Welcome to Construction Complete! What was something small (in a game you played) that really inspired or got you thinking? [ You can help support the channel on Patreon: www.patreon.com/skorvion ]
I just wonder, why do most Community made-missions don't include crates in their levels? I understand that the vanilla RA2 and TS sometimes didn't have crates scattered around the original campaign map. But only in Sage engine games where they included crates. But it is kinda cool to have crates being put in certain parts of the levels as a reward for exploration. Like.. i remember one Nod mission in Tiberium Wars where we have escort a truck to Temple Prime, in the early game we're given a small squad, like one commandos, & 2 shadow team. If we use the shadow team to explore on left side of the map and the bottom, we'll find some health and cash crate, which is kinda rewarding for players that want some extra funds. But in most community maps, crates are barely used, and we barely see them. Is there an explanation for the design decisions like this? :)
I think it might have to do with the initial approach. In competitive-focused maps, notably mirrored ones, the crates would likely add a randomness factor that could destabilize the intended balance and tournament-like fairness of the experience. In narrative-focused missions, crates are useful if the designer can set it to give a predetermined (accounted for) benefit, so as to avoid accidentally hindering or overpowering the player in that particular setting. So it depends on what a designer is going for. Do note however, that most people are not professional designers (in the community) and might often be improvising or learning as the go. But then again, if the wider community has passively set up a culture in which maps without crates are preferred or played more often, that might influence future map development and help propagate it as the default way of doing things. Any of these factors could play a part in what you're wondering about, but it's ultimately down to the map designer, their knowledge of how crates work, and the direction they want to go with the end-user experience. A development team might have different ideas amongst themselves as to what serves the game better, so compromises or inconsistencies might happen as well. I can only really speak for myself as to my own approach with certainty. I personally love bonus crates, but chose not to focus on them too much in my missions. For example, rather than a health crate, I opted to reward the player with a medic at one point. It's down to design preference, I feel, but also to making decisions based on what serves the experience better rather than what we personally enjoy editing in. Albeit, the way we go about doing that is often subjective, otherwise we wouldn't have any fun in designing maps. :)
I spent so many hours as a kid playing the Command & Conquer games, they did them right. This is such a great video, different, unique and well explained.
Pretty much that exact scenario you described is something I went through in the Twisted Insurrection mod for the latest GDI mission. Saving the armed civilians and minimising the loss to just one trooper and avoid attacking the civilians as well due to weird house choices by the designer. It can be frustrating but whenever I play as GDI I have to save everyone that I can. 😂 This mission looks neat, where could I find it/more of them?
Seeing this makes me want to dig into my box of games in the basement. Really well explained by you on how to play the game and be successful!! Well done! 😀
Awesome video mate i love the command and conquer series, my favourite game to date has to be generals zero hour the time i put into that was crazy haha teaching myself rush tactics to beat people online, hummers full of rocket men haha and fast aircraft general attacks, or sit back on your laser general defences what a game haha great vid brother left a like
I've spent a lot of time designing missions for Zero Hour too, so I know fairly well how amazing of a game it can be. Nice to know you've got such fond memories of it as well! Thanks!
Pretty much that exact scenario you described is something I went through in the Twisted Insurrection mod for the latest GDI mission. Saving the armed civilians and minimising the loss to just one trooper and avoid attacking the civilians as well due to weird house choices by the designer. It can be frustrating but whenever I play as GDI I have to save everyone that I can. This mission looks neat, where could I find it?
Mission design can be quite difficult from the developer's end, as we have to stay aware enough from multiple perspectives on how it plays out, beside the technical aspects. I've played a bit of TW in the past as well, but haven't followed their development in a long while now. The map I featured in this video is of my own design and is part of a short series of missions I've made for fun. I haven't made any of them available for public download yet, so I unfortunately don't have a download location for you to try it out first hand at the moment. I too often have the urge save everyone I can in games in the right context, a bit of my good natured personality always leaks through there, so I get that part. Also, thanks for watching the video and for sharing some of your thoughts!
@@SkorvionGames understood. I should probably say I didnt want to throw shade at the TI team for not anticipating that. But I do really appreciate designers that consider the players choice to that level of depth. I've never gone further than sculpting maps or writing out plans for TS and RA2 maps but multiple choices and open paths were always at the heart of them and I think for more than half of the concepts I played with open ends to the mission was something I would have wanted. The triggers Westwood put into TS that allowed that were GOATed. The mission series that saw GDI take on the chemical missile plant with I think four variants of the actual mission depending on your choices is something I dont think I have ever seen replicated elsewhere and it still blows my mind that undertook that.
@@squishymusic9723 Map design is complicated, yeah, from visuals to gameplay to how it all works in scripts and the backend. All the more reason to appreciate the little things and when something feels good while playing. And agreed, it was really nice to see choices impact missions in the Westwood campaigns. I fondly remember seeing the different map starting positions and effects in certain parts of the campaigns. It added a bit of an extra cool feeling to the whole thing, making the mission selection geo map feel a bit more useful rather than just an aesthetic immersion type of thing.
There is value in smaller choices like that beyond thinking purely in numbers. It's up to the player to decide if and how to approach situations where loses could be taken. You don't have to take any serious loses, but then again this encounter's design doesn't really help the player to intervene quickly - so it's down to what the map design encourages on a case by case basis with a bit of luck from what the player is doing.
That's alright, might just not be your cup of tea. Tiberian Sun does have units and mechanics that you need to learn a bit about and all, but it still plays pretty much like any other Command & Conquer RTS from the Westwood Studios era.
Welcome to Construction Complete! What was something small (in a game you played) that really inspired or got you thinking?
[ You can help support the channel on Patreon: www.patreon.com/skorvion ]
In the TS campaigns many times you could choose between which mission you want to do and that could have effect on a later mission.
@@Csetnikke That is certainly an appreciated addition to the game. Helps you feel like an actual Commander within the story.
I just wonder, why do most Community made-missions don't include crates in their levels?
I understand that the vanilla RA2 and TS sometimes didn't have crates scattered around the original campaign map. But only in Sage engine games where they included crates. But it is kinda cool to have crates being put in certain parts of the levels as a reward for exploration. Like.. i remember one Nod mission in Tiberium Wars where we have escort a truck to Temple Prime, in the early game we're given a small squad, like one commandos, & 2 shadow team. If we use the shadow team to explore on left side of the map and the bottom, we'll find some health and cash crate, which is kinda rewarding for players that want some extra funds.
But in most community maps, crates are barely used, and we barely see them. Is there an explanation for the design decisions like this? :)
I think it might have to do with the initial approach.
In competitive-focused maps, notably mirrored ones, the crates would likely add a randomness factor that could destabilize the intended balance and tournament-like fairness of the experience.
In narrative-focused missions, crates are useful if the designer can set it to give a predetermined (accounted for) benefit, so as to avoid accidentally hindering or overpowering the player in that particular setting.
So it depends on what a designer is going for. Do note however, that most people are not professional designers (in the community) and might often be improvising or learning as the go. But then again, if the wider community has passively set up a culture in which maps without crates are preferred or played more often, that might influence future map development and help propagate it as the default way of doing things.
Any of these factors could play a part in what you're wondering about, but it's ultimately down to the map designer, their knowledge of how crates work, and the direction they want to go with the end-user experience. A development team might have different ideas amongst themselves as to what serves the game better, so compromises or inconsistencies might happen as well.
I can only really speak for myself as to my own approach with certainty. I personally love bonus crates, but chose not to focus on them too much in my missions. For example, rather than a health crate, I opted to reward the player with a medic at one point. It's down to design preference, I feel, but also to making decisions based on what serves the experience better rather than what we personally enjoy editing in. Albeit, the way we go about doing that is often subjective, otherwise we wouldn't have any fun in designing maps. :)
I spent so many hours as a kid playing the Command & Conquer games, they did them right. This is such a great video, different, unique and well explained.
Very grateful for such a comment. I'm glad C&C played a fun role in your childhood as well. Thank you for the uplifting feedback!
Not something i would usually play but another great video, so much information given and you did really well with this!
I understand, but glad you checked it out regardless! Thanks!
Pretty much that exact scenario you described is something I went through in the Twisted Insurrection mod for the latest GDI mission. Saving the armed civilians and minimising the loss to just one trooper and avoid attacking the civilians as well due to weird house choices by the designer.
It can be frustrating but whenever I play as GDI I have to save everyone that I can. 😂
This mission looks neat, where could I find it/more of them?
Seeing this makes me want to dig into my box of games in the basement. Really well explained by you on how to play the game and be successful!! Well done! 😀
I'm grateful for the feedback. Thank you! But don't let classic games crumble away in a basement - shelter them with the respect they deserve. :)
Awesome video mate i love the command and conquer series, my favourite game to date has to be generals zero hour the time i put into that was crazy haha teaching myself rush tactics to beat people online, hummers full of rocket men haha and fast aircraft general attacks, or sit back on your laser general defences what a game haha great vid brother left a like
I've spent a lot of time designing missions for Zero Hour too, so I know fairly well how amazing of a game it can be. Nice to know you've got such fond memories of it as well! Thanks!
man, command and conquer was such an amazing game, I miss some of the older rts games, they did it right lol
C&C games are well known for a reason. :)
Pretty much that exact scenario you described is something I went through in the Twisted Insurrection mod for the latest GDI mission. Saving the armed civilians and minimising the loss to just one trooper and avoid attacking the civilians as well due to weird house choices by the designer.
It can be frustrating but whenever I play as GDI I have to save everyone that I can.
This mission looks neat, where could I find it?
Mission design can be quite difficult from the developer's end, as we have to stay aware enough from multiple perspectives on how it plays out, beside the technical aspects. I've played a bit of TW in the past as well, but haven't followed their development in a long while now.
The map I featured in this video is of my own design and is part of a short series of missions I've made for fun. I haven't made any of them available for public download yet, so I unfortunately don't have a download location for you to try it out first hand at the moment.
I too often have the urge save everyone I can in games in the right context, a bit of my good natured personality always leaks through there, so I get that part.
Also, thanks for watching the video and for sharing some of your thoughts!
@@SkorvionGames understood.
I should probably say I didnt want to throw shade at the TI team for not anticipating that. But I do really appreciate designers that consider the players choice to that level of depth.
I've never gone further than sculpting maps or writing out plans for TS and RA2 maps but multiple choices and open paths were always at the heart of them and I think for more than half of the concepts I played with open ends to the mission was something I would have wanted. The triggers Westwood put into TS that allowed that were GOATed.
The mission series that saw GDI take on the chemical missile plant with I think four variants of the actual mission depending on your choices is something I dont think I have ever seen replicated elsewhere and it still blows my mind that undertook that.
@@squishymusic9723 Map design is complicated, yeah, from visuals to gameplay to how it all works in scripts and the backend. All the more reason to appreciate the little things and when something feels good while playing.
And agreed, it was really nice to see choices impact missions in the Westwood campaigns. I fondly remember seeing the different map starting positions and effects in certain parts of the campaigns. It added a bit of an extra cool feeling to the whole thing, making the mission selection geo map feel a bit more useful rather than just an aesthetic immersion type of thing.
Another amazing video !
Hey thanks, feels good to hear!
5:03 So it is a simple case of either take it easy and take a L or go aggressive and take an even bigger L?
There is value in smaller choices like that beyond thinking purely in numbers. It's up to the player to decide if and how to approach situations where loses could be taken. You don't have to take any serious loses, but then again this encounter's design doesn't really help the player to intervene quickly - so it's down to what the map design encourages on a case by case basis with a bit of luck from what the player is doing.
Awesome video!
Thanks, I appreciate it!
awesome video! big like!
Thanks! I'm grateful.
where my love for these games started but it ended with number 4
90% of C&C fans can only count to 3. We're cool like that.
I didn't find this game particularly interesting, maybe because I didn't understand how to play it
That's alright, might just not be your cup of tea. Tiberian Sun does have units and mechanics that you need to learn a bit about and all, but it still plays pretty much like any other Command & Conquer RTS from the Westwood Studios era.