Same Sex Civil Marriages For Priests?!
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- Опубліковано 15 лип 2024
- If the General Synod of the Church of England allows for same-sex priests to marry this for many people would cross a red line and see an exodus from the Church! (Video 3 of 3)
First Video - • Will The Church of Eng... Second Video - • Which Way Will They Go?!
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00:00 Introduction
02:09 History and Context
06:09 Legal Background
11:26 Pastoral Provision
14:26 Relaxing Discipline
16:57 What Is Marriage?
The real question here is how do faithful Christians remain within the CofE when the leadership of the church have abandoned God, His Son, and His teaching...
They don't!
We fight and take it back for
God. We scatter Jezebel and prophets of Baal.
My prayer, and join me in exorcising the Church of England, of Jezebel and demonic spirits.
The answer is; they don't (they go to Orthodoxy).
It amazes me that so many bishops have forgotten the vows they made BEFORE GOD - and are not thinking of the Day of the Lord - are they willing to hear Christ say, I never knew you?
Dear Lord, It is so difficult for us to witness the demise of this once great Christian church and Christian country and we pray that you deliver some good out of the bad. We know that it is Your will, not ours, but may we pray for a sign to show Synod the right path? Help those with ears to hear and eyes to see to remain steadfast in Your word. In Jesus Name, Amen
There is a problem in that phrase " this once great Christian church and Christian country " in that the NT does not tell us to have "Christian countries" but a rather different way of engaging with the world, in which the Church itself is "God's holy nation" on earth, but a nation in 'diaspora', that is it lives scattered throughout the world somewhat in the pattern of exiled Jews living outside Israel. The secular countries in which we live are not supposed to be superficially 'Christianised' and identified with the Church - they are 'the world' from which we call people into the people of God. Even at its best (and I do agree that can be very good!) the CofE has always been compromised and even handicapped by what amounts to a 'serving two masters' situation.
I have been hoping that this might be resolved by disestablishment; it is looking now as if the acceleration of the LLFetc will make that impossible - the only course now is to leave the sinking ship... and ideally don't just trickle, GO!
The numbers of parishioners is declining so they decide to broaden the population base from which they attract parishioners to keep their "jobs" as bishops and the money rolling in. So sad. I'm an atheist raised Christian and find it so sad that those who have retained their faith are not supported by their power structure (bishops, etc.)
@@carolynbrightfield8911 The irony is it's not working! The so-called 'liberal theology' agenda doesn't impress or attract people because a 'liberal' church is so like the surrounding world as not to be worth joining.
Not sure becuse not CofE myself, but my impression is that currently there are a lot of 'liberal' or just fuzzy bishops because the entanglement with the state favours that; there are also more liberal/fuzzy clergy and so more such local churches/parishes. BUT - the 'evangelical' churches tend to be a lot fuller, and evangelicals are probably a majority among the laity although the electoral process for the 'synod' doesn't reflect that. Also as far as I can gather for many decades the liberal wing have been financially parasitizing on the evangelicals when income across the church is shared out. If the current shenanigans provoke a major exodus of the biblically serious, I don't think the 'liberals' will know what's hit them!
@@carolynbrightfield8911Did you ever learn to know the jewish Yeshua when you were raised as a christian? Go and find out the real jewish Messiah -Yeshua haMashiach. When you learn jewish context, you might find Hashem again. Perhaps the best youtube content in messianic judaism is the "One for Israel".
Amen
I dont see how the two sides can be reconciled. We as believers cannot deliberately go against the word of God.
I agree with you Revd Dan the General Synod will have crossed the red line.
"Will have"??
Yet another red line
The red line has long since been crossed!!
They're just making it up as they go along. I think you have to accept that the Church of England is finished as a church, it's becoming just a social club and not particularly social either. GAFCOM may be the future of true Anglicanism, but we'll have to see.
Making it up as they go along? How do you think religions start?
As Christians we r not to be of this world but separate thay are a disgrace. ( keep up the good work Dan.)
I've never heard of such convolutions or treacle tongued deception in my life. It's just sinful.
Why not just throw out the Bible and do what you want?
I think they're past that!
I think they have.
I think of Jesus words to the Pharisees and Sadducees who had added more and mire rules and regulations to the Scroptures. These had caused great burdens to the people who followed. I see the burden today as different but with the same result as the Word of God is reduced to what is acceptable to the world.
I feel for you Dan,having to be a part of an organisation that has become so PC
That face said it all. The face I saw on many an evangelical friend briefly before they walked away last February. I'm personally ready for the gorilla warfare (spiritually rather than with people) as we fight from within for the kingdom, but know that it is much harder to fight on with opposition from above than indifference and toleration from above.
Guerilla rather than gorilla! (An archdeacon 😮)😅
@@andybarton234There is a reason why the archbishops are called primates!
At least you understood what was being said. we need to stop critising and nit picking but come together in love of Christ! The world needs Jesus even more now than ever. @@andybarton234
Father, please hold-onto the surety of the Faith in the Sacred Scriptures!
I continue to pray for you and for your ministry!
+Blessings, Love, and Peace!
Rev Dan, no disciplinary action will be taken, a separate marriage service happened already in Ely with no action. The creeping normalisation of SSM was the pattern in the US Episcopalians we are 15 years behind them on the same track. The Bishops will just play it long, a Labour Government would bring in a new Equality Act and would not include the current exemptions for the CofE.
Yes… it’s awful that those exemptions are being worn down from within the church. Doctrinally sound Christian’s’ protections under law are being eroded. I can foresee a time when we will not be able to rely on our biblical position… people will point to our bishops and say that their liberal stance reflects church’s belief.
Well done Rev Dan. I hope your fellow Anglicans are supporting you in prayer and financials. Fr Clive ( Catholic priest).
You make the valid point that the issue of difficulty in change should show that this is because it is not meant to be changed. Yet the route to ordaining women as priests was not straightforward and it took another 20 years before they could be made bishops, something that Jill Duff seems to conveniently overlook on her quest to preserve the status quo.
I wish that biblically orthodox Christians could be orthodox on all matters, rather than those which suit their purposes.
That's a good point. I could never understand the evangelicals and Anglo Catholics who didn't do anything after the vote to ordain women. It was clearly in contradiction of the Bible and church tradition. I left for the RC Church. Now we have Pope Francis gone completely off the rails and wanting to ordain women, but it's difficult to see how he can get round John Paul II's final ruling on the matter, "the Church has no authority whatsoever to convert priestly ordination on women and this judgement is to be definitively held by all the faithful".
WE DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO BLESS SIN. Simple as that.
the issue is that there are a lot of good, faithfull Christians who feel it unloving to support same sex couples, therefore they consider the Scriptures to support love and threfore same sex marrages. We have to remember that there are good, faithfull Christians on both sides of the argument
@@helenbond8893both sides can’t be right. Either God is the authority, or man’s ego is.
@@pressme71nz the point is that Gods authority as given and explained through Scripture, can be understood in different ways, therefore it is wrong to insinuate that someone who understands scripture differently to ones self is not a faithfull Christian
Yes… we are all called to live holy lives. I really don’t think I could stay if this line is crossed.
This is the red line crossed. Stand firm on God's Word. Do please leave for Gafcon affiliated churches- the Free Church of England. This other "Church" is a relic, a mere shell.
I feel Rev Dan seems like a nice chap and have some sympathy. I want to make a comment to help his algorithm. This debate is so old it can be found in the bible. My philosophy is to get on a bus that is going where I want to go. If the bus is going somewhere else I get off and either get on another bus or walk. It is obvious where this bus is going and that is why I am not on it. There are nevertheless some very nice people on the bus and I wish them well. As an onlooker I advise you to put an end to this debate any way you can or you will be arguing over it for the next 25 years.
Sadly I think everyone can see where this is going. No doctrine or teaching will be changed, but priests will "marry" priests and bishops will "marry" bishops out of love for one another, but they will have no love for the god they claim to represent.
When I joined the C of E - having experienced had a life changing conversion - I asked about my sexuality. I was told they they could pray for my healing. I believed utterly. This was of God surely. Two years later I got married. After ten years we were divorced, broken and I was bankrupt having given all to my wife - I was gay - therefore it was all my fault. After that - no one in the church would speak to me except to say hello, how are you. Excommunication takes many forms. Dan... you will have the luxury of leaving. I was left. Excommunicated for being gay.
I look at the church today and think when will it return to God? Whatever the petty hatefulness- it fails Christ whatever 'side' you take. Stand with Christ - or leave him. It's not the Church. It is Immanuel. God with us. Will you desert God? Or will you stand with him offering him your confusion - 'help me Lord'.
Hi, I’m bisexual by orientation and love Jesus. I have a difficult time in churches because I actually love Jesus and obey Him. Most church folk are the middle class club. That’s why things are as they are now in the c of e with this, the race nonsense, the environment nonsense. It’s all middle class talking points.
I married my husband because I loved him but I did think I was going to be single for life. We divorced over something else but we have managed to get our friendship back and things are so much better. Maybe we will get married again in the future but my priority is that he comes to Christ. I think me marrying him when I did stopped him coming fully to faith. He’s now in churches more often than I am! So happy about this.
Please find Christ at the heart of everything. We are here to glorify Him. Nothing else. That is our mission; to tell the Good News.
I hope that wherever you are today, that life is good for you. God does also want us to be happy in Him. 💜
If you say that you don’t change doctrine but instead ignore it then you will lose any credibility you may have left.
In my small village there is no other bible based church that the faithful in the pews can go to.
Ummm... Start one - remember that in the earliest days all churches were 'house churches'.
I'm always amazed that in these vast documents there is no Scripture.....actual words of Christ Himself. He definitely has an opinion on the matter!
The church is supposed to be Christ’s Bride. Yet the church does not seem to love Christ very much.
I’m bisexual and have always lived for Jesus. I’m not very popular in church circles because I quote Jesus.
so the Christian belief is that they die and go to heaven and the majority of Christians have believed that for the last 2000 years. now though modern Christianity has been turned on its head, God isn't a man, God accepts homosexual relationships etc,etc. i would just love to see the faces of modern day christians if they get to heaven and heaven hasn't moved with the times, heaven's not woke! 😂
Rev Dan, this is an excellent presentation. Clear and precise.
The authors of this catastrophe are fully aware that what they are advocating is contrary to Scripture and to Canon Law, which reflects the biblical view. They are adopting the same approach as Ahab or the Pharisees. They do not honour God or His teaching, and because they do not believe or obey, they think that they can get away with all of this. They overpower true believers, ruin it for them and hijack their church.
Ahab tried to outfox God, but we know how it ended.
While I am still ambivalent about women priests - G-d the Father will use anyone to present the Kingdom of G-d and the Gospel if there is no-one else who will do it, especially male priests - but this will be, if we haven't already passed over and blew it up, a bridge too far! As a Churchwarden, I will not allow this sort of travesty in my church. I might not be allowed to to change *established* liturgy based on Scripture, but I am sure as heck allowed to say what goes on in the building!
The C of E hierarchy are lost, lost lost, they are now close to, if not already, Ichabod - without the presence of G-d - because they have rejected Sola Scriptura. But have the individual parishes? With less than 500 K on the Electoral Roll, and decreasing, can the C of E, not taking the hint of the *schizm* of the African Anglican Communion and the likes of GAFCOM and the FIEC C of E, really go through with this? Enough is enough! G-d the Father may be love, but He is also Justice, by His own metric and, according to the Epistle of Hebrews, He *does not change!*
Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil, who change light for dark and sweet for bitter! Woe to those bishops who seek to worship at the altar of Ba'al! Woe to those spiritually blind and deaf leaders who mislead the flock!
*Read Isaiah Chapter One and repent!*
Legally the church warden is only in charge if there is no priest, and even then what goes on, would be governd by the arch deacon. Ultimately the church will be goverend by someone who is theologically trained
@@helenbond8893 Churchwardens cannot change *liturgical protocols.* But we have more authority than you may think in churches.
I wonder if you are, or have been, a Churchwarden? Often, the priest or vicar will accede to CWs suggestions, but most times things go through the Standing Committee and/or PCC in the first instance, unless it is a minor issue to do with the fabric.
But we still do have a spiritual responsibility as as Elders of the church. I suppose much depends on the dynamic between the priest/vicar an the CWs. Shalom.
@@chrismaguire3667 I am a priest in training, however I have chosen to study towards a phd in Theology & church doctrine. So I am aware of the process
@@helenbond8893 Thank you. Blessings.
The whole enterprise is ill-conceived. Like, for the sake of inclusively, allowing driving on both the left-hand and right-hand side of the road (without chanding traffic laws, of course). And if the experiment is a success, we'll amend the Highway Code... 😮
Dan, I think Christians need to be clear that marriage is not the property of either the church or the state; it is God's intention, written into his original and unchanged creative design for the joining together of a man and a woman for their mutual benefit and of course to provide for procreation and the safe nurturing of children. There is more than enough witness to this in the Bible as well as in the plain facts of human biology.
The Old Testament clearly reveals that the notion of marriage was a universally accepted human arrangement for living, whether among God's chosen people or those who did not worship the true God; it was never queried as invalid. So the idea of there being a fundamental difference between 'Holy Matrimony' and 'Civil Marriage' has no warrant from scripture. Holy Matrimony is just the church's description which reminds us of the attitude in which Christians will want to accept this beautiful gift from God.
The so-called Laity (AKA Christians) leaving the CoE is the major problem. They leave and take their families and money and spiritual gifts with them. The problem with Clergy is that heterodox Clergy who no longer support the traditional faith don’t leave.
What we believe (doctrine) and the practices we do (discipline) require teaching, obedience and the ability to discern between the two. Such wisdom is clearly absent from a church that continues to accept the zeitgeist as its summum bonum.
These Bishops etc are not Christians. I am 84 and retired from my role as NSM.
Have they never read Scripture. Definitely not Christians. Rev'd
Les Cruttenden.
Iam a Ma Theology student, and while I hope that the sames sex marrages are not allowed, I can attest to the fact that there are extreamly well read, good and faithfull Christians on both sides of this argument. To a lot they feel that the people who are against ssm are not Christians and have no respect for the Bible or Jesus' message. We must not accuse others as not being Christians, it is not acceptable, it shows a lack of understanding of how they view scripture, and makes us look like the unChristian party when we make such statments
There is no such office as priests in the New Testament Church anyhow. The Priesthood was done away with along with the Temple system of sacrifices, incense, vestments and headwear that were all part of pre-Christian Judaism. Yeshua, or Jesus as the Gentiles call Him, fulfilled all of that by becoming the Passover Lamb, our Great High Priest and King.
We are all called to be kings and priests spirirually before God by adoption by salvation, but the actual office of a priest is not as far as I can ascertain from Scripture still in vogue.
The Church is an All-Body ministry with offices listed in the New Testament, such as pastors, teachers, evangelists, prophets etc., but today that is all rolled into one "priest."
That is a glaring issue and as un-Biblical as same-sex clergy wearing priestly vestments.
There is a longstanding confusion here in English - strictly speaking the word 'priest' comes from the NT word and office 'presbyter/elder', and the Greek word for OT priests is different. Having become a national religion in the Roman Empire the concepts were conflated and inter alia the communion reinterpreted as a sacrificial 'mass'. Nobody, male or female, should now be a 'priest' in the OT sense. Whether women may be acceptable as elders depends on whether one sees the NT evidence as depicting a permanent state of affairs or, as in the teaching on slavery, an interim position during the adjustment of the new covenant and the Gentile mission.
@@stevelangton829 And what about the use of incense, vestments, headwear (mitres i.e. priestly turban), altars etc which seem to be used in many of the edifices used as "churches" (which means congregation, as opposed to synagogue meaning meeting house) in Christendom?
I read about these in the Bible only concerning the Temple, but not about the NT Church.
@@scented-leafpelargonium3366 Again part of the national (nationalised) Imperial church in which ceremony became more important than changed lives.
'church' is arguably wrong as a translation of 'ekklesia' which as you say means 'congregation' and is also the word in the Greek OT (Septuagint/LXX) for the 'cingregation or assembly of Israel; that implies continuity between God's OT and NT people under Jesus as 'Messiah/king of the Jews' - thus the 'congregation/assembly meets in a meetinghouse.
@@stevelangton829 Yes, the Church meets in meetinghouses, not in "churches." Synagogue is just a generic word for any meeting place, in Hebrew BEIT KNESSET, or House of entering/coming, from the verb LEHICANESS, to enter, also used to describe the Israeli Parliament building, so it need not be a religious building, but just a building for the purpose of meeting.
To suggest that meeting houses or "synagogues" are only restricted to Jews as it is used today is not logical, but only comes from reading of its Jewish use in the Bible, and the Gentile Christians not wishing to be connected with the Jews opted to call their meeting places "churches" instead, when in fact the Bible uses it generically to mean any meeting house.
@@scented-leafpelargonium3366 Interesting - 'church' derives from 'kyriacos' and from 'Kyrios', the word for Lord, not only a title of Jesus but also the usual rendering in the Gk OT for 'Yahweh', the divine name which at that time Jews avoided using and in the Gk translation tried to avoid making that name available for possible misuse by Gentiles. Thus a word implying Jesus' deity. Kyriacos is not an NT word for Christian meetingplaces, at that period Christians rarely had dedicated buildings for that purpose.
Reverend Dan, this is so disturbing, these matters are going against Gods teachings. If they go ahead with it, they will have crossed the line of no return. The C of E will be totally finished. The question is then, what does all this mean for our marriages between Man and Woman as taking or taken our vows in Gods house as we all made a covenant to our lord.What happens to us and our children of our faith, what do we become?
Perhaps the easiest way to escape the dilemma of the UK Christian Church and SSM is for the UK to follow the continental pattern of all marriages being secular with a subsequent Church blessing if appropriate. Then secular ‘equality’ laws and pressures would no longer apply (this is the situation regarding Islamic weddings I think). However, it has to be faced, that once the Church of England chose to ordain women, it had severed its links with orthodox christianity and so this slide into ‘relativism’ was inevitable. I found it very interesting during the debates on the ordination of women, and the subsequent debate about the consecration of bishops, that there was much debate about the need for ‘equality’ but, in my view, very little about what priesthood and the episcopacy actually was and what the CofE thought it was actually doing when someone was ‘ordained’.
Agreed - the NT does not teach that Christianity should be a national religion but shows a different way for Church and state - or Church and surrounding world generally - to be related. A state separate from the Church should have secular marriages/partnerships; Christians would use the secular marriage in relating to society at large for legal purposes, but also have its own distinctive practice for within the fellowship.
We stand on God’s word.
Priests or Vicars whatever you want to call them are alread living their gay lifestyles publicly. I live in a very small Yorkshire town, almost a village. Between one small methodist Church and the local Anglican Church we have recently had 3 such clergy. At the local C o E we had a lady vicar who lived in the vicarage with her lesbian partner. She left after a few years and we now have anothe famale vicar who's male husband cross dresses and comes ti church in full regallea, wig, handbag heels, nice litgle tweed suit, pearls etc. The methodist chuch after some time waiting got a new minister, another lesbian with a live in partner who is also a lay preacher and takes part in services. Now I wouldn't want to exclude anyone but I think its gone beyond a joke! I do not think clergy with alternative lifestyles should be ordained. When it comes to the point where it serms to be shoved in your face everywhere you turn its gone too far. Lets welcome gay and lesbians as our friends and do our best to support them, but not ordain them. Also in particular with gay men. Very very often they are very promiscuous and even when they have a stable partner. Christians are meant to rise above their animal instincts and live meaninful relationships, that is the model of marriage to one person. If you think I'm talking nonsense listen to Becket Cook on youtube. He's lived it and he knows.
Yes, very true. I am bisexual and have always followed Jesus.
You are right that at least half of men who marry men continue to have sex with other men. Female-female relationships are more violent, sexually violent and much quicker to break down than opposite sex relationships. Of course God says things for a reason. Thank you for speaking senses.
We hope this wicked sin will not happen . Marriage is very clear as the Bible teaches us can only be between a man & women. Its leaders should be setting an example. But under Welby it has departed so far from Christian teaching. How can Priests even consider this ? Priests are only human like the rest of us & open to sin but this is something that the lines must never crossed. The Cof E has become so wicked no wonder even more of the faithfull are having to leave.
They are pulling out all of the stops. The Church will become a toothless tiger or a pound shop counterfeit devoid of any authority in preaching on sin and repentance.
Are you a minister of God or a minister of the COE?
God and the Holy Spirit were definitely present in our civil marriage Our relationship is set aside for God which makes it Holy Matrimony, despite not thaking place in a church building.
Er no. I have heard other people say similar. No. We are very good at deceiving ourselves.
The Holy Spirit is God. God does not fight against God.
Jesus was clear in Matthew 19 when He said His only vision for marriage is that between one man and one woman for life.
Jesus referred back to Genesis and the creation of male and female.
Jesus said the only reason a man leaves his father’s house - meaning matures physically and mentally - is to be United with his wife.
Jesus spoke of Heaven many times and salvation with God as the Groom and us as the Bride, echoing almost every Book in the OT.
No, God is not ok with your same sex partnership.
I am bisexual. Most gays are as the census shows us. Knowing so many lgbt people, I know most lgbt people are bisexual. I have never yet met a homosexual.
We do have choices. You have made a choice to turn away from Christ. You can make the choice to turn back to Him.
Even if we are all born homosexual, which is not the case at all, we still would have the choice to turn to Christ or turn away from Christ.
Also, you are probably aware that we are not born lgbt. We are lgbt as a trauma response to childhood abuse, having an absent or emotionally absent parent, having been bullied badly in childhood, having a mentally ill parent etc. All the independent research shows this.
I hope you take facts on board and reassess your emotions and your faith. Your salvation could be at risk. This is your life and your salvation. Do as you see fit but at least educate yourself on the facts that we are not born lgbt, we are traumatised and we have an emotional same sex need because of trauma. You were not created to be gay or to have a same sex relationship. Please dwell on this and get help for any unresolved trauma you may have. Jesus is waiting with outstretched arms.
And no, the Father, Son and Holy Spirit do not fight against each other as you seem to think.
Please do reassess your beliefs and your childhood. Your happiness and your salvation may depend on it. Good luck.
How can the Bishops desire this???
These are the bishops who regularly teach against Jesus’ teachings and ignore sexually abused children. It shouldn’t come as a surprise.
This is truly the end of the Church of England. The heart of heaven is breaking, Heavenly Father may your son return soon.
It's not living along the line of least resistance, it's living to Scripture..This isn't going to happen..
Should they also consider whether same sex marriages, civil or "holy", blessings are a pathway to heaven or a quick entry to hell?
We are called to be faithful to Christ. Christ was clear about male and female and marriage in His eyes is between one man and one woman for life.
I am bisexual by orientation. I have loved Jesus since i was 8 year old. Most lgbt people are bisexual and every year since same sex marriage was legalised in the uk, more lgbt people marry someone of the opposite sex than someone of the same sex. Most bisexual people don’t even announce their sexual orientation and live a life with opposite sex partners solely.
Add onto that that most lgbt Christians follow Jesus and not society. Some have lived a “gay life” and been very damaged by it and their choice was suicide or Jesus. These people speak clearly on how gay living is not what God wants for us.
So the whole ripping apart Jesus’ teachings is being done for the tiniest minority. The tiniest minority who, in my experience, are not the most holy people around. Their behaviour is often disgusting because as soon as you ok one sin, you ok all the others and your faith and personality fall apart and I see this most markedly when someone oks same sex sin.
I would like to know what the c of e does with the fact that at least half of men married to men continue to have sex with other men and hold sex parties in their home, and the fact that female-female relationships have a far higher incidence of domestic violence and rape as well as a speedy relationship breakdown after marriage.
catherinehume.wordpress.com/2024/02/21/the-intersections-of-lgbt-obesity-and-christianity/
God help us.
In my R A TORREY what the Bible teahes, who can pray so that God will hear?
Ps 66; 18. "If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear me."
Seems to me, anyone who prays for same sex couples would not be heard anyway! Useless action.
If there is a belief in God,you cannot alter his laws to suit the fashion of today’s thinking.
Surely this goes against the teachings of Jesus?. The COFE seems to drifting away from the teachings and committing Sin.
All this talk. The C of E is finished. Get out, fight back, or belt up. Born again, Anglicans have had the past 50 years to deal with these issues. And have failed. Heads have been buried in the sand, and now we face the consequences. Lessons learnt? I doubt it.
Aren’t some priests already in same sex civil marriages ?
These bishops take too much authority upon themselves.
God gave marriage to all peoples, as a relationship and intimacy between one man and one women, before sin was in the world.
God's creation ordinance is for all peoples, for all time. It cannot be changed.
The church is a joke. Write as much dribble and use as much confusing language as possible. They do whatever they want , God is hardly In it these days.
They want their cake and eat it too!
😢
People who have a problem with the Church, the Word of the Lord, the Kind and Honest Faith of Generations, should take personal responsibility, leave and establish their own denomination as has sometimes happened previously over centuries, I myself being baptised into the Free Presbyterian Church of Scotland. Elements of the Anglican Church leadership rank alongside the most heretical in ecclesiastical history. Yet their greatest evil before God is the imposition of their own heresy and apostasy upon their own congregations, forcing them either to comply or flee the defiled Temple of the Lord. That is a terrible sin, shameful and unapologetically arrogant.
Matthew 23:15
Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you traverse sea and land to make a single proselyte, and when he becomes a proselyte, you make him twice as much a child of hell as yourselves.
Deuteronomy 32: 31-32; 32:35;
31 For their rock is not as our Rock,
even our enemies themselves being judges.
32 For their vine comes from the vine of Sodom,
and from the fields of Gomor′rah;...
35 Vengeance is mine, and recompense,
for the time when their foot shall slip;
for the day of their calamity is at hand,
and their doom comes swiftly.
We should have kept the clause many years ago
We should have kept to Jesus and teaching His Word.
@@CatherineX-ph3on I was meaning section 28 which the uk once had
@@CatherineX-ph3on ?
The Nave is full to the brim with sinners, that's how it is. Just because we go to church and rise and fall through life, and at times are filled with the Holy Spirit, it doesn't mean we should cross over to priesthood. We are all sinners, His rod and His staff they comfort us, like the Good Shepard He is. It seems to me that priests are to be held to a logical and ridged path, because they are supposed to know. We have been told that the more you know the harsher the punishment for wrong doing. Lets not confuse the elation of forgiveness through temporary repentance with the beauty of a calling.
Yes, we are sinners in the Church of Christ, no matter the denomination. But Paul writes in Romans that we are convicted of our rebellion - sin - against G-d the Father and changed to be like Christ, from glory to glory. This may take one's whole life, or sudden changes at times, or a mix of both, but it *leads AWAY from sin and and the rejection of same.*
Then we grow the real Fruits of the Spirit. Homosexuality is *NOT* a Fruit of The Spirit!
Jesus was NOT a homosexual, so how can any 'professing Christian', priested or lay, say that their being an active homosexual reflects Jesus' nature? Show me Scriptures that *explicitly* supports their argument that it does! I know it does NOT exist. So the AoC and HoB is beyond wrong and need purging!
@@chrismaguire3667 I do have an answer. But I would like you tell me why you answered the way you did in response to what I wrote? It's like you are talking to someone else.
@@chrismaguire3667 How do you know that Jesus was NOT a homosexual?
@@andrewlowe5102 Because if He was sinful in any way, then we are *all* hellbound, whether you believe or not.
@@mikewilliams235 It was a general statement. If you felt it was aimed at you, I apologise. Jesus is who He demonstrated Himself to be. Still, we all have to hit that interface sometime or another - "Who do you say I am?", as Jesus asked of Pilate. He asks that of us, as well.
You might need to leave, clearly articulate the LORDS invitation to be HIS friend. Lay hands on the sick and love the broken and see GODS power explode to your amazement. At the end of the day our LORD will do what HE will do. JESUS is ALIVE and well. NEW era brother. Shake the dust off your feet and be about aHIS business.
Interesting that you state that these are your views as a parish priest. Surely they are your viewed as an ordained Anglican clergyman. You dont have to be licensed to a parish to hold these views.
What a joke. They are mocking God, I pity them.
If an atheist couple (one man and one woman) marries (in a civil ceremony), then finds god, would the church consider them married, or expect them to be celibate until they repeat their vows in church?
They are married since it's the only sacrament that the couple confer onto one another. Therefore a state wedding is valid in the eyes of the Church.
@@philiphumphrey1548 I agree they are married in the eyes of god (as far as I can tell anyway), but by trying to distinguish between civil marriage and holy matrimony, I wonder if some in the house of bishops would disagree.
this is my husband and I, we renewed our vows in the church last year to be married under God.
@@SevenTimesaDay I don't think I explained very well. I am not trying to argue that ALL civil marriages should count as marriage in the church. I am trying to say that some in the church have come to the position that NO civil marriage should count in the church, by creating a separate artificial category of holy matrimony, which I don't think has a place in scripture. A civil marriage which also meets a scriptural definition of marriage should count as marriage in the church even if it wasn't conducted in a church by a member of the clergy.
@@jessicathespy Whether I would consider it necessary to do so, I certainly think that renewing your vows before God and the church is a wonderful thing to do. I hope God really blesses your marriage.
God told Moses what the laws were concerning the Holiness of the priests and also the laws for sex.
The text describes basically that you have the soul, the earthly mind that recieves the soul and the body inwhich the mind works.
The levites or priests were to accept Gods will without question. Those that refused were not accepted near the Tabernacle. The priest's were camped around the Tabernacle to protect it from any bad thoughts or arguing parties. This kept the sanctuary harmonious because God could see the world through the priests. They were connected to God.
Their harmonious and Holy thought spread out through the community.
On the deepest of levels, children are an extended thought of the parents.
This mirrors Gods creation in the seperation.
Through covenants, God accepted this system of life which went against the original creation of thought through God.
God desires the body to be sacrifed for the higher thought of the soul.
The promised land was full of people who sacrificed children so that their life would be plentiful.
Jesus stood by the gates of hell where children were sacrificed.
Jesus said that this would be overcome.
God said the same to Moses.
By allowing certain practices, you worship the body rather than the creative thought of God.
The church has fallen way short.
Where can you go to talk about God in the deepest and most meaningful way that is translated from thought into action.
Why go to someone who argues about not following God's truths so that he can be a happy body but not directly connected to God so cannot give the people what God desires.
May the world live in God's thought and fulfil God's purpose.
'I' before 'e'; except after 'c'! Thank goodness British education remains all it was in the 1950s! The Church of England cannot allow same-sex relations for its clergy without first acknowledging that Paul (let alone the authors of the Torah) knew nothing about human sexuality, compared with what modern science has revealed; and that we should no more turn to Paul for advice on human sexuality, than we should for his views on 'climate change' or 'germ theory'! Dan, all you are revealing here is how much you adhere to legalism (citing Canons, which may, themselves be out-of-date) and 'scriptural literalism'. This is to treat our wonderful scriptures (humanly-written ancient documents) as though they are the Koran (divinely-authored words). Personally, I feel those who claim to be "called" to ordained ministry, should be given the choice I was given in the 1970s: you either give up sex and get ordained (ie: you feel a "call" to celibacy!) or you have not had a "calling".
You are pushing heresy.
@@news_internationale2035 Oh, goodee!
Yes, it is a bit rich pushing the noble idea of 'sacrifice' ... when married with children.
@@andrewlowe5102 Please expand, Andrew. I have not mentioned 'sacrifice'.
@@andrewlowe5102 What?