The original creators of VSH here, want to share some facts: 1)Amplifier was added deliberately as a way to encourage people to group together, because when people are scattered all over the place, the Boss pretty much always wins. At least it was the case back in 2011. 2)Since the Amplifier was pretty much everywhere, the damage curve was designed with the assumption of having the AMP. Same with the Taunt Crits and the Goomba Stomp. 3)There was a plugin that allowed people to respawn, having the shared pool of lives across the team. Each player had their own respawn cooldown that increased with each death, preventing one person from eating the entire life pool. For some reason nobody used or maintained it. Personally, having to spectate the match if you've died early on was a huge issue of this gamemode in my eyes. 4)There was a plugin that added a giant explosive barrel for the Demoman in place of a sticky launcher - it had the rage meter you have to fill by dealing damage and a 5 second fuse and dealt like 2000 damage in a decent radius. Lost to time, I guess. 5)HHH Jr was made in less than a day for the Halloween event, which resulted in rather poor game design. 6)Vagineer was originally made for the April 1st Update and was the first ever boss besides Saxton Hale. Btw, his rage range is lower (at least it used to be when I was around), with the intention to make him more specialized on taking down sentries and scouts, rather than a group of players like Saxton can. 7)Originally, the Boss used to one-shot everything but ubered players. While it's makes sense lorewise, removing this opened much more possibilities. Like, not making the overheal completely useless. 8)Pyro used to have x2 damage than normal. For some reason it didn't stick. Crits were x2 too.
Hey, I wanted to say. I'm honestly really happy I met you, dude. I used to play VSH and FF2 for days at a time, and I still do. But, if you don't mind me asking. 1. What ever happened to that barrel plugin for the demo? Is it still around? Maybe I could convince the folks at Skial to implement it in someway. 2. Ditto for the respawn plugin. 3. Was the X2 Damage for the pyro intended on purpose for his weak damage output? I feel as though I'm constantly dealing damage with crits, etc. But I always end up with less than 3k. 5. Would you believe the Gas-Passer essentially stole the barrel idea for demoman, when it was introduced and given it's own MVM Explosion in VSH?
also a weapon I find underused for sniper, the Bazaar Bargain. You can get heads for the quicker charge time on headshots, so you can match the Sydney Sleeper's charge time with only 3 headshots
It really is. Once, I hit 9 heads on the enemy, I do not remember what map I was in, but it had this huge tall soot in the middle of a lot of green areas, the boss can barely reach me with 2 super jumps, which proves how op it was. I kept pepereing the boss, scoring about 8000 damage, I did die though at the very, very end, since he was a couple of fully charged shots away from losing. Carried my team that day for the first and last time. Love it.
@@whoopas312pyro also lost the mega detonator/flare gun which was by far pyros best weapon Oh also phlog damage resistance doing hurts Pyro as well so mmph in not personal battalions to go mental with. So pros viability kinda evens out You got one big general change to the class in exchange for alot of pyros best options getting nerfed.
I'm seeing more up and coming tf2 channels. Even with the game under attack by basement dwellers, it still manages to pull peak player numbers. Also more people have been driven to playing community servers, which means the game can thrive without Valve's 'help.'
As a boss, you can escape the huntsman's taunt by doing taunts like conga, forcing the huntsman sniper to do the conga or just dance away from his range.
Alone Heavy can't do much against bosses, however with Engis amplifier, Pyros pushes and Medic ubers heavy easily becomes MVP. Heavy is truly the definition of teamwork
Pretty sure medic is S, especially when each crossbow shot deals 400 damage and he somehow keeps his uber when his medigun isn't out and ubersaw maxes out his uber instantly
Not really, think about what the Medic's Ubers actually help with. Makes a single person invincible for a few seconds which only matters if the boss is targeting that person and no one else is near... in which case the boss can just wait around and hard punish you by using anything when your Uber ends or Super Jump away. You can give people crits... but who does these crits actually help? Soldiers and Demos will empty their weapon in the 3 second taunt window meaning wasted Crit Uber reloading... This pretty much leaves Heavies who are slow and have trouble hitting at range and do best when the boss is close TO YOU... or you could have been any class and got those 3 seconds of taunt crits and have an escape tool. So then you have a Crossbow, which if you're hitting with that consistently... well congrats the boss likely is a bad player or you'd be better as a Soldier to provide a Battalion's Backup to your entire team as an effective team wide Uber. The 400 damage seems impressive till you factor in the DPS other classes can offer. Medics work well against bad boss players... but against better ones they are able to be ignored and are a wasted team slot. If teams stick close enough to make use of being able to Uber the boss's target without flaw for the Uber's duration it leaves teams vulnerable to Rage or other mechanics and if you want to provide healing for your TEAM there is a Soldier Weapon which provides healing for the team. The Soldier provides everything a Medic can do and can be a viable alternative... which is why they are in the same tier. Compare this to the Engi who gives his team Healing or Crits... his team an escape tool... a Sentry which slows the boss's assault. Tools which act as a physical wall. Comparatively Medics are weak... hence not S tier.
@@Buglin_Burger7878 this all implies that the boss is constantly making the best possible decisions likely, since they aren't an ai, they are not, and will either wait until the Uber ends (giving your team time), or not perfectly dodge the ubered player. that's without even mentioning overheal, which is a complete gamechanger, letting your team not get 1 shot by the boss. yeah, medic isn't as good as engineer, but you just waiving away everything medic can do as being 'not good as engi' despite engineers having to choose between a dispenser or amplifier, of which are completely stationary, so a smart boss (like you were mentioning) would simply target and destroy, likely then killing a few of the dozen players crowding around it, i have to say no. medic, in the right circumstance, is equally as good as engineer. if they weren't, it wouldn't matter, because that's not the point of the character. engineer gives area denial and damage support. medic gives health support.
One funny thing about me and TF2 is that, i have more than 1000 hours in this game but im wost than an gibus player when im playing any normal game mode. Almost 90% of the time i spent with this game was in custom servers/games mod. I fucking love it.
I have 650 hours yet I am only casual level 17 because all I play is community servers. funny enough I have hundreds of hours poured into deathrun yet I still suck at most maps on the server that I usually play
@@scumknight6074 that's true. my favorite deathrun map of all time is dr pirate adventure fix which is a really difficult parkour map, and even though it's my favorite, I absolutely suck at it. I was close to beating it one time though
Hybrid-knight is the strongest demo. By using tide turner, the eyelander and the primary of your choice, you can have huge damage crit nades from the shield and enough risk to charge into hale and get a swing to build up the 4 heads. With enough practice, you will consistently achieve top damage without dying.
You should've mentioned that the Pyro can push the hale into map hazards, sometimes into certain doom. HHH Jr. can climb the Skyhigh building you were talking about by standing a bit further from the roof. The Remains of the King sentry strat you mentioned can be stopped by using weighdown to push against the sentry's knockback.
Fair enough, map hazards are pretty rare in VSH maps and even if a boss does fall into one, unless it's his first match, he'll just super duper jump out of it or if hes being knocked back into it, a quick charge super jump to jump out of it before taking damage. But yeah I guess that's technically noteworthy enough to bump Pyro into E tier.
The DeGroot map has a powerful one, it's just tricky to get the hale near you since it is a pretty useless spot for any other class in my eyes. Oh, also Volcanic.
You could also do the little known strat of not charging your super jump all the way to just get over the edge and be grounded before he sentry can push you back. I swear I was the only one on my server that did this.
The Offical VSH. Differences. There are no AMP's or crits after taunting (i think). Uber works the same. Boss (Saxton Hale) Saxton's been going to the gym, or something. But he's got some new attacks, he has the Mantread's on passively. He can also charge up a lunging punch, able fly across the map by sheer strength. He also has a devestating Left hook, able to clean anyone's clock. Also he can ground pound, able to inflcit damage and fling people away. An improtant thing is that there is no rage mechanic, but saxton is basically immue to knockback outside of weapons that solely inflict it. Also, no weapon is blacklisted, but scout only has two jumps, even with the Atomizer.
Also the classes and weapons are more balanced. The Caber, Vita-saw, every stock weapons except Bottle (for demoknight), Kukri and Wrench for Heavy, Eviction Notice, Hitman's Heatmaker now have actual uses outside meme weapons or nerfing yourself with bad weapons at least better due to all melees get knockback on hit + 25% deployment speed + ability to wall climb (and higher with the caber or faster with Eviction Notice) and those weapons get a buff or it's alternative in same weapon slot get a nerf, sniper isn't overpowered with his +200% bodyshot damage and outline on hit removed and Engineer no longer have Amplifier to basically triple nearby teammates's damage and remove fall-off damage with only downside of no health and ammo dispensed, taunts doesn't give you crits so you aren't forced to have taunts that can be stoped at any time to optimise it, Crits doesn't delete the boss as fast because Hale has 25% crit resistance, Miniguns have 40% damage penalty and Sentry Guns have 50% damage penalty as they deal too much damage. Rocket Jumper and Sticky Jumper no longer has ammo bonuses so Hale can eventually catch up to them or wait 4 minutes to capture the point instead. Some weapons such as the Gas Passer are still bad so the weapons isn't perfect balanced but the imbalance are reduced.
Great video! I was going to make one of these for VSH eventually, but seeing as someone beat me to the punch, I do want to add some weigh in: First of all, VSH is a hard mode to talk about since there are so many different versions with minor differences between them. For instance, I've played on servers that give Pyro a super flare jump, which significantly affects his mobility. I feel like there's a lot of minor differences to talk about though so I can understand keeping things brief. With that in mind, I'd argue that Pyro in most of his incarnations is far from F. If you pair him with an Engineer, every spot becomes a jump spot since you can deny Hale access to the Engineer via airblast. If you have a good Pyro who knows not to spam airblast, I could see him being at least C for the potential support he could provide. HHH also has a longer melee range than the rest of the Hales since he uses the Headtaker as his base weapon. This is extremely good for winning matchups like Demoknight since you have even range, but it also gives you a ton of leniency when fighting fast classes like Scout and Soldier. I've alao personally never seen a server that doesn't have the wall climb mechanic, and with practice I find it to be almost as versatile as a super jump. HHH also excels at destroying cheesy maps since he can instantly deny Engineers and Demos the ability to camp. Engineers will build a dispenser and sentry first if they're playing right, so you have a bit of time to attack them before they can have a teleporter set up. Additionally, using a teletrap means that Engineers can't have an escape teleporter set up, so it's a lot easier to brute force your way into nests. I'd consider him around B, though he does take practice and not many like to play without a super jump so I don't see many people pick him. Other than that, great video, and I hope that these community server tier lists continue to pop up!
Ouch, when did HHH Jr. get nerfed? I remember playing VSH a long while back and that stun on teleport was NOT a thing, which made the teleport downright terrifying. It often made fighting HHH Jr. a race against time, as enough teleports would simply whittle down the red team to nothing.
yeah they also nerfed the teleport on any custom bosses, so you cant kill that ONE MOTHERFUCKING SNIPER CAMPING ON A ROCK okay but seriously this is why you dont use bosses that teleport unless there's only a few players its better to just super jump
I'll say on that map called vsh_reservoir_v2, HHH Jr. (The map used for the Sniper tier) can build up immense speed by climbing walls and strafing, outspeeding even SH's Super Jump.
Unironically, pyro is the guy who fought against sax all alone in meet the amazing pyro. he did not win, he needed soldiers help. and then sax came back to life.
One saving grace I will say for pyro is that on maps with pools of water, a pyro with airblast can force the Hale or whoever to stay in the water and swim so they don't have nearly as much mobility. I've done it a few times before and it can completely stall the boss' progress for as long as you can keep them in.
I know this was 8 months ago but pyros placement pissed me off. No mention of the gas passer or dragons fury. The gas passer has explode on ignite, which deals 350 damage. Assuming one isn't a coward, tou get the gas passer back like every 20 seconds at most. The dragons fury requires a little bit of aim, but 80 damage per hit on burning target is really good for damage. If Hale doest target you right off the bat, you can rack up a lot of damage. I've personally gotten to around 3,000. Pretty high and consistent if Hale doesn't have a burning hatred for you.
Oh wow, a couple Pyros to keep the boss swimming and a bunch of heavies to rain fully automatic hellfire from the shorelines should work. Add engies to for ammo and things become a slaughter.
Sniper with the Huntsman Spies with any knife Scout with most bats Demo with any sword Medic with the Ubersaw Heavy with fists Engineer with the gunslinger or frontier justice Soldier in a last hurrah with the escape plan or equalizer Out of those including Pyro, only the huntsman and Ubersaw are worth going for since they actually stun the boss and not just damage him.
15:33 One thing I wanna add alongside for Scout. The Boston basher/ Three Rune Blade can be used to build up Uber with your medics. (It’s a trick most pros use in usual TF2 but it can also be applied here in VSH) It can also be used to explore and get into places Hale either A: needs to super jump or rage in order to stop the scout from doing damage.
if the bfb isnt blacklisted, use it. its extremely helpful because its easy to get boost with the cleaver and wrap assasin, and losing boost is really hard because youll be one shotted anyway, and double jumping doesnt matter because you can just get the boost again easily
I played on a Sever that had the bfb able to be equipped and it just gave a short speed boost with no movement speed penalty I think if you hit a meatshot.
There was a new boss added to the first map you played in, and he looks really good, its basically a robot Saxton hale whos special turns him into a sentry buster.i don't know if he is only in that server, but he is there lol
I remember one time I was playing VSH and I was the Easter Bunny. When I used my special, it glitched and it just gave me the normal Grenade Launcher to use as much as I like... There was no survivors.
I believe that all classes are able to express themselves in different ways. There are maps where there are many or few first-aid kits and ammo. Classes that can quickly escape by spending HP will feel great on the map with a large number of first-aid kits, but with a small number of them, they will not be able to easily escape
you forgot to mention that goomba stomping is very effective, so playing scout with the force a nature is really fun, trying to get altitude on the boss and then dropping down on him is always fun, especially if you juke them as well. best loadout would be force a nature, bonk (if not black listed, if it is use the winger) and the atomizer
The only reason I don’t want to play vsh with ransoms, is because if you can’t respawn, you’ll spend most of your time dead, and it isn’t fun when you are just dead for basically forever
I remember a long time ago, there was a server that would automatically switch the last member of the RED team to a Pyro (fully healed and ammo restocked) because they thought Pyro was actually the _best_ match for VSH. Granted that was a while ago, there may have been lots of balance patches since then
I remember playing this game mode years ago. Combine that with the fact that I recognize almost every track used as background music in the video, and wow... what a nostalgia trip. Thanks for making this video.
i really love playing medic because i get to save a lot of people's asses when the boss rages, also I play FF2 (freak fortress 2) and medic receives 20% uber for every crossbow hit on the boss, which is pretty insane edit: 2 years later, the server i play on has removed all these things for medic sadly :( but hey there's goomba stomping now! edit 2: actually nvm it was bugged and so medic gets 20% again! but no crits so my dopamine receptors are lacking
Pretty cool to see someone making such deep content for a game I used to call my bread and butter. This vid really reminds me of the glory days of spending all my hours on saxton hale trying to do as much damage as possible, great vid overall.
The most fun I've had in TF2 was in VSH. Like seven to ten years ago, a Steam group/forum called OzFur ran a server that did interesting things with boss concepts and balancing that nothing I've seen since has even come close to matching. I miss it so I'm gonna gush about it. Bosses had passive effects and you could select modifiers to change how the game was played. There was sudden death if the rounds dragged on for too long. Last man standing was forced pyro so you didn't have to worry about circlejerking with a scout, spy or soldier. Bosses had interesting rages which could be used at 100% or 200% for increased effect. Saxton Hale passively had 50% knockback resistance and could rage to fear anyone nearby, gain invulnerability, and kill anyone that touched him for a while. Christian Brutal Sniper did not take % HP damage from backstabs, always killed anyone they hit unless uber'd, and could rage to force everyone to charge at him. Captain Falcon didn't lose rage unless he killed someone with it, and could perform a falcon punch to dash forward, killing anyone in a line that wasn't uber'd (stunning them instead). Gabe Newell prevented Medic from doing a thing they could do by spending 100% uber to summon a dead player as a vampire Heavy since he "banned" any player killed, and could rage to cause everyone on the enemy team to enter Valve Time, experiencing massive input delay. DC's Joker didn't kill enemies, but turned them into vampires on hit which had friendly fire enabled, lost health slowly and were forced to melee teammates that got too close to them, and could rage to swap the position of everyone on the map while bringing in intense visibility restricting darkness and inducing a temporary vampire state in addition to allowing him to kill. The Guardian turned the match into hide and seek on round start, complete with vision restricting darkness. Everyone was forced Demoman and all forms of communication were disabled. You could only hide and wait out the round to win. Shame the whole thing fell apart because of drama and the owner deciding to just pack it in. They didn't keep the server files either so it's just gone forever.
Man this footage is super nostalgic, used to play this mode and these maps all the time. Also I remember Pyro used to be pretty good due to pre-nerf reserve shooter critting the hale when they were in the air at all, even when they were jumping.
Frequent VSH and FF2 player here. Creating tier lists for bosses in VSH is kind of useless since the bosses and various weapons can greatly differ depending on the server you like to play on (VSH is Open Source after all). My recommendation is to play Saxton Hale. Not only is he consistently good across any VSH or FF2 server, no one will get mad at you in chat or VC because you played Saxton Hale. The biggest tip I also have is to go on a jump server and do the air strafing levels. Air strafing is an invaluable skill to have as most bosses.
yeah things can be wildly different, i was in a server that even added the MvM revive mechanic in. idk if all vsh/ff2 servers have it but going for ~2k damage market gardens on the boss never gets old
i have been playing VSH since 2014 and it's legit the only game mode i play. Although i don't agree with everything you say in this video, i still really appreciate that a proper in-depth analysis has been made on this game mode.
I agree, demo with pipes charge and highlander are high tier, same for spy, medic and engineer. A good spy, medic, engi or demo can easily deal more than 10'000 dmg solo
Hi there! 2500 hours on Vsh player here. Just wanted to share my thoughts on some of the classes potential and bosses aspects. *The Easter Bunny* might at first seem the worst boss, but actually it's really good against more experienced players. You see, all of the bosses have the same jump height. Players get used to this, and position them selfs in places the bosses can't reach them. And here's where the Bunny shine's because players sometimes forget about the higher jump or just underestimate how high he can actually jump, you can often catch overconfident players thinking they're safe. Also the crit eggs which fall after killing a player is also pretty useful against classes that need to be hit more than once. Dead ringer is a great example, since the spy using it simply cannot survive a crit mele hit from the boss even with overheal. The same goes for overhealed Heavies, medics exc. *The horseless headless headtaker Jr.* Actually has a small knockback resistance. It's something few people know about, but shooting him with for example the rocket launcher doesn't make him go flying as far as the other bosses. *Pyro* is definitely the worst class for Vsh. Airblasting at the wrong time can be devastating for your team. He requires a lot of skill and game sense to be useful, since airblasting at the right time might save your team from an lethal rage. It's obviously better for 5 people to survive the rage and to give the boss about 30% of it back instead of just watching your team die. Also the backscratcher is very useful, since the medic can build Uber very quickly. *Scout* .I'm kinda disappointed you didn't mention the babyfaces blaster and crit-o-cola combo. It's the most powerful combo for scout. Dealing damage to your self makes the babyfaces blaster fire far quicker than before. Using the the crit-o-cola with that makes scout deal insane amounts of damage in just seconds. Probably the best choice for scouts on Vsh. Also the Boston basher is really good to help with the blaster and cola combo, since you can damage your self for that extra firing speed very quickly. Also medics can build Uber quicker similarly to the backscratcher. *The huntsman sniper* is really good. But did you know you can completly destroy a taunt killing huntsman by using the conga or any other dance taunt? It will stop the sniper from taunt killing the boss and make him dance. It's really funny sometimes to see the snipers reaction :D
You didn't mention Gun Spy's potential. Deals huge damage, greater than most mercenaries and has a high survivability. The main weapon in this mode is not a knife, but a revolver that always has a mini-crits, which provides incredibly high damage from all ranges. You use the knife as a last resort or when you are sure that you can do backstab. The main feature is that you shoot the revolver all the time, and when the boss wants to kill you, you either try to trickstab him (sometimes it worth it), or you jump out on his damage ,being invisible ,by jumping right before he will hit you If you combine this with a YER it gives a reduced decloak sound volume. Boss won't be able to track you down and kill you. If you die a lot because you don't have time to charge up your watch, you can play Big Earner, which gives you speed boost and charges your watch just for hitting Boss. L'Etranger removes a VERY much damage Spy could do, so not. The Ambassador deals HUGE damage, but takes away the ability to spam the Boss, and if you don't have good aiming, you're likely to miss most of your shots. But I think you can try it. As a result, Spy is able to deal more damage than Demoknight, not as fast as he does, but is able to double the damage of Demoknight for an entire round as he is just less of a Glass Cannon. (Spy can backstab, but don't forget he has a good gun) Sorry for bad english
I find the revolver useless if the hale is mildly decent. if there's a hale constantly super jumping or flanking the enemies via super jump then it's almost impossible to hit your shots unless you're an absolute god at the revolver
Worth mentionning that the Enforcer 20% damage bonus apply while undisguised and stacks while disguised, if you have an AMP nearby and only shoot while disguised, you can do 170+ damage per shot, turning you into a diet Sniper.
lotta stuff i'd change about VSH balancing. I played a server once that changed a lot of things, but it seemed to have vanished the next day. My main gripe is everyone relying on taunt crits, really. Minicrits would be fine since they're not nearly as powerful.
The server that you were playing on in the beginning in one that I play quite frequently. The classes I usually see getting top damage on that server are soldier, spy, sniper and demo. Sometimes pyro with the gas passer can do a lot, but it can be as risky as playing spy to pull off. Medic on that server is OP because he can revive everyone once per game. The server's name is BlackWonder and it runs the map Reservoir 24/7.
they made the pyro bad for this game mode and adding an extra ubersecond for the vagineer with airblast if it removed a second then pyro could be ranked a little higher
It annoys me to hell how he zig-zags around after every shot with sniper. The boss doesn't have a hitscan long range weapon. Wiggling around only makes you more visible.
Great video. The main reason why Vagineer is S Tier is his knockback immunity, not his invulnerability (although that's pretty sweet as well). Being immune to knockback allows you to easily take down sentries or even sentry nests.
Oh your knock back immunity? *loose cannon* and yes vagineer can still be knocked back by loose cannon or well stopped for a brief period but if if shot at his feet it will throw him into the air a little
Ah, VSH. That was a fun mod to help develop. I'm surprised your ranking spy so low, but idk of many changes they did after CBS was introduced since thats when I left the dev team. Spy used to be a hard carry class, as a good spy would routinely reach top damage with the rapid backstab thing, Although they couldn't actually kill the boss by themselves very easily and needed some help after the 4th stab. The rapid stab thing was you used quickswap after stabbing the boss, then quickswapping back. This let you stab without the razorback stun affecting you, it was a glitch though. I dunno if they fixed that though, i should really play this gamemode again.
I find that Spy generally gets weaker the longer a match goes on while most other classes become stronger. More players alive means more distractions meaning a Spy is likely to get a stab or two in, but when Hale starts weeding them out a bit, the spy disguised as a Scout stands out and doesn't get stabs anymore. Would also say that just through playing TF2 you eventually learn to turn around occasionally and deny Spies a backstab, you don't chase people for more than a few seconds without turning around and attacking the people behind you. I recall the knife glitch however I recall it being slightly different, where after a stab you were free to switch to your revolver and take potshots while backpedaling away, maybe I just never swapped back to my knife as I assumed it was still under stun but eh.
@@SpaceGuyOnline Yeah spy is def an early game terror. His advantage is that if he gets stabs he can sometimes deny an entire rage due to hte sheer amount of damage he does in early game. But yeah he can't carry a gaem by himself at all.
A good spy can easily reach thousands of damage, but can also be the first to die. From what I have seen in my years of VSH, spies are best at doing the first chunks of damage to hale, stabs are based on HP so you will always do huge damage. The more players means more stab damage. I remember playing a vsh server where spies instead of having protection on cloak, you had the big earner speed boost on a stab with all the knifes aswell as faster decloak. So a good trickstabbing spy could play with the kunai and stab hale over and over.
@@ghoulbuster1 Yep that was essentially the design intent with how spy's damage curve was balanced. Spy can chunk down Hale's hp when hale is confident that no one can stand against him due to having 20k hp easily, making him panic quicker than he normally would as a spy chunks it down if he goes in overconfident. However if a spy just hid all game, he wouldn't do much damage at all to a low hp hale.
Talking about the HHH Jr. Teleport, i was once looking for the last remaining member of the red tram after taking out other reds. The timer is running out and i decided to do a teleport to find where he is, then i found the engineer with a teleporter and before i can react, i get telefragged
I think you underestimate just how potentially amazing the backburner in vsh; (a swarm of enemies vs 1 very slow unit who'll likely just spend the rage on a spy that's dead ringing or a engie camp, all encompassing and flooding hales view more often than not.) truly is. you can spend about a full tank and as long as you're straddling his back right they'll barely ever notice, by the end of it you should come out to something like 1.5k - 5k. it's insane. deals 460 damage per second from behind, and base stock damage from the front. or go with something like the dragons fury, constant pressure, annoys the shit outta most people, lotta damage if d.o.t. isn't your thing, with crits it's 225 per shot after being burned, which ramps up. extremely quickly. that plus the scorch shot in cramped tunnels with alot of clutter has helped me escape from hale more times than I can count. it's a force of nature but from any distance. with the only caveat that it's a slug as apposed to a buckshot, and not all servers support it for flare jumping. or just simply run the powerjack and bam, any time you get targeted with a rage, or just chased in general the slow penalty is completely removed and all it comes down to is juking hale. so you're already covering the main goal of two of the classes in the game, and doing it adequately enough at any rate. by being effectively a scout, easy escape, fast speed, constant knockback and withdrawl, and a spy but just d.o.t. and if played correctly not giving the hale any significant meter. as for spy, all I can say is if you play hale long enough there's not a chance in hell you're looking in one direction for any longer than a second unless you're deliberately trying to get stabbed for the rage or someone is turbo tunnel visioned on some dude that's goomba'd him like 8 times throughout the match. unironically solider market gardens are so much more viable than any spy i've ever met since my eyes aren't constantly looking behind *and* above. even further than that, his stab gives an automatic rage bar in most servers, the amount of times I got killed that way has been alot more often than pyro air spammers. all that being said, yeah there are players that just m2 every time hale gets close outta fear. but in general, nah. he can be useful if y'just know how to play him. always have him on fire, if he's being swarmed it's probably advantageous to just hit him from behind with the scorch, and he'll get knocked up in the air for a fair amount of time, even better if he looks at that as an opportunity to super jump as it completely stagnates his speed so he just jumps straight up then back down without moving, also opening him up to back stabs and markets/goombas. I feel like he just gets a bad rep because people only notice the airblasting, nothin' else. spy is alot worse imo. lotta damage, but fucks over teammates with absolutely no warning as the rage meter instantly fills then the ones closest to hale just died for that spy's 900 - 2k. and there's usually multiple of them in lobbies, which just makes it that much worse.
"as for spy, all I can say is if you play hale long enough there's not a chance in hell you're looking in one direction for any longer than a second" So the Hale strat which removes the benefit of Spy doesn't remove the benefit of backburner Pyro which needs to do the same thing? In fact when you consider this a Hale will SEE the Backburner, let you get close... then turn around and kill you. Man everyone just died for that Pyro's 900-2K before the rage filled up too... it is almost like you can be taken advantage of for Rage people aren't expecting. It is almost like the Pyro is hated because they have all the issues Spy does but more. To do well they need to be close. To do well they need to flank. To do well they end up filling Rage incredibly fast killing their team. Have a button which if they press makes the boss dodge an few attacks and build rage. Lacks a Dead Ringer to escape.
@@Buglin_Burger7878 generally 3500 damage is rage, most servers as far as i'm aware tweak it to 2500, or the odd turbo server will go even lower. are you really comparing hugging hale with a melee, to a ranged weapon that's notorious for having the most broken hitbox detection in the game besides possibly the huntsman? by the time hale notices in the middle of a fire fight from all angles, you'll have done atleast 500 minimum to 900 damage from a 4 - 6 ft distance at let's say a 3 - 5 second interaction, of which it gives you plenty of time to powerjack away, since I guess we're pretending like flare jumping isn't a thing in quite possibly the only server that makes it viable. yes raging carries the benefit of nobody exactly knowing when it'll go off. a really moot point. by that logic everything but spy and the occasional heavy is irrelevant because they can take more than one hit? it's more about how they cope with the situation, just like any other class. in this instance it's speed as I already mentioned. to do well you do not need to be close. you typically want to flank yes, just like literally any other class that isn't demo knight, heavy or- well that's really it. doing well you still have an immense amount of time to stay away and fire from a distance as any other player, and as the pyro it comes down to how quick on the draw are you and how well can you juke hale for 3 or so seconds, and that's if you haven't played the game long enough to get that sense of when you should leave and come back to keep hale away from raged players, whether that be distracting him with that backburner he almost certainly will see the giant flaming vignette cornering his screen as you mentioned, or to knockback with the scorch shot, or airblast if you're in dire straits or need. airblast is a horrible thing yes, so long as you use it effectively in some cases and it was a necessary evil, I can justify it. like saving an engie by throwing hale off the edge of the platform you're standing on. but nobody is denying airblast sucks, again, it's a moot point, as I wasn't even arguing for it to begin with. just don't use it, backburner I believe is the best weapon any new player could use to learn pyro, keep behind them hold m1, keep your middle finger off the right click and on the mouse wheel. spy, will do absolutely none of the things I just mentioned, he comes in, takes the 2k, right clicks, runs away while the rest of the team dies. he's not saving anybody from being targeted, he's not going to be flying across the map or acting as a distraction, it's sheer unga bunga I liek leederbord, fuck everyone else. but since he has a dead ringer I guess that takes it, every class in the game sucks except spy.
The best VSH I ever played was the OpenFortress Merc only VSH. Everyone playes the same class, and has to pick up weapons. It was so fun and the server went down.
I expected you to mention the Dragon's fury ): Also the Thermal Thruster is okay-ish to escape, this due to (most) servers allowing you to launch again mid air
Yeah, i use both of them and after 2-3 hits Dragon's Fury deals a shit ton of damage. Then i flee with my Thermal Thurster to get ammo and move back in.
I played this game mode a lot when I was new to the game. Much more than the regular game. When I first played as the christian brutal sniper, I had no idea how the huntsman works. I had already been playing the gamemode forever before I even found a Bushwaka, and then I immediately used it to scale walls. I kept trying to scale walls in the normal game because I thought that was just what the bushwaka is for. Honestly, sniper needs one of those "climbing axe" things. The only thing I hate about this mode is the "scare" effect on rage. What do you even do against that except rely on luck? If the boss targets you or you just happened to be close to him, you're dead. It invalidates any skill and cool strategy except maybe sniping from a good hiding spot. If a boss uses this as often as he can, it's just so unenjoyable.
Demoman is a very, very strong class, you just have to play safer than other guys and not rush the boss down. Scottish resistance is very good, because boss simply can't notice sticky trap when he chasing some scouts or soldiers or when he running to engineer's sentry. The sticky traps is very, very powerful, they can deal a lot of damage and most importantly, you don't have to be close to them. Just play safe and wait for your team to distract boss or just to die, because it will give you crits on granade launcher, which means you have 300 damage per shot. And, as for escape option, just place one of 14 scottish resistance stickies near to you, so when boss will find you you will be able to just fly away to your team and use them as a meat shield.
On more tunnel filled maps he's even better since the boss can't avoid them as easily. If you play well enough, bosses that aren't Vagineer can have their rage ruined in one right-click.
@@PurpleNecromancer-10 Exactly. On that popular Nebula map it is even better than tunnels, because of boosting ramp that launch people to other side of map. It's kinda like boss's second super jump and if there will be 14 minicrit stickies boss will go for boost anyway. Very powerful strategy.
@@jumpinghunter9152 Crevice is also pretty good since it has launchpads that go up tall funnels into tight areas that the boss can't go around, on top of plenty of ways to keep out of a boss's sight, on top of good sentry nest spots that can be protected by sticky traps.
@@PurpleNecromancer-10 Overall it is just very common for bosses to drastically underestimate demomen and stickytraps. When he see 14 stickies in each other its hard to identify the amount of them, so bosses usually just walk through traps and don't even bother to look under their feets. And then we get like 6000 damage in around 3-4 well planned explosions.
Playing demoknight with the Scottish resistance is one of my favorite ways to play. Collect your heads early game, and stack up crit stickies underneath the cap point, sentry, or a common retreat area for reds. This works for me especially on Skyhigh.
What about hybrid demo? If you manage to land 4 hits in with the eyelander, you'll be able survive 1 hit and move fast, not to mention you'll still have your primary, which, if you can aim, can make you immortal to an extent thanks to the knockback it provides oh and you also have a shield that lets you tank a hit if you get hit without having 4 heads
holy shit this dude used advance wars music, i loved the original and playing against sturm and eagle. you deserved a follow for this and your mega valid chart
when i used to play these game modes, my favourite strategy would be to play spy with a stock revolver and only use that, taunting usually gives you crits and you can deal a fairly decent amount of damage throughout the match since you can always just cloak away when hes coming for you
I absolutely love that you used that LoZ music for the bunny boss. I'm so glad people remember that weird bunny form link got, easily my favorite zelda game
![[TF2] The Zombie Fortress Tier List](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cK1YwEUdLVc/mqdefault.jpg)
![[TF2] The Item Iceberg](/img/n.gif)
Adding time stamps for you so you don’t have to do it yourself.
0:00: intro
2:27: pyro
5:08: demo
6:28 bunny
8:11: heavy
10:19: spy
13:06: headless horseman
15:33: scout
17:57: lucksman
19:48: demo knight
21:23: soldier
23:13: medic
25:18: saxton hale and cbs
26:48: engineer
30:28: sniper
32:17 vagineer
33:01 end
Real one
@@SpaceGuyOnline yup
@@SpaceGuyOnline
This is really helpful thank you very much
@@SpaceGuyOnline put them in the description
@@SpaceGuyOnline you forgot the robo saxtron
The original creators of VSH here, want to share some facts:
1)Amplifier was added deliberately as a way to encourage people to group together, because when people are scattered all over the place, the Boss pretty much always wins. At least it was the case back in 2011.
2)Since the Amplifier was pretty much everywhere, the damage curve was designed with the assumption of having the AMP. Same with the Taunt Crits and the Goomba Stomp.
3)There was a plugin that allowed people to respawn, having the shared pool of lives across the team. Each player had their own respawn cooldown that increased with each death, preventing one person from eating the entire life pool. For some reason nobody used or maintained it. Personally, having to spectate the match if you've died early on was a huge issue of this gamemode in my eyes.
4)There was a plugin that added a giant explosive barrel for the Demoman in place of a sticky launcher - it had the rage meter you have to fill by dealing damage and a 5 second fuse and dealt like 2000 damage in a decent radius. Lost to time, I guess.
5)HHH Jr was made in less than a day for the Halloween event, which resulted in rather poor game design.
6)Vagineer was originally made for the April 1st Update and was the first ever boss besides Saxton Hale. Btw, his rage range is lower (at least it used to be when I was around), with the intention to make him more specialized on taking down sentries and scouts, rather than a group of players like Saxton can.
7)Originally, the Boss used to one-shot everything but ubered players. While it's makes sense lorewise, removing this opened much more possibilities. Like, not making the overheal completely useless.
8)Pyro used to have x2 damage than normal. For some reason it didn't stick. Crits were x2 too.
thats cool
U are amazing
Is the reanimator/revives based off of fact 3 listed here?
I love the amplifier
Hey, I wanted to say. I'm honestly really happy I met you, dude. I used to play VSH and FF2 for days at a time, and I still do.
But, if you don't mind me asking.
1. What ever happened to that barrel plugin for the demo? Is it still around? Maybe I could convince the folks at Skial to implement it in someway.
2. Ditto for the respawn plugin.
3. Was the X2 Damage for the pyro intended on purpose for his weak damage output? I feel as though I'm constantly dealing damage with crits, etc. But I always end up with less than 3k.
5. Would you believe the Gas-Passer essentially stole the barrel idea for demoman, when it was introduced and given it's own MVM Explosion in VSH?
Okay, I legit seen myself, in a clip and started to laugh because I was standing there shooting my pistol at the boss as a engie.
When did you show up?
When
Doing god’s work
Cheap damage is free damage
When and where?
I think it's funny when I play as spy in this gamemode, backstab the boss once, then die instantly.
just like in the normal game
Thats why i use the enforcer and crits
That's why big earner is so useful, you can run faster than hale after a backstab
kuna, after back stab you can survive 1 hit
No f*rries.
also a weapon I find underused for sniper, the Bazaar Bargain. You can get heads for the quicker charge time on headshots, so you can match the Sydney Sleeper's charge time with only 3 headshots
It really is. Once, I hit 9 heads on the enemy, I do not remember what map I was in, but it had this huge tall soot in the middle of a lot of green areas, the boss can barely reach me with 2 super jumps, which proves how op it was. I kept pepereing the boss, scoring about 8000 damage, I did die though at the very, very end, since he was a couple of fully charged shots away from losing. Carried my team that day for the first and last time. Love it.
Bazaar bargain snipers are everywhere. I dunno what you mean.
maybe its just the server i play on
i find that stocks and sydney sleepers are way more common
Bazaar bargain is banned almost every where(replaced with stock rifle)
I used to play on the panda community servers, Bazaar was not banned, I would usually run it or the huntsman in small tight maps
I feel like this is gonna get more popular once VSH finally works. You just watch.
well i just got this in my recommended randomly and I honestly thought it was a new video at first, so probably
this tier list is mostly outdated now anyways. pyro is no longer f tier cuz there is no rage and there are no weapon bans
It happened
Pyro is still the worst because the flamethrower not doing anything he does like 600
@@whoopas312pyro also lost the mega detonator/flare gun which was by far pyros best weapon
Oh also phlog damage resistance doing hurts Pyro as well so mmph in not personal battalions to go mental with.
So pros viability kinda evens out
You got one big general change to the class in exchange for alot of pyros best options getting nerfed.
So underrated UA-camrs are making underrated tier lists for underrated modes now huh?
Does it seem like the TF2 UA-cam community isn't as big as it once was, or is it still as big as it ever was?
@@Chud_Bud_Supreme when was the last time , you saw a lazy purple video
@@JcoleMc I only ask because it seems like it was bigger in 2015-2016. Not saying I'm right, just genuinely curious
I'm seeing more up and coming tf2 channels. Even with the game under attack by basement dwellers, it still manages to pull peak player numbers. Also more people have been driven to playing community servers, which means the game can thrive without Valve's 'help.'
Underrated Comment
24:18
*saving teammates*
What's funny about this?
@Pantuternik because he didn’t hit the crossbow shot and the the sniper died
@@dabestike7159 Ah, okay i see
As a boss, you can escape the huntsman's taunt by doing taunts like conga, forcing the huntsman sniper to do the conga or just dance away from his range.
Vsh is pay to play confirmed
@@fixmakintosh4820 Also these taunts where you can cancel them at any time are useful for quick crit gain.
As a huntsman sniper, you can look at the boss's feet and still hit them with the taunt, although it's way easier to miss
I love the stupid dumbass idea of escaping an infinite loop by conga dancing away from it
@@PoutyBun only in team fortres 2
Alone Heavy can't do much against bosses, however with Engis amplifier, Pyros pushes and Medic ubers heavy easily becomes MVP. Heavy is truly the definition of teamwork
Pyro just gives more rage.
Replace the Pyros with Engineer or Heavy for even more knockback and damage.
Pretty sure medic is S, especially when each crossbow shot deals 400 damage and he somehow keeps his uber when his medigun isn't out and ubersaw maxes out his uber instantly
Not really, think about what the Medic's Ubers actually help with.
Makes a single person invincible for a few seconds which only matters if the boss is targeting that person and no one else is near... in which case the boss can just wait around and hard punish you by using anything when your Uber ends or Super Jump away.
You can give people crits... but who does these crits actually help?
Soldiers and Demos will empty their weapon in the 3 second taunt window meaning wasted Crit Uber reloading...
This pretty much leaves Heavies who are slow and have trouble hitting at range and do best when the boss is close TO YOU... or you could have been any class and got those 3 seconds of taunt crits and have an escape tool.
So then you have a Crossbow, which if you're hitting with that consistently... well congrats the boss likely is a bad player or you'd be better as a Soldier to provide a Battalion's Backup to your entire team as an effective team wide Uber. The 400 damage seems impressive till you factor in the DPS other classes can offer.
Medics work well against bad boss players... but against better ones they are able to be ignored and are a wasted team slot. If teams stick close enough to make use of being able to Uber the boss's target without flaw for the Uber's duration it leaves teams vulnerable to Rage or other mechanics and if you want to provide healing for your TEAM there is a Soldier Weapon which provides healing for the team.
The Soldier provides everything a Medic can do and can be a viable alternative... which is why they are in the same tier.
Compare this to the Engi who gives his team Healing or Crits... his team an escape tool... a Sentry which slows the boss's assault. Tools which act as a physical wall. Comparatively Medics are weak... hence not S tier.
@@Buglin_Burger7878 this all implies that the boss is constantly making the best possible decisions
likely, since they aren't an ai, they are not, and will either wait until the Uber ends (giving your team time), or not perfectly dodge the ubered player.
that's without even mentioning overheal, which is a complete gamechanger, letting your team not get 1 shot by the boss.
yeah, medic isn't as good as engineer, but you just waiving away everything medic can do as being 'not good as engi' despite engineers having to choose between a dispenser or amplifier, of which are completely stationary, so a smart boss (like you were mentioning) would simply target and destroy, likely then killing a few of the dozen players crowding around it, i have to say no. medic, in the right circumstance, is equally as good as engineer. if they weren't, it wouldn't matter, because that's not the point of the character. engineer gives area denial and damage support. medic gives health support.
Question, what if you get 3 Medics? What about 4? 5?
@@daletaylor4242 most servers have a class limit of 3 Medic, I can only imagine how 15 medic would deal with the boss
@@vivelespatat2670half blutsauger/ubersaw, half healing, some will fling between the two
One funny thing about me and TF2 is that, i have more than 1000 hours in this game but im wost than an gibus player when im playing any normal game mode. Almost 90% of the time i spent with this game was in custom servers/games mod. I fucking love it.
I have 650 hours yet I am only casual level 17 because all I play is community servers. funny enough I have hundreds of hours poured into deathrun yet I still suck at most maps on the server that I usually play
As long as you’re having fun in this game, you don’t have to worry too much about losing.
@@scumknight6074 that's true. my favorite deathrun map of all time is dr pirate adventure fix which is a really difficult parkour map, and even though it's my favorite, I absolutely suck at it. I was close to beating it one time though
treat every heavy as a hale trust me it works all the time
Same, I mostly play Jailbreak
This is the tier list I’ve been waiting for
Hybrid-knight is the strongest demo. By using tide turner, the eyelander and the primary of your choice, you can have huge damage crit nades from the shield and enough risk to charge into hale and get a swing to build up the 4 heads.
With enough practice, you will consistently achieve top damage without dying.
You should've mentioned that the Pyro can push the hale into map hazards, sometimes into certain doom.
HHH Jr. can climb the Skyhigh building you were talking about by standing a bit further from the roof.
The Remains of the King sentry strat you mentioned can be stopped by using weighdown to push against the sentry's knockback.
Fair enough, map hazards are pretty rare in VSH maps and even if a boss does fall into one, unless it's his first match, he'll just super duper jump out of it or if hes being knocked back into it, a quick charge super jump to jump out of it before taking damage.
But yeah I guess that's technically noteworthy enough to bump Pyro into E tier.
The DeGroot map has a powerful one, it's just tricky to get the hale near you since it is a pretty useless spot for any other class in my eyes. Oh, also Volcanic.
You could also do the little known strat of not charging your super jump all the way to just get over the edge and be grounded before he sentry can push you back. I swear I was the only one on my server that did this.
@@brimp4989 Using weighdown on top of a sentry seems more reliable to me
There is also dragons fury. It is a very powerful weapon being able to deal around 300 damage per shot.
There is 1 class you missed, the "That one dude that is using lmao box on vs saxton hale" class.
@@XxXThiccoModeXxX the lamo box?
@@epicassassin8502 it's a hack that gives you good aim
The Offical VSH.
Differences.
There are no AMP's or crits after taunting (i think). Uber works the same.
Boss (Saxton Hale)
Saxton's been going to the gym, or something. But he's got some new attacks, he has the Mantread's on passively. He can also charge up a lunging punch, able fly across the map by sheer strength. He also has a devestating Left hook, able to clean anyone's clock. Also he can ground pound, able to inflcit damage and fling people away.
An improtant thing is that there is no rage mechanic, but saxton is basically immue to knockback outside of weapons that solely inflict it.
Also, no weapon is blacklisted, but scout only has two jumps, even with the Atomizer.
coulda sworn I was triple jumping in casual vsh yesterday. But even so, that thing with the atomizer has got to be an oversight, right?
That scout part is incorrect
Also the classes and weapons are more balanced. The Caber, Vita-saw, every stock weapons except Bottle (for demoknight), Kukri and Wrench for Heavy, Eviction Notice, Hitman's Heatmaker now have actual uses outside meme weapons or nerfing yourself with bad weapons at least better due to all melees get knockback on hit + 25% deployment speed + ability to wall climb (and higher with the caber or faster with Eviction Notice) and those weapons get a buff or it's alternative in same weapon slot get a nerf, sniper isn't overpowered with his +200% bodyshot damage and outline on hit removed and Engineer no longer have Amplifier to basically triple nearby teammates's damage and remove fall-off damage with only downside of no health and ammo dispensed, taunts doesn't give you crits so you aren't forced to have taunts that can be stoped at any time to optimise it, Crits doesn't delete the boss as fast because Hale has 25% crit resistance, Miniguns have 40% damage penalty and Sentry Guns have 50% damage penalty as they deal too much damage. Rocket Jumper and Sticky Jumper no longer has ammo bonuses so Hale can eventually catch up to them or wait 4 minutes to capture the point instead. Some weapons such as the Gas Passer are still bad so the weapons isn't perfect balanced but the imbalance are reduced.
Great video! I was going to make one of these for VSH eventually, but seeing as someone beat me to the punch, I do want to add some weigh in:
First of all, VSH is a hard mode to talk about since there are so many different versions with minor differences between them. For instance, I've played on servers that give Pyro a super flare jump, which significantly affects his mobility. I feel like there's a lot of minor differences to talk about though so I can understand keeping things brief.
With that in mind, I'd argue that Pyro in most of his incarnations is far from F. If you pair him with an Engineer, every spot becomes a jump spot since you can deny Hale access to the Engineer via airblast. If you have a good Pyro who knows not to spam airblast, I could see him being at least C for the potential support he could provide.
HHH also has a longer melee range than the rest of the Hales since he uses the Headtaker as his base weapon. This is extremely good for winning matchups like Demoknight since you have even range, but it also gives you a ton of leniency when fighting fast classes like Scout and Soldier. I've alao personally never seen a server that doesn't have the wall climb mechanic, and with practice I find it to be almost as versatile as a super jump. HHH also excels at destroying cheesy maps since he can instantly deny Engineers and Demos the ability to camp. Engineers will build a dispenser and sentry first if they're playing right, so you have a bit of time to attack them before they can have a teleporter set up. Additionally, using a teletrap means that Engineers can't have an escape teleporter set up, so it's a lot easier to brute force your way into nests. I'd consider him around B, though he does take practice and not many like to play without a super jump so I don't see many people pick him.
Other than that, great video, and I hope that these community server tier lists continue to pop up!
Yeah it's a complicated tier list
Weapon reskins in tf2...
Ouch, when did HHH Jr. get nerfed? I remember playing VSH a long while back and that stun on teleport was NOT a thing, which made the teleport downright terrifying. It often made fighting HHH Jr. a race against time, as enough teleports would simply whittle down the red team to nothing.
yeah they also nerfed the teleport on any custom bosses, so you cant kill that ONE MOTHERFUCKING SNIPER CAMPING ON A ROCK okay but seriously this is why you dont use bosses that teleport unless there's only a few players its better to just super jump
I'll say on that map called vsh_reservoir_v2, HHH Jr. (The map used for the Sniper tier) can build up immense speed by climbing walls and strafing, outspeeding even SH's Super Jump.
Just yesterday I played VSH Nucleus and a group of Pyros really bullied Saxton, having the team deal significant amount of damage.
Talking about V-Script Saxton not Plug-In Saxton.
They're two completely separate things
mark my words i will find poopy joe one of these days
Playing with you was so fun man, hope you're enjoying your "American Cuisine"!
What?
@@garethbgoogle9396 probably an in joke from that match.
I love these 1 looped 3 times spy clip
Unironically, pyro is the guy who fought against sax all alone in meet the amazing pyro.
he did not win, he needed soldiers help. and then sax came back to life.
That’s also a parody of a borderline self parody that is the tf2 comics
Uuuuuuuuhhhhhh. You might wanna make a redo for this. Because it's an actual game mode in TF2 now
One saving grace I will say for pyro is that on maps with pools of water, a pyro with airblast can force the Hale or whoever to stay in the water and swim so they don't have nearly as much mobility. I've done it a few times before and it can completely stall the boss' progress for as long as you can keep them in.
Especially if you have Neon Anihilator to use in those map having water
I know this was 8 months ago but pyros placement pissed me off. No mention of the gas passer or dragons fury. The gas passer has explode on ignite, which deals 350 damage. Assuming one isn't a coward, tou get the gas passer back like every 20 seconds at most. The dragons fury requires a little bit of aim, but 80 damage per hit on burning target is really good for damage. If Hale doest target you right off the bat, you can rack up a lot of damage. I've personally gotten to around 3,000. Pretty high and consistent if Hale doesn't have a burning hatred for you.
@@thewholeofdainland256Not to mention crits stack with the triple damage of hitting lit enemies.
Oh wow, a couple Pyros to keep the boss swimming and a bunch of heavies to rain fully automatic hellfire from the shorelines should work. Add engies to for ammo and things become a slaughter.
Pyro is the only class who can still defend himself when being stunned by using "execution" taunt.
Sniper with the Huntsman
Spies with any knife
Scout with most bats
Demo with any sword
Medic with the Ubersaw
Heavy with fists
Engineer with the gunslinger or frontier justice
Soldier in a last hurrah with the escape plan or equalizer
Out of those including Pyro, only the huntsman and Ubersaw are worth going for since they actually stun the boss and not just damage him.
@@SpaceGuyOnline On spy, the spycicle can't tauntkill, as it uses the revolver taunt, but yeah.
@@toxic_shr00m why would you use spycicle, when there litteraly no way of getting fire damage in saxton hale.
@@d1amondsquare019 Not the point. They said "any knife" so I corrected them.
Also only two scout melees tauntkill, not most.
@@toxic_shr00m welp an stupid correction, seriously spycicle is useless in vsh.
Never thought there would be a meta for this Gamemode
And yet here we are
15:33
One thing I wanna add alongside for Scout.
The Boston basher/ Three Rune Blade can be used to build up Uber with your medics. (It’s a trick most pros use in usual TF2 but it can also be applied here in VSH) It can also be used to explore and get into places Hale either A: needs to super jump or rage in order to stop the scout from doing damage.
Scout can also be quite effective on servers supporting goomba stomp. You can use force a nature to have tons of tries and out damage most of the team
does medic Really need another way to charge uber tho?
if the bfb isnt blacklisted, use it. its extremely helpful because its easy to get boost with the cleaver and wrap assasin, and losing boost is really hard because youll be one shotted anyway, and double jumping doesnt matter because you can just get the boost again easily
God please don’t encourage that. BFB is more annoying than snipers on vsh_toys
I played on a Sever that had the bfb able to be equipped and it just gave a short speed boost with no movement speed penalty I think if you hit a meatshot.
This video just got a whole lot more relevant. Also I was just watching this right before the update was dropped
I'd love to see an updated list for the current official vsh
There was a new boss added to the first map you played in, and he looks really good, its basically a robot Saxton hale whos special turns him into a sentry buster.i don't know if he is only in that server, but he is there lol
its a custom boss, i THINK hes just saxton hale but his rage turns him into a sentry
@@Rodrigo-kq3js That thing is crazy. Basically Hale but after stunning players you can just kill them all in one hit.
Where exactly should the Robo Saxtron Hale sit on this tier list?
I remember one time I was playing VSH and I was the Easter Bunny. When I used my special, it glitched and it just gave me the normal Grenade Launcher to use as much as I like... There was no survivors.
on a server i was on the battalion's backup summons dead players as bat scouts, its funny but quite useless
Actually, it could be very useful, distracting the boss while reviving other players/getting crits/getting uber/escaping
Do you know what the server is called ?
@@besnick i think he meant enemy scouts like scouts that attack the players
@@HellcatMonkey no, he means friendly scouts that only have a bat
I believe that all classes are able to express themselves in different ways. There are maps where there are many or few first-aid kits and ammo. Classes that can quickly escape by spending HP will feel great on the map with a large number of first-aid kits, but with a small number of them, they will not be able to easily escape
I have never even heard of this gamemode. Guess I have something new to try.
play more community servers
what claude said, there is a whole new world waiting for you in community custom maps and gamemodes
you forgot to mention that goomba stomping is very effective, so playing scout with the force a nature is really fun, trying to get altitude on the boss and then dropping down on him is always fun, especially if you juke them as well. best loadout would be force a nature, bonk (if not black listed, if it is use the winger) and the atomizer
Okay but hear me out, dragons fury and mvm buffed gas passer
"On top of that, your airblast can greatly annoy your teammates"
Is that not why you play Pyro..?
He should make a new tier for the official VSH gamemode
It's fun, but I hate when you join and the round already started, or when you're the first player to die and have to wait an eternity
The only reason I don’t want to play vsh with ransoms, is because if you can’t respawn, you’ll spend most of your time dead, and it isn’t fun when you are just dead for basically forever
I can't believe it took me this many years to realize Saxton's chest hair is shaped like Australia.
I remember a long time ago, there was a server that would automatically switch the last member of the RED team to a Pyro (fully healed and ammo restocked) because they thought Pyro was actually the _best_ match for VSH. Granted that was a while ago, there may have been lots of balance patches since then
lmfao
you either die a hero, or live long enough to become a pyro.
I remember playing this game mode years ago. Combine that with the fact that I recognize almost every track used as background music in the video, and wow... what a nostalgia trip. Thanks for making this video.
I love this! I'm so glad that this game mode is getting so much more attention.
We need vsh official version tier list
I almost went on a defense on Pyro but then I realized this is about the Old VSH.
i really love playing medic because i get to save a lot of people's asses when the boss rages, also I play FF2 (freak fortress 2) and medic receives 20% uber for every crossbow hit on the boss, which is pretty insane
edit: 2 years later, the server i play on has removed all these things for medic sadly :( but hey there's goomba stomping now!
edit 2: actually nvm it was bugged and so medic gets 20% again! but no crits so my dopamine receptors are lacking
which server do you play on? i used to play on leathal zone with they closed theirs a couple years back
@@erikstrindberg2520 I play on Skial's server
Pretty cool to see someone making such deep content for a game I used to call my bread and butter. This vid really reminds me of the glory days of spending all my hours on saxton hale trying to do as much damage as possible, great vid overall.
The most fun I've had in TF2 was in VSH. Like seven to ten years ago, a Steam group/forum called OzFur ran a server that did interesting things with boss concepts and balancing that nothing I've seen since has even come close to matching. I miss it so I'm gonna gush about it. Bosses had passive effects and you could select modifiers to change how the game was played. There was sudden death if the rounds dragged on for too long. Last man standing was forced pyro so you didn't have to worry about circlejerking with a scout, spy or soldier. Bosses had interesting rages which could be used at 100% or 200% for increased effect.
Saxton Hale passively had 50% knockback resistance and could rage to fear anyone nearby, gain invulnerability, and kill anyone that touched him for a while.
Christian Brutal Sniper did not take % HP damage from backstabs, always killed anyone they hit unless uber'd, and could rage to force everyone to charge at him.
Captain Falcon didn't lose rage unless he killed someone with it, and could perform a falcon punch to dash forward, killing anyone in a line that wasn't uber'd (stunning them instead).
Gabe Newell prevented Medic from doing a thing they could do by spending 100% uber to summon a dead player as a vampire Heavy since he "banned" any player killed, and could rage to cause everyone on the enemy team to enter Valve Time, experiencing massive input delay.
DC's Joker didn't kill enemies, but turned them into vampires on hit which had friendly fire enabled, lost health slowly and were forced to melee teammates that got too close to them, and could rage to swap the position of everyone on the map while bringing in intense visibility restricting darkness and inducing a temporary vampire state in addition to allowing him to kill.
The Guardian turned the match into hide and seek on round start, complete with vision restricting darkness. Everyone was forced Demoman and all forms of communication were disabled. You could only hide and wait out the round to win.
Shame the whole thing fell apart because of drama and the owner deciding to just pack it in. They didn't keep the server files either so it's just gone forever.
29:23 does this man play without quickswitch?
what is that
@@maestrofeli4259 it makes you switch weapons like any other fps game, it took me a while to find out that that was an option you could turn off
this aged really well
boy this really applies to the official one.
Man this footage is super nostalgic, used to play this mode and these maps all the time. Also I remember Pyro used to be pretty good due to pre-nerf reserve shooter critting the hale when they were in the air at all, even when they were jumping.
2 years later and VSH has become an official part of TF2
Hey, literally my favorite tf2 youtuber!! Let’s watch this baby!
Will be expecting more Tier lists soon, this is a threat.
H U H
H U H
30:54 Spotted the sniper. He's hiding behind several trees under the cracked rock face.
We need a follow up for the official version
Frequent VSH and FF2 player here. Creating tier lists for bosses in VSH is kind of useless since the bosses and various weapons can greatly differ depending on the server you like to play on (VSH is Open Source after all). My recommendation is to play Saxton Hale. Not only is he consistently good across any VSH or FF2 server, no one will get mad at you in chat or VC because you played Saxton Hale.
The biggest tip I also have is to go on a jump server and do the air strafing levels. Air strafing is an invaluable skill to have as most bosses.
yeah things can be wildly different, i was in a server that even added the MvM revive mechanic in. idk if all vsh/ff2 servers have it but going for ~2k damage market gardens on the boss never gets old
i have been playing VSH since 2014 and it's legit the only game mode i play. Although i don't agree with everything you say in this video, i still really appreciate that a proper in-depth analysis has been made on this game mode.
I agree with you mr mumbus sir +rep
Lol i saw you in a server playing hybrid knight. Bruh you fucking solo that boss
I agree, demo with pipes charge and highlander are high tier, same for spy, medic and engineer. A good spy, medic, engi or demo can easily deal more than 10'000 dmg solo
-rep, called me the n word for playing demo man
@@marjar___7121 -rep bad medic
Hi there! 2500 hours on Vsh player here. Just wanted to share my thoughts on some of the classes potential and bosses aspects.
*The Easter Bunny* might at first seem the worst boss, but actually it's really good against more experienced players. You see, all of the bosses have the same jump height. Players get used to this, and position them selfs in places the bosses can't reach them. And here's where the Bunny shine's because players sometimes forget about the higher jump or just underestimate how high he can actually jump, you can often catch overconfident players thinking they're safe. Also the crit eggs which fall after killing a player is also pretty useful against classes that need to be hit more than once. Dead ringer is a great example, since the spy using it simply cannot survive a crit mele hit from the boss even with overheal. The same goes for overhealed Heavies, medics exc.
*The horseless headless headtaker Jr.* Actually has a small knockback resistance. It's something few people know about, but shooting him with for example the rocket launcher doesn't make him go flying as far as the other bosses.
*Pyro* is definitely the worst class for Vsh. Airblasting at the wrong time can be devastating for your team. He requires a lot of skill and game sense to be useful, since airblasting at the right time might save your team from an lethal rage. It's obviously better for 5 people to survive the rage and to give the boss about 30% of it back instead of just watching your team die. Also the backscratcher is very useful, since the medic can build Uber very quickly.
*Scout* .I'm kinda disappointed you didn't mention the babyfaces blaster and crit-o-cola combo. It's the most powerful combo for scout. Dealing damage to your self makes the babyfaces blaster fire far quicker than before. Using the the crit-o-cola with that makes scout deal insane amounts of damage in just seconds. Probably the best choice for scouts on Vsh. Also the Boston basher is really good to help with the blaster and cola combo, since you can damage your self for that extra firing speed very quickly. Also medics can build Uber quicker similarly to the backscratcher.
*The huntsman sniper* is really good. But did you know you can completly destroy a taunt killing huntsman by using the conga or any other dance taunt? It will stop the sniper from taunt killing the boss and make him dance. It's really funny sometimes to see the snipers reaction :D
You didn't mention Gun Spy's potential.
Deals huge damage, greater than most mercenaries and has a high survivability.
The main weapon in this mode is not a knife, but a revolver that always has a mini-crits, which provides incredibly high damage from all ranges. You use the knife as a last resort or when you are sure that you can do backstab.
The main feature is that you shoot the revolver all the time, and when the boss wants to kill you, you either try to trickstab him (sometimes it worth it), or you jump out on his damage ,being invisible ,by jumping right before he will hit you
If you combine this with a YER it gives a reduced decloak sound volume. Boss won't be able to track you down and kill you.
If you die a lot because you don't have time to charge up your watch, you can play Big Earner, which gives you speed boost and charges your watch just for hitting Boss.
L'Etranger removes a VERY much damage Spy could do, so not.
The Ambassador deals HUGE damage, but takes away the ability to spam the Boss, and if you don't have good aiming, you're likely to miss most of your shots. But I think you can try it.
As a result, Spy is able to deal more damage than Demoknight, not as fast as he does, but is able to double the damage of Demoknight for an entire round as he is just less of a Glass Cannon.
(Spy can backstab, but don't forget he has a good gun)
Sorry for bad english
Your English is not bad, my friend.
@@magmacube8689 I wrote this with a google translator but thanks
I find the revolver useless if the hale is mildly decent. if there's a hale constantly super jumping or flanking the enemies via super jump then it's almost impossible to hit your shots unless you're an absolute god at the revolver
Each first shot from the revolver is 100% accurate, just point and click
Worth mentionning that the Enforcer 20% damage bonus apply while undisguised and stacks while disguised, if you have an AMP nearby and only shoot while disguised, you can do 170+ damage per shot, turning you into a diet Sniper.
Pyro has one use case air-blasting the boss away from medics
you should probably make an updated version of this
Love playing VSH and FF2, always have trouble finding places to play it though, not sure why. Great video!
lotta stuff i'd change about VSH balancing. I played a server once that changed a lot of things, but it seemed to have vanished the next day. My main gripe is everyone relying on taunt crits, really. Minicrits would be fine since they're not nearly as powerful.
Press F to pay respects to pyro
F
F
F
F
Little did he know...
The server that you were playing on in the beginning in one that I play quite frequently. The classes I usually see getting top damage on that server are soldier, spy, sniper and demo. Sometimes pyro with the gas passer can do a lot, but it can be as risky as playing spy to pull off. Medic on that server is OP because he can revive everyone once per game. The server's name is BlackWonder and it runs the map Reservoir 24/7.
I play on it frequently too lmao
This needs an update now
I appreciate the flags for the songs. I wish more creators did this.
The Easter bunny in an enclosed room.... his rage would be quite deadly since the stun from the rage makes it difficult to escape
And the greamdes dear god
they made the pyro bad for this game mode
and adding an extra ubersecond for the vagineer with airblast
if it removed a second then pyro could be ranked a little higher
just a little??? vagineer rage would be made near useless by a pyro
@@vierzehn575 it’s just 1 second
@@supermaximglitchy1 just fucken spam airblast
@@vierzehn575 nah it’s just 1 boss so pyro would still be low
It annoys me to hell how he zig-zags around after every shot with sniper. The boss doesn't have a hitscan long range weapon. Wiggling around only makes you more visible.
Great video.
The main reason why Vagineer is S Tier is his knockback immunity, not his invulnerability (although that's pretty sweet as well).
Being immune to knockback allows you to easily take down sentries or even sentry nests.
And force a nature scouts
Oh your knock back immunity? *loose cannon* and yes vagineer can still be knocked back by loose cannon or well stopped for a brief period but if if shot at his feet it will throw him into the air a little
Ah, VSH. That was a fun mod to help develop. I'm surprised your ranking spy so low, but idk of many changes they did after CBS was introduced since thats when I left the dev team. Spy used to be a hard carry class, as a good spy would routinely reach top damage with the rapid backstab thing, Although they couldn't actually kill the boss by themselves very easily and needed some help after the 4th stab.
The rapid stab thing was you used quickswap after stabbing the boss, then quickswapping back. This let you stab without the razorback stun affecting you, it was a glitch though. I dunno if they fixed that though, i should really play this gamemode again.
I find that Spy generally gets weaker the longer a match goes on while most other classes become stronger.
More players alive means more distractions meaning a Spy is likely to get a stab or two in, but when Hale starts weeding them out a bit, the spy disguised as a Scout stands out and doesn't get stabs anymore.
Would also say that just through playing TF2 you eventually learn to turn around occasionally and deny Spies a backstab, you don't chase people for more than a few seconds without turning around and attacking the people behind you.
I recall the knife glitch however I recall it being slightly different, where after a stab you were free to switch to your revolver and take potshots while backpedaling away, maybe I just never swapped back to my knife as I assumed it was still under stun but eh.
@@SpaceGuyOnline Yeah spy is def an early game terror. His advantage is that if he gets stabs he can sometimes deny an entire rage due to hte sheer amount of damage he does in early game. But yeah he can't carry a gaem by himself at all.
A good spy can easily reach thousands of damage, but can also be the first to die.
From what I have seen in my years of VSH, spies are best at doing the first chunks of damage to hale, stabs are based on HP so you will always do huge damage.
The more players means more stab damage.
I remember playing a vsh server where spies instead of having protection on cloak, you had the big earner speed boost on a stab with all the knifes aswell as faster decloak.
So a good trickstabbing spy could play with the kunai and stab hale over and over.
@@ghoulbuster1 Yep that was essentially the design intent with how spy's damage curve was balanced. Spy can chunk down Hale's hp when hale is confident that no one can stand against him due to having 20k hp easily, making him panic quicker than he normally would as a spy chunks it down if he goes in overconfident. However if a spy just hid all game, he wouldn't do much damage at all to a low hp hale.
I went from abusing that to eventually fixing it ;p
Just had to set an additional netprop, m_flNextPrimaryAttack on the weapon.
Talking about the HHH Jr. Teleport, i was once looking for the last remaining member of the red tram after taking out other reds. The timer is running out and i decided to do a teleport to find where he is, then i found the engineer with a teleporter and before i can react, i get telefragged
I think you underestimate just how potentially amazing the backburner in vsh; (a swarm of enemies vs 1 very slow unit who'll likely just spend the rage on a spy that's dead ringing or a engie camp, all encompassing and flooding hales view more often than not.) truly is. you can spend about a full tank and as long as you're straddling his back right they'll barely ever notice, by the end of it you should come out to something like 1.5k - 5k. it's insane. deals 460 damage per second from behind, and base stock damage from the front. or go with something like the dragons fury, constant pressure, annoys the shit outta most people, lotta damage if d.o.t. isn't your thing, with crits it's 225 per shot after being burned, which ramps up. extremely quickly.
that plus the scorch shot in cramped tunnels with alot of clutter has helped me escape from hale more times than I can count. it's a force of nature but from any distance. with the only caveat that it's a slug as apposed to a buckshot, and not all servers support it for flare jumping. or just simply run the powerjack and bam, any time you get targeted with a rage, or just chased in general the slow penalty is completely removed and all it comes down to is juking hale. so you're already covering the main goal of two of the classes in the game, and doing it adequately enough at any rate. by being effectively a scout, easy escape, fast speed, constant knockback and withdrawl, and a spy but just d.o.t. and if played correctly not giving the hale any significant meter.
as for spy, all I can say is if you play hale long enough there's not a chance in hell you're looking in one direction for any longer than a second unless you're deliberately trying to get stabbed for the rage or someone is turbo tunnel visioned on some dude that's goomba'd him like 8 times throughout the match. unironically solider market gardens are so much more viable than any spy i've ever met since my eyes aren't constantly looking behind *and* above. even further than that, his stab gives an automatic rage bar in most servers, the amount of times I got killed that way has been alot more often than pyro air spammers.
all that being said, yeah there are players that just m2 every time hale gets close outta fear. but in general, nah. he can be useful if y'just know how to play him.
always have him on fire, if he's being swarmed it's probably advantageous to just hit him from behind with the scorch, and he'll get knocked up in the air for a fair amount of time, even better if he looks at that as an opportunity to super jump as it completely stagnates his speed so he just jumps straight up then back down without moving, also opening him up to back stabs and markets/goombas.
I feel like he just gets a bad rep because people only notice the airblasting, nothin' else.
spy is alot worse imo. lotta damage, but fucks over teammates with absolutely no warning as the rage meter instantly fills then the ones closest to hale just died for that spy's 900 - 2k.
and there's usually multiple of them in lobbies, which just makes it that much worse.
"as for spy, all I can say is if you play hale long enough there's not a chance in hell you're looking in one direction for any longer than a second"
So the Hale strat which removes the benefit of Spy doesn't remove the benefit of backburner Pyro which needs to do the same thing? In fact when you consider this a Hale will SEE the Backburner, let you get close... then turn around and kill you.
Man everyone just died for that Pyro's 900-2K before the rage filled up too... it is almost like you can be taken advantage of for Rage people aren't expecting.
It is almost like the Pyro is hated because they have all the issues Spy does but more.
To do well they need to be close.
To do well they need to flank.
To do well they end up filling Rage incredibly fast killing their team.
Have a button which if they press makes the boss dodge an few attacks and build rage.
Lacks a Dead Ringer to escape.
@@Buglin_Burger7878 generally 3500 damage is rage, most servers as far as i'm aware tweak it to 2500, or the odd turbo server will go even lower.
are you really comparing hugging hale with a melee, to a ranged weapon that's notorious for having the most broken hitbox detection in the game besides possibly the huntsman?
by the time hale notices in the middle of a fire fight from all angles, you'll have done atleast 500 minimum to 900 damage from a 4 - 6 ft distance at let's say a 3 - 5 second interaction, of which it gives you plenty of time to powerjack away, since I guess we're pretending like flare jumping isn't a thing in quite possibly the only server that makes it viable.
yes raging carries the benefit of nobody exactly knowing when it'll go off. a really moot point. by that logic everything but spy and the occasional heavy is irrelevant because they can take more than one hit? it's more about how they cope with the situation, just like any other class. in this instance it's speed as I already mentioned.
to do well you do not need to be close.
you typically want to flank yes, just like literally any other class that isn't demo knight, heavy or- well that's really it.
doing well you still have an immense amount of time to stay away and fire from a distance as any other player, and as the pyro it comes down to how quick on the draw are you and how well can you juke hale for 3 or so seconds, and that's if you haven't played the game long enough to get that sense of when you should leave and come back to keep hale away from raged players, whether that be distracting him with that backburner he almost certainly will see the giant flaming vignette cornering his screen as you mentioned, or to knockback with the scorch shot, or airblast if you're in dire straits or need.
airblast is a horrible thing yes, so long as you use it effectively in some cases and it was a necessary evil, I can justify it. like saving an engie by throwing hale off the edge of the platform you're standing on. but nobody is denying airblast sucks, again, it's a moot point, as I wasn't even arguing for it to begin with. just don't use it, backburner I believe is the best weapon any new player could use to learn pyro, keep behind them hold m1, keep your middle finger off the right click and on the mouse wheel.
spy, will do absolutely none of the things I just mentioned, he comes in, takes the 2k, right clicks, runs away while the rest of the team dies. he's not saving anybody from being targeted, he's not going to be flying across the map or acting as a distraction, it's sheer unga bunga I liek leederbord, fuck everyone else.
but since he has a dead ringer I guess that takes it, every class in the game sucks except spy.
@@skully.8955 Lots of time wasted on a worthless class
I dont even play VS Hale... or really tf2 in general and yet I'm still watching this 34 minute video
actually phlog pyro is quite effective at doing damage. I still wouldn't use pyro tho lol
The best VSH I ever played was the OpenFortress Merc only VSH. Everyone playes the same class, and has to pick up weapons. It was so fun and the server went down.
I expected you to mention the Dragon's fury ):
Also the Thermal Thruster is okay-ish to escape, this due to (most) servers allowing you to launch again mid air
same I dunno why he didnt mention the DF. Im guessing if he did he'd just say its inconsistent. When the DF hits it hits really hard.
He didn't mention it cause I see barley any pros use the DF
@@BritishSoldier-kr9xf I mean, Me neither, but that doesn't mean the weapon doesn't exists!
@@DL-SUFF After a day or 2 of saying that I was hale fighting a DF
Yeah, i use both of them and after 2-3 hits Dragon's Fury deals a shit ton of damage. Then i flee with my Thermal Thurster to get ammo and move back in.
Spaceguy: Saxton Hale
UA-cam captions: sex and hail
I played this game mode a lot when I was new to the game. Much more than the regular game. When I first played as the christian brutal sniper, I had no idea how the huntsman works. I had already been playing the gamemode forever before I even found a Bushwaka, and then I immediately used it to scale walls. I kept trying to scale walls in the normal game because I thought that was just what the bushwaka is for. Honestly, sniper needs one of those "climbing axe" things.
The only thing I hate about this mode is the "scare" effect on rage. What do you even do against that except rely on luck? If the boss targets you or you just happened to be close to him, you're dead. It invalidates any skill and cool strategy except maybe sniping from a good hiding spot. If a boss uses this as often as he can, it's just so unenjoyable.
Long have I waited for this tier list.
Demoman is a very, very strong class, you just have to play safer than other guys and not rush the boss down. Scottish resistance is very good, because boss simply can't notice sticky trap when he chasing some scouts or soldiers or when he running to engineer's sentry. The sticky traps is very, very powerful, they can deal a lot of damage and most importantly, you don't have to be close to them. Just play safe and wait for your team to distract boss or just to die, because it will give you crits on granade launcher, which means you have 300 damage per shot. And, as for escape option, just place one of 14 scottish resistance stickies near to you, so when boss will find you you will be able to just fly away to your team and use them as a meat shield.
On more tunnel filled maps he's even better since the boss can't avoid them as easily. If you play well enough, bosses that aren't Vagineer can have their rage ruined in one right-click.
@@PurpleNecromancer-10 Exactly. On that popular Nebula map it is even better than tunnels, because of boosting ramp that launch people to other side of map. It's kinda like boss's second super jump and if there will be 14 minicrit stickies boss will go for boost anyway. Very powerful strategy.
@@jumpinghunter9152 Crevice is also pretty good since it has launchpads that go up tall funnels into tight areas that the boss can't go around, on top of plenty of ways to keep out of a boss's sight, on top of good sentry nest spots that can be protected by sticky traps.
@@PurpleNecromancer-10 Overall it is just very common for bosses to drastically underestimate demomen and stickytraps. When he see 14 stickies in each other its hard to identify the amount of them, so bosses usually just walk through traps and don't even bother to look under their feets. And then we get like 6000 damage in around 3-4 well planned explosions.
Playing demoknight with the Scottish resistance is one of my favorite ways to play. Collect your heads early game, and stack up crit stickies underneath the cap point, sentry, or a common retreat area for reds. This works for me especially on Skyhigh.
What about hybrid demo?
If you manage to land 4 hits in with the eyelander, you'll be able survive 1 hit and move fast, not to mention you'll still have your primary, which, if you can aim, can make you immortal to an extent thanks to the knockback it provides oh and you also have a shield that lets you tank a hit if you get hit without having 4 heads
So this is a gamemode dominated by snipers where people would hate on Pyros... and both more so than usual.
not gonna lie this made me interested in trying out vsh
it's a very fun mode. avoid servers with stupid shit like medic revives enabled or robo saxtron hale and you'll be fine
same, dunno how to find good servers tho
holy shit this dude used advance wars music, i loved the original and playing against sturm and eagle. you deserved a follow for this and your mega valid chart
I hope your ready to make a sequal for the new vsh mode they added
when i used to play these game modes, my favourite strategy would be to play spy with a stock revolver and only use that, taunting usually gives you crits and you can deal a fairly decent amount of damage throughout the match since you can always just cloak away when hes coming for you
Best underrated UA-camr and tier list
I absolutely love that you used that LoZ music for the bunny boss. I'm so glad people remember that weird bunny form link got, easily my favorite zelda game
vsh got added into tf2 bro no waying
Me watching this knowing I’m not taking any of these tips: