It seems that we learned a lot about TF2 in this video, such as that: -A player can take no damage when not invulnerable -A wooden bat is considered a bullet when swung in a specific way -And the Warrior Spirit/Buffalo Steak Sandwich Heavy set is still terrible
You forgot that a Scout can do 175 (525 crit, etc) to a Pyro with a melee, if wearing the Isolationist set & the Pyro is wearing the Isolated Merc set.
Fun fact: the reason valve made the strength powerup not affect crits is because of solarlights video titled "If i die, the video ends" and he actually made the game he was in unfun to play because he would come out of nowhere and one shot you.
You that like in deserved to be nerfed when the reality of in mannpower everything being intentionally stronger Scout can one shot 8 of the nine classes with his primary in mannpower with strength and somehow someone doing it with melee, in a mode where everybody is flying around off the ground, is overpowered
I'm just imagining a bullet doing zero damage, and the spy is acting all dramatic and writhing on the floor, like "I'M HIT, I"M HIT! THE PAIN, IT'S UNBEARABLE!!"
Wow, that was pretty insane to see a Buffalo Steak Heavy take that much damage. But then again when hasn’t that set been pretty bad?! And wow! So the taunt kills do count as a different damage type! I could swear I had a Heavy survive a taunt kill before with a vacc shield, and it turns out that was true! Just goes to show that blunt force weapons will always do more up close damage than a shotgun, doomsday preppers take notes. Love the new vid SquimJimiJam. And happy to work on the thumbnail for you! Was a really fun and interesting change of pace :3
if a Single stat should be added to make the Steak better. the Steak could give you 400HP that can overheal Dalokosh bar style, that would make it better since 450HP with 20% damage vulnerability is more survivable then 300HP with 20% damage vulnerability for melee only mode that lasts for 16 seconds. now, if the Steak also gave 15HP on hit and 25HP on kill and both can overheal to 60HP or small health kit equivalent that would make it better and would even combo with all the other melees better. the Warrior's Spirit aka Bear Claws simple fix would be lowering the damage vulnerability from 30% to 15%, and then the 30% extra damage is 30% less for 30% faster swing speed, no random crits for minicrits are crits, 10HP on hit and 50HP on kill that can stack up to 60HP overheal and can steak with the Steak. Brass Beast simple fix is the removal of the rev up penalty. so now you have a slow to start up but good escape denier in the Natasha and a good Stand your ground slow to move Brass Beast.
@@supermudkipz I mean sure, but it is put there for a reason. which was probably that getting more speed and minicrits was a good thing so they offset it with melee only and damage vulnerability? While I do agree that removing the damage vulnerability could work, then it would be just bland steak, so adding some seasoning with at least a Dalokosh bar type overheal would be great.
When it comes to damage calculations tf2 will always usually round down. That’s why the scattergun is SUPPOSED to do 105 damage but since it isn’t a whole number (about 104.8) it will round down to 104
6*1.75*10 is 105 if i recall correctly, thank to collision boxes, there's still a small distance that makes you don't achieve max ramp-up (in csgo happened something similar with some iteration of the aug afaik) maybe when no clipping inside the enemy, you can achieve the 105 shot
if the Shove was a 15 damage attack with SHOVE HIT & KILL marks in the killfeed, that would at least make it a good meme kill weapon instead of the measly 1 damage it has. if the Shove was a Core class Scout ability on mouse 3(the old fall damage negation stat of the PBPP could be a crouch when falling to negate damage sort of core class passive) that would be one with a 15 base damage with SHOVE HIT& KILL in the kill feed, airborne attack would be a Kick that does 100% more damage, meaning 30 damage while airborne with KICK HIT & KILL in the killfeed and both the Shove and Kick have ", no random crits, minicrits are crits" stats which means 15 *3 for 45 SHOVE HIT and 30*3 for 90 KICK HIT. what do you think of this? and of course improvements for the shortstop.
Fun fact: The mannpower update happened because solarlight went on a massive 84 killstreak with the strength powerup as demoknight and pissed off the valve employees (maybe)
The best explanation for the 105 dmg and 104 dmg issue is that the distance is calculated looking for you to be literally in the middle of the hitbox to get the 175% increase, but due to player collision it is not possible. Maybe if collision was off and you were inside the enemy, you would reach max damage scaling relative to distance? (Note, I commented this on the second mention of the issue, so if it was addressed later on, ignore my comment.)
I think the explanation for the full ramp-up doing 104 damage instead of 105 is that there is a very _very_ slight distance between you and the heavy. To get the full 105 you would have to be _inside_ the heavy, which is impossible in normal gameplay.
the 104 357 damage stuff might have to do something with the fact that even when ure standing right in front of someone ure still 0.005 hammer units away or some shit like that
For those who didn't know: the steak will give user "mark for death" effect which make the target take mini crit from normal attack. If you had crit, the mini crit from "Mark for death" will be ignore. Also the steak not fully make the user take 50% damage like a normal mini crit although the effect suppose to be (I'm pretty sure this was make for the sub-class boxing Heavy not as weak) but it's still be overwrite by the crit effect.
I seem to remember that the max resistance is actually higher since the backup has an additional resistance explicitly to sentry fire. Not relevant to scout but the demomam shooting the spy was labeled as the highest possible resistance when iirc that's not technically accurate.
At about 16:50 i heard infinity mijinion and mistakenly thought "what dont use the final countdown youll get copyright struck" until a moment later i realized what the song actually was. always nice to hear megaman music in your videos, love it.
another interesting fact about damage types is that the shield bash from a demoknight's charge is classified as bullet damage. makes me think that they just lumped everything that they couldn't immediately decide on into "bullet" and forgot about it later.
I have noticed the same bug with the wrap. My one guess is it’s bugged and still uses random damage spread. For those that don’t know RDS was a old mechanic that would make you either do up to (I think but I’m not sure) 20% more or less damage. Pipes from a demo could do 80 or 105 or 95 or 98. It was random whether or not people would survive on one hp
4:16 You made me P a n i k, I instantly rewinded the video It's like this dog video that I saw when some dude was reciting his shopping list to his retired police dog, and then he says "Cocaine" to the dog and it turns it's neck and stares at the dude
the reason why the wrap assasin ball does inconsistent damage is because (at least I think) it creates a small explosion, an that means the max damage could by increased by multiple enemies
The damage calculation is probably due to a float-to-integer conversion. Source was created with and uses c++. doing said calculation @4:56 floors the value to 368. It is less data to use ints 4bytes versus a float which normally is 1 integer with a 7 decimal precision after. (E.g. 3.1234567). Its also less math in the future because no one was to see their health bar at 120.3320819.
I think when damage calculation results in a decimal in TF2, the number always rounds down to the closest integer, no matter what the decimal number is.
Im my oppinion the most broken weapons ingame despite their damage are shotguns, because you can either take 6-18 damage, *or you can get buttfucked by a bazillion damage by that one lime/pink scout that manages to not miss any pellets from his scattergun*
So basically the highest possible damage the Scout can do is basically just an accurate depiction on what would happen if you got shot in the face with a Shotgun
I may have a theory for the random amounts of damage the christmas ornament deals: Its the pieces of it when it breaks that deal the damage most of the damage and not the ornament itself. Think about it, if it were to bust open on someones head, the pieces would go flying everywhere randomly, which means a random about of pieces be stuck inside their head. The whole base of this theory is the fact that you can damage yourself with the ornament if you throw it into a wall right infront of your face.
Fun fact in regards of low scout damage, the shortstop shove does 1 whole damage to any victim you shove. However, it does not show any damage marker when you hit a person nor does it increase the damage dealt stat tracker on the tab menu.
If the number has a fractional component, such as 104.7, it will be discarded. A result of 104 in that case. Even if you would have dealt 99.999 damage, it comes out as just 99 damage, not 100. Sometimes this can happen multiple times from various multipliers before a final result is reached.
A possible reason why the pistol (among other weapons) are capable of doing 0 damage is because .3 is closer to 0.0 when rounding while something like 0.5 is closer to 1 when rounding. Of course I could be wrong but it’s very possible. Edit: granted .5 is just as close to 0 than it is to 1 but the numbers before probably are also taken into account.
I might have an idea about total damage being always slightly off than calculated damage. In programming, it's always easier to work with integers than floating points (rational numbers). But fractional multiplications commonly result in rational numbers, so whenever we don't need the absolute exact number, we can just convert a floating point to an integer, essentially throwing away the decimal part. This also makes sure that dealt damage always amounts to exactly what is displayed, but it can have side effects. Now, I haven't seen TF2 source code, but my guess is every damage multiplication is done one by one, with conversion to integer in-between them. Some damage buffs and debuffs you talk about in this video are most definitely fractional multiplications, and if you assume we lose all of the decimal part every multiplication, the missing 1 to 2 damage adds up.
you forgot to make note of the shortstop's shove for the lowest damage!!! it literally does 1 damage to the enemy, except it doesn't even credit the damage to you
I think the steak+warriors spirit combo ignoring crits is due to how the vulnerability is handled, because I think it applies the vulnerability as a mini-crit damage like marked for death, but that might be hard coded to be overridden by crits and not doubled with regular mini crits
In terms of least damage, what about the grappling hook? It deals a base damage of 5 when it hits an enemy. Paired with those resistances, it should come out even lower than the Fan-O-War.
4:55 I think in the event of a decimal, TF2 will always round it DOWN to the nearest whole value. That's my guess as to why 368.55 is interpreted as 367.
awesome video, really really interesting stuff! ive been an avid fan for a while and the production value on this channel really amazing, can clearly tell how much goes into this. keep on keeping on man ur content is awesome :]
To answer your question about scouts scattergun ramp up, he can do 105 in 1 hit but you need to be literally inside of them. Most of the time because tf2 rounds down you will be getting 104. But I get 105 damage shots semi frequently in mge especially and they’re juicy.
5:10 the reason why the damage numbers is less than you estimated here, is that tf2 floors (or rounds down) any decimal in the calculation, regardless of if it’s still calculating, or the final number. So basically what tf2 does is: 6 x 10 = 60 60 x 1.75 = 105 105 x 2 = 210 210 x 1.35 = 283.5 283 x 1.3 = 367.9 the final number is floored too, resulting in 367 damage rather than the estimated 368.55
Scout does 104 damage with the scattergun at “point blank” because damage fall-off calculates using the hammer-unit distance between each player’s position; the position is at the *center* of your hit box. This means that, although you’re literally touching the heavy, the distance from the center of each player’s hit box to the edge of their hit box is the effective “range” used in the calculation, which just so happens to math-out to 104 damage for the scattergun. This *does* mean that, if you managed to abuse some weird exploit or glitch to place the scout within the heavy’s hit box therefore bringing the players’ respective hit box centers closer, you could deal the gun’s full damage.
I'm still so happy to see more TFTubers still active, I'm not near as dedicated to the game, I cant play it 99% of the time because I physically can't. And I love it sooo much when I can. And I joined, I think 2 years ago? So, I think about 2019
4:56 This is likely just because how the code works. In most coding languages, integer calculations remove the decimals, for example 1/2 would not be 0.5 but would be 0, or 10x1.01would not be 10.1 but would be 10. I did the math and by the end the number would be 167.9 which would be turned into 367 at the end.
This is too much math, but I respect your commitment to it and the other videos. As for the bit in here about Scout's damage being slightly off... I think, though don't know for sure, that it may be due to the shotgun's natural spread and the way the pellets spawn from the gun. At point blank range, it should be doing 175% more due to the ramp-up, but the pellets aren't just in a ball together or right behind the other despite being an even 10 pellets. Which is something you can see just by hitting a wall; they all seem to be in an odd spread from each other and sometimes seem to even be missing a bullet hole, though that may just be a visual bug. Either way, I'd guess the ramp up becomes 174% for a few of them just because they spawn closer to Scout rather than the Heavy target; resulting in a very small fall off that messes with the calculation, if only slightly. ... Can't explain the wrap-assassin, though. But anywho, based on the other videos, all that may also be why some damage falls off with some weapons, but not with others, as the travel speed and your positioning is calculated from the spawned bullet or explosive. Notably the Demoman's Sticky Bomb only calculates the fall off damage based on where Demoman is when it explodes, rather than when or where it was fired, so long as 5 seconds haven't passed. But Bullets and Rockets are tracking where they were fired from to calculate the fall off, since they have to figure out where they explode when they hit something, rather than when the player presses a button. All of that is just speculation, though. I'm not a programmer and didn't bother testing any of it.
Hi The two points of damage lost are because the player's position is determined by a really small dot which is surrounded by the hitbox. Since the hitbox is bigger than the dot, two player's dots never get to touch under normal circumstances. Since the dots never touch, the distance between two players is never 0, again, under normal circumstances. Since the distance is never 0, the damage ramp up can never go all the way up even when hitboxes are colliding. Since damage ramp up can never go all the way up, real damage dealt will always be a little less than calculated when distance in calculations is 0.
The likeliest explanation for the 1-2 dmg missing is that you would have to be *inside* the enemies point of origin (Meaning at the center of his model, which is unreachable without commands or mods)
Those discrepancies in practical and calculated damage could come from Valve rounding their figures between each new factor, which would change the figures by 1 or 2 for each new calculation.
It seems that we learned a lot about TF2 in this video, such as that:
-A player can take no damage when not invulnerable
-A wooden bat is considered a bullet when swung in a specific way
-And the Warrior Spirit/Buffalo Steak Sandwich Heavy set is still terrible
But we learned the Warrior’s Spirit Buffalo Steak combo isn't QUITE as terrible as you'd think!
@@SquimJim Yet another win for the power of science! 🤪
-actually it's decent in Medieval Mode-
-not as good as steaKGB, but not terrible-
@@tonyf3431 why'd you type it like that?
@@gregorymirabella1423 I felt like my pedantry wouldn't be appreciated, so I wanted to indicate that it wasn't wholly sincere.
You forgot that a Scout can do 175 (525 crit, etc) to a Pyro with a melee, if wearing the Isolationist set & the Pyro is wearing the Isolated Merc set.
Youre right! That would have been fun to show.
Holy
@@SquimJim I was also wondering how much damage the Shortstop's shove would do
@@SquimJim wait those set effects still work?
Well it’s requires a SUPER SPECIFIC Senario for it to be pay to win
Fun fact: the reason valve made the strength powerup not affect crits is because of solarlights video titled "If i die, the video ends" and he actually made the game he was in unfun to play because he would come out of nowhere and one shot you.
It was terrifying lmao
Thanks solarlight
You that like in deserved to be nerfed when the reality of in mannpower everything being intentionally stronger
Scout can one shot 8 of the nine classes with his primary in mannpower with strength and somehow someone doing it with melee, in a mode where everybody is flying around off the ground, is overpowered
He got like 84 heads
Simply a superior gaming chair
I'm just imagining a bullet doing zero damage, and the spy is acting all dramatic and writhing on the floor, like "I'M HIT, I"M HIT! THE PAIN, IT'S UNBEARABLE!!"
*fake dies*
That's realistically what a dead ringer user would do lol
soccer
DOC IM DYIN HERE
Tyler Lackey
now it’s just
dead
4:24 That death sequence was great
5:37 another one for you
fun fact, the RPS taunt does a base damage of 999, if you win, meaning scout can go higher than 1755 dmg
1754>999 I was mistaken
@@duckton440 if the various damage increasing effects apply to the RPS taunt, it probably will deal more damage.
@@duckton440 BASE damage.
Wouldnt that mean that every class can do that?
@@reichertmatias2994 yes.
Squimjim has a brilliant way of answering questions I had no idea I wanted the answer to.
They’re mildly interesting
Wow, that was pretty insane to see a Buffalo Steak Heavy take that much damage. But then again when hasn’t that set been pretty bad?! And wow! So the taunt kills do count as a different damage type! I could swear I had a Heavy survive a taunt kill before with a vacc shield, and it turns out that was true! Just goes to show that blunt force weapons will always do more up close damage than a shotgun, doomsday preppers take notes. Love the new vid SquimJimiJam. And happy to work on the thumbnail for you! Was a really fun and interesting change of pace :3
It’s not just insane, it’s absurd. I just wanna punch people man.
if a Single stat should be added to make the Steak better. the Steak could give you 400HP that can overheal Dalokosh bar style, that would make it better since 450HP with 20% damage vulnerability is more survivable then 300HP with 20% damage vulnerability for melee only mode that lasts for 16 seconds.
now, if the Steak also gave 15HP on hit and 25HP on kill and both can overheal to 60HP or small health kit equivalent that would make it better and would even combo with all the other melees better.
the Warrior's Spirit aka Bear Claws simple fix would be lowering the damage vulnerability from 30% to 15%, and then the 30% extra damage is 30% less for 30% faster swing speed, no random crits for minicrits are crits, 10HP on hit and 50HP on kill that can stack up to 60HP overheal and can steak with the Steak.
Brass Beast simple fix is the removal of the rev up penalty. so now you have a slow to start up but good escape denier in the Natasha and a good Stand your ground slow to move Brass Beast.
@@drivanradosivic1357 OR You could just remove the damage vulnerability?
@@supermudkipz I mean sure, but it is put there for a reason. which was probably that getting more speed and minicrits was a good thing so they offset it with melee only and damage vulnerability?
While I do agree that removing the damage vulnerability could work, then it would be just bland steak, so adding some seasoning with at least a Dalokosh bar type overheal would be great.
I just signed up for Skillshare but didn't use your link out of spite! Congrats on securing the bag
I'm about to sign you up for KILLshare!!!
@@SquimJim *Punch Out theme plays*
@@SquimJim FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT
@@SquimJim Why do I hear boss music? (Megalovania plays)
@@kermitthesuperluigifan3938 sans note
“Strength and crits don’t stack anymore”
Yeah... I wonder why they did that
*Coughs in Solarlight*
LMFAO
Goddamn-
*Demoknight TF2*
-'s always nerfing things down by wrecking everything while screaming....
I like how heavy has always a sad face when he's being tested for damage, it's like he is being abused
@@d9gepro2 LIKE!?!?!
@@d9gepro2
He's literally lined up for execution. You'd probably have a sad face in that situation too
I already know the lowest damage, The Shortstop shove.
I found out today that the Shortstop's shove won't push Snipers using the Cozy Camper
@@Dog-999i That's actually very interesting.
@@Dog-999i doesn't that reduce knockback now?
yea he kinda forgot that
Also, the shortstop shove does exactly 1 Damage, which is more than 0.
I just realized that heavys facial expressions change from angry to sad when at low health
every of them do, but i couldn't find any videos about it
If I remember correctly, the last hit from the gunslingers taunt was classified as explosive damage, probably to cause the gibs.
That could mean you can possibly not ko with the gunslinger taunt.
When it comes to damage calculations tf2 will always usually round down. That’s why the scattergun is SUPPOSED to do 105 damage but since it isn’t a whole number (about 104.8) it will round down to 104
And the ornament explosion does a random amount of damage on top of the impact damage (I think the max is 35 damage from the explosion?)
6*1.75*10 is 105
if i recall correctly, thank to collision boxes, there's still a small distance that makes you don't achieve max ramp-up (in csgo happened something similar with some iteration of the aug afaik)
maybe when no clipping inside the enemy, you can achieve the 105 shot
the way my name was spoken has me worried. AM i even vinegar? is my name a lie to who i am?? am i having an existential crisis????
Well you PROBABLY are Vinegar but how can I know for sure?
i don’t know either!
YOU ARE *P R O B A B L Y* VINEGAR
THAT VINEGAR IS A SPY
@@Cbrmkn98xs THAT SPY IS A VINEGAR!
everyone gangsta until he tries to find Sniper's max damage
Why?
6
Why?
3:54 thank solarlight for that lmao
Yea and his 84 KS
it's actually really interesting that it's possible to deal 0 damage lol
THE BRICK
That brick's a bloody spy
With the shortstop scout can do 1% damage to a player when he push someone
I assume the percent is a typo.
if the Shove was a 15 damage attack with SHOVE HIT & KILL marks in the killfeed, that would at least make it a good meme kill weapon instead of the measly 1 damage it has.
if the Shove was a Core class Scout ability on mouse 3(the old fall damage negation stat of the PBPP could be a crouch when falling to negate damage sort of core class passive) that would be one with a 15 base damage with SHOVE HIT& KILL in the kill feed, airborne attack would be a Kick that does 100% more damage, meaning 30 damage while airborne with KICK HIT & KILL in the killfeed and both the Shove and Kick have ", no random crits, minicrits are crits" stats which means 15 *3 for 45 SHOVE HIT and 30*3 for 90 KICK HIT.
what do you think of this?
and of course improvements for the shortstop.
@@drivanradosivic1357 that must be a long wast of your life tipeing
@@ebonytherussiafan2808 no, it was actually quite fun, got the creative juices flowing.
anyway, thoughts on that?
1:37
Holy crap... The heavy started looking sad as he got injured. Has that always been a thing?
Yes, likewise many other classes emote during the course of the game as they do things
I noticed that too!
Always had been. 🔫
Yes
Heavy: The entire team! Is baby!
Also heavy:
Local Man Shatters Russian Man's Entire Skeleton With A Bat
*local man child
*Florida man
*Bostonian Boy
Fun fact: The mannpower update happened because solarlight went on a massive 84 killstreak with the strength powerup as demoknight and pissed off the valve employees (maybe)
So in other words a player made the game unfun to play so valve actually rebalanced their fucking game
I just noticed the heavy, probably all classes with a face, has a more sadder face when they're on low health.
Are we going to ignore how sad heavy was during this experiment :(?
NICE HUSSLE TONS-O-FUN, NEXT TIME EAT A SALAD ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
*Screams in POOTIS*
I know the face he makes on low health made me genuinely so sad, glad someone else noticed:(
"Should Scout be able to one shot a Heavy?"
6s players: Yes, actually.
I love how much obscenely obscure information you managed to find by trying to make a pretty fun and innocuous video.
The best explanation for the 105 dmg and 104 dmg issue is that the distance is calculated looking for you to be literally in the middle of the hitbox to get the 175% increase, but due to player collision it is not possible. Maybe if collision was off and you were inside the enemy, you would reach max damage scaling relative to distance? (Note, I commented this on the second mention of the issue, so if it was addressed later on, ignore my comment.)
If you no clip into an enemy and shoot it will do 105
@@cyruscheng499 Yeah, that proves it, then. Thank you.
The real question is, Would this said damage kill me?
ua-cam.com/video/SjG99OLFNmg/v-deo.html
Depends on what damage type, emotional?
You're ugly
@@lef8282 okay so genetics didn’t do me a favor who really cares?Still bleed red as everybody
Physically, maybe. Emotionally, absolutely
4:03 Solarlight directly caused this, He wasn’t even in the video and he still did a collab
I think the explanation for the full ramp-up doing 104 damage instead of 105 is that there is a very _very_ slight distance between you and the heavy. To get the full 105 you would have to be _inside_ the heavy, which is impossible in normal gameplay.
It is possible, it's just that server must fail to keep the players from sticking togather.
the 104 357 damage stuff might have to do something with the fact that even when ure standing right in front of someone ure still 0.005 hammer units away or some shit like that
day 2 of asking SquimJim to make the history and lore of tf2 cows
Keep going bud, we gotta see it
Mood
6:07 “176 damage”
-Deals 190
Seems legit.
HEY YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED IN HERE
Who let you have internet?
Bleed is applied instantly so 176 + 14 is 190
@@user-Insane_Ails that's the joke
@@silly_lil_guy he just pointed something out :/
The original comment said “seems legit” lol
For those who didn't know: the steak will give user "mark for death" effect which make the target take mini crit from normal attack. If you had crit, the mini crit from "Mark for death" will be ignore.
Also the steak not fully make the user take 50% damage like a normal mini crit although the effect suppose to be (I'm pretty sure this was make for the sub-class boxing Heavy not as weak) but it's still be overwrite by the crit effect.
I seem to remember that the max resistance is actually higher since the backup has an additional resistance explicitly to sentry fire. Not relevant to scout but the demomam shooting the spy was labeled as the highest possible resistance when iirc that's not technically accurate.
At about 16:50 i heard infinity mijinion and mistakenly thought "what dont use the final countdown youll get copyright struck" until a moment later i realized what the song actually was.
always nice to hear megaman music in your videos, love it.
9:28 0 damage, after missing all 6 scattergun shots, then running away
Watching this during breakfast and you can't stop me Jim
Somebody stop this man
*NO! YOU MUST WATCH THIS AFTER BREAKFAST!*
SquimJim: Shows the highest and lowest dmg scout can do
Scout mains when they use the loadout: STRONK
Fun fact: the wrap assassin uses random damage spread that is why it is so inconsistent
14:49 ah yes, my every point blank meat shot.
Can relate
The lowest damage scout can do without the enemy being in any effects is 1 with the shortstop shove.
Forget a maximum/minimum damage series, give us a Rubix Cube lubing tutorial
another interesting fact about damage types is that the shield bash from a demoknight's charge is classified as bullet damage. makes me think that they just lumped everything that they couldn't immediately decide on into "bullet" and forgot about it later.
15:00 this is how i feel as a scout main
when heavy is at low hp it makes him sad. oof
3:54 *faint Demoknight laugh in the distance*
*don't stop me now flashbacks*
I have noticed the same bug with the wrap. My one guess is it’s bugged and still uses random damage spread. For those that don’t know RDS was a old mechanic that would make you either do up to (I think but I’m not sure) 20% more or less damage. Pipes from a demo could do 80 or 105 or 95 or 98. It was random whether or not people would survive on one hp
"Can scout one shot a heavy?"
Scout : Batter up
4:16
You made me P a n i k, I instantly rewinded the video
It's like this dog video that I saw when some dude was reciting his shopping list to his retired police dog, and then he says "Cocaine" to the dog and it turns it's neck and stares at the dude
your art on your thumbnails is looking more and more amazing. you love to see it. good stuff yo
This has the potential to be a pretty cool series. Keep going!
wouldnt every video just be the same but with a different weapon lmao i mean he already has all the formulas
I definitely thought the lowest would be the shortstop's shove.
does it even do damage
@@icedchqi It does 1 damage.
the reason why the wrap assasin ball does inconsistent damage is because (at least I think) it creates a small explosion, an that means the max damage could by increased by multiple enemies
The steak doesn't have a damage vulnerability anymore. It was removed a month before jungle inferno
It does. They just lowered it from 25% to 20%...and removed it from the description. I have no idea why.
@@SquimJim bear heavy can get any buff he gets. Disappointed it wasn't removed entirely. I thought it was.
The damage calculation is probably due to a float-to-integer conversion. Source was created with and uses c++. doing said calculation @4:56 floors the value to 368. It is less data to use ints 4bytes versus a float which normally is 1 integer with a 7 decimal precision after. (E.g. 3.1234567). Its also less math in the future because no one was to see their health bar at 120.3320819.
“Are you paying attention???”
Me: let me sleep its 3am
"Strength powerup no longer multiplies critical damage"
Solarlight: *NERVOUS SWEATING*
Grinding for that Wiki Cap i see, smart move
Wiki cap?
@@seizuresalad1558 .... sir or madam that’s the worst half answer I have ever heard
@@blutagg63 sir or madam what did you expect when your question was just two words?
@@blutagg63 you get the wiki cap by contributing for the wiki. Its pretty cool
14:52 box trot spy
I just now realized after like 1.5k hours in game, heavy look sad when low health 😭
I think when damage calculation results in a decimal in TF2, the number always rounds down to the closest integer, no matter what the decimal number is.
what about MvM's + damage upgrade?
you can´t deal damage to humans in mvm tho, itsabout how much dmg can you do to a player
@@leonardo9259 thats fair, but i still wonder how much damage that could do hypothetically. Even still, why not just do it against a robot anyways?
This is the video I expected the least to see, but it was certainly one of the most interesting. Nice job on securing a sponsorship!
No bs Scout damage:
Lowest damage- 1 (Shortstop's shove)
Highest damage- 500 (Sandman taunt)
@@smeggiamagarwine 999 iirc
999 base damage
Im my oppinion the most broken weapons ingame despite their damage are shotguns, because you can either take 6-18 damage, *or you can get buttfucked by a bazillion damage by that one lime/pink scout that manages to not miss any pellets from his scattergun*
I've always found it interesting how the characters facial expression change when there in low hp.
Change your profile picture please
Next episode... I wonder what solder will use for his prum...
*insert lazy purple clip of him using the direct hit while ode to joy plays*
So basically the highest possible damage the Scout can do is basically just an accurate depiction on what would happen if you got shot in the face with a Shotgun
To make sure, we are going to test that in real life for the next video.
5:15 1-2 less damage might be because of the rounding error between calculations.
Babe wake up, after breakfast uploaded.
I may have a theory for the random amounts of damage the christmas ornament deals: Its the pieces of it when it breaks that deal the damage most of the damage and not the ornament itself.
Think about it, if it were to bust open on someones head, the pieces would go flying everywhere randomly, which means a random about of pieces be stuck inside their head.
The whole base of this theory is the fact that you can damage yourself with the ornament if you throw it into a wall right infront of your face.
I notice you forgot the MvM Upgrades, including the straight damage upgrades.
4:25 that ragdoll had me falling
Fun fact in regards of low scout damage, the shortstop shove does 1 whole damage to any victim you shove. However, it does not show any damage marker when you hit a person nor does it increase the damage dealt stat tracker on the tab menu.
Hol up, what about the Rock Paper Scissors kill? It does 999 damage, but is it affected by mini-crits?
If the number has a fractional component, such as 104.7, it will be discarded. A result of 104 in that case.
Even if you would have dealt 99.999 damage, it comes out as just 99 damage, not 100.
Sometimes this can happen multiple times from various multipliers before a final result is reached.
A possible reason why the pistol (among other weapons) are capable of doing 0 damage is because .3 is closer to 0.0 when rounding while something like 0.5 is closer to 1 when rounding. Of course I could be wrong but it’s very possible.
Edit: granted .5 is just as close to 0 than it is to 1 but the numbers before probably are also taken into account.
I might have an idea about total damage being always slightly off than calculated damage.
In programming, it's always easier to work with integers than floating points (rational numbers). But fractional multiplications commonly result in rational numbers, so whenever we don't need the absolute exact number, we can just convert a floating point to an integer, essentially throwing away the decimal part. This also makes sure that dealt damage always amounts to exactly what is displayed, but it can have side effects.
Now, I haven't seen TF2 source code, but my guess is every damage multiplication is done one by one, with conversion to integer in-between them. Some damage buffs and debuffs you talk about in this video are most definitely fractional multiplications, and if you assume we lose all of the decimal part every multiplication, the missing 1 to 2 damage adds up.
5:08 when the damage value is facing with a decimal it is always rounded up to the nearest whole number
you forgot to make note of the shortstop's shove for the lowest damage!!! it literally does 1 damage to the enemy, except it doesn't even credit the damage to you
I think the steak+warriors spirit combo ignoring crits is due to how the vulnerability is handled, because I think it applies the vulnerability as a mini-crit damage like marked for death, but that might be hard coded to be overridden by crits and not doubled with regular mini crits
In terms of least damage, what about the grappling hook? It deals a base damage of 5 when it hits an enemy. Paired with those resistances, it should come out even lower than the Fan-O-War.
4:27 that was such an amazing and dramatic ragdoll
fun fact, the wrap assassin ornament is considered an explosive as well
4:55 I think in the event of a decimal, TF2 will always round it DOWN to the nearest whole value.
That's my guess as to why 368.55 is interpreted as 367.
awesome video, really really interesting stuff! ive been an avid fan for a while and the production value on this channel really amazing, can clearly tell how much goes into this. keep on keeping on man ur content is awesome :]
Force A Nature + strength power up + crit-a-cola + fan o'war + warrior's spirit = nuclear bomb
To answer your question about scouts scattergun ramp up, he can do 105 in 1 hit but you need to be literally inside of them. Most of the time because tf2 rounds down you will be getting 104. But I get 105 damage shots semi frequently in mge especially and they’re juicy.
14:53 hmmm that box in the lower right corner looking mighty sus
5:10 the reason why the damage numbers is less than you estimated here, is that tf2 floors (or rounds down) any decimal in the calculation, regardless of if it’s still calculating, or the final number.
So basically what tf2 does is:
6 x 10 = 60
60 x 1.75 = 105
105 x 2 = 210
210 x 1.35 = 283.5
283 x 1.3 = 367.9
the final number is floored too, resulting in 367 damage rather than the estimated 368.55
Scout does 104 damage with the scattergun at “point blank” because damage fall-off calculates using the hammer-unit distance between each player’s position; the position is at the *center* of your hit box. This means that, although you’re literally touching the heavy, the distance from the center of each player’s hit box to the edge of their hit box is the effective “range” used in the calculation, which just so happens to math-out to 104 damage for the scattergun.
This *does* mean that, if you managed to abuse some weird exploit or glitch to place the scout within the heavy’s hit box therefore bringing the players’ respective hit box centers closer, you could deal the gun’s full damage.
I'm still so happy to see more TFTubers still active, I'm not near as dedicated to the game, I cant play it 99% of the time because I physically can't. And I love it sooo much when I can. And I joined, I think 2 years ago? So, I think about 2019
4:56 This is likely just because how the code works. In most coding languages, integer calculations remove the decimals, for example 1/2 would not be 0.5 but would be 0, or 10x1.01would not be 10.1 but would be 10. I did the math and by the end the number would be 167.9 which would be turned into 367 at the end.
This is too much math, but I respect your commitment to it and the other videos. As for the bit in here about Scout's damage being slightly off... I think, though don't know for sure, that it may be due to the shotgun's natural spread and the way the pellets spawn from the gun. At point blank range, it should be doing 175% more due to the ramp-up, but the pellets aren't just in a ball together or right behind the other despite being an even 10 pellets. Which is something you can see just by hitting a wall; they all seem to be in an odd spread from each other and sometimes seem to even be missing a bullet hole, though that may just be a visual bug. Either way, I'd guess the ramp up becomes 174% for a few of them just because they spawn closer to Scout rather than the Heavy target; resulting in a very small fall off that messes with the calculation, if only slightly. ... Can't explain the wrap-assassin, though.
But anywho, based on the other videos, all that may also be why some damage falls off with some weapons, but not with others, as the travel speed and your positioning is calculated from the spawned bullet or explosive. Notably the Demoman's Sticky Bomb only calculates the fall off damage based on where Demoman is when it explodes, rather than when or where it was fired, so long as 5 seconds haven't passed. But Bullets and Rockets are tracking where they were fired from to calculate the fall off, since they have to figure out where they explode when they hit something, rather than when the player presses a button.
All of that is just speculation, though. I'm not a programmer and didn't bother testing any of it.
Hi
The two points of damage lost are because the player's position is determined by a really small dot which is surrounded by the hitbox.
Since the hitbox is bigger than the dot, two player's dots never get to touch under normal circumstances.
Since the dots never touch, the distance between two players is never 0, again, under normal circumstances.
Since the distance is never 0, the damage ramp up can never go all the way up even when hitboxes are colliding.
Since damage ramp up can never go all the way up, real damage dealt will always be a little less than calculated when distance in calculations is 0.
The likeliest explanation for the 1-2 dmg missing is that you would have to be *inside* the enemies point of origin (Meaning at the center of his model, which is unreachable without commands or mods)
3:54, Shoutout to SolarLight for making valve do this nerf to mannpower lol
Those discrepancies in practical and calculated damage could come from Valve rounding their figures between each new factor, which would change the figures by 1 or 2 for each new calculation.
11:12 kind of a non-sequitur, but if playing with hit / kill sounds enabled then the Deadringer doesn't trigger either when activated.