I think that the American Christian Church has allowed or encouraged for "love" to be made an idol...and our culture was very open to that concept. God is love, but love is not to be made a god.
Indeed. We use ‘love is love’ or ‘love wins’ to justify our sin. God’s love and the world’s understanding of love are very different. We think love means accepting and allowing a person’s flaws. God loves us so that we can become better and holy people.
in 2Tim3, Paul lays out a series of warnings about the "perilous times" that will come because men will be "lovers of their own selves" and "having a form of godliness but denying the TRUTH thereof"... that is EXACTLY what "progressive Christianity" is and 2Tim 3:13 says But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.....and the answer for that problem is to do EXACTLY what that "conservative Christian" did: 2 Tim 3:14-17 "But continue(remain) thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works." Stand your ground Christian, it's going to get rough!
Trying to construct a biblical theology without the authoritative source is a fools errand. I don’t remember who said that Progressive Christianity is one step away from Secular Humanism,but it rings true when you listen to this. You can’t hold to a concept of Jesus without the historical account of Jesus.
GODS first commandment to us when he was removing Adam and Eve for Eden was "GO FORTH AND MULTIPLY" that is why GOD REJECTS homosexuality. Progressive Christianity accepts their lifestyle which rejects GOD .
My two cents: I think that part of the problem is the entitlement season we're all living in now. By "right"of birth, we no longer have to work or aspire for or too certain things and standards, we are simply entitled to a whole host of rights and respect simply because we're "here". If I am a Christian (and I am), then I have to acknowledge that my life was bought for a price and that my path and purpose are no longer my own. I am seeking a higher cause through and with Christ. My "struggle" with homosexuality, is of late starting to feel like less of a "struggle" and more like a purpose and reason. The path that I'm walking is revealing itself to me in beautiful and complex ways that I couldn't possibly articulate. My celibacy is still in its infancy, along with my faith but I'm starting to see that I was given this "burden" so that when I did one day come to Christ I could use my entire life's journey to relate to a wider range of people. By virtue of my background, I can immediately relate with a whole host of minorities and traditionally marginalised people that perhaps I might not have been able to before. With all of that being said, I also have to add that Christians need to stop just "throwing scripture" at LGBT people. Or anyone for that matter. If yours is not to minister or evangalise to the specific person that you're crossing paths with, then don't. Rather just be honest and direct them to someone in your community who is better prepared to walk a walk with them and perhaps relate better - you might just be the "link" to the person that that individual needs. Being a Christian cannot be about a popularity contest, but whatever issue you're tackling, it simply has to have the foundation of love, first. Love, then truth and then correction but the consistency has to be the foundation of love. One doesn't have to agree or be agreed with by everyone all the time. "No", is also an answer - but one can still have a human experience with someone. Thank you for increasing understanding through intellectual and empathetic discourse. You never know who you're reaching. ;-)
Explain to me how any pastor/preacher/priest "works" for anything? What tangible thing do they create (even by proxy)? What service do they provide that people depend on for their survival/improvement that cant and/or isn't provided by other means in more efficient ways? In fact religion as a mass organization wasn't really possible until agriculture starting providing enough food and resources that entire segments of the population could stop worrying about gathering food and spend all their time telling other people what they think their imaginary friend wants them to do. At the end of the day, they are just an entertainer that gets on a stage every week and tells people how to live their lives according to a book of myths from bronze age sheep herders. Then those people donate money to support them. Some of them get filthy rich doing this. BILLIONS of people around the world lead successful and productive lives without the benefit of their directives and will continue to do so. It sounds VERY familiar to what conservatives are VERY critical of "Hollywood" doing and they don't even do it as a mass organization with a weekly schedule. "What business does George Clooney have telling anyone what to do?! He should just shut up and stick to what he does best." Sound familiar? Except preachers don't have a "what they do best" to fall back on. They ONLY make a living off of telling other people what to do (well, I suppose of them do have second jobs, but let's not get mired down in semantics, exceptions, and other minutiae)… The fact that so many people don't really "work" for a living is a product of modern society. We produce so much so easily that people literally don't have to work to survive. As we automate more and more, more and more people don't have to work. Capitalism is going to have to adapt to this new reality or it's going to fail as an economic system and will have to be replaced with something else...
First mistake of anyone who false to understand the word of God... You shouldnt have to proclaim you you are... It should be shown by your actions. Its the same mental hoop that people who ask and respond, "do you consider yourself a good person?" the bad response being only, "YES I am a good person..." Because the bible tells you to humble yourself and serve others is the way. Self proclaiming is an issue, Just like These Open prayers intentionally Done in the view of others... Jesus walked away from CROWDS to pray to the father, Our lord in heaven. The devil has been hard at work using his tools to decieve people and christians have sat complacent thinking that God was doing everything yet forgeting, "God acts through you and all his creations..." Love and compassion doesnt mean accepting someones sin, Its not our position to judge them to condemnation, but that doesnt mean you tolerate the devil in your midst acting up. He will conform to the lords words or find his comfort with his Idol, Satan. Not everyone needs scripture, the people who are Tribal, emotional people of the flesh.. you must teach them through the flesh like christ. "Which of you who has no sin, can cast the first stone". Jesus didnt cast the stone because even if he was sinless, he was not worthy to judge the creation of God. I love my mother, but I dont let her abuse me and ruin my opportunities because she is in the devils grasp.
I left evangelical Christianity for progressive Christianity and would like to help clarify your misunderstandings. Progressives shift the focus to right actions rather than right beliefs, i.e., you can believe in Christ and still commit evil actions. We believe God is immanent as well as transcendent. We reject blind adherence to rigid doctrines and dogma and take the Bible seriously but not literally. There is a great deal of information about progressives if one is searching for understanding rather than just interested in taking pot shots, e.g., en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_Christianity
Colby Martin has established his own values, but the word of God is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow. God doesn’t conform to the world, we must conform, be saved, and sanctified by God.
@@michaelmore4758 that's why we don't use modern false bibles like niv....the word of the lord is forever....It is not to be changed whether for copyright reasons nor for political culture nor for people who want their own religion like jw...sda...mormons
Deliverance is available to all Christians. Do not let the devil fool you into believing that you cannot change. Possession is real and it does not present itself the way that you see in the movies. Much of these ideas are coming from the thoughts that the devil has placed inside you. Seek God, fast and pray and he will deliver you from all manners of evil.
@@ChristianityStillMakesSense I have question for you out of the topic of your video and I hope you can answer it . Who is the ANTI CHRIST satan evil the God who KILLED INNOCENT Jesus on the cross in VIOLENT BARBARIC way in the name of LOVE and called him the CURSED ONE or the God ALLAH who saved Jesus from the crime of the cross in the name of LOVE and called him the BLESSED ONE ? Please watch this 4 minutes video ua-cam.com/video/piarY-7NSZE/v-deo.html She is talking about me in her vlog . She fail to answer my question and I hope you can answer . Thanks.
I am hard pressed to say God loves and cares about everyone when made us all defective and throws the vast majority into hell for fire and eternal torture and torment because we are the defective way he made us.
Love is expressed as much in how we disagree as in how we defend our positions on issues. Jesus showed us how to live. He unconditionally accepted "sinners" and relied on his ability to love them out of sin, rather than to exclude and shame them. This is the dilemma that the institutional church has. It tends to rely on conformity to propositional beliefs rather than the example and power of love to define who is "in" and who is "out".
The issue is that culture demands people make their orientation their identity. Our identity needs to be in Christ, not in our gender or sexuality. I lie, and I'm ok with being called out on that because my identify is not in being a liar. If I framed my whole being on the fact that I lie, I'd call anyone a bigot for attacking my identify when they call me out on it.
Jesus said come and follow me. Count the cost and only follow if you're willing to pay it. Die to find life...or try to hold onto your life and die. Those are harsh statements. Many of the crowds that followed him for miracles would turn back when he started making demands because they understood them for the demands they are. His love only changes you once you've left everything to follow him. You can't be changed if you're clinging to something else at the same time.
I'm hoping I won't be attacked for asking this question, here goes... what is it that prevents me from having a relationship with god and entering the lords kingdom. Example 1. I am a Christian, I'm a loving, devoted, respectful, kind, humble husband by human standards I am a "good person" however I am a husband to my husband. What part of my life prevents me from being loved by god and entering his kingdom. Can I fix it by divorcing my husband? Does that make me a better person? Example 2. I'm the same person as above but I have a wife and a gambling problem, am I allowed to have a relationship with god and enter his kingdom? Example 3. I'm the same person as above I have a wife but I don't have a gambling problem, I just lie occasionally, am I allowed a relationship with God and can I enter his kingdom? I am asking this out of genuine curiousity and interest not because I believe I have an answer. I guess my question is, is one sin greater than another, if all people sin what makes Example 2 or 3 any different from Example 1?
The problem with your scenario is that you put homosexual marriage on the same level as heterosexual marriage. One fits the criteria of Christian marriage while the other doesn't. You can't just say it was marriage just because the secular world recognizes that. If somebody was married to a pre-teen girl, would you call that marriage? Of course not. Kindness isn't a prerequisite to Christian. They are atheists who are extremely kind yet they reject the existence of God.
@@computationaltheist7267 Thanks for taking the time to answer my question. I'm still unsure of a few elements of your assertions. Why do you say they aren't Christian? Is it because they sin? Why is this sin worse than all the sins you and I commit everyday through the fact that we are merely human? Also what about it stops it from being a real marriage? I wouldn't consider marriage with a minor real because they cannot give consent. Both the people in this scenario can and have given consent and stood before God and said their vows.
@@computationaltheist7267 interesting, I guess that makes sense. My only thought is "how can you determine that being gay is a bigger sin than lying etc. but i guess you could argue that it's the not "being gay" it's consistently acting on the impulses (behaving) in a way which goes against the moral law documented in the bible? Thanks for taking the time to explain your reasoning
@@MariaRose360 I will do my best with the lords help to answer. It's not what sin have I done or not done, the big picture is we as everyone ever born is born into sin. That is why we commit to any sin. It's called lust of the flesh or lust of the eyes or the pride of life. God is a pure an holy god,loveing,righteous an just. Because he is holy!we sinners can not be in his presence. We cant just be good people to make it to heaven. There is absolutely nothing we can do in an of ourselves to make it to heaven. God knows this! God has a holy hatred for sin. An because he is just an righteous,he has to judge sin. So with that being said how will you stand when the time comes for his judgment! Knowing there is no amount of goodness (what we mear humans call good that is)you can do to save yourself from his judgment? Here is the good news, because god is pure only he can save us an that is exactly what he did. Through the blood of jesus an his resurrection!!! Jesus was not conceived from a sinful man an lived a sinless life, jesus was pure an righteous. Question, would you say life is in the blood?.........jesus came an payed our debt for sin. For it is written "the wages for sin is death"(real death an spiritual death)the 3rd day god rose him from the grave unto eternal life!jesus also defeated the grave. This is the grace of god a free gift. Turn from your sin,Believe in his son an the finished work on the cross an put ur trust in jesus an god will forgive you an give you eternal life with him. This is god almighty's promise to man kind, grace alone, faith alone, christ alone.god can not lie! So the issue isn't what sin is worse than the other, the issue is the sin nature. I hope this helps an if you have any more questions feel free to ask.
You don't get your life straight before coming to Christ you come to Christ and he helps you to get your life straight. You don't have to be a perfect person (you can't) before coming to God you don't meet him he meets you where you are and then the Spirit convicts you and if you listen to that Conviction and change your life to be more Christ like and more fitting to what the Bible describes then you get to being a better person. The path to Salvation is through Christ alone and we have all sinned and we will all continue to sin but with salvation our sins are forgiven but that is not a license to sin. When you become saved you will work on your life.
Theistic evolution is refuted by the N.T. writers, the ancient Israelites, and Jesus Himself treating the creation account in Genesis as LITERAL history.
The bible is not univocal. This is its main problem among many ohers. Practically all moral problems that are being discussed nowadays can be answered differenty with the help of tge bible and are at bottom controversial. No one can harmonise the Jesus from the Sermon on the Mount with the Book of Revelation. Whether its violence,, abortion, sexuality, affluence, abortion, eating habits and many more issues. Tenthousands of conflicting denominations speak a clear language. Nothing is clear when it comes to what GOD wants from us and who is right😂 And Paul is a subject of its own. No one knows whether he isnt that false apostle the real apostle thought him to be, who really messed up Jesus morals. Just glad the two dont treat the bible like a valid science book as they used to in the Middle Ages. That would be even more absurd🎉 Unfortunately things are so much more complicated🍹
@@Yakon3Reborn and that is your problem. It’s all about “ feelings” and that’s adolescent. The Bible says the heart is deceptively wicked, so emotional arguments are weak . Progressive Christians seem to embrace sin even gross perverted sin and call that virtue.
@@kennethdias9988 no it's not about feeling. It's about seeking truth. It's about breaking open the greek, searching after the true character of christ not just believing what your church has shoved down your throat. Also, I've led many people to christ, have dedicated my life to ministry, and I can garuntee you, I've made a change for the kingdom that isn't limited to hating progressives. Sooooooooo honestly, I'd rather continue to believe what I've done, which is real research and searching after God's heart. So honestly your words mean nothing to me. I know who I am in Christ. Your people will not shame me anymore.
@@kennethdias9988 your comment is just steaming with homophobia. "Gross"? You're undoubtedly referencing is affirming the lgbt. What's gross is your negligence for their souls. Enjoy your day, Caiaphas!
@@Yakon3Reborn I said nothing about LGBTQIA’s you assumed. That assumption says more about you than me. I’m glad you have preached the Gospel . Hopefully it’s the true Gospel because woe to those who preach a false Gospel. No one is more lost than that Trans person who shakes their fist at God and says “ You made a mistake I’m not a man I’m a woman “ or the reverse. But God Loves that person so We are called to also but we don’t have to affirm their rebellion. I find the progressives more judgmental than conservative evangelicals. And don’t forget the 60 million children sacrificed to the god of selfishness through abortion.
Very interesting, I think one point that Bobby ignores is that to the ancient Israelites there was no division amongst the laws. They did not see some as the dietary and some as moral, but rather they were all the law and you followed all, or faced the consequences for it.
According to the ancient Israelites they did make distinctions between Dietary, Civil and Moral Law. Just as today there is a distinction between Civil Law and Criminal Law. They are both "the law" but they are distinct from one another. Because Isreal was a Theocracy the Dietary law is included.
I like the idea of the progressive Christianity movement and if it gains a foothold Christianity will evolve as it has always evolved over 2000 years. If you think it has not evolved then you need to study Church history. Some people think they are holding the original 1611 KJV bible in their hands when their KJV bible was changed until the 1800s. I was reading the preface of my Oxford annotated bible and some people actually believe the KJV version was the original manuscript for the bible. I about fell of my chair about that.
@@rapturewatch353 Just because the KJV has no copywrite does not mean it is perfect. What about Rogers and Tyndale bible, the first handwritten bible into English was written in 1380 by John Wycliff. in 1496 John Colet Started to take the Greek NT and translated into English for his students. William Tyndale was the first man to ever print the NT in the English language. _"Having God's Word available to the public in the language of the common man, English, would have meant disaster to the church. No longer would they control access to the scriptures. If people were able to read the Bible in their own tongue, the church's income and power would crumble."_ Myles Coverdale finished translating the old testament and in 1535 he printed the first complete bible in the English language. There were bibles printed before the KJV. Perhaps this history of the English bible will be of interest to you. greatsite.com/timeline-english-bible-history/
Sean Mc Dowell is a really nice genuine guy. Colby Martin is a genuine nice guy also. I think Christianity will evolve like it always has for 2000 years.
Christianity hasn't evolved, but something is happening that has happened for the last 2000 years. That is heretics try to apply the world to the word as opposed to the word to the world.
ummm as someone who was raised in the church, being bisexual doesn't mean that you want a polyamorous relationship? you really misrepresented LGBTQ+ people in here. and the fact that your first sentiment about them was more focused on the church not being at fault and us being, wrong, and how not "all" christians treat them that way and how most of your friends would be loving towards us really has me upset. the worst things ive ever heard about myself have come from the pulpit and from, "Well meaning," christians. I encourage you to hear more lgbtq stories and to research the actual word that Christians think means homosexuality, (arsensoki and malokoia.) there are soooo many versions eluding this words to rape or pedophilia. the word homosexual wasn't even added to the Bible until 1946! anyway - love a very hurt lgbtq member whose been continously hurt by mistranslated theology.
Sweetie, you're never gonna find someone who respects you, your identity, and who you are in Christ if you're looking at conservative christians. Check out God is grey, it's a great community where you won't be attacked constantly.
@@Yakon3Reborn you're so right, and I totally have :) I love God is grey and definitely have found more empathy, love, and grace, in those types of circles :) Thank you so much for being so positive!
'kids can't give consent' is always used. But at what age is someone all of a suddenly able to give consent? Surely that's subjective? I've known 10 year olds with more maturity and solid grounding than some 20 year olds...
"Discarding what I don´t like, and taking what I like" is a blame thrown on progressives. Personally that is from my own perspective as a progressive a misrepresentation and a misunderstanding. First question, how is it with conservatives, that ignore some bible passages, like stoning people in the OT, but being very keen on not accepting homosexuality. Isn´t that the "the same" pick what suites you? Or not going so harsh on divorce, but full on against homosexuality. * Now from my view, I don´t start by thinking how to discard what I don´t like and take what I like. I started by WANTING TO KNOW THE TRUTH. If Jesus did not exist, I would want to KNOW, If Jesus is God, I want to KNOW, if Jesus was the second son of God, I wanted to KNOW. The truth mattered, not a "false" preposition. By checking what was said, and learning more, being able to critically evaluate data, to fight with my prepositions, my earlier beliefs, was not an easy task. But I wanted to be honest, and find the truth. * Progressive Christianity is NOT a belief system including certain dogmas. It is more an insight, into the fact, that some things what to many of us was said to be the truth, were not the truth. I would claim that many progressives do not claim or know the EXACT CORRECT BELIEFS... in other words, we can have different personal opinions about details. To take an image: We are on big ship over the Atlantic... some Conservatives say we should continue as before, dine as we did one hour ago. Other say, there´s something wrong, the ship slowed down, and it feels like it´s tilting a little. The conservatives say, just sit down and eat with us, we have always eaten together as a big family, don´t start making things up, don´t you hear, the band is playing the same old tunes, just relax. Other have started to question, and some heard rumors about an iceberg and a collision. Those are just the "new" afraid people, who don´t trust this gigantic ship. - When one realizes that something bad happened on Titanic, one may not exactly know how to react, but one knows, that the Conservatives claims, just sit down and eat as before, and the band is still playing are NOT the answers of how to proceed. When a conservative says about us "they are just trying to create panic" we know that is NOT what we try to do. In the same way, i don´t recognize the idea (mantra) spread about us that we look for possibilities to sin (create panic). From the table where they sit, and don´t realize the changes, it might FEEL we create panic, but that is a very subjective view. When one realize for example that the bible has errors (in opposition to what someone tried to teach), and one then sees how people twist and turn (lie) to try to defend that position, then one knows, that their claim is false.... what else may be false? Their conclusions about many things! Again, I do not always know what exactly to believe of some certain matter, should one get into a small boat, try to find a life jacket, speak with the captain, help others.... if I do that, conservatives blame me of trying to be a social justice warrior. Today, some people start to leave the table, and those sitting in it becomes nervous. Could the boat be sinking? Of course not, we have apologists who say this ship is unsinkable! It is sad that our younger people question our eating traditions, and move away from us... and those bad bad "new" people who cause all this chaos... Well that´s how i personally see the situation. You also in this video question (what if we open Pandora´s box and allow for Polygamy)? Ok, let´s check that.... In the OT polygamy was OK (Abraham, Jacob, David....) .... never sanctioned or in any way condemned by God! It is never condemned in the bible.... so why do you condemn it now? As I suppose God´s not changing opinions? The "funny" things is that you are afraid that progressives would be so evil that they would allow for polygamy, while God allows it - the ultimately good itself. SRY guys, God was meeting them "IN THEIR CULTURE" - the thing you blame progressives to do! No, certainly NO... it´s like saying God compromised with sin, so that they later, hopefully wouldn´t sin with that... it´s not at all consistent with how God acted in the OT according to the writers.
You may have your opinion, but just stating like "you are wrong" without any arguments is not much of an input. A lot of people get angry when one question phrases that have been established by the years, but they seldom give logical arguments for their opinions - just the "you are wrong" type.
YEP!!!!!!! THATS ALL THEY ARE. GATEKEEPING CHRISTIANITY SO PEOPLE UNLIKE THEM CANT GET IN. BIG SURPRISE WHEN THEY END UP IN HELL FOR ALL THE HATE IN THEIR HEARTS.
These comments are insane. I feel like no one here even cares to see how Jesus would see the LGBT community.. he healed a leper, an adulterer, murderers… this seems to be a very unloving and unchirst like conversation. Sorry 🤷🏼♂️
So you're putting them on the level of an adulterer or murderer? Clearly there are degrees of harm caused by sin. But even to go with your point...he healed the leper. He told adulterers to cease their adultery. He told murderers to stop murdering. In no case to did his compassion ever lead to permissiveness. I remember the first time I read the Bible all the way through as a teen I was shocked at how blunt Jesus actually was. I'd thought he was more just about love. But there was a tension between love and truth.
@@tayh.6235 I agree with your point. Jesus never left people continue in their sin. He told them to go and sin no more. Truly loving someone is showing them that We have all sinned and that God desires for us to live holy lives. Turning from our sin and following after God, because sin separates us from God.
@@dramageek1092 yes. Sin actually keeps us from being fully the selves we were created to be in God's image. God's not trying to throw off our groove because he's a meanie.
@@tayh.6235 no I’m not putting them on that level at all.. I’m just saying that so we not think that the LGBT community has been hearing about Christ and what the Bible says about homosexuality?? They know what it says but unloving Christians have told them they are going to hell for how they feel. I’ve been told since I was a child that if you are gay or kill yourself then you are going to hell regardless of if you are a Christian.. which is not true. Very rarely have I seen Christians choose to love people in that community.. so why would anyone wanna turn from those ways if all they hear is hate? That’s all I was saying. Jesus still loves people even if they don’t choose to turn from their sins
I think that the American Christian Church has allowed or encouraged for "love" to be made an idol...and our culture was very open to that concept. God is love, but love is not to be made a god.
Bingo!
Indeed. We use ‘love is love’ or ‘love wins’ to justify our sin. God’s love and the world’s understanding of love are very different. We think love means accepting and allowing a person’s flaws. God loves us so that we can become better and holy people.
@ShetheOvercomer good points. Thanks.
That's because they have a very poor understanding of what love truly is...God is love and not "love is love"
I think the version of God’s love is different from the world’s culture.
Great content, I appreciate it very much, because breaking down discussions like these are very important.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Thank you for this critique! So many great points!
You are so welcome!
Totally agree with you regarding Sean McDowell and his debate with Matthew Vines in a loving way dismantled him .
im just so completely stoked on this channel. thanks so much for the amazing content :)
Great job with clips and explanations guys- Thank you!
Spread The Good News everyone don’t forget or be distracted away from The Great Commission.
1 Peter 3:15
Mark 16:15
Great conversation!
Colby did say on a recent interview with Sean McDowell that he is okay with polygamy.
This was a wonderful video
in 2Tim3, Paul lays out a series of warnings about the "perilous times" that will come because men will be "lovers of their own selves" and "having a form of godliness but denying the TRUTH thereof"... that is EXACTLY what "progressive Christianity" is and 2Tim 3:13 says But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.....and the answer for that problem is to do EXACTLY what that "conservative Christian" did: 2 Tim 3:14-17 "But continue(remain) thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; and that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works."
Stand your ground Christian, it's going to get rough!
Trying to construct a biblical theology without the authoritative source is a fools errand. I don’t remember who said that Progressive Christianity is one step away from Secular Humanism,but it rings true when you listen to this. You can’t hold to a concept of Jesus without the historical account of Jesus.
Important conversation!
Very good explanation
Thank you for this!
Glad it was helpful!
GODS first commandment to us when he was removing Adam and Eve for Eden was "GO FORTH AND MULTIPLY" that is why GOD REJECTS homosexuality. Progressive Christianity accepts their lifestyle which rejects GOD .
Oh shut up.
My two cents: I think that part of the problem is the entitlement season we're all living in now. By "right"of birth, we no longer have to work or aspire for or too certain things and standards, we are simply entitled to a whole host of rights and respect simply because we're "here".
If I am a Christian (and I am), then I have to acknowledge that my life was bought for a price and that my path and purpose are no longer my own. I am seeking a higher cause through and with Christ. My "struggle" with homosexuality, is of late starting to feel like less of a "struggle" and more like a purpose and reason. The path that I'm walking is revealing itself to me in beautiful and complex ways that I couldn't possibly articulate. My celibacy is still in its infancy, along with my faith but I'm starting to see that I was given this "burden" so that when I did one day come to Christ I could use my entire life's journey to relate to a wider range of people. By virtue of my background, I can immediately relate with a whole host of minorities and traditionally marginalised people that perhaps I might not have been able to before.
With all of that being said, I also have to add that Christians need to stop just "throwing scripture" at LGBT people. Or anyone for that matter. If yours is not to minister or evangalise to the specific person that you're crossing paths with, then don't. Rather just be honest and direct them to someone in your community who is better prepared to walk a walk with them and perhaps relate better - you might just be the "link" to the person that that individual needs.
Being a Christian cannot be about a popularity contest, but whatever issue you're tackling, it simply has to have the foundation of love, first. Love, then truth and then correction but the consistency has to be the foundation of love.
One doesn't have to agree or be agreed with by everyone all the time. "No", is also an answer - but one can still have a human experience with someone.
Thank you for increasing understanding through intellectual and empathetic discourse. You never know who you're reaching. ;-)
Explain to me how any pastor/preacher/priest "works" for anything? What tangible thing do they create (even by proxy)? What service do they provide that people depend on for their survival/improvement that cant and/or isn't provided by other means in more efficient ways? In fact religion as a mass organization wasn't really possible until agriculture starting providing enough food and resources that entire segments of the population could stop worrying about gathering food and spend all their time telling other people what they think their imaginary friend wants them to do. At the end of the day, they are just an entertainer that gets on a stage every week and tells people how to live their lives according to a book of myths from bronze age sheep herders. Then those people donate money to support them. Some of them get filthy rich doing this. BILLIONS of people around the world lead successful and productive lives without the benefit of their directives and will continue to do so. It sounds VERY familiar to what conservatives are VERY critical of "Hollywood" doing and they don't even do it as a mass organization with a weekly schedule. "What business does George Clooney have telling anyone what to do?! He should just shut up and stick to what he does best." Sound familiar? Except preachers don't have a "what they do best" to fall back on. They ONLY make a living off of telling other people what to do (well, I suppose of them do have second jobs, but let's not get mired down in semantics, exceptions, and other minutiae)…
The fact that so many people don't really "work" for a living is a product of modern society. We produce so much so easily that people literally don't have to work to survive. As we automate more and more, more and more people don't have to work. Capitalism is going to have to adapt to this new reality or it's going to fail as an economic system and will have to be replaced with something else...
First mistake of anyone who false to understand the word of God... You shouldnt have to proclaim you you are... It should be shown by your actions. Its the same mental hoop that people who ask and respond, "do you consider yourself a good person?" the bad response being only, "YES I am a good person..." Because the bible tells you to humble yourself and serve others is the way. Self proclaiming is an issue, Just like These Open prayers intentionally Done in the view of others... Jesus walked away from CROWDS to pray to the father, Our lord in heaven. The devil has been hard at work using his tools to decieve people and christians have sat complacent thinking that God was doing everything yet forgeting, "God acts through you and all his creations..." Love and compassion doesnt mean accepting someones sin, Its not our position to judge them to condemnation, but that doesnt mean you tolerate the devil in your midst acting up. He will conform to the lords words or find his comfort with his Idol, Satan. Not everyone needs scripture, the people who are Tribal, emotional people of the flesh.. you must teach them through the flesh like christ. "Which of you who has no sin, can cast the first stone". Jesus didnt cast the stone because even if he was sinless, he was not worthy to judge the creation of God. I love my mother, but I dont let her abuse me and ruin my opportunities because she is in the devils grasp.
I left evangelical Christianity for progressive Christianity and would like to help clarify your misunderstandings. Progressives shift the focus to right actions rather than right beliefs, i.e., you can believe in Christ and still commit evil actions. We believe God is immanent as well as transcendent. We reject blind adherence to rigid doctrines and dogma and take the Bible seriously but not literally. There is a great deal of information about progressives if one is searching for understanding rather than just interested in taking pot shots, e.g., en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_Christianity
Colby Martin has established his own values, but the word of God is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow. God doesn’t conform to the world, we must conform, be saved, and sanctified by God.
the bible has over 30 revisions.... just fyi mr.... the word of god is the same, yesterday, today and tomorrow.
@@michaelmore4758 that's why we don't use modern false bibles like niv....the word of the lord is forever....It is not to be changed whether for copyright reasons nor for political culture nor for people who want their own religion like jw...sda...mormons
Oh wow you speak fluent coinea greek and hebrew??
Deliverance is available to all Christians. Do not let the devil fool you into believing that you cannot change. Possession is real and it does not present itself the way that you see in the movies. Much of these ideas are coming from the thoughts that the devil has placed inside you. Seek God, fast and pray and he will deliver you from all manners of evil.
Mental illness is real and you have it. Gay people are not posessed.
Thank you
You're welcome
@@ChristianityStillMakesSense I have question for you out of the topic of your video and I hope you can answer it .
Who is the ANTI CHRIST satan evil the God who KILLED INNOCENT Jesus on the cross in VIOLENT BARBARIC way in the name of LOVE and called him the CURSED ONE or the God ALLAH who saved Jesus from the crime of the cross in the name of LOVE and called him the BLESSED ONE ?
Please watch this 4 minutes video ua-cam.com/video/piarY-7NSZE/v-deo.html
She is talking about me in her vlog . She fail to answer my question and I hope you can answer . Thanks.
I am hard pressed to say God loves and cares about everyone when made us all defective and throws the vast majority into hell for fire and eternal torture and torment because we are the defective way he made us.
SO LOVING RIGHT
Love is expressed as much in how we disagree as in how we defend our positions on issues. Jesus showed us how to live. He unconditionally accepted "sinners" and relied on his ability to love them out of sin, rather than to exclude and shame them. This is the dilemma that the institutional church has. It tends to rely on conformity to propositional beliefs rather than the example and power of love to define who is "in" and who is "out".
The issue is that culture demands people make their orientation their identity. Our identity needs to be in Christ, not in our gender or sexuality. I lie, and I'm ok with being called out on that because my identify is not in being a liar. If I framed my whole being on the fact that I lie, I'd call anyone a bigot for attacking my identify when they call me out on it.
Jesus said come and follow me. Count the cost and only follow if you're willing to pay it. Die to find life...or try to hold onto your life and die.
Those are harsh statements. Many of the crowds that followed him for miracles would turn back when he started making demands because they understood them for the demands they are. His love only changes you once you've left everything to follow him. You can't be changed if you're clinging to something else at the same time.
He also condemned and reprimanded those walking in sin.
This dude looks like he should be in N’SYNC
I'm hoping I won't be attacked for asking this question, here goes... what is it that prevents me from having a relationship with god and entering the lords kingdom. Example 1. I am a Christian, I'm a loving, devoted, respectful, kind, humble husband by human standards I am a "good person" however I am a husband to my husband. What part of my life prevents me from being loved by god and entering his kingdom. Can I fix it by divorcing my husband? Does that make me a better person?
Example 2. I'm the same person as above but I have a wife and a gambling problem, am I allowed to have a relationship with god and enter his kingdom?
Example 3. I'm the same person as above I have a wife but I don't have a gambling problem, I just lie occasionally, am I allowed a relationship with God and can I enter his kingdom?
I am asking this out of genuine curiousity and interest not because I believe I have an answer. I guess my question is, is one sin greater than another, if all people sin what makes Example 2 or 3 any different from Example 1?
The problem with your scenario is that you put homosexual marriage on the same level as heterosexual marriage. One fits the criteria of Christian marriage while the other doesn't. You can't just say it was marriage just because the secular world recognizes that. If somebody was married to a pre-teen girl, would you call that marriage? Of course not.
Kindness isn't a prerequisite to Christian. They are atheists who are extremely kind yet they reject the existence of God.
@@computationaltheist7267 Thanks for taking the time to answer my question. I'm still unsure of a few elements of your assertions. Why do you say they aren't Christian? Is it because they sin? Why is this sin worse than all the sins you and I commit everyday through the fact that we are merely human? Also what about it stops it from being a real marriage? I wouldn't consider marriage with a minor real because they cannot give consent. Both the people in this scenario can and have given consent and stood before God and said their vows.
@@computationaltheist7267 interesting, I guess that makes sense. My only thought is "how can you determine that being gay is a bigger sin than lying etc. but i guess you could argue that it's the not "being gay" it's consistently acting on the impulses (behaving) in a way which goes against the moral law documented in the bible? Thanks for taking the time to explain your reasoning
@@MariaRose360 I will do my best with the lords help to answer. It's not what sin have I done or not done, the big picture is we as everyone ever born is born into sin. That is why we commit to any sin. It's called lust of the flesh or lust of the eyes or the pride of life. God is a pure an holy god,loveing,righteous an just. Because he is holy!we sinners can not be in his presence. We cant just be good people to make it to heaven. There is absolutely nothing we can do in an of ourselves to make it to heaven. God knows this! God has a holy hatred for sin. An because he is just an righteous,he has to judge sin. So with that being said how will you stand when the time comes for his judgment! Knowing there is no amount of goodness (what we mear humans call good that is)you can do to save yourself from his judgment? Here is the good news, because god is pure only he can save us an that is exactly what he did. Through the blood of jesus an his resurrection!!! Jesus was not conceived from a sinful man an lived a sinless life, jesus was pure an righteous. Question, would you say life is in the blood?.........jesus came an payed our debt for sin. For it is written "the wages for sin is death"(real death an spiritual death)the 3rd day god rose him from the grave unto eternal life!jesus also defeated the grave. This is the grace of god a free gift. Turn from your sin,Believe in his son an the finished work on the cross an put ur trust in jesus an god will forgive you an give you eternal life with him. This is god almighty's promise to man kind, grace alone, faith alone, christ alone.god can not lie! So the issue isn't what sin is worse than the other, the issue is the sin nature. I hope this helps an if you have any more questions feel free to ask.
You don't get your life straight before coming to Christ you come to Christ and he helps you to get your life straight. You don't have to be a perfect person (you can't) before coming to God you don't meet him he meets you where you are and then the Spirit convicts you and if you listen to that Conviction and change your life to be more Christ like and more fitting to what the Bible describes then you get to being a better person. The path to Salvation is through Christ alone and we have all sinned and we will all continue to sin but with salvation our sins are forgiven but that is not a license to sin. When you become saved you will work on your life.
Theistic evolution is refuted by the N.T. writers, the ancient Israelites, and Jesus Himself treating the creation account in Genesis as LITERAL history.
that boy ain't Christian.
Oh good! I finally found you. I've been looking for the person who decides who is and isn't a Christian, the one ordained to speak for God. 🙄
@@gregorya1179 should of found me sooner. i could of told you to just read the bible. best of luck in the future.
I'm going to become a nun
The bible is not univocal. This is its main problem among many ohers. Practically all moral problems that are being discussed nowadays can be answered differenty with the help of tge bible and are at bottom controversial. No one can harmonise the Jesus from the Sermon on the Mount with the Book of Revelation. Whether its violence,, abortion, sexuality, affluence, abortion, eating habits and many more issues. Tenthousands of conflicting denominations speak a clear language. Nothing is clear when it comes to what GOD wants from us and who is right😂 And Paul is a subject of its own. No one knows whether he isnt that false apostle the real apostle thought him to be, who really messed up Jesus morals. Just glad the two dont treat the bible like a valid science book as they used to in the Middle Ages. That would be even more absurd🎉 Unfortunately things are so much more complicated🍹
What I’ve seen Progressive Christianity isn’t Christianity at all
And we feel the same thing about you.
@@Yakon3Reborn and that is your problem.
It’s all about “ feelings” and that’s adolescent. The Bible says the heart is deceptively wicked, so emotional arguments are weak . Progressive Christians seem to embrace sin even gross perverted sin and call that virtue.
@@kennethdias9988 no it's not about feeling. It's about seeking truth. It's about breaking open the greek, searching after the true character of christ not just believing what your church has shoved down your throat. Also, I've led many people to christ, have dedicated my life to ministry, and I can garuntee you, I've made a change for the kingdom that isn't limited to hating progressives. Sooooooooo honestly, I'd rather continue to believe what I've done, which is real research and searching after God's heart. So honestly your words mean nothing to me. I know who I am in Christ. Your people will not shame me anymore.
@@kennethdias9988 your comment is just steaming with homophobia. "Gross"? You're undoubtedly referencing is affirming the lgbt. What's gross is your negligence for their souls. Enjoy your day, Caiaphas!
@@Yakon3Reborn I said nothing about LGBTQIA’s you assumed. That assumption says more about you than me. I’m glad you have preached the Gospel . Hopefully it’s the true Gospel because woe to those who preach a false Gospel. No one is more lost than that Trans person who shakes their fist at God and says “ You made a mistake I’m not a man I’m a woman “ or the reverse.
But God Loves that person so We are called to also but we don’t have to affirm their rebellion. I find the progressives more judgmental than conservative evangelicals.
And don’t forget the 60 million children sacrificed to the god of selfishness through abortion.
Very interesting, I think one point that Bobby ignores is that to the ancient Israelites there was no division amongst the laws. They did not see some as the dietary and some as moral, but rather they were all the law and you followed all, or faced the consequences for it.
According to the ancient Israelites they did make distinctions between Dietary, Civil and Moral Law.
Just as today there is a distinction between Civil Law and Criminal Law.
They are both "the law" but they are distinct from one another.
Because Isreal was a Theocracy the Dietary law is included.
You mean the laws that says to marry your rapist? I'm sure glad God changes
Hey I'm moving from California to North Carolina in a month
I like the idea of the progressive Christianity movement and if it gains a foothold Christianity will evolve as it has always evolved over 2000 years. If you think it has not evolved then you need to study Church history. Some people think they are holding the original 1611 KJV bible in their hands when their KJV bible was changed until the 1800s. I was reading the preface of my Oxford annotated bible and some people actually believe the KJV version was the original manuscript for the bible. I about fell of my chair about that.
KJV is the perfect bible, it has no copyright . No one owns it
@@rapturewatch353 Just because the KJV has no copywrite does not mean it is perfect. What about Rogers and Tyndale bible, the first handwritten bible into English was written in 1380 by John Wycliff. in 1496 John Colet Started to take the Greek NT and translated into English for his students. William Tyndale was the first man to ever print the NT in the English language. _"Having God's Word available to the public in the language of the common man, English, would have meant disaster to the church. No longer would they control access to the scriptures. If people were able to read the Bible in their own tongue, the church's income and power would crumble."_ Myles Coverdale finished translating the old testament and in 1535 he printed the first complete bible in the English language.
There were bibles printed before the KJV. Perhaps this history of the English bible will be of interest to you.
greatsite.com/timeline-english-bible-history/
God doesn’t change. The world evolves and changes, God is the same yesterday, today and forever.
@@commonsensetruecrime9635 Yahwey or Jesus or el elyon?
Sean Mc Dowell is a really nice genuine guy. Colby Martin is a genuine nice guy also. I think Christianity will evolve like it always has for 2000 years.
God does not change he is the same yesterday today and tomorrow
@@paulan7218 then why did he fry sodom and gomorrah and kill all of population only to die for everyone?
Christianity hasn't evolved, but something is happening that has happened for the last 2000 years. That is heretics try to apply the world to the word as opposed to the word to the world.
@@Yakon3Reborn he didn't die for everyone.
That's 101 my boy.
@@gp9616 Christianity has evolved that is why it has lasted so long what do you think happened in 1517 a full thousand and a half years later.
.
If you can’t say anything good....,
@@jmdsservantofgod8405 this is an alg boost attempt, to help boost this video
ummm as someone who was raised in the church, being bisexual doesn't mean that you want a polyamorous relationship? you really misrepresented LGBTQ+ people in here. and the fact that your first sentiment about them was more focused on the church not being at fault and us being, wrong, and how not "all" christians treat them that way and how most of your friends would be loving towards us really has me upset. the worst things ive ever heard about myself have come from the pulpit and from, "Well meaning," christians. I encourage you to hear more lgbtq stories and to research the actual word that Christians think means homosexuality, (arsensoki and malokoia.) there are soooo many versions eluding this words to rape or pedophilia. the word homosexual wasn't even added to the Bible until 1946! anyway
- love a very hurt lgbtq member whose been continously hurt by mistranslated theology.
Sweetie, you're never gonna find someone who respects you, your identity, and who you are in Christ if you're looking at conservative christians. Check out God is grey, it's a great community where you won't be attacked constantly.
@@Yakon3Reborn you're so right, and I totally have :) I love God is grey and definitely have found more empathy, love, and grace, in those types of circles :) Thank you so much for being so positive!
@@Aviebaybe He said they'd know us by our love for each other, it's our job to show that!
Relationship bi to relationship poly to relationship with kid? that last leap is a big one. The big thing is consent and kids cannot give consent.
Yes kids cannot give consent to whether or not they want straight parents.
'kids can't give consent' is always used. But at what age is someone all of a suddenly able to give consent? Surely that's subjective? I've known 10 year olds with more maturity and solid grounding than some 20 year olds...
“Kids cannot give consent” is a concept that is quickly dissipating.
@@angeleyes3386 If kids cannot get earrings without consent why invasive surgical procedures?
"Discarding what I don´t like, and taking what I like" is a blame thrown on progressives. Personally that is from my own perspective as a progressive a misrepresentation and a misunderstanding. First question, how is it with conservatives, that ignore some bible passages, like stoning people in the OT, but being very keen on not accepting homosexuality. Isn´t that the "the same" pick what suites you? Or not going so harsh on divorce, but full on against homosexuality.
* Now from my view, I don´t start by thinking how to discard what I don´t like and take what I like. I started by WANTING TO KNOW THE TRUTH. If Jesus did not exist, I would want to KNOW, If Jesus is God, I want to KNOW, if Jesus was the second son of God, I wanted to KNOW. The truth mattered, not a "false" preposition.
By checking what was said, and learning more, being able to critically evaluate data, to fight with my prepositions, my earlier beliefs, was not an easy task. But I wanted to be honest, and find the truth.
* Progressive Christianity is NOT a belief system including certain dogmas. It is more an insight, into the fact, that some things what to many of us was said to be the truth, were not the truth. I would claim that many progressives do not claim or know the EXACT CORRECT BELIEFS... in other words, we can have different personal opinions about details.
To take an image: We are on big ship over the Atlantic... some Conservatives say we should continue as before, dine as we did one hour ago. Other say, there´s something wrong, the ship slowed down, and it feels like it´s tilting a little. The conservatives say, just sit down and eat with us, we have always eaten together as a big family, don´t start making things up, don´t you hear, the band is playing the same old tunes, just relax. Other have started to question, and some heard rumors about an iceberg and a collision. Those are just the "new" afraid people, who don´t trust this gigantic ship.
- When one realizes that something bad happened on Titanic, one may not exactly know how to react, but one knows, that the Conservatives claims, just sit down and eat as before, and the band is still playing are NOT the answers of how to proceed.
When a conservative says about us "they are just trying to create panic" we know that is NOT what we try to do. In the same way, i don´t recognize the idea (mantra) spread about us that we look for possibilities to sin (create panic).
From the table where they sit, and don´t realize the changes, it might FEEL we create panic, but that is a very subjective view.
When one realize for example that the bible has errors (in opposition to what someone tried to teach), and one then sees how people twist and turn (lie) to try to defend that position, then one knows, that their claim is false.... what else may be false? Their conclusions about many things!
Again, I do not always know what exactly to believe of some certain matter, should one get into a small boat, try to find a life jacket, speak with the captain, help others.... if I do that, conservatives blame me of trying to be a social justice warrior.
Today, some people start to leave the table, and those sitting in it becomes nervous. Could the boat be sinking? Of course not, we have apologists who say this ship is unsinkable! It is sad that our younger people question our eating traditions, and move away from us... and those bad bad "new" people who cause all this chaos...
Well that´s how i personally see the situation.
You also in this video question (what if we open Pandora´s box and allow for Polygamy)? Ok, let´s check that.... In the OT polygamy was OK (Abraham, Jacob, David....) .... never sanctioned or in any way condemned by God! It is never condemned in the bible.... so why do you condemn it now? As I suppose God´s not changing opinions? The "funny" things is that you are afraid that progressives would be so evil that they would allow for polygamy, while God allows it - the ultimately good itself. SRY guys, God was meeting them "IN THEIR CULTURE" - the thing you blame progressives to do! No, certainly NO... it´s like saying God compromised with sin, so that they later, hopefully wouldn´t sin with that... it´s not at all consistent with how God acted in the OT according to the writers.
All those words, feelings and opinions and not one bit of biblical truth.
You may have your opinion, but just stating like "you are wrong" without any arguments is not much of an input. A lot of people get angry when one question phrases that have been established by the years, but they seldom give logical arguments for their opinions - just the "you are wrong" type.
Earrings on a man.... progressive Christianity???
What does that even mean?
*gauges*
Grace is good for only certain believers..... the ones in the conservative section
Who are sinners saved by His grace demonstrated by Jesus suffering and dying on the cross for our sins.
YEP!!!!!!! THATS ALL THEY ARE. GATEKEEPING CHRISTIANITY SO PEOPLE UNLIKE THEM CANT GET IN. BIG SURPRISE WHEN THEY END UP IN HELL FOR ALL THE HATE IN THEIR HEARTS.
They did an autopsy on 100 conservatives and couldn’t find any hearts
@A Girl Named Billie i would love to meet the two morons who raised you... let me guess the apple didnt fall off the tree?
And they autopsied 100 progressives and found they had no brain
@@paulan7218 God looks at the heart!
These comments are insane. I feel like no one here even cares to see how Jesus would see the LGBT community.. he healed a leper, an adulterer, murderers… this seems to be a very unloving and unchirst like conversation. Sorry 🤷🏼♂️
So you're putting them on the level of an adulterer or murderer? Clearly there are degrees of harm caused by sin.
But even to go with your point...he healed the leper. He told adulterers to cease their adultery. He told murderers to stop murdering. In no case to did his compassion ever lead to permissiveness. I remember the first time I read the Bible all the way through as a teen I was shocked at how blunt Jesus actually was. I'd thought he was more just about love. But there was a tension between love and truth.
@@tayh.6235 I agree with your point. Jesus never left people continue in their sin. He told them to go and sin no more. Truly loving someone is showing them that We have all sinned and that God desires for us to live holy lives. Turning from our sin and following after God, because sin separates us from God.
@@dramageek1092 yes. Sin actually keeps us from being fully the selves we were created to be in God's image. God's not trying to throw off our groove because he's a meanie.
@@tayh.6235 no I’m not putting them on that level at all.. I’m just saying that so we not think that the LGBT community has been hearing about Christ and what the Bible says about homosexuality?? They know what it says but unloving Christians have told them they are going to hell for how they feel. I’ve been told since I was a child that if you are gay or kill yourself then you are going to hell regardless of if you are a Christian.. which is not true. Very rarely have I seen Christians choose to love people in that community.. so why would anyone wanna turn from those ways if all they hear is hate? That’s all I was saying. Jesus still loves people even if they don’t choose to turn from their sins
@@jeffreykitchens7083 in your opinion what does loving the lgbtq+ look like. This is an honest question. Not rhetorical or smart.
Colby is more of a Christian than either of you will ever be.
LOL
Not according to the Bible but I’m pretty sure that you’ve never read it
@@paulan7218 I've read it front to back on 3 different translations.
Amen
@@paulan7218 hey paula explain to me the greek translation of homosexuality in the new testameny