This is one of my favorite episodes. I love how the humans can't comprehend that the demons might just be monsters without empathy, without any good inside them. Even watchers/readers of the show can't help but wonder "Maybe Frieren is wrong?". We have no basis for thinking that, we think like this because it's our nature, and we can't help it.
Tbf, lots of recent media has made it so that races like orcs or goblins are allegories for minorities. Even Dungeon Meshi has done that with orcs. Frieren has made the subversive choice of saying, "No, demons are inhuman monsters in human flesh." They are scorpions.
That's why I love the writing so much, cause I can't help but laugh when real life reactors are actually being manipulated by the demon characters words, just like the humans in the story lol
Just commented something similar to this but totally agree. I don't think nothing is truly evil or bad but our greatest strength as humans is wanting to see the good in everything. Demons in frieren realized this and turned it into a weakness to exploit simple. They are not good or evil and neither are we but nature says we cannot coexist.
It also exploits age as a factor for is Frieren right. Because she has a history with demons as recent as the journey with Himmel. If we look at a person saying another person is a predator we'd likely conclude they have a bias because of previous conflicts.
@@andrewmahabir589 thats actually not our greatest strength, that's one of our biggest weakness which can be exploited by cunning enemies. throughout human history, many all trusting and benevolent people have been bacstabbed by evil people,
What i like is tht its shown that basically Demons truly just watch learn and imitate words, but for most words they dont actually understand them, its like parroting and seeing whats effective, it shoes how intelligent they are
@@MoreEvilThanYahweh I would argue egoism is more of a problem. We slowly killing our planet becouse people in power just dont care about people and the future.
@@syressx9098 That's a problem with those at top, I'm referring to the people on the ground and "middle management" level, their enablers of sorts given the well-intentioned rhetoric most of them use.
@@I_am_doomed True tho, that's why I love this series, it gives a new breath to the concept of demons in anime, instead of beings that pursue power for domination, they are just monsters with predatory instinct
In that flashback...you really feel the hurt of Himmel, that really hard lesson that he had to learn from Frieren about demon. I'm certain he did not do it ever again after that. It's kinda cold that she had to make him learn it that way, the Frieren of that moment in history with Fern and Stark would not have try it, but it was efficient !
If there's one person that knows demons it's frieren. Flamme and her trained their whole lives just to fight the demons, that's it. It's only when frieren met himmels group and after he died that she found a new reason to live.
Guys, you're overcomplicating things. Demons are not people. Demons are animals. Predators. For demons, people are prey. Nothing more. There are different ways to hunt prey. One way is to imitate the "speech" of the prey in order to deceive it and get closer. You can't negotiate with demons. Because they do NOT communicate, when they make sounds of human speech. When a hunter uses a quail-call to lure a quail, he does not "talk" to the quail. :) And naturally, they are familiar with the sense of hierarchy and subordination to the leader and working in a team. More precisely, IN A PACK. Like wolves. Or lions :)
I mean, they are technically people. Their mind state is basically what people with Antisocial Personality Disorder are like. It´s simply impossible to reason with them, just like you can´t rehabilitate a true psycopath.
It's a bit more complicated than that. Demons are genuinely as sapient as humans, but they lack certain human emotions as well as the capacity to understand those emotions. And of course, having evolved to predate on humans, they are compelled to do so even though they can survive off other food.
13:50 Yes, for example (curiosities about the DUB) Himmel's Japanese VA is Nobuhiko Okamoto better knows as the voice actor of Bakugo of My Hero Academia. And the english voice of Kacchan is playing by Clifford Chapin also Clifford is the voice of Himmel in the DUB.
Suraj is the Chief in this episode, a perfect victim for Demons. surprised he's still sad despite how many info was given of how bad is a Demon in Frieren's universe 😬
Demons are demons, in this series. They'll say, do, and promise you anything, to get you lower your guard; and the moment you do, they slaughter and consume you.
The capacity for empathy is indeed essential for co-existence. The systemic problems we're experiencing because the portion of people who seemingly lack empathy is actually a great demonstration of how incongruent it is to live in such a state. And for the most part those individuals still do actually have empathy and can be related to.
Yeah, demons live in STRICTLY hierarchical, power based societies. Even if they could be convinced to stop killing people, they would still lord whatever little power they have over anyone beneath them because they have no empathy, just like real life people with Antisocial Personality Disorder do.
Frieren’s situation is ironic, beautiful and tragic at the same time. As you said, she knows it all. All except for herself and her own emotions. But she is figuring it out, slowly but surely.
Graf granat is such a refreshing character man. He can actually assess the situation and come up with the most logical conclusions. Am so glad hes not the quintessential "whats going on here? You must be the criminal because you are at the crime scene" type of infuriating characters in almost every show
Junichi Suwabe voice Lugner here...you guys might also know him for his voice acting of Grimmjow in Bleach, Aizawa in MHA, Captain Yami in Black Clover, Barou in Blue Lock and Sukuna in JJK among his many many great roles...his tone and way of speaking is so unique, top 10 best japanese voice actor no question !!!
Fun fact: You know when Stark asks Frieren what her destination is and she simply said "Heaven" in japanese? Well, Himmel is the German translation for "Heaven" :'D
15:30 that is the whole point. demons may not be malicious and even being personally interested in living peacefully. fundamentally they have a diferent range of emotions and understanding. technically they can live in peace but we can never be sure and they are too strong to risk it.
As someone who watched the dubbed first I have to greatly disagree about her dub not having the same aloofness and nonchalance. Well maybe not the same but to act like you don’t get a similar vibe as the sub I heavily disagree
Frieren is legit the Boogeyman to demons. She is the horror stories they tell around campfires at night. She is the last person a demon would ever want to meet. Cannot wait to see your episode 10 reaction.
Frieren the anime really succeeded in presenting the opposition as truly alien. Demons appear like humanity but it's all imitation and illusion, camouflage for predation. it's so refreshing compared to the standard "anime demon lord" stuff.
This is basically what people got used to after having the bad guys become "good" in too many anime. This is not Kurama. This is Sukuna. Straight evil and doesnt want to be redeemed
Demons need to be the way they are presented in order to further develop one of the main themes of the show - relationships. Their inner species relationships are in contrast to the ones which humans develops between each other which helps them evolve. This contrast will become more evident in future episodes.
it is not about evilness or good, it is simply their nature, it is like ppl even today cant get it about psicopaths, most of them dndt wish to be like that, they ust r, for whatever may be, their brain and their feelings, perceptions etc works diff, but we still judge them with normal morals etc
One of the many things about this anime that is so good is the way demons are portrayed in this show, humans are prey to them. I don't mind the sympathetic villain trope but it's gotten used to subvert expectations so often it's got a little stale.
Yeah and it's what so many authors have done in stories for so long now, I myself have gotten bored and annoyed by antagonists because of it. I missed the days where there was a character like Frieza from DBZ or Aizen from Bleach, cause even though recent years people have been saying "Oh there're only shades of 'gray' in this world" basically in almost every story, but that there IS a lot of black and white and things DO end up that way. Freiren is the MOST refreshing series out there because of that and I love it :)
I think you do need some empathy to live alongside someone. If there isn’t a sense of guilt or connection, as soon as the humans are in a position of weakness and theirs no benefit to helping or not exploiting it, they are going to seize the opportunity to take over.
Demons manipulate and cooperate as a means to survive
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0:25 we really don’t know for sure at this point. But if you piece all the clues together you can arrive at a ballpark estimate of at least how old Frieren has to be.
15:41 You cannot teach empathy. It's either innate, or you are a psychopath. Demons in this show are like humans with psychopathy, though even the latter aren't necessarily violent.
Every series has their own take on demons. This episode has two major scenes showing demons can't be trusted. In this series, demons are irredeemably bad. Simple as that.
I think, if demons were talking like this but looked like the creature from Fern's flashback there would be far fewer people looking for nuance. It's insidious, lol. There's also an uncomfortable feeling cuz this is the sort of stuff someone trying to engineer a genocide might say. So you kinda want to keep from seeing demons as "other" cuz you can sense that slippery slope. But like, they don't have functioning organs, right? The kid demon was a talking head at the end. Is their appearance genetic or do they shape themselves like humans to get closer?
Also its a complicated stalemates of sorts... Like show so far, is that for most of Frierens life (at least as far as flashbacks up until this point and next episode, and a bit of assuming), demons ruled, over humanity, and in episode one, we learn that our heroes are on their way back, after defeating the Demon King. Which is significant, but also don't mean that all demons just disappeared, or erase the history of how long they had ruled over humanity... So we sort of have to think big, medium, and small pictures and context. Like fluctuations. In some places, humans exist in relative peace and comfort, in some others, like this city, there is still left over conflict, that seems to be building. Like many conflicts, methods of winning or breaking stalemates will differ, from outright direct conflict to subterfuge. Gets even more complicated when you add in different species, lifespans, power structures, evolutionary traits and characteristics, political aspects (a city requested assistance from other cities), so on. I also think its good to remember, that some individuals actions, can be interpreted as neutral or fair, by also be motivated by greed or selfishness. Making amends can be complicated. Like if I don't like how someone looks at me, and they have friends, well, if I take them out, their friends will attack me so... but I know there is an old man who has no friends who lives in the forest. If I rip out the eyes of the person who looks at me funny, as well as the old man, I can give the old mans eyes to the other person, to make amends. I did take their eyes, but i also gave them eyes, so fair, and the old man has no friends to attack me. I made amends, why y'all looking at me funny? It can get complicated a little, because feeling uncomfortable with how some people look at you, is also a very human thing. We could argue, the idea, that if the village people didn't give negative glances at the demon, looks of fear and anger, so on, they would have not felt a pressure to try and make "amends", and its a bit like asking modern day people to actually try and understand mental health issues better and deeper, and to understand transformative justice better over punitive justice... Or understand conditions of wealth inequality, and say homelessness better... That would be ideal, but also... Another weird way to think about it, is to imagine every human being, even human children was Himmel. Could a village of Himmel have raised that demon child, and taught them in a way to make coexisting with other humans (also Himmels) okay? So even if the Demon has moments of weakness or flaws of logic, its Himmel, physically and speed wise, they should be fine, and instead of a life or death situation, its just a learning moment... Like its a bit of a silly example, but conflict usually happens with imbalances in understanding, goals and priorities. In real life as well as fiction.
A big thing about why the demon girl tried to fix the problem she caused, she said she wants to live in peace. Shes already proven to lose to the heroes so shes still not powerful enough. While not confirmed my take has always been shes just trying to survive and her best chances is this village taking her in. And making the couple giving her death glares every day happy could help secure her spot (a wrong call of course) Ultimately she would probably turn on the village either when the heroes are long gone, shes string enough to beat the villagers/heroes, or another demon comes along she can join, since while not social creatures they obviously will make the most basic if connections needed for power
Hahaha i love this normies trying to rationalize evil. Frieren anime is simple, demons are evil and corrupt the living. They eliminate the elfs, the humans are the next
Frieren's view on demons can be tied to the other theme of the episode of human's are comparatively forgetful in the long term. Sure they'll hold celebrations of some event for 100 years, in the same way they can know absolutely demons are evil. But after enough time the pain will be dulled and the thought of "maybe we should give them a chance" will happen. Frieren probably has seen humanity make this mistake so many times.
The little demon girl didn't give them the kid to solve the problem or to actually live in peace. She did it because she deemed it to be the most optimal way to get them to accept her and lower their guards. She just wasn't experienced enough to realize that killing the chief made the situation worse. Also the reason she didn't just try to kill everyone initially is because she knew Himmel and his crew was much much stronger than her.
13:54 I completely disagree, I feel like this definitely has that but with even more nuance because I actually understand the language's nuances and tones. Plus, when personality is supposed to appear, it comes off more natural to me.
I disagree I think the dub friren can still do that cold harshness but like a charchter way latter on ubel wail there dub and sub voice are very different they are both very fitting I will settle that alufness is lost without the monotone voice in the same way friren's dub voice fits her goofy moments aswell her exited moments better there very polor opposite charchter traits that work well for her character but hard to land a voice for
I know Normies are ahead, but in case any random person reads this comment, I will state I am going to kinda spoil a bit of the show, by generally talking about all of it generally. Also talking about the movie Nope a little too. Kind of more putting SPOILERS for courtesy than really spoiling though, user, reader discretion. ... ... ... ... SPOILERS Think about humans using duck calls? Actually just think about the long and complicated history of humans and waterfowl hunting? Like the tools and technology we have around tricking and deceiving waterfowls is vast. Do humans generally use duck calling to understand, empathise, foster friendly mutual relationships with geese and ducks? Or is it to kill them for food or sport? Lets take it a step further though. Since some humans may actually have pet ducks or geese they do care about. It is technically possible for a human, to have a tranquilliser rifle, and potentially use duck calling, to only neutralise a duck, to potentially befriend it, take it in, and sincerely care about it, so in this situation, also imagine if all humans physiologically and psychology had components of ASPD and desired and generally minimised any small or intuitive amounts of empathy. Not just for ducks or geese but everything and everyone... Now imagine a duck thinking that maybe they are just misunderstood... Also I remember when the Normies watched Nope, and a big theme they discussed was some peoples inability to actually understand and respect wild animals. To think that special relationships can happen, if you just show a wild animal you mean no harm, and are friendly... Like special vibes and connections. Except thats not how wild animals work, at all. Does it make them inherently evil? No, but... there is. a huge difference between understanding, respecting and keeping your guard and wits up, and empathising and projecting the idea that say a shark can form deep loyalty and respect and admiration, and attachment for you, because you feed it. Can you teach a shark morality? A lot of default human nature involves empathy, intuition, projection. Its important to remember empathy can be understood and learned about as well. Consider and compare a very friendly 4 year old, who empathises with another child who is hungry and shares their food, with a really good professional psychiatrist or psychologist, decades into careers, who volunteers in a soup kitchen in the weekends. Both can be very empathetic, but one would probably understand it a lot better. Seeing any "humanoid" races in fiction, will often mean many of us will attempt to empathise just intuitively. Especially when a lot of shows we watch, in fact, create their fictional races to have actual friendly members, or even just rare exceptions... Like Demon Slayer, Castlevania, and many many others... So what about Frieren? Given the pace of the show, which is slow, how careful, and deliberate and consistent it is... how it deals with morality, like around Stark and Eisen and how its okay to be scared... How well thought out its world building is, to be juggling two different depicted eras? I think they are sending a pretty deliberate and careful message. That being said, I don't think its that demons in the show are innately evil or beyond redemption and potential coexistence. Its like certain modern personality disorders, that negatively affect peoples ability to empathise. In ideal modern societies, where such conditions can be diagnosed early and young, and you have a solid parenting and family structure, thats supported by friends, extended family, the community, with good social and financial safety nets for everyone... You can teach and make such individuals to coexist and integrate into society much like anyone else, with no issues. However like 2000 years ago, you take into account uneven power dynamics, the lack of understanding of mental health, you have a large next door neighbour that seems like they might murder people as a hobby... In the Frieren setting, demons are much stronger, faster and durable than humans. They are antisocial great white sharks, with a lack of empathy, that learned how to talk, and listen, and walk, because humans have spears and swords... but the main and first priority is to eat and kill, not just to survive, but for sport as well, a bit like the humans using duck calls. Like there are also some humans trying to communicate with whales, for scientific reasons... so maybe like in 2000 years, humans will have technology, and ways to teach sharks and communicate friendly with grizzlies, and all that, but also don't be Ricky's characters from Nope. Empathy is one thing, respect and understanding something else. (Side note, I don't want to make it seem like I am vilifying people with ASPD, since enough of that stigma already exists, but as far as discussions of empathy, and peoples intuitive empathy, which can be misleading, and learned empathy, which involves actual learning and understanding, and thus about dispelling stigmas that can develop, especially around mental health and humanity's horrible treatment of different peoples, in the past, but still ongoing in some ways today...)
nah, you have to understand that nature is nature, think as the demons would be lions, if the lion turns veggie 😅, he is still a lion, and can kill you anytime, thats why humans don’t live with lions 😅, nature doesn’t change, i could go very deep in this subject but i think you get the idea 👍
I love that you picked up on the Shtark. Because in Japanese there's no st. It's シュタ (shu ta) the "u" is omitted in a lot of Japanese works. Stark in Japanese is シュタルク (shutaruku). Good catch guys!
I like how alien the writer made the demons in Frieren. You can see that the demon child isn't evil per se. There's an actual calculation being made (the computer reference you make is apt): "If I replace the daughter I ate, then the family won't want to kill me anymore, but based on their reaction, if I just try to take the chief's daughter, he'll want to stop me. So, I'll kill the chief, give the family a new daughter, and everyone wins!" There's more nuance to them then Frieren herself lets on, but there's no interest in coexistence being shown by them. Though I'm sure if the demon child believed itself strong enough, it may not have bothered with the "peace overture". The one thing I can't stand is Lugner's, "Who knows?" line. It's so dumb to say demons don't understand what words mean when they *clearly* do. They have entire conversations with each other in private, and you can't negotiate peace if you just show up and start saying things like, "Kumquat rotary engine!". If I wanted to learn Spanish so I could trick and eat Spanish people, I'd still have to know what I'm saying. The demon child grew up alone and is young, so relying on a word like "mom" that it can't understand but knows humans react positively to makes sense, but you can't tell me it doesn't understand language when it goes on a whole monologue explaining it's actions. If the writer had said they didn't understand the power of family words because they don't understand the concept of family, that would be fine. But straight up saying they don't know the dictionary definition of "father" after growing older and being in constant contact with humans? Nonsense.
Not quite nonsense. Even if they know what a ‘father’ is in accordance with a dictionary definition (one of two tango participants), the _moment_ nuance enters the picture (a “father” goes to the store for milk and doesn’t return, a “father” is a role model, a “father” is a leader in a religion, a “father” is ‘maybe’ the husband of a wife _or_ the secret third party in the relationship), demons likely _check out_ hard. At which point, the _exact_ , shorthand definition for a given word, becomes a gun with a single bullet, and _every_ time they use the word, they run the risk of proving they don’t know what they’re talking about.
(Alternate phrasing) With the sheer amount of uses given words have, they have a _vague_ impression of how to string certain words together that doesn’t lend to true understanding. To which end, among demons, conversation can amount to trading notes on what tricks ‘worked’ and what tricks did not land, or become surreal affairs where any normal person would immediately catch malapropisms and outright misusage of words and phrases that another demon wouldn’t.
You seem to not have understood literally any of that then lmao, they know speech and basic reactions humans get FROM words, but they do not know actual understandings of said words, that's why Frieren says they are capable of speech SPECIFICALLY to deceive and NOT actual communication/understanding.
@@atifzaman8095 Maybe. That certainly makes the scene sound better to me. It could be a translation issue too, since what Lugner says in Japanese doesn't use any of the words I recognize for "I don't know/Who knows".
The Humans have a barrier. So they clearly don't need expansion to succeed. The Demons desire expansion and the barrier is preventing that. So those who love demons. How are the Demons good in this situation?
if you interested in demon in frieren the 2nd season explore more deep in golden country arc. but well have to wait like the rest of us for 2nd season lol
That's the great thing about this show is that there's absolute evil here and it's the demons. They're like when you first meet the Borg in Star Trek, before they got nerfed. I never watched the dub. I'm a sub guy. I've watched so much anime without knowing Japanese and unsubbed, but I could still figure out what they were saying because the storytelling and the voice acting gets it across. You guys should know that Frieren is over 1000 years old. I like the cold open with Frieren talking about Flamme and her being compared to a fairy tale and when Frieren says she's the only one that remembers her face and Himmel's expression slightly changes leading to why he has so many statues made...
im suprised people said that about frieren in dub because most people usually tell me frieren is the best part of the dub lol i like both but frieren is allways the dub performance people hype up to me.
The only people who hype the dub are those who never watched the original, so they have no concept of why Frieren's dub version completely butchers her character. I think their favorite thing to say is that she is "boss mama" or something like that, which is not how she comes across in the manga or original Japanese language.
@@willpina i mean thats your opinion lol i liked both. there both just different interpretations of the manga. for all we know nether could sound the way the authors imagined them in there head.
@@willpina "dUb BuTcHeReD hEr ChArAcTeR" she's better cast in dub. Frieren sub isn't bad obviously but it suffers from alot of poor casting compared to the dub. "How the author envisioned them" dude Akira Toriyama envisioned Goku sounding like an old lady, THE AUTHOR DOESNT ALWAYS USE LOGIC.
My issue with the demons is the difference between how the one in the flashback was shown and how the current 3 are portrayed. The flashback demon didn't seem evil, just neutral/plank. It just couldn't understand human logic and was acting out of self preservation without malice. She really felt like an animal that could talk to humans but can't understand them. There appeared to be nuance. But then when we get to the current 3, they just seem to be the basic evil villains. They know they're doing bad things and are aware of their actions. They brag and gloat. If not for Frieren's explanation, would they appear as anything more than 3 bad people lying to everyone? The flashback added complexity that isn't reflected with the modern demons.
The flashback demon is "evil" the same as any other demon. not evil as we human understand but evil in it practice in it consequences. very easy way to understand this logic is the quote "Demon don't NEED to eat human" then why is The flashback demon eat villager daughter....that the evil part. So everything that can be view as neutral("self preservation") cease to be neutral because it serve the "evil" purpose which is brought about danger to itself by itself in the first place. so by definition demon are without intent of evil or malice but by nature evil in itself...that my interpretation.
3 місяці тому
They don’t know really. They both operate under orange and blue morality logic totally foreign to us.
You mentioned complexity but that was because it was in danger and felt that way so it's behavior mirrored that of a cornered animal. They aren't in danger so why pretend?
Here I'll make it easy for your Sunday Rundown, cuz this is gettin rough. The show has said these things direct & thru context, but you guys seem to miss/over think them. Frieren's over 1000, seen everything and the Demons are bad and not redeemable. More flashbacks will come to support, for the reason of the low elf population and how Demons are only evil, about their survival and only respect power. Humans are cattle to them.
Empathy is key to keep a safe human civilization. Imagine humans without empathy, that’s a sociopath who tend to be murderers. How would our civilization survive with sociopaths freely amongst us, is that a safe world. Ridiculous over rationalizing on a point.
To be fair against all the die hard fans in comments saying the demon thing is done so well and normies missed it, some reddit post discussed the same issue. I saw a post that had issue with an opponent that’s just evil period. They linked it to how people saw groups in real life as just below others and who “enjoyed being free labor”. So it’s hard for people to just take face value that a group that seems smart is just bad. I’m more surprised how all the fans so easily agree with frieren no debate prior the reveal. But there are people who like orcs in lord of the rings to be mindless monsters to be culled vs having wants and needs so I guess it’s whatever. Personally I don’t really think the demons being completely evil is that much deeper than other stories but I could be missing something. People say the demons are better villians than say jjk mahito or sukuna frieza dbz etc so I’m definitely gonna need to rewatch. They seemed sorta okay I guess nothing mind blowing.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
This is one of my favorite episodes. I love how the humans can't comprehend that the demons might just be monsters without empathy, without any good inside them.
Even watchers/readers of the show can't help but wonder "Maybe Frieren is wrong?". We have no basis for thinking that, we think like this because it's our nature, and we can't help it.
Tbf, lots of recent media has made it so that races like orcs or goblins are allegories for minorities. Even Dungeon Meshi has done that with orcs. Frieren has made the subversive choice of saying, "No, demons are inhuman monsters in human flesh." They are scorpions.
That's why I love the writing so much, cause I can't help but laugh when real life reactors are actually being manipulated by the demon characters words, just like the humans in the story lol
Just commented something similar to this but totally agree. I don't think nothing is truly evil or bad but our greatest strength as humans is wanting to see the good in everything. Demons in frieren realized this and turned it into a weakness to exploit simple. They are not good or evil and neither are we but nature says we cannot coexist.
It also exploits age as a factor for is Frieren right. Because she has a history with demons as recent as the journey with Himmel. If we look at a person saying another person is a predator we'd likely conclude they have a bias because of previous conflicts.
@@andrewmahabir589 thats actually not our greatest strength, that's one of our biggest weakness which can be exploited by cunning enemies. throughout human history, many all trusting and benevolent people have been bacstabbed by evil people,
What i like is tht its shown that basically Demons truly just watch learn and imitate words, but for most words they dont actually understand them, its like parroting and seeing whats effective, it shoes how intelligent they are
as for the child demon she was trying to not get killed not trying to make amends
Yea demons in this show are beyond saving but they are powerful and intelligent.
@@minuette1752 my fave thing is you can tell it works because every reactor ive seen falls for it, if you give someone a human face it lower our gaurd
Chris’s idea about teaching them; we be mentioned in season 2, if there is one
I don't think it's that simple. We see that they do care about each other so it's really open to interpretation at the end of the day
"I still feel like I can save the demons" Welp you're gettin eaten.
Pathological altruism is a real social problem
@@MoreEvilThanYahweh I would argue egoism is more of a problem. We slowly killing our planet becouse people in power just dont care about people and the future.
@@syressx9098 That's a problem with those at top, I'm referring to the people on the ground and "middle management" level, their enablers of sorts given the well-intentioned rhetoric most of them use.
This is not Nezuko. It's a pretty version of the monster in IT trying to lure you into the sewer. And you all are Georgie.
Yo that's a perfect analogy lmfao
Haha, true.
Humanizing demon is so common nowadays, that we forget about their true nature which is to hunt.
@@I_am_doomed True tho, that's why I love this series, it gives a new breath to the concept of demons in anime, instead of beings that pursue power for domination, they are just monsters with predatory instinct
Draht: Are you stronger than me?
Frieren: "I'm stronger than your boss's boss"
In that flashback...you really feel the hurt of Himmel, that really hard lesson that he had to learn from Frieren about demon. I'm certain he did not do it ever again after that. It's kinda cold that she had to make him learn it that way, the Frieren of that moment in history with Fern and Stark would not have try it, but it was efficient !
If there's one person that knows demons it's frieren. Flamme and her trained their whole lives just to fight the demons, that's it. It's only when frieren met himmels group and after he died that she found a new reason to live.
Guys, you're overcomplicating things.
Demons are not people.
Demons are animals. Predators.
For demons, people are prey. Nothing more.
There are different ways to hunt prey. One way is to imitate the "speech" of the prey in order to deceive it and get closer.
You can't negotiate with demons. Because they do NOT communicate, when they make sounds of human speech. When a hunter uses a quail-call to lure a quail, he does not "talk" to the quail. :)
And naturally, they are familiar with the sense of hierarchy and subordination to the leader and working in a team. More precisely, IN A PACK. Like wolves. Or lions :)
TBF some of this is elaborated on in the next couple episodes.
They'll figure it out as they go along. Show don't tell.
I mean, they are technically people. Their mind state is basically what people with Antisocial Personality Disorder are like. It´s simply impossible to reason with them, just like you can´t rehabilitate a true psycopath.
It's a bit more complicated than that. Demons are genuinely as sapient as humans, but they lack certain human emotions as well as the capacity to understand those emotions. And of course, having evolved to predate on humans, they are compelled to do so even though they can survive off other food.
Demons just be running ChatGPT version 5.0 without programed in limits.
The Demons preyed on our humanly kindness and their deception is uncanny like our lies despite there not humans it's terrifying
13:50 Yes, for example (curiosities about the DUB) Himmel's Japanese VA is Nobuhiko Okamoto better knows as the voice actor of Bakugo of My Hero Academia. And the english voice of Kacchan is playing by Clifford Chapin also Clifford is the voice of Himmel in the DUB.
Suraj is the Chief in this episode, a perfect victim for Demons. surprised he's still sad despite how many info was given of how bad is a Demon in Frieren's universe 😬
Next episode is so good, I love the line from this episode where Frieren say “stronger than aura the guillotine”.
Demons are demons, in this series. They'll say, do, and promise you anything, to get you lower your guard; and the moment you do, they slaughter and consume you.
The conversation at the end of this react about whether demons can learn emotions like empathy make me even more excited to see Macht introduced 👀
Yeah, when they said "maybe they can be taught empathy" I was like 'boy, you're in for a ride'.
Suraj: I can fix them.
Draht: are you stronger than me?
Frieren: I'm stronger than your boss's boss.
The capacity for empathy is indeed essential for co-existence. The systemic problems we're experiencing because the portion of people who seemingly lack empathy is actually a great demonstration of how incongruent it is to live in such a state. And for the most part those individuals still do actually have empathy and can be related to.
Yeah, demons live in STRICTLY hierarchical, power based societies. Even if they could be convinced to stop killing people, they would still lord whatever little power they have over anyone beneath them because they have no empathy, just like real life people with Antisocial Personality Disorder do.
Frieren’s situation is ironic, beautiful and tragic at the same time. As you said, she knows it all. All except for herself and her own emotions. But she is figuring it out, slowly but surely.
Graf granat is such a refreshing character man. He can actually assess the situation and come up with the most logical conclusions. Am so glad hes not the quintessential "whats going on here? You must be the criminal because you are at the crime scene" type of infuriating characters in almost every show
Junichi Suwabe voice Lugner here...you guys might also know him for his voice acting of Grimmjow in Bleach, Aizawa in MHA, Captain Yami in Black Clover, Barou in Blue Lock and Sukuna in JJK among his many many great roles...his tone and way of speaking is so unique, top 10 best japanese voice actor no question !!!
Totally agree! He gives so much to Lugner's character, no dub can do that. His voice and Frieren's are special.
Dudes about to rewatch this with the dub crew
Yes the part with the mother and her child being eaten gave me chills in the dub
Fun fact: You know when Stark asks Frieren what her destination is and she simply said "Heaven" in japanese? Well, Himmel is the German translation for "Heaven" :'D
15:30 that is the whole point. demons may not be malicious and even being personally interested in living peacefully. fundamentally they have a diferent range of emotions and understanding.
technically they can live in peace but we can never be sure and they are too strong to risk it.
As someone who watched the dubbed first I have to greatly disagree about her dub not having the same aloofness and nonchalance. Well maybe not the same but to act like you don’t get a similar vibe as the sub I heavily disagree
I agree. Even if it isn't as good, I understand her words and therefore can actually appreciate the performance.
Frieren is legit the Boogeyman to demons. She is the horror stories they tell around campfires at night. She is the last person a demon would ever want to meet. Cannot wait to see your episode 10 reaction.
I hope you guys enjoy this arc as much as I did the first time I watched. Cheers
next 3 episodes will blow your mind 🔥🔥
I love the dub. it flows really well. and Frieren's voice is great.
Frieren the anime really succeeded in presenting the opposition as truly alien. Demons appear like humanity but it's all imitation and illusion, camouflage for predation. it's so refreshing compared to the standard "anime demon lord" stuff.
Second season production has been decided!!...announced some hours ago!🎉
When I watched the dub that didn’t even cross my mind I felt that it was the same tone and emotion that frieren has through the whole show
This is basically what people got used to after having the bad guys become "good" in too many anime. This is not Kurama. This is Sukuna. Straight evil and doesnt want to be redeemed
Demons need to be the way they are presented in order to further develop one of the main themes of the show - relationships. Their inner species relationships are in contrast to the ones which humans develops between each other which helps them evolve. This contrast will become more evident in future episodes.
No, Granny Frieren. We don't call them demons anymore. They perfer "morally challenged."
Here we go baby! This arc might be my favorite of the whole show, can’t wait to see how they react to THAT scene in ep. 10
it is not about evilness or good, it is simply their nature, it is like ppl even today cant get it about psicopaths, most of them dndt wish to be like that, they ust r, for whatever may be, their brain and their feelings, perceptions etc works diff, but we still judge them with normal morals etc
One of the many things about this anime that is so good is the way demons are portrayed in this show, humans are prey to them. I don't mind the sympathetic villain trope but it's gotten used to subvert expectations so often it's got a little stale.
Yeah and it's what so many authors have done in stories for so long now, I myself have gotten bored and annoyed by antagonists because of it. I missed the days where there was a character like Frieza from DBZ or Aizen from Bleach, cause even though recent years people have been saying "Oh there're only shades of 'gray' in this world" basically in almost every story, but that there IS a lot of black and white and things DO end up that way. Freiren is the MOST refreshing series out there because of that and I love it :)
I think you do need some empathy to live alongside someone. If there isn’t a sense of guilt or connection, as soon as the humans are in a position of weakness and theirs no benefit to helping or not exploiting it, they are going to seize the opportunity to take over.
You guys already fall for demon Deception twice in one episode 😂
The demon Lord Lugner japanese VA is also the voice of Ryomen Sukuna.
Demons manipulate and cooperate as a means to survive
0:25 we really don’t know for sure at this point. But if you piece all the clues together you can arrive at a ballpark estimate of at least how old Frieren has to be.
Rana, gurl, your fashion sense is immaculate ❤
Suraj the hair is killing me. Drop the hair day routine asap😂
15:41 You cannot teach empathy. It's either innate, or you are a psychopath.
Demons in this show are like humans with psychopathy, though even the latter aren't necessarily violent.
Never forget: the casting is SO GOOD in the sub... That Frieren, Fern, and that Demon Child almost sound exactly the same. BRILLIANCE 🎉
No they don't sound the same
Wdym
@@akritianwesha4151 you forgot the *almost* and it's more specifically Frieren and the Demon Girl.
13:49 I feel the same about dub in delicious in dungeon. Lios and the elf are way better in English
You know the demon is gonna be a baddie when they give him the same VO as Sukana
Every series has their own take on demons. This episode has two major scenes showing demons can't be trusted. In this series, demons are irredeemably bad. Simple as that.
Still surprised Marketa ain't in this reaction series....
I think she doesn't do sub anime reactions anymore
"Lügner" literally means "liar" in German ^^ mostly all of these German names are so fitting
Sorta the equivalent of when a Western author takes a basic word from eastern language to name a character
isn't it nice the anime would just answer their questions and doubt😂
I think, if demons were talking like this but looked like the creature from Fern's flashback there would be far fewer people looking for nuance. It's insidious, lol.
There's also an uncomfortable feeling cuz this is the sort of stuff someone trying to engineer a genocide might say. So you kinda want to keep from seeing demons as "other" cuz you can sense that slippery slope.
But like, they don't have functioning organs, right? The kid demon was a talking head at the end. Is their appearance genetic or do they shape themselves like humans to get closer?
Also its a complicated stalemates of sorts... Like show so far, is that for most of Frierens life (at least as far as flashbacks up until this point and next episode, and a bit of assuming), demons ruled, over humanity, and in episode one, we learn that our heroes are on their way back, after defeating the Demon King. Which is significant, but also don't mean that all demons just disappeared, or erase the history of how long they had ruled over humanity... So we sort of have to think big, medium, and small pictures and context. Like fluctuations. In some places, humans exist in relative peace and comfort, in some others, like this city, there is still left over conflict, that seems to be building. Like many conflicts, methods of winning or breaking stalemates will differ, from outright direct conflict to subterfuge. Gets even more complicated when you add in different species, lifespans, power structures, evolutionary traits and characteristics, political aspects (a city requested assistance from other cities), so on.
I also think its good to remember, that some individuals actions, can be interpreted as neutral or fair, by also be motivated by greed or selfishness. Making amends can be complicated. Like if I don't like how someone looks at me, and they have friends, well, if I take them out, their friends will attack me so... but I know there is an old man who has no friends who lives in the forest. If I rip out the eyes of the person who looks at me funny, as well as the old man, I can give the old mans eyes to the other person, to make amends. I did take their eyes, but i also gave them eyes, so fair, and the old man has no friends to attack me. I made amends, why y'all looking at me funny? It can get complicated a little, because feeling uncomfortable with how some people look at you, is also a very human thing. We could argue, the idea, that if the village people didn't give negative glances at the demon, looks of fear and anger, so on, they would have not felt a pressure to try and make "amends", and its a bit like asking modern day people to actually try and understand mental health issues better and deeper, and to understand transformative justice better over punitive justice... Or understand conditions of wealth inequality, and say homelessness better... That would be ideal, but also... Another weird way to think about it, is to imagine every human being, even human children was Himmel. Could a village of Himmel have raised that demon child, and taught them in a way to make coexisting with other humans (also Himmels) okay? So even if the Demon has moments of weakness or flaws of logic, its Himmel, physically and speed wise, they should be fine, and instead of a life or death situation, its just a learning moment... Like its a bit of a silly example, but conflict usually happens with imbalances in understanding, goals and priorities. In real life as well as fiction.
A big thing about why the demon girl tried to fix the problem she caused, she said she wants to live in peace. Shes already proven to lose to the heroes so shes still not powerful enough. While not confirmed my take has always been shes just trying to survive and her best chances is this village taking her in. And making the couple giving her death glares every day happy could help secure her spot (a wrong call of course)
Ultimately she would probably turn on the village either when the heroes are long gone, shes string enough to beat the villagers/heroes, or another demon comes along she can join, since while not social creatures they obviously will make the most basic if connections needed for power
Hahaha i love this normies trying to rationalize evil. Frieren anime is simple, demons are evil and corrupt the living. They eliminate the elfs, the humans are the next
Because they think Talk no Jutsu will solve everything lol
They watch Naruto too much
Himmel is so kind heart 😢
All of the character names in the show are German words, it kind of spoilers it that lugner means "liar".
And so good stuff began...
You locked a dub with Marketa behind a paywall? A dub? I love the complete lack of fomo.
Frieren's view on demons can be tied to the other theme of the episode of human's are comparatively forgetful in the long term. Sure they'll hold celebrations of some event for 100 years, in the same way they can know absolutely demons are evil. But after enough time the pain will be dulled and the thought of "maybe we should give them a chance" will happen. Frieren probably has seen humanity make this mistake so many times.
The little demon girl didn't give them the kid to solve the problem or to actually live in peace. She did it because she deemed it to be the most optimal way to get them to accept her and lower their guards. She just wasn't experienced enough to realize that killing the chief made the situation worse.
Also the reason she didn't just try to kill everyone initially is because she knew Himmel and his crew was much much stronger than her.
13:54 I completely disagree, I feel like this definitely has that but with even more nuance because I actually understand the language's nuances and tones. Plus, when personality is supposed to appear, it comes off more natural to me.
I disagree I think the dub friren can still do that cold harshness but like a charchter way latter on ubel wail there dub and sub voice are very different they are both very fitting I will settle that alufness is lost without the monotone voice in the same way friren's dub voice fits her goofy moments aswell her exited moments better there very polor opposite charchter traits that work well for her character but hard to land a voice for
I know Normies are ahead, but in case any random person reads this comment, I will state I am going to kinda spoil a bit of the show, by generally talking about all of it generally. Also talking about the movie Nope a little too. Kind of more putting SPOILERS for courtesy than really spoiling though, user, reader discretion.
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SPOILERS
Think about humans using duck calls? Actually just think about the long and complicated history of humans and waterfowl hunting? Like the tools and technology we have around tricking and deceiving waterfowls is vast. Do humans generally use duck calling to understand, empathise, foster friendly mutual relationships with geese and ducks? Or is it to kill them for food or sport?
Lets take it a step further though. Since some humans may actually have pet ducks or geese they do care about. It is technically possible for a human, to have a tranquilliser rifle, and potentially use duck calling, to only neutralise a duck, to potentially befriend it, take it in, and sincerely care about it, so in this situation, also imagine if all humans physiologically and psychology had components of ASPD and desired and generally minimised any small or intuitive amounts of empathy. Not just for ducks or geese but everything and everyone... Now imagine a duck thinking that maybe they are just misunderstood...
Also I remember when the Normies watched Nope, and a big theme they discussed was some peoples inability to actually understand and respect wild animals. To think that special relationships can happen, if you just show a wild animal you mean no harm, and are friendly... Like special vibes and connections. Except thats not how wild animals work, at all. Does it make them inherently evil? No, but... there is. a huge difference between understanding, respecting and keeping your guard and wits up, and empathising and projecting the idea that say a shark can form deep loyalty and respect and admiration, and attachment for you, because you feed it. Can you teach a shark morality?
A lot of default human nature involves empathy, intuition, projection. Its important to remember empathy can be understood and learned about as well. Consider and compare a very friendly 4 year old, who empathises with another child who is hungry and shares their food, with a really good professional psychiatrist or psychologist, decades into careers, who volunteers in a soup kitchen in the weekends. Both can be very empathetic, but one would probably understand it a lot better. Seeing any "humanoid" races in fiction, will often mean many of us will attempt to empathise just intuitively. Especially when a lot of shows we watch, in fact, create their fictional races to have actual friendly members, or even just rare exceptions... Like Demon Slayer, Castlevania, and many many others... So what about Frieren? Given the pace of the show, which is slow, how careful, and deliberate and consistent it is... how it deals with morality, like around Stark and Eisen and how its okay to be scared... How well thought out its world building is, to be juggling two different depicted eras?
I think they are sending a pretty deliberate and careful message. That being said, I don't think its that demons in the show are innately evil or beyond redemption and potential coexistence. Its like certain modern personality disorders, that negatively affect peoples ability to empathise. In ideal modern societies, where such conditions can be diagnosed early and young, and you have a solid parenting and family structure, thats supported by friends, extended family, the community, with good social and financial safety nets for everyone... You can teach and make such individuals to coexist and integrate into society much like anyone else, with no issues. However like 2000 years ago, you take into account uneven power dynamics, the lack of understanding of mental health, you have a large next door neighbour that seems like they might murder people as a hobby... In the Frieren setting, demons are much stronger, faster and durable than humans. They are antisocial great white sharks, with a lack of empathy, that learned how to talk, and listen, and walk, because humans have spears and swords... but the main and first priority is to eat and kill, not just to survive, but for sport as well, a bit like the humans using duck calls. Like there are also some humans trying to communicate with whales, for scientific reasons... so maybe like in 2000 years, humans will have technology, and ways to teach sharks and communicate friendly with grizzlies, and all that, but also don't be Ricky's characters from Nope. Empathy is one thing, respect and understanding something else.
(Side note, I don't want to make it seem like I am vilifying people with ASPD, since enough of that stigma already exists, but as far as discussions of empathy, and peoples intuitive empathy, which can be misleading, and learned empathy, which involves actual learning and understanding, and thus about dispelling stigmas that can develop, especially around mental health and humanity's horrible treatment of different peoples, in the past, but still ongoing in some ways today...)
Great reaction!
nah, you have to understand that nature is nature, think as the demons would be lions, if the lion turns veggie 😅, he is still a lion, and can kill you anytime, thats why humans don’t live with lions 😅, nature doesn’t change, i could go very deep in this subject but i think you get the idea 👍
It's not a stalemate. They can't get thru Flammes barrier.
I love that you picked up on the Shtark. Because in Japanese there's no st. It's シュタ (shu ta) the "u" is omitted in a lot of Japanese works. Stark in Japanese is シュタルク (shutaruku). Good catch guys!
It's pronounced "Schtark" because it's a German word and Stark is pronounced Schtark.
frieren would definitely back the blue
Just a theory but may we be watching her flashback as she focuses on her own flashbacks too?
You can´t really teach empathy. People have empathy or they don´t. What you can do is make it so people can´t get away with misbehaving.
I like how alien the writer made the demons in Frieren. You can see that the demon child isn't evil per se. There's an actual calculation being made (the computer reference you make is apt): "If I replace the daughter I ate, then the family won't want to kill me anymore, but based on their reaction, if I just try to take the chief's daughter, he'll want to stop me. So, I'll kill the chief, give the family a new daughter, and everyone wins!"
There's more nuance to them then Frieren herself lets on, but there's no interest in coexistence being shown by them. Though I'm sure if the demon child believed itself strong enough, it may not have bothered with the "peace overture".
The one thing I can't stand is Lugner's, "Who knows?" line. It's so dumb to say demons don't understand what words mean when they *clearly* do. They have entire conversations with each other in private, and you can't negotiate peace if you just show up and start saying things like, "Kumquat rotary engine!". If I wanted to learn Spanish so I could trick and eat Spanish people, I'd still have to know what I'm saying. The demon child grew up alone and is young, so relying on a word like "mom" that it can't understand but knows humans react positively to makes sense, but you can't tell me it doesn't understand language when it goes on a whole monologue explaining it's actions.
If the writer had said they didn't understand the power of family words because they don't understand the concept of family, that would be fine. But straight up saying they don't know the dictionary definition of "father" after growing older and being in constant contact with humans? Nonsense.
Not quite nonsense.
Even if they know what a ‘father’ is in accordance with a dictionary definition (one of two tango participants), the _moment_ nuance enters the picture (a “father” goes to the store for milk and doesn’t return, a “father” is a role model, a “father” is a leader in a religion, a “father” is ‘maybe’ the husband of a wife _or_ the secret third party in the relationship), demons likely _check out_ hard.
At which point, the _exact_ , shorthand definition for a given word, becomes a gun with a single bullet, and _every_ time they use the word, they run the risk of proving they don’t know what they’re talking about.
(Alternate phrasing) With the sheer amount of uses given words have, they have a _vague_ impression of how to string certain words together that doesn’t lend to true understanding.
To which end, among demons, conversation can amount to trading notes on what tricks ‘worked’ and what tricks did not land, or become surreal affairs where any normal person would immediately catch malapropisms and outright misusage of words and phrases that another demon wouldn’t.
You seem to not have understood literally any of that then lmao, they know speech and basic reactions humans get FROM words, but they do not know actual understandings of said words, that's why Frieren says they are capable of speech SPECIFICALLY to deceive and NOT actual communication/understanding.
@@alecLogan Except none of that is what we see in the show (or manga).
@@atifzaman8095 Maybe. That certainly makes the scene sound better to me. It could be a translation issue too, since what Lugner says in Japanese doesn't use any of the words I recognize for "I don't know/Who knows".
The Humans have a barrier. So they clearly don't need expansion to succeed. The Demons desire expansion and the barrier is preventing that. So those who love demons. How are the Demons good in this situation?
if you interested in demon in frieren the 2nd season explore more deep in golden country arc. but well have to wait like the rest of us for 2nd season lol
HERE WE GOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
For you guys rewatching shows solo, can the $5 tier have access or is it only the premium tier that has access? 🤔👀
Next few episodes boutta be good
Demons in this show is straight up evil, they may lie and say they want to have "piece" or understand human to deceive them
That's the great thing about this show is that there's absolute evil here and it's the demons. They're like when you first meet the Borg in Star Trek, before they got nerfed. I never watched the dub. I'm a sub guy. I've watched so much anime without knowing Japanese and unsubbed, but I could still figure out what they were saying because the storytelling and the voice acting gets it across.
You guys should know that Frieren is over 1000 years old. I like the cold open with Frieren talking about Flamme and her being compared to a fairy tale and when Frieren says she's the only one that remembers her face and Himmel's expression slightly changes leading to why he has so many statues made...
im suprised people said that about frieren in dub because most people usually tell me frieren is the best part of the dub lol i like both but frieren is allways the dub performance people hype up to me.
The only people who hype the dub are those who never watched the original, so they have no concept of why Frieren's dub version completely butchers her character.
I think their favorite thing to say is that she is "boss mama" or something like that, which is not how she comes across in the manga or original Japanese language.
@@willpina i mean thats your opinion lol i liked both. there both just different interpretations of the manga. for all we know nether could sound the way the authors imagined them in there head.
Wrong, Americans always try to subvert the original work, the autor in Japan have yo give his approbation to the voice actors.
@@tamarindo709 what are you even talking about?😂 and what statement was wrong? and wy are yall all the angry it is not that deep
@@willpina "dUb BuTcHeReD hEr ChArAcTeR" she's better cast in dub. Frieren sub isn't bad obviously but it suffers from alot of poor casting compared to the dub. "How the author envisioned them" dude Akira Toriyama envisioned Goku sounding like an old lady, THE AUTHOR DOESNT ALWAYS USE LOGIC.
lol aura and her subordinates has no idea who just came in the city.....
Demons are to be slayed.
One episode a week is not enough
My issue with the demons is the difference between how the one in the flashback was shown and how the current 3 are portrayed.
The flashback demon didn't seem evil, just neutral/plank. It just couldn't understand human logic and was acting out of self preservation without malice. She really felt like an animal that could talk to humans but can't understand them. There appeared to be nuance.
But then when we get to the current 3, they just seem to be the basic evil villains. They know they're doing bad things and are aware of their actions. They brag and gloat. If not for Frieren's explanation, would they appear as anything more than 3 bad people lying to everyone?
The flashback added complexity that isn't reflected with the modern demons.
The flashback demon is "evil" the same as any other demon. not evil as we human understand but evil in it practice in it consequences. very easy way to understand this logic is the quote "Demon don't NEED to eat human" then why is The flashback demon eat villager daughter....that the evil part. So everything that can be view as neutral("self preservation") cease to be neutral because it serve the "evil" purpose which is brought about danger to itself by itself in the first place. so by definition demon are without intent of evil or malice but by nature evil in itself...that my interpretation.
They don’t know really. They both operate under orange and blue morality logic totally foreign to us.
You mentioned complexity but that was because it was in danger and felt that way so it's behavior mirrored that of a cornered animal. They aren't in danger so why pretend?
21:14 demon girl ate the child.
Because she can’t kill everyone since Himmel is there
Here I'll make it easy for your Sunday Rundown, cuz this is gettin rough. The show has said these things direct & thru context, but you guys seem to miss/over think them. Frieren's over 1000, seen everything and the Demons are bad and not redeemable. More flashbacks will come to support, for the reason of the low elf population and how Demons are only evil, about their survival and only respect power. Humans are cattle to them.
Empathy is key to keep a safe human civilization. Imagine humans without empathy, that’s a sociopath who tend to be murderers. How would our civilization survive with sociopaths freely amongst us, is that a safe world. Ridiculous over rationalizing on a point.
To be fair against all the die hard fans in comments saying the demon thing is done so well and normies missed it, some reddit post discussed the same issue. I saw a post that had issue with an opponent that’s just evil period. They linked it to how people saw groups in real life as just below others and who “enjoyed being free labor”. So it’s hard for people to just take face value that a group that seems smart is just bad. I’m more surprised how all the fans so easily agree with frieren no debate prior the reveal. But there are people who like orcs in lord of the rings to be mindless monsters to be culled vs having wants and needs so I guess it’s whatever. Personally I don’t really think the demons being completely evil is that much deeper than other stories but I could be missing something. People say the demons are better villians than say jjk mahito or sukuna frieza dbz etc so I’m definitely gonna need to rewatch. They seemed sorta okay I guess nothing mind blowing.
now we come to the episodes that spawned some of the most obnoxious debates around this show lol
need moreee
This tumb 😂💀
lmao they'll be demon food
Lol normies would die first against demons, they are evil, all the demons!
The good demon and that there are some good demons is such a overdone trope, that is such a surprise when demons are just demons
Walsh Locks
We better hope Frieren never meets Nezuko 😂😂
i prefer the dub
Thanks for sharing your preference that's all this discussion is really. Personally I just want people to watch the show that's best for them
Look up what "Lügner" means in english ;)