Blastoise vs Feraligatr - Pokemon Crystal
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- Опубліковано 16 чер 2023
- Rules:
1. Only my starter in battle
2. No items in battle, except held items
3. No glitches, exploits, save states, or RNG manipulation
4. No evasion moves before level 100*
Rule details:
-- *In gen1, evasion boosting is allowed if the Pokemon does it through means other than learning the move by level up or TM. For example, using Mimic or Mirror Move to boost evasion is allowed. (This exception is to keep ranking consistent with my legacy videos.)
-- I am allowed to manipulate my starter
-- I play the game at 4x game speed
-- For fair comparisons all my Pokemon have perfect (or near perfect) DVs / IVs
-- I am allowed to catch HM users - I can use all field moves
-- All in-battle glitches are allowed in generation 1
-- In generation 1, I'm allowed to skip Marowak with the Poke Doll
-- Surge's trash-can-puzzle is automatically solved
-- The bike is allowed in gen1, banned in gen2, and allowed for bypassing terrain in gen3
-- Saving between league members is allowed
-- If the solo Pokemon faints and I choose to blackout it counts towards my reset counter
-- I can pause the game and timer to take breaks
-- The footage is sped up / slowed down to match the pace of my narration
-- The ability Pickup can only be used if the starter has it
Patreon: / scottsthoughts
UA-cam memberships:
/ @scottsthoughtspokemon
Twitter: / psychicflying
Twitch: / scottsthoughtspokemon
Illustrations by / sarinavail
Thumbnail art by / brianlsart
STAB: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
DVs / IVs: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
Damage Calculations: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
Gen1 Stat Calculator: pycosites.com/pkmn/stat_gen1.php
Gen2 Stat Calculator: pycosites.com/pkmn/stat_gen2.php
Gen1 Crit Rates: www.smogon.com/rb/articles/cr...
Learnsets: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...
Base Stats: bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wi...) - Ігри
Hey everyone and welcome back to the latest installment of Scotts show "Both of these two pokemon can learn mud-slap but Gligar can not!".
Glad this is still a running theme in the comments section. Thanks, Oathkeeper Keyblade!
No, but seriously, I never understood why it was never able to learn that. It's just as asinine as Aerodactyl not knowing Rock Slide.
I was sad to not see that show return on the Charizard and Typhlosion video despite the fact that it applies there. Still though, love that it’s here.
Are you the new Denis or something?
@Charles Segale Aerodactyl does get Rock Slide in gen 3. Lance's Aerodactyl is a cheat by itself with Dragonite
@Duskstar89 Correct. I only brought it up because this was Generation 2 and Lance's Aerodactyl is a Cheating McCheaterson. :p
I think the reason Emboar got so much hate was because he was the 3rd Fire/Fighting starter in a row(Blaziken then Infernape). It was more a fatigue issue than a design one. Great, now I wanna do an Emboar run...
Yeah I think everyone was hoping it be fire dark. But that was inceneroar?
Nah, it gets hate because its design is atrocious
I like his design, he was my starter in gen5
@@rainogh6440 to each their own i guess. Scott mentioned he doesn't and never did like the Blastoise design, which i would argue it's one of the best in the series.
I mean the design was also a bit of a shrug. It's okay... but also we had multiple bipedal fire-fighting starters in a row and it was getting old. Hell, every fire-fighting starter eventually became bipedal up till generation 9! That's... honestly weird.
My favourite part of this video will inevitably be when Feraligatr says "It's gator time" and proceeds to beat Karen and Red without any resets
He's going to Morb so hard
Morbidly obeast
I only know of that reference because of the meme and I only remember it because of the Fubuki and Leto interview.
@@TheLeviathan1293 but do you know about 🙂
I love the bit about the egg. Prof Elm is entrusting you with the mysterious pokemon egg cause he has so much faith in you since it's so important. Then Scott just immediately throws it in the trash once his aide leaves.
the egg can be dealt with 5 hrs later, beating red comes first
"You'll have to get used to eating eggs for breakfast..."
Oh. It seems "Select your Stater" by Plauge of Gripes is too spicy for UA-cam anymore... But you still gotta get used to eating eggs...
Scott: "There is only 1 Grass-Type Pokémon in the league!"
Will's Exeggutor: "I'm a joke to you?!"
He was talking about Feraligatr's vulnerability to Grass move, and that Exeggutor has no offensive Grass moves, so yes, he *is* a Joke to Feraligatr and Scott.
Rapid Spin is absolutely invaluable in competitive GSC. Spikes are extremely powerful, especially since instead of having 3 layers that do 1/16 each as in Gen 3 and beyond, they're a single layer that do 1/8. They're so powerful that Pineco is used in NU to set them up since all of the fully evolved Spikes setters are in the higher tiers (Forretress and Cloyster in OU and Qwilfish in UU).
EDIT: I was incorrect about Spikes from Gen 3 on. The first layer does still do 1/8, and then the second layer is a fairly small increase in damage, I want to say around 1/6, then the third layer is 1/4. But even in modern gens, just one layer of Spikes is powerful.
GSC NU is so cool
I actually knew about Mind Reader/Lock-On allowing you to hit Pokemon using Fly/Dig, because that was specifically taught in the Academy in Pokemon Stadium 2, with an entire trial battle focused on hitting Pokemon using Fly/Dig.
Pokemon Stadium 2 was so good for having that Academy. It was chock full of info that was hard to find online at the time. It was also how I first learned about STAB.
Oh that's fun!
The Academy in PS2 also mentions RBY's "Normal type Pokemon can't be paralyzed by Body Slam" thing.
In the lecture "Residual-effect changes" in the "Moves" section of the Trainer class course:
"In the past, if a target Pokemon's type was identical to an attack move's type, the attack move's added effect would never work. The Gold and Silver versions have changed things a bit.
"Now, even if the defending Pokemon's type is identical to the attack move's type, the added effect may or may not work.
"That means that the Electric type Electabuzz could become paralyzed by Spark, an Electric type attack.
"There are still some exceptions... Attacking a Poison type Pokemon with a Poison type move will not poison it! In the same manner, an Ice type Pokemon cannot easily be frozen by an Ice type move! A Fire type attack won't easily burn a Fire type Pokemon!
"Pokemon are not affected as often by status problems that match their own types. Other than those exceptions, the added effects of moves will affect all Pokemon, even if attack and defender's type match."
@@paulnewton2284 that’s so cool
Ypu know, I think we could make a decent "which mon is most fun to play" tier list by ranking mons by the ratio of the time their playthrough is on screen to their play times.
I should do a stream and re-rank the mons based on how much I enjoyed the playthrough. Because some that are near the bottom were fun! I'm thinking of Smeargle, which was so fun to figure out and it felt really good when compared with its base stats.
@@ScottsThoughtsPokemon seel last spot
I'm not surprised that the water starters did so well. Having access to surf relatively early gives them an amazingly powerful & reliable STAB move that the other's don't get. The fire types can get flamethrower, but that happens a lot later in the game, and the grass types don't get anything. One thing I feel is interesting when comparing gen 1 & 2 is the significance of the differing gym orders. In gen 1, the gyms types give a significant advantage to the grass types in the early game, a tough mid game for the water types and a late game advantage to the fire type, but that isn't really true in gen 2. Gen 2 is kind-of mean to grass types for most of Johto, whereas the Johto gyms tend to be easier for fire and water types in general. Flying & Bug gyms are a lot harder for grass types than rock & water ones, which maybe be why the Chikorita line is so defensive.
Just one correction, the late game gyms in Gen 1 give the advantage to the water types, not the fire types
At the end of the day it feels like it came down to feraligator having stronger return and therefore better damage ranges, makes sense why he's the #1
He's my favorite/first Pokemon I ever used. I was so happy he pulled it off.
@@OmegaScorpio96 My fave starter for sure, Totodile is just too adorbs
Big thing is that Scott rarely needed to rely on physical bulk which is Blastoise's advantage, while the attack difference really helped with both Earthquake and Return.
@Scott's Thoughts - Being able to get a time like that with no hidden power i think deserves something to show that fact (metric). Can i suggest putting a star or using the shiny sprite on the tier list for Pokemon that don't use hidden power? i really think that its important to some how show that fact in the rankings.
I second this!
I am new to this channel? Why is hidden power not being used so "special"?
@@RK-cj4oc The short answer is that it gives any Pokemon access to a base 70 Power, 100 Accuracy move of a specific type that it otherwise would never get access to. For example, if you watch the Meganium vs Venasaur run, Scott manipulates Hidden Power to be of Rock type in order to give them coverage vs Fire/Flying type Pokemon that they otherwise have no good answer for with their learnset/TM choices.
@@RK-cj4oc Since it can be set to any Type(Fire,Water Grass, Ect...) it solves alot of problems for pokemon. so a grass type can have it set to water or ice type to deal with problem battles.
Just saw the second run...
*WOW!*
I...I have no words. These two did so well in Generation 2. Great job, Scott!
You are the man, Scott. Thank you for always giving us this incredible content. It was really neat to see how the 6 Pokémon stacked up against one another, and it now makes even more sense why Feraligatr is the speed runner’s choice for Gen 2. Keep up the awesome work!
These videos are always a key part of my Saturdays to watch comfortably on my couch with a nice drink and snack
Thank you for the amazing series Scott, it's think they are my favorite on your channel. Totodile was my starter choice when I was a kid and I'm happy to see its final form perform so exceptionally well!
This was a really awesome versus series! Like I figured it would definitely be close for Feraligatr vs Blastoise, but it was like really really close! I wonder in the future for Emerald, we see 3-way versus videos for each of the starter types?
o
That might be a bit much for him to do in one video
@@ruthlesace remember the eeveelution one? Similar to that, although Emerald is a longer game than yellow.
Love your videos, Scott!
I really think feraligatr should have been given the dark type. It looks like a dark type. It was the new type in the game.
Yeah, it would be fitting as a dark type, especially cause it learns Bite
Yeah and Typhlosion should had been Ground.
Meganium should be fairy. Make the worst starter a little more viable
Great video Scott, this series of vs videos was amazing.
I've missed your uploads since Ampharos but I'm glad I tuned in for this one, becauee WOW those final times are amazing! I like both of these starters and I'll be watching the other two vs videos as well, as this is exactly what I was waiting to see. Physical attacking usually means it won't do as well as a special attacker, but Feraligatr really proves that wrong today. What a great video!
I wanted Blastoise to win so badly but the extra attack came in clutch. Especially with Red's Snorlax.
Doing the gen 2 vs gen 1 starters was a lot of fun, thanks again Scott!
Wow thanks for the spoiler at 15 minutes guess I’m not watching the rest thanks
@@asscrackb4ndit1st rule of UA-cam. Don't read the comments
@@asscrackb4nditWhy are you reading the comments at 15 mins?
Maybe put a bunch of line breaks next time so people don't get spoiled.
@@ScottsThoughtsPokemon line breaks lol. You really are a programmer
Great series Scott, you're really finding your stride. Also Shout-out to the editors! These videos are so well polished!
I love your channel Scott, I’m glad I found you years ago on this platform
Scott - I have absolutely loved the trio of Gen 1 / Gen 2 Starters Versus Series. I have watched each of them 3 or more times. I think you did great in each of the runs, but I was particularly impressed with Feraligatr's Optimized Play-through. That was such a sick time. My favorite video of the 3 is definitely the Fire Starter video. You killed Typholusion's run as well, but the best part of that video was how much you managed to improve Charizard's Optimized Play-through - compared to its first run. These were some of your best work - if not your outright best work IMO.
"Blastoise can learn defense curl, it is a turtle after all"
Turtles, well known for their flexible bodies that curl into a ball for defense.
Ahh I really needed this video to release today for night time anxiety reasons, thanks
You're welcome Sato. Sorry to hear about the anxiety.
@@ScottsThoughtsPokemon All good, it's normal stuff for me when in bed at night! Passing out watching these long runs has been helping for the past month or so.
I just love how each pair ends up ranked with exactly one Pokemon between them. Heck of a mini-series!
This video series has been an amazing ride from start to finish, and it has been VERY satisfying seeing it scientifically confirmed without a doubt that childhood-me made the correct choice and picked Totodile as my very first starter pokémon ever ^^
Hell yes, feraligatr is my favorite water type. Great end result :)
Hi first of all i am so excited my first EVER mon vs my fav starter of gen 1. Its E P I C!!!!
Im sooooo happy Feraligatr did soooo well. I was a bit dissapointed in gen 2 Feraligatr since ive learned what physical/special attack distribution and what it means for Feraligatr and it saddend me greatly. Thank you for this result. Thank you very much!
The transition at 29:30 really looks like you're taking a ladder to Jasmin's gym full of lava straight out of ice path lol. I always love the smooth edits in your videos Scott!
This is actually a seriously underrated thumbnail. You know what. I love it.
Today was a hard day at work so i was so happy to come home and watch this.
Sorry to hear about the hard day at work. I hope the video was an enjoyable escape!
"Vileplume is the only grass type in the E4"
- sad Exeggutor noises
Amazing video, as per usual, scott!
Would you ever consider doing a legendary birds vs legendary beasts series? Would love to see how they stack up against each other!
Love watching these videos!!
Been a long week waiting for this
Feraligatr best water starter.
Can’t change my mind
Swampert wants to know your location
@@grundgutigertv6170
water/ground typing too stronk.
@@uteriel282Grass says hi 😂
@@Arti_The_Great
most grass types in gen1 through 3 are grass/poison so water/ground still slaps.
@@grundgutigertv6170gator cooler
Great versus video!
They (and you!) did so well! So impressive.
Aww thanks
I'm happy to see Blastoise perform well because I love the Squirtle line. I suspected it would get beat out for the best time, so I'm glad I actually got a prediction right 😅
In Meganium’s defence, it had the lowest level compared to all the others, which is a decent consolation prize.
This has been an interesting series to watch. My favoured starters for the Gen 1 and 2 won their races (Venusaur and Typhlosion respectively). I might need to look into the water types a bit more and see if I can do a good general play through with them. I might have done a Squirtle run-through long ago and far away, so need to revisit.
Putting a request to re-do Pokémon Yellow with Persian, Starmie and Kadabra. They are some of my favourites and are in my party often. Cheers! Keep up the excellent work!
I don't think Meganium did badly, for a grass type it did quite well imo.
When you mentioned the Ice path being the game telling you to catch an ice type before Clair that's actually something that I did as a kid. I got stuck on her quite a few times since dragons resisted some of my strongest pokemon and the combination of all her pokemon did super effective damage to most of my team. As a result, I started catch Jynx often just for this gym since I didn't want to drop any of my beloved pokemon long term. She learns ice punch at level 25 which was only a few levels after you caught her so it worked out really well.
Pleasantly surprised that Blastoise put in the showing it did. When I saw the stat distribution with no real powerful attack stats I was worried about a blowout.
Gold was my first mainline Pokemon game and I instantly fell in love with the feraligatr line. He really is a bit too easy maybe, but it makes him a great introduction to the game if you're a tiny baby person.
Went through your catalog and didn't seem these combinations so thought I'd mention them:
Poliwrath v. Politoed
Slowbro v. Slowking
Macargo v. Torkoal (emerald)
Quagsire v. Octillery
Love your channel. It is very relaxing and nostalgic
Good ideas. Two of them them I have intentions of doing in the future. Might add Quagsire to the list.
My two favorite starters in my favorite region of Pokemon with the revelation that three of my favorite Pokemon in the gen are at the top. Perfection.
And thus the starters are complete. This was a fun ride, great work!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you for doing this. I kind of figured Feraligatr was gonna be the best, Blastoise I felt was gonna beat the original starters cus of the orginal Pokemon game, but I expected the best from Feraligatr because I've seen speed runs and as far as I know they always choose Totodile as their starter. It was fun to see this, haha tho nowadays in todays remakes I'm sure Feraligatr would still be solid but I have a feeling Blastoise would probably get closer to last place. 😂
Wow,both of them had some incredible results, I was betting on Feraligatr ,but I'd never thought that would have the best time in gen 2 thus far.😊
Feraligatr was my first starter in crystal, so this run was kind of reminded me of how it was dominating the gen 2 games. I wonder if it could do that in firered or in emerald as well, without relying on ice punch basically.🤔 Maybe you should do a rematch with these in firered ,that could be an interesting concept to try out.
Blastoise and Feraligatr could do it without hidden power , which amazing in its own right,and basically the access to a ground move and to an early ice move made these two unstoppable. I think that using dig to counter Miltank's rollout could have been a safer strat for some Pokémon especially if they are not as fast as Miltank is .😊
Other than that, these last three videos were really on point when it comes to the editing and the visual details. Well done 🫡☺️
Yaaaaaay another thought from my man Scott!
The Gligar economy stocks are dropping once more
Feraligatr my favorite Pokémon from day one. Love to see it!
I loved the starter battle series! You should do the same thing with the different regional categories (Butterfree vs Ledian, Beedrill vs Ariados, Sentret vs Raticate, etc)
You mentioned there only being one grass type in the league: Karen's Vileplume
Another is Exeggutor but since Blastoise one hits it, I don't think forgetting to mention it is that big of a deal 😅
WOO, I love the Totodile line, debatably my favorite from the entire series but I expected it to lose out because his STAB was weaker so he could miss some neutral hits but happy to be wrong.
my favorite poketuber strikes again and imo the best poketuber on platform i really wish i could meet u one day shake your hand give u a hug and thank u... u just seem so chill and awesome the way u talk is so down to earth don't be afraid to use to cuss words either alot of us our age prefer it
I intentionally avoid cuss words because I know some people our age who watch these videos with their kids. Want to make sure that it's a family friendly show, even if it isn't targeted at younger audiences.
Wasn't expecting the video to become twice as nice in such a short turnaround~
The additional ice coverage is just so good for water types, especially in a solo run context. I think this will always make a good water type like the starters a top contender. The other two starter types can sadly not compete with that in most cases but that might change (and already did in emerald for now) with future games and better movepools across the board.
I’m loving this series
Just saw the first run...I was NOT expecting them to be *THAT* close!
Awesome runs by both of them:) Wouldn't fury cutter have helped Feraligatr with the Bayleef in the rival fight after Bugsy (to then be replaced by bite right after, probably)? Either way, awesome job, as always! You're incredible
It is interesting how you mention Feraligatr's Surf feeling weak when you were younger, because it is actually on par with Typhlosion's Fire Punch. The Base Power of the move makes up for the Special disadvantage. So until you get Flamethrower, Feraligatr's STAB hit as hard on the Special side as Typh's does.
Awesome video!
Firaligator to this day is my favorite starter. My boy did amazing 👏
Blastoise has always and will always be my favorite Pokémon it was my very first starter vack in h days of rad and blue it has cannons how can you not love that
BLASTIOSE is my favorite starter evolution overall. Love it. Torterra is my favorite to battle with however.
Charmander is my favorite starter.
My favorite Starters won each Race! I'm so happy!
This is the one I've been looking forward to! I have no idea who could win this! I'm rooting for blastoise, though 😏
Wow that were some amazing runs. Now I‘m kinda curious how a pikachu with the light ball item would perform in crystal.
Wow, these mons are units. Can't believe how quickly they smashed through the game.
Spikes are the only hazard in gen 2, so rapid spin is very good to have, but not a hard requirement like it was after stealth rock was introduced
iirc
I was going to mention this before but rapid spinners have been a staple in all aspects of VGC and Singles due to how common hazards are. Usually a team with have one or two Pokémon dedicated to spinning and hazard setting respectively. This also gives utility to lower power pokemon such as misdreavus and gastly who would otherwise have no use other than being a spin blocker.
"There's only one Grass-type in the League."
*Will's Exeggutor huddles in the corner and tries to stifle its audible sobs.*
AAA I'm really happy with these results. Of course, I'm a huge fan of Totodile, so of course I'm going to be rooting for Feraligatr! I'm really happy that the lower special attack stat didn't slow it down too much - it seems to have just the stats it needs for the most part.
A bit of an aside, but when I rewatched your Typhlosion run, it came to me a thought something I find annoying with Gen II - the fact that they removed Rock Slide as a TM. They eventually re-added it in Gen IV, giving more Pokemon access to the move who didn't have it before Gen IV (such as Aerodactyl and Typhlosion), and I feel this would've been a really nice moveset upgrade for many Pokemon as an alternative to moves like Hidden Power and Rollout.
Yeah, Rock Slide as a TM, or a Tutor Move would really help... Especially Aerodactyl - if they actually let it learn it that is. I get a lot of comments about how I should use Rollout more, but that move is really bad for consistency and it is slow because it takes time to become good.
@@ScottsThoughtsPokemon Honestly, yes. I think the issue is that Rollout being a Rock-type move gives it the impression of being a coverage move. Or they think of the potential for it to hit 480 or even 960 in base power.
Whatever the reason, people see it as a solution to Lance's flying types when it just isn't, as the amount of setup required means you're constantly exposed to getting hit by Thunder Wave. And being paralyzed means that landing just three Rollouts in a row is now only a 31% chance.
A move like Rock Slide may have only 90% accuracy as well, but the fact that missing Rock Slide does not affect what your next Rock Slide will do makes it a far more consistent move than Rollout.
Frankly, I feel making Rollout a TM and removing Rock Slide as a TM was a bit of a mistake on Game Freak's part.
oh my wow, I didn't see that coming, fair enough that is exactly how well I thought Blastoise would do, your Yellow run showed us the way with how good it could be, but Feraligatr just straight up blasted through the game and Lugia and out of the top spot, you're gonna have to run Mewtwo to top that, I loved this VS series, what you gonna do next, Gen 1 VS Gen 3 starters in Fire Red, how about Racihu vs Light Ball Pikachu?
1:24 I think the most important thing keeping Charizard close to Typhlosion in terms of time was the fact he learns Flamethrower at level 34 while Typhlosion has to wait until 60. I lost count of how many times I solo’d Silver with Ty, and that always bugs me even today.
Edit: Love your videos, by the way. Even my kids watch them with me sometimes.
Grass i "rooted" for Venusaur. Fire i was hoping Typhlosion would "scorch" the competition. I love both these starters so honestly im happy with either of them winning so im gonna have to "wave" my pick
Now I kinda wanna do this same VS but in hg/ss. That could be pretty fun!
I've noticed that the gyms throughout the series have interesting placements.
Diglet Tunnel near Vermillion
Two caves around Azalea
Cinnabar is an island
"Grassy" patches near Cerulean
Just on top of my head from the first two gens alone
It's a pretty nice way to make sure players always have options if they get stuck on a particular obstacle.
If you want more examples from Gen 8, which I have played extensively:
-A multitude of Flying, Bug, and Poison Pokémon on the routes between Motostoke and Turffield in advance of Milo and his Grass gym
-For Nessa's Water types, Milo gives you the Magical Leaf TM, the Electroweb TM is right next to where you meet Nessa before you can challenge her gym, there's a static Eldegoss encounter on the Route 5 bridge and an in-game trade for a Cottonee in the market where you can also buy incense, including Rose Incense.
-The game specifically draws attention to the fact that Galar Mine 2 is full of Water types that help against Kabu, and you can also find a couple of Ground types there as well as Sudowoodo in the Motostoke Outskirts.
-I have Shield so I can't say too much about Bea, but you get Ghost types on Route 6, an in-game trade for a Hattena in Stow-on-Side itself, and access to enough of Glimwood Tangle to access its Psychic and Fairy types. Plus, Kabu's Will O Wisp TM can help against her predominantly physical team.
-Allister is actually a bit sparser on this front, but there are still the Ghosts, and the same person who gives you Hattena in Sword gives you Impidimp in Shield.
-They give you so many options for the Circhester gym on Route 8. Ground types for Gordie, Rock types for Melanie, Fighting and Steel types for both, and a TM for Brick Break just off to the side, especially handy for countering Melanie's Lapras.
Speaking of Brick Break, that TM is also found in Verdant Cavern in the Alola games, which you can obtain during the trial. I got Moon and Ultra Moon, so while I can't say exactly how much it helps against Gumshoos, I can tell you that it completely trivializes Raticate.
I always played Feraligatr in G/S/C. My favourite. With the exception I used slash as main killer move. High level gives you enough damage to easily break through opps.
BTW Rapid Spin is a pretty good move competitively in Gen 2. While it isn't as important as it will be in later generations, it's not uncommon to run into teams that set spikes.
spikes and whirlwind is a viable set for skarmory which is hilarious
@@wideright7567 I think you're thinking of Gen 3, Skarmory doesn't get Spikes in GSC. It's just Cloyster, Qwilfish, Pineco, and Forretress that get Spikes there.
Thoughts on this run: Water is a good consistent type that's never bad in a Pokemon game.
Especially when Surf is earlier to get in Gen 1 and 2. Since then, Surf is now in the midgame territory where you need Surf to progress except for Kalos, where you get Surf after beating the 3rd Gym Leader.
Water types in Johto, while not as advantageous as the Fire types, are still very good. There's not a lot threatening Grass types other than Bayleaf in the earlygame, Vileplume and Venusaur in the lategame. And, it's only the Magnemite line for Electric types with average Special Defense when you have access to Surf when you get to Ecruteak City. They have Return for good Physical damage. And, even without Ice Punch, Icy Wind gets the job done for the ones who get Icy Wind instead of Ice Punch. After that, you have Ice Beam for Venusaur at the end.
Feraligatr really did get one of the fastest times ever. The fact that it beats Lugia really tells me that Mewtwo might be the only one who can beat Feraligatr's time. And even then, I don't think that's gonna be a possibility, given that Mewtwo is leveling up slowly. And, it now has problems with not only Karen, but also Snorlax with that massively buffed Special Defense. It may have higher Attack than Feraligatr for non STAB Returns, but the Slow growth rate might be enough to hold it back from beating Feraligatr. Plus, if Mewtwo wants to use a Fighting move to deal with Karen and Snorlax, you either use HP Fighting, which gives out horrendous DVs, or Dynamic Punch, which is obviously worse than Hypnosis.
As for Blastoise, pretty good. Blastoise is excellent in Fire Red and Leaf Green speedruns. Blastoise in Gen 1 Speedruns is not too shabby if you are not gonna be cheesing with Nidoking. For a defensive tank like Blastoise, it did very well. Being a Water type is far better defensively than being a Grass type like Meganium. Plus, having good and diverse coverage in the attacking department really helps.
Mewtwo is probably going to be the fastest. But I think the slow-growth rate may hold it back from setting a new standard of performance like sub 1:10
I would love to see Gyarados in Crystal now, would be a Challenge in the first playthrough without HP Ground for sure :)
I love the Water starters of early gens. Carrying me across water with a strong STAB since 1998
Fun fact: bite is the only move to change damage types twice. From physical to special from gen 1 to gen 2 and back to physical later
I absolutely love the water starters throughout the Pokémon games, generation 1 and 2 are no exception. Feraligator is by far my favorite between it and Blastoise. Hopefully my boy Chomper does well!
He weak as hell
These videos are always cool, what i wonder is if you would consider back porting pokemon from future gens like 3 and 4 to crystal, like say do mightiena or shiftry to crystal to see how they do, anf wonderful video
Yup. Gen2 portbacks will start in the future when I've wrapped up other series (like my Yellow series)
I gotta say, I really really like the execution on this starter vs series! Comparing the starters to their respective type counterpart was really interesting, considering how close each matchup ended up being. I’m also excited to see how the unevolved starters perform in Yellow!
Glad you liked it! I think I'm going to port the gen2 starters back into gen1 and do it again in Yellow to re-rank those starters.
That 105 base atk with 102 base power return really does wonders for Feraligatr
Yup.
Despite it´s lose, Blastoise is my favorite.
The starterrace is my favorite series on this channel and I would like to see it through the generations.
Cannot wait to see Scott get around to alakazam in Crystal
I did have to laugh when you said you didn’t know if Rapid Spin was any good in Gen 2 competitive. RS is what give entire mons, teams and play styles viability in Gen 2 OU. It’s a defining feature of certain mons like Starmie, Golem, Smeargle, and yes, Blastoise.
Ahhh just in time for my Bday ❤ Blastoise forever will be my favorite
Happy belated bday!
@@ScottsThoughtsPokemon thank you!!!!
Good Job Scott
"Typhlosion edging Charizard" is not a line I ever expected to hear
Looking at this more, I think having native access to Ice Punch or Ice Beam is a good indicator of a pokemon's ability to succeed in gen 2. They trivialize Lance who can be a roadblock and mean you don't need to use Hidden Power for it. And generally if you have native access to a decent ice move, you also have access to water moves because those two tend to go together and if _that's_ the case then you don't really need to fear Jasmine either since the Magnemites aren't very tough and the Steelix is weak to water and has abysmal special defense. And of course it makes the Charizards and Arcanine trivial through the late game too.
Yes! That is a really good point. Access to ice moves frees up hidden power.
@@ScottsThoughtsPokemon Yup. Sure it won't help _every_ pokemon; if a hypothetical Poke has 25 base Sp Attack and 90 Attack you're still probably better off with Return or something even if you can learn Ice Beam, but I think as a general rule of thumb it works, and certainly in Gen 2 there really aren't pokemon like that afaik.
And yeah with HP freed up you can go for Electric to deal with troublesome water types like late game Blastoise and Gyarados, or whatever else you need. Of course, a lot of pokemon with native access to ice moves are also at least part Water, which means resisting water moves which makes those mons less of a threat too. So maybe even something else like HP Fighting for Karen's Umbreon and Red's Snorlax.
It's just one of those quirks of the generation, caused by certain key trainers and the common attributes of pokemon with access to moves that excel against them.
Feeling very proud of my favorite starter right now
In cases like the one where you froze the shiny gyrados you could catch it to use as your waterfall user and skip the dratini, but that probably wouldn't change things as far as saving more than a few seconds.
its amazing vid n 1st 2 generation startes my fav is blastoise n fraligator
You did my Boi Blastoise good! I love him!
I never saw much of a use for the grass types but in all of the generations Swampert is the best overall with movesets, stats, and typing with unique water/ground type that is only found in Quagsire prior to gen 3 leaving it with 1 weakness to grass (although a big weakness but good thing is there are not that many grass types).