One of the things I think is cool about Persona 2 is how the mindsets of the character differ between each game. In Innocent Sin, the cast is very reactive while in Eternal Punishment they're proactive. In IS, one of the earliest missions is to destroy school emblems, but it's a preventative measure- They aren't taking initiative by doing so. On the other hand, EP has Maya destroying a school emblem specifically so that she can pursue Tatsuya, it's a choice to move towards the future. This is probably the single biggest reason why the EP cast succeeded while the IS cast failed- The IS cast was content to be strung around by the riddles of their enemies but never made any effort to get ahead of them, while the EP cast was actively working to try to accomplish their goal.
That also works from the lens of IS focusing on a teenage cast, rebelling against a status quo that perpetuates their trauma with no true understanding or support to do so successfully. I have my criticisms of how EP handles some of the commentary of the first game but I think framing it around adults using their greater power to influence change for the sake of Tatsuya and the younger generation was not one of those mistakes.
At the same time the cast from IS produced the requirements to make Maya and Tatsuya defeat a threat so big that they can not do anything about it (the plan from Nyarl. was too perfect and it was simply too much for them to handle) However it’s not like they have not accomplished anything. In fact I consider all the events of IS a preparation. They gradually witness their sins, grow as people and face their weaknesses to eventually be ready to face the memories of their childhood. By doing they realize how horrible the world is and the darkness inside human hearts (represented by Nyarl.). Eventually they are enough strong as people to be able to counter Nyarl’s plan and sacrifice something they treasure to give a future to mankind. In my opinion the game prepared them to that choice.
I never liked endings where everyone forgets there adventure. But there is something about persona 2 showing that the mind and body can easily forget. But the soul will always remember
I do like the bittersweetness of this duology ultiamtely tho. Yes they will (mostly) forget, but Maya remembers, and.. just lets go of the past, of a fate that she is willing to move on from and because of it, it doesnt feel liek a reset like most of the "forget everything you worked for" scenarios in games or movies.
Wait, you mean you don't love everyone just calling P2 "the game with Hitler in it" ? That is a totally perfect and completely honest representation of it
seriously, after playing every main persona game for several hours, even after being emotionally devastated by the likes of persona 3 and it's incredible message, ending, and cast, being absolutely sucked into persona 5 as a whole, and loving innocent sin every single bit, i still believe that eternal punishment is my favorite persona game out of the entire series, the vibe is so unlike anything else i've seen come from persona or even smt as a whole, people can say all they want about whether or not they think it's "outdated" but honestly i think it holds up perfectly, it's only outdated in the sense of the hardware it's on and nothing else, it still looks amazing in some places like the final dungeon and if the resolution were higher it would be actually perfect, and personally, i found the gameplay to be really fun, with my only complaint being my preference of a proper fusion system over the card currency system in place in both p2 games, though it far from ruined anything. i could talk about how much i adore the story and it's ideas too, but then this comment would probably rival the length of this video lol thanks a ton for making these analysis videos, they're very well done and it's nice to see more love for what may be some of my favorite games *ever* at this point, if we ever get a modern day re-release of either of the p2 games in some form, then i will officially declare this the best timeline possible
I agree wholeheartedly. While the first persona is my personal favorite for the nostalgic and dreamlike vibes, in terms of story, Eternal Punishment is unmatched imo, especially after this video. I knew a lot about persona lore already before this series, but especially with the p2 videos, my mind is consistently blown with how much more Tadashi and the rest packed into this duology in regards to storytelling and symbolism and theming and paralleling real world stuff and AAGGHH. I hope he's still proud of what he did with these games because this is the most energy I've personally seen be put into a game story
@@burnt_ramen9757 yeah, I think since ppl start with 5 these days they somehow expect the rest of the series to be exactly the same. But even before that, I get that feeling from ppl who started with 3 or 4 and went backwards. Idk, I played 1&3 psp simultaneously and going between the 2 wasn't very jarring at all. Idk, I guess its an expectation thing, if you're intentionally going backwards in the series, then expect the older games to... Play like older games lol. Not all the bells and whistles of the newest title will be there. Though in the case of persona, a huge factor is also how much you enjoy the calendar system, which I personally won't miss if the new director ditches it lol. I like feeling more in control of the pace of the story. So many instances in 4&5 where I'm just like "LET ME PLAAAYY" but the game wants to take a week or 2 for cutscenes lol.
@@MagillanicaLouM I started with 4 and I went on to 3 then 5 and after all that I felt P2 was a breath of fresh air, I have always been good at getting into older stuff though
Lani is so sweet, glad to hear her voice again! She's actually the voice of Lucas from the Mother series as well, and I got a voice clip from her as well! She needs love and support!
Some more details about Baofu. Coins are his weapon of choice because he was also a qi gong practitioner, and his Persona ability lets him harness that Chi and turn it into a viable throwing weapon. Also something about Zenigata as a cool reference. The backstory lore about the Tien Tao Lien is based on an actual Triad mafia and some historical events in Taiwan in the 80s. There's some obscure stuff that talked about unconstitutional enforcement, which Baofu references in the line "they're hunted in Taiwan for being 'impure'"
Another cool detail. His chinese name, Bao Fu, can be understood 2 ways. If read as ‘報復’ Bao4Fu4, it means revenge which fits his backstory perfectly. If read another way, ’包袱‘ Bao1Fu1 means baggage. Which also explains the baggage he carried with him all those years.
I'm not sure if this was supposed to be a thing, but I think that it was important that the adults were the ones to save the day and finally stop evil. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that younger generations aren't capable of making change, but I think that both the younger and older generation are needed to actually get things done. Neither party could of done it without the other. Without the first game's deeds, even though they technically failed, it got the ball rolling for other people to pick it up and carry the torch, until it was finally over. It doesn't matter how many times the world wipes itself, someone will always be there to rise to the occasion. Even if humanity as a whole were to fall, there will always be a person prevail in the darkness of themselves. No matter the age, anyone can stand up and fight for humanity, it's not just a rebellious phase that only teenagers go through because they think that can fix the world. And just because you're older, doesn't mean you can't change, or have flaws. Nyalathotep always underestimates humanity, which is why he will always lose.
I think that the Classical Personas, as you mentioned, are the best games story-wise of all. They are wholesome, very well linked to each other, it manages to settle an unnerving scenario and build solid personality into the characters. Nice job, it was truly a lesson what I just watched.
28:16 oh man this whole scene, and then the follow-up at the end, is absolutely wonderful. I can see why Satomi Tadashi liked it so much. To be an adult is to suffer one's own consequences, which you have to face head-on since no one but yourself can take responsibility for them. It's difficult and scary, but once they're overcome by your own hands, you start to understand yourself much better and you can see the good things in life again. Great job, man.
Nothing hurt worse than when Baofu says “Sorry Miki...” if you get a game over shit was so fucked UP and the ending theme man you can’t even get me started with that and when Nanjo tries to give Kandori a chance at redemption, and to escape the cave he’s about to die in, but he stays and the story just continues on. Man this game really hit the feels
its great listening to someone delve into esoteric religious and psychological themes of this series, the hard work you put into these videos really shows. already anticipating the next one!
What an a absolutely incredible series, from start to (hopefully not) finish. Your in-depth explanations of Jung's work, as well as all the other parallels between mythology, religion, and psychology and Persona left me with a much greater appreciation for the series as a whole, even moreso than I did before.
This is a very interesting reminder about why lots of people loved Persona. I think SMT fans loved these twists, I know I did. This also gives a stark contrast to what P4 and P5 are missing. Even if you did not get most of what this video goes over, in P1 and 2, you still "felt" the impact of all that mind jank. You don't have understand it all completely to enjoy and feel the underlying web of intrigue and philosophy throughout. There's character development using the persona, conversations, settings, they use a variety of tools to tell a story of character development. Not necessarily growth, but development. I think 3 4 and 5 lacks some of this web of character development. And seems to be hollowed out more and more the further we get away from 2. The games now are just challenged by the world. Having to overcome things and maybe?? grow. But they are not having a conversation with the world through their character development. And I think this conversation with the world is what SMT fans hold dear. The alignment system invites this conversation, and gives you at least the development of the alignment along the story and the development of your relating to it. Being able to dig a little deeper and come to new realizations is what SMT fans love I think. The gameplay, compendiums, fusions, equipment, spells, those are all cool. And we've seen games made that are built on just those things. But I think fans who have played the old games can really feel when the game has left out its philosophical core and detailed development. I think this is also why fans are excited and dreading V. I would just love for the entire staffs of Nocturne, P1n2, and Raidou to be thrown in the same building for a few years and see what game they come up with. I don't care what you call it, just make it feel like the early games did.
It's such a great and thoughtful analysis! Thank you very much!!! Come to think of it, Nyarlothotep said that he "cannot tolerate contradictions", which, in itself, seems a very Jungian idea, too: as "anti-individuation" archetype, Big Nya is opposed to Individuation... which, in itself, IS about accepting contradictions and coincidenting oppositions! He hates contradictions as much that he cannot even grasp the contradiction that he, in all his danger and badness, is still not alienated by the protagonists, but accepted by them instead. So, in that sense he really IS "cosmic idiocy" that wants things as simple as they can be, and then even simpler still. He is a part of us that "wants to keep things simple", tires of contradictions, is scared or annoyed by them... And, frankly, this is something we all can relate to sometimes and feel it as part of our "sinful" human nature. It also feeds into the motif of both Philemon and Big Nya meant to be transcended: the inherent paradox of the Individuation is that uniting contradictions does ALSO mean uniting the "contradiction of both having to unite the contradictions and the self-protective need of dismissing, devaluing, attacking them". It's kinda like having to keep the Balance between Balance and Imbalance, - because unilaterally calling contradictions "good" and escaping them "evil" will still place us back at the square one, in the dismissing of the complexities, in the tentacles of the cosmic idiocy once again! It's also an amazing thing that you point about Maia and Buddha - the fact that it's that MAIA (Illusion) somehow gave birth to the Buddha! The one who saw through all the illusions. Which is in itself one of contradictions like those Big Nya hates =)
Part of the main draw of EP is adults as the party members over teenagers, as you explained have their own completely different set of problems. Honestly I think this is what modern day persona needs now. We've had the teenagers in highschool 3 times now, it'd be nice to see the formula done with adults and how they see the world. Which is why I like the concept of Zenkichi/Wolf being a Phantom Thief in Persona 5 Scramble.
I completely agree, I'd love for them to ditch the High school setting as well, it's getting old now. An University setting would be a bit more interesting if they don't want to change the formula too much but I won't get my hopes up.
@@JPF222 Well, control of the series has changed hands again starting with Royal. Most of the people who worked on 3-5 are gone and working on Project Re:Fantasy. And the new people want to take the series in a "new direction" whatever that means so who knows what the future will hold.
Your interpretation of Maya's character is spot on and amazing! It's given me a new insight on the character. I love how you tackled a lot of the symbolism that I missed out on, which just blew my mind and would have never noticed without this analysis. Eternal Punishment definitely is a beautiful game.
Classical Persona was the best! It was well researched, filled with so many deep easter eggs and meanings, like a tree's roots dividing endless but still part of a grand, strong whole and I'll miss it forever!
@@kallum39 As far as I'm aware, they are not done hacking the script into the iso yet. You'd think they would by now, but what can you do. At least it's still being worked on.
Nice, been waiting for this! Funny how just earlier today I remembered your channel and thought about checking out whether this video had already come out. Pretty good timing!
Why do the Persona creators all look like they just stepped off a film noir-parody film set? It really fits with the themes and moods of the games, it's just hilarious it's reflected down to the way the creators dress. Quite a contrast from the work-place images we get of say, Shigeru Miyamoto, or Hirinobu Sakagachi.
Shame, you missed the perfect opportunity to have Ms. Minella say "It's whoopass time!" or "Grab your asses and run!" Overall, great breakdown! I was waiting for this to come out after finding your channel a few months ago!
Astounding as always. Thank you for giving Classic Persona the treatment that it deserves. Hopefully newer Persona fans will find these videos and give the older games a shot.
A bit of a nitpick, but Eternal Punishment takes place in 1999, just after August 18th. the line referencing persona 1 as 4 years ago is a mistranslation. good video so far!
Thanks to this series I got interested in these older Persona games. Played through Persona 1 and almost done with Innocent sin. I love these older games, flaws and all.
My favorite game. Ulala's persona Asteria has maybe another way to show her development. The island Asteria became was the same one Leto gave birth to none other than Artemis and Apollo. So in a way she went from Callisto someone who was defined by her connection to Artemis to Asteria someone Apollo and Artemis couldn't have succeeded without
Decades later, after much rumination on these games and their messages, my mind sometimes wanders into a most existential of questions: WHO IS THE TIME COUNT???
I see people saying in comments below this and Muji Soft's videos that Ep is the best persona game, because EP without IS is like only one side of a coin, ending without a beginning. My opinion that both parts of persona 2 are making the story meaningful and complete. They are inseparable. I find themes of finding yourself and your meaning of life in IS more relatable to me, but I can't imagine EP without IS as IS without EP. Just like yin and yang. (Sorry for my poor English grammar)
Awesome conclusion to the original Persona games. These games were so much of my teenage years and your analysis is both deep and nostalgic for me. Thank you so much.
Bro you are a legend. These analysis have just made me want to go in more on the shin megami tensei franchise and see how many hidden messages that can be open from understanding what each layer of the games are based on
One of my favorite video games ever and that ending is so powerful. I loved how you allowed it to take its time in your video. Overall, loved it and would love to see more videos from you. On EP, I remember a senior at the tuition center I used to go to introducing it to me way back in 2002, and I was super hooked to the series since. I read the whole Innocent Sin script at Oracle of Maia/Room 303 way back when too. I used to memorize the trivia sections and everything. Hope those people are doing fine.
I can't tell you how happy I am to see this video. EP is honestly my favorite game of all time. Good to see that someone took the time to truly analyze it and this analysis does the story justice. Keep up the good work
The game is so meaningful to me and you really conveyed so many of the things I did and didn’t notice that many have not spoken about and I really commend your work! It was really a great series and it made emotional at times!
I can't wait to watch this video with my sister. We just finished P2 EP, and thought your videos on IS were amazing! Thanks so much for such an incredible, interesting, and thorough analysis!
Everytime I watch this I discover something new about this game. You make me love one of my favorite games even more with your analysis. Fantastic work.
So I just found your channel I watched the whole thing in one sitting... yes the 7 hours. What an amazing quality!!! I hope this videos continue for a long time!!!
just when U thought u knew persona here comes slice to jumble your brain haha jeez I never even looked into half of what this video explains and I already raved about how amazing this game was.
man I know I'm hella late to make a comment on this, but I got all emotional, teary eyed n shit near the end. looking back retrospectively and thanks to your video, I realized how much this series and this game in particular mean to me. So, thank you for creating this, much love
Absolutely loving it already, thank you once again for excellent content, with just the right amount of humor, well researched background and just pure analysis. Kudos on a job well done! :)
Akihiko voice: *I've been waiting for this!* Thank you so much Snickety for giving P1-P2 the love they rightfully deserve and for making such a thorough analysis :)
Well, goddamn. I literally watched your other Persona 2 videos last night, and was sad there weren't more. Guess I know how I'm spending my night! Thanks, man.
This series was the final push I needed, to get into the Persona series for real. Before I just lurked, watching videos about personas, characters, and gameplay, curious, but never sure if it is something I would enjoy playing. But after watching your deep dive into Persona 1. I was hooked and had to give it a try. I ended up buying Persona 5 royal, and absolutely loving it, now I'm slowly going through the PC port of P4G.
@@midnight-fox7456 well i hope this doesn't lead to you not playing these games. Games like p2 should definitely be a experience you should enjoy on your own
@@magicmanthegeez330 Don't worry, I definitely intend on one day playing through all of these games. But this is the internet, so I just have to accept that I'll have stuff spoiled, one way or another. For example, I had the final villains of Persona 3 and 4 spoiled, when watching a video about meaning of Velvet room in P5. There was no info that they'll be talking about story of P3/4, and no spoiler warning. They were just talking and then BOOM, important story info, out of nowhere. Major elements of the game, spoiled out of f*cking nowhere. But I still intend on playing these games.
@@midnight-fox7456 The Persona fanbase is very bad when it comes to spoilers, but thankfully the games remain fantastic, and there are plenty of smaller moments throughout the games that aren't casually talked about as often, so not *everything* is spoiled
SPOILER They be talking about how tragic makoto's fate is but forgot Tatsuya's kicked-in-the-balls bittersweet ending. I mean he's supposed to be forgotten but still
oh man the waiting was so worth it! You did an excellent job on the original trilogy, The P2 duology is my favorite part of the Persona series and one of my top spots in the overarching SMT Universe.
Man,watching through your entire persona 1 analysis and part 1 of 2 makes me wish you did one on the Shin Megami Tensei games,especially 1 and 2 since they're almost never covered in depth.
Dam. I really just sat here and watch all of the persona videos. The ideas and concepts is honestly fucking great. Thank you for making these videos. I guess next is Persona 3?
I love this game, it was the very first Persona I ever played. My eldest brother (R.I.P.) had a copy of it that was returned with his belongings after he passed away. 11 year old me was mesmerized with the game cover. I didn't have a PS or PS2 at the time, and I had to wait a few years to play it. 14 year old me spent the entire summer playing the game. I loved it. Now I'm 27 and I have a Seven Sisters High School emblem patch that sits on my tv stand, my protection from Joker. I'm glad to know there's other people who love this game as much as I do. Also, I don't know if I speak for anyone else on this, but the Undersea Ruins dungeon can go to hell. I still hate that place.
I am such a huge fan of your Persona analysis videos that I finally started the series in 2020 and I just finished EP today. I put off watching this analysis so I wouldn't get spoilers hahaha. I was most of the way through the PS1 version when the PSP English patch came out so I restarted to have all of the QOL improvements. Man EP is such an incredible game where so much content is optional. After nearly every major event you can walk around the city and talk to your party for a look into their personality and how they are handling their situations. It adds so much depth and nuance, just like P1 did and is what made me want to keep playing. The ONLY think I disliked in EP was the "Silent Protagonist" trope that Persona likes to use. Sure Maya does talk a little but aside from choices she's basically mute. It made her character a lot flatter than it should have been which is a shame as she was my favourite from IS. It also meant that the game had to rely on others talking about her emotions or thoughts in some slightly awkward ways to get her themes across. Unlike IS where Tatsuya was planned to be silent, making Maya just seemed silly and a set back. She didn't need to talk all the time but I would have like more. EP also makes the stoic Tatsuya more relatable thanks to him expressing himself and seeing his pain as he tries to fix his own problems.
A huge thank you to Lani Minella for lending her voice as Maya in the intro. Please check out her IMDb page: www.imdb.com/name/nm0591115/
Snick I need to ask you to get the gameplay one out too man it’s all amazing but I’m awful at this game 😂
Absolute legend
The king finally returned
You are absolutely Legend
You literally came in clutch, I was just searching for this series but thought I’d have to rewatch the past ones, bless ✌️
One of the things I think is cool about Persona 2 is how the mindsets of the character differ between each game. In Innocent Sin, the cast is very reactive while in Eternal Punishment they're proactive. In IS, one of the earliest missions is to destroy school emblems, but it's a preventative measure- They aren't taking initiative by doing so. On the other hand, EP has Maya destroying a school emblem specifically so that she can pursue Tatsuya, it's a choice to move towards the future. This is probably the single biggest reason why the EP cast succeeded while the IS cast failed- The IS cast was content to be strung around by the riddles of their enemies but never made any effort to get ahead of them, while the EP cast was actively working to try to accomplish their goal.
That also works from the lens of IS focusing on a teenage cast, rebelling against a status quo that perpetuates their trauma with no true understanding or support to do so successfully. I have my criticisms of how EP handles some of the commentary of the first game but I think framing it around adults using their greater power to influence change for the sake of Tatsuya and the younger generation was not one of those mistakes.
At the same time the cast from IS produced the requirements to make Maya and Tatsuya defeat a threat so big that they can not do anything about it (the plan from Nyarl. was too perfect and it was simply too much for them to handle)
However it’s not like they have not accomplished anything. In fact I consider all the events of IS a preparation. They gradually witness their sins, grow as people and face their weaknesses to eventually be ready to face the memories of their childhood. By doing they realize how horrible the world is and the darkness inside human hearts (represented by Nyarl.). Eventually they are enough strong as people to be able to counter Nyarl’s plan and sacrifice something they treasure to give a future to mankind.
In my opinion the game prepared them to that choice.
Its a theme i noticed in Eternal punishment, and its having to grow up eventualy and move on or accomplish something.
I can't believe you got the professional voice actor to do those lines. Gods she is awesome!
They got the original va. God I’m glad they still know how to do the voice.
Where was this at?
holy crap i didnt believe you and then i heard
@@lucaskincanyon7393 the beginning.
Amazing
When dad returns with milk and cigarettes.
and bought u a christmas gift at the same time
Finally this guy remember his UA-cam Password
Eh ketemu lagi
@@agreenplasticwateringcan Hello
He caught COVID, dude.
@@TheZENbros
Wait, you're not serious are you?
Ketemu lagi Kita
I never liked endings where everyone forgets there adventure. But there is something about persona 2 showing that the mind and body can easily forget. But the soul will always remember
I do like the bittersweetness of this duology ultiamtely tho. Yes they will (mostly) forget, but Maya remembers, and.. just lets go of the past, of a fate that she is willing to move on from and because of it, it doesnt feel liek a reset like most of the "forget everything you worked for" scenarios in games or movies.
Persona 2: Innocent Sin 🤝 JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: Stone Ocean
Doing the forgetting trope in a good way.
Hoo boy another big boy dropped
I now you
@@espantaviejas9469 i don't think you now him, dood. He is hiding after all
Finally somebody actually talks about Persona 2
Tired of this game always being misrepresented, bless you
Wait, you mean you don't love everyone just calling P2 "the game with Hitler in it" ? That is a totally perfect and completely honest representation of it
Whaat you mean you dont love that people cant seem to stfu about hitler in p2?
u know this is part 3 right
@@nore5888 I've been watching this series since it started
Persona 2 is criminally underrated.
Persona 2 > Every other Persona game :)
That beginning made me smile so much. Hearing Lani as Maya again would be pretty cool imo.
Where was this at?
@@lucaskincanyon7393 do you just- not watch the beginning of videos?
seriously, after playing every main persona game for several hours, even after being emotionally devastated by the likes of persona 3 and it's incredible message, ending, and cast, being absolutely sucked into persona 5 as a whole, and loving innocent sin every single bit, i still believe that eternal punishment is my favorite persona game out of the entire series, the vibe is so unlike anything else i've seen come from persona or even smt as a whole, people can say all they want about whether or not they think it's "outdated" but honestly i think it holds up perfectly, it's only outdated in the sense of the hardware it's on and nothing else, it still looks amazing in some places like the final dungeon and if the resolution were higher it would be actually perfect, and personally, i found the gameplay to be really fun, with my only complaint being my preference of a proper fusion system over the card currency system in place in both p2 games, though it far from ruined anything. i could talk about how much i adore the story and it's ideas too, but then this comment would probably rival the length of this video lol
thanks a ton for making these analysis videos, they're very well done and it's nice to see more love for what may be some of my favorite games *ever* at this point, if we ever get a modern day re-release of either of the p2 games in some form, then i will officially declare this the best timeline possible
I agree wholeheartedly. While the first persona is my personal favorite for the nostalgic and dreamlike vibes, in terms of story, Eternal Punishment is unmatched imo, especially after this video. I knew a lot about persona lore already before this series, but especially with the p2 videos, my mind is consistently blown with how much more Tadashi and the rest packed into this duology in regards to storytelling and symbolism and theming and paralleling real world stuff and AAGGHH. I hope he's still proud of what he did with these games because this is the most energy I've personally seen be put into a game story
I 100% agree, people shit on the gameplay for absolutely nothing
@@burnt_ramen9757 yeah, I think since ppl start with 5 these days they somehow expect the rest of the series to be exactly the same. But even before that, I get that feeling from ppl who started with 3 or 4 and went backwards. Idk, I played 1&3 psp simultaneously and going between the 2 wasn't very jarring at all. Idk, I guess its an expectation thing, if you're intentionally going backwards in the series, then expect the older games to... Play like older games lol. Not all the bells and whistles of the newest title will be there. Though in the case of persona, a huge factor is also how much you enjoy the calendar system, which I personally won't miss if the new director ditches it lol. I like feeling more in control of the pace of the story. So many instances in 4&5 where I'm just like "LET ME PLAAAYY" but the game wants to take a week or 2 for cutscenes lol.
@@MagillanicaLouM I started with 4 and I went on to 3 then 5 and after all that I felt P2 was a breath of fresh air, I have always been good at getting into older stuff though
I'm glad you liked Eternal Punishment. I couldn't be happier I'm not the only one.
Persona 2-2: the only persona game about adults rather than teenagers
Well... there is one teenager in the party.
@@thegumonyourshoes yeah but who cares about him?
@@sarafontanini7051 Smh, that’s like saying Minato is a bad protagonist or that men having husbandos is worse than having waifus.
@@thegumonyourshoes I was being ridiculous XP
@@sarafontanini7051 Clearly. Anyways I hope you and everyone else who might’ve potentially read this have a good day/night.
Earlier today I was like "Man I haven't seen a SnicketySlice video in a while" and you upload this. Very nice!
Omg this is exactly how I feel! Like a day earlier I was like "man I should rewatch that persona a analysis" and BAM!!! now a new vid!
Same for me! Geez, is Snickety psychic?!
I can’t get over how well written, researched and presented this series is!
Someone get this man a PHD in the study of persona!
This series sounds ridiculously interesting and rich! Very deep full of a lot of great symbolism. Great video I'm loving this so much!
Lani is so sweet, glad to hear her voice again! She's actually the voice of Lucas from the Mother series as well, and I got a voice clip from her as well! She needs love and support!
Some more details about Baofu. Coins are his weapon of choice because he was also a qi gong practitioner, and his Persona ability lets him harness that Chi and turn it into a viable throwing weapon. Also something about Zenigata as a cool reference. The backstory lore about the Tien Tao Lien is based on an actual Triad mafia and some historical events in Taiwan in the 80s. There's some obscure stuff that talked about unconstitutional enforcement, which Baofu references in the line "they're hunted in Taiwan for being 'impure'"
Another cool detail. His chinese name, Bao Fu, can be understood 2 ways. If read as ‘報復’ Bao4Fu4, it means revenge which fits his backstory perfectly. If read another way, ’包袱‘ Bao1Fu1 means baggage. Which also explains the baggage he carried with him all those years.
@@hwen28 my mind if fucking blown by this
I'm not sure if this was supposed to be a thing, but I think that it was important that the adults were the ones to save the day and finally stop evil. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that younger generations aren't capable of making change, but I think that both the younger and older generation are needed to actually get things done. Neither party could of done it without the other. Without the first game's deeds, even though they technically failed, it got the ball rolling for other people to pick it up and carry the torch, until it was finally over. It doesn't matter how many times the world wipes itself, someone will always be there to rise to the occasion. Even if humanity as a whole were to fall, there will always be a person prevail in the darkness of themselves. No matter the age, anyone can stand up and fight for humanity, it's not just a rebellious phase that only teenagers go through because they think that can fix the world. And just because you're older, doesn't mean you can't change, or have flaws. Nyalathotep always underestimates humanity, which is why he will always lose.
Notice how Odysseus seems to have SCUBA equipment in his mouth. This can be connected to his journey of travelling (and getting trapped) in the sea.
Okay this is epic!
Just finished the Neutral ending for SMT 2 and this is my reward? I love it.
SMT 4 is still waiting on me...
I think that the Classical Personas, as you mentioned, are the best games story-wise of all. They are wholesome, very well linked to each other, it manages to settle an unnerving scenario and build solid personality into the characters.
Nice job, it was truly a lesson what I just watched.
Jesus Christ, huge shoutouts for actually getting Lani for that voice over in the beginning.
I wonder what Carl Jung would think of the P2 duology if he was still alive
28:16 oh man this whole scene, and then the follow-up at the end, is absolutely wonderful. I can see why Satomi Tadashi liked it so much.
To be an adult is to suffer one's own consequences, which you have to face head-on since no one but yourself can take responsibility for them.
It's difficult and scary, but once they're overcome by your own hands, you start to understand yourself much better and you can see the good things in life again.
Great job, man.
"I've been waiting for this!" - Akihiko
"WOOO! YEAH BABY, that's what I've been waiting for!" - Critikal
Wholesome as heck
Honestly, Critikal would be an amazing persona character.
he’s been waiting for this
Well, time to get the Jack Frost branded caramel popcorn! I’ve got enough to share
Hey Door
@@blueorchid1313 too soon
@@kallum39 lol nah
Nothing hurt worse than when Baofu says “Sorry Miki...” if you get a game over shit was so fucked UP and the ending theme man you can’t even get me started with that and when Nanjo tries to give Kandori a chance at redemption, and to escape the cave he’s about to die in, but he stays and the story just continues on. Man this game really hit the feels
Ulala drinks and becomes her true self without realizing it
its great listening to someone delve into esoteric religious and psychological themes of this series, the hard work you put into these videos really shows. already anticipating the next one!
to this day I still miss Maya. Her role along with Tatsuya's are absolutely brilliant.
What an a absolutely incredible series, from start to (hopefully not) finish. Your in-depth explanations of Jung's work, as well as all the other parallels between mythology, religion, and psychology and Persona left me with a much greater appreciation for the series as a whole, even moreso than I did before.
This is a very interesting reminder about why lots of people loved Persona. I think SMT fans loved these twists, I know I did. This also gives a stark contrast to what P4 and P5 are missing. Even if you did not get most of what this video goes over, in P1 and 2, you still "felt" the impact of all that mind jank. You don't have understand it all completely to enjoy and feel the underlying web of intrigue and philosophy throughout. There's character development using the persona, conversations, settings, they use a variety of tools to tell a story of character development. Not necessarily growth, but development.
I think 3 4 and 5 lacks some of this web of character development. And seems to be hollowed out more and more the further we get away from 2. The games now are just challenged by the world. Having to overcome things and maybe?? grow. But they are not having a conversation with the world through their character development. And I think this conversation with the world is what SMT fans hold dear. The alignment system invites this conversation, and gives you at least the development of the alignment along the story and the development of your relating to it. Being able to dig a little deeper and come to new realizations is what SMT fans love I think.
The gameplay, compendiums, fusions, equipment, spells, those are all cool. And we've seen games made that are built on just those things. But I think fans who have played the old games can really feel when the game has left out its philosophical core and detailed development. I think this is also why fans are excited and dreading V.
I would just love for the entire staffs of Nocturne, P1n2, and Raidou to be thrown in the same building for a few years and see what game they come up with. I don't care what you call it, just make it feel like the early games did.
It's such a great and thoughtful analysis! Thank you very much!!!
Come to think of it, Nyarlothotep said that he "cannot tolerate contradictions", which, in itself, seems a very Jungian idea, too: as "anti-individuation" archetype, Big Nya is opposed to Individuation... which, in itself, IS about accepting contradictions and coincidenting oppositions! He hates contradictions as much that he cannot even grasp the contradiction that he, in all his danger and badness, is still not alienated by the protagonists, but accepted by them instead. So, in that sense he really IS "cosmic idiocy" that wants things as simple as they can be, and then even simpler still. He is a part of us that "wants to keep things simple", tires of contradictions, is scared or annoyed by them... And, frankly, this is something we all can relate to sometimes and feel it as part of our "sinful" human nature.
It also feeds into the motif of both Philemon and Big Nya meant to be transcended: the inherent paradox of the Individuation is that uniting contradictions does ALSO mean uniting
the "contradiction of both having to unite the contradictions and the self-protective need of dismissing, devaluing, attacking them".
It's kinda like having to keep the Balance between Balance and Imbalance, - because unilaterally calling contradictions "good" and escaping them "evil" will still place us back at the square one, in the dismissing of the complexities, in the tentacles of the cosmic idiocy once again!
It's also an amazing thing that you point about Maia and Buddha - the fact that it's that MAIA (Illusion) somehow gave birth to the Buddha! The one who saw through all the illusions. Which is in itself one of contradictions like those Big Nya hates =)
The mirror symbolism is beautiful, as always you open my eyes to even more greatness from Tadashi's big brain and the creativity of the original team
I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS! YES!
This is where let's thinking positive gets you.
Part of the main draw of EP is adults as the party members over teenagers, as you explained have their own completely different set of problems. Honestly I think this is what modern day persona needs now. We've had the teenagers in highschool 3 times now, it'd be nice to see the formula done with adults and how they see the world. Which is why I like the concept of Zenkichi/Wolf being a Phantom Thief in Persona 5 Scramble.
I completely agree, I'd love for them to ditch the High school setting as well, it's getting old now. An University setting would be a bit more interesting if they don't want to change the formula too much but I won't get my hopes up.
@@JPF222 Well, control of the series has changed hands again starting with Royal. Most of the people who worked on 3-5 are gone and working on Project Re:Fantasy. And the new people want to take the series in a "new direction" whatever that means so who knows what the future will hold.
@@breloompauncher5593 Yeah that's true, I just hope that they change enough to keep it fresh but without losing its essence. We'll see.
Your interpretation of Maya's character is spot on and amazing! It's given me a new insight on the character. I love how you tackled a lot of the symbolism that I missed out on, which just blew my mind and would have never noticed without this analysis. Eternal Punishment definitely is a beautiful game.
Classical Persona was the best! It was well researched, filled with so many deep easter eggs and meanings, like a tree's roots dividing endless but still part of a grand, strong whole and I'll miss it forever!
I'm disappointed that the psp translation didn't get finished before the making of this video, but I am happy with how this video turned out.
Wait its done? Can you link it?
@@kallum39 As far as I'm aware, they are not done hacking the script into the iso yet. You'd think they would by now, but what can you do. At least it's still being worked on.
Nice, been waiting for this! Funny how just earlier today I remembered your channel and thought about checking out whether this video had already come out. Pretty good timing!
Why do the Persona creators all look like they just stepped off a film noir-parody film set? It really fits with the themes and moods of the games, it's just hilarious it's reflected down to the way the creators dress. Quite a contrast from the work-place images we get of say, Shigeru Miyamoto, or Hirinobu Sakagachi.
Shame, you missed the perfect opportunity to have Ms. Minella say "It's whoopass time!" or "Grab your asses and run!"
Overall, great breakdown! I was waiting for this to come out after finding your channel a few months ago!
Astounding as always. Thank you for giving Classic Persona the treatment that it deserves. Hopefully newer Persona fans will find these videos and give the older games a shot.
A bit of a nitpick, but Eternal Punishment takes place in 1999, just after August 18th. the line referencing persona 1 as 4 years ago is a mistranslation.
good video so far!
Fantastic Analysis. It's incredible how much thought was put into the two game's story & themes by Tadashi "Chad" Satomi *wink* simply marvellous.
Thanks to this series I got interested in these older Persona games. Played through Persona 1 and almost done with Innocent sin. I love these older games, flaws and all.
My favorite game. Ulala's persona Asteria has maybe another way to show her development. The island Asteria became was the same one Leto gave birth to none other than Artemis and Apollo. So in a way she went from Callisto someone who was defined by her connection to Artemis to Asteria someone Apollo and Artemis couldn't have succeeded without
Decades later, after much rumination on these games and their messages, my mind sometimes wanders into a most existential of questions: WHO IS THE TIME COUNT???
One of Nyarlathotep's avatars most likely. He is known to appear in many guises.
I see people saying in comments below this and Muji Soft's videos that Ep is the best persona game, because EP without IS is like only one side of a coin, ending without a beginning. My opinion that both parts of persona 2 are making the story meaningful and complete. They are inseparable. I find themes of finding yourself and your meaning of life in IS more relatable to me, but I can't imagine EP without IS as IS without EP. Just like yin and yang.
(Sorry for my poor English grammar)
Awesome conclusion to the original Persona games. These games were so much of my teenage years and your analysis is both deep and nostalgic for me. Thank you so much.
Honestly, This is such an underrated analysis series.
"Maya is the means by which we are deceived by our senses"
Ah yes and the arcana is the means by which all is revealed
Bro you are a legend. These analysis have just made me want to go in more on the shin megami tensei franchise and see how many hidden messages that can be open from understanding what each layer of the games are based on
The final part about Maya was mind-blowing, and atruly great ending to the analyses of the original Persona trilogy.
Glad to see this return, Slice. Amazing series that’s gotten me more into the classic era of Persona.
One of my favorite video games ever and that ending is so powerful. I loved how you allowed it to take its time in your video. Overall, loved it and would love to see more videos from you.
On EP, I remember a senior at the tuition center I used to go to introducing it to me way back in 2002, and I was super hooked to the series since. I read the whole Innocent Sin script at Oracle of Maia/Room 303 way back when too. I used to memorize the trivia sections and everything. Hope those people are doing fine.
what a perfect video, saved in my favourites.
Same
Yes he’s back!
Hey it's the continuation of that thing I found a month ago that I subscribed specifically for... Neat
I can't tell you how happy I am to see this video. EP is honestly my favorite game of all time. Good to see that someone took the time to truly analyze it and this analysis does the story justice. Keep up the good work
The game is so meaningful to me and you really conveyed so many of the things I did and didn’t notice that many have not spoken about and I really commend your work! It was really a great series and it made emotional at times!
Oh shit! I loved the others you did. Very excited to see this
24:05
The same character from WHERE????
IS, Innocent Sin
I can't wait to watch this video with my sister. We just finished P2 EP, and thought your videos on IS were amazing! Thanks so much for such an incredible, interesting, and thorough analysis!
I stumbled upon this video while researching Personas. And I must say, I'm surprised how much symbolism can be found in the first two Persona games.
Everytime I watch this I discover something new about this game. You make me love one of my favorite games even more with your analysis.
Fantastic work.
The game that defined my love of the series.
So I just found your channel I watched the whole thing in one sitting... yes the 7 hours. What an amazing quality!!! I hope this videos continue for a long time!!!
just when U thought u knew persona here comes slice to jumble your brain haha jeez I never even looked into half of what this video explains and I already raved about how amazing this game was.
man I know I'm hella late to make a comment on this, but I got all emotional, teary eyed n shit near the end. looking back retrospectively and thanks to your video, I realized how much this series and this game in particular mean to me.
So, thank you for creating this, much love
Still my favorite Persona game. The rest are incredible too. But this one, is uniquely special. No other game quite like it.
I was waiting ages for this! I'm so glad it came out, and thanks for all the work and time you put into this!
Absolutely loving it already, thank you once again for excellent content, with just the right amount of humor, well researched background and just pure analysis. Kudos on a job well done! :)
I just started replaying Innocent Sin and I started thinking about your compendium series. Next thing I know this beauty pops up in my recommends 😍
Welcome back! Hope you're doing well and stay safe out there!
Akihiko voice: *I've been waiting for this!*
Thank you so much Snickety for giving P1-P2 the love they rightfully deserve and for making such a thorough analysis :)
Your videos are simply amazing, I feel like watching a docu on psycho analysis just on my favourite games. Kudos!
Just so you know, your videos inspired me to play the duology, and now they are among my favorite games. Thank you.
Well, goddamn. I literally watched your other Persona 2 videos last night, and was sad there weren't more. Guess I know how I'm spending my night! Thanks, man.
I was introduced to Persona when Joker got in smash, and I've really been enjoying your look at the early persona games.
I really love these compendium videos. Keep up the good work
This series was the final push I needed, to get into the Persona series for real. Before I just lurked, watching videos about personas, characters, and gameplay, curious, but never sure if it is something I would enjoy playing. But after watching your deep dive into Persona 1. I was hooked and had to give it a try.
I ended up buying Persona 5 royal, and absolutely loving it, now I'm slowly going through the PC port of P4G.
I'm so happy for you. By the way, I hope you didnt watch all the spoilers throughout the retrospective series (especially p2).
@@magicmanthegeez330 well, considering that around 90% of this series IS spoilers, and I watched all videos. I think you can guess the answer.
@@midnight-fox7456 well i hope this doesn't lead to you not playing these games. Games like p2 should definitely be a experience you should enjoy on your own
@@magicmanthegeez330 Don't worry, I definitely intend on one day playing through all of these games. But this is the internet, so I just have to accept that I'll have stuff spoiled, one way or another. For example, I had the final villains of Persona 3 and 4 spoiled, when watching a video about meaning of Velvet room in P5. There was no info that they'll be talking about story of P3/4, and no spoiler warning.
They were just talking and then BOOM, important story info, out of nowhere. Major elements of the game, spoiled out of f*cking nowhere. But I still intend on playing these games.
@@midnight-fox7456 The Persona fanbase is very bad when it comes to spoilers, but thankfully the games remain fantastic, and there are plenty of smaller moments throughout the games that aren't casually talked about as often, so not *everything* is spoiled
SPOILER
They be talking about how tragic makoto's fate is but forgot Tatsuya's
kicked-in-the-balls bittersweet ending. I mean he's supposed to be forgotten but still
Worse than dead/Forgotten
*I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS*
Akihiko style
My favorite Persona game still this day.
Based video as always, this channel needs way more recognition and views, keep up the good work my man
oh man the waiting was so worth it! You did an excellent job on the original trilogy, The P2 duology is my favorite part of the Persona series and one of my top spots in the overarching SMT Universe.
Niiice. I’ve been waiting for this. Your analyses are amazing.
Thank you so much for creating this, this was so insigtful!!
*Sighs*
I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS >:D
Can't name many other things I've been looking forward more than this video.
Man,watching through your entire persona 1 analysis and part 1 of 2 makes me wish you did one on the Shin Megami Tensei games,especially 1 and 2 since they're almost never covered in depth.
Dam. I really just sat here and watch all of the persona videos. The ideas and concepts is honestly fucking great. Thank you for making these videos. I guess next is Persona 3?
I love this game, it was the very first Persona I ever played. My eldest brother (R.I.P.) had a copy of it that was returned with his belongings after he passed away.
11 year old me was mesmerized with the game cover. I didn't have a PS or PS2 at the time, and I had to wait a few years to play it. 14 year old me spent the entire summer playing the game. I loved it.
Now I'm 27 and I have a Seven Sisters High School emblem patch that sits on my tv stand, my protection from Joker.
I'm glad to know there's other people who love this game as much as I do.
Also, I don't know if I speak for anyone else on this, but the Undersea Ruins dungeon can go to hell. I still hate that place.
I’m so glad this is here. I’ve been waiting for months man. Love your analysis the best
Been waiting for this for months!
Now the question remains,
Will this series explode im popularity with the analysis of modern era of persona games? Only time will tell.
I've been looking forward to this for so long and I missed it when it dropped!
I am such a huge fan of your Persona analysis videos that I finally started the series in 2020 and I just finished EP today. I put off watching this analysis so I wouldn't get spoilers hahaha. I was most of the way through the PS1 version when the PSP English patch came out so I restarted to have all of the QOL improvements. Man EP is such an incredible game where so much content is optional. After nearly every major event you can walk around the city and talk to your party for a look into their personality and how they are handling their situations. It adds so much depth and nuance, just like P1 did and is what made me want to keep playing.
The ONLY think I disliked in EP was the "Silent Protagonist" trope that Persona likes to use. Sure Maya does talk a little but aside from choices she's basically mute. It made her character a lot flatter than it should have been which is a shame as she was my favourite from IS. It also meant that the game had to rely on others talking about her emotions or thoughts in some slightly awkward ways to get her themes across. Unlike IS where Tatsuya was planned to be silent, making Maya just seemed silly and a set back. She didn't need to talk all the time but I would have like more. EP also makes the stoic Tatsuya more relatable thanks to him expressing himself and seeing his pain as he tries to fix his own problems.