Avenger 85 some things to know.
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- Опубліковано 4 жов 2024
- Hope you are all well. In this video we have some new toys for the Avenger 85. We will not use all of them but I’m excited to see how it all gose. I’m going to keep it short and sweet this time. Kick back and wait till the end. Not what I thought would happen…
Tool tip always loosen your torque wrench when you store it
I did not know that. Read this and went straight to the garage. 😂😂😂😂 thank you! 🎉🎉
Thanks for the ride along brother I was told to check the squash on the side in line with the pin bearing because the piston can't rock on you and give a fake reading another thing try putting your old head back on and see if you get your performance back then check it's squash then check the squash on the smolik head you want a 1mm squash or less be safe brother that gasket maker should be ok I personally use ultra gray gasket maker high torque
Thanks for the feed back brother! I was going to have to do what you said, but ended up finding out it was a carb issue. I also went base gasket, shim, base gasket. Ran the smolik oring with a squish of 0.9ish mm. There are so many gasket makers 😅. Thanks again Mike!!
Piston will not rock at TDC, it has full support of the cylinder wall. At bdc however, the Sam can not be said
@kennethferguson3103 Thanks for that info. Ride safe!
That's a Smolik head for Sure. It's similar and yeat soooo different. Permatex black is good. Thanks for sharing. Thanks for the ride.
I was looking at the Permatex black! Thanks Leo. We have her running much better now.
@@grendelsgarage9723 i use ultra grey for all my engines
Black is called Chevy motor shit. Blue is Ford motor shit. Grey is called Toyota motor shit. Which is betterest? Toyota
Great video bro thanks for sharing it bro
🎉🎉 thanks brother. I ended up working out the bugs today. Got a sold ride it too. Ride safe!
Thanks for the support! We appreciate the feedback. Ride safe!
Thank you guys for making these products! Helps the hobby grow and more fun for us garage junkies 😂😂😂🎉🎉🎉 I will be buying from you again! 😉 ❤❤🎉🎉🎉😊
You should be in the 40's and 50's with that
Fix the problem today and had a solid ride! It was a Carb issue that I didn't see coming. Also, maybe to much compression. I will have to jet up or upgrade carb. 😊😊.
@@grendelsgarage9723did you fix it? If so what was wrong? Oh and what did you change?
@DeadSharkOG I ended up having to remove the air filter on the carb. It Wierd fix, but the motor wasn't getting enough air.
@@grendelsgarage9723 ah okay yeah everyone says they remove the air filters. Also I got a question. My piston was hitting my case is there a fix for that?
Thanks for your support. Ride safe
Thank you guys for making a solid product! This head is worth every penny. Love this hobby 🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉
After watching some of your videos I made a shim just like the ones you bought and then that raised my cylinder to correct the port timing and then I deck the cylinder down to get my squish
Hey, thanks for posting. 🎉🎉 I'm wondering if your just running the shim and/or base gaskets? Also, could you elaborate on correcting the port times? I'm very interested in hearing your take on this engine. 🎉🎉 thank you!!
He's referring to putting a degree wheel on the crank and checking the numbers. By that I'm meaning the intake opening, transfer opening, exhaust opening. This will give you your blow down #'s. You'll need to likely learn how this is done and then to figure out what you want the intake to drop to, if you'll be raising the transfers and finally or 2ndly raising the exhaust.
This engine the exhaust is restricting the top end, the intake is restricting the fuel flow and mild transfer configuration can be done
You definitely want to check squish at the sides of either transfer. If you check at exhaust or intake the piston can rock front to back and give an incorrect reading. That’s the reason we check on sides by transfers, because the piston wrist pin won’t allow the piston to rock left to right which will give you a proper squish measurement. Just an fyi on what and why. Also I agree iron horse has a lot of info, he a lil long winded but if you can sit though all the talking you can learn a lot, same goes for tinman too. But there’s a lot of chainsaw guys out there that have good info if you can find their channels.
Thanks, brother! 👍 that makes perfect sense. I will get a proper reading and let you know what we got. Yes, he is long-winded, haha 😄. Hope you're well better.
I am starting to think my Avenger shipped with a 38mm crank. it came with only one paper base gasket and there is too much squish. I plan on breaking it in without touching anything and then put a Smolik head on it and grind the cylinder down to get proper squish. I didn't measure the stroke but I will when I take the head off.
Mmmmm.... that is very interesting. I'm starting to think there might be different cylinder cast?? 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔😶🌫️😶🌫️😶🌫️
Haha they are secretly taking my advice lol
I used the 2 base gaskets that came with my engine and I also used the stock head gasket with the Smoking head and with the O ring installed and had a squish of .8
Just out of curiosity, where did you buy yours? Seems like people are all over the place with the amount of basa gaskets they need to get a 0.80 squish 😅.
@@grendelsgarage9723 I bought it from Hybrid Power and how I set it up was recommended by Kurt Smolik
Take a grinder cut top off the acorn nuts
Sorry, not sure what your talking about 😅. Let me know thanks. 🎉🎉
@@grendelsgarage9723 the head bolts you don't want to torque the head down with acorn nuts because they can bottom out and mess up the case
@@Xos_BassHead999 total agree there 👏. I've pulled to many studs out with the acorn nuts.
Check your crank seals. Mine were dusted after about 20 miles. Leave your bearing shields alone. I had issues using the shims with the motoseal and went to a double base gasket. you might want to check your cranking compression. 0.66 seems tight to me.
Hey, I looked at my seals, and they seem good. 0.66 ended up being a little much. No damage 😅 thank goodness. I did end up using the shim. I eaned up going base gasket, shim, base gaskets 😊 and ended up with 0.90ish I think. I'm not going to lie, I was avoiding the gasket maker 😅. Working of the video for next week!
I just got my A85 yesterday.
I also just ordered the smolik head.
Quick question, why are you using those metal shims/ base gaskets?
I measure my squish, i had 2mm solder twisted together and it still wasnt enough. So my squish is over 2mm. I haven't started the engine yet, and i haven't tightened down the head bolts all the way either.
Just trying to see if you could give me a heads up before i waste money or f***k something up . Thanks
My man, great question. From what I've been seeing 👀 on Facebook, it all depends on where you bought your Avenger 85. I bought mine from Ken Hinson on facebook. It appears that my cylinder is shorter than others. That is why I bought the shims. I ended up going base gasket, shim, base gasket, and just the Smolik Performance. When you get your smolik performance head, I would recommend not using the stock head gasket. Just use the rubber O ring in your new head. That will drop your squish gap. Also, if your motor came with 2 base gaskets, remove one to help drop that cylinder down. I'm sure you know, but shoot for that 0.8mm. If you still have too much squish, you're going to have to deck your cylinder. Hope that helps. Keep me posted 📫 😌
@@grendelsgarage9723 mine only has one base gasket.
But from all the information that I have gathered from the saw hybrids, they were using huge gaps, and was about 1.5mm
Also I read somewhere I think it was on Smolik site that said to shoot for 1.2mm
I know that in the past everyone was saying to shoot for .8 mm for the most power, but those were the regular China dolls.
My gaskets aren't compressed, but I plan to use a base gasket and the Smolik head with O ring. Hopefully that will put me at 1.2 . I will be happy with that, lol
@KB_Joys Interesting, I might have to run the stock head gasket, measure sqish again, and shoot for the 1.2mm and see what happens. Thanks foe that input. I know Tim the tinman don't go crazy on his saw builds. Good luck 👍
@@grendelsgarage9723 you said that you may have had too much compression?
Or it could have been the head gasket that split your O ring.
But also I've read that the saws have bigger gaps because they have the most power under load.
That was with using an actual ms460 chainsaw jug on top a China doll bottom.
I think Ken had redesigned the cylinder he made so it could utilize higher rpm power, but I suppose doing so would decrease initial take off torque.
On the ms460 jugs that I have done I used 1.5 mm and those engines indeed had great torque, but seemed to lack top end.
I'm ok with that, but the biggest problem with the real saw jugs is heat. They do get real hot, and that wouldn't be any good for what I intend to do with my bike.
I want a dependable runner that can go great distances and climb hills. I'm not looking to go 50 mph, let alone 40, but I would be cool with 35 and that's so I can keep up with normal traffic.
The head bolts have top when you tighten them down the stud bottoms out cut top off so head does not leak
Thank you for your comment, but I'm not 100 percent sure what you mean.
stud will stop tightening once it hits the rounded part of the nut
It could be the carb bro those are tiny tiny. Thanks for the ride🚴🏼♂️💨💨💪🏼
So, it did end up being the carb but not how I expected 😅😅. Running a 0.66mm piston squish gap wasn't the best either. No damage but I did end up going a different route. With that all being said, a do think a bigger carb will be needed. I was thinking pz 19?
Piston slap occurs after bdc on phantom 85 cylinders. Because a ms 460 does not have a 40mm stroke so it pulls the piston out of the cylinder to far allowing it to rock back and then slap
Hey, thanks for that information 👍 I understood what it was, but now why! This helped me wrap my head around piston slapping.
What’s the speed completely stock on it?
Yeah just head stock carb
😅😅😅 okay, let me break it down the best I can. I'm about 200ld. I'm riding on a steel frame with a 36 tooth sprocket, and I'm still braking it in. All that equals about 37 to 40ish stock. For 150 bones, I'm impressed. 🎉🎉🎉🎉
@@grendelsgarage9723 300+ bones to canada
When you practice on a couple of 80's with your new degree wheel and learning the art of timing, you'll invest soon enuf in a Dremel and carbide bits and polishing. This really makes all engines wake up
You should be checking the squish to the side over the top of the wristpin to avoid any possible rocking of the piston
Hey, thank you very much. When I was doing the reading, I felt like I was doing nothing off. 😆😆😆
@@grendelsgarage9723also only measure the very tip of the solder after measuring up from transfer ports, like he said☝️. And don’t measure with the tip of the calipers. Go about an inch back, just behind the chamfer at the tip
@jamiebouchard9862 Thank you very much! I didn't know that either! You all rock! That makes sense in my head!!
you get a good ticket here with this,,,, lol
Sad to hear that. I could see someone calling me in for noise, but I do try with silencers to the most part. 😅😅
I like how you run the chain on the chain tensioner that's how I run mine. That's how they should be
Thank you, almost didn't have to run one! Close hahah
@@grendelsgarage9723a half link could get you there…
Jet your carb really rich lean out the needle 1 notch
I just ordered some new jets for the carb. Didn't think I would ever get to get up of of these bo fang carbs haha. The carb was part of the issue. Just not how I expected. Also, 0.66mm squish gap was to much.
Music spot on bro haha
Thank you brother!! 🎉🎉🎉
Very nice brother keep up the great work
Thanks, brother. I was able to get her running much better! Can't wait to show you.
The gomax head is much better and it's cheaper in price
I was looking at that bad boy, too. It does look nice. Why do you feel it's better? Thanks for posting 📫
I used the same stuff everyone has told me to switch over to Yamabond and Hondabond
That yamabond look good from what I'm reading.... interesting stuff for sure, haha.
Go towards the transfers for squish cuz otherwise piston could rock
Thanks so much! I think that is why I was getting slightly different reading each time. 😅😅. Makes a lot of sense going over the piston list pin/transfer side.
@@grendelsgarage9723 yup ride safe brother
On some Avengers ( mainly the first batch from what I’ve read) have the need for the 2mm spacer because of port timing/ hitting the head. I thought I read some place on the Avenger 85 FB group that it had been corrected recently? Anyway, my issue is I’m getting a squish of .95-1.2 . So if I use the 2 mm spacer that makes the squish greater. I’m wondering if I have an engine that doesn’t need the spacer? Idk know man. I’m confused. 😂
I would have to agree with you. I ordered this bad boy as soon as they came out of Facebook from Ken Henson. In order for me to run it stock, I had to add a base gaskets. At that time, it was 3 base gaskets, which I don't recommend. I got the Smolik Performance head and spacer. Now, this part gets a little hard to follow. I had to go base gaskets, 2mm spacer, and base gasket to get a good piston squish of 0.8mm. Your shooting for 0.6mm to 1.0mm for your piston squish. Also, note that with the Smolik Performance head, you can run a head gasket or not. I ended up not having to run the stock head gasket, just the Oring that came with tm the Smolik Performance head.
I’m gonna just run mine as is until it’s broken in. Then I’m going to throw that spacer on later. From what I just learned today thats the difference. The spacer alters the port timing (stage2) and supposedly gives higher rpm’s and torque. So thats gonna be a future project. Apparently I have the stage one (stock). Ride safe friend!
@@stevemccullars8500 sweet ride safe. These average are no joke!!
@@grendelsgarage9723 I have the Olyin head. I’ve heard pretty good things about it. I’m sure I’ll eventually grab a smolick head though. But man 3 gaskets and spacer? That’s wild!
Steve for very high rpm's and the bigger bore, .9 to 1.1 is good. For you average 80cc China's, .65 to..8 works best. So in short, I suggest leaving your squish alone as when you tighten it down several times, extra will be gone
where did you get that engine kit i tried ebay they said no matches found
Sorry for the late response. They are everywhere now. Evern CDH has one on Amazon. Hope you got one!
@@grendelsgarage9723 i may get one this summer once i get a bike that's worth putting it on
@@grendelsgarage9723 No problem as I'm still doing research on which engines i should not consider getting
@larryshaver3568 Good deal!! 👍 let me know what you end up getting!!
@@grendelsgarage9723 will do
The wear wasn't your fault btw I got a kit and outa the box the piston was scratched.
Worst thing they did was put that rubber seal around the outside it gonna melt and lose compression for sure
Are you talking about the rubber head gasket for the smolik performance head's oring?
Lots of major companies do a Viton oring gasket. It's extremely reliable . It's oil and heat resistant and works great under compression. It's a proven style head gasket.
If the crank is is balanced then I could maybe see using the oilring rubber but 90% of the time the engine vibrates and will cause the the rubber to get cut from your head gasket hitting it over time or even after a few rides seen it happen to many people already..just my opinion on the head. I got the gomax and its fantastic for a much better price point..you can pretty much buy a hole engine kit for the price of the kjsmolik head way over priced 👍🙂
@brianmclellan7498 overpriced for a proper custom made head? How much do you think a custom head is worth from a machine shop? From start to finish what's do you think it takes ? We are talking several hours. Not just pushing a button and let the machine do the work. Mind you most shop rates are 140-180 an hour.
The gomax is for 52 mm bore cylinder head for the avenger 85 it's a machine made after market head without the oilring that gonna be a issue over time for 94 bucks CAD why would anyone wanna pay 130 American cash for the same performance. is my point of view. Same performance for a better price point and there also sold out. 👍
People can see blinking tail light better than the solid light plus the battery lasts longer on blink.
Never thought about it like that. 👍 thanks for the tip, my man. I will make sure I'm blinking next ride. 💯💯💯
Blinking light creates target fixation, causing drivers to subconsciously drift in the direction of the source.
@@nicholaslafferty3928 interesting 🤔 thought 🤔 😀
Dude don't use that head gasket! The smoliks gave you viton seals!
@mikecyanide7492 why not? it seem to work well? Have you had issues with it?
@@grendelsgarage9723 I mean you can but the head is made to give you a perfect squish with no work involved. .8mm. I promise I have one lol
@@grendelsgarage9723 I mean you can but it's designed to bring squish in to perfection at .8mm. It worked me. Perfect squish zero work. Lol
I'm sorry but I'm not being rude but my opinion I don't think you should be making videos that until you get some more experienced 20 mi is all you had on that motor it's not even broke in yet and you're not knowing while some things are loose have to ride in it and thinking your cylinders moving up because your gas get swollen up due to the gas tells me that
Thanks for your comment 👍. I'm always working hard to expand my knowledge of the hobby. Ride safe 🙏
Its those garbage factory acorn nuts. Toss em,get some from hd just 4 nuts (reg) 4 washer 4 look washer. Torque head once your done.
put some reeds on that thing! 2 strokes thrive off reeds BRAAAAAAAAAAAAAP
For sure!!! I'm hesitant for now just because I want to understand reeds a little better first. But yes indeed they would only help.
Mines got the smallest one you can get but man it rips ! Not even broken in yet 😵