Jordan Peterson - "Masculinity is not toxic" - part 2 of interview
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- Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
- The second part of Rebel Wisdom's exclusive interview with psychologist and professor Jordan Peterson - where he talks about the challenges for men and masculinity, and links it to the Jungian concept of archetypes.
See the Rebel Wisdom's full length documentary on Jordan Peterson here: • Jordan Peterson: Truth...
And more content on our website: rebelwisdom.co.uk/
Jordan Peterson is my Internet dad
you know how hard i laughed when reading this. its true that he embodies what we all want in a father figure. how when you listen to him speak you start to look up to him have respect for what he's said and try your best to incorporate it to the best of your ability, like you would with your own father. ( hence the ROFAL )
InterPapa
Does that make his Patreon account your trust fund?
Add to that the subconscious effect of Mr. Rogers sweater and your dad he becomes...
Closer inspection of your Dad's speech reveals a disturbing lack of sense to the trained ear. His Maps of Meaning is defective as a work of anthropology, psychology, philosophy, and politics. Its emphasis on religious myth and heroic individuals provides a poor blueprint for understanding the origins of totalitarianism, and an even poorer guide to overcoming its evils. His 12 Steps you can find at any Tony Robbins seminar.
He's impressive but only if you ignore how often he's wrong.
I'm a woman and I love the inspiration you provide for our men.
The world needs more women like you.
Rhona Mocke I absolutely agree!
I believe J.P essentially provides inspiration for women as well but unfortunately not all of the women are ready to objectively digest Dr. Peterson's explanations to understand them correctly..
That's refreshing to hear something like that from a woman. An obviously good woamn.
That gives this old man hope for the future. Merry Christmas.
"The archetypes are manifestations of the universal grammar of the emotion and motivation." Holy crap. If your'e unfamiliar with the concept of universal grammar I recommend looking it up to grasp how much sense this statement really makes. This guy is beyond brilliant!
Actually there is much more in common (between peoples across distances and time) with regards to the universal language of the psyche than you may think. Jung observed and documented this phenomenon
Not sure what you're trying to say exactly. Last comment on this: Peterson't use of "universal grammar" is a metaphor. It's a metaphor he uses to approximate a description of the archetypal universal language of the psyche, not a literal "universal grammar" of human linguistics.
@Herbal Shaman Ok, this is really my last comment. The origins of the archetypal language of the collective unconscious predates human language. It is not "informed by language." It is formed by universal human (and apparently even pre-human) common experience. It is not communication between humans. It is a symbolic language which facilitates communication between the conscious and unconscious psyche. If you cannot understand this, you haven't studied Jung in depth.
I was thinking you were simply doing some sort of trolling, but perhaps not. Why would you assume that two people need to be able to communicate about, and understand the meaning of an archetype? They exist a priori of human ability to understand. Don't lose sight of what symbol really is--an image of something not completely understandable. A symbol is not a sign. Symbol stands for something not completely known.
@@jasonhathhorn3655 Well said.
Can someone please make this man's writing mandatory reading in our schools... I would have been very grateful to have heard his thoughts earlier in life.
School teaches you nothing and it is gonna forever be that way, learn and teach your loved ones to find systems of knowledge and guidance outside of it
I'd be delighted if they came up at my son's school.
Many modern school systems (at least in the US) would vehemently deny Dr. Peterson's work because many educational institutions have morphed into indoctrination camps.
Proper non-ideological education and wisdom instillation are the fundamental tenets taught in non-hyper corrupt schools in order to create a responsible and productive society .
@@Gaonaism Agreed.
“Most people are afraid to be bad, but the fact that they are afraid doesn’t mean they are being good”- wow, profound!
ua-cam.com/video/1oVyQGmD3d8/v-deo.html&ab_channel=RebelWisdom
ua-cam.com/video/CH0-K-0cauI/v-deo.html
it should be: some people are smart enough not to be bad, they can figure out the difference. They don't need Peterson's bullshit. Wow, profound!.
@@palmereldritch7777 o
Cheap insult
@@nishanthk5306 Cheap, effective and truer than that archaic judeo christian ideology. Clean up your room? Yeah that means - get the cobwebs and dust off your brain and start using it.
I like the masculine spirit. Your challenge is to act well , create order, create beauty, speak truth, have integrity.
My entire formal education was tainted by a feminist-postmodern-Marxist doctrine. As was my long-term relationship. It has undermined everything I've worked for and, though I understood in a deep level that the ideology was oversimplifying the world, I was brain washed by it.
I have only just begun to realise how detrimental this has been to my psychological health, identity and life in general.
I'm now 40, separated, unhappy in my career and drinking all the time.
I'm also very angry about this.
Tony Smart Dude ! I'm 48 and been through alot! The most damaging was alcohol! I have been sober for 2 years now have not looked back since! If I can then anyone can shove that "demon " back in it's hole for good! Keep listening to JBP man he his helping me and you and 100's of thousands of people "sort themselves out"!! Cheers
Cary s. Thanks for your kind words man.
One question: How'd you deal with cravings and stressful times when the booze talks so calmly and reasonably?
Tony Smart
To be quite honest with you,I quit because I really WANTED to quit . (I was an alcoholic since I was 16 among many many other addictions) It is a completely different feeling then all the other times when I thought I did but really didn't! So there wasn't to much of the craving aspect of it. Although I would highly recommend kratom . It is and plant in the coffee family,it is an amazing plant and the government is try to Bann it because it is awesome! It really helped me through withdrawal from pain pills!
I don't know you at all but if you're interested in JBP, I know what he has done for me so I know how powerful the emotions run when you are "sorting yourself out" .!! Feel free to message me thru Google plus or my you tube profile. I really don't know how much of this technology shit works so yeah! Check out LUX BOTANICA on Facebook they are trustworthy and very nice people! ( For the kratom) if you are in continental us. I am about to start reading JBP's book ! 1st book ever I was really excited to get! Cheers mate!
Microdosing psilocybin really helped me with alcohol cravings. Look into it!
Tony Smart good for you to express and be aware, now let the suffering become a totally transformed future for you.
“Every problem contains within the seed for a equivalent solution”
Napoleon Hill
Think & Grow Rich
How to sell your way thru life.
I hope I’m selling you on two things: 1- your total right, 2- your still capable of profound victory.
Jordan is gonna go down as one of the smartest people that ever lived, and that without the need to take any kind of IQ test whatsoever. His way of thinking goes beyond logic puzzle solving in a sense. Hopefully, he can be awarded the Nobel Peace Price because I think he is changing more than anyone is aware of.
I agree. I've honestly never heard anyone like him. He's like a fountain of wisdom and clarity.
personally I think you are overrating him though I am not in any way denouncing him as a highly competent researcher however it is the rejuvenation biotechnologists engineers and AGI researchers who will usher in a new era of nanotechnology biotechnology and advanced superintelligence that will truly transform humanity culture and civilization as we know it
And he can be humble by saying that he doesn't know. I love that about him
no freedom seeker (ironic name considering your comment) your biotech, nanotech is all a set of tools that are in the process of being set up to enslave humanity, not free it. nothing is more powerful than consciousness, because consciousness is the underpinning of all matter, forces, energy, in the universes. AI is an attempt to prevent humanity from finding true intelligence, and to make humans obsolete. we are essentially gods and do not realize it.
Even Max Planck said "I regard consciousness as fundamental. Anything we talk about, anything we regard as existing, postulates consciousness"
Transhumanism is slavery and genocide on a global scale. do some research. they are tricking people into thinking that our problems are solved with technology and AI. true human potential is actually limitless but we have been so brainwashed and lied to we dont even realize a fraction of our true potential. in fact it has been scientifically shown that the human mind can change matter itself from any distance. ... no AI or ANY technology would come close to a human at its natural full potential.
Jeff i like Peterson too but his info actually is not new. just restating aspects of ageless wisdom. take rudolph steiner from the last century, for example... look him up. among many others...
So, what you're saying is...
JPB lives what he says. That what makes him so powerful. Thank you for the interview.
You can go to hell by taking on the "responsibilities" that society expects of you. If we could have the sort of society where everyone can have a rewarding career like Dr Peterson that allows them to live comfortably then it would be more inspiring to see him live out what he says. If a lottery winner recommends winning the lottery as a cure for people's problems they are living what they say but it is still awful advice.
That's true, in principle, but Peterson earned his fame through years of painful and asiduos hard work. He subjected himself to the horrors of humanity buy studying the great atrocities of the 20th century, understood them, was changed by them and by the -universal- human nature that enabled them and had the humility to "come back" and try to explain it to us as well. What he is is neither a product of happy circumstances nor of sheer luck.
Go watch (if you haven't done so already) any of his channel's lecture series and you will see that instead of him telling you anything which was beforehand memorized, you get to see his mental process unfold as he tries to piece-the-puzzle almost in real time. The subjects? Agonizingly complicated. It is this which hypnotises the looker. I don't recall seeing any other example of such authentic display of deep thoughts having exposed with such clarity so that so many people could understand and resonate with him.
I see Peterson as a gymnast acting at the edge of human possibilities. It is this edge that we so loudly applaud.
Do you mean JBP? Jordan B. Peterson?
Indeed I do :)
@ Maybe you need to stop huffing those archetypes.
If toxic masculinity exists, then there is also toxic femininity. Equality right?
Very definitely. "Mean Girls" isn't a meme created by Hollywood, it was art reflecting life. Obviously the majority of girls and women are not toxic, but the ones that are should be called out.
@@jamienelson3470 id argue that neither masculinity or femininity are toxic... They are biological constructs. But human behavior in general can be very toxic, as it is socially influenced. So home values and education are the solution to social problems, not screaming at strangers bc feelings, wanting more safe spaces, and non earned profit. As if bad ppl would stop doing harm bc youre crying about it.
@@hugomolinaOG Very well said. I agree.
they both do exist but that's when men and women get pissed off and act like d-bags but they try to say that all masculinity is the same but we all know that's bull shit, and men are listening because we normally like to be logical and love structure and that's pretty much what he stands for.
@@revanwallace tell us how you really feel about women 🤣🤣
(Jking.) All tho I don't completely agree with your statement. I get it bro...
Most of the things that come out of Jordan's mouth can be turned into quotes. The density of wisdom per minute is incredible.
Hello Jesus, Hello Satan
Google meaningwave, there's actually a guy who makes music with his quotes mixed into it...
So true! My favourite from this film is:
You have to have a conscious relationship with the archetypes. If you don’t then you’re susceptible to possession or despair.
Absolute gold!
@@philippemadec Wow that's something i already picked up from the comic books i read as a kid. I must be so smart.
ＭＡＳＣＵＬＩＮＩＴＹ 👏 ＩＳ 👏 ＮＯＴ 👏 ＴＯＸＩＣ 👏
Akira The Don Love your music man
Ayyyy bless up Samuel
Nobody is claiming it is.
Akira The Don fancy seeing you here!
spencer hughes why would that be surprising?!
At 28 minutes Jordan nailed the reason why men are listening to him. He is probably the only man that they respect for his ability to provide a truthful example of how to be a man.
Tony Smart spot on! Love the cool ass "winning" lobster! Lol!!
Patriotic Realist. Indeed! Not sure about the sandals tho
Women are listening to him as well I am a granny learning from him I respect his wisdom I was never taught all these things by my dad and he wasn't taught by his dad I have a son who seems to be a bit like Jordan but that's not because of me I think my son turned out like that he took responsibility on himself to look after two sisters and me when his dad and I divorced he was ten
Very well put I agree with you 100%
Jocko Willink is great as well, his books are more concerned with leadership, but his kids books are a lot of Jordan Peterson’s message distilled and digestible for kids. Jordan has done a couple of podcasts with him. Jocko’s Discipline equals freedom fits well nested within Jordan’s message of responsibility and meaning.
The common acceptance of masculinity being toxic is (what I see) one of the prime reasons why so many guys, urban hipsters most notably, have brought beards back to such high popularity. It's the last bastion of masculinity they are able to display and still be considered "socially acceptable". I see them every day downtown. Tight hip-hugger jeans, swinging hips and just emoting "I've been feminised" but they still have the beard and it is the ONLY part of them that fits the classical model of a "man".
And going back to Gillette. They're targeting this demographic who have stopped using razors........
There's nothing new under the sun. In Victorian England there was a crisis of masculinity which led to men growing beards for the same reason. This was also linked into fears about growing industrialisation.
It would be helpful to hear more historically and get more context; such perspectives get lost in a miasma of knee jerk reactions though.
That, or they are just too lazy to shave. :P
What annoys the fuck out of me is all thr people who willfully misunderstand the term toxic masculinity just to be contrary.
I grew a beard because I didn't like the way I looked without one. I also have long hair and look more like a classical hippy (without the tye-dye) than a hipster. The beard I wear isn't even a style, someone said grow it out and I thought "huh, never did that yet," so I did.
@@blah914 Care to explain what you mean? What's your definition of toxic masculinity?
This is one of Peterson's best interviews. Thanks for posting!
I've made that same statement- for a variety of his other interviews. His ability to articulate complex structures is spectacular.
I’m so glad us woman have men... I love men. 😁 So glad there are men to make sure other men know how great they are.
binloved That actually really means a lot to most of us because we never hear anything like that in school, on the news, in the workplace, or throughout society. Thank you and I wish you all the best and happiness❤️
We should start a I love boys/ I love men campaign. ♥️
Thank for this, I really appreciate your words, been through a lot of stuff in the last 3 years and this has helped a lot
"What you don't know is more important than what you do know" Truth bomb
Jordan Peterson's critics are lazy thinkers who haven't read his work.
Tom Mcfadden They haven’t read his work and many others which he references. His critics are mostly indoctrinated fools.
Jordan Peterson literally saved my life.
Wyo AnCap how?
Showed me the beginning of the light that helped lead me out of darkness.
Wyo AnCap Congratulations man I’m happy for you truly. I’m still trying to get there myself. God bless you.
I still struggle with some things myself but every day is a new opportunity! Thanks and I hope your journeys leave you well.
Wyo AnCap All the best brother!
"The default position is aimless, impulsive, pleasure seeking, and inertia, because all you have to do to do that is do nothing, and that's easy, so then the immediate question is "why not just do that?" ; One of the answers is that you and the world will go to hell and very rapidly, and that's a pretty good answer, and it's actually True. Now what that means in an eternal sense is not an easy thing to say, but the proximal sense is true enough, so even inaction is not morally acceptable in the face of the unkept, unfinished state of being, I guess that's a reasonable way of thinking about it."
unkempt*
I had to write a paper about so-called "Toxic-Masculinity" for a grade in my College Writing II course. The implications of the positive-viewpoint is so jarring that I actually had to argue (for a grade mind you) in favor of widespread psychotic experience, i.e. psycho(socio)pathy, and tied it to known genetic markers which are linked to research into sex chromosomes.
All an elaborate ruse, all so I could argue against this ridiculously shallow concept while maintaining the illusion that I agreed that "it is bad" that this concept exists (without ever admitting to this verbatim) -- just so I wouldn't be marked off for disagreeing with the meta-ethical ideaologies currently present in core university curriculum.
I know of people who got failure grades just for bluntly arguing the latter (less biased) viewpoint. College is sunk at this point.
how depressing
Where did you go to school? Country, state (if USA), town, university
No such thing as toxic masculinity only toxic behaviour.
Masculinity is awesome and the reason we are still walking around on this planet.
Why do we feel the need to kill masculinity? who's gonna build your house, work on the powerlines, do the logging, go crab fishing, be a steelworker etc??'.
We should appreciate masculinity not bash it.
Different is not "less valuable" if a variety of skills and interests are needed. For most women nothing is more attractive than a positively constructive well-groomed healthy, manly and good man.
@@DNA350ppm true
Amen.
oh the women in pink hats all think they should be doing it instead...can you imagine Nancy logging? it's funny to even imagine it.
There's another interview where he talks about this and he's very emotional. I don't enjoy seeing him upset but to me, when he speaks off the cuff and shows how strongly he feels about something, I think anyone who's ever doubted him would take notice and listen.
I haven’t gotten to that point where my life it has taken almost a 180 ,but man have I ever improved. I feel so much better after hearing his lectures as well as many other academics. Peterson has given me the most to think about though. I was acting out complete nihilistic world view. I truly believed there was no meaning to life. I struggled everyday to find it or create my own meaning. The only reason I didn’t off myself was because I hate losing and I couldn’t let life win before I found a way to beat it that I was satisfied with. And I truly mean that. Now it’s a bit different. The case for meaning as an instinct has given me my ability to take on burdens once again. I have not completely been swayed by everything Peterson says but I am swayed by how genuine he is. Good luck to all my fellow humans. You’ll need a bit in this world.
"There will be no loyalty, except loyalty towards the Party. There will be no love, except the love of Big Brother. There will be no laughter, except the laugh of triumph over a defeated enemy. There will be no art, no literature, no science. When we are omnipotent there will be no need of science. There will be no distinction between beauty and ugliness. There will be no curiosity, no enjoyment of the process of life. All competing pleasures will be destroyed. But always - do not forget this Winston - always there will be the intoxication of power, constantly increasing and constantly growing subtler. Always, at every moment, there will be the thrill of victory, the sensation of trampling on an enemy who is helpless. If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face-forever."
George Orwell's "1984."
Right! Such are totalitarian states, in East and West and South. Be cautious!
How on earth does that have anything to do with the topic at hand.
For what it's worth I miss our men. I'm grateful there is a place like this channel that embraces the inate qualities that men possess. As a straight female I'm hoping for a renaissance that allows we humans to embrace each other and our individual gifts just for the sheer purpose of building a society based on Mutual Love and Respect of Each Other...vs the obvious Divide and Conquer propaganda being inserted into the masses...
Yeeesssss 👏🏽 🙏🏽
We need the masculine spirit! In the ancient Chinese ideal, man has to stand in between heaven and earth. God save the masculine spirit.
I am a therapist and I listen to him because talks common sense in so many areas. Men are human beings and have a lot of burdens on them, different than women but they don't share as much as women do. I think Peterson gives them "permission" to be themselves and it is a great relief. I'm female, by the way. : )
Thanks for the video! So I was listening to National Public Radio, in Oregon, following the tragic school shooting in Florida & they were discussing masculinity. One of their panelists said "masculinity is inherently toxic.... empathy & masculinity don't mix" (I'm paraphrasing) and they'd edited it, so they just left that smelly fart of a comment hanging in the air with no rebuke, they didn't blink an eye at this. I was incredibly insulted, but what can you do if that's acceptable? All I could think to do was not listen to NPR anymore.
I mean what if I said femininity is toxic? I don't believe it inherently is & that's a totally unacceptable view to espouse. But that it isn't recognised to be an unacceptable view, by people willing to say that about men, is absolutely disgusting.
Glad I didn’t buy into the social media smearing. I hope more women see past the spin &open up to his ideas.
I am a young man (18 years old) and I have been struggling with my own masculinity for quite a while. I can't help feeling like there is something dirty about my masculinity and about my own sexuality. I think we live in a time where male sexuality is shown as this aggressive and toxic thing. Indeed a man can commit sexual violence towards woman, but I don't think that is innate and I don't think man should feel afraid of their own instincts. We have desires and there are correct ways of manifesting them. I catch myself so often repressing sexual thoughts because I feel it is wrong for me to have them. It is really hard to access my own sexual energy in a clean way. Any men out there feeling the same?
The Masculine archetypes aren't just about responsibility, but about the Word, the Light, thought. A feminine kind of nurturing is one that takes care of a child's material needs, coddles and sympathizes. A masculine kind of loving is instructional and insightful. That is the Logos coming into the world: ideas that guide our lives. Looked at another way, a feminine kind of suffering is that of pain and the desire for Love, a masculine kind of pain is grief over the very problem of being and the desire for meaning.
Hey, so, what the hell is the Logos? What should I read to understand the concept?
Jordan Peterson is the shaman of Western Civilization. (This Tenskwatawa needs his Tecumseh.)
I'm (attempting to be) complimentary, via an allegorical (dare I say, archetypal) comparison.
no
He distills the wisdom of the spiritual into a logical perspective giving food to the minds of all who listen 🙏🏼
WOW! Right on Kyle, and what a great way to put it....
"You HAVE to remember, all the time, that what you don't know is more important than what you know. You have to remember that, as if your life depends on it, because it DOES."
Brilliant man. I really enjoy his talks. He appears deeply sad + tired. Nothing shameful with that, though I'd love for him to heal his depression. I imagine it would make his work even more powerful and relatable.
“Masculinity is not given to you, but it’s something you gain. And, you gain it by winning small battles with honour.”
Jordon never compete with any man but his intellectuality and power is so precise that a single piece of him is vulnerable. Thus, I bow to his spirit.
Jordan is like a Chieftan, who brings all the stupid tribe people together around the camp fire and TALK COMMON SENSE. SIMPLE COMMON SENSE. And that's why men are drawn to his wisdom, because we adhere to mentors who logically dissects the nonsense others are brainwashed with.
So what he's saying is we should arrange our societies along the lines of the lobsters?
No, not at all. He is saying that the world is your lobster!
Roy The Mac I see it as more like the world is a giant zombie lobster that we should fight to the death and eventually lose gracefully for the greater good
I don't mind if you disagree with me - it's all water off a lobster's back to me.
*raises lobster claws, clickclickclickclick*
The status of these lobsters is too damn high!
It is weird how the yin/yang, god/goddess, male/female fundamental duality of the universe is scoffed at in the West unless it is framed in the context of Freud & Jung's work. We got so out of balance by stuffing down and away the goddess until, I guess, we hoped that she disappeared (except in, perhaps the case of the Virgin Mary). It is just the struggle to restore balance again.
Heidi Keller yes! I think it was Joseph Campbell who talked about how the Virgin Mary became the only sacred woman in western culture, and in so doing made that the only ideal female. That pushed all the other aspects of the feminine into the “bad” realm. There was nowhere else to go but that purity ideal. The mother. The martyr. The one at Christ’s feet.
Now, it seems that men are being pigeonholed into a similar ideal. The men do face the dangers, they still run into gunfire to protect others. They still run into burning buildings and defend their loved ones. But then we want them to behave like females.
He's right.. What I see time and time again is when men are denigrated and devalued, that there is a complete absence of laying down what instead a good ideal valued man is supposed to be (and which as JP says, men are very responsive to and have an instinct to try and fulfill such things).
So you might say well that can't be true just ask them (e.g. feminist) and they would at least be very enthusiastic about saying hey, just be the opposite of what they are complaining about. But no. It just ain't so.
1) Because men are complained about no matter what they do. e.g. for "x" (earning more than her) but also for the opposite of "x". (earning less than her).
2) Because they never praise men for not doing what they complain about.
3) Because if you do the opposite of what they complain about you also get nothing. And often if you do these things (e.g. asking permission to flirt, asking permission to try and build attraction, consent, consent, consent, every step of the way) they get disgusted and annoyed by you and really treat yo like crap.
So the most salient point that is a cause of "collapse of the society" scenario is putting men in a hopeless no-win situation. No matter what they do they are wrong now.
basically, double bind and other psychological attacks, at a collective level.
Yup. Sad, but true.
I find it odd that so many feminists admit to trying BDSM with their boyfriends. They are afraid of masculinity in the workplace and the classroom, but in the bedroom they indulge in a fetish that ritualizes the most assertive, dominant aspects of masculinity. It's the only way they can experience masculinity in a healthy way without betraying feminism. Sad.
Pretty much what my mother engrained in me from the day I was born. She used to tell me that if I turned out anything like my father I'd be abandoned. Of course I didn't know my father well, so whatever he was is what she didn't like. I rarely asked why she found him appealing to begin with. She said he was a good talker.
@@CountArtha One thing about BDSM that I've noticed with some of the submissive women I've talked to is that the entire dance is based around their pleasure. I've found that BDSM is at its core very gynocentric. It's all about creating that sense of helplessness while she controls the power to end it at any time. While they can enjoy giving, most of the submissives I've known revel in being the object of desire and receiving pain or pleasure based on their action/inaction. It's very solipsistic.
This dude is my anti-Tyler Durden. I am Jordan's smirking revenge...
Mr. Womb: Lord of Unmerciful Torment.
Durden is so appealing in his beautiful nihilism. He's also right in many dark ways.
I'm fighting him off every day
Indeed. Very well said.
Im 11 months late to this comment but well put!
The reason why young men aren't taking responsibility for a family is because women have lobbied the governments for generations to pass anti-male laws and men have had to learn the hard way how these laws can be used to ruin their lives. For example, no fault divorce, alimony, biased child custody laws, biased domestic violence laws, etc. The men who are the most likely to commit suicide are middle-aged divorced men. Young men like me have seen the older men in our lives destroyed by divorce are avoiding marriage and considering 50% marriages in divorce and 70% to 80% of divorce are filed by women it's the rational thing to do.
ps: don't give me that nonsense about finding the "right" woman - all the men who got married only to end up losing everything in divorce thought they were marrying the "right" woman. No sane man has ever thought "this woman looks like the type of woman to divorce me and take everything, let me marry her".
Viva patriarchy - my experience is that if I work on my own logos and so does my partner, then marriage works. Each individual has to do the work for themselves. Blaming others is a waste of time and energy. I know I have done it for years. You have to eat your on shit.. first.
I've witnessed the same thing, men who have been totally fucked over as a result of marriage. But I don't think that has to mean that men can't or shouldn't have a family. It just means that they shouldn't get married :) Marriage is a stupid archaic institution anyway.
I agree with you about the biased custody laws -- it's really hard to see a good man working his butt off to provide for a narcissistic woman who has just destroyed his family life, and to watch him losing influence over his children, sometimes just because he has to work too many hours, sometimes because of malicious undermining by his spouse. The percentage of divorces filed by women that you cite is accurate as far as I know. But you may be happy to find - I certainly was! - that the 50% divorce rate is a myth, and has no basis in statistics -- it's just become repeated so often in our culture that we assume it's true. It's dangerous, however, because it can become a self-fulfilling prophesy: people think, "Well, half of marriages end in divorce, so why try to get over this bump in our relationship? I'm divorcing him." If you want to read the actual statistics, statistician & social researcher Shaunti Feldhahn did a multi-year study on it, and she has a book "The Good News about marriage" about her findings -- although you can find out the gist of them without reading the book. If you type that title into UA-cam, there's at least one good interview I just found with her. She and her husband Jeff are pretty awesome; they wrote the books "For Men Only" and "For Women Only," which really helped me as a woman to understand men in a way I never had, and realise the way we women can emasculate and hurt men without meaning to. Some women are certainly malicious or sociopathic, but I have hope that some of those women filing for divorce are just stupid and misinformed, having been given bad advice by culture and friends, and that with enough people like JP or the Feldhahns giving them another view of the world, women like them will become a little wiser, and the divorce rate will decrease.
Ayisha S apparently on the emasculation part, people forget we have feelings, especially coming from the person we care about, we men were already conditioned to never mess with a females emotions this that always tell her how beautiful she is and appreciate her feelings, don’t hurt her, we know females are very emotional, so it gets a pass, which is all based on her ego, but for us, our ego is used and abused so much, now I’m hearing female criticize and dismiss our feelings and say fragile ego when we feel hurt, which is very hypocritical, yet society doesn’t even care, I think that is why the word emasculate was invented, knowing the fact that we have feelings that can be hurt but expect us not to feel a thing because were men
maybe I am old fashioned but to not marry, regardless of risk which you should mitigate by not picking a complete maniac to marry, is shirking a responsibility and there's another side to marriage which is the glue which makes you move past your differences and mature with the woman you married and properly picked. I've seen lots of dudes who are alone and pathetic in their 50s and 60s because they couldn't commit and the long game of marriage sustains while the hookup game is shallow and empty
What worries me is that the younger generation (of which I am apart of) appears to believe in PC stuff the most and in the decades to come they will fill more and more positions of power. I genuinely worry if that could bring us to something much worse than the current situation. Then again, maybe their kids will rebel against them?
I believe that it's the antecedent for the fall of the wst. When people get sick is all the PC discussion and narrative, they will turn their heads to see China and Russia in admiration.
He's so wise. Nvemind the frog he should be an owl
Or lobster?
DiscoDynamiteTNT except that the frog is more pertinent in his case : the frog lives both on land and in water...symbolically mediating between the two.
Owls are thought to be wise because they watch but stay silent.
There are many motifs of frogs throughout mythology : they are not silent, sometimes to the extent of calling predators.
And let's face it...his voice is quite a lot like kermits. 😁
A frog-owl-lobster
Owls are stupid.
Love jordan
He is great!!!! :)
Dr. Peterson is such a good man 😍😍
That was a great point
Why hasn’t someone discovered that by now?
"What you don't know is more important than what you do know!!!"
Enlightening and terrifying, eh?
Humility is remembering that what you don't know is more important than what you do know.
I’ve been pushed so brutally hard to the fringe that it’s a miracle i haven’t become a nihilist angry at the cruelty and lack of care. Being so heavily emasculated, devalued and slandered while i am relentlessly dedicated to the purpose in my life to help others- it’s shocking and disgusting. We have hatred and ideological abuse within the context of nihilism and egoic corruption. I’ve seen some deep horrors. We’re all in the same boat, and some people don’t want to actually see just how much they are not the hero, but the villain about to set the boat on fire. And those people rob good people from those in need who would accept and love the helpers. The ideologues are hurting all of us, themselves most of all.
Look at all of the positive comments and expressions of gratitude from men!
Talk of tyranny and sterile uniformity immediately makes me think of the EU.
Whut?
Life in Germany is probably the most free and cultured I have seen anywhere.
Dominik Forstner the EU is trying to project Franco-German attitudes on all others in the Union. The reason that southern states are financially ruined is because their economies aren’t structured like Germany but they were forced to adopt policy that was built for Germany.
I am not sure how many realize that most of what he is saying are fundamental Christian values. I like the idea that the way to improve society is not from top to bottom but from self, family, community etc... Great wisdom there.
Disconnection from Nature, the cycles of growing season, separation from extended family all add up to discontinuity. Individualism does not have to suffer to achieve a scope of time, I think it would be expanded with greater perspective.
“We know what happens when people act poorly “ says Jordan Petersen. Well, I just hope he learned the lesson.
Ironic you say that, because his addiction came from a prescribed medication for his health. How is that acting poorly?
He also stoped once he noticed the effect but the cold tuykey almost killed him.
@@adio8824 he's not, the previous commenter is either a troll or a deeply resentful person.
After watching several crappy bias interviewers interview Mr Peterson on other channels I am happy to find a quality interviewer that is more interested in the way a guest thinks rather than just ramming mindless nutty-left-accusation at him. Great talk.
So many people spend their time trying to make the comment sections as cancerous as possible.
Some people spread calmness, some people spread chaos, and some people read and gather knowledge. The knowledge gatherers need to pick a side with each of their actions when they leave the comment section.
There's always a mish mash, but I find Peterson comment sections a breath of fresh air w/ much nicer and fairer minded people than other channels I frequent.
I love you
I love you too.
This used to bother me but now I accept is as a reality principle. Disagreeable people exist and you need to deal with them and get stronger on the process.
"this mountain you are carrying, you were supposed to just climb."
Toxic maculinity is indeed a manipulative anathema definition. A general purpose adjective (toxic) is put together along with "masculinity" to contaminate that term with the negativeness carried by the adjective so that it becomes a new compound term which soaks the initially innocuous concept and substitutes it in the public realm.
This guy is starting to sway my thoughts about having another kid
In what direction?
He has opened my mind back up to a many of things I thought I had made my mind up on. And that's the point I think.
thereve the more the merrier kids are always a blessing
Not always. Nikolas Cruz was a blessing?
Everett Newell toward
Jordan Peterson is really an inspiration for me.
Vanity Plate Idea: "Jordan B Peterson is my co-pilot."
I am so sad. So vaulnerable. So small. In many ways weak. I did all I could to lift the man up; encouraged him to be all he could, showed him that I loved his masculinity, that it turned me on, that he was needed and useful and great for just who he was, and the focus was so much on his masculinity that when the motherhood came in all it’s power, he stole it from me aggressively because I had thought him to be all he could be. It was just that I didn’t love him anymore. He treated us horribly. So then I desided to make sure my foundation was so strong, I would be the best mother I could ever be, and now one could tear it down. Then I became a threat. The masculine thought I didn’t need him anymore - but I did! I only wanted to give all the love I could to everyone - but not in risk of someone tearing down a child that needed to be raised and lifted up into the world. I am man, and I am woman, now I have a man, and I have a woman. We can be both, I can be vaulnerable or strong, he can be vaulnerable and strong. I love, so does he, so will most. Men can be bad, women can be bad - humans can be bad. Our typical traits doesn’t include evil. But past has left women without choice. It is not a threat to masculinity that women have choices. We have not reached the perfect outcome, but I am so grateful I could pick myself up and raise in love, give strength to small humans who then will become adults. Now I live in a balanced relationship. I love masculinity, I love to be feminine. I wish men could trust, I wish women could trust. But women had not... when you know you are weaker psychically, you will always feel weaker, always be slightly afraid. Unfortunately, total freedom from that fear is not possible. At the same time, I love feeling weaker. I love to feel protected by my love. But the first one battered me brutally. If that was years ago, I would have been dead. Please don’t tell me that was somehow better for anyone. I matter. Vaulnerability matters. Men can accept their own vaulnerability as well. Please no hate, I only mean to spread love. I am just one vaulnerable little human being. I need your masculinity, and I hope you need my femininity as well.
With all due respect, I think Dr Peterson is wrong about modern women. I think we are also in crisis because we are raised to uphold the logos at the sacrifice of the Divine mother, and we end up in a sort of limbo between the two. No one ever told me it's a good thing to want children going up, so I never developed the feminine side of me that is essential for child care. Plus, if a women fully embraces the Divine mother and chooses to raise children at home, she is looked down upon in society. How are women supposed to sort through that mess of conflicting influences?
Kaili Lee Gibbons: I keep hearing similar things from women and it keeps blowing my mind and breaking my heart. I don't know a single guy who gives a shit what a woman does for her career. Men don't care about that. So precisely WHO is telling you and other women that career is so important or that motherhood isn't good? If it's feminists saying this, well, they're resentful losers so don't listen to them. Men like femininity. Men are attracted to femininity; always have been and always will be. EDIT - "Plus, if a woman fully embraces the Divine mother and chooses to raise children at home, she is looked down upon in society". "Who" is "society"? Do you mean mainstream media? Do you mean college professors? Do you mean other women? Do you mean men? What about all of the women are currently mothers, do they look down upon motherhood? What about all of the men who are attracted to feminine women. Do they look down upon motherhood? I honest to God feel like there is a mass hallucination playing out where women think femininity and motherhood aren't appreciate by "society" because of a small segment of society that controls the narrative. The silent majority think otherwise.
William Koscielniak - by "society" I mean everyone I know, at least that is vocal about it. I literally don't know any women my age who choose to stay at home with their kids; they all use daycare and hardly skip a beat going back to work, and the people I know admire this choice. I was raised from childhood to aspire to be an independent woman who doesn't need a man or even children, which now makes me feel like I'm somehow letting my family down by wanting to stay at home with children. I grew up being taught that princesses are stupid and later, that getting pregnant is a burden to be avoided at all cost. I can see how you would think that through media we tend to blow certain narratives out of proportion but for my local culture at least, femininity and motherhood is hardly acknowledged as good, much less Divine.
Well first of all I think your definition of "society" is actually quite reasonable, particularly from a psychological standpoint, because when we react to "society" we usually mean our circle of peers (even if we're not conscious of that fact). I was cringing a bit when hearing about what your parents told you, and also at the fact that you feel a sense of letting them down by wanting to have a family and settle down. It's not you I'm cringing at; it's the deep corruption of that narrative and its influence on you that makes me feel that way. There is nothing wrong with being strong and independent (I could do a much better job at those things myself) but by God there is nothing wrong with placing a significant emphasis on loving relationships either. I can't think of anything more valuable than loving relationships even though I highly respect autonomy myself. Maybe you can see that the narrative you grew up in is merely one among many and not necessarily the on that is best for your own well being. Wish you the best in your journey.
William Koscielniak - I appreciate the way you phrased it as "emphasis on loving relationships" rather than just a lack of autonomy. Dr. Peterson's work is very helpful in the search for the proper life narrative. and who doesn't need a little motivation to clean up their rooms.
So what you're saying, is that men and women are different, and society should just accept that fact, and stop forcing women to become men?
"There's terrible evil and there's terrible suffering, it's bottomless, but, the human spirit is capable of voluntarily taking that on as a challenge." -J. Peterson. This is something everyone needs to hear.
"But even so, what I want and all my days I pine for
is to go back to my house and see my day of homecoming.
And if some god batters me far out on the wine-blue water,
I will endure it, keeping a stubborn spirit inside me,
for already I have suffered much and done much hard work
on the waves and in the fighting. So let this adventure follow.”
~ Odyssey V.219-224
Excellent job with this Interview, Subscribed !
As a non-native English speaker, I must say Prof. Peterson is always enlarging my eyesights as well as my vocabulary...lol
Same here
Wow. Just wow. Jordan is life changing. Brilliant. Thank you 👌👌
Jordan Peterson is brilliance in mortal form.
That is why many russians love Putin. His figure is represented as a competent, a strong, a responsible and a masculine person. There's an enormous potential hidden behind "healthy masculinity". Jordan Peterson is making a great point in this interview
Ben Widerski well put
Ben Widerski
You make a good point.
He represents the adult in the room. Maybe ruthless, maybe dictatorial but still the Boss relative to everyone else.
The novel 'Lord of the flies' depicts the fall into chaos that occurs when adult authority is absent.
Right now in Europe I feel that there's no adult in the room.
Except that Putin does not move the world forward in a positive way, he is not a teller of truth. He is as corrupt in heart as every tyrant.
Ken Leonard
That is true.
But the three Super Powers of Europe are led by two clueless and childless women ( Britain and Germany) and one clueless and possibly? childless man (France) so is it any wonder that Europe is doomed?
These leaders have no vested or familial interest in the future.
Black Sun Rising Where the fuck did you get the idea that Putin is a nationalist? There are no major nationalist powers in the world, maybe except for Japan - depending on wether you call them major. China is ethnocentric but clearly globalist. Russia isn’t even that because it’s been multicultural for decades.
You want a real insight into Marketing/Media/Madison Avenue's view of Masculinity read this article from the 90-year-old publication AdAge. I think you'll find thoughts quite different from what they were during the "Mad Men" marketing era...interesting but very scary.
adage.com/article/opinion/end-masculinity/314317/
I love this. Professor Peterson is so relaxed here and It shows that when he is in a reasonable discussion he can manage to make more out of it. You get more progress by not constantly challenging someone.
OMG THIS GUY IS AMAZING the universe blessed all of us for his free and compassionate insight on his experience with the archetypes and life
* It feels great when a female finds her yang energy inside of herself and males find their feminine attributes inside themselves ~~~ Yin ~ Yang Being incarnated as a certain gender BUT whole in and of ourselves !!
Which might be "power outside with softness inside" (Yang). Softness outside with a inner power/strength (Yin).
A female in balance would be very feminine in expression but has a strength inside to ground her (her man inside).
A male in balance would be very masculine in expression but has a inner softness to ground him (the softness of emotions he seeks ?).
Thanks for posting. Jordan is my hero. Subscribed
It's great to hear Peterson say about archetypes that "They are pre-existing categories of perception, in the Kantian sense". I have had that same thought for a while but have never heard Peterson use that term. Both Peterson and Jung (and some friends of mine) use the term archetype constantly but I rarely hear any of them define what the hell they are talking about.
William Koscielniak my brother, a preface, english is a rather tricky language, very confuddly"". The definition in which they use is found from contextual use. Also archetypes are character roles that we fulfill mostly subconsciously, when you step back into the observer archetype you begin to see how we all assume archetypal roles, the bully, the victim, the hero, the damsel, the hermit. Hope this clears up some smog from.your sky.
Much love,
A soul with many namss
seRap¡s b3y-ak
I like to compare the differences between an archetype and a stereotype. An archetype Represents the Traditional idea of the purest version of a person, place or thing; a stereotype represents the most currently fashionable, cliched idea of a particular sort of person, place, or thing. Stereotypes tend to literally occur far, far more often then archetypes, Which tend to more approximately occur, but both approximately occur regularly to varying degrees.
A priest that actually achieves saintly perfection has achieved a rare, literal archetypal existence. Most priests can only hope to approximate that to some degree.
Someone who assumes, or at least acts like he assumes, that most or all priests are pedophiles, or aiding pedophiles, is embracing a negative stereotype. Stereotypes may be rational or irrational, based on common experience or common misconceptions. They are always driven by fashion, and usually fade away after relatively short times, except where it is politically useful to force them to endure unnaturally. Sometimes xenophobia or some such prejudice associated with a stereotype can be temporarily useful for survival, IF hard experience teaches you to be “better safe then sorry”, such as “don’t play on the wrong side of the tracks”, and other such stereotypical idioms.
Archetypes are always driven by tradition and/or instinct, and VERY rarely fade. Usually it takes the death of an entire civilization to lose any particular archetype at all, and then only a specialized type unique to that particular civilization. Archetypes are entirely rational and utterly essential for our collective survival.
Keep up the good work! 👏🏻
Damn this fellow just verbalizes what I feel in such a clear way that chills me out of my mind !
My step-grandfather raised me as his very own. He is my father because my "father" wasn't around.
Male and female are different. Vive la difference!
IKR, Isa -. being attracted to women is a real drag sometimes. there are some real toxic messes in a pretty package, out there. some are ugly inside and out, eh.
nah. i expect what you really tell women is that it's a political necessity to take up a lesbian lifestyle.
It's all about balance, people. Balance the masculine and feminine by integrating the archetypes into your psyche. If you favor one gender over the other, it's merely a signal you have internal work to do (forgiveness).
Thanks dad
before the "Village People" and "Cryin' Pat Schroder (D. CO), men joined the military for what you guys are seeking; in that respect i wouldn't trade my Nam' experience for a trillion dollars- you guys have no idea what men being men is like, and it was bodacious wonderful..! 😉👍
Phillip Kokesh
If only Patton had been listened to regarding Russia, then you would have been allowed to win, assuming the Commies managed to get that far, in spite of him. I see pictures of V-E Day and V-J day, and hear descriptions of a nation that was, for one day, in absolute sync. I don’t know if its true, but it is said that there was almost no crime anywhere on those two days. Brotherhood was truly universal in America on those two days, hell, you might have been conceived on one of the two, beginning the Boom with a bang!
It’s been too long since we could enjoy such unconditional unity. You deserved your moment! But the Leftist traitors took it from you, as did the incompetent boobs who were using you all as lab rats in their new kind of unconstitutional war. It didn’t have to be unconstitutional, they could have amended the constitution to make non escalative police actions legal, but they won’t write the bill because it will make people think, and they will really realize how crooked it has all been. And Patton could have prevented it. But a Leftist President was not about to let him go after a Leftist ally. I am very Minarchist Libertarian most of the time, but preventing Stalin from getting a nuke should have been priority one once the Japanese surrendered. As sick of war as everyone was, there was no time for a pointless break. We should have had other Perfect Days of victory. I remember when the Berlin Wall fell and the Soviet Union collapsed, yet there was no particular special day. I don’t want war, but if we TRULY have to, Damn it, I want to experience a day like that when it ends, just once! The Fucking Left have taken that from us!
19:40 - "(Archetypes are) pre-existing categories of perception" ....What an insanely concise statement. It's like he just rolled that off his tongue.
Dr. Peterson's expression style is more articulated and more sophisticated than it was a year ago.
I agree. The man has been coached by a professional or a friend who knows his stuff. Also, the way he kept his cool in the notorious Cathy Newman interview.
He was under a lot of stress back then. He seems a lot more relaxed these days. If you look at his older lectures he's just as good as he is now.
I knew this guy was obviously intelligent, but after listening to these interviews I have a lot more respect and trust in his judgment.
This flow of reality.....
The phrase 'toxic masculinity' refers to toxic masculinity, not masculinity in general. If it's not toxic (being too competitive, not having friends, watching porn, not being able to ask for help or talk about your feelings) then it's not toxic masculinity. The same applies to the toxic aspects of femininity.
I love this man. The last person I was with also had an appreciation of JP, and we bonded quite a bit over that. When things ended, I couldn't really bear to listen to his talks. Everything had a color of the past I was trying to heal from.
But, here I am, allowing Jordan to give me perspective on things again. Helping me bring some order to chaos. Feels good.
I was taking to my wife last night on our children, the teen age boys who are afraid of the dark, yeah true, afraid to go out, when I was their age we were camping out ourselves in the forest at night, exploring the world swimming in lakes and climbing hills, hunting, with the belief we could do anything, I often laugh when I remember my grandmother who would tell me when I said I can't or that's impossible, my grandmother would say "there's no such word as can't or impossible" we can all achieve the things we want. But the education as far as I can see today, puts a fear into their minds. Different world today, this may be due to the fact that there are not so many men in education, and those that are often don't promote that sense of exploration, today it's handouts, whereas in my day there was debate and this gave us a common sense of collaboration, today's doctrine s are from a totally different perspective, and young men in particular are stalling as they try to push through the manure of postmodern thinking.
If responsibility and competence are masculinity what is femininity?
Josie Smith neither of those are perfectly masculine and I don’t think Peterson means that they are. But the father is supposed to let the child learn and grow while the mother nurtures and feeds the child. Responsibilities and competence come from letting a child become independent ( the archetypal fathers roll). This is what young men need to hear to become good fathers and really for anyone to “grow up.”
To be caring and empathetic are feminine traits even high negative emotion is more feminine. But the idea of the archetypes is that the mother is caring and the father helps the child become independent. The journey of the individual is to grow from the mother’s protection at first and then learn from the father to be independent. It should also be noted that in archetypal symbolism is of the male individual and the mother and child. This is why male = responsibility and competence. The male has been used to symbolize that ( because of prehistoric man hunting and such). And of course prehistoric woman would be the prefect caretaker of children. But that is what the symbols mean not that they only relate to one sex or the other. Although there may be preferences in male and females for those traits.
PokeTeeHee thanks for the explanation. I like Peterson a lot but here is my problem: both men and women need to slay the dragon in their lives, probably to equal degrees. However the dragon slaying hero is quentissentialy male. So when I have really needed to embody that role, in a particularly rough time in my life, I would balk at it because I felt like I had to become a man. That is because there is no dragon-slaying heroine archetype. The woman is a princess in the castle waiting to be rescued. This is a paradigm case of victim consciousness and it's not in anyone's interest to encourage that sort of attitude in women. It's true women want dragon-slaying heroes for partners, but they also want - in fact need - to be dragon slayers themselves.
Catchlight * I am not asking about biological differences or the characteristic pathologies. Men are not biologically predisposed to be competent and responsible. This is an ideal that Peterson is positing. So I am asking about the female ideal.
Josie Smith It's an excellent question...my guess is that the correct answer is not possible to understand in our current climate.
Jose Francisco da Silva e Oliveira It would be great if the correct answer wasn't regressive. In other words, it would be great to empower men without at the same time disempowering women. I am not saying Peterson is doing that, but he doesn't really address this sort of question either.
Who's here after shaving off their balls with Gillette?!?!
I wish I had discovered JP before!!!!
AAAAAAAAA
Jordan, the right of transgenders to crush detractors under the government boot, and the right to express a conservative opinion on gender, is mutually exclusive
I wish Jordan would elaborate more about Animus and Anima in female and male unconsciousness. And how they manifest in relationship between them also same gender relationship.
Brilliant as usual. Always learbing something new when he speaks.
well, if you're gonna lie so egregiously, then it's no wonder you are alienated from the idea of speaking the truth. sort yourself out.
Isa. You have access to magic. You can make new people...
Stop being angry about things you can't do and embrace the things you can.
Also, stop nagging men for doing the same. You're destroying society xx
Isa well hold on a second, in this interview the topic is about males, he's a male and the interviewer is male and masculinity is under attack so he is focusing on the great aspects of masculinity. I have watched lots of his talks and he has spoken of the significance of the role of feminity a lot. If you levelled that males are more important than women to Jordan I imagine he would laugh in outrage. He would probably talk about how the woman represents nature and the gateway to life and the protector of life and the natural balancer to masculin creativity and destruction.
Isa well ok how about, on the whole, no women have babies and no men go hunting and we'll see how it plays out? He talks in generalities. You are free not to have children, no law permits it.
What are you taking about? No one has said that. You aren't listening to Peterson's ideas at all.
And I never said you were 'destroying society'.
Your comments seem to be ideologically possessed
Once you accept that suffering is part of life. And that you are only a choice away from evil. It does make you think. But as long as you take responsibility for how you deal with the suffering and do as much as humanly possible to not choose evil, as often as you realistically can. Then life does feel more meaningful. Thank You, Dr Peterson.
I'm baffled by how Jordan misconstrues the construct of toxic masculinity for masculinity being toxic. He's one of the more intellectually grounded conservatives and even he misunderstands it. TM doesn't equate masculinity with toxicity; it describes a set of behaviors and expectations society places on men that toxic. These things include emotional reservation (unless it's anger), domination/humiliation of other men, sexual conquest, hiding your flaws, and fear of anything feminine. Masculinity is about pursuing what you want, standing up for your values, and being vulnerable when you are struggling with something without being debilitated by the experience.
Masculinity isn't toxic; but what society confuses for masculinity definitely is.
Z Z
You can define it but others use it in the way he's referencing. There's a difference
So the concept of "toxic masculinity" is completely detached from the ideology behind the rhetoric so commonplace, i.e. phrases such as "privileged white male?" You may think of it that way, but I think you're in the minority of people using it that way.
I agree completely.
I have seen 2 u tube videos where female feminists asked Mr. Peterson to comment on Toxic Masculinity.
He addressed the angle that you have referred to (that masculinity is toxic) because it was clear that this is what these 2 feminists ment.
You could tell that by their body language, cynical tone and follow up comments.
He rightly pointed out that it's 'Toxic Humanity' that's the real problem but they being toxic Man-Haters had no interest in discussing that issue.
I don't think he's misconstruing it. A few people I know do use the term "toxic masculinity" to mean no more than "those times when what is considered 'masculine' is actually pathological and toxic." You appear to be in this camp. It may also be that 10 months ago fewer people were throwing it around as they are at the moment -- I've only been aware of its far-reaching use more recently. The majority of the people I hear using it are not using it in the sense of "a short basketball player," -- that is, as a modifier that distinguishes it from the norm -- but are throwing it around as an intensifying modifier like "an ugly ogre" or "horrific war crimes." The phrase is ambiguous from the very start: grammatically, neither is a more correct interpretation. Now, if it were merely ambiguous, we could quibble about which meaning is intended in each instance, but the problem is that one of these meanings renders the phrase itself a horrible, toxic attack on maleness, and people seem to be weaponising it in this way. Sure, some people are still using the term in good faith, but the fact remains that the word "toxic" has been linked in a catchy way to "masculinity", and is being used as an equivalency in speech, so it doesn't matter if a minority of people don't *mean* it that way -- whether they like it or not, the careless majority are using it to tar & feather normal, positive, useful masculine behaviour as pathological. If you want to denigrate a man you just have to suggest that his (probably decent and even admirable) actions are representative of "toxic masculinity" and you've just done an effective character assassination. Peterson is particularly passionate about the topic, because members of his own field, the APA, have just announced that normal masculine traits are pathological. That's pretty terrible, pretty reprehensible to my mind. So there's a reason he's calling the term out.
We need jp on cable television in america help our kids
What Peterson is arguing for is biological imperative. The world operates according to the rules of biological imperative according to him. We need to perpetuate therefore masculinity and femininity have a purpose along biological lines. However he fails to acknowledge that alongside this imperative there is civilisation that is constructed along lines that can also transcend these differences and in constructing thoughts and procedures that don't necessarily tow the biological imperative are somehow degenerative and politically correct. In my view the act of procreation is an event that happens despite any moralising to the contrary. Procreation can occur through a loving relationship or an act of violence. There is no morality in the natural world for procreation no matter how we look at it. The sole purpose for the biological imperative is to ensure a very basic biological outcome and that is to ensure the perpetuation of the species. In a world that is over populated with diminishing resources and mass inequalities his voice is discordant and unreasonable. He has become the voice for the emasculated man who feels his sole imperative is to perpetuate the species yet in an overpopulated world the necessity for this is compromised. What he views as the emasculating left is just the voice of reason that is trying to create a society not based on biological imperative that will happen anyway but a society based on transcendent ideas of cultural enrichment, plurality of identity and creative forms of relating. He seems to be stuck in a very binary world of good versus bad and his messianic mission to express this is stuck in his pseudo christian basis of western culture that tried to emancipate itself from this in the 17th century. Get over yourself!
I think this is what I was feeling while listening to the video, but couldn't quite put my finger on it. Thank you.
Nice projection
You seem to miss that masculine and feminine are not just biological, they are the biological representations of complementary concepts which saturate all creation. And Peterson knows this...you’re the one that is assuming the limited scope.
You need to watch more. Yes. His area of expertise is the West, not the East. But it goes back thousands of years...if you watch more videos you’ll see that his comprehension and processing encompass way more than the range you’ve outlined.