@@eratrial insincerity is synonymous with dishonesty, and it takes a very dishonest Nigerian to base his/her argument on the non-existent of God on the insufficiency of empirical evidence and to conclude on the non-existent of the supernatural on the basis that there aren't enough empirical evidence to convince them otherwise.. They should try visiting Ijebu ode on a good day or maybe investigate the rumours on how money ritual work.. You just argue conclusively on things you haven't truly investigated..How convenient?
@@promisenyah8175 lol okay, I don’t have much knowledge about that and can’t argue further but definitely the countries with more religion are doing very badly in every way possible
The fact that every Christian on the panel openly admits that even if there was incontrovertible evidence against their beliefs they would still believe, literally tells us everything we need to know
@@lolivingston6827how could there evidence against atheism though when all it is is rejecting the claim of their being any gods? You have to make it make sense
@@thaimperial97 And you dont see an issue with that? Atheisms entire argument is contrarian at best. Lol. You haven't even proven your own theories . Before we continue. You DO know Big Bang theory is not absolute? Before we continue. Do you acknowledge that? 🤔
As a Christian and Nigerian, I am actually so impressed that atheists exist in this country, lol. There are too many people here that do not think to question their belief which they acquired from their parents, but choose to blindly assume it to be true.
When there are more educated people within a society, superstitions will decline and secularism will increase. People are leaving religion behind in droves and religious leaders are terrified. What a beautiful time to be alive.
“When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said ‘Let us pray.’ We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land.” ― Jomo Kenyatta
You need to understand that Christians are still humans Pastors are still humans All that happened is not because the people allowed it After all there were kings and chiefs, people in authority So as much as you want to say missionaries took our land and deceive us, the people in charge allowed it, which btw, are our fellow people
I believe there's a creator but I don't subscribe to the Christian God, and it's funny how Christian tell us not to inquire or seek evidence but just believe whatever the Bible says, forgetting that the texts were authored and compiled by men... And we know what men (humans) can do.
Curiosity as a Muslim ignites my faith. Because the moment anything doesn't make sense to me. I'm trashing Islam. I'm not accepting it blindly and Islam having the highest converts presently. People are not Stupid
People like that pastor on suit are the reasons I left Christianity. Dear Christians, saying something as a definitive statement and repeating it three times does not make it true. Show workings!
@@Maniflore not in the beginning. But the men who were to feed a new babe the sincere milk of the word didn't do their jobs well. I'm in no way saying there isn't a authentic Christianity or there aren't authentic men of God... But when a new believer runs into the wrong ones, he ends up as me in a few months
The both parties really did a good job in this debate... I really like towards the end how open-minded the atheist were to compromised their position to switch to the other side if concrete evidence were presented unlike how close-minded the Christians were to not compromise if concrete evidence were presented which is a serious problem 😒🤦 in Africa...
And that is my take away from this discussion. They say the Bible says only a fool believes there is no God, but I honestly think only a fool does not change their mind even in the face of evidence.
@@djbreezymillz ...and failed to provide concrete evidence buttressing his belief in the existence of God. These believers never ever provide hard facts, their belief in the existence of God is almost always based on their feelings, emotions and hormones. 😂
@@xydiploid6200 There can not be a creation without a creator, you see inanimate objects such as chairs they have a creator, so how are you going to tell me that I alongside the human race, with intelligence, free will and relative morals was not created by a creator, it is absolute bull. Another one, do you think murder is right? If you do, then there's problem. You see this highlights the concept of objective good, which we know exists, and in turn proves that God exists, but If good were relative God wouldn't exist. But there is an objective good. And, have you seen the marvel of engineering our beautiful planet and we that live on it are? I mean take a look at our DNA for example, you're trying to tell me that could have just happened randomly?
@@iiloveemusic First of all, I was establishing the fact that God exists, now how do we know which one of the religions is correct about God? Well take it like this there cannot be two truths, only one, so we first have to establish that only one can be right. Now, this is all up to you, and which religion you choose to subscribe to/put your faith in, personally I'm Christian because the overwhelming archeological evidence, and written accounts by eyewitnesses and historical accuracy lead me to believe what I believe. So you should do your proper research on what different books say about the Creator, and put your faith in whichever one you find the most convincing? I hope this was helpful, and may the Lord be with you, in Jesus's name, Amen.
Being an atheist in Nigeria is not easy. I respect the atheists in this discussion for their boldness. Nigeria and Africa need some level of rational thinking at this point.
Thank you to all the atheist whose sole purpose is to challenge believers to be stronger in faith. The way my lord and savior Jesus Christ orchestrates is masterful🙏🏽
There are many cases where it is actually happened … prayer is not the assured cure of HIV but people have been healed from it in the past with the power of prayer .
@@dudeof2436 That's simply not true. The gravity of this claim is being severely underestimated. If prayer could genuinely cure HIV, wouldn't it be a standard recommendation in hospitals? Or that too wont work cause its not gods plan??
I'm so pleased and encouraged at seeing fellow African non-believers. The confining affects of the "poverty of the imagination" that Bennet mentioned, is one of my biggest laments, so seeing others breaking free of that is so refreshing.
@JonathanAuguste-oq7yb With me, I'm more pitied than hated. The Abrahamic religions are foreign to Africa, and with the exception of Ethiopia, was introduced by force through colonialism. It's sad to witness my fellow Afrians not challenge the indoctrination at all and even take it on as their African identity.
@@JonathanAuguste-oq7yb Agreed. The only thing that I would personally add is that we have to apply a critical eye to our ancestral traditions as well. There's a tendency to go the opposite route and over-romanticize things. There should continuously be an assessment of what's still working for us, what should be improved upon, and what should be discarded.
@@JonathanAuguste-oq7ybI'm Trinidadian and I feel the same. I thought when I went to university I would find more of us (even in a Caribbean country), but even still I was still a minority and they asked the same stupid questions and told me hurtful things when I said that I was an atheist. Relationships had almost ended when I said I was an atheist.
The Christians are presumably atheists to other gods. They very likely don't believe in zeus, thor or poseidon and all the other 5000 gods. Some of us (the atheists) just go one god further.
Nelson keeps saying "what you are saying is cute and great", which is a very cute and condescending way of saying "You are talking trash, and your opinion is not valid". That's very disrespectful in a debate. Plus, he's a pro in mental gymnastics. Anyway, he's still the best apologetic on the show. The other two are just there to preach, not debate 😁
I agree. I do appreciate that Nelson went outside the "bible as proof" approach, but his repeated use of the word "cute" to describe the atheists' views was very patronizing and condescending. That was enough for me to lose a little respect.
All non believers of any religion is brave. I tip my hat to all. Whether you are in a country of Islam, Christianity, or any religion. Yall are the real ones.
@@kdogg8037 No problem, through logical deduction the universe could not have come from nothing or created itself so it must have been created by something independent (Something that does not rely on anything else for its continued existence) This is because if the universe came from something dependent like another prior universe that prior universe would have to come from somewhere as well and so on and so on ad infinitum leading to the absurdity of an infinite regress. (universe is dependent because it consists of parts for instance all matter, space and time if you remove the parts you have nothing and the universe no longer exists just like if you remove all the atoms in a bottle the bottle would cease to exist so it depends on its parts for its continued existence making the universe and bottle dependent things) In order for our universe to exist there would have to be an end to that chain of dependent things that is independent. An example of why this is, is that if you depend on someone to give you permission to throw the ball and that person who gives you permission requires someone else to give them permission to tell you to throw the ball going back to infinity you would never have permission to throw the ball to begin with. There has to be one part of that chain that does not depend on someone else to give them permission , therefore being independent, to give the command to throw the ball. Now an independent entity that does not depend upon anything else for its continued existence but everything else relies upon it with the power to create the universe, and the knowledge since it was able to do so and has the will shown by the ability to choose when that universe was created (if there was no will or control over when the universe would be created and you just had the perfect conditions for the universe to exist it would have been eternal but it was created 13.77 billion years ago) That is the definition of GOD. Independent All powerful All Knowing With a will I hope that answers your question.
@@kdogg8037 No problem, through logical deduction the universe could not have come from nothing or created itself so it must have been created by something independent (Something that does not rely on anything else for its continued existence) This is because if the universe came from something dependent like another prior universe that prior universe would have to come from somewhere as well and so on and so on ad infinitum leading to the absurdity of an infinite regress. (universe is dependent because it consists of parts for instance all matter, space and time if you remove the parts you have nothing and the universe no longer exists just like if you remove all the atoms in a bottle the bottle would cease to exist so it depends on its parts for its continued existence making the universe and bottle dependent things) In order for our universe to exist there would have to be an end to that chain of dependent things that is independent. An example of why this is, is that if you depend on someone to give you permission to throw the ball and that person who gives you permission requires someone else to give them permission to tell you to throw the ball going back to infinity you would never have permission to throw the ball to begin with. There has to be one part of that chain that does not depend on someone else to give them permission , therefore being independent, to give the command to throw the ball. Now an independent entity that does not depend upon anything else for its continued existence but everything else relies upon it with the power to create the universe, and the knowledge since it was able to do so and has the will shown by the ability to choose when that universe was created (if there was no will or control over when the universe would be created and you just had the perfect conditions for the universe to exist it would have been eternal but it was created 13.77 billion years ago) That is the definition of GOD. Independent All powerful All Knowing With a will I hope that answers your question.
Honestly, it feels good to see other African atheists. Being an African atheist can be an alienating experience, as Africans broadly speaking are deeply religious.
Nelson here! Absolutely enjoyed the conversation! It was a rare previledge to represent Christians i hope i did us proud! Love you all even you atheists you'll join us loving our "sky daddy" soon 😊 We are Praying for you all.
Nelson's argument is fundamentally flawed and deeply misleading. He claims that the uniqueness of Earth as a life-supporting planet is evidence of some divine design, yet he overlooks the vast expanse of the cosmos teeming with lifeless worlds. There are millions, if not billions, of planets without any form of life, including seven in our very own solar system. To suggest that Earth is perfectly placed for life simply because life exists here is to misinterpret causality-a concept Nelson frequently referenced. Life emerged on Earth because it had the right conditions; it wasn’t that Earth was preordained to host life. Nelson's misuse of Occam's razor further weakens his argument. He also placed undue emphasis on eyewitness testimony, which is scientifically known to be one of the least reliable forms of evidence. Human memory is fallible, and our brains are prone to errors and biases, even without considering mental illnesses. If we believed everything we saw without question, we’d be fooled by every magic trick and unable to recount events accurately even a day later. The atheists in the discussion, albeit seemingly overwhelmed by Nelson’s confident demeanor, held their ground admirably. Their stance represents a gradual but significant shift towards overcoming the intellectual stagnation that has long plagued regions like Nigeria. Slowly but surely, we are chipping away at the poverty of imagination, replacing it with a more enlightened and rational understanding of our universe.
Nelson you finish work for this video. I like your style of apologetics. When you try to explain something and they don't get it, you start sighting examples to drive your point home. You are a blessing to Christianity sir and every Christian clergy or laity should know what you know. I am deeply honoured on how you defended the faith. God bless you. I hope I can meet you so I can learn too.
This is the best Cruise episode I've watched. As a person currently reassessing my faith and really having indepth readings of Scripture, I can say I appreciate, most of all, the atheists for their honesty and tolerance, even though they didn't quite have enough science and philosophy to refute the textbook-style concepts the “jacket guy” was arbitrarily bringing up. About whether one would believe in God should irrefutable evidence come, thankfully, the “lady atheist” puts it the way I would: which god? There are hundreds of them across the planet. If it happened to be the Christian god, after all the atrocities he's committed in the Bible, I would never switch sides even if he appeared to me. Yes, I could believe in his existence, but follow him? Never. Please, Cruise, keep bringing more people who understand whatever topics they're discussing to the show. Really proud of you guys. (PS. I'm sorry for not using their names; I tend to forget things quickly. 😢)
Honestly, I feel like they really didn't mean that answer on "would you switch sides" because all their answers before that point contradicted their statement. Especially when they were outlining negative effects of Christianity. I doubt if they'd still want to follow the religion since they have a negative view on it regardless of if God is real or not. It seemed like it was a way to butress their point of "we are openminded" while not actually meaning it cus if they did they'll probably be agnostic not aethists and be like "we haven't seen evidence so we don't know but if we do see, we would believe in Him. It's fundamentally a heart matter imo. Even when Jesus was alive, many desired a sign but He said "no sign will be given to you". Many people even some aethists acknowledge something beyond our imagination is out there but many do not accept it as God, why? because of what it entails... Actually following him and putting away our fleshly desires. Many of them believe in Aliens or "Spiritual Energy" but for some reason when it comes to God they begin to raise eyebrows when the evidence for the latter supercedes the others. It's a heart matter cus those other idealogies do not include giving your lives totally to it. Despite the evidence put out it will still be classed as "not enough" as their hearts aren't' ready to receive Him.
@@mobijaymusicFair enough. But I don't think you should speak for them. Agnostism doubts the idea of a god; atheism says there isn't. What's their primary basis? A lack of evidence. I don't think atheism, for all its worth, has anything to do with openmindedness. Some people can be atheist and quite “conservative”. But if openmindedness was such a progressivist thing to have, why didn't the Christians say they'd switch sides? Because they didn't want to lie, perhaps, and by admitting they might switch sides, the atheists are lying?
Amazing comment 🙌🏿🙌🏿. This is exactly how I feel o. I'm not worshipping a "perfect" that was massacring people anyhow in the bible. Fuck him for what he did to Job
@@mobijaymusic I guess you’re right as to whether they would want to follow religion if God appeared to them and there was undeniable proof of his existence. And that’s the argument no Christian or religious person if given undeniable proof of their God not existing they won’t believe it. They’ll believe they’re being duped. I think most of these guys are agnostic because their disbelief is due to there being no tangible proof of the existence of god. But the truth is the same in the other way there’s no tangible proof that a god doesn’t exist. There are some wonders in the universe and the world that does cause one to ponder on how all this came to be I see religion as providing one potential narrative and one that quite often contradicts itself not only in terms of the books themselves but also the proponents of such beliefs. I used to be a Christian evangelised preached learnt apologetics was even learning Hebrew and Greek. Maybe you could say I saw it as an academic exercise I disagree I wholeheartedly believed what I did until I didn’t. And to be honest I’m way more moral and truthful now as an agnostic then as a believer. I want no harm for my fellow man in fact I want everyone to do well regardless of what they believe. However when I was a believer I only wanted fellow believers to do well there was a very them v us the chosen ‘enlightened’ ones. Anywho my two pence.
Nelson was just trying to jump hoops. He wasn’t open minded about the convo. It’s meant to be an argument. Also he made some scientific statements that were totally false. He is lucky that no one on the opposing side is much of a science talker. I personally would have made him look like a joker with simple reference searches
Exactly! He was just bringing out arbitrary things, what my professor would call-pardon my language-“impressive nonsense”. The Newton was a Christian claim for example, that many Christians love to hold on to, would fall face down if one understood enough history to go with it. Do people know there was a time when it was suicidal to be anything but Christian in Europe?
@@adebesinjacob8311you don’t know what a theory means in science A theory is a solid as it gets, it means it’s been tested and has very solid proof. It’s just a word used to classify new areas of study. Theory is just “the study of” What you’re thinking about is called a hypothesis
"I've seen genotypes change". Ei 😂💔..It is scientifically impossible for genotypes to change from SS to AS. As a medical laboratory scientist, I've seen too many couples ignore medical advice and follow pastors who claim prayer can change their genotypes. Unfortunately, these couples often end up having children with sickle cell disease, who suffer from endless pain and face the risk of premature death. Please, if you have incompatible genotypes, seek proper genetic counseling and make informed decisions. Relying on unsupported claims can lead to a lot of unnecessary heartache and suffering.
Chill, both sides argued well. And TBH, Nelson was the most logical, factual, coherent Christian there. He made his points & brought his facts well. The only thing he said that I knew was cap was that part of his prayer healing cancer and changing genotype. But, apart from that, he is probably one of the most intelligent, realistic, & least delusional Christians I have seen. Christians don't argue reasonably like him (Especially Nigerian Christians)
I'm glad we are having this discussion. To me it's a sign of Africa waking up from religious dogmas that will eventually take us away from European imperialism.
You just so uninformed!! Go and study history well before you speak !! Christianity was present in Africa before missionaries arrived. There are records of Christian communities and individuals in Africa dating back to the early centuries of the Christian era. These early Christian communities were largely in regions such as Egypt, Ethiopia, and Nubia. The Christianization of Africa is believed to have begun as early as the first century AD, with the introduction of Christianity through trade routes and migrations. And a simple question for you.... You use words that you have no undrrstanding of.... Are you an atheist??
@@josephjohn907 my experience of Twitter in that regard is usually argumentative, which I'm not interested in. Maybe I should put in more effort though
I’m Christian but they shouldn’t have called a pastor. He will only revert to the Bible and can’t use the argument of objectivity morality or the argument of cause and effect
Hey Christians, here's a little something to reconsider and ponder over. 1) The creation of the bible (a religious text) by man. 2) Being born into a religious family. 3) The indoctrination into Christianity from an early age. Now, take all that away and honestly (with all emotions aside) ask yourselves this question: "If it weren't for the above factors, would I have believed in the existence of God and become a Christian?"
Let me address each of your items: 1. The Bible has existed for thousands of years. What we see now is a compilation of multiple manuscripts by dedicated historians, some who were there to see these things happen. Multiple discoveries have shown time line correlations and places identified to corroborate what is in the Bible. So taking that away denies evidence gathering. So that's a moot point. 2. Okay yeah, being born into religion has a part to play. But what do you say about the millions of Christians now who were born into atheist families or non Christian religions? Isn't that a case for the fact that they experienced something that brought them into the faith? Many non-theistic scientists have found faith in their trying to prove the non-existence of a God, so why does that happen? 3. The same as above, but let me take it a step further. The indoctrination should keep people who grew up in Christian homes from becoming atheist.... If the indoctrination is that strong... But people stay in the faith because they also experience God for themselves. So the answer for me is I can't say for sure for everyone, but if my personal experiences have been anything to go by, yes, I'd believe in God and His existence. And... I think you can too. You can (even if not convinced), ask God to reveal Himself to you. He's ever ready to welcome you. I can't wait to hear your testimony.
Let me add something to that list. 4. Colonization and importation of religion "Christianity " by Europeans. If not most Nigeriams will still be worshipping our traditional gods.
@@oluwatobifaniyi interesting fact, Christianity was in Africa, long before there was any colonization. Christianity was bound to come here anyway. Islam had already entered a huge chunk of Northern Africa as well. The revolutions were progressing. Also, this also shows that atheism is not in our nature because humans are always looking for God. And whether we did that using our own traditional knowledge, we always identified that there was something missing and we sought for it. Ethiopia was never colonized and they had some of the earliest Christians. Israel in the Middle East was a Jewish community but they also had the first Christians. The “Europeans” didn’t invent Christianity. They don’t even purport to be the source of it (which they could easily have colonized like everywhere else). Does that lead you to admit that maybe there’s something there, something beyond human comprehension that has a life its own that makes Christianity, no matter how many times people have tried to snuff it out, it has grown even stronger? You sef think am now.
@yahushasdaughter9106 LOL, of course you will. It's difficult for the vast majority of people to question their own strongly held beliefs because their world will shatter. It takes a lot of courage to confront your own beliefs and annalyse it logically and address it
Just because you have a handicap doesn't mean God doesn't have a calling for you, we all aren't born the same, God uses is us in ways beyond our understanding.
@@israelbajulaye1491 Religion has not fucked up Nigeria. The issue is the system and how people want to avail themselves of it without building nothing for the next generations. Religion teaches you not to be selfish but if Nigerians show themselves to be selfish, where’s the fault of religion in that?
@@BroJo676 Religion doesn’t teach anything it just list requirements you must follow in order to claim the religion. Humans know that we can’t be selfish because it would put humanity in danger not because of a god, heaven, or a hell. Focusing your time on meeting religious requirements means that you’re neglecting human nature, common sense, and science which some people don’t mind because it’s easier to rely on spirituality than to put in the work to figure out why and how something is happening (aka taking responsibility and accountability). In terms of a humanitarian crisis or corruption, the solution to these issues often includes elements that go against the religion. Human nature and science has always came first but religion likes to regurgitate some points to make an ideology seem more believable. Society looks down upon actions like stealing, murder, and SA because humans have collectively shown a consistent pattern of disapproval when these things happen. It has nothing to do with god or the devil.
@Ytulipss that's the point. We dont even know the origin like we dont know the "guy", we just heard from this guy, who claims to have heard from that guy and hence a book (the bible) was created...that's what the original comment meant I think.
Hmm the atheist guy sorry to say became very silly at end part where he says ‘we have given you evidence that God doesn’t exist, it doesn’t matter how.’ But when it comes to Christians he wants how. Honestly this is one of the sound arguments to be made but I wish they could sit down and watch themselves in the video and I’m hoping they’ll see how Nelson has given a sound and logical reasoning. At least sitting down to watch again would give them time to really analyze what Nelson said
@Ytulipss I was referring to the guy in the video with the green vest. I was talking about his "uncaused causor" argument. Basically, God is real because he said something about there having to be an uncaused causor even though nothing really points to such. Even what @justanotherhuman5162 said, I agree with that too.
My grandma lied about having cancer to lie about how she was cured of it through her prayers and the prayers of the people in her catholic community. She never had cancer but still swears by it to this day lol and sometimes I wonder how many people in her community really believe she had it and not only that, but that god cured her! There is no medical evidence she had cancer but she claims she was touched by god and healed. When I hear people say that their prayers healed someone, I always think about my grandma and assume that others are lying about miracles because they are so abused mentally that they need something to tell them they are special and gods favorite to not die of suicide. I feel bad for the people that are “true believers” because those people don’t trust their own experience due to all their abuse.
@@Mali-jw6im Proverbs 3:5-6 New King James Version (NKJV) Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths. So you were saying...?
If all these different religions are claiming to have a specific god, who is the creator of everything or different gods created one thing specifically, then these religions can’t all be true, they contradict each other. The God of Israel specifically states that he is the only true God and all the other gods do not have the power he has. Which he has proven many times, through history and to people living today, like myself.
@@Rose-xs5frIt's an easy argument to respond to. Just talk about the outcomes of Christianity versus other religions. The positive impacts that Christian ethics has on the world. No one can deny that.
@@Emmanuel_EEEThere are many other religions that have positive impacts on the world. Just look at Buddhism or Hinduism. Your argument doesn't make Christianity unique...do you really think that Christianity is the only religion with moral ethics?
@@Emmanuel_EEE “Some say Christianity has borrowed elements from other religions, including paganism, mystery religions, and other Mediterranean religions: Paganism Early Christians adopted many aspects of pagan funeral rituals into their culture and customs. Mystery religions Some say Christianity borrowed beliefs from ancient polytheistic mystery religions that originated in Egypt, Greece, Asia Minor, and Iran/Syria. Mediterranean religions Some scholars have compared the stories of Jesus's birth and resurrection to those of other divine or heroic figures from the Mediterranean, such as "dying-and-rising gods" like Tammuz, Adonis, Attis, and Osiris. However, others say that these similarities are more likely due to a shared cultural environment. “
@@cemantical 1.Could you provided the positive impacts that both of those religions brought to the world? 2. Christianity morality system is vastly different from other religions. Love your neighbors as yourself, love your enemies, protect the weak. There are many more. Didn't say that Christianity is the only religion with a moral ethics, it's just better than the others.
It's crazy. So many of them. He is obviously using the apologetics way which is quite disingenuous. His aggression and everything is just to overshadow their opponents as a debate tactics
@@JosephMartey-zs2qk His faith and reason argument, he merged cosmological and teleological argument to point to God and misrepresented science in many ways. He appealed to authority talking about big scientists being Religious. Science does not point to a creator, it actually leans away from it. You can easily tell how he gets disingenuous in his presentation
@@JosephMartey-zs2qk he was constantly making strawmans out of his oppositions arguments, shifting the burden of proof, constantly appealing to authority and appealing to ignorance
There’s thousands, if not more, of debates on UA-cam about the existence of god. If he existed and he cared, he could end these debates by showing up to one of them. Right now the average Christian reading this is thinking that it’s arrogant of me to expect god to show up for a debate to prove himself. Meanwhile they didn’t blink an eye when they read the story in the Bible where god showed up to prove himself in a competition versus the Canaanite god Baal.
God is not our tv who shows up when we command. How arrogant. We are the ones who love by his laws and will. It is his universe that we live in. It is he who allows us to draw another breath as we curse his name.
@@tz9422 I stand by what I said. The Bible says if you seek me you will find me. You don’t NEED him to do anymore extravagant miracles to believe. It’s just like the Jewish leaders of the gospels Jesus was doing stuff left, right and centre but they never believed. You don’t want to believe in God fine but don’t treat him like some toy that bends to your will. 🫡
@@JesusisliterallyHimThis argument makes no sense. God supposedly loves everyone an infinite amount why would he not want to do this? The amount of people he would save from hell would number in the billions surely. Not to mention the fact that it would literally be infinitely easy for him to do so, being omnipotent and all. Even if you want to say something like “he doesn’t want to because free will” or something along those lines, knowing for a fact that the God exists doesn’t preclude you from going against him still. According to the Bible that’s what we do anyway
That christian arguing about the big bang theory as if the bible didn't say that Adam and eve was the first human to be created and also agreeing with the scientific evolution 😂😂 how can you contradict your self like that
There is a reason why it is called the big band theory … because it can’t be proven , it is just a theory. Also the Bible doesn’t not necessarily disprove the Big Bang. You are talking about two things different, the start of human and the start of the universe . Now I don’t believe in evolution but there are some Christians who actually do and their argument does not disprove the Bible . Maybe you need to do some research before commenting …
@@dudeof2436 lol. Gravity is a theory. Does that mean it’s not true? Plate tectonic movement is a theory does that mean it’s not true? Theory is the highest level an hypothesis can reach in science. When something gets to a point of theory that means it’s true. It can only be improved upon not completely tossed aside.
@@News_n_Dine the Big Bang theory as a theory is not verifiable as the others you just point out. So we can’t be sure what exactly happened billions of years . The big band theory only argues the expansion of the universe would in the earlier state. But again I don’t mind if it truly happened or not, my argument is that it doesn’t contradict the Bible even if it really happened. Atheist love to use it as some kind of gotcha moment to Christians. Also it is ironic when you found out who came up with the Big Bang theory in the first place .
@@News_n_Dine the Big Bang theory is not verifiable as the other you mentioned. Scientist only agree that the universe rapidly expand 13 billions years ago . And even if it truly happened , it doesn’t contradict the Bible or disprove the existence of God. Atheist love to use it like a gotcha moment for believers. Also it is ironic when you find out about the person who came with the Big Bang theory in the first place .
I'm really itching to be a part of this debate as an atheist. Nelson was just making so many claims that are very very inconsistent with his model. Occam's razor even goes against the concept of a God. The simplest explanation cannot be a God who is far complex than the universe itself. The atheists did well tho, Bennet the software engineer and I'm a software engineer as well
why would you assume god or a creator is only complex? God would be both simple and complex at the same time, technically. Edit: But I do agree Occam razor use here made no sense lol.
@@phil_left8842 Even if we grant that he's simple and complex which is obviously paradoxical, the complexity of it is paramount in the context of an occam's razor. But how do you think God can be simple and complex?
@@boyonpc5499 Its not paradoxical. humans are simple and complex at the same time. Are we not? A creator may be similar just on a grand scale. I mean creating a universe sounds complex but I dunno I aint make it. Shit could be as easy as putting together a desktop pc which my pops still thinks is like rocket science lol.
@@phil_left8842 So what we're doing right now is speaking different languages. I'm speaking from a scientific or empirical sense. An explanation is simple when it's the closest empirical solution and makes accurate predictions. A god hypothesis, is way too complex to explain cos how do you explain a being as such
@@boyonpc5499 u cant use science or empirical data to explain a creator only breakdown the world created. Which leads back to ppl not believe in a creator lol.
@@Weminan Thoughts are based on the biology of HIV infection and transmission. I don't care what you have seen, if you re-test "cured HIV" folks, you'll find evidence suggesting the contrary (i.e. a viral load and/or reduced CD4 counts). Please stop. There's literally no reason to claim false statements like that. It doesn't help you at all, and it certainly doesn't help the vulnerable HIV/AIDS patient population.
@@WeminanYes and yesterday I saw a pig fly. What do you have to say about that? Can you disprove I saw what I saw? I'm 100% sure I saw a pig fly yesterday, anyone who says otherwise is foolish!
@@Weminan Really not sure why my other response to your comment isn't showing up, but whatever. I'm happy to repost it again. --- My thoughts are based on the basics of HIV infection and transmission. And, no. You haven't seen HIV cured. If you test any of these "cured HIV" folks, you'll find evidence to the contrary (i.e. a viral load and/or reduced CD4+ counts). And if you don't? Guess what, it's very likely that they were never positive in the first place. Please stop. There is no reason for you to be making ridiculous claims like "I have seen HIV cured." It does not help you, and it sure as hell does not help the vulnerable HIV/AIDS population out there.
I mean, what Nelson said about the Big Bang Theory isn't accurate. It's not described as an infinite number of big bangs. It's more of a constant, rapid expansion. It's a premise that the universe has been expanding and continues to expand. In fact, many scientists have acknowledged the term "Big Bang" is a misnomer. Also, there's no conclusion about what caused the Big Bang either. That is recognized to be unknown.
This episode, as well as the other episode where we had Christians vs Muslims, have made me believe that a lot of our pastors are not trained for the job. They just pick their Bible, say they're called, and start preaching. No training at all. Maybe there should be some regulation in the Christian religious circle. Same way you can't do surgery without a licence, you can't start a church without a licence. You'd get trained from a reputable theological seminary and all. I'm all for it.
I agree. A lot of them know nothing about apologetics and are not trained in debates. That can't even the cross examination which is the most important part arguably. But thankfully we have great people like trent horn and james white to represent our faith. I mean james white has had over 180 debates and is an author of ten books. He represents us very well.
Most pastors from the penticostal churches just go to Bible School then start running a church, if you want a real argument with a pastor invite either a Catholic, Anglican or a Methodist priest, they have the real theological knowledge
the people who leave religion are people who have gone in deep with questions but got no answer so decided to switch after sometime people will start asking questions
I would also genuinely like to know from the religious camp why the disease that are miraculous healed are usually internal viral diseases or cancers, but no one has successfully seen an amputee regain their limbs. Is there Limitation or preference to the healing process?
Lol. An amputee regaining a lost limb instantly in church is something that could even convert millions of unbelievers all around the world in just few days. But no pastor ever attempts such. I wonder why. 🤔
@@Joecloudjosh I think his point is that no laymen wrote about it. It's always someone who was either a disciple or prophet or a political figure of the time and not necessarily a farmer who just wanted to grow his crops afterwards. No accounts from the people he healed but accounts from people who supposedly witnessed the healing. That's what I think he means.
@@lindamalote1719 Well, they actually did, but their own accounts of the events probably didn't get very widely read ( of course not every book written will be read by the whole world or be preserved for ages). If you read the Bible, you'll see Luke writing in Luke 1:1-4, and affirming that many people have written about the things that happened both leading to the birth of Christ and his time on earth. That was in fact his reason for giving his own account to Theophilus, after he had read and understood what happened from different accounts. I believe that the Bible we read today has been Divinely preserved so that the message would get to us.
you can be both agnostic and and atheist. agnostism is about knowledge, atheism is about belief. most "atheists" are actually agnostic atheist. that is, they don't know is there is a God, but don't believe one exists because of lack of evidence.
I'm in between. I don't believe we have the full gist on the actual shape of the earth. I mean if you don't believe the Bible, then why should I believe anything else that I can never verify? How many people in this life will ever see an actual spaceship, talk more of actually going to space? I don't think 5% of NASA staff even have that experience, talkless of me and you 😂😂. Just know there's a possibility of fowl play, it's not like these people are our friends. The same way religion deceives us, science can also be deceitful: just look at the men who champion certain things, why would I trust Elon Musk and Bill Gates 🤷🏾♀️🤷🏾♀️
@@tamiausten873 Well if you don't believe the earth is round, then what do you believe in? Because you have some explaining to do, especially when it comes to astronomical events and a whole lot more and well it is possible to see space ships being launched, it's just that Nigeria isn't a country that invests in the space sciences. Just because you don't understand the inner workings of space doesn't necessarily mean that it's fowl play, you just haven't done your research to fully understand, the evidence is there you can even go to NASA page to see livestreams of people actually working on satellites in space but then again I think you would say because you can't verify it but ok :) science does not claim to be the absolute truth because if science is wrong science will say so and Science isn't believing in people and you can't decieve people in science be it Elon musk or Bill gates because the sciences isn't left for those people alone, it's left for everyone and anyone, everyone could verify on their own a new scientific research, the maths is there, the equations are there, the entire world so why would we need those people to be sure of science
@@tamiausten873Well if you don't believe the earth is round, then what do you believe in? Because you have some explaining to do, especially when it comes to astronomical events and a whole lot more and well it is possible to see space ships being launched, it's just that Nigeria isn't a country that invests in the space sciences. Just because you don't understand the inner workings of space doesn't necessarily mean that it's fowl play, you just haven't done your research to fully understand, the evidence is there you can even go to NASA page to see livestreams of people actually working on satellites in space but then again I think you would say because you can't verify it but ok :) science does not claims to be the absolute truth because if science is wrong science will say so and Science isn't believing in people and you can't decieve people in science be it Elon musk or Bill gates because the sciences isn't left for those people alone, it's left for everyone and anyone,everyone could verify on their own a new scientific research, the maths is there, the equations are there, the entire world so why would we need those people to be sure of things we can verify ourselves.
@@blackbeauty5817 Oh, you have no freaking idea. The earth is a plane i.e., flat - with a dome cover (sky) to create an ENCLOSED SYSTEM. Life can only be supported, nurtured and sustained in an enclosed system.
I'm an agnostic nigerian, i always knew so much was wrong with the belief but what drove me to stay was the community, lack of other atheists , and the fear of Satan that is heavily pushed on kids. It took me leaving the country to be able to question the belief and explore other option. It's horrible that Nigerians would treat you horribly or even harass you for not believing what they do when it's not even set in stone.
Lie. I went to a Christian school with two muslims in my class. Not for a single day were they bullied for having different beliefs to the whole school. They were treated like anyone else. Christianity also spread very peacefully. Contrary to religions like the one based on the qu'ran which spread exclusively through wars and violence. Christians are very welcoming and lukewarm in faith, you are just being obtuse if you say otherwise.
i find something common about all religion and religious beliefs, they are all want you to give all yourselfs and time but the rewards is so far fetched that you cant get the reward until you are dead, in christianity and other abrahamic faith is it heaven or AL Janaa and the threats also is you refuse to belief is hell fire, when you begin to question the books you become a threat
I was a debator I did Forensics and I did Model UN and the Christian's guy with the vest had nothing but logical fallacies, appealing to authority and because jumping through hoops to run from having an argument.
@@timileyinolalerea.t.o.m3263 seems it's you who doesn't understand English. He pointed out and I asked him to prove it statement or not he disagrees with what the man said so he needs to give reasonable points why he thinks those were fallacies.unless he proves why he thinks what the dude said were fallacies he's also not making any concrete points other than trying to attack the dude and that's ad hominem fallacy. Please read with understanding next time.
@@ultimatefightcrossover7306😂😂😂You're just throwing philosophical words around. That wasn't an ad homenem fallacy rather what is, is what he was pointing out to. Without using the word itself
Good debate but it would be interesting to get perspectives from theists who aren't necessarily Christians. This way get more diverse arguments for the existence of God that don't center on the Bible as their basis.
That big dude was the only apologetic. It seems like in a debate the only one who has relevance of being is there is the apologetic cause they will try to use scientific arguments The rest are just preachers😭
These people are funny defending a god that “wants so badly” to have a relationship with his creation that he created us with an ability to reason and this ability to reason would then be our downfall driving us further away? what? …? ..nonsense
The moment that Nelson guy said 'the bible is one of the most logical books to be' ... that was where i knew he would most likely say nonsense all through....
Nelson talked about Occam’s Razor and how the simplest argument is the only one that should be considered (20:51). That is not what Occam’s razor says. It says that you should consider the simplest explanation FIRST and then that is a starting point to build up to the reality of what happened.
The guy was just misquoting science throughout, it’s a pity nobody there was strong enough in science to tackle him I blame the organizers, if they could bring a pastor for the Christians why not bring a scientist for the atheists?
@@Darkenergy104 that’s the thing with most religious people, pastors and even scammers. 20% facts, 80% confidence Are you familiar with Terrence Howard or Billy Carson?
Bringing in a pastor and leaving out tradditional believers and muslim to help tell this fellows that God truely exist made it a discussion of Atheism and Christianity.
Love this, and just like Ada said i believe personal experiences helped many of us grow stronger and God is never afraid of our questions. And the part where Ada said, telling God to prove himself in our lives, I can attest to that not just once but the truth now is that the first time it happened i tried to prove in every way possible to myself that it just happened like that which is what i am sure many people do. You ask/ believe God for something, he does it but after it happens you now feel life just just happened that it wasn't God! Don't be like that 😅 And to Mr Nelson, thank you very much, I grabbed a lot though that last part 😅, its understandable sha And to Mr Bennet, you did well with questioning and reasoning
Nelson was so on point. Everything he was saying was point and went over peoples head. It was good to hear him defend his points. I really enjoyed listening to him.
@@Geniuswhay yea ik. It’s amazing. And they say the atheist young lady was the smartest. I don’t think so I think the man with the braids was the most insightful atheist until he said “I think religion is for people in poverty”.
@@tidianesimpson I agree. She wasn't saying anything deep. Just doubling down on why she made a great decision to be atheist. I could feel the frustration in the voice of Nelson. They had disagreed before he even spoke
@@Geniuswhay yes I find all the atheist stories compelling because they never became atheist from evidence showing God doesn’t exist. They became atheist because they relied on people. It’s sad to see. But to be fair Christian don’t to a good job at leading by example and teaching Jesus the correct way. It’s sad to see the errors and who they affect.
@@Geniuswhay one thing that bothered me about the debate is that all the atheist agreed that their isn’t evidence to prove God exist or doesn’t exist but yet they still say “well it’s up for y’all Christian’s to prove the claim”. I find that so weird because that doesn’t provide any foundation for the atheist to stand on. It’s strange. It was easy to tell this wasn’t intellectual debate it was an emotional one. But for some reason they claimed logic.
I've lived long enough to know that on both sides, no one knows what the truth is. The universe is too vast for our tiny human minds to comprehend. Using things that happen on our planet which is merely a spec of dust in the infinite beach that is the cosmos is misguided. Is there something or someone out there? Likely. All we can do is just love each other because at the end of the day, that's the only thing we can do to guarantee our short lives will be better
Atheist here. I had always wanted this debate lol. And yes being an atheist in Nigeria is tough work. Especially as a female working with elderly women
Question for the Christians: How can god interact with the material world to help you succeed in life? There is the belief that god allows humans to have free will. Apart from doing things like stopping lightning from striking you, god can’t help you in your exams, relationships, job etc. Doing so would require him to directly affect human choices in your favour. If someone only does B instead of A because of god, then free will is interfered with.
Good question. Many Christians believe in the idea of free will from God but then also believe in intercessory prayer. Then you have the pastors and prophets that claim to be called by God. But how can God call someone without breaking their free will
Side note I love Peter-Nelson Isaiah so far He has shown that as much as he's a believer and in strongly believes in God, he's also someone who would want evidence of the things of the world He's like Timothy, a follower of God who still likes to have proof of the world
Evidence that confirms his biases, that is. That type of person is the type to ignore any evidence that contradicts what they want to believe as coming from 'the devil'
I became so happy when the Atheists said they were willing to switch sides if convinced!!! God is not only about the religion!! God is the light within you!! You are directly the tree of life and the universe is within you!! Christianity and the Bible is a guide to awaken your Christ consciousness and have strong Faith in God... For the Temple of God is within you ...
If there were undeniable and sufficient proof of the existence of God, the scientific world would be in turmoil. All the major scientific journals, all the university faculties would fight to receive the genius behind the demonstration. All the talk-shows, the television news around the world, all the magazines on the planet would offer millions $ to the lucky person to have exclusive access to the story of his discovery. But nothing happens.
Nelson is presenting his case without even quoting the Bible, demonstrating how a debate should be conducted. His argument is very intellectual, and while I don't agree with everything he says, he is making a strong argument so far. Apostle Julius, on the other hand, struggled to defend his faith because he couldn't make an argument without relying on the Bible. In this situation, he needed to go beyond biblical references and present logical arguments, including references outside of the Bible, especially since the atheist audience does not believe in or agree with the Bible. To him, belief is required even if he can't provide an explanation. He has difficulty clearly articulating his own beliefs about his faith and, despite speaking about Christianity, knows very little about it. In my view, the atheists failed to clearly define their statement regarding the non-existence of God. They stumbled because there is a distinction between asserting "There is no God" and saying "I don't know if God exists." From what I observed, they don't truly believe in the non-existence of a Creator; they simply aren't sure if a God (Creator) exists or not. In fact, there is more evidence supporting the existence of a Creator than there is for the absence of one. However, that's a discussion for another time. I have to commend Nelson for making a reasonable argument and being very eloquent. He is highly intelligent and also very convincing.
There is no way to defend non existence. How do you defend the non existence of unicorns? Their points are there is no proof for god, therefore there is no god. They also admit in the end that if they were presented with proof for god then they will agree, similarly if presented with proof of unicorns , a logical person will agree. Nelson was well- spoken and that was all. His claims that causation = god is a weak theory because the same theory is disproven when asked what caused god. If your response is 'god does not need a creator' then why do you think the universe or space needs a creator. As sane and logical humans, you do not make conclusions based off belief, you examine evidence presented to you. for example if you see an egg, you most likely assume a chicken was there because based off repeated evidence gathered from seeing chickens around you can tell that chickens lay eggs. You do not assume a dog made the egg because there is no evidence to support dogs laying eggs. If however, we start to see dogs lay eggs we can then change our conclusion that either a dog or chicken had laid that egg. Same with creation, there is no evidence that god created anything. Until such evidence is presented you are right to say there is no god.
@@felixamadi2237 Fine-Tuning, Kalam’s cosmological argument, The contingency argument as well as the Ontological argument are all arguments supporting the existence of a God
@@kponke you could say the same about almost any argument that exists. So unless you care to actually dismantle at least one of them yourself in this cs, your opinion is irrelevant.
The part where Oyindamola said that newly converted Christians cut a lot of people off has nothing to do with not being accountable or refusing to take correction. It has absolutely nothing to do with bad character. Why that happens is because as a genuine born again Christian there are certain things you would do before that doesn't sit right with you again cause light and understanding which can never be understood by logical reasoning has been shown to that believer. In some cases there is also a period of isolation for people who are personally convicted to take some time from the world to get to know God more. Whenever that period of conformation is over they find it very uncomfortable to do some things cause they've seen light and have knowledge that might seem stupid to others because only the spirit can grant understanding. It could also be that the friend causes them to sin and they might just want to take a break so then can be more firm in their faith to not make mistakes or go back to their old lifestyle and since they've let Jesus into their life even if they fall back into sin they'll always come back home because absolutely nothing can separate us from the love of Christ. I pray that God touches your heart and the heart of those that read this comment because no one can come to God unless he draws them. I know this isn't really related to what I was saying but it's very important, remember that one day we will all die and whether you like it or not, whether you believe it or not, it's either heaven or hell it won't be funny at all to spend eternity in hell. If you go to God geniuenly he loves you so much and will definitely speak to you(in different ways not necessarily an expected way) but you would have a beautiful and life changing encounter and he would direct your path unto the right way❤️
@kamsirichard8347 Like!!! This is the problem with the average Nigerian Christian. Emotional & psychological, manipulative blackmailing, and gaslighting. It is always the same thing, threats about Heaven & Hell they have no genuine evidence or sight of. Worst is that even if these places exist, they are not given any guarantee that they will go to the heaven last last, after all these their holier than thou self-righteous acts & thought process
I think she clarified at the end of her speech that communicating your values are incompatible would be ideal. But I think she is being unfair and biased. People do this in other aspects of their lives that have nothing to do with religion. When some get married or move, find different groups of friends, graduate or any life change, they can distance themselves from people they were once close with without any proper communication. It's a human flaw and she's doing the things that atheist do when trying to put Christians down for their human characteristics.
Another proof that while Christianity as a whole is truth, it's shows also that it can allow for open dialogue among those who do not subscribe to it without any negative consequences
@@isaiahpeter-nelson3140you really are😂😂. Close mindedness is what Christianity is about and there's always going to be something that'll trigger questioning. Why you need to research about Islam
@@hassanabdulmalikodunayo2701yall complain about Christians pushing their religion on ppl but here you are telling him to research Islam which is a very similar religion I don’t get it😂 for him to even go on a show like this proves that he’s very open mindsd
@@kekemarie-rn8cc Nope going to the show doesn't mean you're open minded. It's having a conversation and how people react to logical fact brought to them about that they believe. You can't even believe a hypothetical scenario. That's the height of being close minded.
@@hassanabdulmalikodunayo2701 This is very rich coming from a Muslim! Christianity promotes open mindedness and wisdom 1 Thessalonians 5:21 "But test everything; hold fast what is good." Proverbs 1:22 “How long, O simple ones, will you love being simple? How long will scoffers delight in their scoffing and fools hate knowledge?" The fact that there's an entire book based on wisdom (book of Proverbs), Ecclesiastes & so much more shows how ignorant you are. Don't make such bold claims again, thanks
When you put alot of ignorant people inside the room and they are all throwing their myth no fact-check, nothing, just them lying to support their point
Still on this yes God can do anything, but you need to understand that He has given us authority over the earth. So for Him to do something for us there has to be a medium which is us. The same way where He had to die for us hence the new testament, He had to become man, physical, a medium, hence Jesus Christ, while He was on earth, he showed us the similarities and difference between the physical and the spiritual while also using the life style of Jesus to show us how we should live our life even though He knows we can't be perfect, try, hence the free will
@@myartworkchannel The point of prayer is to do things you cannot do yourself Example You open a business Can you control the mind of the people to ensure your business blows? But if you're a true Christian and born again, God can find a way to influence people to come your way
@@myartworkchannel my point exactly Impossible and supernatural God helps makes the impossible possible Just do what you can first so God can help you through your prayers to make the supernatural happen
"When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said 'Let us pray.' We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land." Jomo Kenyatta.
Christianity was already in africa before the white europeans came....get some knowledge bro!!! .... How did islam enter africa?? And funny how ur name is jesus was a muslim.... U really dont want me to go there
The burden of proof is not a logical fallacy. 😂😂 Let me school you, In an argument or debate, the burden of proof is the obligation on the person making a claim to provide evidence and justification for their position. This principle is essential in logical reasoning and critical thinking to ensure that arguments are based on sound evidence and reasoning. The burden of proof is not a fallacy, but rather a fundamental principle in constructing and evaluating arguments.
Nelson you finish work for this video. I like your style of apologetics. When you try to explain something and they don't get it, you start sighting examples to drive your point home. You are a blessing to Christianity sir and every Christian clergy or laity should know what you know. I am deeply honoured on how you defended the faith. God bless you. I hope I can meet you so I can learn too.
It takes a lot of courage to be an atheist in NIgeria.
And insincerity too..
@@promisenyah8175insincerity- the quality of not expressing genuine feelings. What are the genuine feelings that atheists are suppressing?
@@eratrial insincerity is synonymous with dishonesty, and it takes a very dishonest Nigerian to base his/her argument on the non-existent of God on the insufficiency of empirical evidence and to conclude on the non-existent of the supernatural on the basis that there aren't enough empirical evidence to convince them otherwise..
They should try visiting Ijebu ode on a good day or maybe investigate the rumours on how money ritual work..
You just argue conclusively on things you haven't truly investigated..How convenient?
@@promisenyah8175 lol okay, I don’t have much knowledge about that and can’t argue further but definitely the countries with more religion are doing very badly in every way possible
@@promisenyah8175 nobody judges more than a Nigerian Christian
The fact that every Christian on the panel openly admits that even if there was incontrovertible evidence against their beliefs they would still believe, literally tells us everything we need to know
Ironically most atheist say the same thing. Safe to say its a human thing. Not an ideology thing. We're All sheep to a degree
@@lolivingston6827 they didn’t tho in this video
@@lolivingston6827how could there evidence against atheism though when all it is is rejecting the claim of their being any gods? You have to make it make sense
@@thaimperial97 And you dont see an issue with that? Atheisms entire argument is contrarian at best. Lol. You haven't even proven your own theories . Before we continue. You DO know Big Bang theory is not absolute? Before we continue. Do you acknowledge that? 🤔
@@thaimperial97they can’t make it make sense lol they’re insane
As a Christian and Nigerian, I am actually so impressed that atheists exist in this country, lol. There are too many people here that do not think to question their belief which they acquired from their parents, but choose to blindly assume it to be true.
Why are you still a Christian if you have this mentality
I acquired it from my parents and DID NOT BELIEVE. Then God came to me in my room.
When there are more educated people within a society, superstitions will decline and secularism will increase. People are leaving religion behind in droves and religious leaders are terrified. What a beautiful time to be alive.
@@JONQPiD❤
professing wisdom, they became fools@@JONQPiD
“When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said ‘Let us pray.’ We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land.”
― Jomo Kenyatta
👏
You need to understand that Christians are still humans
Pastors are still humans
All that happened is not because the people allowed it
After all there were kings and chiefs, people in authority
So as much as you want to say missionaries took our land and deceive us, the people in charge allowed it, which btw, are our fellow people
Africans believed the world was created by God before the arrival of the missionaries
So trash this quote
@@Wizzybytes sorry is this towards me?
@Wizzybites the African God and the missionary God aren't the same. Besides the point of the quote is that the foreigners played us.
All i know is Curiosity kills faith because the moment you start to question events in the bible or the bible itself, you might end up as an atheist.
I believe there's a creator but I don't subscribe to the Christian God, and it's funny how Christian tell us not to inquire or seek evidence but just believe whatever the Bible says, forgetting that the texts were authored and compiled by men... And we know what men (humans) can do.
@@olayinkamalik7643lies
That's a lie
Curiosity as a Muslim ignites my faith. Because the moment anything doesn't make sense to me. I'm trashing Islam. I'm not accepting it blindly and Islam having the highest converts presently. People are not Stupid
@@hassanabdulmalikodunayo2701 does your Quran have mistakes?
People like that pastor on suit are the reasons I left Christianity.
Dear Christians, saying something as a definitive statement and repeating it three times does not make it true. Show workings!
What about trying to really understand the word of God before being yourself on somebody else’s word ?
😂😂😂🙌🏼 "definitive statement"
Go read for yourself , Matthew Mark Luke and John don’t take anyone’s word for it ask God to reveal Himself to you just watch your eyes will be open
So your belief (not faith) was based on the word of man ?
@@Maniflore not in the beginning. But the men who were to feed a new babe the sincere milk of the word didn't do their jobs well. I'm in no way saying there isn't a authentic Christianity or there aren't authentic men of God... But when a new believer runs into the wrong ones, he ends up as me in a few months
Releasing on a Sunday is wild, I plaster for here 😂
Talk about cruise 😂😭
😂😂😂😂
So messy!🤭
😂😂😂😂💀💀😩
They always release on sunday dont they
JESUS 😭🤣. “Religion causes not only material poverty, but poverty of the imagination” 😭😭😭. Gagged
The guy spoke fact
No lol he spoke lies
No he spoke lies
True
Not true.
Religion is a preserver of the wealthy and the great..
The both parties really did a good job in this debate... I really like towards the end how open-minded the atheist were to compromised their position to switch to the other side if concrete evidence were presented unlike how close-minded the Christians were to not compromise if concrete evidence were presented which is a serious problem 😒🤦 in Africa...
And that is my take away from this discussion. They say the Bible says only a fool believes there is no God, but I honestly think only a fool does not change their mind even in the face of evidence.
@@gideontawiah4248 simple, one should never underestimate the power of self-delusion
When I was a believer it was a line I wouldn't cross. But now, I'm like how did I ever believe this stuff, lol.
@@gideontawiah4248 why so you so desperately want there to be evidence that God doesnt exist. Just live your life
@@chinedunnadi258 okay. Atheists think different and Christians think different. Cool?
The Christian guy in the vest is an Olympic gold medalist in mental gymnastics
The guys mental gymnastics is insane! He kept contradicting himself and shooting himself in the foot. 😭😭😂🤣💀
@@djbreezymillz ...and failed to provide concrete evidence buttressing his belief in the existence of God. These believers never ever provide hard facts, their belief in the existence of God is almost always based on their feelings, emotions and hormones. 😂
@@xydiploid6200 There can not be a creation without a creator, you see inanimate objects such as chairs they have a creator, so how are you going to tell me that I alongside the human race, with intelligence, free will and relative morals was not created by a creator, it is absolute bull.
Another one, do you think murder is right? If you do, then there's problem. You see this highlights the concept of objective good, which we know exists, and in turn proves that God exists, but If good were relative God wouldn't exist. But there is an objective good.
And, have you seen the marvel of engineering our beautiful planet and we that live on it are? I mean take a look at our DNA for example, you're trying to tell me that could have just happened randomly?
@@oyinkansolaeshoYTbut why does you’re god have to be the correct one? There are tons of different religions
@@iiloveemusic First of all, I was establishing the fact that God exists, now how do we know which one of the religions is correct about God?
Well take it like this there cannot be two truths, only one, so we first have to establish that only one can be right.
Now, this is all up to you, and which religion you choose to subscribe to/put your faith in, personally I'm Christian because the overwhelming archeological evidence, and written accounts by eyewitnesses and historical accuracy lead me to believe what I believe.
So you should do your proper research on what different books say about the Creator, and put your faith in whichever one you find the most convincing?
I hope this was helpful, and may the Lord be with you, in Jesus's name, Amen.
Nelson needs to be added to the Guinness world record the first man to change another person's genotype 😂
😂😂😂
Lol happened to my friend and happened to many other people
@@deniceevan3953 That's a blatant lie. Let him get his test results for us to see. We're not fools.
@@deniceevan3953right
@@deniceevan3953lies lies and lies
Being an atheist in Nigeria is not easy. I respect the atheists in this discussion for their boldness. Nigeria and Africa need some level of rational thinking at this point.
Atheists not equals to rational thinkers
I bet a good number of them are
@@Tech_for_Africa. I'd agree if you say agnostics. Definitely not atheists.
@@Gold-lv5ih You don't even know what an agnostic is
@@preciouse congratulations
I just knew this episode would be released on a Sunday😂. Thank you for having me, I truly enjoyed the conversation😊.
Create a video about it on your channel, it will increase your number
Brilliant discussion, am proud of my fellow Atheists in nigeria. Love from kenya 🇰🇪
Why would you be proud of people who believe the universe came from nothing or created itself it is completely illogical.
I’m from america but I’m proud of all atheists all over the world ✊🏾
to bad you didn't know that kenya is the garder of eden
Yes brother, I am an atheist
Thank you to all the atheist whose sole purpose is to challenge believers to be stronger in faith. The way my lord and savior Jesus Christ orchestrates is masterful🙏🏽
Prayer curing HIV is wild🤣🤣
😂😂😂😂 don’t mind d mumu.
There are many cases where it is actually happened … prayer is not the assured cure of HIV but people have been healed from it in the past with the power of prayer .
@@dudeof2436 That's simply not true. The gravity of this claim is being severely underestimated. If prayer could genuinely cure HIV, wouldn't it be a standard recommendation in hospitals? Or that too wont work cause its not gods plan??
@@dudeof2436 😂
@@dudeof2436Keep dreaming 😂😂😂
Serious credit to Cruise for the prompts. They were very very good prompts
I'm so pleased and encouraged at seeing fellow African non-believers. The confining affects of the "poverty of the imagination" that Bennet mentioned, is one of my biggest laments, so seeing others breaking free of that is so refreshing.
I'm St. Lucian, West Indies, I'm hated. It's a rarity to be a humanist/atheist in the Caribbean
@JonathanAuguste-oq7yb With me, I'm more pitied than hated. The Abrahamic religions are foreign to Africa, and with the exception of Ethiopia, was introduced by force through colonialism. It's sad to witness my fellow Afrians not challenge the indoctrination at all and even take it on as their African identity.
@@msaniitz5588 quite sad indeed to accept a belief system wholesale and disregard ancestral traditions
@@JonathanAuguste-oq7yb Agreed. The only thing that I would personally add is that we have to apply a critical eye to our ancestral traditions as well. There's a tendency to go the opposite route and over-romanticize things. There should continuously be an assessment of what's still working for us, what should be improved upon, and what should be discarded.
@@JonathanAuguste-oq7ybI'm Trinidadian and I feel the same. I thought when I went to university I would find more of us (even in a Caribbean country), but even still I was still a minority and they asked the same stupid questions and told me hurtful things when I said that I was an atheist. Relationships had almost ended when I said I was an atheist.
“It’s not hypothetical, it’s a reality”LMFAOO🤣
This man really came to play!!
Last prompt revealed who the bullshitters were in the first prompt🤭
This was such a beautiful episode. Thank you Cruise for having me❤
Nice one bro
You guys are smart.
Thanks Eric, I was surprised you were so public, I always knew you were an atheist, but regardless
Nice one Eric
Your reason for being an atheist is weak and some are so illogical
The Christians are presumably atheists to other gods. They very likely don't believe in zeus, thor or poseidon and all the other 5000 gods.
Some of us (the atheists) just go one god further.
This is so accurate 🙏🏾❤️
Reminds me Christopher Hitchens.
This is one of the best ways to put our pov into perspective, but I don’t think it holds up as an argument.
Nelson keeps saying "what you are saying is cute and great", which is a very cute and condescending way of saying "You are talking trash, and your opinion is not valid". That's very disrespectful in a debate. Plus, he's a pro in mental gymnastics.
Anyway, he's still the best apologetic on the show. The other two are just there to preach, not debate 😁
True he was the best others wamt to quote book that is irrelevant in this dem age
That one will become an atheist very soon
I agree. I do appreciate that Nelson went outside the "bible as proof" approach, but his repeated use of the word "cute" to describe the atheists' views was very patronizing and condescending. That was enough for me to lose a little respect.
Thank you, dude was arrogant and thinks he's so far above everyone.
But I also kind of like him at the same time, he looks like a Teddy Bear😂
Everybody there was very disrepectful so i dont get your point.
All non believers of any religion is brave. I tip my hat to all. Whether you are in a country of Islam, Christianity, or any religion. Yall are the real ones.
If you think the universe came from nothing or created itself you must be extremely deluded.
@@carbonsoul5121 ok so prove where the universe came from
@@kdogg8037 God
@@kdogg8037 No problem, through logical deduction the universe could not have come from nothing or created itself so it must have been created by something independent (Something that does not rely on anything else for its continued existence)
This is because if the universe came from something dependent like another prior universe that prior universe would have to come from somewhere as well and so on and so on ad infinitum leading to the absurdity of an infinite regress.
(universe is dependent because it consists of parts for instance all matter, space and time if you remove the parts you have nothing and the universe no longer exists just like if you remove all the atoms in a bottle the bottle would cease to exist so it depends on its parts for its continued existence making the universe and bottle dependent things)
In order for our universe to exist there would have to be an end to that chain of dependent things that is independent. An example of why this is, is that if you depend on someone to give you permission to throw the ball and that person who gives you permission requires someone else to give them permission to tell you to throw the ball going back to infinity you would never have permission to throw the ball to begin with. There has to be one part of that chain that does not depend on someone else to give them permission , therefore being independent, to give the command to throw the ball.
Now an independent entity that does not depend upon anything else for its continued existence but everything else relies upon it with the power to create the universe, and the knowledge since it was able to do so and has the will shown by the ability to choose when that universe was created (if there was no will or control over when the universe would be created and you just had the perfect conditions for the universe to exist it would have been eternal but it was created 13.77 billion years ago)
That is the definition of GOD.
Independent
All powerful
All Knowing
With a will
I hope that answers your question.
@@kdogg8037 No problem, through logical deduction the universe could not have come from nothing or created itself so it must have been created by something independent (Something that does not rely on anything else for its continued existence)
This is because if the universe came from something dependent like another prior universe that prior universe would have to come from somewhere as well and so on and so on ad infinitum leading to the absurdity of an infinite regress.
(universe is dependent because it consists of parts for instance all matter, space and time if you remove the parts you have nothing and the universe no longer exists just like if you remove all the atoms in a bottle the bottle would cease to exist so it depends on its parts for its continued existence making the universe and bottle dependent things)
In order for our universe to exist there would have to be an end to that chain of dependent things that is independent. An example of why this is, is that if you depend on someone to give you permission to throw the ball and that person who gives you permission requires someone else to give them permission to tell you to throw the ball going back to infinity you would never have permission to throw the ball to begin with. There has to be one part of that chain that does not depend on someone else to give them permission , therefore being independent, to give the command to throw the ball.
Now an independent entity that does not depend upon anything else for its continued existence but everything else relies upon it with the power to create the universe, and the knowledge since it was able to do so and has the will shown by the ability to choose when that universe was created (if there was no will or control over when the universe would be created and you just had the perfect conditions for the universe to exist it would have been eternal but it was created 13.77 billion years ago)
That is the definition of GOD.
Independent
All powerful
All Knowing
With a will
I hope that answers your question.
I don’t see how a human can seriously look at this earth and not acknowledge that it was constructed by a supernatural Being
Honestly, it feels good to see other African atheists. Being an African atheist can be an alienating experience, as Africans broadly speaking are deeply religious.
Nelson here! Absolutely enjoyed the conversation!
It was a rare previledge to represent Christians i hope i did us proud! Love you all even you atheists you'll join us loving our "sky daddy" soon 😊
We are Praying for you all.
You did well my Brother! You're academically and spiritually sound!!
The Lord will continually strengthen you in Jesus name
@@davidade539 Amen!!! Thank youuu
Well done Nelson! I pray God continues to strengthen you
Nelson's argument is fundamentally flawed and deeply misleading. He claims that the uniqueness of Earth as a life-supporting planet is evidence of some divine design, yet he overlooks the vast expanse of the cosmos teeming with lifeless worlds. There are millions, if not billions, of planets without any form of life, including seven in our very own solar system. To suggest that Earth is perfectly placed for life simply because life exists here is to misinterpret causality-a concept Nelson frequently referenced. Life emerged on Earth because it had the right conditions; it wasn’t that Earth was preordained to host life.
Nelson's misuse of Occam's razor further weakens his argument. He also placed undue emphasis on eyewitness testimony, which is scientifically known to be one of the least reliable forms of evidence. Human memory is fallible, and our brains are prone to errors and biases, even without considering mental illnesses. If we believed everything we saw without question, we’d be fooled by every magic trick and unable to recount events accurately even a day later.
The atheists in the discussion, albeit seemingly overwhelmed by Nelson’s confident demeanor, held their ground admirably. Their stance represents a gradual but significant shift towards overcoming the intellectual stagnation that has long plagued regions like Nigeria. Slowly but surely, we are chipping away at the poverty of imagination, replacing it with a more enlightened and rational understanding of our universe.
Nelson you finish work for this video. I like your style of apologetics. When you try to explain something and they don't get it, you start sighting examples to drive your point home. You are a blessing to Christianity sir and every Christian clergy or laity should know what you know. I am deeply honoured on how you defended the faith. God bless you. I hope I can meet you so I can learn too.
This is the best Cruise episode I've watched. As a person currently reassessing my faith and really having indepth readings of Scripture, I can say I appreciate, most of all, the atheists for their honesty and tolerance, even though they didn't quite have enough science and philosophy to refute the textbook-style concepts the “jacket guy” was arbitrarily bringing up.
About whether one would believe in God should irrefutable evidence come, thankfully, the “lady atheist” puts it the way I would: which god? There are hundreds of them across the planet. If it happened to be the Christian god, after all the atrocities he's committed in the Bible, I would never switch sides even if he appeared to me. Yes, I could believe in his existence, but follow him? Never.
Please, Cruise, keep bringing more people who understand whatever topics they're discussing to the show. Really proud of you guys.
(PS. I'm sorry for not using their names; I tend to forget things quickly. 😢)
This was deep!!!
Honestly, I feel like they really didn't mean that answer on "would you switch sides" because all their answers before that point contradicted their statement. Especially when they were outlining negative effects of Christianity. I doubt if they'd still want to follow the religion since they have a negative view on it regardless of if God is real or not. It seemed like it was a way to butress their point of "we are openminded" while not actually meaning it cus if they did they'll probably be agnostic not aethists and be like "we haven't seen evidence so we don't know but if we do see, we would believe in Him.
It's fundamentally a heart matter imo. Even when Jesus was alive, many desired a sign but He said "no sign will be given to you". Many people even some aethists acknowledge something beyond our imagination is out there but many do not accept it as God, why? because of what it entails... Actually following him and putting away our fleshly desires. Many of them believe in Aliens or "Spiritual Energy" but for some reason when it comes to God they begin to raise eyebrows when the evidence for the latter supercedes the others. It's a heart matter cus those other idealogies do not include giving your lives totally to it. Despite the evidence put out it will still be classed as "not enough" as their hearts aren't' ready to receive Him.
@@mobijaymusicFair enough. But I don't think you should speak for them. Agnostism doubts the idea of a god; atheism says there isn't. What's their primary basis? A lack of evidence. I don't think atheism, for all its worth, has anything to do with openmindedness. Some people can be atheist and quite “conservative”. But if openmindedness was such a progressivist thing to have, why didn't the Christians say they'd switch sides? Because they didn't want to lie, perhaps, and by admitting they might switch sides, the atheists are lying?
Amazing comment 🙌🏿🙌🏿. This is exactly how I feel o.
I'm not worshipping a "perfect" that was massacring people anyhow in the bible. Fuck him for what he did to Job
@@mobijaymusic I guess you’re right as to whether they would want to follow religion if God appeared to them and there was undeniable proof of his existence. And that’s the argument no Christian or religious person if given undeniable proof of their God not existing they won’t believe it. They’ll believe they’re being duped. I think most of these guys are agnostic because their disbelief is due to there being no tangible proof of the existence of god. But the truth is the same in the other way there’s no tangible proof that a god doesn’t exist. There are some wonders in the universe and the world that does cause one to ponder on how all this came to be I see religion as providing one potential narrative and one that quite often contradicts itself not only in terms of the books themselves but also the proponents of such beliefs. I used to be a Christian evangelised preached learnt apologetics was even learning Hebrew and Greek. Maybe you could say I saw it as an academic exercise I disagree I wholeheartedly believed what I did until I didn’t. And to be honest I’m way more moral and truthful now as an agnostic then as a believer. I want no harm for my fellow man in fact I want everyone to do well regardless of what they believe. However when I was a believer I only wanted fellow believers to do well there was a very them v us the chosen ‘enlightened’ ones. Anywho my two pence.
Nelson was just trying to jump hoops. He wasn’t open minded about the convo. It’s meant to be an argument. Also he made some scientific statements that were totally false. He is lucky that no one on the opposing side is much of a science talker. I personally would have made him look like a joker with simple reference searches
Can u debunk what he said??..giving the right science facts or theory that disproves the theory of casualty in question
Exactly! He was just bringing out arbitrary things, what my professor would call-pardon my language-“impressive nonsense”.
The Newton was a Christian claim for example, that many Christians love to hold on to, would fall face down if one understood enough history to go with it. Do people know there was a time when it was suicidal to be anything but Christian in Europe?
@@Ashley-ur1ey firstly you don't even need to disprove anything, it's a theory not a law, so in science sef, e no hold
My exact thought when he said that. It was a death sentence to even doubt the existence of God@OlaWHalim
@@adebesinjacob8311you don’t know what a theory means in science
A theory is a solid as it gets, it means it’s been tested and has very solid proof. It’s just a word used to classify new areas of study. Theory is just “the study of”
What you’re thinking about is called a hypothesis
"I've seen genotypes change". Ei 😂💔..It is scientifically impossible for genotypes to change from SS to AS. As a medical laboratory scientist, I've seen too many couples ignore medical advice and follow pastors who claim prayer can change their genotypes. Unfortunately, these couples often end up having children with sickle cell disease, who suffer from endless pain and face the risk of premature death. Please, if you have incompatible genotypes, seek proper genetic counseling and make informed decisions. Relying on unsupported claims can lead to a lot of unnecessary heartache and suffering.
You have spoken well but let me tell you I'm a witness my own has, and i also have seen HIV healed many times.
Nelson is the CEO of yapping. He has a PhD in yapology.
Oyindamola is a smart queen and I love her
Regular Christian Apologetics😅.
@@boyonpc5499If I was still living in Nigeria, I would have applied. The atheists did well, but I think they would have switched off my mic 😂
Where do you live? We might be coming to a city near you soon 👌🏾
@@jointhecruiseLondon
Chill, both sides argued well. And TBH, Nelson was the most logical, factual, coherent Christian there. He made his points & brought his facts well. The only thing he said that I knew was cap was that part of his prayer healing cancer and changing genotype. But, apart from that, he is probably one of the most intelligent, realistic, & least delusional Christians I have seen. Christians don't argue reasonably like him (Especially Nigerian Christians)
I'm glad we are having this discussion. To me it's a sign of Africa waking up from religious dogmas that will eventually take us away from European imperialism.
You just so uninformed!!
Go and study history well before you speak !!
Christianity was present in Africa before missionaries arrived. There are records of Christian communities and individuals in Africa dating back to the early centuries of the Christian era. These early Christian communities were largely in regions such as Egypt, Ethiopia, and Nubia. The Christianization of Africa is believed to have begun as early as the first century AD, with the introduction of Christianity through trade routes and migrations.
And a simple question for you.... You use words that you have no undrrstanding of.... Are you an atheist??
Listening to this on my AirPods, having a meal at a restaurant, watching the 2nd half of the Portugal vs Slovenia
That sounds divine😅
nice!
What I want to know is what communities do we have to support each other as atheists, cause it's lonely out here
Swears brother
Like Saint Augustine said; 'you have created us oh Lord and our hearts are restless until they rest on you'.
It's sure is man😢
Twitter
@@josephjohn907 my experience of Twitter in that regard is usually argumentative, which I'm not interested in. Maybe I should put in more effort though
I’m Christian but they shouldn’t have called a pastor. He will only revert to the Bible and can’t use the argument of objectivity morality or the argument of cause and effect
"Prayer has healed people with HIV/AIDS" yea that told me everything I need to know😂
It has happened and it those happen.
Hey Christians, here's a little something to reconsider and ponder over.
1) The creation of the bible (a religious text) by man.
2) Being born into a religious family.
3) The indoctrination into Christianity from an early age.
Now, take all that away and honestly (with all emotions aside) ask yourselves this question: "If it weren't for the above factors, would I have believed in the existence of God and become a Christian?"
Let me address each of your items:
1. The Bible has existed for thousands of years. What we see now is a compilation of multiple manuscripts by dedicated historians, some who were there to see these things happen. Multiple discoveries have shown time line correlations and places identified to corroborate what is in the Bible. So taking that away denies evidence gathering. So that's a moot point.
2. Okay yeah, being born into religion has a part to play. But what do you say about the millions of Christians now who were born into atheist families or non Christian religions? Isn't that a case for the fact that they experienced something that brought them into the faith? Many non-theistic scientists have found faith in their trying to prove the non-existence of a God, so why does that happen?
3. The same as above, but let me take it a step further. The indoctrination should keep people who grew up in Christian homes from becoming atheist.... If the indoctrination is that strong... But people stay in the faith because they also experience God for themselves.
So the answer for me is I can't say for sure for everyone, but if my personal experiences have been anything to go by, yes, I'd believe in God and His existence. And... I think you can too. You can (even if not convinced), ask God to reveal Himself to you. He's ever ready to welcome you. I can't wait to hear your testimony.
Let me add something to that list. 4. Colonization and importation of religion "Christianity " by Europeans. If not most Nigeriams will still be worshipping our traditional gods.
@@oluwatobifaniyi interesting fact, Christianity was in Africa, long before there was any colonization. Christianity was bound to come here anyway. Islam had already entered a huge chunk of Northern Africa as well. The revolutions were progressing. Also, this also shows that atheism is not in our nature because humans are always looking for God. And whether we did that using our own traditional knowledge, we always identified that there was something missing and we sought for it. Ethiopia was never colonized and they had some of the earliest Christians. Israel in the Middle East was a Jewish community but they also had the first Christians. The “Europeans” didn’t invent Christianity. They don’t even purport to be the source of it (which they could easily have colonized like everywhere else). Does that lead you to admit that maybe there’s something there, something beyond human comprehension that has a life its own that makes Christianity, no matter how many times people have tried to snuff it out, it has grown even stronger? You sef think am now.
You wise...I love your response.I will rather die a believer than die as an unbeliver.@TheLexash
@yahushasdaughter9106 LOL, of course you will. It's difficult for the vast majority of people to question their own strongly held beliefs because their world will shatter. It takes a lot of courage to confront your own beliefs and annalyse it logically and address it
1 hr is not enough for this conversation. The atheists represented us well
Lol
Haha! My thoughts exactly
They're all very smart. Nelson was just yapping nonsense all through.
Did u Search for: Louis Pasteur and Tomasso d'Aquino ??
Yes, they did
Never seen an amputees leg grow back from prayer, seems like it only works on cancer.
Just because you have a handicap doesn't mean God doesn't have a calling for you, we all aren't born the same, God uses is us in ways beyond our understanding.
All the supernatural healing happened when we weren't around to witness it without own eyes 🤔
Very thought provoking video, Nigerian need to see this, religion has really fucked us up
Christianity has really fucked up our mind
Nigerians will watch and say “God forbid” as everything goes inside one ear and out of the other. There’s no saving us.
@@tosinolorunsola711 Maybe I'm not Nigerian then.
@@israelbajulaye1491 Religion has not fucked up Nigeria. The issue is the system and how people want to avail themselves of it without building nothing for the next generations. Religion teaches you not to be selfish but if Nigerians show themselves to be selfish, where’s the fault of religion in that?
@@BroJo676 Religion doesn’t teach anything it just list requirements you must follow in order to claim the religion. Humans know that we can’t be selfish because it would put humanity in danger not because of a god, heaven, or a hell. Focusing your time on meeting religious requirements means that you’re neglecting human nature, common sense, and science which some people don’t mind because it’s easier to rely on spirituality than to put in the work to figure out why and how something is happening (aka taking responsibility and accountability). In terms of a humanitarian crisis or corruption, the solution to these issues often includes elements that go against the religion. Human nature and science has always came first but religion likes to regurgitate some points to make an ideology seem more believable. Society looks down upon actions like stealing, murder, and SA because humans have collectively shown a consistent pattern of disapproval when these things happen. It has nothing to do with god or the devil.
Basically, God exists because this guy said so
What guy?
@Ytulipss that's the point. We dont even know the origin like we dont know the "guy", we just heard from this guy, who claims to have heard from that guy and hence a book (the bible) was created...that's what the original comment meant I think.
@@justanotherhuman5162 I’m sorry but you’re not making any sense…the original comment knows the guy he’s talking about and I’ll like to know too.
Hmm the atheist guy sorry to say became very silly at end part where he says ‘we have given you evidence that God doesn’t exist, it doesn’t matter how.’ But when it comes to Christians he wants how.
Honestly this is one of the sound arguments to be made but I wish they could sit down and watch themselves in the video and I’m hoping they’ll see how Nelson has given a sound and logical reasoning.
At least sitting down to watch again would give them time to really analyze what Nelson said
@Ytulipss I was referring to the guy in the video with the green vest. I was talking about his "uncaused causor" argument. Basically, God is real because he said something about there having to be an uncaused causor even though nothing really points to such. Even what @justanotherhuman5162 said, I agree with that too.
My grandma lied about having cancer to lie about how she was cured of it through her prayers and the prayers of the people in her catholic community. She never had cancer but still swears by it to this day lol and sometimes I wonder how many people in her community really believe she had it and not only that, but that god cured her! There is no medical evidence she had cancer but she claims she was touched by god and healed. When I hear people say that their prayers healed someone, I always think about my grandma and assume that others are lying about miracles because they are so abused mentally that they need something to tell them they are special and gods favorite to not die of suicide. I feel bad for the people that are “true believers” because those people don’t trust their own experience due to all their abuse.
Finally, Africans are waking up and leaving religion. I'm happy to see this.
Me too
@tinkrr26let them be open-minded and live in a free world
@tinkrr26 wake up from lies
@@HungryBen-d7y it's a welcome development
@tinkrr26 no thank you
This is real sad. These Christians are so afraid to think, they can't even engage in an hypothetical situation.
Generalizing all Christians based on the select 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% show on camera doesn't seem valid
@@Mali-jw6im nope, it's almost 100% of Christians. Christians are defined by fear.
@@Mali-jw6im nah it's pretty accurate that representation.
@@salserokorsou the bible literally teaches us to question our faith, so I don't think so
@@Mali-jw6im
Proverbs 3:5-6 New King James Version (NKJV)
Trust in the LORD with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him, And He shall direct your paths.
So you were saying...?
It’s beautiful seeing people waking up from religious delulu ❤️❤️❤️
Jesus He’s the way. He made us in His image and He loves you. God bless
@@Chosen17Abro just started preaching 🤣
How is being religious delusional? If I said lack of religion was delusional, so many people would be angry.
Even if God exists, why is Christianity the true religion? What about the other thousands of religions that has existed?
If all these different religions are claiming to have a specific god, who is the creator of everything or different gods created one thing specifically, then these religions can’t all be true, they contradict each other.
The God of Israel specifically states that he is the only true God and all the other gods do not have the power he has. Which he has proven many times, through history and to people living today, like myself.
@@Rose-xs5frIt's an easy argument to respond to. Just talk about the outcomes of Christianity versus other religions. The positive impacts that Christian ethics has on the world. No one can deny that.
@@Emmanuel_EEEThere are many other religions that have positive impacts on the world. Just look at Buddhism or Hinduism. Your argument doesn't make Christianity unique...do you really think that Christianity is the only religion with moral ethics?
@@Emmanuel_EEE “Some say Christianity has borrowed elements from other religions, including paganism, mystery religions, and other Mediterranean religions:
Paganism
Early Christians adopted many aspects of pagan funeral rituals into their culture and customs.
Mystery religions
Some say Christianity borrowed beliefs from ancient polytheistic mystery religions that originated in Egypt, Greece, Asia Minor, and Iran/Syria.
Mediterranean religions
Some scholars have compared the stories of Jesus's birth and resurrection to those of other divine or heroic figures from the Mediterranean, such as "dying-and-rising gods" like Tammuz, Adonis, Attis, and Osiris. However, others say that these similarities are more likely due to a shared cultural environment. “
@@cemantical 1.Could you provided the positive impacts that both of those religions brought to the world?
2. Christianity morality system is vastly different from other religions. Love your neighbors as yourself, love your enemies, protect the weak. There are many more. Didn't say that Christianity is the only religion with a moral ethics, it's just better than the others.
Nelson did so many logical fallacy's it's insane 😂
How ? Which part?
It's crazy. So many of them. He is obviously using the apologetics way which is quite disingenuous. His aggression and everything is just to overshadow their opponents as a debate tactics
@@JosephMartey-zs2qk His faith and reason argument, he merged cosmological and teleological argument to point to God and misrepresented science in many ways. He appealed to authority talking about big scientists being Religious. Science does not point to a creator, it actually leans away from it. You can easily tell how he gets disingenuous in his presentation
@@JosephMartey-zs2qk he was constantly making strawmans out of his oppositions arguments, shifting the burden of proof, constantly appealing to authority and appealing to ignorance
There’s thousands, if not more, of debates on UA-cam about the existence of god. If he existed and he cared, he could end these debates by showing up to one of them. Right now the average Christian reading this is thinking that it’s arrogant of me to expect god to show up for a debate to prove himself. Meanwhile they didn’t blink an eye when they read the story in the Bible where god showed up to prove himself in a competition versus the Canaanite god Baal.
Say it louder for the ppl in the back👏👏
God is not our tv who shows up when we command. How arrogant. We are the ones who love by his laws and will. It is his universe that we live in. It is he who allows us to draw another breath as we curse his name.
@@JesusisliterallyHim you just proved his point
@@tz9422 I stand by what I said. The Bible says if you seek me you will find me. You don’t NEED him to do anymore extravagant miracles to believe. It’s just like the Jewish leaders of the gospels Jesus was doing stuff left, right and centre but they never believed. You don’t want to believe in God fine but don’t treat him like some toy that bends to your will. 🫡
@@JesusisliterallyHimThis argument makes no sense. God supposedly loves everyone an infinite amount why would he not want to do this? The amount of people he would save from hell would number in the billions surely. Not to mention the fact that it would literally be infinitely easy for him to do so, being omnipotent and all. Even if you want to say something like “he doesn’t want to because free will” or something along those lines, knowing for a fact that the God exists doesn’t preclude you from going against him still. According to the Bible that’s what we do anyway
That christian arguing about the big bang theory as if the bible didn't say that Adam and eve was the first human to be created and also agreeing with the scientific evolution 😂😂 how can you contradict your self like that
Delulu is the solulu
There is a reason why it is called the big band theory … because it can’t be proven , it is just a theory. Also the Bible doesn’t not necessarily disprove the Big Bang. You are talking about two things different, the start of human and the start of the universe . Now I don’t believe in evolution but there are some Christians who actually do and their argument does not disprove the Bible . Maybe you need to do some research before commenting …
@@dudeof2436 lol. Gravity is a theory. Does that mean it’s not true? Plate tectonic movement is a theory does that mean it’s not true? Theory is the highest level an hypothesis can reach in science. When something gets to a point of theory that means it’s true. It can only be improved upon not completely tossed aside.
@@News_n_Dine the Big Bang theory as a theory is not verifiable as the others you just point out. So we can’t be sure what exactly happened billions of years . The big band theory only argues the expansion of the universe would in the earlier state. But again I don’t mind if it truly happened or not, my argument is that it doesn’t contradict the Bible even if it really happened. Atheist love to use it as some kind of gotcha moment to Christians. Also it is ironic when you found out who came up with the Big Bang theory in the first place .
@@News_n_Dine the Big Bang theory is not verifiable as the other you mentioned. Scientist only agree that the universe rapidly expand 13 billions years ago . And even if it truly happened , it doesn’t contradict the Bible or disprove the existence of God. Atheist love to use it like a gotcha moment for believers. Also it is ironic when you find out about the person who came with the Big Bang theory in the first place .
I'm really itching to be a part of this debate as an atheist. Nelson was just making so many claims that are very very inconsistent with his model. Occam's razor even goes against the concept of a God. The simplest explanation cannot be a God who is far complex than the universe itself. The atheists did well tho, Bennet the software engineer and I'm a software engineer as well
why would you assume god or a creator is only complex? God would be both simple and complex at the same time, technically.
Edit: But I do agree Occam razor use here made no sense lol.
@@phil_left8842 Even if we grant that he's simple and complex which is obviously paradoxical, the complexity of it is paramount in the context of an occam's razor.
But how do you think God can be simple and complex?
@@boyonpc5499 Its not paradoxical. humans are simple and complex at the same time. Are we not? A creator may be similar just on a grand scale. I mean creating a universe sounds complex but I dunno I aint make it. Shit could be as easy as putting together a desktop pc which my pops still thinks is like rocket science lol.
@@phil_left8842 So what we're doing right now is speaking different languages. I'm speaking from a scientific or empirical sense. An explanation is simple when it's the closest empirical solution and makes accurate predictions. A god hypothesis, is way too complex to explain cos how do you explain a being as such
@@boyonpc5499 u cant use science or empirical data to explain a creator only breakdown the world created. Which leads back to ppl not believe in a creator lol.
Not a lot of people talking about the incredibly dangerous claim that HIV can be cured. No one should ever be saying irresponsible things like that.
What is your thoughts based on. You have not seen anything. I have seen HIV cured. What do u have to say abt that?
@@Weminan Thoughts are based on the biology of HIV infection and transmission. I don't care what you have seen, if you re-test "cured HIV" folks, you'll find evidence suggesting the contrary (i.e. a viral load and/or reduced CD4 counts).
Please stop. There's literally no reason to claim false statements like that. It doesn't help you at all, and it certainly doesn't help the vulnerable HIV/AIDS patient population.
@@WeminanYes and yesterday I saw a pig fly. What do you have to say about that? Can you disprove I saw what I saw? I'm 100% sure I saw a pig fly yesterday, anyone who says otherwise is foolish!
@@cemantical No way I saw that pig too. Heard a lot of people talking about it so I was thinking I should write a book about it
@@Weminan Really not sure why my other response to your comment isn't showing up, but whatever. I'm happy to repost it again.
---
My thoughts are based on the basics of HIV infection and transmission. And, no. You haven't seen HIV cured. If you test any of these "cured HIV" folks, you'll find evidence to the contrary (i.e. a viral load and/or reduced CD4+ counts). And if you don't? Guess what, it's very likely that they were never positive in the first place.
Please stop. There is no reason for you to be making ridiculous claims like "I have seen HIV cured." It does not help you, and it sure as hell does not help the vulnerable HIV/AIDS population out there.
CHRISTIANS VS MUSLIMS,CHRISTIANS VS TRADITIONALISTS,CHRISTIANS VS ATHEISTS….And you want to tell me CHRISTIANITY isn’t the One True Faith😂😂😂
love this comment
Based on the topics selected by the channel? Well, sounds like religious reasoning to me😅 smh
They are potentially the most delusional 😂
What kind of backward reasoning is that
Because Christian are more Unsensible😂😂😂
I mean, what Nelson said about the Big Bang Theory isn't accurate. It's not described as an infinite number of big bangs. It's more of a constant, rapid expansion. It's a premise that the universe has been expanding and continues to expand. In fact, many scientists have acknowledged the term "Big Bang" is a misnomer. Also, there's no conclusion about what caused the Big Bang either. That is recognized to be unknown.
This episode, as well as the other episode where we had Christians vs Muslims, have made me believe that a lot of our pastors are not trained for the job. They just pick their Bible, say they're called, and start preaching. No training at all.
Maybe there should be some regulation in the Christian religious circle. Same way you can't do surgery without a licence, you can't start a church without a licence. You'd get trained from a reputable theological seminary and all. I'm all for it.
Any pay taxes too. That would be great.
It’s difficult to hold a standard to know stories that are likely fictional anyway.
@@joemiller7082 Keep being a clown in the comment sections bud
I agree. A lot of them know nothing about apologetics and are not trained in debates. That can't even the cross examination which is the most important part arguably. But thankfully we have great people like trent horn and james white to represent our faith. I mean james white has had over 180 debates and is an author of ten books. He represents us very well.
Most pastors from the penticostal churches just go to Bible School then start running a church, if you want a real argument with a pastor invite either a Catholic, Anglican or a Methodist priest, they have the real theological knowledge
the people who leave religion are people who have gone in deep with questions but got no answer so decided to switch after sometime people will start asking questions
That doesn't mean they are right😂😂
I would also genuinely like to know from the religious camp why the disease that are miraculous healed are usually internal viral diseases or cancers, but no one has successfully seen an amputee regain their limbs. Is there Limitation or preference to the healing process?
Lol. An amputee regaining a lost limb instantly in church is something that could even convert millions of unbelievers all around the world in just few days. But no pastor ever attempts such. I wonder why. 🤔
"500 people saw him". Yet Christians don't realize not a single person wrote about it. Think about that.
So, where did you read it from?
@@Joecloudjosh I think his point is that no laymen wrote about it. It's always someone who was either a disciple or prophet or a political figure of the time and not necessarily a farmer who just wanted to grow his crops afterwards. No accounts from the people he healed but accounts from people who supposedly witnessed the healing.
That's what I think he means.
@@lindamalote1719 Well, they actually did, but their own accounts of the events probably didn't get very widely read ( of course not every book written will be read by the whole world or be preserved for ages).
If you read the Bible, you'll see Luke writing in Luke 1:1-4, and affirming that many people have written about the things that happened both leading to the birth of Christ and his time on earth. That was in fact his reason for giving his own account to Theophilus, after he had read and understood what happened from different accounts.
I believe that the Bible we read today has been Divinely preserved so that the message would get to us.
That last prompt is wild because Pascals Wager is gonna finish the Christians 😭😂
Edit: I knew it lmao they’re too afraid to even fathom a hypothetical
I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure some of the atheists in this video might actually be agnostic, which made the dialogs confusing at some points!
I thought this too! The guy in the pink shirt seems agnostic to me
😊
you can be both agnostic and and atheist. agnostism is about knowledge, atheism is about belief. most "atheists" are actually agnostic atheist. that is, they don't know is there is a God, but don't believe one exists because of lack of evidence.
Scientist vs Flat earthers next video.
I trust Cruise. They'll find flat earthers
I'm in between. I don't believe we have the full gist on the actual shape of the earth. I mean if you don't believe the Bible, then why should I believe anything else that I can never verify? How many people in this life will ever see an actual spaceship, talk more of actually going to space? I don't think 5% of NASA staff even have that experience, talkless of me and you 😂😂. Just know there's a possibility of fowl play, it's not like these people are our friends. The same way religion deceives us, science can also be deceitful: just look at the men who champion certain things, why would I trust Elon Musk and Bill Gates 🤷🏾♀️🤷🏾♀️
@@tamiausten873
Well if you don't believe the earth is round, then what do you believe in? Because you have some explaining to do, especially when it comes to astronomical events and a whole lot more and well it is possible to see space ships being launched, it's just that Nigeria isn't a country that invests in the space sciences. Just because you don't understand the inner workings of space doesn't necessarily mean that it's fowl play, you just haven't done your research to fully understand, the evidence is there you can even go to NASA page to see livestreams of people actually working on satellites in space but then again I think you would say because you can't verify it but ok :) science does not claim to be the absolute truth because if science is wrong science will say so and Science isn't believing in people and you can't decieve people in science be it Elon musk or Bill gates because the sciences isn't left for those people alone, it's left for everyone and anyone, everyone could verify on their own a new scientific research, the maths is there, the equations are there, the entire world so why would we need those people to be sure of science
@tamiausten873 what does anyone gain by lying about the shape of the earth. What benefits does a flat earth have
@@tamiausten873Well if you don't believe the earth is round, then what do you believe in? Because you have some explaining to do, especially when it comes to astronomical events and a whole lot more and well it is possible to see space ships being launched, it's just that Nigeria isn't a country that invests in the space sciences. Just because you don't understand the inner workings of space doesn't necessarily mean that it's fowl play, you just haven't done your research to fully understand, the evidence is there you can even go to NASA page to see livestreams of people actually working on satellites in space but then again I think you would say because you can't verify it but ok :) science does not claims to be the absolute truth because if science is wrong science will say so and Science isn't believing in people and you can't decieve people in science be it Elon musk or Bill gates because the sciences isn't left for those people alone, it's left for everyone and anyone,everyone could verify on their own a new scientific research, the maths is there, the equations are there, the entire world so why would we need those people to be sure of things we can verify ourselves.
@@blackbeauty5817 Oh, you have no freaking idea. The earth is a plane i.e., flat - with a dome cover (sky) to create an ENCLOSED SYSTEM.
Life can only be supported, nurtured and sustained in an enclosed system.
I'm an agnostic nigerian, i always knew so much was wrong with the belief but what drove me to stay was the community, lack of other atheists , and the fear of Satan that is heavily pushed on kids.
It took me leaving the country to be able to question the belief and explore other option. It's horrible that Nigerians would treat you horribly or even harass you for not believing what they do when it's not even set in stone.
Lie. I went to a Christian school with two muslims in my class. Not for a single day were they bullied for having different beliefs to the whole school. They were treated like anyone else.
Christianity also spread very peacefully. Contrary to religions like the one based on the qu'ran which spread exclusively through wars and violence.
Christians are very welcoming and lukewarm in faith, you are just being obtuse if you say otherwise.
i too have this same problem I'm agnostic but forced to stay cus some part of me is still terrified of hell fire 😂
That does not affect christianity in any way
i find something common about all religion and religious beliefs, they are all want you to give all yourselfs and time but the rewards is so far fetched that you cant get the reward until you are dead, in christianity and other abrahamic faith is it heaven or AL Janaa and the threats also is you refuse to belief is hell fire, when you begin to question the books you become a threat
I was a debator I did Forensics and I did Model UN and the Christian's guy with the vest had nothing but logical fallacies, appealing to authority and because jumping through hoops to run from having an argument.
how? prove it
@@ultimatefightcrossover7306Waht are you saying. Do you understand English. What he said was a statement. Not an argument pointer.
@@timileyinolalerea.t.o.m3263 seems it's you who doesn't understand English. He pointed out and I asked him to prove it statement or not he disagrees with what the man said so he needs to give reasonable points why he thinks those were fallacies.unless he proves why he thinks what the dude said were fallacies he's also not making any concrete points other than trying to attack the dude and that's ad hominem fallacy. Please read with understanding next time.
@@ultimatefightcrossover7306😂😂😂You're just throwing philosophical words around. That wasn't an ad homenem fallacy rather what is, is what he was pointing out to. Without using the word itself
@@felixamadi2237 really? It wasnt? 🤣🤣 you don't know what ad hominem means
Good debate but it would be interesting to get perspectives from theists who aren't necessarily Christians. This way get more diverse arguments for the existence of God that don't center on the Bible as their basis.
This kinda felt like a 3 on 1 handicapped match 😂
Apostle and Ada did not come to debate with anyone 🤣🤣 free them please
That big dude was the only apologetic. It seems like in a debate the only one who has relevance of being is there is the apologetic cause they will try to use scientific arguments
The rest are just preachers😭
Shout out to all atheists in Africa!
You have no idea how much j have been waiting for this particular content❤
Nigerian “Apostle”. I go die from laughing.
These people are funny defending a god that “wants so badly” to have a relationship with his creation that he created us with an ability to reason and this ability to reason would then be our downfall driving us further away? what? …?
..nonsense
My favorite part was 49:56 🤣
The moment that Nelson guy said 'the bible is one of the most logical books to be' ... that was where i knew he would most likely say nonsense all through....
How convenient for you to display your disagreement with a concrete point in such a way 😂😂
Likeeeeee 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Christians steady scoring own goals
So with amount of prayerful Christians and powerful men of God in Nigeria
Why is Nigeria still like this
Why are things this way??
That is my point why is nigeria like this
Nelson talked about Occam’s Razor and how the simplest argument is the only one that should be considered (20:51). That is not what Occam’s razor says. It says that you should consider the simplest explanation FIRST and then that is a starting point to build up to the reality of what happened.
The guy was just misquoting science throughout, it’s a pity nobody there was strong enough in science to tackle him
I blame the organizers, if they could bring a pastor for the Christians why not bring a scientist for the atheists?
It’s not even really that. Occam’s razor tells us that the best answer is the one that makes the fewest assumptions.
@brightobesi5982 facts bruv, there are so many problems I caught and the confidence in the way he said his wrong statements was impressive 😂😂😂
@@Darkenergy104 that’s the thing with most religious people, pastors and even scammers. 20% facts, 80% confidence
Are you familiar with Terrence Howard or Billy Carson?
@@Fxckkitt 😂😂😂 perfect example, those two being on JRE just yapping about things they know nothing about
Oyindamola Adeniyis Opening statement is on point❤❤❤
Prayer is a form of self hypnosis. Or the power of being an optimist.
It's a coping mechanism.
Prove it
Bringing in a pastor and leaving out tradditional believers and muslim to help tell this fellows that God truely exist made it a discussion of Atheism and Christianity.
That's literally the title of the video 🌚🤷🏽♂️
Love this, and just like Ada said i believe personal experiences helped many of us grow stronger and God is never afraid of our questions.
And the part where Ada said, telling God to prove himself in our lives, I can attest to that not just once but the truth now is that the first time it happened i tried to prove in every way possible to myself that it just happened like that which is what i am sure many people do.
You ask/ believe God for something, he does it but after it happens you now feel life just just happened that it wasn't God! Don't be like that 😅
And to Mr Nelson, thank you very much, I grabbed a lot though that last part 😅, its understandable sha
And to Mr Bennet, you did well
with questioning and reasoning
"Whether we like it or not God Exists" Wow
I'm happy that West Africans are beginning to break away from this religion that was brought to us in the 14th century by Europeans.
Nelson was so on point. Everything he was saying was point and went over peoples head. It was good to hear him defend his points. I really enjoyed listening to him.
Azzinnn. It was going over their heads even most of the commentors on this section
@@Geniuswhay yea ik. It’s amazing. And they say the atheist young lady was the smartest. I don’t think so I think the man with the braids was the most insightful atheist until he said “I think religion is for people in poverty”.
@@tidianesimpson I agree. She wasn't saying anything deep. Just doubling down on why she made a great decision to be atheist. I could feel the frustration in the voice of Nelson. They had disagreed before he even spoke
@@Geniuswhay yes I find all the atheist stories compelling because they never became atheist from evidence showing God doesn’t exist. They became atheist because they relied on people. It’s sad to see. But to be fair Christian don’t to a good job at leading by example and teaching Jesus the correct way. It’s sad to see the errors and who they affect.
@@Geniuswhay one thing that bothered me about the debate is that all the atheist agreed that their isn’t evidence to prove God exist or doesn’t exist but yet they still say “well it’s up for y’all Christian’s to prove the claim”. I find that so weird because that doesn’t provide any foundation for the atheist to stand on. It’s strange. It was easy to tell this wasn’t intellectual debate it was an emotional one. But for some reason they claimed logic.
I've lived long enough to know that on both sides, no one knows what the truth is. The universe is too vast for our tiny human minds to comprehend. Using things that happen on our planet which is merely a spec of dust in the infinite beach that is the cosmos is misguided. Is there something or someone out there? Likely. All we can do is just love each other because at the end of the day, that's the only thing we can do to guarantee our short lives will be better
Nelson was just talking in logical fallacies lol
Atheist here. I had always wanted this debate lol.
And yes being an atheist in Nigeria is tough work. Especially as a female working with elderly women
Question for the Christians:
How can god interact with the material world to help you succeed in life?
There is the belief that god allows humans to have free will.
Apart from doing things like stopping lightning from striking you, god can’t help you in your exams, relationships, job etc. Doing so would require him to directly affect human choices in your favour.
If someone only does B instead of A because of god, then free will is interfered with.
Good question. Many Christians believe in the idea of free will from God but then also believe in intercessory prayer.
Then you have the pastors and prophets that claim to be called by God. But how can God call someone without breaking their free will
Amazing video. We need PART 2 🤝🏽
Part 2 kor😂😂
Side note
I love Peter-Nelson Isaiah so far
He has shown that as much as he's a believer and in strongly believes in God, he's also someone who would want evidence of the things of the world
He's like Timothy, a follower of God who still likes to have proof of the world
Evidence that confirms his biases, that is. That type of person is the type to ignore any evidence that contradicts what they want to believe as coming from 'the devil'
@@gothic_cloudiaeveryone are biased, even atheists. If you reject this statement, remember that this is difficult to accept
I became so happy when the Atheists said they were willing to switch sides if convinced!!! God is not only about the religion!! God is the light within you!! You are directly the tree of life and the universe is within you!! Christianity and the Bible is a guide to awaken your Christ consciousness and have strong Faith in God... For the Temple of God is within you ...
I hate to hear a Christian yell “science”. It hurts my ears
Religion is backed by faith
Science is backed by facts
....now word of mouth or detailed proof and evidence which would you prefer?
If there were undeniable and sufficient proof of the existence of God, the scientific world would be in turmoil. All the major scientific journals, all the university faculties would fight to receive the genius behind the demonstration. All the talk-shows, the television news around the world, all the magazines on the planet would offer millions $ to the lucky person to have exclusive access to the story of his discovery. But nothing happens.
Last segment showed who is working with logic and who ain't 🗡
Im just sitting here as a Muslim roooting for Nelson when he starting speaking of causality the big bang and God😤👏🏾👏🏾
Nelson is presenting his case without even quoting the Bible, demonstrating how a debate should be conducted. His argument is very intellectual, and while I don't agree with everything he says, he is making a strong argument so far.
Apostle Julius, on the other hand, struggled to defend his faith because he couldn't make an argument without relying on the Bible. In this situation, he needed to go beyond biblical references and present logical arguments, including references outside of the Bible, especially since the atheist audience does not believe in or agree with the Bible. To him, belief is required even if he can't provide an explanation. He has difficulty clearly articulating his own beliefs about his faith and, despite speaking about Christianity, knows very little about it.
In my view, the atheists failed to clearly define their statement regarding the non-existence of God. They stumbled because there is a distinction between asserting "There is no God" and saying "I don't know if God exists." From what I observed, they don't truly believe in the non-existence of a Creator; they simply aren't sure if a God (Creator) exists or not. In fact, there is more evidence supporting the existence of a Creator than there is for the absence of one. However, that's a discussion for another time.
I have to commend Nelson for making a reasonable argument and being very eloquent. He is highly intelligent and also very convincing.
There is no way to defend non existence. How do you defend the non existence of unicorns? Their points are there is no proof for god, therefore there is no god. They also admit in the end that if they were presented with proof for god then they will agree, similarly if presented with proof of unicorns , a logical person will agree. Nelson was well- spoken and that was all. His claims that causation = god is a weak theory because the same theory is disproven when asked what caused god. If your response is 'god does not need a creator' then why do you think the universe or space needs a creator.
As sane and logical humans, you do not make conclusions based off belief, you examine evidence presented to you. for example if you see an egg, you most likely assume a chicken was there because based off repeated evidence gathered from seeing chickens around you can tell that chickens lay eggs. You do not assume a dog made the egg because there is no evidence to support dogs laying eggs. If however, we start to see dogs lay eggs we can then change our conclusion that either a dog or chicken had laid that egg. Same with creation, there is no evidence that god created anything. Until such evidence is presented you are right to say there is no god.
What are the arguments supporting existence of a God?
@@felixamadi2237 Fine-Tuning, Kalam’s cosmological argument, The contingency argument as well as the Ontological argument are all arguments supporting the existence of a God
@@dxmil0la Fine tuning's somewhat decent, but still flawed. The rest are pretty bad arguments that have been dismantled again and again.
@@kponke you could say the same about almost any argument that exists.
So unless you care to actually dismantle at least one of them yourself in this cs, your opinion is irrelevant.
This Nelson guy sef ehn
That "fake" hugs and compliments at the end though 😂😂
The part where Oyindamola said that newly converted Christians cut a lot of people off has nothing to do with not being accountable or refusing to take correction. It has absolutely nothing to do with bad character. Why that happens is because as a genuine born again Christian there are certain things you would do before that doesn't sit right with you again cause light and understanding which can never be understood by logical reasoning has been shown to that believer. In some cases there is also a period of isolation for people who are personally convicted to take some time from the world to get to know God more. Whenever that period of conformation is over they find it very uncomfortable to do some things cause they've seen light and have knowledge that might seem stupid to others because only the spirit can grant understanding. It could also be that the friend causes them to sin and they might just want to take a break so then can be more firm in their faith to not make mistakes or go back to their old lifestyle and since they've let Jesus into their life even if they fall back into sin they'll always come back home because absolutely nothing can separate us from the love of Christ. I pray that God touches your heart and the heart of those that read this comment because no one can come to God unless he draws them. I know this isn't really related to what I was saying but it's very important, remember that one day we will all die and whether you like it or not, whether you believe it or not, it's either heaven or hell it won't be funny at all to spend eternity in hell. If you go to God geniuenly he loves you so much and will definitely speak to you(in different ways not necessarily an expected way) but you would have a beautiful and life changing encounter and he would direct your path unto the right way❤️
The guilt tripping at the end
The guilt tripping at the end
lol… this is exactly her point
@kamsirichard8347 Like!!! This is the problem with the average Nigerian Christian. Emotional & psychological, manipulative blackmailing, and gaslighting. It is always the same thing, threats about Heaven & Hell they have no genuine evidence or sight of. Worst is that even if these places exist, they are not given any guarantee that they will go to the heaven last last, after all these their holier than thou self-righteous acts & thought process
I think she clarified at the end of her speech that communicating your values are incompatible would be ideal. But I think she is being unfair and biased. People do this in other aspects of their lives that have nothing to do with religion. When some get married or move, find different groups of friends, graduate or any life change, they can distance themselves from people they were once close with without any proper communication. It's a human flaw and she's doing the things that atheist do when trying to put Christians down for their human characteristics.
Great to see Africans engaging in such, We have been lied to about God. I am also an Atheist in South Africa.
I'm a deist and in South Africa
Same
Yh😂😂😂 lies like he doesn't exist
@@_DannyforexIT doesn’t exist 😊
Another proof that while Christianity as a whole is truth, it's shows also that it can allow for open dialogue among those who do not subscribe to it without any negative consequences
That’s not how proof work.
Another proof that y'all be delusional
It is well
Just talk about the outcomes of Christianity. Moral Law and Order, Marriage and Union, and the helping of others that are unfortunate.
@@Emmanuel_EEE
You mean the multiple genocides, rape and mass murder committed in the name of the Christian deity
Nelson seems to be suffering from a serious case of Cognitive Dissonance on that last prompt.
Lol Nelson here, maybe i am 😂
@@isaiahpeter-nelson3140you really are😂😂. Close mindedness is what Christianity is about and there's always going to be something that'll trigger questioning. Why you need to research about Islam
@@hassanabdulmalikodunayo2701yall complain about Christians pushing their religion on ppl but here you are telling him to research Islam which is a very similar religion I don’t get it😂 for him to even go on a show like this proves that he’s very open mindsd
@@kekemarie-rn8cc Nope going to the show doesn't mean you're open minded. It's having a conversation and how people react to logical fact brought to them about that they believe. You can't even believe a hypothetical scenario. That's the height of being close minded.
@@hassanabdulmalikodunayo2701 This is very rich coming from a Muslim! Christianity promotes open mindedness and wisdom 1 Thessalonians 5:21 "But test everything; hold fast what is good."
Proverbs 1:22 “How long, O simple ones, will you love being simple? How long will scoffers delight in their scoffing and fools hate knowledge?"
The fact that there's an entire book based on wisdom (book of Proverbs), Ecclesiastes & so much more shows how ignorant you are. Don't make such bold claims again, thanks
When you put alot of ignorant people inside the room and they are all throwing their myth no fact-check, nothing, just them lying to support their point
1:22 Yes prayer has the power to change outcomes. But do not expect for it to come supernaturally, you also need to work towards what you want.
Still on this yes God can do anything, but you need to understand that He has given us authority over the earth. So for Him to do something for us there has to be a medium which is us. The same way where He had to die for us hence the new testament, He had to become man, physical, a medium, hence Jesus Christ, while He was on earth, he showed us the similarities and difference between the physical and the spiritual while also using the life style of Jesus to show us how we should live our life even though He knows we can't be perfect, try, hence the free will
So, what was the point of the prayer if it's your actions and not supernatural? lol
@@myartworkchannel The point of prayer is to do things you cannot do yourself
Example
You open a business
Can you control the mind of the people to ensure your business blows?
But if you're a true Christian and born again, God can find a way to influence people to come your way
@@samcilxix160 That's impossible😂and supernatural
@@myartworkchannel my point exactly
Impossible and supernatural
God helps makes the impossible possible
Just do what you can first so God can help you through your prayers to make the supernatural happen
"When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said 'Let us pray.' We closed our eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land."
Jomo Kenyatta.
Yh talk about mohammed and slave trade😂😂😂😂
Christianity was already in africa before the white europeans came....get some knowledge bro!!!
.... How did islam enter africa??
And funny how ur name is jesus was a muslim.... U really dont want me to go there
The burden of proof is not a logical fallacy. 😂😂
Let me school you, In an argument or debate, the burden of proof is the obligation on the person making a claim to provide evidence and justification for their position. This principle is essential in logical reasoning and critical thinking to ensure that arguments are based on sound evidence and reasoning. The burden of proof is not a fallacy, but rather a fundamental principle in constructing and evaluating arguments.
😂😂😂some comments are just funny...... Do you even understand what you are saying? 😂😂😂
What is objective morality and why can't he use it??
😂😂😂
@_Dannyforex
Christianity is false. My channel debunks Christianity and that pagan trinity
Nelson you finish work for this video. I like your style of apologetics. When you try to explain something and they don't get it, you start sighting examples to drive your point home. You are a blessing to Christianity sir and every Christian clergy or laity should know what you know. I am deeply honoured on how you defended the faith. God bless you. I hope I can meet you so I can learn too.
As for me nothing can be ever said to me to make me that God my father,my protector,my spiritual guardian don't exist
ok buddy lol
That's not a good thing lol.
Some call this, brainwashing, indoctrination or mental slavery.
@@viceanterra3let him be please GOD exists and he believes
Continue with your delulu 😂