The Thalmor are Secret Daedra Worshippers & Here is Why
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- Опубліковано 1 жов 2024
- In our latest Elder Scrolls video we explore a theory about how the Thalmor are secret daedra worshippers.
The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim is an open world action role-playing video game developed by Bethesda Game Studios and published by Bethesda Softworks. It is the fifth main installment in The Elder Scrolls series and was released worldwide on November 11, 2011. The game's main story revolves around the player character and their quest to defeat Alduin the World-Eater, a dragon who is prophesied to destroy the world. The videogame is set two hundred years after the events of Oblivion, and takes place in the fictional province of Skyrim.
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"I hear Daedra worship has become increasingly prevalent in the Summerset Isle."
-NPCs in Oblivion who are overly obsessed with the topic.
"Have you heard of the High Elves?" "I hear Daedra worship has become increasingly prevalent in the Summerset Isle."
Oh god more evidence.... lol
Not to mention the other dialogue about summerset mentions syndicates of wizards leading a boycott of imperial goods
My god, evidence!
the altmer have powerful wizards. it could be a dangerous situation.
"i hear daedra worship is becoming ingrisinly prevent in the summerset isles" is a radiant conversations line in oblivion
200 years before skyrim
coincidence? I THINK NOOOOT!!!!!!!!
As well as "Syndicates of Wizards have lead a boycott of Imperial goods in the land of the Altmer." "The Summerset Isles have become a much more dangerous place."
Possibly the Thalmor? The soldiers in the Embassy, if you don't attack them during the main quest, talk about Mages being sent over. And complain about them bossing troopers around before joking about feeding them to the dragons. Maybe the hierarchy is biased towards mages? It's not like the soldiers of the Dominion aren't spellcasters themselves. But the officers, politicians, and inquisitors are all pure mages rather than battlemages.
@@bigch33se11 you begin to wonder how much of this the writers had planed ahead of time and how much thay retrofitted
Glarthir would approve this
@@articusramos808 who do you think was after him?
Hard to say
The more I hear about Auri-El the less he sounds like Akatosh and more like an elven Talos.
Kings are always similar.
wait auri-el is akatosh?
@@nofun.8376 They are an elven god, sometimes described like a 'second face' of akatosh. They're a less happy-about-creation version of the god of time.
@@nofun.8376 both are the time god that is correct.
Well, that would make sense
Talos = Lorkhan
Auriel = Akatosh
Lorkhan = Akatosh
I know that last bit is disputed more, but if you go with it then this works.
Fudgemuppet at dinner be like:
Fudgemuppet: "I promise I won't get polítical"
*1 sujamma later*
Fudgemuppet: "Thalmor are daedra worshippers, Change my mind".
"needless to say, this diner is scrumptious, and features some of my favorite delicacies, however, I must voice my concerns about the true spiritual endeavours of our wanna-be-rulers, the Thalmors, for their faith is not what they're leading us to believe.
@@b.bergeron8769 I read that in Drew’s voice and it’s so accurate 😂😂
I hope the day has found you well thane
This is something I could see Michael saying lmaoo
I misread the title as “The Thalmor’s Secret Daddy.”
Understandable
What in oblivion
Considering there must be Daedric Prince behind it makes sense
So...who would the Thalmor’s secret daddy be?
Deadra may like to be called daddy
"Secret"? All the accounts on the Oblivion Crisis, Ruby Amulet, and Great War talk about is high elves chucking daedra at humanity.
Even non-Daedra worshippers use summoning so that alone I think is not full evidence
@@McHobotheBobo you have a rather fine point.
Runil was a powerful Thalmor battlemage that killed tons of Imperials whilst being a really good Conjuration user/trainer also has some implications
Conjuration spells are just summoning daedra and conjuration mages are normally worshippers of the aedra.
@@bigch33se11 hes only a beginner trainer. and hes weak af, as if he killed tons of imperials lol
Aldmeri Dominion is, according to subtitles, the old Mary dominion. The latter is more terrifying then the former, if old Mary is an Irish mother who uses a wooden spoon as a weapon liberally.
Oh my god.
the mary sue dominion
Haha
My Grandma was Irish & I'm pretty sure I remember her mentioning "Old Mary" when I was younger. That & her father thought he saw the Banshee & wouldn't leave his room for days after the event.
Lmao I swear that’s all I hear when npcs say “aldmeri”
"The only thing pure about the high elves is their self centered stupidity."
A Ebonheart Pact Dunmer
Love this XD
*an
Coming from a dunmer that's super hypocritical
Their not even elves they were atmoran people who didn't want to die like mortals so they offered souls to daedra for elf bodies
Ironic! Coming from a filthy Dummer, no less. The fallen Chimmer are in no position to criticize anyone!
The main issue I take with this theory is that I think Boethiah would reject what the Thalmor are trying to do. The point of the psijic endeavor is to escape the Aurbis entirely, not mearly mortality. That's why Boethiah so vehemently opposed Trinimac and Auriel, as he understood what Lorkhan was trying to do, and rejected the lies that the elven gods told about him.
Maybe Boethiah knows they'll ultimately fail, and is just in it for the bloodsport along the way :p
@@jogglenoggle9579 nah, I think if that were the case, Boethiah wouldn't have gone all that way to expose trinimac and pass their teachings to Veloth
They say Boethiah is Lorkhan's lover, because she alone truly understood what Lorkhan's end-goal was.
The thing that occurs to me, however, is that it's never addressed if Lorkhan actually.. you know.. TOLD HER.
Lorkhan is God, capital 'G'. He is the Meaning of Life and the reason everything we know, and everything we ever will know, exists in the first place. Without him there is nothing, no meaning, and the passage of time is useless and irrelevant.
So Lorkahan creates the Mundus for whatever reasons he has, and those reasons are the literal "Meaning of Life'".
Boethiah CLAIMS that Lorkhan's intention was the Psijic Endeavor, allowing the mortals to become Godheads and create their own Aurbis. But Boethiah is NOT LORKHAN, and we're taking the word of an established liar, deceiver god as truth? I'm not convinced.
That is not to say I believe Boethiah is lying; I think they certainly do have mortal's best interests at heart (in her own twisted, bloody way), but I don't think Boethiah could truly understand what Lorkahn's intentions were, and that she's preaching a philosophy she herself only half-understands.
Eh, but did the Elven gods really lie though? They were pissed that HE lied to THEM. If anything, the fact that Boethia is literally a God of plotz and deception... are we REALLY gonna act like she may have, ya know, lied about Trinimac?
@@Alizudo
Not necessarily. He's not a god with a capital G. If anything it would be Auriel. Without him, time and the very stability of the universe wouldn't even exist... all other Et'Ada were given a proper form and understanding of, well, ethereal stuff thanks to him making it an orderly manner.
Even if you disagree, Anu kicks off the chain first, and went down to Anui-El to Auriel, and Padomay followed a similar line, so Auriel may have been made first in the interplay. If not, he's still just as fundamental as Lorkhan, if not more.
“Reach heaven by violence” is token Boethiah.
Which is why I prefer Sheogorath's philosophy, "Reach heaven by cheese".
Mmm, cheese!
@ilove bigbrother
But they didn't just use trickery, they outright cheated.
The whole point of the Psijic Endeavor is to truly, and deeply, understand the Meaning of Life and achieve Godhood through your own effort.
Vivec and the Tribunal instead stole a heart and squeezed out some concentrated god-juice and drank it.
They didn't earn it, they didn't understand it, and they didn't know the Meaning of Life.
Not only did they not earn it, they then started creating religions TO THEMSELVES preaching about how they "truly understood" and "if you do as I say you can be a god too!" which is a COMPLETE LIE.
So the Daedra, who are *_actually_* gods, rightly became *_extremely pissed off_* that these lying, cheating, stealing pretenders were going about creating fake religions.
They think making talos worship illegal would let talos return as a mortal allowing them to steal the heart of lorkhan he used to become god to do what the dwemer did
@@Fenris2
Wasn't the heart destroyed? the heart is a catalyst but tiber septim had to achieve chim to become divine
Thinking Nirn is a prison seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy. They waste their long lives on Mundus seeking apotheosis, even though there is a very high chance that it could never happen regardless of what they do. They chase the immortality that they will receive upon death anyways instead of living fulfilling lives.
@SGRKing I tend to disagree. What was the view of Man towards Lorkhan and Mundus? What are the teachings of the Imperial Cult? The belief of Nirn being a prison is more in-line of Gnosticism or Buddhist teaching (samsara) as opposed to what Christianity taught that God made all things good as well as the teachings of Jesus. Granted Buddhism has the Eightfold Path and the call to be virtuous, and the goal of Buddhists is Nirvana, complete non-attachment.
More self-defeating, imo.
@@mmyr8ado.360 This. People are way too quick to just yell “Christianity!” but completely miss the fact that TES is more gnostic than anything.
@Cannabis Dreams Depends on the strain.
@SGRKing I’m pretty damn sure that isn’t gnosticism lol.
I believe that Auriel faces a similar problem as Vivec. In attempting to create a better life for the Dunmer, Vivec blocked the path to enlightenment through his own journey. Auriel may also be struggling with this obstacle, as he wishes for the Altmer to break free of the mortal plane, yet in doing it himself, he has blocked the way similar to Vivec.
I don't know. Vivec also has the added issue of being sort of blinded by the privileged conditions of his own enlightenment. I always thought the idea that he could serve as an "example" to the dunmer on how to reach CHIM was ridiculous, as most dunmer don't have access to the heart of Lorkhan to push them along. It's sort of like a billionaire who was born a millionaire telling average people "Just do what I did, 'pull yourself up by your own bootstraps', and you can be as successful as me!" I think this is what pissed off the daedra about it so much too, as these really sort of were "false gods" who didn't understand their nature or what they were teaching to their people, since they didn't really get there through understanding or achieving some state of enlightenment, but by stealing some god juice from the heart. If Auriel really did ascend back to heaven as a result of seeking wisdom and finding the way back, I think it would be much more plausible that her example would be able to be followed by others.
@@achristiananarchist2509
Agreed, Auriel knows how the system works, he's probably just sad that his Aldmeri children are suffering and just haven't gotten it quite right. It's said that after a pilgrimage, the Falmer (Snow Elves) had reached and achieved an enlightenment, and that every one that succeeded bathed in light with a look of relief and content on their face.
The most exceptional achievement of Snow Elven Civilization was the Chantry, and they may have found a way to achieve what Auriel did, given they were his most astute worshippers.
@@achristiananarchist2509 If vivec had that issue, and he certainly seems to think he did, then auriel does to an even greater extent. Auriel has never been mortal, while vivec has.
@@tzaphkielconficturus7136 If you believe that mortals are the descendents of the aedra, who lost their power when they created the world, and that Auriel somehow regained hers, then I don't see how this logic holds. Auriel was an aedric being who lost her power and then figured out how to regain it. Mortals are aedric beings who lost their power and need to figure out how to regain it. Vivec is a guy who was handed power when he hit a heart with a stick.
@@achristiananarchist2509 " If you believe that mortals are the descendants of the aedra, who lost their power when they created the world, and that Auriel somehow regained hers, then I don't see how this logic holds. Auriel was an aedric being who lost her power and then figured out how to regain it."
Not necessarily all of it, first of all, and secondly, Auriel may have regained some measure of his divine power, but has not completed the Psijic endeavor. This is a different goal, which auriel is probably not capable of.
"Mortals are aedric beings who lost their power and need to figure out how to regain it. Vivec is a guy who was handed power when he hit a heart with a stick."
You can argue that elves are the descendants of such aedric beings, but even that isn't really true for the men or beastfolk, and living elves aren't their ancestors. Further, the Psijic endeavor isn't solely about power; Vivec did not complete it by taking power from the heart of Lorkahn, but by achieving CHIM. He realized that he couldn't lead his people to ascension by violence, while protecting them from suffering.
Drew: I won't take sides
Also Drew: *Spends entire intro badmouthing Shor*
Based.
F**k Shor.
He shor did
@@TonberryQueen Shor >
What the f**k is JUICE?!
The fact that the psijic order assists the player in the Magnus eye quest in skyrim, is proof enough of their malevolent intentions. I don't think it would ever be easy to pick out where they went wrong, but the altmer seemed doomed to repeat the crimes of the aylieds. There not there yet, but it seems many of them wish to get there. Its unimaginable the true horror that was unleashed by ancient elves of the nedic people in cyrodiil. So bad that the gods had to send a future robot to try to set things right! And now the Mer are at it again... if you watch AllinALL, which I recommend for baby scamps sake.
@Wirr Ling That's his point I'm pretty sure.
This "Robot" were Not sended by the aedric or deadric gods. Numidium were createt by the Dwemer/Deep Elves repaired by the Dunmer given to the Empire as a present who createt Numidiums rein Brother. In the end the Elves will win. Nur there are many Elven Species and much more factions.
@@Kira-is9vu he's not talking about the Numidium, but our favorite genocidal crusader, Pelinal Whitestrake
I know it's a very fun concept, but Whitestrake is not confirmed cyborg, and I don't think it was "the gods" that sent him.
@@M00nH34rt I just told that op was talking about Pelinal. I know him being a cyborg is a theory 🤷♂️
It’d be ironic if they did the exact same thing as the Ayleids. A massive fall from grace, become conquered and vassals after a tyrannical reign. I’m just waiting for that day.
You literally described the Septim Dynasty and you don't know it
Races of elves genocided by humans: 3
Races of humans genocided by elves: 0
"Boohoo, elves are so mean and cruel!"
The mer started each conflict.
@Wirr Ling he'd be impossible to defeat, only the gods would rival his power
@@Aethuviel this.
If I was an Elf, I'd be very pissed as well
Last time I was this early, the Thalmor still occupied the Imperial City.
I bought Skyrim for the Switch, happy af since I was never able to play the DLC back when I first played Skyrim for the 360. I discovered your channel at the same time, so glad I did. You guys are the best
Watch out around the nirnroot farm. I also have it on the switch and it seems to crash around there quite a lot for me
@@plate_fox I also have the Switch version and the only time I ever had it crash was a result of me exploiting glitches a bit too much, namely the one that lets you get out of bounds around Whiterun (I think I ran way too far out for it to handle)
@@plate_fox I actually just recently finished Sinderions quest! Like 2 days ago in fact. No issues experienced thankfully, but I'll keep that in mind.
@Wirr Ling Hey cant say the game feels that way though, it still feels like the janky Skyrim I played on the 360 😂
@@plate_fox You mean the Sarethi farm? I had a dragon encounter near there once. A madwoman, the Sarethi sisters, Lydia, and a bunch of Riften guards helped me in defeating it. The madwoman didn't make it, sadly. Such insanity applies to all platforms, even on the Switch.
This is just dark elf fan fiction tbh
ok outlander
Unpopular Opinion;
(God, I'm gonna get torn apart for this, but here goes nothing)
I honestly hate they just resorted to using the Daedra influence to make the Aldmeri Dominion the "Objective Evil". I mean, they hunted and rooted out Daedra worship where they could, and they have a very simple, Aedric belief in what they do... but hey, anything to make the various Elves of the Elder Scrolls the bad guys, right Bethesda? 😒
No matter the reason, it seems the Mer are always the bad guys, and anything they do, regardless of reason, is always used to somehow to make the Humans the objective good, and that they can do no wrong, and all they do is justified... like Tiber Septum who desecrated the Summerset Isles, but is hailed a hero. Like Pelinal who slaughtered many innocents with no other reason that he "thought they were a race of Elves", like Ysgramor that wiped out an entire Civilization in an Ethnic Cleansing, because the Falmer kicked them out of a single city.
I think Bethesda is telling us something. The children of Order and Stability are the ones in the wrong, but the children of Chaos, Instability, and Change are always to be revered and never questioned or called out for their atrocities. I'm kinda disappointed, always undermining/underhanded the Elves.
Elves are bad. If you support elves you support genocide
Elves symbolize stagnation while humans are change. To be at a standstill is to assure destruction. Seeking to stamp out change or the forces that bring change will only hasten that destruction.
@@Marmar90m
No, the Races of Elves have never wiped out a race of Humans.
Mankind on the other hand, have commited genocide upon multiple races of Mer. The Aylieds, the Sinestral, the Falmer...
Slavery (for the most part) has been an Elven Institution, but Genocide Is a human practice. The Redguards? They Slaughtered absolutely everyone in Hammerfell in one of the most devastating invasions of Tamriel. The Nords commited an Ethnic Cleansing of an entire Civilization, culture, history, and nearly ended the entire Falmer race, all after the destruction of a single city, who's inhabitants (given we don't know the full account on other side) may very well have been part of something that pissed the Snow Elves off, but of course Ysgramor would never tell us that 🤷🏿
So yeah, more Humans have commited Mass Genocide than Elves and are responsible for a lot of BS like many Dragon Breaks, so I mean... the Elves have had their wrongdoings and shitty things, but the Humans are certainly not free of Blemish either, and have caused their fair share of Bullshit in Tamriel...
Of course, most fans never call them out. Like killing the Aylieds who were allied with Allesia about a century after the Rebellion ended, and were Vassals to her new Order and helped Set up the first Empire with the Humans and even with the creation of the 8 Divines religion. I could go on....
@@sd5371
So, what, the forces of Chaos are the ones in the right? Wouldn't seeking to destroy the forces of Order also be cataclysmic?
@@thalmoragent9344 if chaos actively seeks to destroy order then yes but so far the elves have been the instigators it's just the chaotic forces of man have been 100 folds in response to the elves.
"Heard any news from other parts of Tamriel?" "Nothing I'd like to talk about." "They say Daedra worship has become increasingly prevalent in the Summeset Isles. " The elves have powerful wizards. Could be a dangerous situation." "Sniff" "I'm done talking" "Goodbye!"
You know it's gonna be a banger of a Drew video when it opens with "Secunda" by Jeremy Soule.
I don’t think all of the thalmor worship daedra. Or know about the Towers. Just the higher ups in the chain of command in the Aldmeri Dominion.
Humans of Tamriel: "Stop banning Talos worship! Talos is our god! We pray to him and get a blessing from him!"
Thalmor: "Talos is not a god! He's a man! A mortal!"
Chad Dunmer: "Imagine worshipping Aedra..."
"Worshipers" is probably a strong word. They'd absolutely engage and entreat the Daedra, likely dabbling in the 'old ways' of their pre-Allessian forebears, but at heart I feel like the Thalmor are more about self-worship and achieving their own delusional 'apotheosis'. The quickest way back to Aetherius is to destroy that pesky Mundus holding us all back, and Deadra can be helpful with that sort of endeavor.
Yea. I mean there power grab was caused by that. Course they cant do something if the same scale for several reasons
No, they are Aedric worshippers, the Aedra are their ancestors, Auriel, trinimac and Magnus
The 4E Thalmor's views are more similar to those of The Veiled Heritance than what the Thalmor represented in past eras.
Makes you wonder if the founders of the 4E Thalmor are descendants of Veiled Heritance members who escaped justice
Just like the wise man from far far away galaxy said:
You have become the very thing you swore to destroy.
The views of the heritance and 4th era thalmor represent a certain tone that has always been present in Altmer society representing genetic purity, heritage and dominance. This went slightly out of fashion under the more liberal queen Ayrenn, but 1000 years later these views are again at the forefront of Altmer politics and thought. Queen Ayrenn was the odd one out. Altmer aren't liberals
@@alexbrowne9566 Yeah we know that, but the more genocide-y stuff feels a little out of place when comparing the Third Aldmeri Dominion to its predecessors.
@@KB-mh5kn lots of genocides in Elven history
I always thought for all their pride and effort, the Altmer were already "corrupted" so to say. Always imagined the whole "we rejected the wandering spirits and our homeland disappeared" thing was pretty much saying "you messed up big time and you're being punished" from the gods.
Thats... not really true. The Elven Gods fought alongside the Old Ehlnofey, and together defeated the humans. Not all the gods are on the same side.
"Lorkhan shattered that land into many", and he was the Human Et'Ada that lead the Wandering Ehlnofey, the progenitors of Man.
They rejected the Ehlnofey who merged with Sithis and joined Lorkhan, and then Aldmeris/Old Ehlnofey, whatever you wanna call it was destroyed in that Ehlnofey War. If I asked to come into your house, and you didn't really know me, and could tell I had been hanging out in a place you don't want any part of, and you said I wasn't allowed inside, then if a fight starts, I'd be in the wrong, since I'm the invader here.
The Wandering Ehlnofey expected to be let inside Aldmeris, and when denied entry, started a war and ended up destroying the place they were now trying to invade.
The Mer are less corrupted than the Humans given their biology evidently shows this greater Elven ability to adapt and evolve wherever they are, and often have more innate magicka and intelligence. There's a reason the Mer were always leagues ahead of the Humans in the Merethic and First Era's, half the sophistication and advancement on Tamriel is due to the Elves... just saying.
@@thalmoragent9344 None of that in any way counters my head canon.
The history makes exactly 0% difference to the idea. The gods not all being friendly makes exactly 0% difference to the idea.
If they were supposed to go "alright, you're hot water, but come in, I guess" and then didn't do that, it would be an issue and telling me the wandering Ehlnopfay took up being friendly with Sithis wouldn't stop that from being the case. It would just add more layers of tragedy to the story.
@@YourWaywardDestiny
But how? I mean, your head Canon is yours, I can't really force that change, but if the Wandering Ehlnofey took up with Sithis and had appeased and preferred Lorkhan, why would the Old Ehlnofey who took up with Anui-El and still revered Auriel as the God king be under the requirement to bring the Wanderers into Aldmeris?
I mean, I gave my analogy, if you could answer that part, perhaps we can better understand the others mindset. The history and sides the gods took DOES make a difference.
You can't claim the gods are punishing the Elves, when there are many Elven gods that sided with them and lead them. You can't claim it was the Old Ehlnofey that causes Aldmeris to be destroyed, the Wandering Ehlnofey essentially barged their way in, with Lorkhan taking the Elderwood/Altmora away from Auriel at the start, and continuing on with the rest of Aldmeris. Their invasion is a part of the shit show in the Dawn Era.
The same happens in Tamriel all over again. Mer live all across Tamriel and vibe, then Humans come on in. Instead of outright rejecting them all after the chaos they caused in the Dawn Era, some Mer;
Allowed them to stay (Falmer, Bosmer)
Others essentially subjugated them since, well they were more advanced with an established society, and didn't see reason to kill them (Direnni)
Others had to fight them off since they were aggressive raiders (Chimer)
Others straight up tortured them (Aylieds)
We could go on, and so given the various dealings, and how many races of Mer have been wiped out by humans, its safe to say that the Old Ehlnofey had the right idea, separation was for the best given the vastly different cultural/religious beliefs would take some serious blending and work to do. The Humans come to the Mer in both cases, and it doesn't end well for a lot of people, innocent or otherwise.
@@thalmoragent9344 Have you ever heard a story of a kid getting in trouble and having to apologize when their younger sibling started hitting them first?
The parents have a reasoning for it. Not one I agree with as a practice, but a reasoning. The older child is supposed to have it more together, they're supposed to be more mature and know the rules better, they're supposed to know their own strength better. Just because the little sibling reacted poorly, doesn't mean the older sibling is free to also lash out.
The old Ehlnofey and the wandering Ehlnofey are the siblings.
The old Ehlnofey are supposed to know better.
The wandering Ehlnofey went and slapped the old Ehlnofey in the face, and then the old Ehlnofey said "you can't play with me" and that was very upsetting.
Some gods heard the bickering and fighting.
The Old Ehlnofey got grounded from their playground because someone like daddy Anui-El put his foot down during a childhood squabble.
That's the idea.
That's the curse.
It's not countered by any lore or reasoning because it is a very simple idea that isn't reliant on much.
@@YourWaywardDestiny
Wait, so Auriel and the Elven gods... punished their people for denying the Wanderers, the ones who sided with the Et'Ada that lied and stole their power to make his own realm?
The Old Ehlnofey got slapped, and then said that they wouldn't play... to me, that sounds reasonable. Most parents would scold the younger sibling for doing such a thing, and then later perhaps get the older siblings to play after the discipline of the younger one occured. THAT would be the logical thing to do.
Plus, why would Anui-El or Auriel, whoever, even punish their people, the ones who venerate and abide by Order and Stability, for standing their ground against the followers of Lorkhan, who was made by Sithis to disrupt all of this??
You’ve managed to keep me interested in this universe during the never ending wait for the next entry. Truly, man, thanks for keeping my childhood alive.
If you want more proof the play Elder Scrolls 4 Oblivion, almost any npc will mention this one fact that Daedra Worshippers are going out of control in Summerset Isle.
I was trying to think of a joke for this, but unfortunately I've been drowning in Ayl(eid). Worth a try. 😂
Ayyyyyyy(leid)!!!
You don’t say.....(leid)
@@masterneloth Its a bit of word play, basically I was saying, "I was trying to think of a joke, however I'm drowning (drunk) in Ayl instead of Ale." Then I put in (leid) at the end to express I was referring to the Ayleids which were also Daedra worshippers.
@@barbaarcapibara6287 I understood the joke I was making a joke of my of my own by saying “you don’t say” by agreeing with you but adding “leid” to make it sound like Ayleid.
@@masterneloth I think I understand what you're saying. But that it does however, I did the joke as Ayl (eid), because if the L was separate from the Ay, then it would not sound like Ale. But Ayl (a-yol), then (eid) would still bring across I'm talking about the Ayleids, without leaving out the part of the Ale part. But no worries, I understand what your point.
‘I hear daedra worship is becoming increasingly prevalent in the Summerset Isle’
‘It seems Summerset Isle just keeps getting more dangerous’
Be seeing you
Bye
So they are they are the Ayleids reborn...then I think it’s time for Pelly-Boi to make a return as well.
Nah mate. No other race but the Sload and maybe Dwemer have ever done anything close to what many Aylieds did. No more Pelinal
@@thalmoragent9344
Pelinal will return in one form or another. Or at least that's my hope.
Of course the Dwemer returning and owning them would be more entertaining to me. But then again. Pelinal 😍😍
@@thalmoragent9344 the nords
@@Walsinats4
Yeah, they were barbaric for what they did to entire Provinces in their Nordic Empire. Their Ethnic Cleansing of the Snow Elves was also terrible, along with how they worshipped Dragons and even a Daedric Prince back in the day
@@KalousTheGuy Pelinal returned in the Oblivion Crisis, mantled by the Hero of Kvatch
This is a nice way to occupy my Saturday morning
I honestly think the story about the forgotten hero donning Titus Mede's armor was pretty lame. Took away more than it added. I don't take it as canon. The story of Mede II taking back the Imperial City with Goldbrand was just way cooler and made him a better character
agreed
Canon isn't something you take... Keep to your fanon.
@@dutchpatriot17 The original canon was better
@@idipped2521 Mede being a Daedra worshipper is not better lol.
Don’t know if you’ll read this but just wanted to thank you guys for your work, it always makes my day better.
As a Bosmer, I wouldn’t be surprised that my narcissistic cousins would turn to Daedra worship. They cause nothing but destruction and chaos
You're a human from earth
@@noxabellus I think he was talking about his character and was speaking from his characters view point dude
@@discipleofveloth6058 🤡
@@noxabellus are you sure?
@@discipleofveloth6058 shheeee....don’t tell him just yet, I’m having too much fun seeing if he’ll be able to figure it out on his own😂🤣
I really don't like the term "Ayleid empire". If anything, one of the main reasons that they were defeated by Alessia was because they _weren't_ a united empire, but a loose coalition of city-states.
Makes me think about what if Boethiah was involved with the demise and corruption of the Snow Elves?
That wasn't Boethiah, that is Nocturnal.
Her Shrikes looks like Snow Elven amazons with Night Elven look.
Boethiah cares only for her dunmer and subsequently MAN thanks to lorkhan.
Plus if you look at the Twilight Sepulcher's location and how old it is, its a strangely large stargate portal that bypass the dragonfires, its possible that it was built by the falmer, as an exchange to escape mundus and the wrath of the nords.
@@Bitterman5868 When I had visited the Twilight Seplicar, the question I must ask is: Why was ancient Nord architecture used?
If it was Nocturnal, should've the Twilight Seplicar be located in Ancient Falmer Ruins?
However, I like the idea that some of the Ancient Snow Elves may had sought Nocturnal to escape the Persecution and Wrath of the Atmorans.
The reason I thought Boethiah could be involved was because of the Night of Tears and their knowledge of the Eye of Magnus. I know they serve Auriel as the Altmer have. But like the Ayleids, they may had started to turn to the Daedra as the Thalmor had during the Great War.
@@Bitterman5868 Nah, Boethiah (as her Khajiiti incarnation, Boethra) loves the Khajiit too. Only, they don't worship her as they would other gods, because they know she hates that kind of simpering weakness. The Khajiit instead honor her by 'walking the Path, and only hiding in order to pounce.' That being said, it's unknown if she's a part of the modern Khajiiti pantheon (after the Riddle'Thar epiphany) since she doesn't show up in the Words of Clan Mother Ahnissi. Though that could simply be explained as how she would prefer it, as again, Khajiiti honor her by simply living and struggling on the correct life Paths.
That was just Dwemer, Calcelmo's stone has been translated.
The Daedra is mysterious as the Dwemer. Even in the Imperial City, how many residents knows they're being used by a Daedric Prince?
Any Daedric Prince can be subtle and insidious that some of their subjects may not even been aware that they're a subject of a Daedric Prince. That can include the Dwemer, for example for their pursuit of knowledge of the secrets of Nirn, Hermaeus Mora could've used certain Dwemer to get that knowledge for himself but he doesn't have to reveal himself.
Plus, there's no need to be so Dogmatic. Just because the developers haven't set the details of the events leading up to the 'Night of Tears' doesn't mean you can't speculate. I will continue to speculate and share my ideas despite your discouragement.
By the way, I was speculating Daedric involvement whether it Boethiah or Nocturnal in the events that lead to the Night of Tears, not the outcome of the demise and corruption of the Snow Elves as Documented by Calcemo's Stone.
Doesn't it seem more likely that they're worshiping Mehrunes Dagon than Boethiah? Mehrunes Dagon already succeeded in destroying Mundus in the kalpa of Lyg, and already tried once to destroy Mundus in the current kalpa. Mankar Camoran worshipped Mehrunes Dagon and caused the Oblivion crisis for the same reasons that the Thalmor are conquering Tamriel now. It seems more likely that Camoran's actions inspired the Thalmor, who are now going about the same goal with a new approach.
I suspect Jyggalag may be playing a role as well. A more Anu-aligned daedra, he embodies the divine plan of returning existence to perfect Anuic stasis. This divine goal was corrupted when Akatosh tore Lorkhan's heart out - an enantiomorph that birthed Sheogorath. (Hence why the ritual of ascent requires destroying the heart of the one you intend to mantle). It's an inherent paradox of bringing stasis via change.
But he's free now, so he may be helping to guide things behind the scenes.
How is Jygalag free? Sheogorath is present/featured in Skyrim, so clearly as of Skyrim Jygalag hasn't resurfaced. It's only been a few hundred years. Sheogorath has probably only just reformed himself, as it was suggested in Oblivion that would take a while, and the hero would have to stand in for some time. Jygalag was described as an exceedingly infrequent threat.
@@justinsherman9350 Sheogorath made it quite clear in skyrim that since the events of Oblivion the title has been passed on 'to me, from me', either meaning the hero became a daedra and thus the Sheogorath we run into is the hero from Oblivion, or the hero gained power but not immortality, and the role has been passed down multiple times since then. In the DLC at the end of the isles storyline Jygalag had been freed of the cycle, explaining the origins of Sheogorath in the process, that it was a curse, a curse that the hero just broke by getting in the way, with Jygalag leaving, congratulating the hero on their new title.
Unless Jygalag was lying, which would be odd for a creature of absolute order, we can probably take his claim that he is free at face value.
@@FastForwardPlans Freed of the cycle doesn't mean free to run amuck, as the threat he poses ends with the hero's victory. As Jygylag explains Sheogorath is his curse, a Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Hyde scenario inflicted on him as he was too obsessed with order. Freeing him from that cycle could represent his end/moving on to Aetherius, as clearly in the 400 or so years since Jygylag hasn't become a known Daedric prince, which he surely would have by now if he were exerting influence over the world. He's not exactly a subtle player, y'know?
The whole presumption that the hero literally becomes a Daedric Prince is silly to me, as pretty clearly you're just a stand-in until Sheogorath can reconstitute himself.
@@FastForwardPlans I'm inclined to think that Jyggalag is indeed free. Most people assume the mantling process didn't truly free him because it was done before with Arden Sul. However, Sheogorath clearly said his plan was new.
It's because you actually mantle Arden Sul instead, but without killing yourself in the process like Sul did so the mantling sticks. Thus there are finally two entities instead of one.
@@PsychicAlchemy Also, Jyggalag himself said at the conclusion of the Shivering Isles DLC is that:' I am free and you will remain here!' So, Jyggalag's possible return in Elder Scrolls 6, which I think is the actual main plot, is starting to make more sense, isn't it! That is one part of my theory, another is that the Dwemer have been time-displaced/stuck in another dimension this whole time, Jyggalag and the Dwemer, come across each other somehow, they strike a deal/alliance (which we know WILL bite the Dwemer in the ass, and may cause the actual extinction of their race), the Dwemer build Jyggalag a new body, similar to the Neumidium, they arrive in Mundus, Jyggalag starts the Greymarch on Tamriel, as a result, whoever is left, and the Daedric Princes will have to unite to try to save the Elder Scrolls universe! Oh, another part of my theory, is that the Great Obolisk will be at the Isle of Arteaum! IF this turns out to be true, Elder Scrolls 6 may be one of the most bat-s%#@, EVER! The mortals of Mundus thought the Oblivion Crisis was bad, that will pale in comparison to the Greymarch, one of the gravest threats ever known!
Whenever elves tried to touch arfitacts they got all demolished. Snow elves to Eye of Magnus , Chimer-Dwemer to Heart of Lorkhan , Now lets wait and see high elves blow themselves up. Soon Men will rule all Tamriel alone lol.
not happening, the First Aldmeri Dominion was perfect to rule Tamriel, not the racist Thalmor of the 4th era, Syrabane willing Elves will bring peace to Tamriel once again after these Thalmor have been abolished.
Yeah, it seems like every time an elven race goes to war with men they wind up getting eradicated or in the case of the snow elves turned into blind monsters.
*Argonians jchilling in Black Marsh*
@@McHobotheBobo Same could be said for the Khajiit in Elsweyr.
@@TeCHnORiOT
Unless you subscribe to the belief that Khajiit are just mutant, evolved elves.
Which *_they themselves_* sort of believe.
I love this. All the more reason to slaughter elves in the name of the holy trinity of blood, Ysgramor Pelinal whitestrake and Shor himself.
Hopefully the vigilants of stendarr will join in on killing thalmor now
They were basically all wiped out when their hall got destroyed by vampires
@@alexbattaglia8297 rip
All the ones in skyrim died but they have other halls i believe
7:41 "Lord Naarifin is a better fit for the Star Wars prequels and sequels than the Elder Scrolls"
Chucked a bit right there
Sequels, sure, prequels... no? The prequels had a manipulative mastermind who wanted complete power (just like in real life), in the original trilogy, the same guy is just... sitting there. Cackling and otherwise doing nothing. The only other bad guy in the originals is Vader, and he got his backstory (being anything other than "bad guy for the sake of being bad")... in the prequels.
He could've just left it at "Star Wars" - Palaptine is a very straightforward villain in all three trilogies, but that's the whole point; he's the devil. In ROTJ he's just there to be true evil so Vader can be redeemed, in the prequels he's there to tempt Anakin into making a deal with him, and in TROS he's back in his ROTJ role (with a bit of Frankenstein's monster flavour) just so Ben can be redeemed. He's never been intended to be conflicted or complex - he just loves being evil and we love him for it.
A sudden insult to the Star War prequel and sequel was unexpected.
It's not really that secret though is it? Most of the lore points to them being daedra worshippers and they're clearly not worshipping any of the aedra. At best they're worshipping themselves, which has to fall under some prince's sphere of influence. Probably Clavicus Vile.
It's been a long time, but I'm trying to remember if any of the Thalmor I ran into summoned any Daedra. Not that it would be proof either way, but still.
Man, if there was one group I really made a point to fight on sight, it was those guys. I didn't even like cutting the Stormcloaks loose, it was just that they were such hateful fascist jerks.
What game did you play?
@@theamazingdagger5584 The same one you did. I just paid attention. Nothing about the way they act works with what we know of the aedra. So they're clearly not worshipping them. Like i said, in the best case scenario they worship themselves. That kind of narcissism probably falls under Vile's sphere of influence. In the worst case scenario they're working with molag bal or dagon to try and take over the world. That seems to be what they're after. World domination, destruction of the divine towers, and what they hope is ascension. Although if that last one really is what they're after they're going about it in totally the wrong way.
@@BrimleyAvatar well, those Thalmor patrols that you meet on the road summon Atronachs all the time, when in combat. Aren't Atronachs Oblivion dwellers?
@@RedOrm68 That's actually a really good point.
whens next build
yeah when
Looks like ima come back to skyrim with ALOT of black soul gems...
Thalmor being daedra worshippers is pretty ironic, but whats even more ironic is worshipping Lorkhan's lover who shat out one of their greatest heroes
It makes more sense for them to worship Daedra, atleast any elves that believe Lorkhan is a trickster, because regardless if they were tricked, many Aedra continued, Daedra by definition of name, didn't help with building the world, thus smart enough not to be tricked as well as keeping their powers, the holy existence the High Elf origin story implies was denied to them by the creation of Mundas, cursing them to mortality. Makes more sense if from the beginning high elves had some respect for Daedra for the fact that they are the exact type of spiritual power the High Elves aspire to return.
I like the idea that it's just the top echelon of altmer being machiavellian af thinking that if they trick the rest of them into accidentally walking the path of boethia by dismantling the towers they will actually get them all to where they want to be. Like, literally no one thinks they are doing wrong, ends justifying means etc.
It's also easy to imagine that those people tell the thalmor just below them in the conspiracy that the intention to to break the towers for the reasons we generally assume they want to. Rule number 1 of massive conspiracies is to lie to the people participating in your conspiracy about the goal in a way that makes it sound like it benefits them.
Lord Neraphim type beat.
Legends is framed as being a Campfire story, and that’s what it is to me
Not really... The story is told by a Moth Priest and the events came from an Elder Scroll...
Bush did 9/11: i sleep
Earth is flat: i sleep
Illuminati have a copy of Shrek 5: i sleep
There's a soap that kills 100% of germs in Area 51: i sleep
The Thalmor secretly worship Daedra: REAL SHIT
Well dont forget that in elderscrolls online summerset some nobility was already worshipping the daedra so it could very well be.
Daedric cults have been rife for as long as there has been civilization tbh
So now we need to listen to Skyrim's npcs to get hints of the next game?
There's a rumor you can hear in Oblivion that suggests deadra worship is growing in the Summerset Isles. At around the same thime the Crystal Tower, a very spiritual monument in the Summerset Isles, fell because of the deadric invasion and later on the Thalmor proclaiming it was them who sent the deadra away. Coincidence?
Somebody said on an old FM video that if there was a Daedric Prince we didn't know about, it would be the Daedric Prince of limitations, but that literally would be Lorkhan since he created the mortal realm (even though he isn't really a Daedra)
@ilove bigbrother This is how I view it.
This means living beings in this realm are "Nirn's Daedra" which are formed by many aspects. Also explains why Daedra want in so much.. You know, take these souls to steal the power of the current aedra.
You put Daedra as If they are all "Demons", but some Daedra looks even Divine, like Meridia....
they're all just trolling mortals
@@goldvivec1344 thats true but not quite lol
Azura for example is The middle Ground I think, she wishes to observe Mortals, see The achieve something, but also Have some Fun punishing them lol
@@goldvivec1344 ALL Hail Vivec, The Living God!!!!
It seems like Mehrunes Dragon had the last laugh, after all. When Jager Tharn failed, he had a backup plan laid out for Mankar Cameron. When he was killed, why not just play into the characteristic Altmeri hubris over the course of 150 years and let them lay waste to the Empire that withstood the best and brightest of Dragon's faithful, twice?
Scorched earth to be sure, but damned if it didn't put the Tamrielic Empire into a stranglehold by 4E 200...
Why would Boethiah want to destroy the towers? They are the biggest proponent of Lorkhan's world.
You DARE mention TESL? I'm still trying to get over what the devs did to it; don't play with my emotions. 😭
I've never watched any of your vids mere hours after posting, only years :O
>Higher echelons of the Altmer worship Daedra
>Highest ranks of the Nazi Party were said to dabble deep into the occult
The similarities become more and more numerous
now that I think of it the creation lore and the Altmer’s mission to ascend back to divinity is really similar to Gnosticism
The Thalmor in ESO are the living embodiment of the old D&D alignment joke about "Lawful = Awful". They have rules for almost literally everything, including "approved methods for procreation" as you can find in a particular book acquired by pickpocketing. The Thalmor are not just about Altmer racial superiority; they are about domination, even of their own kind.
It's worth noting that at least in ESO, the farther one gets from Summerset and Auridon, the generally more tolerable Altmer NPCs become; as Mark Twain said, travel cures bigotry. Distance from the bonds of Thalmor regulation might also be a factor in that.
As for secret Daedra worship: the only real difference between Aedra and Daedra is an extra D, so basically everyone in ESO who worships almost anything is a Daedra worshipper. Any further discussion on that line is just picking nits. The major exceptions would be Sithis, who is a primordial being antedating the Daedra, the the Tribunal.
Secret? Didn't they try to summon a horde of Daedra through mass sacrifice
Considering both Boethia's character and power, she actually fits really well with the Thalmor, as a non aedric (so more powerful) deity of overcoming the mortal trap by force of will
Seeing the title had me quite concerned that it was gonna be Meridia as I'd seen a few people on r/teslore talking about it, but the similarities between the Thalmor and Meridia pretty much end with their self-righteousness.
Kinda Ironic that the children of the Aedra are slowly drifting to the daedra while the children of Lorkhan drift closer to Akatosh and the NINE divines
How interesting would it be if the thalmor outright angered both Hircine and Peryte
I would agree with everything except the part where it says that Altmer religion and the Psijic Endeavor seek identical goals. As Vivec puts it, the later seems to be aimed at transcending, not just the mortal plane, but the Aurbis itself, the whole dream of Anu
I wonder if they will ever be a new daedra Prince?
"Y'all with the knife-ear suicide-cult?"
"Y... No. We simply believe that the physical world is a prison and are working at unmaking it so we can revert back to our natural form!"
"This is them" *Equips axe*
*Ysgramor would like to know your location*
Slaughter the dominion !!!
There's a much simpler explanation than 'worship' in the traditional sense. The Thalmor hate Tamriel and the rest of the mortal plane. If their goals succeed, they will ascend beyond Nirn and have no further use of it. In this way, striking a deal with Boethiah makes perfect sense to both sides - the Thalmor gain an ally that can assist their conquest, whilst Boethiah gains the mortal realm they'll leave behind. Nothing about this bargain implies they've turned their back on Auriel, however.
06:35 correct me if I'm wrong but, wasn't it Vaermina? I remeber playing legends and one of the prizes for defeating Naraafin was the Orb of Vaermina, and in the plot he was using it for sacrifices.
This one does not care what the Thalmor worship. This one has only this to say, if Talos isn't a real God, then why does this one receive a blessing when this one meditates at Talos' shines? Checkmate Thalmor.
They were 3 big skyrim channels: TheEpicNate315 - ESO - Fudgemuppet
The other 2 are inactive now they dont post. You are our only hope fudgemuppet please don’t leave us.
ESO's gone too? Damn. I know Nate disappeared a while ago...
What about Camelworks?
Epic Nate sucks I can’t stand his voice and he’s gone camel works is great though I think he’s the best he puts so much work into his video his augur of dunlain video is basically a full length film
@@mmyr8ado.360 exactly he’s the best one
@@curtiswong7280 ESO is still active not sure what he’s talking about he just does less elder scrolls content now
The Thalmor still salty the Aedra let a man ascend to god hood and not an elf xD
Awesome video! One question though, doesn't Boethiah revel in Lorkhans creation? Why would they aid the thalmor in destroying it?
Who says she'd let them win? Most the time the deadra do exactly as they say and most mortals get the short end of the deal. More likely she's setting them up for her to gain a new mortal champion putting them down. That's Boethiahs way of doing things.
@@josephjohnson5415 ah excellent point!
So in a sense Lord Naarifin made the same deal with the "Good Daedra" that the Chimer did> Worship of Boethia, deals with Mephala, and rescue from Azura's Winged Twilight. Maybe he was really a dunmer in disguise.
The Companions have a saying, that "Even an Elf can be born with the Heart of a Nord".
This is definitely a case of an Altmer being born with the heart of a Dunmer.
Hey yall, not really video related, but I do hope you play through Far Cry 6 when it comes out. Liked watching you guys play Far Cry 4 all that time ago.
Everything we’ve experienced with the Thalmor has pointed towards them being Daedra Worshippers or at least mutually affiliated with them. They are becoming more and more like the Ayleids
@Sean_J. yea I agree, they would probably be aligned in terms of worship but in terms of race supremacy the high elves wouldn’t like the reachmen because reachmen are mostly nedic in origin
Bruh this sounds like something thatd cause a whole new branch of elves.
dude great video but you didn't mention how in Oblivion ES4 a piece of dialogue you can often overhear is "have you heard, daedra worship is becoming quite common in the summerset isles"
I have felt like this even since I saw the robes. I just hope the thalmor don’t doom the altmer race.
I like this theory, but I always felt that Jyggalag would be the deadra that would push the idea. He want's order, what better way than to wipe mundis out of existence.
Let's not forget the random NPC conversation tidbit from Oblivion where a character mentions that Daedra worship is becoming prevalent in the Summerset Isles.
This is the first video on this channel where I got so wrapped up in the theory I didn’t notice the video was almost over and when you did the sign off was like WAIT NO COME BACK-
(Not that this says anything bad about the other videos, more that you’re getting too good at getting into my head and I’m worried I’m gonna end up letting drew talk me into daedra worship and this was all a long con)
Thalmor secret daedra worshippers:yes
The whole tower theory:no
That casual Starwars prequels and sequels burn LMAO. 7.30
If this is true, which I can’t confirm or deny, but do believe, than Tamriel needs a new hero to save the elves from themselves. Anyone got any ideas?
I’m a big fan of the mix of both eso and Skyrim footage
Drew telling stories with the background music from Skyrim playing is something special
God dammit these guys will never let me forget about skyrim.
Well their ancestors were not so secret daedra worshippers
This just makes me think of....Eso the veild heritence in the dominion
Get to the point allready. All this jibber jabber is annoying!
I think Lord Naarafin couldn't be Boetiah's champion. We know that Titus Mede II was in possesion of Goldbrand at the time of Great War.
Titus Mede didn't wielded Goldbrand.The main character of TES Legends in guise of Emperor wore it after he defeated its previous bearer. Naarifin's Dremora guard named Reive and Reive was sent by Boethiah to stop the Forgotten Hero(TES Legends Protagonist) before he thwarts Boethiah.
@@nowan6221that's questionably canon
Really like this because it could make a great story in summerset about some Faction of "true altmer" or whatever to take back control of their government, and in general opens for conflicts between even altmer in the dominion
I wanna play as the shezarine in es6. Just massacre eves for fun
Are the Thelmor secretly Alyids/ Alyid decendants?