With the new MX5 this FRS I'm just glad people have choices for affordably priced rear wheel drive sport cars. Honda and Nissan need to join the party ASAP.
@@rolandotillit2867 Nissan has the new Z. 40k for 400hp and beautiful design. Honda is coming up with a new Integra. Probably around 35-40k range hopefully.
@@FixingWithFriends Too true! It's a shame as well. The new NSX is a fantastic car, people judge it against other cars and don't see it for what it really is. Like the S2k you know Honda put some love into it.
Thank you so much for pointing out the whole torque thing. It kept bugging me how every single person reviewing this car completely misunderstood the torque figures and kept just reporting this misrepresented torque figure. Peak numbers don't tell the whole story people!
Yes, everyone else is just repeating the marketing talking point that peak torque is available lower. This is the only video I've seen so far that gives proper perspective
Sure there are lazy reviewers but that’s the case with any car. The people worth watching demonstrate a good understanding of the context around the numbers. Cammisa, SavageGeese, etc.
Great review! I am so happy Japan is carrying the mantle of making fun cars with great style. Between this, the Nissan Z, and the Integra I am refreshed and relieved that the endless march of washing machine SUVs hasn't crushed the soul of the automotive industry yet....
Don't worry, Tesla will finish crushing that soul with their cookie cutter electric devices they seem to call cars. Once those take over in the near future, it's over.
@@350z33hr yeah, they COULD have done a lot of things but they chose to keep their partnership with Subaru and just evolve the platform. I'm hoping they come out with a GR Corolla with the GR Yaris engine. Wouldn't call it lazy tho ... They improved the engine, transmission, chassis, suspension, interior, exterior design.
I thought I learned everything I needed to about this car from every other auto youtubers' videos and it was starting to sound the same. But I learned something new from your video! All the weight reduction they made to cancel out the added weight of the bigger engine and gear ratios!
What a fun little car! Your description of the driving experience, regarding steering, suspension, engine and gearbox, brought back fond memories of a Triumph TR3 I had, about a million years ago: just a simple, light and agile sports car.
Hey Jason, you didn’t talk about the fact that the chassis has been stiffened by about 50% - I’ve seen other reviewers mention that the car has less body roll and is more direct, what are your thoughts? Thanks.
@Smocaine More info here: “The GR86 is built on the same basic platform as the GT86, which means it retains the same proportions as its predecessor. However, Toyota is keen to stress that the shell has been upgraded with more strengthening panels and stronger bonding techniques, which improve the chassis’s stiffness and sharpen up the handling. Torsional rigidity is up by 50 percent as a result.” - Auto Express UK
@@joeleonard9965 Depends on what you mean by handling. An experienced driver would get faster laptimes, but it's sure gonna feel better to hoon it along a b-road with stiffer suspension x)
Best part of the video, * Peels out from a stop* "Yeah Buddy" *Smiles and giggles* This is a drivers car, I feel like its more daily driver than a newer MX-5 due to comfort and the non-convertible aspect for less areas for the water to leak in.
I had a 2013 BRZ when it first came out. It was riddled with issues. 1. They originally used a soft metal that the rearview mirror was screwed into...mine fell off at a red light within the first 5k miles. It was a known defect but while my I had my car, they never had a warranty fix and just screwed it back in with another screw. 2. "The engine chirp" while idling was awful. 3. The seal around the rear taillights was defective and again within the first 6-8 months of ownership, they fill 50% with WATER. I traded the car in around 1 year of ownership. Don't get me wrong, even with the original engine, I LOVED the driving experience of the car even though it was slow as hell. It also looked amazing and I got so many compliments (pulled over in a parking lot by an awesome cop who wanted to talk cars). Handling was awesome, and a little tail-slide was so fun. Love seeing that they are still making these and upgrading them (finally). If they ever put a 250-300hp engine in I would buy another. I'm sure they addressed the earlier production issues - lesson - never buy a first year run of anything.
I had a late 14 premium and put 40k on it in 2 years before selling it with the arrival of a child. I only have the mirror issue which the dealer fixed for me. no chirp and no tailight issues although i was in a pretty dry climate ( E Idaho).
I just took delivery of one 3 weeks ago in Canada. I was pining for my 1986 MR2, a fun car to scoot around in. I did zero research, saw no videos, I was at the dealer and just told my salesman, I want one of them. It took 6 months to get and in transit it morphed from silver to trueno blue with the premium package. AT-6. I love it, it scoots nicely. Having a slightly modified right knee, all original parts but slightly rearranged, a manual was not in the picture. It's fast, and does corners like its on rails. Nice acceleration and the paddles or sport mode takes care of the absence of the extra peddle and dynamic cruise makes for easier highway driving. A nice rig. I am an infrequent commenter, but enjoy your channel. PS: Post purchase research all leans to what you say and my experience, a decent little sports car that is fun to drive. Cheers from Newfoundland, land of windy roads.
What a great car. Manual, light weight, pretty. I do NOT want rev matching. I'm glad they didn't include that. I'm kind of surprised that you like it. I am also a fan of NO turbo that literally every performance car has now. I haven't seen a new car I might actually buy until now. It's perfect.
Man I'm so happy to see Japanese car makers building cars just for the joy of driving again. This car seems like a hoot. Nissan is bringing back the Z and it looks better than ever and offers the VR30 with a 6MT. The Supra is awesome, even if it's not 100% true to the original formula...it would be even better if they decide to offer it with a 6MT. Honda has the Civic Si and Type R...but honestly this car with RWD and 6MT just seems so appealing.
I'm so happy you brought up the fact that peak torque being earlier is really just a buzz phrase. Sure the Gen1 peaked later, but that was just barely higher than the first peak... I wonder if the 2020 rear diff will fit the 22.
Refreshing finally to see someone correct the misunderstood focus on peak torque rpms, most Naturally aspirated torque curves are 90% of peak torque from 2000 to redline, with the odd deviation here or there / cammy higher peak for older heavier pre vvt engines
It's super interesting to see the design cues from the newer Acura as well as some Supra vibes, mainly on the rear of the car for both of those. Just on paper and seeing how it looks, definitely not a bad car to consider for a fun and affordable vehicle! I think it's a good improvement from the previous gens, and I'm looking forward to what people can do to this car over time as well.
Kinda like the Atkinson cycle 3.5 taco v6, I like that it switches between direct and port injection because it reduces buildup in the intake and valves. Extra power and torque is also attractive. I think I want the GR. In fact, I would take any toyota GR at this point. As far as rev matching... it is installed in my right foot.
Omg thank you for explaining the peak torque right out of the gate. Every other channel just keeps saying peak torque happens a lot sooner, but never explain that the prior gen did have decent torque on the low end.
Why is no one going on about the exterior design. It is superb, especially with the duck tail spoiler. The composition between the line and curves are on par with much more expensive car models form a brand like Porsche.
Hey Jason, absolutely great video! As a current 2014 frs owner and wanting to change to either brz or gr86 2022, I really appreciate this video from you and could you do another video for comparing 2022 brz and gr86 when you buy any of them? I've learned that they are different on sway bar mounting, aluminum vs steel control arm, and different spring and damping parameters. Really want to know exactly how these two cars gonna have a different characteristic and what finally gonna makes you for buying one of them! Thank you for all the great videos you make!!!
Downshift rev matching myself is a point of pride and one of the enjoyable metrics of driving a fast car. Same as heel and toe. Somewhat hard to learn but a rewarding driving experience. The more stuff that's handled by the car's ECU the less you are actually driving it. My Mr2 was devoid of any driver aids except Anti-lock brakes. I spun the car a couple of times and I learned why it would spin and learned not to do that. I became a better driver as a result. The digital nannies hinder learning about actual fast car driving. Managing weight transfer and grip and throttle input are vital to driving any car fast. Luv and Peace.
@@larslrs7234 I think it's a laugh not nice at all.....nice would be having a super or turbo charger and being able to fry on demand 😋 none of this silly 80's chirp noises 🤣
@@jasoncee666 the chirp comes from releasing clutch without providing gas. The wheels slowdown drive train and motor. But motor and drive train are so heavy that there is a wheelspin for a moment.
My first two cars were a 1976 MG Midget and a 1977 Triumph TR7. I was stationed in San Diego so they were both under powered California versions. It was fun getting the most out of those engines with the manual transmissions. It really makes you plan your shifts to get the most out of the car. Since they were British we measured acceleration in furlongs per fortnight.
I'm actually glad it doesn't have rev matching, thank you Toyota! I want my manual in the purest form. If you start rev matching, hanging revs, hill assisting and other BS for me, might as well put a freaking CVT/automatic crap in it.
To me, this car makes a lot of sense! The true heart of a sports car just like the Mazda Miata! Ingenious study and making it into production, albeit sports cars or muscle cars are such a tiny niche and never has sold well in a car market!
Engineering Explained Great review! Was there any rev hang when shifting? You made no mention of it . Hopefully this is because it is non existent. As you know this plagues a lot of newer cars, making it very difficult to get a smooth shift in normal driving. Almost makes me want to shy away from a manual.
Jason, question for you but first: what an amazing fourteen minutes of off the top of your head patter - structured, flowing, smooth, and informative throughout. You could give lessons, that's quite a skill. Second, should one get this new 86GR, an ND1 Miata with supercharger, or a stock 944? Thanks for the years of great and interesting videos.
Thanks for the kind words! I would say: get the 86 if you want to visit the track occasionally. Get the MX-5 if you never plan on tracking, and don’t need the added practicality/space of the 86.
Another perfect video that was worth waiting for, first proper technical description of what's changed as expected, thank you, Toyota on a roll with this and the Yaris.....how to choose between them...
It’s great that Jason pointed out how the engine is a flat curve (except the torque dip). The new 2.4 faster because there is more torque everywhere.Every other reviewer says that the 2.0 is peaky.. false..
Re. 2 torque peaks with the earlier version of this motor. Yes, it produces a comparatively modest amount of torque for the capacity, but that wasn't the biggest flaw (complaint) with that motor. The problem wasn't the quantum of Nm, but _when_ it was generated. The dip in torque coincided with a still low amount of power, *and* it was in the guts of the rev range, where most drivers spend most time, in most situations.
Ah, if only I could get it in Mexico :/ We get the Yaris GR tho ;) Also, you said "pistons move up & down", but it's a boxer... So shouldn't it be side to side? Just being picky LOL, great video!
I am tempted to buy one after watching your review! By the way, how does the GR 86 feel compared to an S2000? I am curious because the two cars seem to be very close in weight with slight power and torque difference.
stock for stock, the 86 has a better more rigid and predictable chassis. the S2000 has a lot of rear end roll out of corners. aero wise the S2000 can't compete with the 86 with high speed stability and slicing thru air. the 86 is also more daily usable and has much better interior comfort and space for the driver, passenger and storage. the only reason to get an S2000 is the engine.
I can’t comment on the GR86 from personal experience but I got the impression that the torque curve is a lot different than an S2000 where you really need to rev it out to get torque. My friend got an S2000 and at the time I had an E46 330Ci (which is a straight 6) and it felt so wimpy to me because I was used to that low end torque of the straight 6. I got the impression from this video that the torque curve to this car was more akin to that than an engine that you need to be over 5000 to really get the V tec to kick in and feel some power. PLEASE correct me if I am incorrect.
Yeah the new GR86 has a meatier middle power band for everyday driving, and it is also a lot more rigid with over 20 years of chassis advancement over the S2k. With the S2k you need to rev above 5000 for VTEC to kick in in order to get decent power. But the S2k is an iconic car with a drop-top. So really it really depends how you like to drive your car every day.
Glad to see this reviewed! I've been seriously considering a 2019+ MX-5 soft top, but I'm tall and it's a close fit. Would you be interested in making a video comparing the GT 86 to your MX-5? If only the 86 had a convertible option. 😊
It's been one of those topics nobody wants to touch, because there are so many MX-5 fanboys. FRS, BRZ, and Type-86 have been better for sure! Had an MX-5 rental. It was terrible (coming from a WRX).
@@ittimjones if you think the MX5 drives terrible coming from a WRX I don’t know what to say lol. WRX drive horrible. No clutch feel, overly sensitive throttle, horrible engine tuning, rev hang up the ass. If you actually found that more fun then a Miata you probably only care about 0-60 and didn’t drive it around a corner or hard enough.
0:40 “So a 2.4 liter boxer 4-cylinder and the way that this engine is larger is that they’ve increased the size of the bore. So the pistons are now wider. They have the same stroke. So they move up and down the same distance.” Jason, Jason, Jason. This is a BOXER engine. The pistons don’t move up and down at all. Let me fix that last line for you: “So they move back and forth the same distance.” Edit: To all those uptight dorks complaining about this post, I’m just teasing Jason. Lighten up.
Pretty sure what you're hearing throughout the whole video is fake engine noise through the speakers. I personally think it sounds really annoying and drones when he's just cruising around, sounds fine when you're rowing through the gears I guess.
Nice revision of the 86, but it would've been the perfect one car daily driver if the rear seats were spilt and the rear glass was able to open up like my Acura RSX even if it adds a few pounds. A little bit more practicality in my opinion. It is hard to pack big/awkward items through the trunk opening in the 86. I still like the car because it checks all the other boxes being rwd, manual, lightweight and affordable. I'm still looking for a replacement for my Type S which has 558000kms on it.
If this thing can take E85 with just a tune like the first gen... that's going to make this car a proper blast to drive. I love the simplicity and fun of my '14 BRZ and plan to run it into the ground. Hopefully lightweight enthusiast car options will still exist when the time comes.
Gains on the old car with just a couple of exhaust bits and a tune were quite good. This car seems to start out even a bit better than that as a baseline, so I can imagine what little torque dip exists can be completely eliminated without even going to an aftermarket header.
I've honestly always respected these cars and I also thought their value was lost in translation to the American Market. The one thing I felt odd about this new generation was the fact no one addressed how the center of gravity was. So thank you for addressing this!
@@alexnutcasio936 It's quite close and as they said, if they had the soft top rather than the RF, they might be the same. Also 1/4 mile times are not what either are made for
@@CarsOverPeople it was also the RF, rather than the soft top. The RF weighs close to 120 lbs more than the soft top (about 5% more). That's almost like throwing in a passenger. So that bumps the power to weight down to 13.62 for the RF vs 12.97 for the soft top. The GR86 is now at 12.33 vs the previous at 13.54. So the previous has a similar power to weight to the RF while the new one has a similar power to weight to the soft top. TLDR, the soft top ND2 Miata and GR86 will be very close in terms of 1/4 mile time.
228hp, 184 lbs torque, RWD, manual, faster than new Miata and old BRZ, digital dashboard, clean and new design for under 30k... tell me better deal than this car!
@@jasonoshima6839 not really both are very affordable. Instead of rushing to buy what could be considered a new MX5 for 25k just say save it for another year or so and pick up a faster sports car
When people say this is a great car for new drivers I smile. I just bought one. I'm 55. My previous cars include a 992 911 and a 718 GT4. I learned to drive in 1984. I love it.
Delighted that everyone knows pistons move side-to-side in boxer engines. Thanks for watching!
Lol, those of us who aren't pedantic morons knew what you meant 👍😂
Thanks for posting this, Jason!
Does this flat 4 require 93 octane like the last one? Or did they come to their senses and engineer it to run on 91 or even 87?
@@Mr.ZiggedWhenHeShouldaZagged 93 or better, sorry to all the potential buyers who will now go mx-5 I guess.
So its running a Suburu FA20 with 10.6:1 and boost? yeah garbage
My dream car. I want one so bad. Its something that i can actually buy in the future if i keep working hard.
I hope you get one bro!
Same here!
Keep up the hard work my friend. Great things will come!
@Team rocket rockin If he says it’s his dream car, then it’s his dream car, simple.
@Team rocket rockin at least his dream car is achievable
You know it's at least a decent car when Jason is smiling.
With the new MX5 this FRS I'm just glad people have choices for affordably priced rear wheel drive sport cars. Honda and Nissan need to join the party ASAP.
@@rolandotillit2867 Nissan has the new Z. 40k for 400hp and beautiful design. Honda is coming up with a new Integra. Probably around 35-40k range hopefully.
@@fraided88 Is the Integra going to have a manual transmission option?
@@FixingWithFriends Too true! It's a shame as well. The new NSX is a fantastic car, people judge it against other cars and don't see it for what it really is. Like the S2k you know Honda put some love into it.
@@fraided88 The Integra is FWD but since I like both drivetrains I'd give it a spin.
Thank you so much for pointing out the whole torque thing. It kept bugging me how every single person reviewing this car completely misunderstood the torque figures and kept just reporting this misrepresented torque figure. Peak numbers don't tell the whole story people!
Yes, everyone else is just repeating the marketing talking point that peak torque is available lower. This is the only video I've seen so far that gives proper perspective
Sure there are lazy reviewers but that’s the case with any car. The people worth watching demonstrate a good understanding of the context around the numbers. Cammisa, SavageGeese, etc.
@@jackwinklebean you should see Jason Camisa review, both before the launch and now. Excelent!
Great review! I am so happy Japan is carrying the mantle of making fun cars with great style. Between this, the Nissan Z, and the Integra I am refreshed and relieved that the endless march of washing machine SUVs hasn't crushed the soul of the automotive industry yet....
Don't worry, Tesla will finish crushing that soul with their cookie cutter electric devices they seem to call cars. Once those take over in the near future, it's over.
Lazy. Toyota out-sourcing the engine from Subaru as they did with the Supra from BMW. They could have thrown the GR Yaris engine on this one
@@Synchromesh123 Never!
@@350z33hr yeah, they COULD have done a lot of things but they chose to keep their partnership with Subaru and just evolve the platform. I'm hoping they come out with a GR Corolla with the GR Yaris engine. Wouldn't call it lazy tho ... They improved the engine, transmission, chassis, suspension, interior, exterior design.
@@Synchromesh123 K
I thought I learned everything I needed to about this car from every other auto youtubers' videos and it was starting to sound the same. But I learned something new from your video! All the weight reduction they made to cancel out the added weight of the bigger engine and gear ratios!
What a fun little car! Your description of the driving experience, regarding steering, suspension, engine and gearbox, brought back fond memories of a Triumph TR3 I had, about a million years ago: just a simple, light and agile sports car.
Love your enthusiasm
What a reference! Had to look it up. Now I’m going on a deep dive on the Triumph TR3.
How was that reliability on your TR3?
Just so-so but, as a teenager, it was all an adventure.
@@bsmukler indeed. Lol. Thanks for the honest reply.
The BIG smile while driving it’s all I needed to see on your review 👍🏻.
Car should make you happy when you drive it !
I absolutely like this better than the new Supra. I imagine it will be a better long term machine too.
You know what I think idc about the speed but this could be my drift machine man .I might have a place for it in my garage by god's grace
@@lovecwtchgamerl6500 keep focused and work hard man!
@@kevindelgado7083 Yes sir 🔥❤️💯
y?
@@matthew7448 Subaru has a better reputation for reliability than BMW is the most probable reason.
Hey Jason, you didn’t talk about the fact that the chassis has been stiffened by about 50% - I’ve seen other reviewers mention that the car has less body roll and is more direct, what are your thoughts? Thanks.
Is it really 50%? That's a big improvement to an existing platform that they just modified a bit here and there.
@Smocaine More info here: “The GR86 is built on the same basic platform as the GT86, which means it retains the same proportions as its predecessor. However, Toyota is keen to stress that the shell has been upgraded with more strengthening panels and stronger bonding techniques, which improve the chassis’s stiffness and sharpen up the handling. Torsional rigidity is up by 50 percent as a result.” - Auto Express UK
@@thatoneotherotherguy sac can
People often don't realize that the best way to improve handling is to stiffen the chassis and loosen the suspension.
@@joeleonard9965 Depends on what you mean by handling. An experienced driver would get faster laptimes, but it's sure gonna feel better to hoon it along a b-road with stiffer suspension x)
Best part of the video, * Peels out from a stop* "Yeah Buddy" *Smiles and giggles*
This is a drivers car, I feel like its more daily driver than a newer MX-5 due to comfort and the non-convertible aspect for less areas for the water to leak in.
"Yeah buddddyy...." funniest acceleration ever 😂😂
7:15
@@obkf-too thank you!
I guess those who buy a manual AND care about rev-matching also like doing it themselves.
God Forbid!
Hell f****** yeah!
I think auto-rev match features are more for new enthusiasts that are learning to drive stick, would've been nice but not a deal breaker
Agreed!
I mean, sometimes you just want to relax in your car, having rev matching as an option would be nice in those situations.
I had a 2013 BRZ when it first came out. It was riddled with issues. 1. They originally used a soft metal that the rearview mirror was screwed into...mine fell off at a red light within the first 5k miles. It was a known defect but while my I had my car, they never had a warranty fix and just screwed it back in with another screw. 2. "The engine chirp" while idling was awful. 3. The seal around the rear taillights was defective and again within the first 6-8 months of ownership, they fill 50% with WATER. I traded the car in around 1 year of ownership. Don't get me wrong, even with the original engine, I LOVED the driving experience of the car even though it was slow as hell. It also looked amazing and I got so many compliments (pulled over in a parking lot by an awesome cop who wanted to talk cars). Handling was awesome, and a little tail-slide was so fun. Love seeing that they are still making these and upgrading them (finally). If they ever put a 250-300hp engine in I would buy another. I'm sure they addressed the earlier production issues - lesson - never buy a first year run of anything.
I had a late 14 premium and put 40k on it in 2 years before selling it with the arrival of a child. I only have the mirror issue which the dealer fixed for me. no chirp and no tailight issues although i was in a pretty dry climate ( E Idaho).
What car did you trade your brz for?
Sounds like they fixed the main problem I had with mine, which I sold. This will probably be my next daily. Thanks for the top notch review!
I just took delivery of one 3 weeks ago in Canada. I was pining for my 1986 MR2, a fun car to scoot around in. I did zero research, saw no videos, I was at the dealer and just told my salesman, I want one of them. It took 6 months to get and in transit it morphed from silver to trueno blue with the premium package. AT-6. I love it, it scoots nicely. Having a slightly modified right knee, all original parts but slightly rearranged, a manual was not in the picture. It's fast, and does corners like its on rails. Nice acceleration and the paddles or sport mode takes care of the absence of the extra peddle and dynamic cruise makes for easier highway driving. A nice rig. I am an infrequent commenter, but enjoy your channel. PS: Post purchase research all leans to what you say and my experience, a decent little sports car that is fun to drive. Cheers from Newfoundland, land of windy roads.
This looks like a great car for younger drivers. Sporty, reliable, safe and affordable.
I just bought one of these. With zero experience in driving a manual. Its been fun so far!
What a great car. Manual, light weight, pretty. I do NOT want rev matching. I'm glad they didn't include that. I'm kind of surprised that you like it. I am also a fan of NO turbo that literally every performance car has now. I haven't seen a new car I might actually buy until now. It's perfect.
Rev matching that is selectable would be great. Don't like it, turn it off.
Why is turbo bad. Sorry not as educated.
@@good-tn9sr A turbo isn't necessarily bad. I have owned them. They're just not as good for long term reliability as a naturally aspirated engine
Man I'm so happy to see Japanese car makers building cars just for the joy of driving again. This car seems like a hoot. Nissan is bringing back the Z and it looks better than ever and offers the VR30 with a 6MT. The Supra is awesome, even if it's not 100% true to the original formula...it would be even better if they decide to offer it with a 6MT. Honda has the Civic Si and Type R...but honestly this car with RWD and 6MT just seems so appealing.
I like how the thumbnail just says "good"
Honestly i'm sold
Car good. 👌
Thank you for showing the gear ratios! Been looking for that & no other reviews cover that!
YESSS! I was worried you weren't going invited to review it! I love your reviews. I go to EE first always!
I like how despite this being a four cylinder, they really tried to give it a unique sound and embraces the fact that it is a four cylinder
The perfect entry level enthusiast car in the new car market
Great video as always ! You provide the most engineering centric stuff about the cars which is awesome! Keep them coming!
Wow, the screen is actually in-dash and not stuck on top like every other car.
Myself an automobile engineer from India and I love to watch your UA-cam channel because you describe the things very accurately.
I like how marketing says the dual injection system helps power yet we all know it is to keep the intake valves clean on the backsides.
Yep! Toyota actually does a lot of neat tricks with D4-S. Here’s a video with all the details: ua-cam.com/video/66C4YIiwRbM/v-deo.html
Love how you keep your backpack safe in the rear seat, belt and all 🤪
0:49 The pistons actually don’t move up and down. They move from side to side. It’s a boxer :)
We know what you mean but damn! You really had to mention it huh 😂
Peak pedant!
Almost like 99.9% of cars he talk about have pistons that go up and down and talking while driving leads to an occasional mistake 🙄
@@josefgordon7712 actually, only 99.73% ;)
@@jamesengland7461 this is true, he does have slightly more Porsche and Subaru content than others 😅
I'm so happy you brought up the fact that peak torque being earlier is really just a buzz phrase. Sure the Gen1 peaked later, but that was just barely higher than the first peak... I wonder if the 2020 rear diff will fit the 22.
How come you would want the old diff genuine question
@@Djentfan420 the 17-40 rear diff had shorter gearing, so it makes it a bit quicker accelerating and rowing through the gears.
Very nice review. The precise, clear, and rapid delivery of the mechanical and subjective content is refreshing. Keep up the good work.
He said the pistons move up and down… isn’t it side to side since it’s a boxer engine??
Yep.
After you roll it and it's laying on its side.
@@abdullahkolabhai6004 The eventuality of us young naive cheap rear wheel drive car lovers
Refreshing finally to see someone correct the misunderstood focus on peak torque rpms, most Naturally aspirated torque curves are 90% of peak torque from 2000 to redline, with the odd deviation here or there / cammy higher peak for older heavier pre vvt engines
It's super interesting to see the design cues from the newer Acura as well as some Supra vibes, mainly on the rear of the car for both of those. Just on paper and seeing how it looks, definitely not a bad car to consider for a fun and affordable vehicle! I think it's a good improvement from the previous gens, and I'm looking forward to what people can do to this car over time as well.
Kinda like the Atkinson cycle 3.5 taco v6, I like that it switches between direct and port injection because it reduces buildup in the intake and valves. Extra power and torque is also attractive. I think I want the GR. In fact, I would take any toyota GR at this point.
As far as rev matching... it is installed in my right foot.
I would even take the Prius G's made around 2015... haha
Omg thank you for explaining the peak torque right out of the gate. Every other channel just keeps saying peak torque happens a lot sooner, but never explain that the prior gen did have decent torque on the low end.
It did have decent torque up to 3 and a bit thousand, but then it fell in a big hole.
i love the way this thing looks, glad to hear it's a general improvement.
This makes me happy to see the next gen 86 is here but now gt86 prices should be cheaper.
The prices will probably start to come down. Well not right now, demand for used cars is so high that everything is inflated but eventually...
Not in this current market they wont.
Lol maybe by next year gt86 prices might even reflect market value 🥴
Why is no one going on about the exterior design. It is superb, especially with the duck tail spoiler. The composition between the line and curves are on par with much more expensive car models form a brand like Porsche.
Hey Jason, absolutely great video! As a current 2014 frs owner and wanting to change to either brz or gr86 2022, I really appreciate this video from you and could you do another video for comparing 2022 brz and gr86 when you buy any of them? I've learned that they are different on sway bar mounting, aluminum vs steel control arm, and different spring and damping parameters. Really want to know exactly how these two cars gonna have a different characteristic and what finally gonna makes you for buying one of them! Thank you for all the great videos you make!!!
Downshift rev matching myself is a point of pride and one of the enjoyable metrics of driving a fast car. Same as heel and toe. Somewhat hard to learn but a rewarding driving experience.
The more stuff that's handled by the car's ECU the less you are actually driving it.
My Mr2 was devoid of any driver aids except Anti-lock brakes.
I spun the car a couple of times and I learned why it would spin and learned not to do that.
I became a better driver as a result.
The digital nannies hinder learning about actual fast car driving. Managing weight transfer and grip and throttle input are vital to driving any car fast.
Luv and Peace.
Chirped the tires shifting into second, nice!
Cops have pulled me over for such behaviour 😋
Why is this nice? It is better than automatically reducing motor power but a lighter drive train would be better.
@@larslrs7234 I think it's a laugh not nice at all.....nice would be having a super or turbo charger and being able to fry on demand 😋 none of this silly 80's chirp noises 🤣
@@jasoncee666 the chirp comes from releasing clutch without providing gas. The wheels slowdown drive train and motor. But motor and drive train are so heavy that there is a wheelspin for a moment.
@@larslrs7234 oh okay compression lockup that's also known as, I forget the video already 😀
My first two cars were a 1976 MG Midget and a 1977 Triumph TR7. I was stationed in San Diego so they were both under powered California versions. It was fun getting the most out of those engines with the manual transmissions. It really makes you plan your shifts to get the most out of the car. Since they were British we measured acceleration in furlongs per fortnight.
Was the TR7 pretty reliable for you overall?
@@joshuagibson2520 Clutch problems and a tiny bit of overheating eve with the 3 fans made me trade it in.
@@mikecampbell5856 cool. Thanks for your honest feedback.
I'm actually glad it doesn't have rev matching, thank you Toyota!
I want my manual in the purest form. If you start rev matching, hanging revs, hill assisting and other BS for me, might as well put a freaking CVT/automatic crap in it.
I think having the option is nice. But must be allowed to disable!
I really love the changes to the 86 buy I wonder how much better it would be with just 2 seats and saving even more weight like the Miata.
Someone is having a lot of Fun. The Smiles of the Reviewer a speaking more than everything. He has a lot of Fun!!!
WOO been waiting for this review since the others dropped!
To me, this car makes a lot of sense! The true heart of a sports car just like the Mazda Miata! Ingenious study and making it into production, albeit sports cars or muscle cars are such a tiny niche and never has sold well in a car market!
Jason, thank you very much for the videos. You make the complex understandable. I really appreciate that about the videos.
Happy to hear it, thanks for watching!
Engineering Explained Great review! Was there any rev hang when shifting? You made no mention of it . Hopefully this is because it is non existent. As you know this plagues a lot of newer cars, making it very difficult to get a smooth shift in normal driving. Almost makes me want to shy away from a manual.
Jason, question for you but first: what an amazing fourteen minutes of off the top of your head patter - structured, flowing, smooth, and informative throughout. You could give lessons, that's quite a skill.
Second, should one get this new 86GR, an ND1 Miata with supercharger, or a stock 944?
Thanks for the years of great and interesting videos.
Thanks for the kind words! I would say: get the 86 if you want to visit the track occasionally. Get the MX-5 if you never plan on tracking, and don’t need the added practicality/space of the 86.
@@EngineeringExplained thank you for the response and about the rest it was very much my pleasure!
@@EngineeringExplained I had the same question: Thanks for the definitive answer! No tracking for me. -Hersch
Another perfect video that was worth waiting for, first proper technical description of what's changed as expected, thank you, Toyota on a roll with this and the Yaris.....how to choose between them...
I can't wait to see what the aftermarket does with this car.
Told my father that I’d love to pickup one of these and this is the vid that I shared with him - thanks!
Rwd is amazing to me, especially while partnering with Subaru, surprised it’s not AWD.
...light and affordable...not AWD...
not surprising at all, previous one wasn't AWD either...
@@dericanslum1696 Would spice things up if more manufacturers came out with this class of car.
it's based on the Toyota 86, never would be AWD. Toyota had to even fight Subaru and convince them that AWD is not what an 86 is about.
@@waterloo123100 you'd need a time machine to go back to the 80's and 90's
It’s great that Jason pointed out how the engine is a flat curve (except the torque dip). The new 2.4 faster because there is more torque everywhere.Every other reviewer says that the 2.0 is peaky.. false..
power/hp is the number that end up at the wheels in a meaningful way
Jason, I share your sentiments about most seats being a tall stick myself!
Though the Miata is space limited, this is my next "go to" for my retirement toy. But Miata still holds my heart.
Try a few miles in the sun with the top down before committing to that decision.
You know, honestly I think I'm starting to like your reviews of cars more than Doug's.
The styling of this car is a GRAND SLAM. It looks phenomenal sitting and in motion.
I am excited to see how this car compares to the previous model.
Throttle House did a great comparison and it’s quicker than the old GR and Miata.
Yes, its faster than old brz and the last Miata
@@arride4590 faster than the current Miata too.
Savagegeese said it was about 25% better if that's useful to you.
Re. 2 torque peaks with the earlier version of this motor. Yes, it produces a comparatively modest amount of torque for the capacity, but that wasn't the biggest flaw (complaint) with that motor. The problem wasn't the quantum of Nm, but _when_ it was generated.
The dip in torque coincided with a still low amount of power, *and* it was in the guts of the rev range, where most drivers spend most time, in most situations.
Ah, if only I could get it in Mexico :/
We get the Yaris GR tho ;)
Also, you said "pistons move up & down", but it's a boxer... So shouldn't it be side to side? Just being picky LOL, great video!
The GR Yaris is perhaps the coolest car in modern times.
@@tqracing worst thing about the car is, it’s not available in US and Canada
@@tqracing Yaris is FWD or RWD?
@@arride4590 It's a WRC homologation special with AWD.
yes, I am also being picky. at 0:50 stroke should move side to side.
This is my next car. Never expected this guy to do a review of it though.
Thought that was a red 400Z at first in the thumb lol.
They do look alike from the front!
@@namankandoi8554 good, I'm not crazy lol... at least with this thought 🤪🤪🤪
This exactly, it does not look like a Toyobaru at all.
In the back it looks like an 2014 Opel Insignia :/
Nissan Z will cost at least 40k.
Ive already seen like 6 reviews on this car but love the content and knowledge as well thanks
I am tempted to buy one after watching your review! By the way, how does the GR 86 feel compared to an S2000? I am curious because the two cars seem to be very close in weight with slight power and torque difference.
The top end on an s2k is hard to match as they both weigh about the same. I'm with a tune and some light mods the GR would be close
stock for stock, the 86 has a better more rigid and predictable chassis. the S2000 has a lot of rear end roll out of corners. aero wise the S2000 can't compete with the 86 with high speed stability and slicing thru air. the 86 is also more daily usable and has much better interior comfort and space for the driver, passenger and storage. the only reason to get an S2000 is the engine.
I can’t comment on the GR86 from personal experience but I got the impression that the torque curve is a lot different than an S2000 where you really need to rev it out to get torque. My friend got an S2000 and at the time I had an E46 330Ci (which is a straight 6) and it felt so wimpy to me because I was used to that low end torque of the straight 6. I got the impression from this video that the torque curve to this car was more akin to that than an engine that you need to be over 5000 to really get the V tec to kick in and feel some power. PLEASE correct me if I am incorrect.
@@jeremyspecce yes S2k is not about torque, it's about high rpm HP
Yeah the new GR86 has a meatier middle power band for everyday driving, and it is also a lot more rigid with over 20 years of chassis advancement over the S2k. With the S2k you need to rev above 5000 for VTEC to kick in in order to get decent power. But the S2k is an iconic car with a drop-top. So really it really depends how you like to drive your car every day.
Looks like affordable sports cars that are fun to drive are coming back. We'll have a new Integra, Z car and the GR86/BRZ. It's about time.
Glad to see this reviewed! I've been seriously considering a 2019+ MX-5 soft top, but I'm tall and it's a close fit. Would you be interested in making a video comparing the GT 86 to your MX-5?
If only the 86 had a convertible option. 😊
This. I am very surprised he didn't cover this, it's the obvious comparison to make.
It's been one of those topics nobody wants to touch, because there are so many MX-5 fanboys. FRS, BRZ, and Type-86 have been better for sure! Had an MX-5 rental. It was terrible (coming from a WRX).
@@ittimjones if you think the MX5 drives terrible coming from a WRX I don’t know what to say lol. WRX drive horrible. No clutch feel, overly sensitive throttle, horrible engine tuning, rev hang up the ass. If you actually found that more fun then a Miata you probably only care about 0-60 and didn’t drive it around a corner or hard enough.
Look out for the new Nissan Z as well.
Im 6,0 but i dont have a long torso, lets just say I don't do road trips longer than 6-7 hours.
So thankful that your happy with the second gen and love what I'm hearing. Now I need to wait about 3 year till I can afford one
Cant wait for the engine swap, turboing and 1000hp videos
0:40 “So a 2.4 liter boxer 4-cylinder and the way that this engine is larger is that they’ve increased the size of the bore. So the pistons are now wider. They have the same stroke. So they move up and down the same distance.”
Jason, Jason, Jason. This is a BOXER engine. The pistons don’t move up and down at all. Let me fix that last line for you: “So they move back and forth the same distance.”
Edit: To all those uptight dorks complaining about this post, I’m just teasing Jason. Lighten up.
0:36 it was at this moment when Jason decided he will purchase a GR 2000
I really enjoy the vids but I would like to see metric units when you show/talk numbers, would be a nice feature
I love the way it sounds!
Pretty sure what you're hearing throughout the whole video is fake engine noise through the speakers. I personally think it sounds really annoying and drones when he's just cruising around, sounds fine when you're rowing through the gears I guess.
@@billedwardz a lot companies like BMW has this fake engine noise.
Sounds like a video game.
For me it sounds like a riced car, worst part of this car for me.
Really? It sounds terrible to me, it’s fake sounds. I would turn them off if I ever bought it
seing the smile on your face when you accelerate, I can see how good the car is !
The pistons move up and down the same distance? Are you driving on 2 wheels?
???
Nvm, it finally clicked lol
gr86 looks really cool. and increasing performance/price is always a good thing
Nice revision of the 86, but it would've been the perfect one car daily driver if the rear seats were spilt and the rear glass was able to open up like my Acura RSX even if it adds a few pounds. A little bit more practicality in my opinion. It is hard to pack big/awkward items through the trunk opening in the 86. I still like the car because it checks all the other boxes being rwd, manual, lightweight and affordable. I'm still looking for a replacement for my Type S which has 558000kms on it.
These cars are just meant to be fun, not practical.
@@RobbieFitzgerald It would be nice to able to buy just one car to fit all the buyer's needs.
@@xlr8hard Im not saying youre wrong.
As always fantastic review! Finding your videos = UA-cam treasure chest of the best information.
I’m getting one (premium) as soon as I can order one.
If this thing can take E85 with just a tune like the first gen... that's going to make this car a proper blast to drive. I love the simplicity and fun of my '14 BRZ and plan to run it into the ground. Hopefully lightweight enthusiast car options will still exist when the time comes.
Gains on the old car with just a couple of exhaust bits and a tune were quite good. This car seems to start out even a bit better than that as a baseline, so I can imagine what little torque dip exists can be completely eliminated without even going to an aftermarket header.
I knew if I waited a decade, they'd get this right.
I've honestly always respected these cars and I also thought their value was lost in translation to the American Market. The one thing I felt odd about this new generation was the fact no one addressed how the center of gravity was. So thank you for addressing this!
every 2+2 should offer a rear seat delete from the factory, and this should be a hatch for usability. Love the Honda taillights.
I'm glad to see accessible sports cars still exist Ace review, EE
Jason, glad you like the GR 86. Will you be trading your S2000 for a GR 86?
He hasn't owned the S2K for years
Yeah I believe he sold out a while back
Getting a yellow one and supercharging it? 😂
@@EngineeringExplained Wait a minute. 🤨
😉
Savagegeese are too underrated. They are making some of the best car videos around. Give them your support. They truly deserve it.
Hey Jason, compared to a stock ND4-2….. what do you think?
According to Throttle House, who raced them, the GR is quicker.
@@alexnutcasio936 It's quite close and as they said, if they had the soft top rather than the RF, they might be the same. Also 1/4 mile times are not what either are made for
@@clayduval1255
But Hagerty did the same race and it basically smoked the Miata…
@@CarsOverPeople it was also the RF, rather than the soft top. The RF weighs close to 120 lbs more than the soft top (about 5% more). That's almost like throwing in a passenger. So that bumps the power to weight down to 13.62 for the RF vs 12.97 for the soft top. The GR86 is now at 12.33 vs the previous at 13.54. So the previous has a similar power to weight to the RF while the new one has a similar power to weight to the soft top.
TLDR, the soft top ND2 Miata and GR86 will be very close in terms of 1/4 mile time.
@@CarsOverPeople Hagerty also used an RF, the soft top is quicker than the 86 since it’s about 150 lbs lighter.
NA is the best for driving precision, well done Subaru and Toyota!
this guy's 25 and 52 at the same time.
GR86 also uses different front wheel hub/knuckle material than the BRZ (aluminum in the Subaru), along with different rear sway bar mounting points.
I'm curious if any manufacturer is going to go old school with any models, with the lack of computer parts.
Nope.
i think they need those for regulations now
How unusual - a good car gets better in every way but doesn't gain weight or a turbo - how refreshing!
You should become a fax machine because of that fact.
Finally, someone else that gets it! 👍🏻
228hp, 184 lbs torque, RWD, manual, faster than new Miata and old BRZ, digital dashboard, clean and new design for under 30k... tell me better deal than this car!
2023 Nissan Z 400hp, 350 lbs torque, rwd, 6 speed manual or 9 speed dct, digital dash $40k
@@niallhoran1367 Totally different price brackets...
@@jasonoshima6839 not really both are very affordable. Instead of rushing to buy what could be considered a new MX5 for 25k just say save it for another year or so and pick up a faster sports car
@@niallhoran1367 Nissan Z will not cost 30k. 10k more...
@@arride4590 I never said it cost 30k lol I said save the 25k you saved up and most likely in 2 years you’d have about 10k - 15k saved then buy the Z
Just thinking back on my 07 wrx it was 227hp. And it was a blast to drive. I bet this thing is fantastic. I'd love to give one a go.
When people say this is a great car for new drivers I smile. I just bought one. I'm 55. My previous cars include a 992 911 and a 718 GT4. I learned to drive in 1984. I love it.
wish Jason bring a whiteboard with math formula during test drive day :)
hahaha he should have it in the seat in the back with a seatbelt on it as a joke.