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“Cape independence is UNREALISTIC” | Helen Zille
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- Опубліковано 27 кві 2021
- What does Helen Zille make of recent calls for 'Cape independence'? The former Premier of the Western Cape speaks to David Ansara of the CRA to discuss whether this idea is realistic. Could a more federal system be preferable to secession?
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Check out the full interview with Helen Zille on the 'Solutions With David Ansara' podcast: ua-cam.com/video/ZoCsWLv5LkU/v-deo.html
Interview Hein Marx from the ULA. Zille doesn't know what she is taking about
Never believe those who says your ideals are unrealistic.History is made by those who reject the status quo. In the 90's they said the notion of a town build on Afrikaner labour alone could never work, and yet, 30 years later and Orania is booming. Anything is possible if enough people take up the cause.
Exactly right!
Hellen is controlled opposition same as her party and a snake oil sale woman.
4,5 million is barely enough. VS 50 million equally determined to prevent the break up of a unitary South Africa.
Not to mention the progressive international community.
@@brianmuvuti2102 Not really. If the majority in a certain region feels that the country does not have their best interest at heart, and are better off on their own, there is no reason why they shouldn't be allowed to go their own way. Its written in the UN charter. Besides, the South African state is so hollowed out by corruption and incompetence, they will have as much power to hold South Africa together, than the Brittish had to hold their empire together in 1960. New countries forms all the time. There is no reason why it can't happen here.
I am not interested in "realistic politics" but a future. No thanks to the utter failure of the DA as an opposition to the criminality we are dealing with. The DA is losing votes because it lost its way....
You talk utter rubish
United States, Bangladesh, Eritrea, South Sudan, Syria, Singapore, Montenegro... the list goes on of nations formed by secession. So few people seem to realise that the Cape independence movement(s) are not breaking new ground, they are following set precedent. And every nation formed this way had an abundance of politically motivated naysayers, all of whom were proven wrong.
Even more interesting is that SA politics is rife with politicians supporting the self-determination of Palestinians while they refer to the self-determination of unique Cape cultures as "unrealistic".
@@karenlang4776 Actually, failed states do tend to fracture!
@@karenlang4776 Yes it can. Who would stand up to resolute Capies wanting independence. Do you really think the national 'woke' military of fat men and women who are unfit staggeringly overpaid are prepared to die simply to prevent some people in the Cape who want separate passports and drivers licences from getting them. At 73 and a 10 year SADF veteran(1965-1975) I will call their bluff.
@@normangoldstuck8107 they will fight and China and Cuba will support them. Chinese gunships will bombard Cape Town and the world will do nothing.
Africans will never let this happen 🤣 a white man will never rule an inch of this continent ever again 🤣
@@chesterdonnelly1212 the world will do nothing precisely because it is a racist bunch of white settlers with racist ideas who want to secede. No African wants to secede.
I respect Helen Zille but the DA should start woking with the secessionist if they want to remain relevant in the Western Cape going forward. Their own supporters are growing in numbers supporting the Western Cape independence.
Ongelukkig is die meerderheid van DA ondersteuning in getalle nie in die WP nie. Hulle sal altyd ondersteuning geniet buite die WP
@@johannstrauss3779 Jy is dood reg! Maar die antie wil net haar wil uitvoer.
Helen's job is on the line when independence is achieved😃😃
That's her and other naysayers main reason for shooting independence down!!
@@rioscordoba606 Yep, exactly that.
Precisely, the DA stooges just want to protect their government salaries and pansions
Africans will never allow a white man to rule an inch of this continent ever again 🤣
Helen would make an excellent Western Cape president.
Western Cape is better off independent free the Cape
Yes of course, if you're prepared to have a civil war, and you think you can win.
Why will there be a civil war?
@@RynoLeGrange if the Cape is trying to win independence and the ANC government is trying to stop that from happening there could be civil war. When a region secedes there is usually a civil war.
@@chesterdonnelly1212 why will there be a civil war? Helen Zille also failed to substantiate her statement.
@@RynoLeGrange do you think South Africa will let a province secede? I guess you could be right. If no one is prepared to fight the army there will be no secession and no civil war.
Zille you are on a page no one wants to be on. It is time! We need an independent Cape!
Visit www.capexit.org - we have over 800 000 registered members for Western Cape independence already.
@@faa9261 not true. Refer to international Art 1 & 20 of Humanitarian rights. SA government's approval not needed.
Well u crazy if u think majority in the WC want independence
Keep on insulting Helen Zille who has been in politics longer than you've had hot dinners
@user-md4op6ko3y and thats the problem.
I voted to exit last time and will vote for an independent Cape again!
Africans will never let this happen 🤣 a white man will never rule an inch of this continent ever again 🤣
Do u realize u being racist ?
It will never happen. Try that and see what happens. This is South African soil and will always be South African soil.
@@NEMB213 logically I don’t see it happening, but emotionally I want it to happen.
I will vote this time around for for cape independence...
If Namibia did it, so can the Cape. Federalism means little if you cannot control your own law enforcement.
Namibia was never part of South Africa
What's Law Enforcement got to do with Federalism go insult the ANC
@@user-md4op6ko3y Chris, law enforcement is a national competence. Let me spell that real slow: It is governed from Pretoria. Federalism can mean a number of things. You can have no meaningful law enforcement at provincial level, you can have some with limited competences, and you can have your own. If you don't have your own, your federal project becomes ephemeral. The W Cape police might catch criminals, but it is still the Pretoria-controlled SAPS that will investigate them, lose their dockets, assign incompetents, and ultimately fail the prosecution.
I am not referring to the useless.corrupt police force we have I am referring to the Law Enforcement we have in Cape Town
The Leap Program were doing just fine de centralisation more power to the Provence away from Pretoria
In time we will root out the corrupt element in the Police thanks to Ian Cameron our Leep Program and Law Enforcement are doing just fine de centralisation and more power to have more controll and not being dictated to by the ANC in Pretoria I have full faith our Governing Body
DA all the Way in May
I've lived in Gauteng for 25 years. (21y in Pta and 4y in Jhb). Also lived 6y in Kzn. It is a shithole that will NEVER recover. Western Cape is still far from this irreparable state. But is still deteriorating, just at a slower rate than the rest of SA.
Cape Independence is a chance to have a country that we can truly be proud of.
So who will run the country.. Whites aren't the majority..
So wat would happen to the hundreds of thousands of people who migrated to the cape...
@@madimetjamahlatse9270 qualified people will run the country based on merits not based on friendship race etc
Yes
Secession is the future where minorities can enjoy their basic human rights, without domination and oppression. Independence of those regions where minorities are in fact the majority. If the majority wants to destroy that part of the country where they form the majority, they welcome to do so.
Cape independence is an idea for which the time has come and its support is growing by the day judging from daily conversations with common decent people who have had enough.
Africans will never let this happen 🤣 a white man will never rule an inch of this continent ever again 🤣
@Danny Archer thankfully your opinions don’t matter nearly enough to influence anything 🤣
@@sam3407 Who said Cape Independence is about the white man ruling? 50% of the people of the Western Cape are Coloured people. Africans who do not want to accept independence must go back to the other side of the Fish River, EC where they came from.
@@andries3339 is it you and your kind who’s going to force Africans out?
I like the fact that you guys are carrying out your secession idea. You’re likely to trigger a lot of activity…
@@sam3407 Nobody is going to "force" Africans out of the Cape. If a person does not want to stay in the independent Cape, he is free to leave and live in any part of the country if he thinks he will have a better life in his new place.
Cape independence is about all the people (BLACK,WHITE,COLOURED) who live in the Cape who have had enough of the ANC regime who pretends to govern and who has stolen the future of our children while ANC politicians and cadres are living in sickening and extravagant luxury at our expense.
Why must the Coloured people of the Cape who are the majority in the Cape, not demand independence from a mafia band of ANC thieves who control the rest of the country for their own pockets? If my neighbour is a thief, there is no reason for me to trust him and invite him into my house or discuss with him matters regarding my house and my family. I don't need to friends with this thief.The ANC thief is never going to stop with his stealing and corruption and the people of the Cape don't want their children to be part of this pathalogical way of life. The ANC is rotten to the core and will self destruct and the people of the Cape are saying we don't want to be part of this.
Good chat with Helen. I think she is spot on but there is an alternative such as driving independence through these "splinter groups" as she calls it, like CapExit etc. This way you bypass the national government by large and reach out to the international community who then accepts you as an independent nation.
The "international community" are useless people who don't support secessionist movements unless there is an underdog factor of a repressed racial or religious group.
Crazy, that won't happen we love being part of south africa. The UN has no power over this country, this is the new generation u want Cape Town, a war is coming ur way then. U don't want to see bloodbath don't u.
@@motionenergy808 I agree it is complete and utter bullshit. I'm willing to take up arms to make sure this doesn't happen. These people must go back to Europe if they want independence not in our motherland this is our soil.
Rubbish Zille! Nigel Farage went to the EU in 1999 and everyone laughed at him when he advocated Brexit. Today he is laughing at them.
...and many are suffering over the results of Brexit, which owed a lot to Putin whose hands were all over it in his attempt to propagandize democratic states in Europe. Those who voted enthusiatically for Brexit now wish that they hadn't. It's a disaster. Nigel Farage is nothing but a racist POS.
This is South Africa not Europe or the UK
@@user-md4op6ko3yyes a failed state we are !!
Dear Helen. It will not help your DA, in any way. for you to get involved in a "Demand for Cape Independence discussion." The best possible political answer for the DA, is to send two of your most dedicated Party Members, to Zimbabwe, to sit in the Public Gallery in the Zimbabwe Parliament, for about ten days, to see why the MDC is also continuing to lose more and more public support.
Have discussions with Zanu PF and MDC members of Parliament, to determine exactly what must be done, to save the DA from an otherwise inevitable massive voter loss at the next election.
Only You can do it to save your DA, Helen!
You are sadly mistaken the DA will win the Western Cape
Because there won't be a DA party anymore if the Western Cape independence.
Living in the Western Cape is like being in first class on the Titanic.
Mostly wen ur well of financially
No it's just one of the most beautiful cities in the World to live in despite all its problems wealthy or poor
People who are not happy in South Africa or Africa must leave it it is that simple this is outlr land it is ours . You do not get black people going to Europe and demanding a land in there
Yes, you do.
There is literally tons of footage of your brothers running to Spain and Italy, and they go there to complain not to work or assimilate.
The Cape had only some Khoi people(who consider themselves as coloured) here, and none of the black tribes were here when the white immigrants (many of whom had been kicked out of Europe by the Catholics (eg Hugenots)), and found this basically uninhabited Cape area!
Ha ha ha. This is why the country is going nowhere Ms Zille. Limited thinking is the problem.
Limited thinking on her part you mean she is as much part of the problem as her party is and so are all other political parties all talk and no walk as they get rich from taxes and privileges.
We need Federal Autonomy. We need Independence. Support this 100%. I'm in favor of Cape Party since they been preaching independence since 2007 despite being called crazy for all those years, but I wouldn't mind VF+ or CCC taking the gold from DA either. It's like Jack Miller said. It doesn't matter who wins the WC Elections, it matters only if they push for independence. Cape Party all the way for me.
I've voted Cape party since matriculating in 2012.
Their policies of low taxes and more foreign business investment are the main reason I like them.
CCC are just socialists looking for there piece of tax money.
@@rioscordoba606 I don't think CCC are socialist. It's a good thing that Coloureds are taking responsibility for themselves rather than waiting for someone else to fix their problems. CCC will have a role to play in an independent Western Cape.
@@frankie7529 I could be wrong, but I've read their mission statement on their website, and from what I've read it's dogwhistles for communist lingo.
"EQUALITY/ ABORIGINAL priveleges/etc"
Fadiel Adams probably will have a massive role to independence though.
@@rioscordoba606 who knows who wrote that. Probably some Marxist. But there's no way Fadiel Adams is a Marxist. He's not an academic or an intellectual. He just wants to be the leader that his community needs. I absolutely believe that his intentions are good. I have been following him for a few years and I have seen him develop as a leader.
@@frankie7529 Then why not side Cape Party like Ebrahim David's is doing.
Also I've been on their Facebook page awhile back and some of them literally said down capitalism.
I admit though in the start of gatvol cape tonians he did seem to want help mostly.
Remember this is not Europe this is Africa and there is no need to fight for Africa's Land Hellen.
R W Johnson believes it's possible, that's good enough for me.
Might happen, but it will be tough
@@xinyorixahumba6307 Just because it may be tough, doesn’t mean you don’t strive for it. I believe it is the only way that minorities will get to have a future on the Southern tip of Africa.
@@gregdennis6584 Exactly
Not gonna lie it will be fun leaving the western cape in ruins
This is one area where I disagree with Helen. Hopefully this coming local elections the secession parties become the king makers that force the DA to go down the secession road.
I agree with Zille, there will never be an independent Western Cape without a civil war, and a civil war is an understatement. But the civil war will not be along racial lines with blacks vs whites & Cape Coloureds. It will be all South Africans, black white coloured indian muslim etc, vs the separatists. There ar just too many people that have a vested financial interest in keeping South Africa united. Western Cape independence threatens the ifinancial interests of all white people in the rest of the country whether they are farm owners, real estate owners, mine owners, car dealership owners, supermarket owners etc. Western Cape independence is basically land expropriation of a huge chunk of the land of the country without compensation. If it happens then the private property of whites in the rest of South Africa would be at risk of a similar expropriation by the majority black government with the more radical elements now armed with the justification they need. The politicians in Government will not want this to happen because they are benefitting imensely from the current arrangement and the political and economic fallout will be unpredictable. Everyone will fight tooth and nail to prevent this independent Western Cape. The separatists will be brutally and swiftly put down with a united effort by people of all races in this country.
Bring it on we willing to die for it😎
@@rioscordoba606 So be it. The formation of a separatist crypto-apartheid state right on the border of South Africa will not be tolerated.
@@rioscordoba606 die for a country which is not urs for the first place ,keep dreaming
@@rioscordoba606 why not secede to Europe?
@@xyz835 why not fix your side of the country?
Scotland went to the polls only a few years ago in an attempt to leave the UK and gain independence. The Scottish people were given the choice. Why not the Western Cape? There is no good reason to stay part of SA and a million reasons why independence would work. At least we would a country that could prosper without any interference from the likes of the ANC or EFF. There is "NO SUCH THING AS CAN"T" Helen.
Scotland never stopped being a country. Scotland is in a voluntary union with England and is free to leave if it wants to. South Africa is no longer a union. It is a republic. Western Cape is a province not a country and has no right to secession.
@@chesterdonnelly1212 SA should never have been one country to begin with. The British Empire engineered it they way because it suited them. SA is a relic of the Colonial past, let’s decolonize it and have the Western Cape secede.
@@gregdennis6584 I agree. South Africa should have always been a federal country like Australia and Canada. But unfortunately it isn't and the Western Cape has no legal right to secede.
No choice to be given here, the manner which our Land was taken from us, indeed the 1994 is our 2024, we want out Land back ..we will live together as a rainbow Nation as we claim to be ..we want to be equals ...
I am sure Ramaphosa ANC will have a deal with you...Zuma -ANC umkhonto wesizwe will not agree to this nonsense...EFF won't allow that ..DA surely no black South Africans will allow this
Was this about Cape Independence or Helen telling us how wonderful Helen is.
Cape independence now,
lets go back to our history an foundation of segregation and racism, Cape independence is the only way we can achieve this.
Kosovo did it a decade ago, there is a possibility for secession. They paved the way for how to gain international recognition.
They were are one ethic group with support from Albania western cape to diverse
@@jacqueslorenz977 shared ethnicity is not a requirement to be defined as a 'peoples' under international law, the collective will to do so, accepting that some within the group may not, is what is required (see so called 'Kirby description' - UNESCO)
We’ll see Helen’s tune change when the next ANC proposal in parliament is gerrymandering the EC into the WC. Think it won’t happen? That’s what the said about EWC afew years ago
Let the western cape people decide
South Africa
Last week's nationwide looting and rioting only pushed more in the Western Cape to secede from failing South Africa
I'm from Joburg. Will I need a new passport to visit Cape Town ? 😂
Well she said that it wont happen so no you won't
No, but you'll likely need a visa
A visa? 😁
@@tyroneaskew5594 Anyone who is currently a legal citizen of South Africa and who permanently and legally resides within the borders of the new country will automatically qualify for citizenship should they wish to adopt it. Regardless of their race, religion, or culture.
Anyone else wishing to settle in or visit the Cape of Good Hope will be welcome to apply for either residency, citizenship or a visa. These applications will be assessed by the democratically elected government of the Cape of Good Hope under an immigration and tourism policy consistent with established international norms.
@@tyroneaskew5594 lol, no need to worry. Cape Independence is just a meme. It's not happening. Not this year, not ever.
The DA is supposed to stand for federalism, but they've never even formally asked for federalism. They asked (unsuccessfully) for some powers to be devolved, yes but not for federalism which they supposedly stand for. They know there is no change for the NC to concede to that, so independence is then the only remaining form of self-determination that remains. Now, in 2024, the Referendum Party creates a space for DA voters to vote for independence, since the DA made no such option available.
It’s only “unrealistic” because it doesn’t serve political machinations.
It is absolutely practical, implementable and worthy as a goal.
When a politician speaks against something you must know it is not in their interest & has little to do with the will of the people.
There's NEVER going to be a better time than NOW to stand together and hold hands ! We have our differences, but the Western Cape has the stance to do it !! LET THE PHOENIX RISE !!!
The answer is to get political heads in the WC together and start with a plan of action. Ex Unitate Vires will be the sollution ! This secession CANNOT be postponed !
Go to Europe if you want independence
@@NEMB213 i don't think your mind operates naturally. I can guess why not !
@@proveritate9312 It actually does. You can't be decedent's of colonialists and want to secession in a country that was colonized by your ancestors. Y'all are trying to take us back to that BS and we are not having that. If you want independence you better be willing to pay with your lives for it. This African soil the land of Africans and we will spill blood for it.
@@proveritate9312 Uyanya wena msunu. Western Cape is African soil and it's for Africans always has been before your ancestors colonized western cape inn1652 I know my history quite well. You should go back to Europe instead of being out here spewing all that garbage. You'll have a civil war trust me it won't be nice when we kill the boer. Killing the boer will not only be a song but it will be a reality.
I believe you are looking at yourself in the mirror 😅
Why not secede to Europe? The arrogance of colonizers
Let's just remember that no country in the world or entity like the United Nations can force a president of any country to act on anything, even if the majority of western cape citizens voted for cape independence, the president of South Africa can still just ignore the proposal for independence, the proposal for independence of cape is different from south west Africa that became Namibia in that there were crimes against humanity that were committed by apartheid government that's when the United Nation coerced South Africa to let go of South West Africa , today South Africa has a different political atmosphere,the president is not forced to sign on anything,life is too short to look at if a person will do what you want to see when they can just choose not to do it.
Free the Cape!
Lol free frm cape Malaysia and boers
Make it happen so that we can live a normal life again..free from corruption crime and BEE
Naturally she would not support Cape Independence. That would not serve her, nor her lifestyle. The DA is not doing that great in the Cape. Better than other parties but not Great.
Its a pity but its true. You cannot have Cape independence peacefully without the government's consent. That you will NEVER get! So, the only alternative is UDI. Rhodesia tried that and we all know how that ended. Israel did it in 1948 and within 24 hours 5 Arab nations declared war on Israel. They had one tank and a trained civilian guard. The Cape doesn't even have that. We have Naval bases, Air Force bases and military bases of the SANDF within the borders of the Cape. There is NO way that you can win a UDI war!
Well said Helen our Master Politician
The secessionist movements are liberation movements. Previous liberation movements created a precedent that armed struggle is justified against a racist and oppressive regime. However, I don't think armed conflict is necessary because South Africa is already a failed state. Failed states do tend to fracture...
Armed struggle is not neccesary but it is certain if the cape tries to secede, look all over africa for examples, the question is are you or your family willing to fight for the western cape
Africans will never let this happen 🤣 a white man will never rule an inch of this continent ever again 🤣
@@sam3407 why would it have annything to do with race?
@@arendvandermerwe3309 it’s the modus operandi of your people in Africa so you tell me…
@@sam3407 i don't think my people (South Africans) related everything back to race. But i have found a select few, such as yourself, who think this way.
How strange that AI NEVER heard YOU calling for a REDISTRIBUTION of THE WEALTH of the country!!!
Anc is harlem globetrotters while DA is washington Generals.
Zille you are forgetting that in 1992 when the Cordessa negotiatings were taking place SA was very close to a civil war and the CIP Capexit along with many other political parties were able to get into the constitution chapter 14 section 2.3.5 that any province could breakaway by way of a referendum that must be called out by the premier of the province which you could have done when you were in power and now is also not been called out by Winde. """VERY UNDEMOCRATIC"""so your party is no longer democratic. Further the ANC has signed off on the SA constitution and also the AU constitution that also states any country or province in Africa if they call out a referendum could become independent just like South Sudan, further the ANC has signed the UN Charter where it also allows for a country province to get independence if a referendum is called out. So there will not be any civil war if the western cape should get its independece via a legal referendum. ""STOP WITH YOUR BANG MAAK STORIES"""and call out our long overdue cape independence referendum.
She's a neighsayer. People need to break free and stop being held hostage. Don't let naysayers stop the progress, its just a matter of time. Its not the National government's choice but rather the people of the cape.
Which progress are you taking about..
Hellen don't start problems for your people they will cry for you.
No Helen YOU need to understand that your time has come and gone........
If the indented party picks up 5 to 10 ponts and the D.A. is below 50% they could come together a d form a collaborative union...
These people should never be allowed to have majority rule😂😂😂 they are honestly crazy
I am sick of south african politics,i like DA but are turning my back on them because they dot want to support secession,i have huge respect for Helen butI disagree
Unfortunately Helen one thing you don't have is time..even if the DA win the elections next year, do you really believe the ANC are going to accept it..
Never you going to have major unrest.
So independence of the Cape I think is a good thing, no matter what...we can't carry on.
Can somebody tell me about France history in South Africa or was that only a dream I had
South Africa will not be divided.
Sounds like the Berlin wall again. We all want a future for our kids and we live in other parts of South Africa voting for the DA hoping that one day things will change. Now why does my votes seem worthless. Its easy to run away, easy to say its not my problem. But we vote for you because you are willing to go toe to toe with the ANC. Fighting for all of South Africa this sounds like someone who just wants to give up. We are a young country about 27 years old as a Democracy. By splitting don't you think we will go backwards, that everything will be in vain. Running away from the fight means you are leaving the foot soldiers behind. This is why people are so afraid to keeping voting for the DA.
Zillz do ypu realy think this is impossible for my God .please leave the cape alone and stays with whst you believe .people are dying of hunger pensioners are sleeping outside where are you when people suffer .
It's also unrealistic to see South Africa move forward with how much corruption is going on.
Well, sorry to say, but to even consider an Independent Cape, better control
should be applied with all the busses and busses full of people going down
from Gauteng, and I don't mean from exclusive places like Dainfern and Sandton,
from rural areas. Strange conversation I had with a Zimbabwean lady the other day,
informing me all three her children live and WORK in CT? So yes, there is that factor too?
How do they get work even, while me whose lived here my whole life and grandparents and their grandparents have lived here their whole life?
How do they get work even, while me whose lived here my whole life and grandparents and their grandparents have lived here their whole life?
I don't want to agree with her views but yes realistically cape independence is only possible through war and 2.) Cape independence party is very inactive on UA-cam and etc. They are very loud om voting day it seems and they creeps back into their shells afterwards. Voting DA 🗳 supports the over all dream of a fair SA
The United States of America was the first country to become independent from England . World,s greatest super power, So the Western Cape can become the greatest economic hub of Africa and the rest can learn from it
Black people of South Africa will never agree to this....
You mean Khoisan, Xhosas, Khois, Coloureds, Griqua
Not only Black people, many Coloured people will also not agree to this.
The DA and their constant message of fear. The Rep. of South Africa is a British colonial construct to begin with. Before they invaded there were numerous independent states which operated successfully and peacefully. Three of those states were Griekwa States. The DA seems imbedded with the ANC while protracting an illusion of been an opposition party. The South African Republic does not have a government in service of the citizens of South Africa hence we are already in a low key civil war. The public verses the "civil service" which was put together and designed at a conference called CODESA (Code for South Africa) to which very few if any citizens of South Africa were invited to begin with. You and I were not invited, instead huge international corporations, foreign dignitaries, politicians, monolithic church organizations, the UN, the EU, foreign ambassadors and a whole host of non-South Africans were invited but not you the South African citizens. Citizens are still not invited at all in any way shape or form. We are living an illusion of Democracy while every part of government is been continuously centralized and with each step the individual gets less say in anything. That is why the lines are growing for government hands outs, and the DA and all who pretend to serve the people of South Africa in Parliament are responsible for the present state of affairs. Period.
For a seasoned politician to fob off the rising sentiment of a growing section of population calling for smaller independent states (it is not all about Cape Independence) and then to claim that such a thing can not be done without civil war is a clear example of the lack of responsibility present within our parliamentary structure and the people who claim to serve the citizens of South Africa. If a majority of citizens called for independence via secession then there is no need for a kinetic civil war, when a clear number of people voted for a new path, and in the process made the present government structure illegitimate then it is the duty of parliament to peacefully reflect the will of the people and either get out of the way or facilitate a peaceful process and allow Provinces a return to Statehood. The Union of South Africa was a forced situation to begin with, the experiment is failing and the Republic now serves a ruling elite that are totally invested in keeping the status quo.
Smaller states with smaller decentralized governments, make for easier accountability and doable democracies.
What justifies these demands for I dependence? What rights are minorities denied I SA? They enjoy high standards of living and high employment. What rights are they denied?
The right to discriminate
Negative! HZ says, "And also, how are you going to defend a border that extends from A to B?" I.e., if DA won SA votes, how are you going to defend her borders??!!! You've just told us you're incompetent; that you believe you've lost before you've even tried! Yes, it's a weighty issue, with lots to think about, but that's a pathetic argument against independence!
Only God Knows 😊
What is fascinating is that is the DA's (& academia's) inability to reason outside a box of our own creation.
Who secedes by going to parliament and asking for permission? Is that how apartheid ended?
Civil War is the opposite extreme and no sane person wants that either.
Between the two is a vast political arena, where domestic political pressure, and international politics and law, offer endless possibilities to deliver a peaceful, legal, negotiated political settlement.
(Then please spare us the border argument - its not like SA doesn't have a rather large one already)
@@karenlang4776 I don't think ANC supporters are the decision makers here. In terms of how secession actually occurs there are two critical constituencies, WC voters and the international community.
What I'd like to ask you though is, as the people of the WC do we not even ask for what we want, even though it is a fundamental human and political right (to which SA is a signatory) because if we peacefully claim our right, some other group of people might misbehave?
Is that how you want to live? The values you want to teach your children?
@@karenlang4776 I've not questioned your right to hold whatever view you want, I support it.
I'm just not in favour of giving up on what I want, without even trying, because somebody else might try to bully me if I don't.
The ANC accounts for 28.6% of WC voters.
@@karenlang4776 I'm genuinely more positive and think large scale violence unlikely.
SAns have been remarkably peaceful (in relative terms) in the past. I also think the WC demographic mix makes dominance by any one race difficult.
It certainly wouldn't be easy to silence a WC who had voted for independence and now wanted to peacefully negotiate a settlement, and in truth I don't believe ANC will go that route.
You have to fight for what you love.
Cape Independence?? Hay inene 🤣🤣
Sorry to say but maybe icivil war is what this country needs. Honestly would it be worse than things already are?
Western cape land , is belonging to who?? If traditional is belonging to Xhosa people, trust me we will never giveup that land.
Gogo Zille is scared of becoming irrelevant.
Helen the fight is lost for not having a welfare state. time to move on . the only option is independence. we don't want to fix this in another 27 to 50 years, it needs to be fixed now. if not then we are guaranteed a total failed state of SA. insanity is expecting a different result by trying the same thing over and over
TALK ABOUT GIVING THE LAND BACK TO THE SAN KHOI PEOPLE WHO ARE THE ORIGINAL PEOPLE OF THE LAND!
Baie van hierdie swart mense se verstande sit in hulle gatte hoeveel keer word daar gese en bewys dat dit nie hulle voken land is nie
Me Zille, we have not had democracy in SA from the beginning until now. Previously whe had white minority rule. What we have today is black majority rule - which is also not democratic. Let me explain majority rule: all females, white, black, Indian, coloured and KoiSan are the majority in SA - in term of statistics there are 7 women in SA to 1 male. Stop fighting for the wrong things. Do you want true democracy? Or shall I have the guts to collect all females - previous disadvantaged - to march up to the Constitutional Court, with an application in 1 hand and the bill of rights in the other hands? Then we can call it majority rule.
To try and get a successful economy!!!!! After cessation you will see exactly that!!!, which you will be dreaming about for the rest of your life under the anc.
Helen Zille is smarter than I thought, 💀😭Lol.
you mean power hungry
I'm so done with the colonialists South Africa Project. I'm voting and supporting a Party that has Cape Independence front & center on their manifest.
Helen! Please back to lead the DA 🙏
Western cape will never become independent to diverse on all grounds race religion rich poor etc in order to get independence one must have a common denominator which wc does not have
Zille sjek!
Ag ou Helen gaan slaap nou rustig op jou bed en los die probleme vir jonger mense dalk moet jy uit tree van die DA af
I think it will be good but not possible. It might only be a dream.
We know that the kingdom of a white man is depending on mermaids water spirits. Now their power has exhausted now they want to reactivate it in secret. Not in tbe name of Jesus it was defeated long time ago. Thank you Lord Jesus Christ.
You do realize that Christianity was brought here by white people?
Helen! All we is "we" what "we are you talking about? Try somewhere else!
Hellen Zuma
why do you have your books in the background ordered by color? seem pretty absurd.......
Even though this sounds logical, in theory it will only further segregate us as a country and community. Secession has remnants of apartheid and even though i understand peoples concern of wanting to secede out of safety for their lives, as minoroties we should understand that we atleast live in a country with freedom of religion, with freedom of speech, with equal rights. Even if times get hard we have to stick together as one unit and do away with any policy that is just an echo of what the Group Areas Act was. Having gone through what we have several weeks ago, my hope is that the ANC atleast gets competent people on board who can adress the socio-economic issues the black community are faced with and that the ANC stop misappropriating funds that could help our people. Secession is not an answer because what we as minorities are trying to do is co-exist, not seperate ourselves from society and fuel another uprising.
Hellen you and your followers are going astray if you know what is good for you stop thinking nonsense if you and your people do you want indipendency go and ask Europe to give you land this land you want to claim is for the people of south Africa without thinking of skin color.
Ag nee Hellen man..
You want federalism when Africa want to unite and form one united Africa. What are you going to do with Africans in western cape
A united Africa could still be federal. The United States is federal.
@@chesterdonnelly1212 I don’t think it will be a success, your numbers are dwindling by the day because you make less babies. America and Europe are not in a good shape and the exclusive economy that you created is on a downward spiral
@@lindambasa4963 that really doesn't have anything to do with federalism. Many larger countries are federal, because it is difficult to effectively government a large country centrally. I can't really have an opinion on America or Europe as I don't live there. African countries are almost all made up of several ethnic groups. As long as minorities rights and safety is respected and protected, that diversity is a strength not a weakness, because it reduces conflict. Federalism is good because it prevents central government from having too much power to commit massive corruption.
@@lindambasa4963 so what are the too extreme options? 1. Africa breaks up into tribal nations. There would be constant war and hardly any economic growth. This would be a disaster. 2. A united unitary Africa. This would be a dictatorship with massive corruption, with so little government control that would organise themselves, probably along tribal lines, so it would be similar to option 1. Federalism or the status quo would both be much better than these 2 options.
Option 3. Regional unions. Look at the East African Community. Each country retains its own national identity and self governance, but the intergovernmental organisation work together on things such as a single currency, passport, and other institutions that can benefit the whole region. This may lead to full federalism with, for example, a single armed forces, a single foreign policy, a supreme court etc.
Helen dont alow them, they want to destroy da
Zille is wrong and does not understand the legal basis pursued.... it directly threatens her parties base SO vested interest in disagreement...
How will the western cape make money?
The W/C has lots of money if we are independent.
TAX.
@@karenlang4776 how does it make money? 40% of SA's economy is in Gauteng?
@@karenlang4776 heres the more accurate breakdown :
Gauteng: 34.82%
KwaZulu-Natal: 16.05%
Western Cape: 13.86%
Eastern Cape: 7.53%
Mpumalanga: 7.25%
Limpopo: 7.20%
North West: 5.91%
Free State: 5.20%
Northern Cape: 2.20%
@@krokodilpil8335 This has to be measured against the population!
WC produces 13.9% of SA GDP, houses 11.2% of SA population, and gets 10.1% of funds allocated to provinces from national govt.
SA only has 2 net income producing provinces, WC & GP
WC would be better off alone and that includes financially
Spot on
Agreed
Hellen Zuma