Datto's Thoughts: The Director's Cut 2020 (Weapon Retirement, Seasonal Content)
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- Опубліковано 28 лип 2024
- Luke Smith is back with another Director's Cut, this time for 2020. He discusses the theme of aspiration for this one, broken down into sections:
Seasons of Change - Bungie wants to rely less on seasonal activities and FOMO events for their seasonal content and want to have a fusion of seasonal events with core activities within the game.
Weapon Retirement - Weapons will only be able to be leveled so high before they are capped, with a range given of 9-15 months, to be determined.
World-Building - While past expansion launches have focused more on game systems as marquee events, this year's expansion hopes to focus on the game world.
Timestamp for my thoughts if you've already read the article: 10:39
Director's Cut 2020: www.bungie.net/en/News/Articl...
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Timestamp for my thoughts is 10:39.
Datto you cute
Datto I love you 💕❤️
No homo
Datto I am not going play destiny any more if there going do kill my weapon ever 6 month I was so hype for trial kill all weapon I grind so many hour are now useless I not going to play good bye
Ok here's my thoughts on the weapon thing. I would like pinnacle weapon to stay usable. Here's why. For context I hate crucible. The state it's in is awful and I'm also kinda bad. I spent hours every day for a week to get Randy's, because I have always loved scouts. When I got it I quit playing crucible and did raids with the thing and now I only use it for a primary. The game's ritual and pinnacles are so difficult for average players to get. Like most of these are 10 times harder then most quest exotics. For that reason I think they should be treated like exotics, but they should stop being made. Find a way to keep them not as good as raid weapons, but still viable and quit producing them. Continuing to make legendaries that are the best in class is just bad for the game, but removing current hard to get weapons would just invalidate that one week of work I and other people did. I had similar feelings when they left behind Thorn in D1 pve. It took ages to get that and it was removed. I would understand if they did remove them I just hope they don't.
Datto what is the shader on your Randy’s
“Evolving world”. I want the sea creature on Titan to eat the rig. Make us go into its stomach and rescue Sloane.
Crescendo Only if my character can pick up Sloane and use her to activate pressure plates in a giant Titan sea creature dungeon.
When you take a look at its actual length. Its not actually that big compared to the Rig itself.
Haha
Pretty sure Sloane has a penis
I want the sea creature to be the new Titan vendor /s
My main concern is that when loot gets retired it doesn't get anything interesting to replace it, like when Spare Rations gets retired we just get Spare Rations 2: Electric Boogaloo with no real differences.
But it's a "New" gun!
Most of us don't play destiny 2 as a primary "job" so regrinding for gear every year is going to be much more painful than the streamers think.
You'll be able to grind for Spare Rations with a different season icon, it will be ok if you don't get one right away though just come back tomorrow and try again.
And remember when your done the exit is just past Eververse.
I think most people would be more than happy to see Spare Rations retired without a spiritual successor
@@SammehEatWorld we cant hate every good weapon in pvp it's the best handcannon if it goes to 140s it becomes ace it it goes to 180s it's a kill clip service revolver or lunas and 110s Duke with rampage ppl will use the best weapon per archetype spare rations is not the bad we've had worse much worse metas lol
Me listening to this and sometimes you hear “wonderful day guardian”
Thought I was going crazy
Remember when there was a character in the game that said that?
Think that’s his subscriber noise
@@legofanatic5 it is lol
@@Insan1tyW0lf postmaster is d1
Yay now after my gun with outlaw kill clip gets retired I can go grind for a another gun with outlaw kill clip. What an engaging and meaningful gameplay loop.
Innovation :D
I'm 100% in the same boat man.
@AFL97 ah fuck I'm a fool
That isn't necessarily how it will work though. This new system gives Bungie the ability to completely remove Outlaw + Kill Clip by making it so that there aren't any guns that can get those two perks together/make one of those perks near or completely unavailable until next rotation/etc. Too early to make conclusions in this regard.
So would u rather we don't do what literally any other mmo does and consequently never want to get new weapons like what happened this season
The total time of this vid is 24:02. F
Rory Abshire oh no 😭
Datto had to have done this on purpose
I dont get it
Admiral Ackbar Datto and his team were going for the 24 hour emblem for Last Wish. When they finally beat the raid, they were 2 minutes past the 24 hour mark. The total time was 24:02 and just kind of became a meme for a few weeks.
24:02 Brothers
Me: notices length of video
Also me: starts shedding a tear
Conjon Silver guessin you didn’t play d1
Lord Solar hey bud you kinda missed the joke there
Lord Solar woosh
FriedPK not your bud guy
Lord Solar you missed the joke you clown
Here's my take on weapon retirement: if we're giving up our old weapons for new ones, what's going to make the new one's any different than the ones we already have? If a y4 weapon is just multi-kill clip and feeding frenzy on a new looking gun, then nothing ever really changes. Also, I think we should have *some* weapons stay around for the sake of having a sense of permanence in an ever changing world (hopefully exotics can fufill this purpose). I'll cautiously look at what bungie is going to do and see how it plays out.
From what I understand, a large part of the reason they are doing retirement is so they *can* make legendary weapons that are more than just "rampage outlaw". As of current, they cannot make anything that would be worth using over previous things since it would cause power creep, and lead to a bunch of time being spent on balancing. If the weapon is going to go away in X seasons, then it is much less of a problem. Wouldve been interesting to see how this wouldve played out with old pinnacle weapons.
That's the Destiny community, complaining about shit 8 MONTHS BEFORE IT EVEN HAPPENS.
@@janesmith1840 Well yeah because if people don't like the core idea of it, why would they want it to happen in the first place, especially when it involves losing your weapons and you're strongly against that?
@@janesmith1840 DERP
@@Gerwhal They're not taking your weapons. You're not losing fucking anything. God you people have the reading comprehension of a fucking 5 year old.
So this is my thoughts on fomo and making memories. Memories can't just be manufactured like that. It's something organic that needs to come from something just being what it is. Why was gjallarhorn such an amazing experience? Because it was just good and exciting and rare. Not because a bungie dev sat down and said "I'm making this so people are going to remember it" instead of making something just unique and worth remembering.
"You had to be there" isn't something you just design around. It's something that has to come from just inherent parts of the experience. They need to think about making things just fun and interesting and those "you had to be there" moments will come on their own.
"Remember when we spent all day farming mind benders? And then we finally got the ones we wanted! You just had to be there to see how excited we ere for god rolls"
Bungie: yeah about those god rolls....
This, my frind, has to be the most crucial point the devs can't understand. They throw around big words like "memorable" or "aspirering" without truly understanding what those terms actually mean
That's why the secrets like whisper and outbreak are fun and memorable. We should have more things like that, even if it's just small discoveries that are cool. I'm sure they are working on more of them though. They know how exciting it is.
I’m just glad they addressed the FOMO factor that these seasons had. I was worried they would keep that element in the game.
It’s a artificial way to engage players into playing mediocre content that otherwise wouldn’t last 3 months p.s right now if you have recluse and izanagi, you don’t need to get anything cause it’s gonna be useless, unless you just like to collect things for the sake of it
هلا في ابن سوريا :)
Fomo doesn't exist. There's nothing in this season
Forza JQV You do know what FOMO is, right?
@@skaapippai u do know there's nothing in the season to miss right?
@@_Forza good guns, cool armor, there's a lot to miss my dude.
Top priority: buff oxygen SR3 with rapid hit, condense dragonfly and meganeura into one perk like they did on Ace's firefly + outlaw combo
Fuck yes
Sorry can't hear you, retiring Oxygen so it can no longer be infused to the new light cap. Don't need to worry about making it less shit when Bungie can just make it irrelevant anyway.
Why buff oxygen? It'll be irrelevant anyway because of these new changes.
@@Luteloots Never got its moment in the sun, and I didn't grind 70 basic strikes for nothing
@@zenith1809 That's where you're wrong! Bungie is always willing to make any and all time you put into the game be for fucking nothing.
I'm not a huge fan of loot retirement. My biggest complaint is weapons with lore tied to them. I want to be able to use Mountaintop, Perfect Paradox, and other lore-heavy weapons well into the future.
Video length: 24:02 ...nice
When you see all the stuff inside
*NOT NICE*
Last Wish Vietnam flashbacks lol
Remember 24 hour Last Wish Raid?
@@abdulmuhaimin5274 yes that's the joke
@@ImponteDeluxo We get it, you're bitching about "issues" that you didn't even try to fully understand, you're going to say that you're leaving the game, and the playerbase's size isn't going to change at all. Go cry about it somewhere else.
Datto secretly thinking about getting that new monarchy gear back for his season 10 fashion show
Forcer I’m sorry sir, but I don’t recall asking.
Forcer Those ornaments were godly
@@DJNerfStudios sorry I don't remember giving a shit whether you asked or not. Did you ask him not too??? Didn't think so.
Forcer look man, I’ve been searching for ages, and I still can’t find the guy who asked. I think it’s time to retire.
@@xanderhenthorn596 chill out dude, the guy was just joking, it's a joke so calm down
No one was participating in faction rallies because no one was playing destiny.🤦🏻♂️
Facts, pre warmind was a dark time
@@liamhood4981 not as worse as launch d1 actually no far worse
Also don’t forget faction rallies happened once every 20 years
I would like them to improve the armor design aswell, I know that this could just be me but the armor just doesnt compare to the d1 raid armor you can get. I wanna feel like a God slayer not a damn potato lol. (This is obviously not a major issue, there are still some armor sets that I like, but it would be nice to see an improvement.)
Even though the garden of salvation stuff is a reskin, I still love the armor glows, hope we get more glows like that.
Universal ornaments should include all armor
DudesInSuits wym, it is for all armor except exotics
YES! JUST YES. I don't know what they hell the design team is doing but I literally only wear the Cormorant Blade armor because that armor truly makes me feel like a warlock. Not some princess playing dress-up.
Kleindog idk about everyone else, but my ornaments only include ever verse armor.
The fun in Destiny for me was running my favorite activities with my favorite weapons that took a load of time to earn. Now those weapons will be phased out and replaced by stuff in the same archetype with the same perks we've seen for years and some slight variations in stats. What is the point?
Money.
It was all about the monz. Very sad to see it all go from this point in time. Obviously im in the future but still, there was no need for content vaulting. Like you said its just the same things but slight variations. Beyond light was a mistake... Lickily they have confirmed that they are no longer vaulting content unless it is a seasonal activity. Other than that, nothings changed.
Datto still mourning over 24:02. Nice.
I’m definitely one of the few people who cycle out weapons in my inventory constantly, and I love that. I have options in PVP and I can do well with those options, I have options in PvE granted they’re a little more limited I have options. Retiring weapons means the only things I’ll be able to use in content that matters are a limited number of guns. Say they retire all our old weapons and add in 30 new weapons; we have to take into account that most of them aren’t gonna be god tier so that means made 1/4 of those weapons will be truly viable and nothing else will come close? That ruins weapon diversity and MAKES us use the same things over and over again. Right now people use the same thing because they want too; forcing us to use new weapons because we have no other option is worse. Bungie really needs to reevaluate this change. We’re okay with all the other stuff but doing something like this will literally put a ton of the community off from the game
I agree I do the same, I still use my bad omens rocket launcher it is like a son to me
It’s not restrictive, they’re just trying to stop bitches from only using spare rations and mindbenders
@@Benny_B0O0 PVP isn't power-enabled outside of IB and Trials, what the fuck are you even talking about.
Kleindog but yet the biggest issue with pvp is shotguns and fusion rifles. There’s no reason why I should die in one shot to a fusion rifle or a shotgun when a AR or a SM can’t even do that.
@@joegonzales1932 There's no reason you should die to a weapon that has extremely limited ammo and is designed for high risk high reward, when an AR or an SMG can't also oneshot...? I don't even know what to say. You have left me speechless with how mind-numbingly fucking moronic that statement was. Holy fuck.
I feel like the whole “fixing fomo” kinda clashes with the whole weapon retirement scheme. As well as well if the loot and stuff dropped from raids becomes virtually unusable, who will do raids? There seems to be no point of these outside activities (menagerie, raids, etc) suffering from whatever plan bungie has, it’s not like they’ll just get rid of all of the raids for that sole purpose. Guess not only the weapons might be powercrept if something like this happens.
I'm, guessing they might rotate out the raids especially with that talk of the game reaching a big file size
im gonna assume raid, pinnacle and trials gear won't be included in that list in some way/ easy access to updated version if you already have it.
@@ihaveafriendwithabigforehe2677 What do you mean? every legendary will be rotating out including pinnacles
@@DoomKaiserGliders the idea is a concept right now we don't know the small details like that yet, thats why i threw the idea out there, luke mentioned himself that pinnacles are just legendary exotics, so the rule may not apply, raid weapons are whatever as they were never really designed to be meta nor are they much of a time consumption to get and we don't even know how exactly trials gear will work, as i said that gear may just get updated versions every season or 2 that will be easier to obtain if you already have an older version. afaik they didn't specifically include pinnacles or the likes they simply stated legendary weapons, which more or less just points to it being a concept not something set in stone.
@@ihaveafriendwithabigforehe2677im 99% sure new pinnacles will rotate out because they mention that pinnacles are the source of power creep. Pinnacles explicitly are legendary weapons, there's no questions about this.
We need a vault size upgrade then I’m not dismantling any godrolls that have kills in the thousands
That is much more complex than it might let on.
Soooooo badly
I'm all for a vault size upgrade, but don't tell you've got hundreds (400+) god rolls weapons with 1k+ kills!
No u don't. Everyone should have at least 50 open slots with enough on each character as well. This is coming from a collector as well
@@SimonJJFletcher I have a collection of them. All sorts. Year 1 armor. 3 different characters with exotics and year 1 armor alone take up less now than before because I had to delete them. But yeah the vault should double.
We are so used to every single thing being infusable that changing it at this current point would be a bad idea. It was fine in TTK since its main purpose was to phase out the elemental primaries, but in destiny 2 I feel like it would just piss off too much people. Also if bungie wants to phase out old gear, they need to create better or more interesting gear to replace it. Judging from the overall lack of new loot (no vendor refresh in shadow keep or season of dawn), I’d prefer if bungie stick to balancing instead of the easy method of making guns useless.
they cant add new powerful guns to the game because of power creep guns are already too strong. If they can retire a bunch of old stuff this lets them flex their creativity and make cool unique guns again.
I doubt it would anger the community as much as you think. The community went through phasing out old gear in Taken King and Rise of Iron in D1. Also constantly adjusting doesn't help when the same loadout is being run in every activity. Retiring guns is also a harder activity because then new guns need to be designed to replace the now retired weapons. The lack of a loot pool is an issue atm and retiring guns can help solve that problem as well.
@@peterdozal8825 the issue is that "cool new stuff" will just be something with "reload perk" and "damage perk" again. The only thing it'll do is piss people off when they have to ditch the ones they have and grind new ones with the same perks.
@@peterdozal8825 But what's the point then? Wow, you retired my Outlaw + Rampage Hand Cannon, let me just grind another. It just adds frustration on top of the time you just spent being wasted. Unless the guns are fundamentally different why would people not just gravitate towards (reload boost) + (Damage boost) especially in PvE.
@@alexc6088 and i can agree with that idea, if they are going to retire guns they need to make new ones that are powerful, fun, and different. Having to hunt for basically the same gun with a new skin is not good enough. They talked about retiring perks for a while and bringing some back. My hope would be with less guns they have to balance will come more creatively in perks and perk combos they can make. Thats the hope at least. If new guns are just reskins then they completely failed.
I feel like farming for a god roll weapon that expires, per se, isnt good. Especially when it comes to PVE content for players who dont raid, etc. regularly. (Same for PVP players).
honestly if you dont do raid why would you bother for a pve god roll?
All PVE activities outside of raids and Nightfalls are default 750 light. A weapon "expiring" will mean literally nothing to you. God I am so fucking sick of saying that.
@@Kazuhira2249 Nightfall? Everything else lmao
This change literally won't affect anyone like this, they specifically point out they would just have a power level cap to keep them from being optimal in the highest level content. they aren't making it so you can use the guns, they will just hit like a wet noodle in master level activities. should be exactly the same as it is now in everything else.
@@Kazuhira2249 gambit
Just watched half this video while flying to the tower
See there are more pressing matters at hand here.
@@thein1997 is the loading a server issue or a wifi issue? Its really inconsistent for me
The problem I have that drew me away from destiny and towards other games like siege and ghost recon is work.
Destiny was fun for a while, now it just feels like a chore. I don't really enjoy playing the sundial or the crucible or anything, I just do it because I need the guns to compete! The world is boring as it isn't changed, and the story is the only interesting part for me.
Games like ghost recon are so much less competitive, and aren't time gated like destiny, so it's more fun to play since I can just meme around and do stupid stuff while still getting good stuff. In destiny, you have to do the same thing repetitively to get gear and pass tiers. And for what? Like datto said, to check off tick boxes. I'll probably never use last word or bastion again.
Thank you for coming to my ted talk.
den just stick to that game u said u move to simple fix
@@kustard1170 I never said I never play destiny anymore. There are just fewer dings dat I enjoy bout it now. Is dat a good answer?
This is just because of time and the style of game Destiny is. Its like saying, i want to watch every movie this year or every anime this season, thats fucking imposible. Siege and Ghost Recon can be played at your own pace, it doesnt requiered heavy grinding just to be at the same level as someone else but then again, thats the type of game Destiny is, and maybe, any other MMO. Maybe this isnt your type of game or the one that fits the best with your life style. Besides it would pretty shitty if someone new would have the same things as someone who worked hour and hour for it, just because the game needs to be more casual friendly.
@@kustard1170 don't be the guy that says reductive things like this... He gave a very thoughtful comment about how he feels. Don't take offense, we all obviously love destiny... We are here...
The problem isn't Destiny, it's Bungie. If Destiny was owned by Blizzard or HiRez, we wouldn't have these problems. OP items would be negligible. UP items would be buffed. Exotics would never be a wasted slot. Seasonal armor wouldn't be weak as fuck. They'd run a public test server, so people's items and currency wouldn't disappear twice in one month. There's a lot of huge dev problems, like light level balance, raid matchmaking, optional solo content, and pvp rotation, while the game itself is damn near perfect.
Bungie: People won't stop using the same guns over and over, so we're going to force them to stop using them... and make them get the same gun again, but from the raid instead of Zavala this time! We fixed Aspiration y'all!
yeah... oooor you could just make the raids have GOOD rewards. I don't mean every gun in the raid has to be Recluse. How about raid exclusive perks? Like ones that improve performance in the raid (Oracle Disrupter / Knight Shield Bypass), or interesting perks that only drop there (Battle Runner + Running Interference from Wrath shotty), or even just unique types of guns like Randy's being the only kinetic 200 RPM Scout.
How about armour with exclusive raid perks like oh you know the Leviathan set? How about giving the raids ANYTHING cool looking to chase, like exclusive Ghosts, Ships, Sparrows, Emblems, sick as fuck armour ornaments you can only get through completing challenge modes instead of buying it all in eververse. OOH, I know, how about giving the raid ghost some crazy perk that gives you increased chances of exotic engram and eververse engrams on each activity completion? OH WAIT. How about making the raids give guaranteed high stat armour, and high level infusement materials?
Oh here's a crazy thought, what if they made an in game sherpa system that encouraged clans to run new people through the raids and gave them cool rewards for doing a good job like exclusive ornaments or shaders or increased chances on raid exotic drops or ANYTHING (lol still in beta after 3 years).
There are a million ways to encourage players to care about new content and rewards, but instead of incentivizing players to search out the rewards by making them good, they'd rather just make you give up your old guns for new ones that are exactly the same. Everything doesn't have to be the best thing ever to be FUN and WORTH CHASING.
Also I keep seeing this argument that they want to retire the old OP guns so they can make the meta more balanced. Bull. Luke straight up says they want to be able to make crazy guns without having to balance them cuz they can just essentially delete them later when people get fed up. They don't want to stop you from using Recluse, they just want you to use NEW Recluse.
All of this for me is made even worse by the fact that I DO grind out and use the new guns. Every season for me has had at least a handful of sick looking guns with fun perks that I grind out and add to my rotation. My Recluse is sitting in the vault with like 200 kills on it, I've already got more kill on some of this seasons guns, but because Lukes friends won't put down their Breakneck (lol this gun isn't even OP) I'm forced to stop using my Imperative (such a huge blight on the meta that gun right?)
On the mention of Breakneck, that part is so completely bewildering to me. These friends LOVE that gun, instead of being proud that his team made something that truly resonated with players, his thought is "how do I get these assholes to use something else?" Mind boggling.
I could (and arguably have) go on and on about ways to fix this apparent lack of "aspiration" problem, it just really grinds me the wrong way that his solution is just "fuck you, put that old gun away and go get a new one!" truly a masterful solution.
skeet skeet for a post as long as his little mistakes like that are quite trivial and your comment seems quite petty.
Yes, but doing this still doesn't solve the issue that by making these rewards "just better" still doesn't solve the underlying issue of power creep. By making absurdly powerful wepons that always step over last seasons weapons your already making the weapons you are so dearly coveting obsolete. It's simpler, and more efficient, to simply neuter the previous seasons wepons.
People are claiming that bungie will release a new and revamped version of the same wepons, but aside from black hammer, and maybe gjallerhorn I've seen no proof backing this claim up.
Overall I think instead of lobbying to stop this decision we should be trying to encourage bungie to make more unique and creative perks so they don't end up recycling wepons.
Great, back to grinding for the best relevant weapons and asking for more vault space for the weapons that have become usless for end game content. I like what I like. I don't want to regrind for weapons with similar rolls/perform just as well to what I already had before.
If you "dont want to grind for weapons with similar rolls/perform just as well" shouldnt you be in favor of this change? You cant have it both ways. Either they put a time limit (which if it is a year, that is a really long time) so they can make things without risking power creep. Or you use the same guns forever, and then the only weapons you can grind for are weapons with the same level of performance, since they cannot risk power creep (as it has been for a while now). Whether they do in fact start making better weapons is to be seen, but that is what they said, and if they dont make the change at all, then they will never make anything above what you have now anyways.
@@usingbridge1770 different people play destiny for different reasons. My weapons I grinded for are a part of my characters. I worked hard for them and imo bungie just said "yeah that's cool but it's gone now". I have a job I so I can't play hours on end for new god rolls all the time or want to. If they come up with something new that shakes the meta then cool. But forcing a meta by removing what we already had is not how I enjoy destiny. I'd rather be forced to use more materials or ascendant shards to upkeep old weapons I like than having to ask for more vault space for weapons I can't use in end game content anymore to remember the "good ol days".
The Cel Games agreed
@@usingbridge1770 thats only if you dont like using the same gear. I dont like chasing carrots. I like getting the carrot and enjoy eating it when i want to and how i want to. If they spoil my carrots to try to incentivize me to farm more carrots ill just stop eating carrot all together.
@@nolives Lol funny comparison but i agree with you
I grind weapons every season from any content(raids, pvp, NFs, etc) and use different loadouts all the time, I spent hundreds of hours in the Reckoning to get a Spare Rations with Rapid-Hit and Rampage to finally put down my Midnight Coup, unless all new weapons are easily target farmed(like menagerie or sundial) I will abandon Destiny(been playing non stop since D1 vanilla).
This is not like most MMOs where you just click and never control the weapon, they're not stat sticks like in WoW.
god i cant wait till spare rations get auto nerf out the game good job Bungie
@@bats4jm644 this will hurt the pve playerbase the most(my Rapit Hit + rampage SR is for pve), pvpers will just use the next 150 with any perks(all 150s have crazy AA) and continue to stomp you.
Armageddragoon I agree with you 👍
All I see is people like you who totally miss the point :
When you get that god roll Spare Ration, anything else afterward is irrevelant. Any other 150 handcannons becomes irrevelant unless Bungie releases a better version of your Spare Rations, which creates powercreep, which leads to nerfs, which leads to complaints.
This move keeps the new content fresh and rewarding, even if that new version of ''Spare Rations'' performs similarily. As of now, many players, me included, never care about new content releases since their rewards NEVER MATTERS.
Im just repeating what Datto said, because it makes sense.
@@jeremitschiember5280
Ah yes, because Meta Apes refuse to use anything different, everyone has to be forced to use new shit constantly and be blocked from stuff they liked
Amazing decision, totally won't kill a huge portion of the community
Infuse team: “All weapons they need to be always infuse and be always update.”
Limit infuse team: “No, they need change to be balance and not stay with the same stuff forever.”
Destiny 2 Civil War.
This could be bad perhaps.... means the god weapons with rolls and armor will not be at power level cap and will be useless on hard content.... i hear a Destiny 1, year 1-2 problem?
This is the end of freedom choice of weapons
I don't take issue with the whole retirement thing, but I grind guns out so that I can use them, not just to get the stupid gun. If it takes an entire year because of shitty RNG to get a gun that I want and I can no longer use it for a decent amount of time I will feel like my time was wasted.
If they are retiring guns then current season gear needs to be dropping like a mother fucker otherwise you won't have a chance to use a good roll of the gear.
Ditching equipment people earned just because the overboard try hards don't like having everything is really fucking stupid.
If shit I earned is just going to be erased over and over, I ain't fucking playing, simple as that.
@@ImponteDeluxo Oh fuck off, no it's not. After a YEAR, you won't be able to use certain legendaries in the most high level content in the game, and everything else literally won't be affected at all. Stop whining, you sound like a god damn child.
@@janesmith1840 They're KINDA MURDERING your gear. Now don't give us that "Oh fuck off," shpeal... XD
Bungie: Play the way you want to play - Also Bungie: Not with those guns tho
This 👆 💯
Yeah, and?
That’s not what “play the way you want to play” means. That’s talking about playstyle. Not the weapons you use
@@confusedrealm7047 Your style of play is defined by the weapons you use. Headass.
Hunter McKenna not necessarily. There’ll always be shotguns and snipers for close quarters and long range play. Plus the armor, mods and subclass combinations aren’t going away unless they are seasonal. It’s only the legendary weapons. The archetypes from these legendaries aren’t going away. Therefore the playstyle that you love will remain in the game.
get rid of infusion is a big nope for me, and i guess they will loose alot of players on that decision..
SParis74 yep plus the content creators shilling out saying it’s a good thing. That it’s a good thing to lose weapons to grind new ones out and waste your time again.
Same, weapon retirement is fucking retarded, has always been, and it kills variety and options. Get ready to see everybody using the same damn best weapon from the new batch that can be leveled to the current max level each season on endgame content, and only those weapons, retarded as fuck. At least before players had a bunch of options that were all decent to choose from, now there's gonna be only a few that everybody will be forced to use
Victor Hugo exactly and people say “they won’t release the same gun with another name” they always have it’s such a bad idea ofc only people who play this game like a damn religion think it’s good
As someone who never tried Trials, now that the Artifact is enabled , i’ll never try it. Good job bungo.
ARL no one cares
@@brandoncmn stfu kid
Dude that’s actually crazy! You managed to add nothing of value!
They havent revealed enough info on trials yet to know if the artifact level will be used or if its going to have a cap in trials, maybe only the first 5-10 are going to count, it wouldnt be that bad
brandoncmn you are a pssy clown
We are going to agree to disagree.
Here’s my bit though... because I honestly loved Pinnacle weapons. They were and to some extent are still a coveted thing. It’s the reward that made things like Gambit (thee most hated game type) worth playing.
Idc about the other loot... getting meatball to spawn and killing it was the thing. Getting 21% has meaning. Ect.
I agree that there should be coveted weapons that are big deals. I think Pinnacles were supposed to be that.
I don’t agree with the retirement of pinnacle weapons. That’s my only point where I differ from you.
The problem with pinnacle weapons is that they are better than almost all other legendary weapons. Apart from checking off a box to say “I got it”, there’s no reason to grind for any other legendary weapon. The solution then becomes, nerf the pinnacle back to the power of everything else. Then they aren’t “pinnacle” anymore!
When I play the game now, i literally delete every single loot drop I get. I have a load out which I like and no other weapon, god roll or not, will better. There’s no point in playing the game right now to get a slightly less weapon or armour piece than you have now. Just my opinion though
you shouldnt agree with the retirement of any weapons? why are we retiring weeapons for some stupid ass d1 maps, confirmed d1 armor and likely some dumbass d1 weapons. were going to throw away d2 shit for d1 shit? how stupid is the fanbase?
Zach Childs ok I guess I will keep using recluse for the second year in a row when ever am in a raid or something
Zach Childs the weapon retirement has literally nothing to do with trials. You do realise that?
@@mofobecks it does though. Why would we retire new d2 weapons for a doctrine of passing. Why would i retire d2 armor for d1 trials armor? Thats is the most asinine shit ever
Bungie: alright people aren’t using the new guns so let’s force them to use them.
SH!T
No that’s not it at all they can’t continue to balance ALL guns at this point it’s not an option I play the game non stop and to me this is what the game needs you have 9 months at least to use your new god rolls AND you can still go use your recluse in a strike say just not a nightfall
@@darienparadis6591 Why not a nightfall? I want you to give me ONE SINGLE LOGIC reason, on why i shouldnt be able to use a recluse at a nightfall. The weapons are already balanced, they just dont have ideas on how to make their "NeW" work relevant. Fml people still dont remember D1Y1
Destiny: what's the point of doing seasonal activities if they just go away
Player base: what's the point of getting new weapons if they just go away
Joshua Wright we need this man to be in charge
whats the point of getting new weapons if we are just gonna use recluse anyway?
@@J.D.... Recluse after the nerf is now a perfectly balanced Pinnacle weapon. If you are bored with it, there are plenty of other options in the Energy slot you can use that are, admittedly not on the same exact power level as Recluse, but not far behind it either.
Unbe Kannt well would you look at that, destiny moving to PC has ruined it for everyone else. Imagine my shock. It’s crap like this that screws up the meta, trying to cater to mouse and keyboard players when the larger base is on console. Just marvellous.
@@astallas4405 console is just shit at FPS games
5:50 by all the heavens no. More guns does not equate power creep. It does so in Destiny, because of an *incredibly* limited perk system, by which many weapons are inherently always slight variations on each other. If there was more variety amongst weapon functionality, they could create more horizontal progression, rather than resorting to vertical progression as a means of incentive. This is an issue that has been created by Bungie, and, I'd say, is easily addressed.
I would look toward the Sundial Grenade Launcher that was introduced this season as an example of functionality. It's still a grenade launcher, but at the same time it's something else.
Zdude0127 yet datto “doesn’t care about it”
Like, if you don’t care about this unique one of a kind weapon what do you care about?
@@DwWarWolf Many people focus on weapons that are deemed to be "the best" at whatever content say they are in. Next season will be a good example, with a whole load of AR buffs in PvP, but there are already some extraordinary ARs as is, namely Halfdan-D and Steelfeather Repeater.
Edit: They also better leave Pinnacles and Rituals alone though. They are unique weapons with specific purposes. Let them stay that way.
and adding more and more perks takes a ton of development time, adds way more time to testing to make sure everything works, creates a far greater chance of making extremely broken guns, and with more variables adds to more bugs to the game. there is always a trade-off. and even with all of that, if they just added more perks that does not mean that people will switch over to these new guns. Things need to be better for people to switch to them, and just adding more stuff is power creep. I think your idea is flawed.
"Does it have rapid hit kill clip?"
"No"
"Shard it lol"
How about seasons with story missions and cutscenes + a new activity but the trade off is no new gear
Making that would be costly
They talk about FOMO and then seem to be adding artifact power levels to trials... i still hope we're misunderstanding something about that, otherwise thats just a contradiction in itself, having players grind everything to stand a chance in a mode that is supposed to be about skill
How is fear of missing out related to power? Yeah, trials absolutely shouldn't have artifact level in it, but what fear strikes you from missing out on anything there?
Fear of missing out first week of season? When there will not be 1000 light people =D
@@Tsun_Derek because I didnt have time to grind out 20 2x EXP bounties on 3 characters, now everyone that did will have a HUGE advantage over me on the very first week of a game mode I've been waiting on since I started playing
@@Tsun_Derek you fucking elitist, no life having, dick head
@@Tsun_Derek some of us have 20+ cannabis plants to care for plus cloning on a daily basis. Some of us have fucking college on top of that to further their life outside of gaming. Get tf off your high horse you cocky shit
Maybe it's finally time for me hang up this game. Weapon retirement after grinding up a nice variety of guns 2 to 3 times. Grinding out 3 sets of armor 3 times to stay "strong" maybe my friends finally bailing is the Turning point that I need a break from it. I'm not sure I can handle another loot rehaul...
Drug addict talking here...(no offense)
Right? It's the game throwing out our progress. If they go forward with that loot change the way it's sounding, that'll be the nail in the coffin for me. I'm not paying for new content just to have my old progress dumped.
Especially because Bungie’s track record for differentiating perks on guns fails to really alter anything within the sandbox is seemingly non existent. There’s a handful of perks that are top tier and then the rest are gawbage and utterly useless. We are talking triple tap on 72 rpm snipers...
This isn't going to solve their gb storage issue btw this game has 2 now useless armor systems and a bunch of legendary gear that's just technically blue gear. So long as these remain or aren't upgraded to random roll status it's just gonna be extra data that no one uses. Thanks free to play: (
Sounds like my temporary break from Destiny 2 might be getting a little more permanent.
Same. Heck, I won't even buy D3 at launch, given Bungie's history. I guess no more Destiny for me until... 2021? 2022? Oh well.
12:17 feels bad man, that barrier coming up at just the right time
I understand why they wouldn’t bring back the faction rally but why wouldn’t they just bring back the factions like how they were destiny 1 and have them around all the time
They’ll bring it back when they’re running out of other recycled content- when they believe the player base will be as excited for factions as they’d be about new content.
They mentioned that there are to many characters in the game as is, and adding back factions would add to it. Additionally that would take up more space a problem they are trying to get away from
@@saxboss1 >when they’re running out of other recycled content
What recycled content are you referring to? Name one piece of "recycled content" in the last year.
Cause of Money 💰 that’s why. There is no current way for them to monetize the return of Factions like how they are in Destiny 1. At least that is to say, they haven’t figured that out yet. As Factions are now in Destiny 1, Bungie is unable to monetize them, just as they are unable to monetize them right now in Destiny 1 despite D1 being over and done with.
But as soon as they are able to monetize Factions, they will return.
@@janesmith1840 literally the moon, Vex offensive weapon, one weapon of each Sundial, Perfect Paradox though got random rolls still is a recycle, Garden of salvation armor is a recycle, all nightmares are recycled bosses. Do you even play the game?
Retiring loot will just bring back the same issues D1 had by making outdated content have irrelevant loot.
Exactly outdated
How is this not a problem in D2? Last Wish, Leviathan and SoTP are oh so relevant right now.
@@MarcoBarroca for PvE I still prefer Nation of Beasts over Spare Rations. Even my godroll kindled Orchard isn't as fun.
Taffrica agreed
@@MarcoBarroca
You can still roll around with all those weapons and armor, I still see people use Leviathan guns from time to time in both PvE and PvP
This garbage idea forces everyone to use the exact same shit and makes all that stuff obsolete and worthless
I got 15 minutes in to this video and finally loaded in to the tower from orbit.
Great video as always, Datto.
I have to ask, what's the point in chasing gear when it will be retired within a year? If they don't make new perks people will just grind a new version of an old favorite. If Armor is going to be retired then people will have to farm for good rolls on armor every retirement phase, and being able to change elemental affinity is worthless and investing in gear is also pretty pointless. If people aren't CONSTANTLY playing with the weapons they like, they take a break, or they can't get the god roll they like then they might wind up too close to the retirement period. Even worse, what is the point in buying Legendary Ornaments for guns getting retired? You'll just have to buy new ones. This means all those ornaments bought will become worthless which is pretty greedy in my eyes.
A big problem with trying to make Destiny an MMO is that a lot of character progression in MMO's is acquiring new skills, abilities, and classes. Gear is disposable because they are just stat boosts and every good MMO has true transmog. However Destiny is the opposite. Progression is entirely gear based. Your capacity to alter how you play is based entirely off of gear. Most MMO's add new classes, new abilities, and new perks in their expansions. Destiny has never added a new class, and we have only the first three this far into the 6th years. Furthermore they've only ever made ONE new subclass for each class, and 1 new perk set for every subclass. If Bungie made new classes, new skills, new perks (for characters, weapons, and armor) weapon retirement wouldn't be as much of an issue. It doesn't help that they've stated in the past that they want you to build a story with your weapon and have it become an extension of you. Yet they keep forcing people to change in a tepid attempt to make the game feel more varied. When Spare Rations gets retired people will just look for a hand cannon that can roll with the perks they liked on Spare Rations. This isn't exciting and will probably drive people away.
To say nothing of the absolutely boneheaded decision to enable artifact levels in Trials. After all that talk from Luke about how it took so long to come back because they wanted to get the balance right, how they know how important it is to get it right, how anticipated the mode is, and then they just throw balance out the window when people have the time to farm bounties all day and gain 40+ light levels over others allowing people to tank a super hit in trials. Nothing says competitive game mode like variable damage numbers!
I personally believe this next season will be awful, and I'll be interested to see how the player population fares. Trials was hype for .2 seconds until we were told about Artifact power. Armor 2.0 changes won't mean much with items retirement. New loot means nothing when it'll be useless within a year. Why play trials when the rewards won't be useful next year?Maybe I'm wrong, but only time will tell. I'm predicting an even worse season of the Drifter with Season of the Worthy.
I agree with your comment and I liked the comparison of guns with abilities. This is mainly because how unique destiny is because both your weapons and abilities both matter equally. Weapons a bit more so. Them not being permanent is anti-MMO thing.
In my opinion, gear retirement is another stick to drive FOMO home. It's actually insane. I think the retirement period is long enough and yet I hate that my Y2 guns will instantly become useless in Y4.
Honestly, this just feels like a rehash of the D1 story of Gjallarhorn and Black Spindle and Hammer. It's a heavy handed hammer to balance the game and I disagree. You can argue that it was beneficial in D1 but I like grinding for old gear. Another point I can make is what are returning and new players going to grind for if they intend to do hardcore activities? In this manner, old content will become even more abandoned than it already is because there will be no meaningful reward to satisfy those who want to be efficient or are not-exploration-oriented.
Ill leave as soon as my good rolls are not optimal in end game content.
Don't necessarily disagree with anything you've said but I'll ask you this. What's the point for grinding for anything now? Seriously have there been any new weapons since season of opulence that has been absolute must haves? Even in season of the drifter and season of opulence id say there were 2 guns that were special (spare rations and beloved). My loadout has been essentially the same since black armory.
At the same time though I think the idea of having your favourite weapon and being able to carry that through your whole journey is a good ideal. Personally my favourite all time destiny gun is my kindled orchid and I will be sad when that gets retired. But I think back to what my favourite time in destiny was and it was the taken king. Going into it and everything was new and exciting and I wanted to experiment with things. Currently my experience with new weapons is to look at which ones look the coolest and then be disappointed that they can't compete with my go to loadout.
I think there has to be a couple of things they need to do though in order for the weapon retirement to be good. First, make retired weapons be acquired meaningfully through the collections. I would like to see a collections 'builder' that would allow you to reacquire a retired weapon through the collections with a combination of perks you can choose from as long as you have had that weapon drop with the perk in its specific slot. So for example if I had 1 spare rations drop with rapid hit and moving target and another with threat detector, kill clip after it's been retired I could build one with rapid hit kill clip. This would be specifically for retired weapons and not for current weapons. Also gives you at least some long term reason to grind for the weapons that will be retired.
Second when they retire weapons they need to be retired only when the big September expansion drops and replace with a big loot pool of new weapons. Say we're 6 months down the line, they retire every weapon from year 2 and in the September expansion we only get shadowkeep levels of loot. This won't be solving the problem they think they're addressing. Weapon retirements worked in d1 because they were always replaced with a massive new loot pool of weapons. It made you WANT to experiment and WANT to replace all the weapons in your go to loadout. Personally with the number of new weapons in shadowkeep it didn't make me want to replace my entire loadout, it made want to maybe see if there was one weapon that could possibly take a slot but I never got the desire to experiment with creating a brand new loadout. Personally I want that feeling back.
Also completely agree with you on classes and subclasses. Would LOVE to see new subclasses and even new perks for existing subclasses. Great point 👍🏻
@@SkaterJonny9 yeah, me too, if this is the reason why you quit d2, that might be too soon
@@Slstoev That's a really good point you made about new players. When you put it like that, no activity is worth doing unless it came out within the last year.
I was just saying the The other day with my friend, we have no villain in destiny, oryx was the only one that was actually cool everything else is just a random boss that shows up, no back story, no bad ass cut scenes of the boss showing us how dangerous he is, how powerful he is... I want a villain that I am some what afraid of..
The Darkness xd
Your points are right on point and we need things to happen asap
I totally agree with the weapons conversation. You had your weapons that lasted all the way into D1's end (like the Hung Jury Firefly/triple tap roll) but they were very few and far between, outside of exotics.
Droped out from Hearthstone when they started taking my cards away, will do the same if Destiny does this shit with my godrolls. I earned them, goddamit!
Hearthstone never took your cards away though, it simply shifted formats.
I honestly stopped playing not long after they split it between what you can use in this season and what's not.
Bungie: Talk about reducing fomo
Also bungie: How about making weapon only available for certain period of time
Another case with bungie havin their head up their ass
Oml shut up about fomo! It's a game it's not that important to have every weapon. Also you'd rather have stale boring garbage for the next few years?
@@lukatosic09 card games usually have mode that litmited cards you can play like what bungie trying here. The thing is, if you're not playing for a while and a new rotation is comming, why bother comming back, lets wait for the new stuff.
That what happen to me with hearthstone, since last year rotation and i have not gone back to it yet. That's why fomo matter
@@lukatosic09 Its my choice if i want to have the same stale garbage over the years, not Bungie's. The problem is all theirs as they cant find out on how to make their nEW weapons relevant lmao. If Bungie is missing at something, is ideas. And white knights like you are still defending something that unreasonable...
Amazing video but the background gameplay at 9:50 was my favorite part 🤣
Great video Datto, love the content. My one big complaint with the Directors Cut blog post was when they compared the game to Magic the Gathering and how the standard content has a finite lifespan. The eternal, non-rotating magic content is far more popular and has been for some time. I feel ppl will not want to embrace new items if they constantly feel less powerful than before.
Idea:
Reintroduce the Chalice as a way to get loot from every activity, therefore giving incentive to all the runes we have
Chrust yes but should it include raid weapons?
No, that’s gay
@@subieguy4567 not sure, it was just a random idea that came to me while watching. The chalice is a great piece that is kinda obsolete rn, and reintroducing it as a way to choose your loot seems like it would fix two problems at once. there would def need a lot more thinking as to if it could be applied EVERYWHERE, but i feel it could work
I agree with everything with what they discussed but the weapons being capped to a certain power. If feels like a lazy way for a bungie to get people to farm for new weapons. Instead of making them unique and actually new.
Would you rather use a unique weapon or your god roll spare rations?
Man, spot on. 13:30 - 14:45 echoes my exact feelings on the state of the story at the minute. I went all deep-dive on Reddit the other day on the same topic, I actually referenced WoW a few times as comparison. They weave an absolutely fantastic narrative but it all seems so fragmented at the moment. Shadowkeep (wrote shadowlands the first time lmao) was more or less centred around the fact that the Darkness is starting to make it's move, and we've spent the 6 months since that revelation doing... stuff. But like you said all we can do at the minute is wait because I get the feeling this is all gradually working towards a meta-narrative that going to simultaneously tie about 20 threads together and if I had faith in a developer for pulling that off, it'd be Bungie. We'll just have to see how it all unravels. But I feel like a world that reacts more to current events (Savathun corrupting the EDZ to use your example) even just to the level of updating longtime NPC dialogue so Hawthorne isn't still patting me on the back for killing Ghaul would go a long way to easing the feeling of fragmentation. At the end of the day this is well and truly a live service model now, so the kind of story they're trying to tell is going to feel like it's dragging its feet between big developments. I don't think it's avoidable while they keep the seasonal model
This fills me with so much confidence for the future of the game.
So okay, refresh the loot that is fine and I get it, it just kills my motivation. For example, I’m not great at pvp, and I just barely got Not Forgotten about 2 weeks ago, that was a tough grind, and really hard to reach Legend for me. Now that gun will be worthless for the activities I want to play, and I have no incentive to grind out a quest like that ever again if by the time I get it I will have a week to use it. To be honest it just sucks. And knowing that even getting the good newly released guns won’t do me any good because I will just get trashed by “power per hour” players isn’t very enticing either. I feel like something has to give one way or the other, let me keep/use guns I like and worked hard for or have a power cap... to deal with both, 30 hours a week won’t be enough time and that is hard for people that have a family, friends, a demanding full time job, as I do. I love destiny, and have since D1 launch, but this just hurts, and knowing I can’t keep up hurts worse.
I'm with ya 100%, man. I don't buy the new expansions/seasons just to have Bungie throw my time and money-bought content away. Destiny 2 isn't real life, and players shouldn't have to work at it as if it were.
Not only that but what happens for new light players? They load up the game to and start from the beginning only to find out all that stuff is pointless because it won’t carry over...And you are telling me they are going to do it for the story? Haha I’m no Tolkien but we all know that no one plays Destiny strictly for the story. So now you have loads of players who have been saving up rolls and guns throughout the last two years waiting for Trials to come back. Filling vaults full of side arms, auto rifles, and guns of all archetypes they love and enjoy (my sweet Kindled orchid) and spending time which equates to money on god rolls and builds for it all to become borderline worthless. Unless you are filling saucy enough to load into nightfalls, strikes with your old stuff just to mess around with...because everyone wants to run bungies strike playlist with their maybe 5 strikes repeatedly
Let’s also talk about how we are going to even get these new guns? Are we to expect that Bungie is going to roll out a bunch of new strikes, and story missions for the “wave” (more like the waves seen on a small pond with some strong wind) of new guns that are more than likely going to have a slight variation of the same perks? Reskinned and renamed?
I feel you. Weapon retirement basically kills all my motivations to farm for god rolls, too. Hell just looking at all my pinnacle and ritual weapons, I don't even wanna log into the game now... What's the point to continue farming if all these weapons will be gone in about 1 year?
I just got Not Forgotten this season too and that PvP grind was hard AF. This is also my first season ever hitting Legend in Comp. i am never doing anything like that again knowing that Bungie plans to leave my hard earned pinnacle weapons behind. I have no incentive to play Destiny 2 now. I enjoy Destiny 1 more than ever now.
just remember . . . true endgame=fashion frame
No
Yes
I love watching your channel.
Honesty can be brutal but it's necessary
Nice video, I agree with your points on the new infusion system.
If they add a kind of uniques perks in the raid weapons, the change will be perfect.
Honestly, I don't think Raid weapons ever should have become random rolls. They should have stayed as curated, fixed rolls with a specific purpose they were designed for.
@@RikiazGaming 100% agree
@@RikiazGaming but then, what the purpose to farm them? when you can do 10+runs to get all triumphs and weapons
@@RikiazGaming should've done like D1 raid weapons where they did have random rolls, but they still had set rolls that were specific to that raid (ie. Cacoon on Kings fall weapons, or like the triple-double for Chaos Dogma)
Theyll still end up under leveled because its old content. And thus no one willwanna farm for level throttled gear. Especially in a game mode with such low r.o.i. such as a raid. Why the fuck would ANYONE wanna play levi when theres not a grauntee of a good drop and even if you do get one itll be trash because it wont be able to match the current ll cap?
Wait wait wait... by “weapon retirement” does that mean loot pool or EVERYWHERE? Is it like prime vaulting in Warframe, or does it lock out YOUR CURRENT stuff from the load out?
Gabe Donlon no it means at a certain power level you won’t be able to increase that guns power so you can take to high level activities, no more infusion for that gun it will always stay at 980 for example
@@Kazuma0305 Ironically infusion was made to solve that exact problem back in D1, why they're deciding to bring it back I have no clue.
@@lordcrimson913 no it wasn't infusion was made to up the level of guns u got that year
After 9-15 months, you will be unable to infuse certain weapons. You can still use them in everything other than the most high-level activities like Master Nightfalls.
Imagine if you had a god rolled spare rations that couldn't be leveled beyond 800. You'd still use it for pvp for sure, could use it for strikes or Gambit and even old raids. But a 980 NF or GoS? No way.
Something neat to include with the season pass would be a stamp or a trinket we can put on old guns that will allow them to be l veiled up instead of left behind if this is the plan.
For weapon retirement, I would like to have a "shelf", maybe in the tribute hall. When the weapon can no longer be infused, but it is masterworked (with big number) and has good rolls, I can put it on a "display shelf" and when/if that weapon is reintroduced into the game in a future season I can go get mine off my shelf. This also adds to the "you had to be there" as day 1 of the season I can run around with it with an end of season number, or just simply day 1 you have your god roll perks. The caveat would be that since it is back in the loot pool that I can infuse it again. This would relieve vault problems as it would not be taking up a vault spot from current farming. Basically just give us a separate vault (or a quest to open it) where it will not let you put "current" items in it, you are only allowed to put non-infusable items in it. Would not fix current vault space, but over time it would help. Naming wise that would be more of a vault and in the tower would be more of a storage locker, but calling it a "display shelf" since it is like where you would put trophies, which these weapons would be. Or put it somewhere in the tower (maybe with Ada) and so people can look at other peoples shelves with masterwork numbers listed above items. Doing it in the tower as a public space would make the "collecting" part of D2 more valuable than just checking off the box, just like the glow from nightfall high score emblem (to an extent at least).
I really like the MTG analogy. I love playing legacy, but sometimes I want to play standard and not have to worry about force of will when I try to dark ritual or lions eye diamond (or play other formats too). Activities (or modes) where you are allowed to use stuff from only current season, 2 seasons, 5 seasons, ANYTHING (vintage), would be great. You can't have every combination of season lengths or you might sit in queue and never find a match if you happen to be going for the wrong length. I think the following would be good additions of modes for activities with the MTG parallel in parentheses:
*ALL (eternal formats) - old and new gear combined to make allowed "game breaking combo" could fit here
*Forsaken and forward ("modern")
*current year ("standard"...rolling out by season instead of year would be more consistent, so current season and last 3?)
These 2 could be added, but not sure how well people would like first or how hard second would be on the technical side:
*current season
*Draft/random ("cube"-ish) - you load into the activity and instead of using your gear you have been given a random set (weapons or weapons and armor). YOU DO NOT GET TO KEEP IT, nor can you dismantle/infuse. Could be everyone gets different set, the same set or same types like all get pulse, shotgun, and bow. Many ways this could be great or horrible depending on how they implement it (and choose the pool of options). Maybe even your class and super are random, could be a fun spin. Done right, I think it could be a fun "chaos mode".
The big power level question with the modes would be if a) the activity power cap, in the same way as contest mode worked during day 1 raid, is set at the highest that the lowest/oldest gear could be, or b) the activity does not scale based on the mode which makes gear choice a more important consideration as power would be part of the factor along with stats and perks.
On world building/changing, other than loosing Cayde-6 (in story and tower), has anything actually changed since D2 launched? Stuff has continuously been added, but has there been any actual change?
The straw that broke the camels back. I’m officially ending my 5-6 year relationship with Destiny. It’s not me, it’s you
well, bye than
I've done the Sundial exactly three times, and I was over it after the first. Seasonal activities are a detriment to the game. I know it wasn't sustainable to have the older model with actual expansions every few months or so, but they need to find a balance between that and what we have now. I don't have that FOMO feeling at all. Actually, I have the opposite feeling. I just don't care about this stuff. I don't care to learn it like I would a raid because it will be gone before you know it and that knowledge of the game no longer matters.
Thank you Daddo I was worried I’d have to form my own opinion on all this. Good lookin out! :)
I commented on a video somewhere saying that I was bored of getting guns just to get them. They would then be shoved in the vault and I would continue to use the pinnacle weapons. I’m glad Bungie will be retiring weapons, it makes getting new “god rolls” more special. I now just add my new outlaw/rampage to the vault or shard it.
I also mentioned somewhere about the core game, how it was basically left behind with no real reason to play it apart from xp. Strike and crucible loot is boring. We’ve had better devils for 3 years now!! I’d love to see more care put into the core game experience so I was happy to see Luke touch on it.
I can’t wait for these changes to be implemented!
Sure. A year is a long time to gather loot and get the new god roll, but with a full time job, its hard to find time to play. I love D2, and i like knowing the time I have to dedicate to the game is not wasted in any way. I want to be able to pull ol' reliable and use that in say, a new raid, without having to put in a bunch of extra time gathering new weapons for it on top of the time it takes just to gather a team and actually raid. So, Its all well and good for the privileged Datto to be able to not care about weapons anymore, because he can spend literally a hundred hours in D2 in a week if he wanted to. But there are plenty of people who just can't. And the game will get a whole lot more annoying for them with changes like that. I feel like a good compromise would be would be only pinnacle sources can drop weapons and gear that maintain high light level*. other stuff being capped at whatever the non pinnacle cap is.This would require bungie changing their pinnacle sources around more, but that would be a better alternative to just retiring weapons because they cant just release fewer weapons each season. Seriously, whats wrong with just slowing the release of new gear? Focus on core balance. The game could use more of that.
*This would also requre them to limit what loot can roll as pinnacle, but that seems an easy thing to do.
Top shelf comment right here
Retiring weapons really just killed my enthusiasm. I'm not going to bother grinding for a good roll on a weapon or getting attached to it because I know it'll become near useless in a few months because getting the roll you want can literally take that long. If I keep playing after the next two Seasons, then I'm just going to use whatever the game gives me and not grind at all.
That's how vanilla D1 was, it meant you needed to switch up your weapons and was actually fun and interesting
I agree, who cares about grinding for god rolls, just grind power and your crap will beat god rolls in pinnacle activities. And all the pinnacles we spent mindless ours grinding quests for using guns we don’t like to get one we do, those are useless now too. I finally hit legend 2 weeks ago so I have a solid 2 weeks to use the gun it got me before it is irrelevant. So much for when they announced at shadowkeep how we can play how we want with the guns we want.
@@Sohelanthropus Infusion was supposed to be the solution to that and here we are.
Spot on
Sohelanthropus remember infusion?
I didn't like the idea of retiring weapons at first, but I'm starting to like it more now that I've heard you talk about it. I'd love for raid weapons to be unique and actually matter and stand out from everything else. I love my Year 1 Foggy Notion, but if there's a new SMG that can only drop from raids that goes above and beyond what my favorite gun has to offer, I'll gladly chase after it.
Walked in not liking the idea of shelving my Forsaken/Last Wish weapons, but figured you were worth hearing out.
I feel as though now you helped me look forward to playing the game again after the incoming changes. After playing gacha games for years and Magic for decades, I think I see where youre coming from and what youre worried about.
I'll still miss my old weapons, but I loved chasing loot in the best gunplay this generation has. And if I didnt care about new loot... then I wasnt playing very much. Mostly to help friends new to the game.
Good chat, Datto. It might not make you popular, but you changed my mind.
Kinda sad that pinnacle weapons are being shelved since I just got them recently
BioWare used the term “aspirational content” when describing Anthem’s endgame.
fungus amongus BioWare jade released Anthem.
@@fakename2926 What? Maybe you mean that you just bought it?
What is an anthem?
Yikes
That’s a yikes from me fam
For me I am right now okay with the waiting game. As I just started playing (light 970 with artifact)
I also bought forsaken in the sale and the season pass aswell. As I started mid season I'm right now trying to get to level 100. I also need to do all the exotic guests and learn about the game. Finally when I learn everything they add more content that I finally can understand
Thanks again datto for always stating your thoughts in a cool non-hyberbolic way. It's refreshing when coming from literally anywhere else on the internet.
R.I.P.
I’m pissed about the old weapon retirement but hopefully the fix that
You did not understand
Elam Raul Colon I already saw Aztecross’ video, and I don’t feel like making a 20 hour discussion about it. Basically, old weapons are going to be obsolete in a certain amount of time.
@@GaijinNomad787 we do understand my friend hours of hours spend on my kindle so i can use a god hc wit Izanagi's now cant use because "old weapons" are apparently too good
@@GaijinNomad787 he didn't understand your reply either
I’m fine with it as long as it doesn’t render pinnacles and other seasonal gear obsolete.
My aspiration ran out when they started remastering old dlc weapons
But some people like that, and it's not like it's that hard to do. It doesn't take away anything from the game.
My aspiration ran out when they retire my entire vault.
Seraphim Valkyrin unlike forcing weapons into obsolescence
With the shelving of loot they need to take a look at the collections, make curated rolls acquire-able from the collections tab.
Honestly would like the faction weapons back. Missed out on most of the faction items and would love them back!
Boy, am I excited for all the new legendary weapons that'll come with the next season and are going to be irrelevant just a few months later! Super exciting, Bungie, why not just get rid of all my exotics too, just so you can then reintroduce them 8 months later with a quest that involves some nice 'rEprRisEd ePiC vErSiOnS' of Y1 strikes.
e/ It's also not necessarily gonna be "a year" (~18:20) for loot to be relevant. It might as well just be 9 months - as they said - and if we take into consideration how long it sometimes takes to get the desired loot, with the desired perks - I'm looking at you Antiope - it might come down to 8 or even 7 months, which is significantly less than a year.
Don't worry, it's gonna be one of those "you had to be there moments" they keep insisting on, now when weapons get pushed to irrelevancy. Who knows, maybe we'll get some wacky emblems for when you used a weapon in a certain timeframe that was never even disclosed too!
9-12 months is not "just a few months" if that's too short for you then why do you play this game lmao.
peter dozal You haven’t been playing for a long time have you? One year is extremely fast in Destiny.
The Library - Bearers of The Mantle lmao clearly you have not been playing long. Try going back to D1 year one. That shit was slow. Anyone who thinks a fucking year is too fast is an idiot. Bro I got over 5,000 hours in destiny with a max Grimoire score in D1. Nice try though.
@@peterdozal8825
Apparentely you didn't read my second paragraph; or you just didn't get the point at all.
There is a significant difference between the actual, individual time you personally got with your loot and those official 9-12 months, and even if there wasn't, the quintessence is that Bungie purposefully devalues legendary loot into - what I consider - irrelevance, maybe not "a few" months later, but sure enough eventually.
18:04 you don’t need to tell me how to play my game.
It's not your game, it's Bungie's game. They can make it how they want to. The fact of the matter is sometimes they have to make difficult choices that splinter the community. You can't please everyone. If this puts a bad taste in your mouth you can play some other games for awhile and come back when you wanna play some more Destiny. For me, I haven't played D2 in a few weeks since we finished Savior, I claimed my title, and I fell off the wagon of farming Bright Dust to keep up with buying emotes from Eververse. People have different levels of engagement with the game. Just do what makes you happy.
@@WiseSam95 I don't think he meant "my game" as literally his game.
Honestly an idea that i find to work in my head is have a sort of tier list for perks. With this comes a tier set of “godrolls” where the level of relative optimal rolls for something like heroic strikes is objectively less than that of a higher level activity. To keep this in sort of line with wanting players to be able to get good stuff without having to have the ability to do the extreme of the extreme we could have a sort of super rare drop of a true god roll able to be rolled in any activity but have it be like very VERY rare
The problem with weapon retirement is the current cadence they add weapons at. We have 16 weapon types, each with up to 4 archetypes (frames, speeds), then almost doubled again for the energy/kinetic split.
We got 8 new weapons this season, and 3 ritual weapons.
That means it could take 10 seasons just to see ONE new weapon for each archetype. That's two years, with yearly expansions. We'd be left with either having to regrind the same weapon just for it to be useable, or we'd have the choice of, "I guess I'll use THE kinetic aggressive sniper with THE energy 150 handcannon." All that does is severely limit choice and identity, creating a curated loadout system with the extra step of having to spend hours/days/weeks grinding to get the correct weapon and roll.
Power creep is always an issue, in Destiny and similar games. But the difference in Destiny is that our guns ARE our loadout and our character identity. Almost everything else goes into improving our guns, whereas other games are based around classes and skills, with gear for stats to enhance that.
It is a problem, but Smith's answer is a copout taken from the wrong lessons without consideration for context.
For the casual player this feels like a massive slap in the face. I spent my limited time grinding for the weapons I have that I enjoy playing with and Bungie is making that time worthless by making them irrelevant and instead asking that I grind all over again. Beyond angry with this decision.
You will have an entire YEAR to grind and use these wepons.
Maybe a system where you can pick a few weapons to be infused forever and the rest get left behind would be a better than stopping all weapons from being infused.
Or maybe you can spend an ascendant shard or something similar to enhance a weapon that is capped. Encourages using new weapons, but doesn't make past weapons literally useless.
After solo grinding all the crucible pinnacle weapons except for Not Forgotten, i got burnt out on Destiny this past season but looking forward to picking it up again. Hopefully the bring some fresh stuff this year
I could see the Darkness wiping out a few planets and getting new areas on earth and other planets where we see defenses built up, invasions, etc.
Example: People would lose their minds if Nessus was blown up. It'd force the Leviathan to move to a different planet and give them an excuse to mix up the menagerie. You could involve the player in holding off the Darkness as a last stand on the Tangled Shore while the awoken try to flee, etc. Then repopulate the Dreaming City with Awoken. Make it a giant, cataclysmic expansion event.
I think you’re looking at it with the wrong perspective, Datto. It’s not “I got my five guns and I don’t need anything else!” It’s more having your hand forced and in so many ways being told what to do instead of being allowed to play in the way that is the most fun for the individual. Leaving behind weapons you are fond of just because you like them, enjoy using them, maybe like the way they look, etc. because Bungie is forcing you to do so to many players is not only a bad time but a throwing away hundreds of hours or more of time invested getting those rolls. We are about to go from Season of FOMO to Season of Why Bother?
As someone who wants to use everything, retirement just makes everything i do a waste of time and it's frankly insulting. Attaching to 5 weapons is a personal choice, and if I did that, i wouldn't have room to complain about nothing else being interesting because I haven't used everything. My 78 builds are screwed and im not wasting my time updating them with thematically incorrect gear that won't ever carry the same feeling it originally did, just for that to get trashed too.
My OG Quickfang is set to die...and with it my interest.
Rip naruto sword.
TJM99 poor guy
"Evolving world"
we need something on par with the taken king bringing in the taken.
Or the iron lords bringing the siva outbreak into the cosmodrome.
Or forsaken bringing the end to a beloved character.
Or even something small to counteract the power creep, like how shadowkeep brought more powerful enemies (nightmares) to some lost sectors.
I’ve made a few reddit posts (or are they still on my notepad on my phone) about an overarching enemy for the seasons and the expansion years. The seasons progress us through the story of the expansion. And the world evolves at points through the year and at the end/beginning of the next year.
Then changing leveling and progression of the guardian and remove light from gear and armor and just as values to stuff like D1.
Man:/ weapon retirement hit me hard. I’m shipping off to the army after this senior year. And I won’t be able to grind or even play for these new seasons and coveted weapons.
I like how Luke Smith compared our weapons to magic the gathering, and I would like to see a rotation like that because it stops the game from being stale
I wouldn't mind rotation, but not if RNG is too stupidly low to get a good roll of it. FFS I still don't have a roll of Antiope that's as good as the collections roll.
Loot needs to rain if they really want rotational loot otherwise it'll just feel bad to finally grind out a gun only to find that you can't use it. It'd be like if you wanted this one card in Magic and you kept dumping loads of money and time into trying to get it but woah-oh when you do get it it's no longer playable in the game.
Id love if there still was a way to get season of undying armour since i like the aesthetics
i was away for some time and couldnt finish leveling the season pass ;_;
FOMO problem, for real. Good thing undying guns looked and handled like garbage so we don't miss them if we missed out lol
@@Gerwhal I've found the SMG to be rather nice, but yeah I can agree on the rest.
example is escalation protocol. it was so fun doing it and then when you get the items you need you don't need it anymore. I would also recommend add more loot in that activity like after a certain amount of ep clears you get a certain catalyst or certain weapon with perks. maybe have something like sundial where you can choose your weapon for that season and onward like i want an auto rifle for future season and want a certain armor for future seasons. maybe let us pick the weapon and let us pick at least one roll or two. if i end of doing escalation protocol give us weapons that you could get from previous seasons like sundial weapons or complete a mission or quest to get the sundial fusion weapon. something like that
I’m just saying: if they touch my mountaintop which was a pain in the ass to get (did the quest before they made it easy) I’m gonna be very unhappy, that’s probably my favorite legendary in the whole game at the moment. In my opinion, they shouldn’t touch *pinnacle* weapons but obviously they’re most likely going to retire them, thing is, MT is so unique that there will never be anything to replace it unless they just remake the weapon. As for retiring weapons as a whole, I understand why they’re doing it, it’s just frustrating to me that it’s a returning feature from destiny 1, never liked the idea of obsolete weapons sitting in my vault to collect dust, only to be brought back because the community missed them
At best youll have to regrind the same rolls on a reskinned mountain top. Ut i it would be affected by this change.
It seems like there is going to be two types of players if they do this the old guys who just use the same guns and the ones that grind season over season for the best as a person who plays every weekend why get any wepon. Grinding for a new God roll is dumb and if they do restrict perks all that will do is make people use their old weapons more no rampage this season let me just use my old one, no ambiguous assassin or multi kill clip why bother
My solution: add new perks
I know they do that and how limited is to make more but think about perks like more kills equal bigger blast radius, or precision kills sharply increase precision damage or stowing this weapon buffs your primary stuff like that to make more toys for me
As someone that plays somewwhat regularly, my season pass is still only lvl 70. I feel like if I don't put in heaps of time in the next 2 weeks I will miss out on the exclusive seasonal pass rewards which isn't a good feeling to me. I hope they really work on addressing this and making all the content more accessible for people like me.
I like the idea of a rolling year period, not just every year having a reset. For example, we’d still have access to anything from February 2019-February 2020, in that other scenario, it would just be to September 2020. I DO have a major issue with retiring exotics. I get everything else, but exotic retirement crosses the line