One thing I would like to point out is only a certain part of the bike is used for ground effect, which is the one closer to the bottom of the bike. You might have noticed that MotoGP riders take some very extreme positions nowadays by not just dragging the elbows but also the shoulders. The upper winglets aren't there to create any sort of ground effect or diffuser effect. Those winglets act like small versions of F1 front wings and rear wings. The reason why they are angled slightly is exactly for cornering. They were initially used mostly to keep the bike on the ground when braking and accelerating, hence why the Ducatis from 2019 had flat winglets. However, they were angled so that, when cornering, the winglets on the outside of the bike would create vertical downforce. The problem with the winglets on the inside is they would create downforce to the side, which only reduces grip. The way engineers have countered this is by making riders get into such extreme positions that the winglets' airflow is blocked. It's crazy how much engineering goes into MotoGP for a few tenths. For reference, if you're cornering left, the bottom left winglets are creating ground effect while the ones on the bottom right aren't doing anything because ground effect can only create a low pressure when there is a surface nearby. The top right side of the bike is instead pushing the bike down by having air pushed against it, like a front wing. The top left side of the bike isn't doing anything because the riders are blocking the winglets.
The biggest reason riders can lean so much has more to do with tire technology and todays rubber compounds, not just aero. It’s a combination of both the tires today are incredible as well.
It's nearly impossible cause in the last 5 year motogp developed a lot of things, not only aerodynamics. But they get faster every year, with perfect track condition they are 2 seconds faster then 2014, dependance also on the lenght of the track.
That is simple check the lap record of 2018 when both Yamaha & Honda were still fast without any Aero on their bikes. Then compare it today's current record & full race time on every track. There you go.
just saw the thumbnail, and knew what it was about, these videos are 10 min long for no reason, it's venturi tunnels that MotoGP ""coppied"" from F1 (the effect is well known, so they'd come up with it, with or without F1)
In fact, this example of the paper lifting is wrong, it really gives an idea of how the solo effect works, but it is not the solo effect that acts in this example, but the coanda effect. This is because the ground effect only works in closed systems, in addition, when we blow, the air that comes out of our mouth is almost instantly returning to the standard pressure of the environment, which would not generate enough force for the paper to actually lift. this strength is almost non-existent. the effect that is occurring in the example in the paper is the Coanda effect, which says that a fluid has the tendency to follow the shape of the surface that the same fluid is on, therefore, the air (which is our fluid in this example) follows the curve that the paper is making, generating a downward force, and as every force exerted in one direction ends up having another force of the same intensity in the opposite direction (law of action and reaction), at the end of all this the paper ends up lifting. Edit: I apologize for my bad English, I'm taking an English course and I'm trying to use the translator as little as possible in these cases.
Yes, I'm sure Alpinestar & Dainese will lead the development. I will be more interested if some huge apparel companies like Under Armour, Nike or anyone will enter the Motorcycle suit & gear stuff. Like Puma that also do race driver shoes.
@@dayleashleynolasco5765 Unde armor and nike etc arent developing anything, or they would have"developed" shoes that have foot shape. They are marketing companies
The bike has more forces in play than a car. Firstly in the corner the bike is lean so the suspensions dont work vertically to the ground. The rider has to balance the various forces, and introducing a force what will push the bike on the ground can cause the bike to fall down. Infact many crashes lately are caused also by aero. Another danger is that the wind may change the effect of the wings
For the record, MotoGP didn’t copy anything from Formula1…. Teams like Aprilia and KTM literally hired Formula 1 engineers to design aero for their bikes. This is why you see wings and canard style designs on GP bikes now. Aprilia’s rear sub frame design is specifically Formula 1 derived and looks completely different than any other bike and provides excellent downforce. So when you say copied it’s more like adopted via using F1 engineers to apply their experience on motorcycles.
What I want to see is for the MotoGP engineers to look for a gray area & have an even more better concept in 2027 to what they currently have now. Not just a continuation & a slight change like the ones Ducati use & copied by KTM as well as Honda.
WoW I’ve been a race fan for over 30yrs & F1 had always been my favourite not cos of the racing but the technology that went into making them so fast ground effect was before my time in F1 but I learned a lot about it & would never of thought it could be possible on a bike but I’ve missed MotoGP qualifying today cos all I’ve been watching is how close those tunnels are getting to the ground & yes your right & it’s amazing WoW again the technology on these bikes today are amazing & thanks for pointing it out plus you can see on the 24 Ducati has a better tunnel than the 23 Gresini bike!!!great vid’s well done 👍
I think Aragon was simply a bit of a one off. The track levelled the playing field and when it's back to tracks with more grip. The GP24's are going to be a fair bit ahead again. We'll see though!
He literally explained that it was banned and then unbanned in the video. It was banned for 40 years and only recently unbanned. He says that in the video and since I watch more f1 than motogp I can confirm this is accurate.
Downforce pulling the bike down at the top of the bike... LMAO! Shut up. The video clips is explaining the bike fairings have enough clearance, like they always have...
I always appreciate constructive feedback....but simply berating someone is not the best way to go about it. I've done research, and am trying to improve on every video. If you aren't going to say anything constructive, best not to say anything at all.
One thing I would like to point out is only a certain part of the bike is used for ground effect, which is the one closer to the bottom of the bike. You might have noticed that MotoGP riders take some very extreme positions nowadays by not just dragging the elbows but also the shoulders.
The upper winglets aren't there to create any sort of ground effect or diffuser effect. Those winglets act like small versions of F1 front wings and rear wings. The reason why they are angled slightly is exactly for cornering. They were initially used mostly to keep the bike on the ground when braking and accelerating, hence why the Ducatis from 2019 had flat winglets. However, they were angled so that, when cornering, the winglets on the outside of the bike would create vertical downforce. The problem with the winglets on the inside is they would create downforce to the side, which only reduces grip. The way engineers have countered this is by making riders get into such extreme positions that the winglets' airflow is blocked. It's crazy how much engineering goes into MotoGP for a few tenths.
For reference, if you're cornering left, the bottom left winglets are creating ground effect while the ones on the bottom right aren't doing anything because ground effect can only create a low pressure when there is a surface nearby. The top right side of the bike is instead pushing the bike down by having air pushed against it, like a front wing. The top left side of the bike isn't doing anything because the riders are blocking the winglets.
Well same also on 2024 SBK RIDERS.
The biggest reason riders can lean so much has more to do with tire technology and todays rubber compounds, not just aero. It’s a combination of both the tires today are incredible as well.
During my final year (bsc aerospace engineering) I did a project on ground effect vehicles, what you need to do is consult an aero engineer
P.S you don't understand ground force effect.
Pretty much....
Can we get numbers on how much faster are MotoGP with and without areo?
Good shout, would be interesting to see how much faster the bikes have gotten over time!
Prob not possible, but they routinely broke records on every track after they were introduced
@@absolutedan9173
I forget about this but motogp2 vs WSB is interesting to me.
It's nearly impossible cause in the last 5 year motogp developed a lot of things, not only aerodynamics. But they get faster every year, with perfect track condition they are 2 seconds faster then 2014, dependance also on the lenght of the track.
That is simple check the lap record of 2018 when both Yamaha & Honda were still fast without any Aero on their bikes. Then compare it today's current record & full race time on every track. There you go.
just saw the thumbnail, and knew what it was about, these videos are 10 min long for no reason, it's venturi tunnels that MotoGP ""coppied"" from F1 (the effect is well known, so they'd come up with it, with or without F1)
In fact, this example of the paper lifting is wrong, it really gives an idea of how the solo effect works, but it is not the solo effect that acts in this example, but the coanda effect. This is because the ground effect only works in closed systems, in addition, when we blow, the air that comes out of our mouth is almost instantly returning to the standard pressure of the environment, which would not generate enough force for the paper to actually lift. this strength is almost non-existent. the effect that is occurring in the example in the paper is the Coanda effect, which says that a fluid has the tendency to follow the shape of the surface that the same fluid is on, therefore, the air (which is our fluid in this example) follows the curve that the paper is making, generating a downward force, and as every force exerted in one direction ends up having another force of the same intensity in the opposite direction (law of action and reaction), at the end of all this the paper ends up lifting.
Edit: I apologize for my bad English, I'm taking an English course and I'm trying to use the translator as little as possible in these cases.
Commenting for the algorithmCommenting for the algorithm
Wut
Will we see aero developpment on the riders suit one day?
You never know!
Yes, I'm sure Alpinestar & Dainese will lead the development. I will be more interested if some huge apparel companies like Under Armour, Nike or anyone will enter the Motorcycle suit & gear stuff.
Like Puma that also do race driver shoes.
@@dayleashleynolasco5765 Unde armor and nike etc arent developing anything, or they would have"developed" shoes that have foot shape. They are marketing companies
The hump is aero…..Aleix Espargo was testing something on his suit. But can’t for the life of me remember at the moment.
The bike has more forces in play than a car. Firstly in the corner the bike is lean so the suspensions dont work vertically to the ground. The rider has to balance the various forces, and introducing a force what will push the bike on the ground can cause the bike to fall down. Infact many crashes lately are caused also by aero.
Another danger is that the wind may change the effect of the wings
For the record, MotoGP didn’t copy anything from Formula1….
Teams like Aprilia and KTM literally hired Formula 1 engineers to design aero for their bikes.
This is why you see wings and canard style designs on GP bikes now.
Aprilia’s rear sub frame design is specifically Formula 1 derived and looks completely different than any other bike and provides excellent downforce.
So when you say copied it’s more like adopted via using F1 engineers to apply their experience on motorcycles.
Given MOTOGP has RHD, maybe we'll see a version of ERS/KERS in the future of MOTOGP potentially?
That would be certainly...interesting :D
What I want to see is for the MotoGP engineers to look for a gray area & have an even more better concept in 2027 to what they currently have now. Not just a continuation & a slight change like the ones Ducati use & copied by KTM as well as Honda.
More better
WoW I’ve been a race fan for over 30yrs & F1 had always been my favourite not cos of the racing but the technology that went into making them so fast ground effect was before my time in F1 but I learned a lot about it & would never of thought it could be possible on a bike but I’ve missed MotoGP qualifying today cos all I’ve been watching is how close those tunnels are getting to the ground & yes your right & it’s amazing WoW again the technology on these bikes today are amazing & thanks for pointing it out plus you can see on the 24 Ducati has a better tunnel than the 23 Gresini bike!!!great vid’s well done 👍
I noticed in motogp racing at the first start of race they loward the bike for first start 😅😅
You can create horizontal ground effect by being very close to another vehicle.
I hope MotoGP back to its old bikes (no aero requirements) on 2028 season
early dan please notice me what on your toughts about marc might be winning here in misano again?
I think Aragon was simply a bit of a one off. The track levelled the playing field and when it's back to tracks with more grip. The GP24's are going to be a fair bit ahead again. We'll see though!
@@absolutedan9173Oh well
I miss Suzuki in Moto go
C'mon !! You're not a school kid ! Wear your cap properly !?
that is not ground effect. I have to say it but a lot of videos are wrong... please do more research
Its not banned in F1...
have you ever watched F1? the cars are built around a ground effect venturi floor... wtf are you on about?
Ground effect was reintroduced with the 2022 regulations, up until then, it was banned. Also, I greatly enjoy these videos, keep up the awesome work!
He literally explained that it was banned and then unbanned in the video. It was banned for 40 years and only recently unbanned. He says that in the video and since I watch more f1 than motogp I can confirm this is accurate.
Thanks Mark!
Where is Rosi mouth now? Didn't he hate TC so much in 2013? What now? Why is a champion rider on a jet fighter motorcycle safe from Rosi propaganda?
Downforce pulling the bike down at the top of the bike... LMAO! Shut up. The video clips is explaining the bike fairings have enough clearance, like they always have...
I always appreciate constructive feedback....but simply berating someone is not the best way to go about it. I've done research, and am trying to improve on every video. If you aren't going to say anything constructive, best not to say anything at all.