ironic, it still helped give me insight on people’s opinions about the class. Thanks bro!
I know the awnser of this, it's a mix of the combination of mixing airblast, wm1, flame particles blinding players, airblast spam, annoying unlockable weapons and toxic furry pyro mains, airblast is very annoying and if the pyro is good at the game he can shut down completly explosive classes, denoman is completly hopeless against pyro, he can do shit. Soldier has a shotgun but most soldier like using the banner for defense and gunboats for offense, the shotgun is not a fun weapon to use as soldier to most people, the elephant of the room, wm1 is extremely annoying when pyro is getting kuckynor has a pocket, unlockables such as phlog scorch shit, flare gun, backburner make it way worse, flame particles also, even if you switch to the shotgun you can barley see the pyro cause of the fire making you almost hopeless, toxic furry pyro mains come from kids that are having real life problems and want to take their rage by playing pyro and that there are many fury cosmetics for pyro and they look good on hem, that concludes , coming from a demo/soldier/pyro main
@@costaricaam just like any other class 🤣 I could speak endless about sticky spamming, 40km splash that 1shots scout, op ubersaw, sniper backpacks (aka fuck you pyro, spy or everyone), op natasha, pocket medicks etc etc etc, but if you look closely, most of these problems have simple counter. Also what is wrong with these "eh he, I want to use gunboasts, they are best item in game y thre are situatins wher thr is beter optons uaaaa" people, 3 clicks is not very hard, just do it, changing weapon is normal when you have hundred of them, come on
@@epicsandvich014because of slowing down enemies, while reved up, it's arguably better than stock. Yes, classes like heavy or demo aren't this much affected by slow down, but much easier tracking on faster classes And killing air momentum of rocket jumpers is just too good. Also a resistance on top (I know about a bug that allows you to theoretically ignore all slowdown effects by spamming A and D keys - well, i even use it often when playing bonk. But it's hard to pull off, and realistically it doesn't negate all stun, so you're still doomed, especially against natasha as a scout)
@@licemere9899 in my experience in 90% of situations where you are using the natascha you would have gotten the kill faster or anyways if you had good tracking. The Natascha is good if you can’t track but if you just learn how to aim it’s a downgrade. But hey that’s just my opinion
@@jh047o a class shouldnt change how you play the game. people can play however they want and if someone doesnt want to use the shotgun they have the option but pyro forces you to change your loadout
man I hope they nerf the engineer's sentry guns. I wanted to play as a pure demoknight but was forced to change into a hybrid demoknight because I can't fight a sentry gun otherwise
@@pixll9045 wy cant I tak bas jumpr and shild and kil everything? That's what loadouts are made for, most of them Are SITUATIONAL. There is no loadout useful in all situations, just change for second, that's not so hard, this is not how you play game with 100+ different weapons
People love to cry about every aspect of pyro, things that are quite easy to deal with, such as; Keeping distance, watchout for corners and stop firing reflectable projectiles. While pyro is fairly fast, they are also pretty vulnerable, to the point where it's mostly about who gets the drop on the other. The w+m1 argument is so dumb. All classes moves forwards, backwards and strafe, while holding / mashing m1. Pyros just happens to be foced to be in your face while doing so. A position where they are the most vulnerable. The short version is; If you die to a pyro, it's either a coincidence, the pyro outplayed you, or you were an dumbass. Pyro got a lot of forgiving tools, but they are still easy to deal with.
@@largin386 So, do you remember when I said "watchout for corners" or "it's likely a coincidence"? Also, almost any class can instantly kill you when you run into them, from around a corner. You sound like you never have ran right into a random crit soldier or demo or scout, or demo trap, or heavy, or sentry nest. Alot of things will kill a scout instantly, so what is your point?
@anonymous shadow048 I would go with; Avoid close range, watchout for corners and doors, and be aware that projectiles might come back to you. I know that pyro is incredibly strong on paper, being able to counter a handful of the other classes, but that's on paper. In my experience as a pyro main and from dealing with pyros; Most pyros don't airblast every projectile that comes their way and some of the time when they do, the reflected projectile don't hit nothing. One flare shot is not going to kill you (unless you're allready badly wounded), it usually takes two or even three. And having a low fire rate, makes them practically warning shots, giving you plenty of time to back-off when hit by one. When a pyro kills you it's either because he got the drop on you, it's a coincidence, or because you underestimated the pyro player. When you do watchout and you do read the pyro players, learning what they individually are cable of, they are easy to deal with. And this is something you should do with any enemy in any game.
@anonymous shadow048 Huh, I never thought about using the degreeser to reload faster. (ahem, DEGREE) But yeah, we don't have to argue that pyro have some incredible strong sides. As you said; A focus from a pyro is likely to kill you, and if a backburner, phlog or just random crit (which isn't ok) pyro ambushes a team, he's gonna send them all back to spawn. But that's the point of pyro, that's his design. Kinda fast, with high close range damage, but somewhat squishy. But pyro ain't the only class who can destroy a whole team in seconds. So can heavy, soldier, demo and spy. Spy can infact do it without warning the enemy team when he's doing chain stabs, while having the perfect tools to get behind his targt. Pyro gets a lot of hate because he's very easy to pickup and be effective with, but I think that people forget how vulnerable he also is. I also gotta say that I think he got a high skill ceiling with flare jumping, using others' projectiles to rocket jump and so on. A good pyro is scary man. But I think minimum skill requirement for effectiveness, of a pyro, keeps most players from mastering him. But at the end of it all I'm gonna stand by my words, that pyro is fair and what you gotta do to deal with one, is to watchout, keep distance and back off when you get burnt.
I'm a noob pyro with less than 30 hours to the game and my poin is that: what the video says is correct in every aspect but the problem (at least for me) is that when i am in a fight with an other guy i find myself very outmanuvred, a scout can simply outrun me or go back if he sees me behind a corner, a competnet sniper can shoot me the first time i get expose or when i chase someone else, an heavy popping around a corner can annihilate me and with the sandwitch is save from afterburn, hitting anithing in the distance is pretty rought because the bullet of the flaregun is moving slow and require experience to use appropriately. Clearly the piro required less competence to use, scout or demo have a very difficult time, but i dont think that the pyro is immortal too strong as a class. this is my tought, the video is a hell of fun.
I main pyro and can tell you that what this guy says is just salty tears. Every class can w+m1. Pyro isn't even that good at it. Soldier, heavy, demo, scout all like to w+m1/spam and can do it harder and better than pyro. Not to mention that none of those classes has the ability to support their team like pyro can.
Yes, because of his well known ability to become completely invisible to the enemy eye, who cannot see his giant flames or his short range at all. According to that one time I was killed by after-burn just before being healed, he may be the strongest class in TF2, and perhaps in gaming history due to his sheer contributions to the salt-mines of TF2
I am sure thats not true, maybe they will get a few undeserved kills by using the strongest loadout pyro has to offer (phlog, scorch shit, and powerjack) but pyro takes skill contrary to popular belief. If you want fire damage, you put yourself at risk since you need direct sight to actually kill someone. Just w+m1 24/7 never works
@@renzofirpo4686 you have to at least try if you want to have a single clue on how actually playing it is. Any idiot can say playing spy takes no skill or playing engineer takes no skill without knowing anything about how actually playing them works.
The thing with pyro is that he requires the other team to be coordinated which in pubs is usually hard to do. Other than keep m1 the same but reduce afterburn damage to 1/3 rd of its current capacity except on the dragons fury as that requires some semblance of aim
when you have the clip of pyro detonator jumping doesnt that look familiar like that one class whats his name oh yeah soldier and what can soldier do market garden and what does pyro do detonator jump its bassicaly almost the same (i am not salty or angry at you)
@@costaricaam ah yes, because thats the hard part xd sure not the jump and strafing. The detonator is weaker than rockets too, he has to also do 2 things before landing, i tried both. Trolldiering is easier
Hilarious video, only things I disagree with are the "engie initiated stalemates" and "pyro is useless in 6s". Adressing them one at a time: -Engie is the least impactful class in highlander, classes like Scout, Soldier, Heavy, Demo, Medic and Sniper are far more impactfull. Most stalemates happen because Sniper exists actually, you simply cant peak a sightline because he exists. The single reason why everyone is out to get him and constantly feed to kill him is just so the team is able to walk finally. -Pyro is weak to run full time, not worthless. Pyro is able to fuck shit up in last points because they have to walk into chokepoints to push (5cp lmao). Also the uber denial ability of the airblast is insane, if your team has massive uber disad, a pyro can make the enemy uber unusable by sacrificing himself to save the game. Of course the higher up you go in divisions the less you will need to do this, since people wont feed every three milliseconds, but still.
I legitimately can't tell if this video is a joke directed at pyro defenders or pyro complainers, so congratulations? Like, no way it's not a joke, but the question is who exactly are you supposed to be mocking with said joke? Did you intend for it to be a Schrödinger's cat, or did you accidentally manage to make one? Someone please send help.
Puff and sting does take skill though, you have to predict where the enemy pyro will be so you can leave lingering flames to combo them with a flare or an axtinguasher (bad spelling by sorry). In a 1v1 scenario, this is significantly harder than juggling your opponent with rockets.
@@fuuunnniiipaaapppeeerclooo495 with the downside of being a. slow as heck b. about as effective as throwing a rock at a piece of wood anywhere slightly further than close range c. extremely vulnerable to flankers, snipers and spies d. unreliable in almost every situation except when the enemy is right in your face pyro? a. has the powerjack and has slightly faster walkspeed than most other classes b. scorchshit and basically any flare gun resolves pyro's issue of being dogwater at mid range c. hard counters spy and can w+m1 to no end to deal with flankers d. can excel against every class except MAYBE heavy in close range
Imagine being a spy minding your bussiness getting behind the enemy but you bumped a random pyro around the corner you couldn't have seen coming and now you have no option but to die because the afterburn completly gets rid of your ability to be stealthy (and your HP on top of that)
While I do have many nitpicks with this video, you never really seem to acknowledge how a competent Pyro will almost always lose to another competent class. Smart Scouts will tank the damage or just outmanoeuvre the flames and kill you in to clean meat shots. Smart Soldiers will typically avoid Pyros altogether because they're aware that they shouldn't mess with them, but even if they decide to they can get two clean meat shots with a shotgun or unpredictably shoot their rockets. Even the classes that are more vulnerable to Pyro like Medic and Spy can outplay him. A REALLY good Medic can out dps a Pyro and should be positioned where there team can fight the Pyro off for them. A REALLY good Spy can still trickstab a Pyro if they're sneaky enough. Also, I don't get the argument that a Sniper won't fight a Pyro. If the Sniper is using the jarate, cozy camper, or darwin's danger shield (which are all common choices) then they won't really be affected by the fire damage and a smart Pyro won't peak a Sniper because they should know that dealing some fire damage isn't worth the risk of being headshot. Edit: Just read this, that was a lot longer than what I thought it would be.
I don't think I'd mind fighting pyro so much if: -The airblast cone made sense. I've had rocket jumps airblasted before -flame particles were consistent. It can be hard to tell where the effective range of particles are and I'm pretty sure lag makes it even more wonky -why does he have melees that delete sappers. If I go through the effort of killing an engi while he has an active sentry I should be rewarded with destroying the buildings
You sure there is the sniper that can snipe you from your spawn all the way from another galaxy and pyro needs to be in you to do max dmg and sentrys just sentrys that's it
Ok, but reflecting a pipe to get a kill needs skill for demoman as well as the pyro because you need to understand how his projectiles travel, their speed, and when to air blast. I have my most hours on demoman, so for me airblasting pipes isn’t that hard, but I used to be shit at them
as a soldier main you should know, dont shoot the rocket launcher at him since soldier has so much mobility you can easily disengage or use a hitscan secondary if you got it
the problem with pyro is that hes insanely strong in low level play, but pretty bad in high level play. Hes also just not very fun to fight against. "Oh whats that? you don't like the fact that pyro can completely stop uber pushes and make demoman/demoknight impossible to play? Too bad kid, you're obviously just bad at the game. Get good." Now I understand the fact that pyro is a hard counter to demoman, but hard countering is completely different from making a class completely unplayable. Pyro hard counters spy, but does that mean you cant play spy at all? No. Engineer counters scout, but does that mean a scout cant do anything do an engineer/sentry nest? No. Pyro hard counters demoman, but does that mean demoman has almost 0 options against a slightly competent pyro? Yes. Also the fact that flamethrowers can get random crits is bullshit. But who knows, maybe I'm just salty because the 2 classes I play a lot (soldier and scout) can have a hard time with pyro.
pyro is my least played class in the game , and i always stand the idea of "low skill floor , high skill ceiling" but you did bring up lots of good arguements here , goodjob expaning more on the subject! p.s. the loud noises - stop that shit
@@Izayoink_Saccuy yeah thats just called spychecking, thats why a spy should wait for an uber or whatever other distraction, trust me, i have a lot of shit to do as pybro, there will definetelly be times when i leave the nest
there's only one thing this video could apply to and that is wm1. now what i mean isn't like the times where your doing your thing and randomly decide to wm1 for a bit. i mean like backburner without using it for its intended purpose.
@@xdmememaster5403 1. Out of flamethrower range or dodge the flare 2. Same way you dodge a DH rocket or a pipe or a crossbow bolt 3. Same way you dodge and counter any other shotgun 4. If you actually find a pyro who can m2 effectively, try to throw off their timing. Make them panic and m2, and then once they airblast exploit the cooldown. Alternatively, don't feed them projectiles 5. Dragon's Fury still has the same range limitation, plus it's objectively harder to aim. Hell, you can counter the DF with airblast ffs
I agree with this video but I'm still gonna play the class, I feel good helping my teammates out by destroying the sappers and extinguishing dudes. Also I honestly only use the shotgun, but I do W+M1 if the guy gets close.
Maybe a good way to prevent the WM+1 'playstyle' that plagues new Pyros would be to add some form of 'overheat' counter to the flamethrower. The counter ticks up the longer you hold M1; The higher it is, the less time your enemies will suffer from afterburn. It slowly decreases while the flamethrower is not in use. If you hold M1 long enough, the afterburn inflicted on enemies would very quickly dissipate. IMO this would increase the skill cap of the various flamethrowers, as Pyro players would then need to determine when it's a good idea to hold down and when to not, it would also prevent Pyros from pushing the cart and randomly flaming around, and it would encourage the Pyro to use their other weapons while waiting for the overheat to decrease. Synergy between items is encouraged with almost every class (L'Etranger+DR, Demoknight items, etc) and Pyro doesn't really have that. His flamethrowers are gimmicky at best and fucking broken at worst
I was expecting you to talk about how you can one shot any 125 hp class from any range from 125 to 0 with the scorch shot, without even needing a crit. It just needs to bounce on the target.
There is a lot wrong with this video. While I do think afterburn provides way to much value in specific situations and that the scorch shot should be nerfed, I can also recognize that Pyro is not as bad as you have portrayed him as in reality (even most of the clips you showed were staged 1v1s). In reality, almost every situation has counter-play that is easy enough to learn even for someone like me that doesn't put thousands of hours into the game. For example, at around 6:30 you did your rollout and carelessly shot a rocket at a Pyro knowing that he had the flamethrower equipped and that he had the high ground, making it easier for him to hit crit splash damage on you. Furthermore, that pyro had to put a lot more skill into that particular kill than you would have because he would have to react to the speeding soldier blasting onto the point, predict where you would shoot and where you would go, and then reflect all in time to hit you while you were on a bad spot. I can quickly say that each of the situations you mentioned has some pretty easy counter-play: Scout can either out burst damage the Pyro or use mad milk for sustain or even use the pistol and just fight him out of range, the soldier can equip the shotgun or bait out airshots/splash behind the pyro/pick his fights better, the demoman can overwhelm the pyro with a combo of stickies and pipes to bait out airblasts or even just take the high ground with his stickies so that the pyro will have to take into account the arc of a pipe and where the demo is moving to shoot him back (or he might not even be able to airblast it back anyways because of the pipe arc), engie and heavy pretty much always win against pyro anyways in a 1v1 so im not sure why you made an acceptation to your 1v1 rule for heavy, medic is fucked by everyone and so is spy, and sniper can just not get hit by a projectile from half way across the map because thats how shooters work? you hit and dont get hit? although i will admit that the scorch shot is bs and makes no sense. oh and the reason there are no sweat mge pyros is because he takes advantage of sprawling maps and the enemy team being bunched up for most of his kills, in mge you usually find good players that know how to do what I just mentioned above and ya know, position themselves properly and understand class counters. ps you made a seven minute video with edits and were wrong, so any response has to be at least half that lol. ig its a good way to shut down criticism.
I just got insulted for 17 minutes and I enjoyed it lol but honestly I dig where you're coming from, but I intentionally try and stray away from the W+M1 bullshit and try and combo my attacks. Plus I play more defensively being a Pybro. I liked it, hilarity ensued
as a scout, you easily dodge the flare with a double jump for example you can jump on the pyro's head and get your second meatshot, or if you tend to jump in try jumping away as a mix up and finish them with your pistol. and if the pyro spams m2 he's a free kill (even for me and I'm bad at scout) soldier: stagger the timing of your shots, shoot at his feet, or use a shotgun (FYI pyros don't think they have "won" just because you switch to a shotty) demo: stagger the timing of your shots, use rollers, use stickies heavy: use anything but brass beast or natasha engineer fight him near your sentry gun if you have one up (which you should) med and spy: shoot, run, pray sniper: if he spams flares use the cozy camper or pay attention and dodge one last thing: airblast has a much smaller hitbox than it used too and it no long stuns you so learn how to air strafe. Pyro is not the problem your, stubbornness is.
Finally, a player that tells the truth. Soldier has the same skill floor as Pyro, but ends up being more effective at max skill ceiling. It is just unfair imo.
the soldier takes a lot more skill than pyro, all because rocket jump, just see what pro players can do with rocket jumps, its hard as fuck to get good at rocket jump as they are
@@jotaa9660 yes, but here's the thing. Soldier only takes skill during mastering, not during basics or beginning. Meanwhile, Pyro is REQUIRED to learn every single thing about him just to remotely get to the same level as Soldier (a basics soldier, a master one can shred a pyro no matter pyro's skill which is bullshit).
soldier mains when they discover that they probably should stop shooting the pyro that airblasted their every predictable rocket and killed a teammate with them:
As played this game more and more, my maining pyro became less about playing the game and more about making people suffer. This game is ass. This class is ass. Its a match made in heaven. See yall in scorchshot hell.
Im a pyro main and most of the mains are just W+M1 users with the occasional M2 press, which does take no skill i wont lie. i use dragons fury with the flare gun and powerjack, sometimes switching to degreaser and homewrecker to help against spys with engis. but i usually dont use airblast at all because i dont care to get the timing right and i also think it make a pyros gameplay much more harder against soldiers and that makes things more fun. it makes me think about how i would go about fighting soldiers instead of pressing M2 all the damn time. so if any pyro main is reading this, try to not use airblast as much, as it actually makes the game more fun.
I kinda see the opposite. Playing with airblast gives pyro a lot more breathing room especially with other flamethrowers and also gives quite a lot of utility. It might be hard to get the hang of but once you master it, dealing with soldiers is easy work especially if they throw rockets at you mindlessly. 2 solid reflects and that soldier is *_G O N E ._* no need to combo, no need to dodge rockets while closing the distance, just ez pz lemon squeezy. Also you can push away stickies, stuff über pushes, keep spies away from buildings, and push enemies into walls or positions where a follow-up combo is easier. Also if you time it right you can reflect a rocket into the ground next to you and rocket jump really fast and really far, which can be really cool and handy but it’s kinda tricky to do
![[TF2] Punishing Pyros: The American Way](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tFHEHN6bnEg/mqdefault.jpg)
"hes trash at long range"
laughs in shit shot
*laughs in shotgun*
@@gamesclips380 how is shotgun long range
@@mysticaltree4875 well it really isn't unless if it wants to be
Not the shit shot. Its rhymes better as the scorchshit.
Yeah it's kinda fucking busted. Free afterburn was a terrible idea, at least with the detonator you actually have to time your det to set people on fire. The Scorch Shot is just "sit on dispenser and fire at choke"
This mans got reflected once and snapped lmao
Some casual shitter like me reflected him and laughed at him with the taunt one too many times xd
This seems less like a factual vid and more of a salty I got bodied by a pyro cuz he kept reflecting my rockets.
If a pyro reflects a rocket and it hits you in the air, doesn't that mean that he airshoted you?
why wouldn’t it
the rocket literally goes 2x as faster, it is like loch n' load if it was a rocket launcher (faster than direct hit)
@@doomemes1778 I think reflected projectiles retain their speed, they just deal minicrits
@@davitdavid7165 they shouldn't, IT'S MY FUCKING ROCKET WHY DO AN AIRBLAST MAKE IT DO MINI-CRITS? PUNISHMENT? HAVE YOU SEEN THE AIRBLAST HITBOX NOW?
@@doomemes1778 I think that reflects are still harder to do, even if you think they are easy and you should be rewarder more for taking more of a risk. And you can shoot your feet, bait an airblast, use your other weapons or avoid fighing your counter.
Nooo, you portraid me as a soyjack, MY ARGUMENT IS DESTROYED.
I am sorry who is crying again ?
@@jh047o me of course
@@spaceman2737 seriously...learn how to use the shotgun idiots
@@jh047o Yeah I get it. Tf2 is about being adaptable and changing your loadout on current situation. Not to have 100% best loadout for every situation
@@spaceman2737 you are one of the most creatures that cry daily..right there with the witch.
Oh, so hitting air flares is unskilled but hitting airshots with rockets is? Wtf
Also most flares travel at a speed of around 2000 hammer units per second, on a front closer to home for the creator of the vid, the direct hit has rockets that travel at 1980 hammer units per second. I guess the direct hit takes no skill when compared to the flare gun, detonator, and man melter. The only real flare that doesn’t take skill is the scorch shit.
@@anitabath8315 agreed
@FORK Both still take skill though, one might be harder but that doesn't make the other brain-dead no skill baby mode
@FORK Probably just you lol, if you already have experience with aiming other projectiles you can transfer that experience over to similar projectile weapons.
@FORK Cool, not sure how that's relevant lol
Use the liberty launcher, nobody uses it so most pyros don’t know how fast the projectile is and they can’t reflect the rockets.
Oh yeah, its really annoying xd its such an inbetween it passes every time. Screw you :p
Funny every time you use it. Some pyros ragequit lamo. Sadly the liberty sucks
I play both soldier and pyro and yeah it's very hard to deal with that launcher as pyro
but what if the pyro can reflect direct hit rockets
@@eggflavoredsoda you're basically screwed
"player who exploits game mechanics" isnt that what rocket jumping is
Kinda??? ... You can't just make a HOLE in the surface of space and time.
not really, explosives where designed to push you back so that you could rocket jump, there is a cannonical explanation for rocket jumping even.
@@mr.absolute8556 You just explained a game mechanic
@@user-kn9yy3ee2p yeah but i wouldnt consider it an exploit because it was intended to be that hard.
@@mr.absolute8556 Rocket jumping originally was an exploit in the original quake (and by extension team fortress because it was a mod for quake), the developers just decided to make it an official feature in TF2.
Soldier mains when their class has a soft counter (Just like every class in the game, wow)
tell me one class that counters pyro
@@goldenpengu Hard: Heavy, Engineer
Soft: Sniper, Scout
Unless they're using the dragons fury, then its
Hard: Darwins Danger shield (lol)
Soft: Soldier, demo
Soldier mains when flicking your brain on autopilot and mindlessly spamming projectiles relatively close to someone to stunlock them can be prevented with proper timing and skill:
@@garrangery8180 airblast to almost all of the, you can still w m1 darwin's panic attack to heavy.
@@goldenpengu >W+M1 with the dragons fury
>Airblasting with the dragons fury
also the fact that pyro has to perform a difficult tech just to break even is ridiculous
I’m not even a pyro main and I don’t think this is a good take. A shìt ton of your points are from the perspective of a soldier. Classes hard counter other classes. Spy? Practically anything thats not a medic. Engineer? Demo. Soldier? Pyro. If you know what’s gonna happen, why fight him? You can pick your fights in tf2. Don’t pick a fight in which you know the pyro will counter you.
Hard agree
@Mike Hawk not really. I’ll give a few examples of ways to either get out of a fight you know you can’t win, or ways to prevent yourself from getting in those bad situations
Spy: can definitely pick his fights
Sniper: ever fight is his fight from a distance
Medic: observing your team and deciding who is going to keep you safe and be strategic and who will abandon you in the dirt
Demo: seeing a scout coming after you? Sticky jump away. Seeing a heavy? Run away.
Heavy: not a lot of ways to get out of a bad situation Becuase of speed, but attempt to stay out of major sight lines because of snipers
Engineer: pretty much screwed
Scout: you have the movement speed to get out of a bad situation.
Soldier: you have rocket jumps for a reason. If you see a bad situation, you have the tools to get out.
Pyro: don’t go for sentry nests, or heavy’s
Tf2 is just one of those games where things hard counter other things, and only by being effective with your class and knowledgeable about your weaknesses and strengths will allow you to pick your fights
or you could just use a shotgun or be really unpredictable
@Mike Hawk the only one who can't is the heavy
@@the_apotecary_from_tf2 but even heavy has chance because of ton of hp
are we not gonna adress the pain spys go through against the pyro who is literaly wm1 and making his flames go everywere in existance
Not really, you just need to gun down the player
@@abcedariumu8033 You cant gun down the pyro when YOU CANT FUCKING SEE
@@soggyasscereal6506 I don't consider myself deadly
im a pyro main and you dont know how uch i have been killed by a spy the class thats SUPPOSED to be counterd by pyro
if a spy kils you as a pyro it doesnt mean pyro is any less fucking op he can literaly kill you from across the map with flares what happened to him being close range
I suppose my greatest issue with these sorts of videos is that pyro faces ridiculous scrutiny for this while other classes often fly under the radar. Have you ever wondered why so many in the casual community main soldier? Soldier is far stronger in W+M1 situations as his range is not radically restrained like pyro, and he can be just as effective in close range combat due to his immense splash damage. While the capacity to land direct hits exists, more often than not a soldier will never need to be concerned with that in casual games. In this respect, soldier remains largely unpunished for W+M1'ing due to his superior mobility and larger healthpool. However, I believe that soldier has this blind stigma that, due to having a high skill ceiling, he must consequentially have a high skill floor, when in reality soldier has perhaps the lowest skill floor while being effective and benefiting his team. NOTE: I am not saying that W+M1 is some amazing feat of geometry and calculus, but I am saying that other classes simply get a pass for it, which is quite unfair should you ask me.
Yeah! Every single class can be annoying braindead w + m1, but it's only pyro that ever gets shit on for it. It's super dumb.
@@captaingoomba6907 huh, heavy feel right)
@@captaingoomba6907 except for spy
@@captaingoomba6907 Probably because other classes have hitscan weapons that you actually need to aim, whereas pyro uses flamethrower.
@@captaingoomba6907 Yeah
Scout: Equip the bonk or winger and two shot the medic before instantly dying
Soldier: Abuse kritz medic or use cheaper weapon combinations
Pyro: Phlog+Scorchshot+Medic go brrrr
Demoman: Play on dustbowl or goldrush and spam stickies
Heavy: Nothing really, while he can be unskilled they usually get killed by a sniper before they are actually effective
Engi: Either build on last the whole game or go battle engi and suicide bomb yourself just to build an "epic sentry"
Medic: I guess do the medic girlfriend but when was the last time you've seen that, and no, skial doesn't count
Sniper: Machina+Razorback or Machina+Jarate+Bushwaka go brrrrr
Spy: More suicide bombing to get a medic.
Soldier mains: No, you can't play like a braindead person and get away with it.
Pyro mains: haha fire goes fshshshsh.
I'm a pyro main and I still get hit by rockets lol
I think geo bro is suffering from a major skill issue lmfao
Can we get a parody or something off this but with sniper being op?
jUsT DoN’t gO iN HiS SigHtLinEs
Snipers not op
Just get good
Just don't get in my sight bro! Sniper isn't op!!
@@Game-ne5nb yeah but he's fucking annoying
"Fantastic, this was a huge waste of my time."
"WELL THIS WAS A DISAPPOINTMENT."
Honestly seen a lot of hate and defense for pyro
I main pyro and I can say with absolute confidence that I don't care about what anyone says or what anyone feels, I'll play the class that I find fun because it's neat so I'll continue using my Detonator and Dragon's Fury along with my Backscratcher and flank on happily
I also use that exact loadout!
When the angry Soldier main actually gets up and puts a video together to rationalize his cope:
I am using always a shotgun and pyromains still annoying to fight if your a pyromain i am sure why your giving your Shit on a video about a dude who uses atleast a decent class with skill requirement
@@tonivoul1971 Get better aim. Soldier is too much for even the best pyro to chew through before a few shotgun shells domes them. Clearly you are just bad.
@@blueberryslushie9868 excuses
The pyro class needs no absolute skill to play with him
I am main soldier with a shotgun and blackbox
And trust me i met very experienced and high level players who used pyro class and destroyed the whole team
Bro admit it pyro class is just too easy to play
And other classes are not easy to play
I use scout pretty often so i can have a couple of kills on a nooby pyro
But
The experienced players will end me with the flaregun delay and critical hit while i am burning
Truly the pyro class a no skill class who makes other classes day disgusting
@@tonivoul1971 Every game needs an easiest class or nobody would play them. You are literally just bad at the game. If you still die to pyros, I can tell you right now that you
Have bad positioning skills
Don't know how to consistently hit your shots
Don't know how to play the rocket delaying mindgame
Panic every time you get lit on fire
Walk in straight lines
Don't know when to retreat
And keep wandering away from your team and losing their support.
ALL of this is proven by the simple fact that you are complaining here about dying to pyro. Pyro is countered by literally just being an intelligent human being and not rushing in without your team, staying calm when taking damage, dodging and weaving whenever possible to avoid flares or any other projectiles, positioning yourself away from possible ambush spots, and delaying close range rockets in a pattern the pyro cant memorize. ALL of these skills are important for EVERY situation, and will make you a better player by learning them.
Pyro is the get good class. You either get good or keep dying to him. So I suggest you stop being a little crying bitch boy and start learning to play the game.
@@blueberryslushie9868 tbh when i see a pyro from a far distance i will retreat or i will cover my self from the flaregun shots
From soldier i can kill more pyros as a scout and it is an enjoyment to me to see them suffer
This made the scattergun an amazing gun and mad milk good
Now i play less soldier if i have to take on a pyro i use scout which is more affective
Even he can one shot me i can kill him from a far distance.
So scout is a good class that can do something to pyro
Fast speed to dodge
Fast speed to go far away from him
It is the only class i can use to counter him
>soldier main mad
Also loud == funny and right, right?
yes loud things are funny
Fireworks are funni
When the soldier main gets angry over a reflect rocket and makes a video essay on why pyro takes no skill.
Also as a pyro main I can agree that pyro doesn’t take much skill to play but it’s HARD to master him. Good job on the video!
...You do realize every class is hard to "master", right?
It's literally called "Mastery" for a reason, because you've spent so much time doing something, that you have the perfect process embedded into your head.
I will admit, this video might be a bit... 1 sided...
But it should of course be noted, that all classes take a lot of time to master.
Yes, even the Heavy.
No harsh feelings of course, just the truth.
In any case, why should we even bother playing any class besides Engineer Pompson B)
run at the enemy pressing m1+w
@@Manomed3 my dude you just unlocked pyro's true power
"but it's hard to master it"
As if pressing one button into the ground on a close range with the person,make him have no chance of doing something while he's in the air and then using the flare gun that deals 90 crit damage with said range is harder than doing trickstabs
"Well yes its easy to punish mistakes stop doing them train your placement instead of complaining like a baby"
-me at every player that rage for no reason
Good point but the thing is that punishing should not make a class be able to shut down completely another class for example, a scout can counter a denoman, but he can't shut hem down completly
@@costaricaam Heavy and sniper matchup
@@nplt8392 ye but he doesnt stop every bullet coming out of his gun as long as the heavy us aware thats why sl you wouldnt think of spy in this situation
@@nplt8392 fists of steel
you forgot to add that pyro's airblast can completely negate an uber, something that takes a lot of time and survival to build up only to be shut down or severely set back by a pyro just spamming M2
then just use the quick fix
@@concorde9065 bruh wym "just use the quick fix" why do you think stock uber exists? It's best for taking down nests, and tanking insane amounts of fire. Quick fix is not enough.
@@GhostofFarta I meant to avoid knockback, if you're taking down a nest then yes sometimes it isn't enough but in pubs flashing the constant 100 health per second on your team mates can be quite useful. They have different applications
but all forms of knockback do that, also negating an uber can save games
@@GhostofFarta why doesnt the ubered being just shoot the pyro? its that simple just press m1 at the non uberd pyro and you can continue to destroy nests
i clicked on this video thinking there would be a point to all of this. It was just a sweaty soldier main complaining about a class with no real arguements except “pyro takes no skill” and a rebuttal of “pyro takes no skill” air blasting rockets is hard at close range which is where the pyro needs to be to actually do damage waiting an extra second to shoot a rocket will kill any pyro. Any competent scout will destroy pyro as long as he’s smart enough.
I hate playing against pyro, but airblasting at close range is harder than long range. The airblast takes more cooldown and soldier can just spam rockets
One time i managed to get a sticky spammer to blow himself up after reflecting his sticky at him then he baites one sticky to blast me with another.
@@Subject_Keter its because holding down m2 with stickies auto detonates them as soon as they are ready they would have probably held down m2
thats like saying "soldier only requires a highground and rocket spam to be an effective class"
All I see here is a 17 minute video about a salty soldier main, ranting about how much he hates airblast
note how this is one of the only comments that isn't hearted, spittin facts
Pyro takes no skill to play but takes lot's of skill to master
Actually true
Wow almost like.........every other class.
@@randoshmuckarias1296 i guess
@@randoshmuckarias1296 not exactly. pyro has a low skill floor, but a high skill ceiling. where a class like sniper has a high skill floor and low skill ceiling.
i mean yeah, lowest skill floor but like all the other classes has a really high skill ceiling
Apparently my old comment with all the replies bugged and I could no longer reply, so I'll put everything I wanna say here.
Lets talk teamplay. First off, 2fort doesn't count in this argument. TEAM Fortress 2 is not a deathmatch game. Talk of balance should be centered around game modes like CP and PL, where there are a set of lines like the front and back line that have to be considered by players in order to succeed.
So lets talk about some classes and their roles and how they pertain to Pyro. Starting with the most obvious, spies. Spies will be found in the enemy lines and are the only class that should be there due to their set of skills. Those skills can DECIMATE the entire team. Even a garbage F2P 0 hours spy can suddenly land their very first backstab on your ONLY medic, while they were about to initiate an uber push. Obviously, this is bad. The heavy they were coordinating with then dies because they are now overextended without the invincibility they planned for, the enemies now have a very clear opening to push, the lack of a healer leads to more and more massively impactful deaths, the couple of people huddled around a dispenser get stickied to death, and the enemy team captures the point with the final touch of destroying the engineer's sentry. Point lost. And not only that, but this could start a roll that loses the team the entire match. If you want to talk about overpowered, a spy with nothing stopping him is overpowered. So what do you expect to stop him if your whining and complaining gets you your pyro nerfs? Pyro specializes specifically in denying the sheer game changing power of Spy. Even though he has such low DPS compared to other damaging classes, his DPS is so heavily guaranteed at close range that spies stand no chance unless they manage to outsmart, outmaneuver and outplay the pyro. And no, that is NOT a sign of being overpowered like youre about to whine about. Its a COUNTER. And spy has plenty of ways to counter the counter, both literally in the case of DR and the spycicle, and mentally in the case of memorizing pyros flamethrower range, avoiding predictable hiding spots, utilizing the loud noise of a spychecking pyro to cover decloak noise, and other such spy tricks. So we now have two classes, one counters the other, but if one is bad and the other is good, the good one will most likely come out on top no matter what, and if both are good, its intense, its suspenseful, its a test of the skill of both players, both the pyro for trying to predict the sneaky frenchman, and the spy attempting to avoid the crazed fire lover while sneaking in vital picks. I would love to see you try and twist that into a "pyro OP" crying fit.
Next we have the Soldier, pretty much the main character of the comics, America loving, fought the Nazis so hard that he only stopped a few years after the war was already over, stupid as hell, and unnaturally explosive resistant. Soldier is by far the most powerful class in Team Fortress 2. Rockets hit for some heavy damage when used correctly, mastering rocket jumping makes them even faster than the Scout, splash damage exists, health that can only be exceeded by the Heavy or a demoknight with full heads, Soldier is at the top. Nothing beats the pure consistency and fun of playing Soldier. And thats not even taking banners into account. Theyre probably the most powerful secondary items in the game. But place a team against a soldier main and, of course, that power starts to show a bit too much. Nobody can stop him, the medic he will inevitably attract makes him genuinely unkillable, and crockets just hurt the soul in a way nothing else does. So what do you do? Play pyro, and learn how to airblast. But the soldier main expects that, he starts delaying those rockets. What do you do? Delay the airblast, of course. But then he notices that too. He fires his rocket instantly again, well now you have to change your timing back, and now hes delaying again, youre delaying too, the tension is palpable, until FINALLY... He fires a rocket at a timing you weren't expecting and you die. That was an accurate depiction of a fight between a soldier main WITHOUT a shotgun and a pyro main. Unlike what the whiny idiots who just wanna spam their rockets as hard as possible will say, pyro VS soldier is not a losing battle. Its an intense mindgame at best, and a trivial, sad little win at worst... Because Soldier is capable of equipping the shotgun. As many have said in many comments, the shotgun completely counters Pyro. Its consistent, it hurts like hell, and it can't be reflected back in your face. By pulling out a shotgun and knowing how to hit your shots, you as a giant wad of 200 health american muscle can more easily outdamage a pyro with the shotgun than any other class. Even missing a few shots completely will still leave you with plenty of health for you to pump lead into the pyro while he desperately tries to keep his stream of flames on you and chew at that monstrous health bar. The shotgun is honestly overkill when you can instead try to mindgame with rocket timings, but if you're bad at such timing games, the option is there for the price of your shoes or your banner. Now, you may be about to say, "Waaaahh but the afterburn will kill him afterburn unfaaaaiir". You are playing soldier. To put things lightly, if you dont have a medic worshipping your big stompy american boots, you're doing it wrong. Not to mention there is a guaranteed engie in every match, and even the stupidest engie knows to build a dispenser so they can upgrade their sentry. Even if the dispenser is off the beaten path, you should still be close enough to it if you're playing WITH your team like you should be. And if you're being a roamer soldier, well, health packs also exist, and if you can't find one, then dying to afterburn is just a part of the roamer experience, get over it, if you know how to rocket jump then you can just get back to where you were mere seconds after you leave spawn. A lot of this argument also applies to Demoman, including the mindgame of delaying pills and playing WITH the team to avoid afterburn, as well as knowing what you're getting into when you decide to roam.
Now lets talk Scout. People love to bring one thing up. The disproportionate levels of effort. Yes, it is absolutely true. Pyro can deal damage easier than Scout can. But here's the thing... So can Soldier. So can Demo. Scout isn't meant to be EASY, dipass. If anything, he is the hardest class in the game. He's a speedy pick class capable of 2shotting almost the entire class roster. So dont come at me trying to whine about disproportionate effort. Here's the plain facts. Scout is a pick class. In a fight against multiple people, he is almost guaranteed fucked. He lives on the flanks and preys on anyone and everyone who is alone and helpless. Realistically, pyro VS scout should be a rarer occurrence, because any good scout knows how to prioritize targets. If a scout sees a medic or a sniper or anything else that is fucking over their teams push, they'll generally go for them rather than the pyro, as picking a fight with a pyro is too risky as Scout. Assessing the risk of picking a fight is important as scout, so generally a scout should stay away from a pyro to avoid being afterburned to death. This is why, in general, scout mostly has items that help him ESCAPE pyro rather than fight him. Mad milk will cure afterburn, but not if hes currently being burned.
Of course, I could go on and on about all the characters, but that would be boring to sift through. So lets get to the biggest point. Pyro. What does PYRO bring to a team. Well, Lazypurple defines it best. Pyro is a bodyguard of epic proportions. That scout who overextended to try and pick the medic? Flamed down. That soldier who is trying to bomb the team? Reflected and flared. Pyro is a powerful class, but ONLY when he is actually amongst his team. A lone pyro will lose almost any 1v1 with the other classes that they can expect to end up fighting no matter how good they are, as long as that enemy class can hit their shots, delay their rockets, etc etc. Pyro is made to stomp out the overextenders, the idiots, the fresh installs who dont understand how the game works. But he is NOT a dominating class. Notice one thing about most pyro frag videos compared to most soldier or scout or demo frag videos. Its always single or double or triple kills. Its always an insane reflectjump into detonator jump into fire puff into axtinguisher with +attack bound to use the Schadenfreude instantly. But with other classes, its some cool airshots and an insanely huge killstreak. Pyro can get killstreaks like any other class, but he does so by staying in his team and bodyguarding, not by WM1ing into the enemies and getting 20 kills instantly without anyone shooting him back. Pyro doesn't roam the map accumulating kills, he punishes and he makes it tougher for the enemy team to successfully push his team. And without him, no team would be able to survive the spy who is going for the medic, the scout trying to 2shot the top scoring soldier, the three soldier mains bombing your sentry base and everyone around it, and everyone else on the enemy team. Pyro keeps ALL of that to a manageable level, scaring off pesky scouts, sweeping spies, and ensuring that the soldiers are punished for spamming their rockets. They are required for the games health, and nerfing them will only ruin that dynamic. The ONLY pyro item that needs nerfing is the scorch shot by taking away the exploding flare. End. Of. Story.
Holy shit man
Didnt read
@@sneedchuck9746 Didn't ask
legendary comment. Hope you have a good day, man
While I agree that pyro takes skill here's some counterpoints in my opinion
#1: As much as spy v pyro is fun, there is a line, that line being when the team has had enough you having fun and decides to all go pyro, or when there's that one pybro that always knows where you are, and your basically forced to look like a dushbag with your dead ringer and spycicle screaming "I'm a little bitch"
#2: Shotgun is not overkill in my opinion, any competant pyro knows to stay away from that shiny, lead pumping beast the second in comes out, why? the reasons you said, and they'll either pull out a shotgun of their own or flare shot them, which can make it really difficult when up against a really good pyro
#3: Afterburn is cheeky, it's whole design is kinda meant to be that ace up your sleeve that can just barely give you that kill on your target, but sometimes that ace wins you a little too much money, and teaches you to gamble a little too hard, metaphors aside afterbun can slow down the pyro learning process as long as you are capable of dealing enough damage especially with stock, at the end of the day as long as you can strafe that scout long enough it's a guaranteed kill on the poor bostonian unless he happens to find his lucky health pack.
That's it though, other than that you hit the nail on the spot.
12:25
To be fair, if you are in this scenario, u have guboats equipped, then don't deal with the pyro. Let your teammates deal with them, this game doesn't revolve around you, soldier main. Soldier is already easy enough to main, man. Don't make yourself look more stupid by overcomplicating the easiest mechanics and every game ever: "shoot at the ground, and if that don't work, shoot MYSELF off the ground, and if THAT don't work, run away"
As a Heavy main idc tbh lol. You Soldier mains are funny
heavy will now let bu * gets stabbed *
yeah same lol, i main heavy and i think ive died to a pyro like once
@@staples9897 dying to Pyro as a Heavy when you have a brain is like impossible
Heavy actually takes skill
@@aguidner7285 People say a lot that Heavys an easy class but in a game with bad teammates I've single handley had to carry my whole team. When ever a Medic gives me an Uber I feel like I earned that. For all Heavy mains it's a thankless job
As a pyro main, I see where you are coming from. In the beginning, he doesn't take that much skill. But you forget how many responsibilities a pyro has in a match. He has to spy check, reflect, remove sappers, put down ubercharges, AND still be an offensive player all at the same time. If you think about it, he is pretty balanced. He does tons of damage, has no reload time, and an airblast. But he has to get very close to you in order to do significant damage. He has one of the lowest HP levels in the game, and gets one-shot by just about anything I will be respectful, but if you're a scout against a pyro, you should know that that is not a fight you could win easily. He may be EASIER than most classes to pick up, but the responsibilities he has outweigh his mechanics.
take unlocks in consideration
cof cof (not corona) scorch shit
Thank you fellow pyro main for admitting, pyro is one of my mains and i agree he doesnt take much skill
I do have one question why do airbuses objects have to mini critic why can't they simply just do normal damage in fact why do they even have to deal with damage why can't it simply just delete projectiles in general
@@jaredmizzell869 because that is really boring, thats what the olf short circuit did it was boring af. This makes pyros skill ceiling way bigger, you can aim it at them, or other people, or rocketjump with their rockets, you can make demos detonate themselves, pipes are different with their trajectories, and its minicrits because it would just be better to play soldier against the soldier, this way if a soldier is retarded and just shoots at you from long range, you can punish that or have free rockets against others. Its minicrits so the direct shit pocketed soldier wont have a medic if hes not carefull. This whole class is designed to punish cocky players. Regular rockets wouldnt feel like a big enough incentive to switch their playstyle
@@eeeguba432 I feel like you're forgetting one more thing if Air blust was a lot more precise than I would get your point but it's way too forgiving in fact you can air blast someone behind there back
Tbh every class takes some form of skill, and a brain. even pyro. You need to position well to get the advantage, and airblast takes timing.
EXACTLY, half of pyro is positioning and understanding what your matchups are and "should i ambush this heavy medi combo?". Hes like scout in the way that he should pick his fights and ambush people at least on attack. he supports his team by reflecting, extinguishing, spychecking, and if the medic ubers him, clearing out chokeholds or sentry nests pretty easily
@@danielkang1560 yep! Thats why i like pyro, one of my favorite classes.
Pyro takes skill, just lesser than every class, so people complain, it’s normal and air blast require huge luck also
@@log-e1882 airblast is mostly timing and guessing when the soldier or demo is going to shoot, its mostly a mind game once you know how to reflect on a mechanical level. Especially if you are close enough that you have to reflect it before you can see the projectile
For some odd reason people who play FPS games tend to view the ability to aim as more skillful than mastering the movement mechanics and developing a solid sense of positioning. Even though in reality mastering keyboard manipulation and developing a sense of what's going on around you when you lack peripheral vision are both harder than learning how to precisely slide a lightweight object along a flat surface.
Fun fact: heavy+medic combo is just co-op w+m1
THAT ISN'T-
.....
*THAT ISN'T-*
............
*It's true*
You have to aim your shots more, and you're slow as fuck, so not really
Wanna counter pyro?
Pick Engie , build a sentry.
Done.
Although the Pyro is the actual weakest class in the game (being chased by Spy after) The most powerful thing the Pyro has is a Phlog and a Medic Uber. (w/o the uber ur gonna die to a sentry) And airblast a really good mechanic that forces Medics to not just w+m1 a heavy and uber him then win the game. Afterburn is quiet easy to get rid of if you are not playing on a koth map. And if you are a Scout and you dont want to die to a Pyro , dont approach. Seriously if you are dying to a pyro on 1v1 just stop pressing w on your keyboard after seeing him (If he camps in a corner , nothing much to say). And the airblast prevents the Soldier from spamming with a kritzkrieg and killing all the team. And if you dont wanna get airblasted your kritz projectiles , pick a Demo and stickyspam. When you do that Pyro's airblast is quiet useless against sticky launcher. All you gotta do is caring and knowing whats Pyro good at and being cautious.
Pyros can airblast sentry rockets to destroy sentries, and sticky spammers are easy to rush. If you could play anything other than pyro, you would know this.
let me get this straight, Pyro does takes skill when the opponent is far away, HE IS FUCKING OVERPOWERED IN SHORT RANGE
the fact that i have to pick a certain class just to deal with a pyro and not just have options for the class I'm already playing is pretty stupid but, I will respect your opinion.
@@iamme2739 I'll take a look how you play with lvl 3 sentry all the time. In atack lvl2 is same if not better because of moving that gear up, there is no rockets in. Even if it's lvl3, so you probably stay somewhere to keep it save (if you are leaving 530 metal somewhere, go yeehaw and someone destroy this stupid ai, don't complain), also pyro can't destroy it from 1 rocket, almost never from 2, and in case to launch 1 rocket pyro have to take at least 32 damage. Just stop being a wall and learn game please
@@ME-wy5uv no, he has less hp than heavy (and in close range speed does not matter), less dps, and even if you do step away from him dps will go deep down to 0. Also demo and soldier can do better from feather ranges
fun fact: when pyro was first shown in Team Fortress (1999), he was made as a class for people with really bad internet. That means pyro is a spray and pray class made for people who don't play video games/Game Journalists. That's why pyro is so OP, he's not meant to go full pro, it's a "well shit, there goes my internet, guess I'll play as" class, or a "I'm gonna let my little brother play now, I'll just switch too" class.
Brhu moment for pyro mains xd
@@renzofirpo4686 and you think the class hadn't changed at all in 22 years? Are you brain damaged?
@@konkey9209 ... Huuuummm, no?
@@konkey9209 22 years? what
@@konkey9209 tf2 is gonna have 14 years now
What is more difficult?
A: Press M1 at the ground 1 or 2 times and kill an opponent.
B: Press M2 with correct timing (though slightly forgiving range) and aim your screen towards your target, dodging other attacks as all this is going on since rockets (except for direct hit and LL) go kind of slow.
Actually deluded. Airblast is ZERO skill
ok pyro main 🤡
I’m planning on doing some research and understand why pyro is such a hated class in order to make a video about sometime. This has helped see a lot of the pyro’s issue from a design perspective and from the viewpoint of other class mains. Even if this video was ironic, it still helped give me insight on people’s opinions about the class. Thanks bro!
I know the awnser of this, it's a mix of the combination of mixing airblast, wm1, flame particles blinding players, airblast spam, annoying unlockable weapons and toxic furry pyro mains, airblast is very annoying and if the pyro is good at the game he can shut down completly explosive classes, denoman is completly hopeless against pyro, he can do shit. Soldier has a shotgun but most soldier like using the banner for defense and gunboats for offense, the shotgun is not a fun weapon to use as soldier to most people, the elephant of the room, wm1 is extremely annoying when pyro is getting kuckynor has a pocket, unlockables such as phlog scorch shit, flare gun, backburner make it way worse, flame particles also, even if you switch to the shotgun you can barley see the pyro cause of the fire making you almost hopeless, toxic furry pyro mains come from kids that are having real life problems and want to take their rage by playing pyro and that there are many fury cosmetics for pyro and they look good on hem, that concludes , coming from a demo/soldier/pyro main
@@costaricaam just like any other class 🤣 I could speak endless about sticky spamming, 40km splash that 1shots scout, op ubersaw, sniper backpacks (aka fuck you pyro, spy or everyone), op natasha, pocket medicks etc etc etc, but if you look closely, most of these problems have simple counter.
Also what is wrong with these "eh he, I want to use gunboasts, they are best item in game y thre are situatins wher thr is beter optons uaaaa" people, 3 clicks is not very hard, just do it, changing weapon is normal when you have hundred of them, come on
@@licemere9899 hot take but the natascha sucks ass. Thats my opinion as someone with multiple hundreds of hours on heavy.
@@epicsandvich014because of slowing down enemies, while reved up, it's arguably better than stock. Yes, classes like heavy or demo aren't this much affected by slow down, but much easier tracking on faster classes And killing air momentum of rocket jumpers is just too good. Also a resistance on top
(I know about a bug that allows you to theoretically ignore all slowdown effects by spamming A and D keys - well, i even use it often when playing bonk. But it's hard to pull off, and realistically it doesn't negate all stun, so you're still doomed, especially against natasha as a scout)
@@licemere9899 in my experience in 90% of situations where you are using the natascha you would have gotten the kill faster or anyways if you had good tracking. The Natascha is good if you can’t track but if you just learn how to aim it’s a downgrade. But hey that’s just my opinion
Remember, this is the same youtuber who said bullying is good.
Take what he says with a grain of salt.
Well...what did you expect....he is an idiot that doesn't know there is something called 'shotgun' in their inventory.
@@jh047o a class shouldnt change how you play the game. people can play however they want and if someone doesnt want to use the shotgun they have the option but pyro forces you to change your loadout
man I hope they nerf the engineer's sentry guns. I wanted to play as a pure demoknight but was forced to change into a hybrid demoknight because I can't fight a sentry gun otherwise
@@pixll9045 every class changed how you play the game. thats kinda the point.
@@pixll9045 wy cant I tak bas jumpr and shild and kil everything?
That's what loadouts are made for, most of them Are SITUATIONAL. There is no loadout useful in all situations, just change for second, that's not so hard, this is not how you play game with 100+ different weapons
People love to cry about every aspect of pyro, things that are quite easy to deal with, such as; Keeping distance, watchout for corners and stop firing reflectable projectiles.
While pyro is fairly fast, they are also pretty vulnerable, to the point where it's mostly about who gets the drop on the other.
The w+m1 argument is so dumb. All classes moves forwards, backwards and strafe, while holding / mashing m1.
Pyros just happens to be foced to be in your face while doing so. A position where they are the most vulnerable.
The short version is; If you die to a pyro, it's either a coincidence, the pyro outplayed you, or you were an dumbass. Pyro got a lot of forgiving tools, but they are still easy to deal with.
@@largin386 So, do you remember when I said "watchout for corners" or "it's likely a coincidence"?
Also, almost any class can instantly kill you when you run into them, from around a corner.
You sound like you never have ran right into a random crit soldier or demo or scout, or demo trap, or heavy, or sentry nest. Alot of things will kill a scout instantly, so what is your point?
@anonymous shadow048 I would go with; Avoid close range, watchout for corners and doors, and be aware that projectiles might come back to you.
I know that pyro is incredibly strong on paper, being able to counter a handful of the other classes, but that's on paper.
In my experience as a pyro main and from dealing with pyros; Most pyros don't airblast every projectile that comes their way and some of the time when they do, the reflected projectile don't hit nothing.
One flare shot is not going to kill you (unless you're allready badly wounded), it usually takes two or even three. And having a low fire rate, makes them practically warning shots, giving you plenty of time to back-off when hit by one.
When a pyro kills you it's either because he got the drop on you, it's a coincidence, or because you underestimated the pyro player.
When you do watchout and you do read the pyro players, learning what they individually are cable of, they are easy to deal with. And this is something you should do with any enemy in any game.
@anonymous shadow048 I haven't really played competetive, but can imagine they are scary, cuz they now how to use their tools.
@anonymous shadow048 Huh, I never thought about using the degreeser to reload faster. (ahem, DEGREE)
But yeah, we don't have to argue that pyro have some incredible strong sides. As you said; A focus from a pyro is likely to kill you, and if a backburner, phlog or just random crit (which isn't ok) pyro ambushes a team, he's gonna send them all back to spawn.
But that's the point of pyro, that's his design. Kinda fast, with high close range damage, but somewhat squishy.
But pyro ain't the only class who can destroy a whole team in seconds. So can heavy, soldier, demo and spy. Spy can infact do it without warning the enemy team when he's doing chain stabs, while having the perfect tools to get behind his targt.
Pyro gets a lot of hate because he's very easy to pickup and be effective with, but I think that people forget how vulnerable he also is.
I also gotta say that I think he got a high skill ceiling with flare jumping, using others' projectiles to rocket jump and so on. A good pyro is scary man.
But I think minimum skill requirement for effectiveness, of a pyro, keeps most players from mastering him.
But at the end of it all I'm gonna stand by my words, that pyro is fair and what you gotta do to deal with one, is to watchout, keep distance and back off when you get burnt.
@anonymous shadow048 Ew no. Not unless it got like -25% to -30% damage penalty.
I'm a noob pyro with less than 30 hours to the game and my poin is that: what the video says is correct in every aspect but the problem (at least for me) is that when i am in a fight with an other guy i find myself very outmanuvred, a scout can simply outrun me or go back if he sees me behind a corner, a competnet sniper can shoot me the first time i get expose or when i chase someone else, an heavy popping around a corner can annihilate me and with the sandwitch is save from afterburn, hitting anithing in the distance is pretty rought because the bullet of the flaregun is moving slow and require experience to use appropriately.
Clearly the piro required less competence to use, scout or demo have a very difficult time, but i dont think that the pyro is immortal too strong as a class.
this is my tought, the video is a hell of fun.
i like you
funi
I main pyro and can tell you that what this guy says is just salty tears. Every class can w+m1. Pyro isn't even that good at it. Soldier, heavy, demo, scout all like to w+m1/spam and can do it harder and better than pyro. Not to mention that none of those classes has the ability to support their team like pyro can.
pyro can literaly pub stomp while sleeping and accidently holding buttons
Yes, because of his well known ability to become completely invisible to the enemy eye, who cannot see his giant flames or his short range at all. According to that one time I was killed by after-burn just before being healed, he may be the strongest class in TF2, and perhaps in gaming history due to his sheer contributions to the salt-mines of TF2
I am sure thats not true, maybe they will get a few undeserved kills by using the strongest loadout pyro has to offer (phlog, scorch shit, and powerjack) but pyro takes skill contrary to popular belief. If you want fire damage, you put yourself at risk since you need direct sight to actually kill someone. Just w+m1 24/7 never works
use heavy i guess
@@formidiguy4010 Pyro takes skill as long as you're not abusing the phlogshit combo
@@captaingoomba6907 yes
I think this video was just to make Soldier and Pyro mains really mad, and if it was, you did a great job.
i love when a pyro shoots me one time (once) (1) time with a flare and i take like 90 afterburn
60 afterburner damage, and even then it could have been worse, it could have been a rocket for 100 damage on splash damage after missing you
Damn pyros and landing a skill shot to deal damage
Spoken like someone who's never tried maining them.
You have to main a class for talking about it?
@@renzofirpo4686 you have to at least try if you want to have a single clue on how actually playing it is. Any idiot can say playing spy takes no skill or playing engineer takes no skill without knowing anything about how actually playing them works.
The thing with pyro is that he requires the other team to be coordinated which in pubs is usually hard to do. Other than keep m1 the same but reduce afterburn damage to 1/3 rd of its current capacity except on the dragons fury as that requires some semblance of aim
when you have the clip of pyro detonator jumping doesnt that look familiar like that one class whats his name oh yeah soldier and what can soldier do market garden and what does pyro do detonator jump its bassicaly almost the same (i am not salty or angry at you)
Soldier needs to time it while he's in the air, pyro can land on hem and have another chance to kill hem, slightly different
@@costaricaam ah yes, because thats the hard part xd sure not the jump and strafing. The detonator is weaker than rockets too, he has to also do 2 things before landing, i tried both. Trolldiering is easier
Hilarious video, only things I disagree with are the "engie initiated stalemates" and "pyro is useless in 6s".
Adressing them one at a time:
-Engie is the least impactful class in highlander, classes like Scout, Soldier, Heavy, Demo, Medic and Sniper are far more impactfull. Most stalemates happen because Sniper exists actually, you simply cant peak a sightline because he exists. The single reason why everyone is out to get him and constantly feed to kill him is just so the team is able to walk finally.
-Pyro is weak to run full time, not worthless. Pyro is able to fuck shit up in last points because they have to walk into chokepoints to push (5cp lmao). Also the uber denial ability of the airblast is insane, if your team has massive uber disad, a pyro can make the enemy uber unusable by sacrificing himself to save the game. Of course the higher up you go in divisions the less you will need to do this, since people wont feed every three milliseconds, but still.
I legitimately can't tell if this video is a joke directed at pyro defenders or pyro complainers, so congratulations? Like, no way it's not a joke, but the question is who exactly are you supposed to be mocking with said joke? Did you intend for it to be a Schrödinger's cat, or did you accidentally manage to make one? Someone please send help.
Puff and sting does take skill though, you have to predict where the enemy pyro will be so you can leave lingering flames to combo them with a flare or an axtinguasher (bad spelling by sorry). In a 1v1 scenario, this is significantly harder than juggling your opponent with rockets.
thats a very long way of saying "i dont know how to shoot the pyros with my gun"
soldier mains when mindlessly spamming explosives at an enemy can get countered with proper timing and skill.
i am a pyro main and after this video I am a heavy main now
I like how they say pyro is 2m+w when heavy IS JUST THAT
@@fuuunnniiipaaapppeeerclooo495 true that was the joke cuz heavy is also like wm 1
@@fuuunnniiipaaapppeeerclooo495 with the downside of being
a. slow as heck
b. about as effective as throwing a rock at a piece of wood anywhere slightly further than close range
c. extremely vulnerable to flankers, snipers and spies
d. unreliable in almost every situation except when the enemy is right in your face
pyro?
a. has the powerjack and has slightly faster walkspeed than most other classes
b. scorchshit and basically any flare gun resolves pyro's issue of being dogwater at mid range
c. hard counters spy and can w+m1 to no end to deal with flankers
d. can excel against every class except MAYBE heavy in close range
"snipers at long range can be shot by your secondary and will immediatly piss off"
Darwin´s Danger Shield:*exists*
Jarate*also exists*
@@englishmailbox8830 yeah
Imagine being a spy minding your bussiness getting behind the enemy but you bumped a random pyro around the corner you couldn't have seen coming and now you have no option but to die because the afterburn completly gets rid of your ability to be stealthy (and your HP on top of that)
even if this video is meant to be a shitpost, it gives pretty valid points lmao.
While I do have many nitpicks with this video, you never really seem to acknowledge how a competent Pyro will almost always lose to another competent class. Smart Scouts will tank the damage or just outmanoeuvre the flames and kill you in to clean meat shots. Smart Soldiers will typically avoid Pyros altogether because they're aware that they shouldn't mess with them, but even if they decide to they can get two clean meat shots with a shotgun or unpredictably shoot their rockets. Even the classes that are more vulnerable to Pyro like Medic and Spy can outplay him. A REALLY good Medic can out dps a Pyro and should be positioned where there team can fight the Pyro off for them. A REALLY good Spy can still trickstab a Pyro if they're sneaky enough. Also, I don't get the argument that a Sniper won't fight a Pyro. If the Sniper is using the jarate, cozy camper, or darwin's danger shield (which are all common choices) then they won't really be affected by the fire damage and a smart Pyro won't peak a Sniper because they should know that dealing some fire damage isn't worth the risk of being headshot.
Edit: Just read this, that was a lot longer than what I thought it would be.
bro i dont care i still hate him
Why is there so much motion blur in all of these clips?
thank you for this informative video. i will delete all of my pyro items and ascend to become a tryhard soldier main
Eww motion blur in a video game.
I don't think I'd mind fighting pyro so much if:
-The airblast cone made sense. I've had rocket jumps airblasted before
-flame particles were consistent. It can be hard to tell where the effective range of particles are and I'm pretty sure lag makes it even more wonky
-why does he have melees that delete sappers. If I go through the effort of killing an engi while he has an active sentry I should be rewarded with destroying the buildings
@Oooga Booga Daze this one too
**dont get hit duh**
I think sappers are more of a push incter like a Uber than anything else, why else do sappers give sentry’s armor against your revolvers
He has weapons that destroy sappers because in lore engineer and pyro were roommates just like how soldier and demo and good friends and share weapons
@@asdawasda that has anything to do with balance… how?..
@@GoodlyData86596 i know that but its the reason its there
What's your opinion on market gardener soldiers?
You sure there is the sniper that can snipe you from your spawn all the way from another galaxy and pyro needs to be in you to do max dmg and sentrys just sentrys that's it
The 476 dislikes are from Pyro mains
Ok, but reflecting a pipe to get a kill needs skill for demoman as well as the pyro because you need to understand how his projectiles travel, their speed, and when to air blast. I have my most hours on demoman, so for me airblasting pipes isn’t that hard, but I used to be shit at them
the airblast reflects where you aim too
as a soldier main you should know, dont shoot the rocket launcher at him since soldier has so much mobility you can easily disengage or use a hitscan secondary if you got it
I don't know how to feel about this video there's aspects I both agree with and disagree with
“Pyro doesn’t take skill”
Me a Pyro main with over 1000 hours: *Well Actually*
no it takes no skill
damn those are some 1000 hours you wasted and never will get back
Yeaaah
"Im such a fucking smartass to know how to click fucking m2 to get undeserved mini crit reflects"
Y’all are doin some outdated stereotypes. Pyro is a really hard class to play. Unlike click on people’s heads over there
no
So we are not gonna talk abaut heavy are we?
the problem with pyro is that hes insanely strong in low level play, but pretty bad in high level play. Hes also just not very fun to fight against. "Oh whats that? you don't like the fact that pyro can completely stop uber pushes and make demoman/demoknight impossible to play? Too bad kid, you're obviously just bad at the game. Get good." Now I understand the fact that pyro is a hard counter to demoman, but hard countering is completely different from making a class completely unplayable. Pyro hard counters spy, but does that mean you cant play spy at all? No. Engineer counters scout, but does that mean a scout cant do anything do an engineer/sentry nest? No. Pyro hard counters demoman, but does that mean demoman has almost 0 options against a slightly competent pyro? Yes. Also the fact that flamethrowers can get random crits is bullshit. But who knows, maybe I'm just salty because the 2 classes I play a lot (soldier and scout) can have a hard time with pyro.
You could say the same about splash, tho. And you soldier mains don't rant about that constantly...
pyro is my least played class in the game , and i always stand the idea of
"low skill floor , high skill ceiling"
but you did bring up lots of good arguements here , goodjob expaning more on the subject!
p.s. the loud noises - stop that shit
What do you think about the dragons fury
The only good flamethrower in the game
2:22 what is the scout looking at here.
Nooo you cant just W+M1
Pyro go pffffffff
How 2 play pyro w+lmb+spin
Ah yes, because like 10 damage will kill every class
I'm a spy main if the flame touched me ill fucking died
@@Izayoink_Saccuy yeah thats just called spychecking, thats why a spy should wait for an uber or whatever other distraction, trust me, i have a lot of shit to do as pybro, there will definetelly be times when i leave the nest
Thank I'll take the advice
These transition slides are godly
there's only one thing this video could apply to and that is wm1. now what i mean isn't like the times where your doing your thing and randomly decide to wm1 for a bit. i mean like backburner without using it for its intended purpose.
A pyro is easy to counter, just stay out of his flamethrower's range.
What about his flare
Can't kill him if you can't see sh!t
what about afterburn
what about flares
what about shotguns
what about airblasts
what about dragons fury
@@xdmememaster5403
1. Out of flamethrower range or dodge the flare
2. Same way you dodge a DH rocket or a pipe or a crossbow bolt
3. Same way you dodge and counter any other shotgun
4. If you actually find a pyro who can m2 effectively, try to throw off their timing. Make them panic and m2, and then once they airblast exploit the cooldown. Alternatively, don't feed them projectiles
5. Dragon's Fury still has the same range limitation, plus it's objectively harder to aim. Hell, you can counter the DF with airblast ffs
5:14 oh thats why you made this video...
0:55 wow, I'm impressed. I didn't even see the Pyro, and Scout's faster than him, so he must have been hiding pretty well
Trying to listen to this with headphones is as invalid as these takes
epic, im gonna play more pyro now
Being neglected as a kid makes you want revenge.
I agree with this video but I'm still gonna play the class, I feel good helping my teammates out by destroying the sappers and extinguishing dudes. Also I honestly only use the shotgun, but I do W+M1 if the guy gets close.
If a guy voluntarily comes near you then thats not even wm1 thats just playing the game
Maybe a good way to prevent the WM+1 'playstyle' that plagues new Pyros would be to add some form of 'overheat' counter to the flamethrower. The counter ticks up the longer you hold M1; The higher it is, the less time your enemies will suffer from afterburn. It slowly decreases while the flamethrower is not in use. If you hold M1 long enough, the afterburn inflicted on enemies would very quickly dissipate. IMO this would increase the skill cap of the various flamethrowers, as Pyro players would then need to determine when it's a good idea to hold down and when to not, it would also prevent Pyros from pushing the cart and randomly flaming around, and it would encourage the Pyro to use their other weapons while waiting for the overheat to decrease. Synergy between items is encouraged with almost every class (L'Etranger+DR, Demoknight items, etc) and Pyro doesn't really have that. His flamethrowers are gimmicky at best and fucking broken at worst
I was expecting you to talk about how you can one shot any 125 hp class from any range from 125 to 0 with the scorch shot, without even needing a crit. It just needs to bounce on the target.
The scorch shot is legitimately broken, and needs to be nerfed. Enough said
There is a lot wrong with this video. While I do think afterburn provides way to much value in specific situations and that the scorch shot should be nerfed, I can also recognize that Pyro is not as bad as you have portrayed him as in reality (even most of the clips you showed were staged 1v1s). In reality, almost every situation has counter-play that is easy enough to learn even for someone like me that doesn't put thousands of hours into the game. For example, at around 6:30 you did your rollout and carelessly shot a rocket at a Pyro knowing that he had the flamethrower equipped and that he had the high ground, making it easier for him to hit crit splash damage on you. Furthermore, that pyro had to put a lot more skill into that particular kill than you would have because he would have to react to the speeding soldier blasting onto the point, predict where you would shoot and where you would go, and then reflect all in time to hit you while you were on a bad spot. I can quickly say that each of the situations you mentioned has some pretty easy counter-play: Scout can either out burst damage the Pyro or use mad milk for sustain or even use the pistol and just fight him out of range, the soldier can equip the shotgun or bait out airshots/splash behind the pyro/pick his fights better, the demoman can overwhelm the pyro with a combo of stickies and pipes to bait out airblasts or even just take the high ground with his stickies so that the pyro will have to take into account the arc of a pipe and where the demo is moving to shoot him back (or he might not even be able to airblast it back anyways because of the pipe arc), engie and heavy pretty much always win against pyro anyways in a 1v1 so im not sure why you made an acceptation to your 1v1 rule for heavy, medic is fucked by everyone and so is spy, and sniper can just not get hit by a projectile from half way across the map because thats how shooters work? you hit and dont get hit? although i will admit that the scorch shot is bs and makes no sense. oh and the reason there are no sweat mge pyros is because he takes advantage of sprawling maps and the enemy team being bunched up for most of his kills, in mge you usually find good players that know how to do what I just mentioned above and ya know, position themselves properly and understand class counters. ps you made a seven minute video with edits and were wrong, so any response has to be at least half that lol. ig its a good way to shut down criticism.
although pyro v spy is bs and spy needs buffs
I just got insulted for 17 minutes and I enjoyed it lol
but honestly I dig where you're coming from, but I intentionally try and stray away from the W+M1 bullshit and try and combo my attacks. Plus I play more defensively being a Pybro. I liked it, hilarity ensued
Is he a lime green scout, a spy main, or a soilder that met a skilled pyro
i'm not one minute in and he's already complaining about wm1 _and_ m2
good to know the full range of inputs is off the table then
as a scout, you easily dodge the flare with a double jump for example you can jump on the pyro's head and get your second meatshot, or if you tend to jump in try jumping away as a mix up and finish them with your pistol. and if the pyro spams m2 he's a free kill (even for me and I'm bad at scout)
soldier: stagger the timing of your shots, shoot at his feet, or use a shotgun (FYI pyros don't think they have "won" just because you switch to a shotty)
demo: stagger the timing of your shots, use rollers, use stickies
heavy: use anything but brass beast or natasha
engineer fight him near your sentry gun if you have one up (which you should)
med and spy: shoot, run, pray
sniper: if he spams flares use the cozy camper or pay attention and dodge
one last thing: airblast has a much smaller hitbox than it used too and it no long stuns you so learn how to air strafe. Pyro is not the problem your, stubbornness is.
As a Pyro main, yes
the problem is that soldier takes just as much skill as pyro (none)
Valentina Esposito what do you mean? Are you too scared to admit soldier is easy?
Finally, a player that tells the truth.
Soldier has the same skill floor as Pyro, but ends up being more effective at max skill ceiling. It is just unfair imo.
the soldier takes a lot more skill than pyro, all because rocket jump, just see what pro players can do with rocket jumps, its hard as fuck to get good at rocket jump as they are
@@jotaa9660 yes, but here's the thing. Soldier only takes skill during mastering, not during basics or beginning.
Meanwhile, Pyro is REQUIRED to learn every single thing about him just to remotely get to the same level as Soldier (a basics soldier, a master one can shred a pyro no matter pyro's skill which is bullshit).
Direct hit tho
soldier mains when they discover that they probably should stop shooting the pyro that airblasted their every predictable rocket and killed a teammate with them:
The whole video talking about Airblast broken
Phloginistador left the chat
the last time i played pyro i get dominated by half server trying to airblast and useing flares, also yes scorshot sucks and everyone nows that
Go get em sebastian
Yeeee
As played this game more and more, my maining pyro became less about playing the game and more about making people suffer. This game is ass. This class is ass. Its a match made in heaven. See yall in scorchshot hell.
Half of the comments didn't even watch the video
Im a pyro main and most of the mains are just W+M1 users with the occasional M2 press, which does take no skill i wont lie. i use dragons fury with the flare gun and powerjack, sometimes switching to degreaser and homewrecker to help against spys with engis. but i usually dont use airblast at all because i dont care to get the timing right and i also think it make a pyros gameplay much more harder against soldiers and that makes things more fun. it makes me think about how i would go about fighting soldiers instead of pressing M2 all the damn time. so if any pyro main is reading this, try to not use airblast as much, as it actually makes the game more fun.
I kinda see the opposite. Playing with airblast gives pyro a lot more breathing room especially with other flamethrowers and also gives quite a lot of utility. It might be hard to get the hang of but once you master it, dealing with soldiers is easy work especially if they throw rockets at you mindlessly. 2 solid reflects and that soldier is *_G O N E ._* no need to combo, no need to dodge rockets while closing the distance, just ez pz lemon squeezy.
Also you can push away stickies, stuff über pushes, keep spies away from buildings, and push enemies into walls or positions where a follow-up combo is easier. Also if you time it right you can reflect a rocket into the ground next to you and rocket jump really fast and really far, which can be really cool and handy but it’s kinda tricky to do
a i r b l a s t
Your comments are stupid and illogical but this was a super funny video
Like 1/4 of what he said was kinda bull but this video is hilarious lol
This video is a year old we still got people defending pyro hard