I really wish you guys would skip the hugging thing at the end. All I can imagine everytime is me in that situation feeling the pressure that I need to hug someone at the end but not wanting to inside, yet feeling like if I say no its gonna create this awkward atmosphere for everyone.
@@youtubefans510Can't justify anything like that. Wrong is wrong. I can't say, "well I wanted that item, I needed it...couldn't afford it, it was priced too high...so I stole it. It's the sellers fault, he priced it too high. Wouldn't change the price. I had no choice..."
@@sunshinenday3439 half the population in france and india do not consider infidelity as morally wrong so that begs the question what is the definition of wrong and wrong for who ? there is no cosmic law that says infidelity is wrong , is it wrong for the animals , no they are just programmed to propogate the species , what is wrong is dishonesty although understandable dishonesty is actually unnatural you use less facial muscles for starters apparently and it doesn't illustrate disrespect by definition either people are afraid to be honest
The smugness of the woman in the blazer is absolutely wild-to say you don’t owe you *husband* the decency of telling him the truth, after you’ve made a vow to love him through sickness and in health, to then go on and *cheat* on him and *betray* his trust because you are selfish is just absolutely crazy to me.
A flawless relationship can be shattered by a fleeting moment-a kiss, a fling-that may have occurred many years prior. You might not even recall the face of the person involved in that momentary lapse. Yet, for your partner, it can spell the definitive end. In numerous instances, one partner discovers betrayal, a grave error committed in a moment of recklessness. By the time the truth surfaces, the partner once cherished has moved on, leaving the betrayed to embark on the arduous journey of healing anew. This scenario isn't confined to the past. A couple in their 70s found that other cheated them in their 30s they divorced Therefore, after solemnly vowing to stand by your partner in sickness and in health, to then betray that trust out of sheer selfishness is utterly incomprehensible to me. Simply because you possess the capability to do something doesn't mean you should. Theology should remain a thousand feet away from practical, real-world decision-making.
Sad thing is I'm almost positive she has a tic tok page called "The other woman and the wife" where she pushes this narrative constantly and is really dismissive of the betrayed and makes it seem like cheating is okay. She's messed up and still doing whatever she can to make what she's done okay
True. Although that one annoying girl Raven was being self-righteous and trying to impose her Christian superiority on Chelsea who's also a Christian 💀 I wanna see more videos on non-political topics like the flat Earth one.
it’s not that black and white. I personally have never cheated, however you can still love someone and put your selfish desires before them at the same time.
I appreciated both sides a lot. Mainstream narratives often focus on the victim. We seldom get a nuanced conversation from the cheaters, and especially not between the cheaters and cheatees in one setting. It was a rare opportunity.
Chelsea seems like the type of person who thinks she has figured it all out and therefore knows better than everyone else. It was so irritating to watch her treat others in such a patronizing way.
you can tell from the way both chelsea and raven were speaking and wording things that they view their subjective opinions on topic as fact and the superior way of thinking. 🙃
i thought i was the only one who noticed this since no one really mentioned it. She was treating the others in such an odd way, smiling/clapping whenever she "proved" a point (even though this isn't a debate competition), yet to get there she had to contradict herself many times to get there, even being called out on her hypocrisy.
I was gonna say I felt the same about raven “I believe in the cross, and the Bible, the whole Bible, not just one portion of the Bible” like girl get over yourself😂
Hearing Chelsea say “what if you have a partner that’s suicidal” trying to justify not disclosing cheating made me roll my eyes. Like quit coming up with hypotheticals and doing mental gymnastics and just be real with yourself. You did something bad to somebody and they deserve to know so that they can heal properly instead of looking for answers.
If people were that truthful about things, they wouldn't have cheated in the first place. You see things as black and white but partners have to take accountability for their spouse's feelings at some point. If you've been with someone for x amount of time you could guess how they'll react to the truth.
That Raven girl was so annoying and her Christian superiority over everyone is mind-numbing. Apparently she cares about the bible until she gets to the 'thou shall not lie' or 'thou shall not commit adultery' parts when she cheats.
I was thinking this too, she sees everything from the perspective of whats best for her and what benifits her. Theres no room in her head for thinking about someone elses feelings
@@anne-beritgunhildson598 Agreed, a relationship is about US not about YOU as an individual anymore. Marriage is supposed to be a union of two people. If someone can't think as a team and compromise for the sake of the relationship, then they shouldn't even be in one.
@@Re69. But that's not their responsibility though they're doing nothing wrong by breaking up with them I've only ever heard that come up if the person is using offing themselves as a way of manipulation
From the "cheated" group, I enjoy how Sophie is talking about it: not justifying, not blaming others (Raven, I am looking at you), just acknowledging how deeply she fucked up, and trying to be better. I love the honesty
She was the least integrated person on the panel. She just dove into Christianity and convinced herself of the straight-and-narrow path without actually deeply interrogating her motives.
Oh, you mean the woman who in the first sentence managed to say (paraphrasing): "As a cheater I can forgive cheaters, oh yea and as a Christian. Uh... err.. uh"
She also claims everything she did with the guy she cheated with was in the best interest for both of them. Delusional!!! She never states remorse or regret for hurting her partner at the time that she cheated on.
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweathmm I can see why that is okay, but I feel like this could just make the woman get more abused and put her in a worse situation if the abuser were to find out
@@TaylorswiftarmpitsweatI feel like if you are in an abusive relationship, you cheating and getting caught will 100% make things a lot worse for your safety. I think your safety should be no.1 priority rather than cheating on your abuser, not because it isn't moral but because you are literally just putting yourself in danger.
It looks like she is a life coach. That is an unregulated title in America and obtaining training to be a life coach is up to the individual. You can be a life coach without any training. To be a counselor in the US, someone has to have a master’s (or a bachelors in some states) and have a license to offer counseling. Edited for clarity.
@@ancie552but she does it in a way that separates herself from said cheaters. she’s just as bad as them and chooses words and religion to make it seem like she’s above when she earned that title for a reason.
@@abigail5242 i see what you mean, but Christ said that we are a new creature when we accept him. people truly change when they start believing so i truly don't think she did that in a malevolent way :)
@@stamzthehuman897 because he can tell? Maybe the person is South African? I'm British and I get how people can get confused between British and South African accents but ultimately, he does not sound British.
Everyone in this thread is attacking Chelsea but it was really Raven who was the manipulative one. She dove head-long into Christianity, called herself "saved," and didn't integrate any of her shadow side. The red flags are never ending.
@@Orius25 i think the people there noticed did you see at the end how everyone were talking and hugging and no one talked to or gave her a hug lol she's kinda just standing there.
I see her as someone who realised cheating was the biggest mistake of her life. She knows what she did, she knows how she felt, and she hates that she's done it. That's how i see her, my opinion !
The conversation around "not telling someone you cheated to spare them" wtf yea so let them live in a lie instead, put their health at risk without their knowledge or consent, gaslight and manipulate them into second guessing their intuition to a point they canr trust it anymore .. thats a wild stand point to me. If you want to "spare" them LEAVE THEM thats the truly SELFLESS thing to do lol. WHAT!?!?!
Seriously, also the argument that's it's selfish to tell them because it eliviates guilt is crap. It doesn't matter if makes the cheater feel any better, they deserve to know.
Blonde lady saying “we all play a part in cheating society included” euhm what do I have to do with you deciding to go mess with someone else ??? The cheaters were really trying to convince themselves that what they do/did is okay when it never is.
Yes I couldn’t believe her saying that! How does society cause you to cheat?!! 😅 I couldn’t believe anyone was nodding along with anything that arrogant woman said!!!
i think it has less to do with society, more childhood, the community you were brought into, and the values you were born into/raised around. hurt people hurt people and thats probably why people cheat in the first place. still unjustifiable though dont get me wrong!
11 місяців тому+7
@@mahadewiiiiso arrogant! And completely delusional with half of the things she was saying
I think Sophie was the only Cheater that has come to terms with the fact that what she did was awful. The others did some mental gymnastics to be like, "but I'm better now" whereas she was like "i promised myself and my partner that if I started feeling that way again and wanted to cheat, I would tell him." I think that she was more honest than the others because she also was cheated on
Thank you for your kind words. I did a lot of work both in and out of therapy to find the root causes of my repeated cheating and to become a better version of myself. I haven't cheated on anyone in over 5 years. I can't take back the hurtful things I've done or said, but I can work every day to be a better person.
@@sophiemilkes I also really appreciated that you talked about how learning you didn't have to forgive was a way of healing and that it eventually becomes indifference. My recovery from things in life has generally been atypical, and it took me a long time to find because I didn't know there were ways. I couldn't forgive my mom, so I felt like I could never get better because the narrative is you have to forgive for yourself. When I learned it doesn't have to be that way, I was free. I don't forgive my mom, but I also don't have any pent up negative energy towards her either. Sometimes when I talk about this, people who did do the "typical" route for recovery get defensive and push back that I must be holding onto anger and things. I don't know, it's just frustrating when I just want to share with people that recovery isn't one specific path, so thanks for vocalizing it too.
@@AsapChalanor a sa victim. I personally was manipulated whilst under the influence even though i had said no sober multiple times and no drunk- when i was alot more drunk than they were. They manipulated me by saying were just friends its not cheating when i said no im in a relationship (which i had just rambled on abt how great he was and showing pics of him). They said he doesn’t have to know if he thinks it is cheating. And kissing isnt cheating. And then reiterated were just friends its not cheating and got moody with me until i gave in. I live with that guilt of the two kisses we had every day but I learnt not to put myself in that situation again no matter how much I trust my “friend”.
I think of the pain of a partner maybe my husband or wife one day cheating and nothing came of it (always protected, contraception, they already cut it off, has stopped and decided they are dedicated to me) while I had no idea thinking my marriage is going great, and because of their own feelings of guilt they tell me and decide that I have to be judge, jury, and executioner just so they feel "accountable" and "absolved" meanwhile I'm devastated, lost all self-worth, my whole life has fallen apart and I'm traumatized and devastated over something already done and managed. It's not my emotional burden to bare. I rather not know.
@@torysings7468 so you would rather live in a lie than have your partner actually respect you enough to give you the facts of your relationship? Thats horrifying and pathetic.
"its not my place to dictate what someone else needs, they need to tell me what they need"... LADY, YOURE IN A COMMITTED RELATIONSHIP I THINK THAT KINDA TELLS YOU WHAT THEY NEED
When you cheat on someone, you need to tell the person you cheated on to give them the choice to leave or to say. Every day you don't tell them you're allowing them to continue to waste their time with a cheater and that might not that be their choice.
Also its a breaking of trust a again. I mean i think i couldnt continue a Relationship either way but i would have more a change or even more respect when the tell the truth. Becouse honesty is so important.
I agree! To add to your point, if the cheating was physical, the cheater has put their partner's health at risk if they chose to still be physical with their partner as well. Another point to add is that whoever knows about the affair has an unfair advantage over the partner who is clueless. It is imperative for someone who cheats to be honest with their partner.
She said we all play a part?I was a doting spouse, supported my husband,cooked 3 meals a day,and cleaned. I also worked. My ex-husband even admitted that I did nothing wrong. He still cheated during my entire pregnancy and I found out days after our child was born. He snap chatted girls while I was in the hospital recovering. He also SA'd me during our separation. How did I play a part in that?
Let's not forget that cheaters can put your physical health at risk. You absolutely need to tell someone you've cheated especially if the original commitment was monogamous...surprised the topic of venereal diseases didn't come up.
This! So many women contracted diseases from their cheating partners. I don't think they realize that they are putting their partners health at risk by not using protection.
Them being suiccdal was not enough to keep you faithful and not cheat, but once the cheating is finished, now you're suddenly prioritizing their mental health and dont want to tell them so that you don't increase their emotional burden?
She picked him because she’s a manipulator and a “suicidal” type person is a prime example of someone struggling and a great choice for someone who wants to take advantage. It’s bordering on psychopathic.
this comment is amazing. it proves that it's just an excuse not to tell someone. if you truly cared about their mental and emotional health, you wouldn't have cheated on them in the first place.
Chelsea seems very manipulative. I think she has brainwashed herself to live with what she did. The language twisting and the narratives pushed just didn’t seem genuine.
58:06 she actually councils other women. I was thinking either her therapist filled her head with delusions or she is one herself. I can’t imagine how she’s twisted some people’s minds into thinking like she does. Why is it always the people who need the most therapy are actually the therapists?
@@raimeyewens7518 definitively, I think she inadvertently said it herself. Yes, a relationship needs fulfilled individuals but to say she’s the only one that matters was just so showing. Scary that these are the loudest voices and counseling others to make decisions in life.
@@JoseAFV1907she didn’t say she’s the only person that matters she says she has to be the most important person to herself. But I see why people would say that’s jarring because we are told that self sacrifice is the only way to make a relationship work.
Chelsea is so incredibly smart. She has figured out how to convince herself that she's not a terrible person, was able to educate all the noncheaters about how wrong they are, AND has even made a living in counseling other people that are presumably going through similar situations. Absolutely brilliant.
Yup! And tries to reason to others how they're wrong for nor being self centered like her! She admitted she puts herself first in all aspects, which is disgusting behavior.
@@gorillagrip111 It’s the way she said it. Of course we should take care of ourselves first, BUT we absolutely have a responsibility to consider the feelings of the people in our lives before we act. Her whole point was I will always put myself first and do what I want to do, regardless of how anyone around me feels.
Anyone who says cheating is not wrong is either: a) a moron b) a cheater who is defending themselves c) someone who was obsessed (in a romantic way) with a cheater d) all of the above
these cheaters still seem to lack the self awareness to truly understand how evil their actions were, all of their answers were incredibly self centered very rarely did they look at things from their victims pov
Chelsea will say you can't control how someone else feels, but will try to control how someone else feels by not telling them that you cheated. It is hypocritical.
Cheating ruined my family. I was raised by a single father who cried for the first 4 years of my life. It's engraved into me to hate cheaters. If I know you're cheating on your partner, I will tell them. I shouldn't know that and they should. I have always told. End of story.
Chelsea is lowkey just yapping like bro asked her at 36:27 if it was love or lust and she literally didn't answer she's literally doing mental gymnastics
The whole time she gave me the vibes that she's using all these words and psychology speak to seem more intellectual and mature, but beyond the surface she wasn't really saying anything of substance. Just trying to make herself look better, yet never taking accountability for her actions. Correct me if I'm wrong, but her main takes were: she doesn't like playing the "blame game" when it comes to cheating (convenient when you're the one in the wrong), thinks it's wrong and selfish to come clean and tell someone you cheated on them (also convenient, as you get to get away thinking it's not as bad to have cheated because the other person can't be hurt if they don't find out), and thinks cheating isn't the cheater's fault on certain circunstances.
No she's not doing "mental gymnastics," she's self reflecting on how to apply those two terms to her situation because she acknowledges that there is gray area.
I've been cheated on and in my opinion, if you don't see any way to fix whatever you feel is wrong you should just be straightforward with your partner and end it. There's no need to cheat, if you want to search what your missing with another person then don't be in a relationship. I know some will say "it's not that simple" and everything else, but at the end of the day cheating is a choice because if you truly want to be with someone else you can end your relationship way before you do anything physical with another person.
I was expecting lots of comments about Chelsea too. She seems very narcissistic and trying to avoid any type of blame on herself. The gaslighting from this woman is astounding.
@@martingarno9815 Confused by what you mean. How would my being a therapist stop me from diagnosing her with a mental health disorder? What medications would you prescribe somebody with a narcissistic personality disorder? A psychiatrist would be unnecessary in this instance.
I clocked her as one before she even spoke. Autism rizz at work once again lol. No but for real, she's insane. Look in her eyes and look at her body language and how she tries to police everyone around her, and her subtle little passive aggressive jab at the guy who mistakenly walked forward for the final(?) question. I would not trust her in a room with ANYONE.
She like presented herself as an expert. I wonder if she's in psychology or has a degree or appointed herself as a counselor. That's wild. Even if she has a degree in that makes her opinions even more wild. I mean she basically made sense, yes you need to be a complete person who loves yourself to be in a relationship. But everything else was just weird.
These cheaters scare me. I think unless you go through a lot of work on yourself a destructive pattern will always be repeated. So much manipulation, lack of respect for others, and lies
This WHOLE time I was thinking “I need to know the blonde lady’s occupation bc I just KNOW she’s a therapist” bc the therapy speak was driving me crazy, and FINALLY at 58 minutes in she says “the people I counsel” lol I feel so validated
its actually so sad when you truly think about it bc there are so many therapists warping peoples minds to think certain behavior is normal or not hurtful. i hated her talking about how everyone should be basically selfish no matter what. “always put myself first” thats not how most marriages, work, other relationships…i could go on, but that is literally the worst advice/thing i heard in this video. bc thats how people cheat, they are not thinking about anyone outside themselves
Chris saying he cheated because he didn't have a father figure... Bruh that makes no sense 💀 i know plenty people without father figures who don't cheat, just making up excuses
It's only one piece of the puzzle that I'm trying to figure out. I don't blame my actions on any one part of my past. I take full accountability for my actions. I'll always be a work in progress. ✌🏻
It reminds of that meme where guys say "I cheated because my grandma died two years ago and I didn't have a dad and one time my mom put me on restriction and I had a dog that was hit by car" or something lol Like what bro?!
People who come from single parent households are statistically much more likely to cheat. It's not an excuse, but it does explain what makes some people more prone to cheating than others. Understanding human psychology and behaviour is not the same as justifying it.
@@chrissiroisit’s almost like you didn’t delve deeper and give more clarification that made sense lol @elisestevenson9120 him saying that he didn’t have a father was not his excuse for why he cheated. It was a prefacing statement into the real reason that was he was raised by and primarily surrounded by women and learned to crave their attention and what not. THAT was the reason he was a cheater.
@@MrStevo411 well, it wasn't like this was going to answer all of the questions. It was a very limited discussion and there are so many pieces that go into our dysfunctions. I'm on a quest to just be a better person and being a part of this conversation was interesting to say the least. ✌🏻
Chelsea said “ I matter most over anybody else and I come first” then said “ telling your partner you cheated is wrong because you’re just relieving yourself of guilt and shame” BUT THEN SAID “ its wrong to tell your partner because you’re going to cause trauma” according to her, telling her partner would’ve been the best thing for her since she looks out for number 1 but she contradicts herself by saying she’s trying to spare the emotions of the other person. She’s literally contradicting herself just to justify her actions in every prompt 🤦♂️
Agreed! Why did he keep giving Chelsea the floor?? She was clearly manipulating the conversation and overriding other people an problematic ways. I would have loved to hear more from the less talkative folks in the room
Well everybody sort of already knows the generalized opinion of those that were cheated on. But no one really knows much behind the thoughts of those that were cheaters. So I feel like it was nice to hear more of their viewpoint... 🤷♂️
Yeah, they really are trying to justify their behavior. It’s even worse when you consider that some of their spouses have allowed it to happen, meaning that they’re enabling them.
Chelsea's answers scream that she doesn't think she really did anything wrong... she got a beautiful life out of cheating, basically. The thing is, she didn't have to cheat to get that life!! Just don't cheat. It's cowardly and low class. Own your ugliness (the kind on the inside) and teach others through acknowledging your mistakes.
she acts as if there is NOTHING wrong with what she did. i’m not qualified to diagnose anyone by any means but her justifications seem very narcissistic to me. the mental gymnastics she does is on another level. it seems like she learned nothing from her actions and it’s insane to see someone who clearly made a mistake not see it that way…
This is the thing...I understand falling out of love or falling in love with someone else but before you act on it...be a goddamn adult and go through the garbage and pain of a breakup. Who wouldn't rather be broken up with than cheated on? It's just chickensh*t to do that to someone you supposedly love.
Not only did she do mental gymnastics. I was under the impression she works as a therapist or life or coach or something based on her responses in this video, basically, she teaches these mental gymnastics to other people. Her interruptions were "this is wrongspeak, use language that makes what I did look less bad".
chelsea just said she does everything for her, she’s selfish and she has to fulfill herself but then when it came down to confession to cheating she says she’s not gonna do it to save their feelings but it sounds like she just doesn’t wanna take the blame.
The guy in stripes is so hurt :( , I fell sorry for him. This is the reason why cheating on someone is not a joke or a mistake, you are actively hurting someone who is trusting on you.
@@_CetarialThere isn’t any. If anything you’re putting yourself in a huge position of danger if the abuser finds out. If you’re in a abusive relationship, you’re mind should be on survival and trying to get out of that relationship.
When someone cheats and the conversation is about cheating, there is no blame game: the cheater is responsible for their decision and action and so they are to "blame."
I was shocked that whoever said that they "don't want to play the blame game" but are unironically playing the blame game. Cheaters just never want to take 100% responsibility!
exactly. it makes me sad that keith thought that he was partially responsible for raven cheating, and it kinda seems like she put that idea in his head. i mean the fact they're still together says a lot too.
@@rosie2871i mean, there may be more things involved, and those things may not all be the fault of the cheater, but in the end the choice to cheat is fully of the cheater. If she was feeling emotionally abandoned, she should have talked to him, and either he would want to fix that and support her emotionally , or don't care about her emotions, and she would realize they should just divorce, but she did not, she jumped straight to the cheating, and that makes it all her fault
“what if someone was suicidal?” so not only did you cheat on someone that was your partner, but someone that was suicidal. i think that there are several preventable stages you would face before you even got to the point where you ask yourself “should i tell my suicidal partner i cheated?”
“We all played a part” Hard disagree. You don’t get to hold someone accountable for the shitty decision you made. Not happy? Speak to your significant other. Issues still persist with no resolution or effective communication? Then end the relationship. Not hard.
Apparently shame is too much that they’d rather rationalize their actions than actually communicate their unsatisfactory feelings. It’s pretty avoidant and pretty cowardly. She isn’t fooling anyone but herself with these pseudo-intellectualizations.
@Nintendoshi ur tripping 😭 intentions dont matter when your hurting someone the "intention" doesn't make hurting someone, the betrayal of trust etc etc any better. It's wrong on base level u the problem if u can't see that
The title might be “Is it wrong” but they ask a lot of deeper questions around emotional cheating, love for a cheater, and forgiveness. It’s actually very humanizing to hear for those that have been cheated on. Maybe watch the video before leaving a comment
Loved Leon, genuinely engaged with the prompts and seemed open to learn over just parroting his beliefs. He asked great questions and showed respect to everyone.
Wow Chelsea, reeking of narcissism from every pore. Even the fact, that she said that she hasn‘t loved anyone or the fact that falling in love is a choice „because you let it happen“. YIKES Her Ex-Partner dodged a shotgun by being cheated on by her.
@@starsigngirl9789Rule of thumb, if someone says they’re a cheater they’re typically a liar and deceitful which comes along with a cunning way of speaking and are often seemingly very honest (manipulative).
Raven FREQUENTLY posts on social media about how she cheated on her husband and he forgave her. I’m a Christian myself, but I found her points in this video just as infuriating. Attraction is natural. Just because you don’t say it out loud doesn’t mean that you are not attracted to men other than your husband.
Fr her argument that she can't be interested in other men because she's a christian woman is a bit cringe. Hun already cheated, she was interested in someone else, but she's unwilling to admit it which makes me think she hasn't grown as much as she advertises.
Exactly. And finding someone attractive doesn't necessarily mean that now you want to cheat on your partner. Attraction is natural, but cheating is choice.
@@Ray03595exactly Raven even said ‘please calm down’ because the second raven spoke Chelsea automatically started speaking over her. And even after she had that smug look on her face
She says that not telling them is not taking accountability… did you forget about the risk of STDs? Did you get tested? Not only breaking that person‘s trust, but you’re also putting their health in danger.
A lot of people think their way of thinking is the only way, just look at the comments sections. Everyone who disagrees with Chelsea's perspective is insulting and ridiculing her rather than just agreeing to disagreeing.
@@ElectronicCalifornia when people have an arrogant or hypocritical attitude it’s naturally repulsive to others. That’s what people are reacting to, and there’s nothing wrong with that. It (should) serve as a social learning tool for the person to become more empathetic in the future.
Cheaters keep talking about themselves and their growth and whatever trying to validate their actions but they didnt touch on how their actions affected their ex partners. Getting cheated on destroys part of your soul and your heart, it will make you wary in all your future relationships. Therapy helps but it will never fully remove the little thought at the back of your head telling you that your partner might cheat. On my side, i have no interest in having any kind of relationship or friendship with someone who cheated.
Apparently Chelsea is getting sued lmaooo, Chelsea has a history of posting another womens private messages and reading them in front of the internet. Please don’t ever even considered what she is saying in this video, she makes fun of women being cheated on and tries to perpetuate the idea that being blamed for cheating is archiac when in reality cheating is one the modest detrimental things that can affect a human being.
@@rosie2871 i was hoping some of the cheated on would take responsibility for the fact they didn't satisfy their partners and evolve to do better, but it never got bought up
Tbf a lot of serial cheaters have underlying trauma that they're not fully dealing with. I think they should seek therapy so that they can find happiness in themselves.
The thing is some people cheat and yes it about something else than the cheating sadly I am with a husband who is on the spectrum and have a hard time understand his own feelings. Now, he ain't a cheater but I understand and saw a serial cheater does not understand why they did cheat because they don't understand their behaviors so naturally they repeat it. It goes hand and hand with many behaviors not only cheating.
"I like to stear clear of the blame game because we all play a part." That's literally just saying everyone is to blame. That is the blame game. These cheaters should be on the Olympic mental gymnastics team. If you decided to cheat, you are to blame. The only person who could have stopped you from cheating is you. To say otherwise is delusional.
Love the discussion and respect to everyone who participated but one thing that I noticed is that most of the people who have cheated have replaced the definition of " love" with "infatuation"
You can bet money that there was a counceller (just like Chelsea) involved, when Keith figures it out he's gona be pissed. Been there done that, his partner Raven is a sociopath. Letting Chelsea participate tainted the discussion.
@@MarcoAce13she contradicts herself a lot bro. She said she cares about herself more than anyone else but she wouldn’t tell her partner because it might hurt them even tho ACCORDING TO HER (she said this) confessing your cheating relieves your guilt and shame.
What's wild to me is that some partners would cheat and then, they can look at you in the eyes and act like nothing happened. That's some psychotic stuff!
This part. I was gaslit and I had to gather the proof myself because they refused to tell me. Like not telling someone you cheated is WILD. Especially like if you were intimate since! Like damn lemme know if I need to get checked!!!
I love how Chelsea is walking around in circles. At one moment saying you cant play the blame game because 'everyone is at fault' and on another saying that you should "shirk off blame because what someone else does is a reflection of them, not you'. Just from those first 12 minutes I know she's someone who moves goalposts and alters reality to excuse guilt from cheaters.
It is NEVER WRONG to break a commitment if that relationship is no longer serving you. Your own personal, mental, physical, and spiritual well-being is sooooo much more important!
And a divorce would, by definition, be a breaking of a commitment. So every person who chooses to leave their partner is doing something wrong by your statement.
Does that include breaking your commitment to intimacy with your partner? If one partner is not keeping up their end of the relationship, why should the other?
@vr6gls you said it is always 100% wrong to break a commitment to your partner but you don't have to CHEAT to break a commitment. A marriage is a vow or commitment to be with someone forever but if that relationship falls apart and the people in it aren't being served in that relationship any longer breaking that commitment is not wrong. Keeping that commitment and forcing 2 people who are unhappy to stay in it, that would be wrong.
@@ravethomasthomashartwell girl no, but almost all of us know someone who has made a big mistake and then they try to quickly get forgiven and not face consequences by pushing the hurt party into Christian forgiveness. It’s toxic.
An unreleased prompt + an extended cut of Middle Ground: Cheaters vs Cheated On is up on our Patreon www.patreon.com/jubileemedia
Do libetarians vs liberals
Social democrats vs democratic socialism
Do Deaf people vs Blind people PLEASE ❤
@@sschimpfa
I really wish you guys would skip the hugging thing at the end. All I can imagine everytime is me in that situation feeling the pressure that I need to hug someone at the end but not wanting to inside, yet feeling like if I say no its gonna create this awkward atmosphere for everyone.
@@LennyTheHopelessno seriously I’d be genuinely uncomfortable , esp if I had to hug that chelsea woman 😭💀
you know what’s worse than a cheater? a cheater who thinks they did nothing wrong.
Nobody in the video did that tho
@@argent5196 Delusional child
@@argent5196Damn bro you got to comment on everyone’s comment? you’re hella defensive lol
@@biscutvein uh what I replied to like two comments 💀 and that’s how a comment section works
@@biscutvein but.. nobody in the video did that tho, still
Cheating is always wrong. Period.
It’s not always so black and white.
Not for Chelsea 🙄
@@jackthomas6952yes it is
@@jackthomas6952for this it is
@@jackthomas6952because you can always break up
Those who rationalize cheating probably have the talent to become a politician.
😂😂😂
Yes their key talent being a lack of morals and empathy. Agreed.
🤣
Yyyyaaaaassssssssssss!!!!!!!!!
Real😂
It's never the cheated on person's fault. Never let someone manipulate you into believing that.
It’s so wild to watch the cheaters put on a straight face if you’ve ever experienced it. Just be an adult and break up.
it may be a factor though but eventually you are responsible for yourself
Facts
@@youtubefans510Can't justify anything like that. Wrong is wrong. I can't say, "well I wanted that item, I needed it...couldn't afford it, it was priced too high...so I stole it. It's the sellers fault, he priced it too high. Wouldn't change the price. I had no choice..."
@@sunshinenday3439 half the population in france and india do not consider infidelity as morally wrong so that begs the question what is the definition of wrong and wrong for who ? there is no cosmic law that says infidelity is wrong , is it wrong for the animals , no they are just programmed to propogate the species , what is wrong is dishonesty although understandable dishonesty is actually unnatural you use less facial muscles for starters apparently and it doesn't illustrate disrespect by definition either people are afraid to be honest
The smugness of the woman in the blazer is absolutely wild-to say you don’t owe you *husband* the decency of telling him the truth, after you’ve made a vow to love him through sickness and in health, to then go on and *cheat* on him and *betray* his trust because you are selfish is just absolutely crazy to me.
yes omg i’m so glad someone is talking about this !! i literally couldn’t believe what i was hearing
she made my blood BOIL
and she’s still with the person she cheated with
A flawless relationship can be shattered by a fleeting moment-a kiss, a fling-that may have occurred many years prior. You might not even recall the face of the person involved in that momentary lapse. Yet, for your partner, it can spell the definitive end.
In numerous instances, one partner discovers betrayal, a grave error committed in a moment of recklessness. By the time the truth surfaces, the partner once cherished has moved on, leaving the betrayed to embark on the arduous journey of healing anew.
This scenario isn't confined to the past. A couple in their 70s found that other cheated them in their 30s
they divorced
Therefore, after solemnly vowing to stand by your partner in sickness and in health, to then betray that trust out of sheer selfishness is utterly incomprehensible to me.
Simply because you possess the capability to do something doesn't mean you should. Theology should remain a thousand feet away from practical, real-world decision-making.
Sad thing is I'm almost positive she has a tic tok page called "The other woman and the wife" where she pushes this narrative constantly and is really dismissive of the betrayed and makes it seem like cheating is okay. She's messed up and still doing whatever she can to make what she's done okay
It’s refreshing to see Middle Ground tackle a topic that has nothing to do with politics
Same, though a few apolitical Middle Ground videos are on absurd topics, such as flat earth, aliens, and astrology.
What do you mean? Politics and cheating are pretty much combined nowadays 😂
Could i ask how? @@LolaKlein
@@len-1768 flat earthers v. scientists is one of the best episodes, purely for the insanity of it
True. Although that one annoying girl Raven was being self-righteous and trying to impose her Christian superiority on Chelsea who's also a Christian 💀
I wanna see more videos on non-political topics like the flat Earth one.
Imagine you start dating someone and see them in a video defending cheating💀
😂😅
😂😂
...thats why I will never go to California 😂 everyone is crazy
No one really defended cheating
😂😂😂
You don’t love someone if you cheat on them period. If you can go out and cheat knowing someone is at home waiting for you, then you do not love them.
Period.
Facts 🎉
truer words than this haven’t been spoken
that's not true
it’s not that black and white. I personally have never cheated, however you can still love someone and put your selfish desires before them at the same time.
I would rather listen to those who have been cheated on, than those who have cheated while defending themselves
I appreciated both sides a lot. Mainstream narratives often focus on the victim. We seldom get a nuanced conversation from the cheaters, and especially not between the cheaters and cheatees in one setting. It was a rare opportunity.
@@Orius25 I see your point but in this case, it’s the cheaters who are trying to justify their actions and tell you otherwise
Me too
The fact that they are trying to justify themselves for cheating is rather more concerning
@@ievannn4741 true
Chelsea seems like the type of person who thinks she has figured it all out and therefore knows better than everyone else. It was so irritating to watch her treat others in such a patronizing way.
you can tell from the way both chelsea and raven were speaking and wording things that they view their subjective opinions on topic as fact and the superior way of thinking. 🙃
i thought i was the only one who noticed this since no one really mentioned it. She was treating the others in such an odd way, smiling/clapping whenever she "proved" a point (even though this isn't a debate competition), yet to get there she had to contradict herself many times to get there, even being called out on her hypocrisy.
@@shhhyourtooloud257I couldn’t stand her.
I was gonna say I felt the same about raven “I believe in the cross, and the Bible, the whole Bible, not just one portion of the Bible” like girl get over yourself😂
@@Mrturtle.4she was doin that to be funny toward Chelsea haha.
Hearing Chelsea say “what if you have a partner that’s suicidal” trying to justify not disclosing cheating made me roll my eyes. Like quit coming up with hypotheticals and doing mental gymnastics and just be real with yourself. You did something bad to somebody and they deserve to know so that they can heal properly instead of looking for answers.
If people were that truthful about things, they wouldn't have cheated in the first place. You see things as black and white but partners have to take accountability for their spouse's feelings at some point. If you've been with someone for x amount of time you could guess how they'll react to the truth.
@@kamuilasia5813How can someone be responsible for somebody else’s feelings?
If a partner is suicidal, she should be feeling worse about actually doing the action in the first place. I have to wonder why she got married.
if you don't know, it doesn't affect you, if you do know, that is only gonna cause you suffering for a while
besides, if they were worried about their partner being suicidal, they shouldn’t have cheated in the first place
The way Chelsea begins defining random words of the question to avoid the actual answer. 💀
jordan peterson take
Jordan Peterson does this
@@tlotlo7971 give me my comment back
I see Orion25 has nothing to say about this one 😂
I feel completely sorry for the guy in that couple he’s being lowkey gaslit into believing he deserved to be cheated on
Agreed.
Raven seems insufferable
@@Fnanaanf for real 🤦🏻♀️ she uses the bible to justify everything and follows “every part of it” but where was that resolve when you cheated 😒
well..thats because society says its always the mans fault
That Raven girl was so annoying and her Christian superiority over everyone is mind-numbing. Apparently she cares about the bible until she gets to the 'thou shall not lie' or 'thou shall not commit adultery' parts when she cheats.
Chelsea is literally a narcissist. The way she tries to dance around questions and validate her terrible behavior was insane.
This!! Total gaslighting narcissist! Doesn’t like being blamed. Typical.
I was thinking this too, she sees everything from the perspective of whats best for her and what benifits her. Theres no room in her head for thinking about someone elses feelings
I agree. She was scaring me. She seems emotionless.
@@anne-beritgunhildson598 Agreed, a relationship is about US not about YOU as an individual anymore. Marriage is supposed to be a union of two people. If someone can't think as a team and compromise for the sake of the relationship, then they shouldn't even be in one.
Glad I’m not the only one who peeped that
55:16 “if you have a suicidal partner…”
you shouldn’t cheat on them in the first place . ESPECIALLY if they are suicidal.
While I agree. I have heard from friends that they can't bring up "breaking up" because then they will "off themselves"
So they cheat
@@Re69. that’s horrible
Sometimes they will threaten to K themselves if they sense their partner is going to breaking up with them.
@@Re69.exactly what happened in my relationship, though the action was inexcusable its hard to understand and explain unless youve been through it
@@Re69. But that's not their responsibility though they're doing nothing wrong by breaking up with them I've only ever heard that come up if the person is using offing themselves as a way of manipulation
From the "cheated" group, I enjoy how Sophie is talking about it: not justifying, not blaming others (Raven, I am looking at you), just acknowledging how deeply she fucked up, and trying to be better. I love the honesty
Raven is some top tier gaslighter 😭 how she managed to convince the guy it was his fault he was cheated on
She was the least integrated person on the panel. She just dove into Christianity and convinced herself of the straight-and-narrow path without actually deeply interrogating her motives.
She was annoying because she has such strong beliefs when it comes to cheating but she’s a cheater
Raven is just that type of person who doesn't take responsibility for her actions, so she takes them out on others
Oh, you mean the woman who in the first sentence managed to say (paraphrasing): "As a cheater I can forgive cheaters, oh yea and as a Christian. Uh... err.. uh"
legittttt feel sorry for bro 😞
It’s Chelsea saying that she’d never forgive a cheater, then going on to say that she’s cheated multiple times💀
She also claims everything she did with the guy she cheated with was in the best interest for both of them. Delusional!!! She never states remorse or regret for hurting her partner at the time that she cheated on.
@@jazzycola narcissist behaviour
I'm convinced she just wanted to talk for every single prompt
She also said she would date a cheater so 😭😭
I just blank her out when she talks.
This blond woman seems like someone who would go to therapy and then tell the therapist “well actually you should be telling me this”
Can't remember rolling my eyes so much in one episode.
Lmaoooo when she said telling your partner that you cheated isnt accountability I screamed 😂😂😂😂😂
@@amandamorgan8047🙄 she's a different kind of special.
@@chiefnama790 nope...just your typical k
She strikes me as someone who has done therapy and has integrated her experiences. I valued her viewpoints.
If I get cheated on then thats an immediate deal breaker.
That part 🎉
agreeded
its funny how cheaters are trying so hard to convince themselves that cheating is okay
Fr, I laughed whenever one of them opened their mouth. It's ridiculous.
Cheating on men should be normalized i dgaf
Seriously LMFAOOOOOOO
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat ofc it's a swifty talking
Gross how it seems like it's becoming normalizing
Cheating is always wrong. Taking responsibility for getting cheated on is crazy. If you’re not happy in a relationship then JUST LEAVE. Simple as that
Nope, women who are trapped in relationships can cheat on their abusive partners.
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweathmm I can see why that is okay, but I feel like this could just make the woman get more abused and put her in a worse situation if the abuser were to find out
@@TaylorswiftarmpitsweatI feel like if you are in an abusive relationship, you cheating and getting caught will 100% make things a lot worse for your safety. I think your safety should be no.1 priority rather than cheating on your abuser, not because it isn't moral but because you are literally just putting yourself in danger.
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat
How can a woman be trapped in a relationship?
Are you talking about a kidnapped hostage?
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat If all you’re gonna do is post rage bait bullcrap then please stop posting. You’re adding nothing to this conversation.
The fact that Chelsea is "counselling" women is worrying.
she seems so proud... crazy
It looks like she is a life coach. That is an unregulated title in America and obtaining training to be a life coach is up to the individual. You can be a life coach without any training. To be a counselor in the US, someone has to have a master’s (or a bachelors in some states) and have a license to offer counseling.
Edited for clarity.
VERY!
No it’s not she made perfect sense
@@argent5196You're pathetic and delusional
Raven 'Cheater': "I don't look at other men and think that.. I can't do that" ..................... ok how did you earn that title queen💀
lmfaooo
People change. She’s the only cheater who admits that cheating is actually wrong
@@ancie552but she does it in a way that separates herself from said cheaters. she’s just as bad as them and chooses words and religion to make it seem like she’s above when she earned that title for a reason.
@@abigail5242 i see what you mean, but Christ said that we are a new creature when we accept him. people truly change when they start believing so i truly don't think she did that in a malevolent way :)
She literally said she changed
i loved that british dude, he asked hard questions and had pretty solid opinions
He’s South African
@@niyajawn How do you know
He was eating Chelsea up
@@annetteoleary5691 I don't see the relation
@@stamzthehuman897 because he can tell? Maybe the person is South African? I'm British and I get how people can get confused between British and South African accents but ultimately, he does not sound British.
Raven is acting like she didn’t cheat, and that she could never, and it’s just heartbreaking
Everyone in this thread is attacking Chelsea but it was really Raven who was the manipulative one. She dove head-long into Christianity, called herself "saved," and didn't integrate any of her shadow side. The red flags are never ending.
@@Orius25 i think the people there noticed did you see at the end how everyone were talking and hugging and no one talked to or gave her a hug lol she's kinda just standing there.
@@patrickcazer she walked off as soon as everyone started hugging
@@Spijen she didn't, if you go to 1:06:10 you can see her standing in the middle while everyone is hugging. that was someone else who walked off
I see her as someone who realised cheating was the biggest mistake of her life. She knows what she did, she knows how she felt, and she hates that she's done it. That's how i see her, my opinion !
if someone cheated on you, the person does not love you enough.
The conversation around "not telling someone you cheated to spare them" wtf yea so let them live in a lie instead, put their health at risk without their knowledge or consent, gaslight and manipulate them into second guessing their intuition to a point they canr trust it anymore .. thats a wild stand point to me. If you want to "spare" them LEAVE THEM thats the truly SELFLESS thing to do lol. WHAT!?!?!
Seriously, also the argument that's it's selfish to tell them because it eliviates guilt is crap. It doesn't matter if makes the cheater feel any better, they deserve to know.
Middle Ground Idea: Parents whose child ended a relationship with them vs child who stopped having a relationship with their parent
Love this idea!
Incredible idea
yo me and my dad should be there, except he dont speak English, only Spanish
You should’ve phrased this better…Unless you’re from Alabama🌚
This would be so interesting !!
Blonde lady saying “we all play a part in cheating society included” euhm what do I have to do with you deciding to go mess with someone else ??? The cheaters were really trying to convince themselves that what they do/did is okay when it never is.
yup that was so random
Yes I couldn’t believe her saying that! How does society cause you to cheat?!! 😅 I couldn’t believe anyone was nodding along with anything that arrogant woman said!!!
Tell it!! 😭😭😭 Chelsea is ummm.....
i think it has less to do with society, more childhood, the community you were brought into, and the values you were born into/raised around. hurt people hurt people and thats probably why people cheat in the first place. still unjustifiable though dont get me wrong!
@@mahadewiiiiso arrogant! And completely delusional with half of the things she was saying
I think Sophie was the only Cheater that has come to terms with the fact that what she did was awful. The others did some mental gymnastics to be like, "but I'm better now" whereas she was like "i promised myself and my partner that if I started feeling that way again and wanted to cheat, I would tell him." I think that she was more honest than the others because she also was cheated on
Thank you for your kind words. I did a lot of work both in and out of therapy to find the root causes of my repeated cheating and to become a better version of myself. I haven't cheated on anyone in over 5 years. I can't take back the hurtful things I've done or said, but I can work every day to be a better person.
agreed all the others seemed like they were trying way too hard to defend themselves while she admitted fault and changed
@@edenoliver2005if she changed, she wouldn't need her partner to prevent her from cheating again.
@@sophiemilkes I also really appreciated that you talked about how learning you didn't have to forgive was a way of healing and that it eventually becomes indifference. My recovery from things in life has generally been atypical, and it took me a long time to find because I didn't know there were ways. I couldn't forgive my mom, so I felt like I could never get better because the narrative is you have to forgive for yourself. When I learned it doesn't have to be that way, I was free. I don't forgive my mom, but I also don't have any pent up negative energy towards her either. Sometimes when I talk about this, people who did do the "typical" route for recovery get defensive and push back that I must be holding onto anger and things. I don't know, it's just frustrating when I just want to share with people that recovery isn't one specific path, so thanks for vocalizing it too.
@@jamesmcdonnell2455change isn't black and white. And happens in steps. And she's taken BIG steps to hold herself accountable.
Chelseas smug smiles throughout are GROSS!
The girl saying she doesnt look at other men as attractive but cheated... GROSS
I’ve been cheated on, it’s one of the worst feelings in the world. It is NEVER justified no matter what.
Especially when they blame you for it
Not unless you are a dv victim
@@AsapChalanor a sa victim. I personally was manipulated whilst under the influence even though i had said no sober multiple times and no drunk- when i was alot more drunk than they were. They manipulated me by saying were just friends its not cheating when i said no im in a relationship (which i had just rambled on abt how great he was and showing pics of him). They said he doesn’t have to know if he thinks it is cheating. And kissing isnt cheating. And then reiterated were just friends its not cheating and got moody with me until i gave in. I live with that guilt of the two kisses we had every day but I learnt not to put myself in that situation again no matter how much I trust my “friend”.
Most of us have lol
@@AsapChalanjust leave omg cheating is still not ok.. no excuses
Leon was my favorite to listen to. He always had thoughtful and logical questions, comments and responses.
His positions all seemed well thought out and reasonable
Underrated comment fr
Fr he's so real
He isn't trying to justify anything
Just being real
He was the most balanced and came with the intention of asking the whys and how’s. He didn’t pass judgment at all.
I can’t understand not wanting to not know you were cheated on when we live in a world where STIs exist.
I think of the pain of a partner maybe my husband or wife one day cheating and nothing came of it (always protected, contraception, they already cut it off, has stopped and decided they are dedicated to me) while I had no idea thinking my marriage is going great, and because of their own feelings of guilt they tell me and decide that I have to be judge, jury, and executioner just so they feel "accountable" and "absolved" meanwhile I'm devastated, lost all self-worth, my whole life has fallen apart and I'm traumatized and devastated over something already done and managed.
It's not my emotional burden to bare. I rather not know.
Plus, it's continuing a relationship under false pretenses, which makes it impossible for a person to honestly consent to move forward with them.
@@torysings7468 so you would rather live in a lie than have your partner actually respect you enough to give you the facts of your relationship? Thats horrifying and pathetic.
Seriously. Ignorance is not bliss
"its not my place to dictate what someone else needs, they need to tell me what they need"... LADY, YOURE IN A COMMITTED RELATIONSHIP I THINK THAT KINDA TELLS YOU WHAT THEY NEED
Chelsea is the type of woman that just got back from a gentrified yoga retreat in a foreign country and thinks she’s better than everyone else now.
Eat pray love-esk
HAHA
EXACTLY.
Superiority complex at its best. I can't stand it when people act like that. 🙄
😭😭😭
I liked Leon a lot. He’s the type of guy I’d want to just chat with on a park bench.
When you cheat on someone, you need to tell the person you cheated on to give them the choice to leave or to say. Every day you don't tell them you're allowing them to continue to waste their time with a cheater and that might not that be their choice.
Also its a breaking of trust a again. I mean i think i couldnt continue a Relationship either way but i would have more a change or even more respect when the tell the truth. Becouse honesty is so important.
I agree! To add to your point, if the cheating was physical, the cheater has put their partner's health at risk if they chose to still be physical with their partner as well. Another point to add is that whoever knows about the affair has an unfair advantage over the partner who is clueless. It is imperative for someone who cheats to be honest with their partner.
yup!! 💯%
She said we all play a part?I was a doting spouse, supported my husband,cooked 3 meals a day,and cleaned. I also worked. My ex-husband even admitted that I did nothing wrong. He still cheated during my entire pregnancy and I found out days after our child was born. He snap chatted girls while I was in the hospital recovering. He also SA'd me during our separation. How did I play a part in that?
Let's not forget that cheaters can put your physical health at risk. You absolutely need to tell someone you've cheated especially if the original commitment was monogamous...surprised the topic of venereal diseases didn't come up.
This! So many women contracted diseases from their cheating partners. I don't think they realize that they are putting their partners health at risk by not using protection.
Yes!!!!
This!!!!
Was waiting for the STI topic to be brought up the whole time... That's one of my main issues with cheating.
YES!!!!
Them being suiccdal was not enough to keep you faithful and not cheat, but once the cheating is finished, now you're suddenly prioritizing their mental health and dont want to tell them so that you don't increase their emotional burden?
Is so funny how evil they are😂
This!
She picked him because she’s a manipulator and a “suicidal” type person is a prime example of someone struggling and a great choice for someone who wants to take advantage. It’s bordering on psychopathic.
this comment is amazing. it proves that it's just an excuse not to tell someone. if you truly cared about their mental and emotional health, you wouldn't have cheated on them in the first place.
Chelsea seems very manipulative. I think she has brainwashed herself to live with what she did. The language twisting and the narratives pushed just didn’t seem genuine.
Narcissistic gaslighting.
58:06 she actually councils other women. I was thinking either her therapist filled her head with delusions or she is one herself. I can’t imagine how she’s twisted some people’s minds into thinking like she does. Why is it always the people who need the most therapy are actually the therapists?
@@raimeyewens7518 definitively, I think she inadvertently said it herself. Yes, a relationship needs fulfilled individuals but to say she’s the only one that matters was just so showing. Scary that these are the loudest voices and counseling others to make decisions in life.
@@JoseAFV1907she didn’t say she’s the only person that matters she says she has to be the most important person to herself. But I see why people would say that’s jarring because we are told that self sacrifice is the only way to make a relationship work.
@@jesstheromantic a degree of self sacrifice IS the only way a relationship can work, period.
This is disgusting. Lack of accountability and fear of the response to holding someone accountable..
Chelsea is so incredibly smart. She has figured out how to convince herself that she's not a terrible person, was able to educate all the noncheaters about how wrong they are, AND has even made a living in counseling other people that are presumably going through similar situations. Absolutely brilliant.
textbook narcissist
Yup! And tries to reason to others how they're wrong for nor being self centered like her! She admitted she puts herself first in all aspects, which is disgusting behavior.
@@Akili369what’s wrong with putting yourself first?
@@gorillagrip111 It’s the way she said it. Of course we should take care of ourselves first, BUT we absolutely have a responsibility to consider the feelings of the people in our lives before we act. Her whole point was I will always put myself first and do what I want to do, regardless of how anyone around me feels.
That’s because she loves the others 💀🤣🤣🤣
Anyone who says cheating is not wrong is either:
a) a moron
b) a cheater who is defending themselves
c) someone who was obsessed (in a romantic way) with a cheater
d) all of the above
pretty much
No one said it wasn’t wrong, but there are situations that are more nuanced than black and white.
What is a moron? I'm curious
Or, e) professional baseball players in the early 2000’s
@@SqueakyMcGee lol
“I’m a Christian I dont believe in having attraction outside of your marriage… I dont see other men” Literally cheated on your husband… 🙂 ok
she did say she changed so maybe she had a conversion after cheating...
You can think something is wrong and still do it lol. I think her point is she would be wrong to do that
Terrifying stuff... smh
she made no real argument. she just said im a christian the bible says and she still cheated.
Crazy
these cheaters still seem to lack the self awareness to truly understand how evil their actions were, all of their answers were incredibly self centered very rarely did they look at things from their victims pov
Chelsea will say you can't control how someone else feels, but will try to control how someone else feels by not telling them that you cheated. It is hypocritical.
True
Cheating ruined my family. I was raised by a single father who cried for the first 4 years of my life. It's engraved into me to hate cheaters.
If I know you're cheating on your partner, I will tell them. I shouldn't know that and they should. I have always told. End of story.
Same, I will not hold back, men or women
Lmfao damn you sang like a canary
@@freelikeyve for cheating on your partner, ya. That's it tho. Lmaoooo.
amenn
Chelsea is lowkey just yapping like bro asked her at 36:27 if it was love or lust and she literally didn't answer she's literally doing mental gymnastics
His question of: "when you cheated, did you meet the standard of what love means to you?" was so strong and she, once again, didn't answer it 😅
The whole time she gave me the vibes that she's using all these words and psychology speak to seem more intellectual and mature, but beyond the surface she wasn't really saying anything of substance. Just trying to make herself look better, yet never taking accountability for her actions.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but her main takes were: she doesn't like playing the "blame game" when it comes to cheating (convenient when you're the one in the wrong), thinks it's wrong and selfish to come clean and tell someone you cheated on them (also convenient, as you get to get away thinking it's not as bad to have cheated because the other person can't be hurt if they don't find out), and thinks cheating isn't the cheater's fault on certain circunstances.
Listen itnwas crazy. I was like girl you said a lot to say nothing
@@declaracionespolemicas yep I thought her takes were completely wild and audacious, considering she was the cheater 😂
No she's not doing "mental gymnastics," she's self reflecting on how to apply those two terms to her situation because she acknowledges that there is gray area.
I've been cheated on and in my opinion, if you don't see any way to fix whatever you feel is wrong you should just be straightforward with your partner and end it. There's no need to cheat, if you want to search what your missing with another person then don't be in a relationship. I know some will say "it's not that simple" and everything else, but at the end of the day cheating is a choice because if you truly want to be with someone else you can end your relationship way before you do anything physical with another person.
Why isnt anyone talking about Chelsea. Her entire persona is mental gymnastics to validate selfishness
Literally. I don't see anyone talking about her
I came to the comments fully expecting it to be a bunch of comments about Chelsea but this is the first I’ve seen
I commented she was a huge gaslightler an hour ago lol but before mine? 0 comments lol
I was expecting lots of comments about Chelsea too. She seems very narcissistic and trying to avoid any type of blame on herself. The gaslighting from this woman is astounding.
Yes I’m so puzzled by her one of her bad takes is saying confessing you cheated is NOT accountability 🤔🤔
As a therapist myself, I would investigate narcissism with Chelsea.
That's why they call the qualified one psychiatrist
@@martingarno9815 Confused by what you mean. How would my being a therapist stop me from diagnosing her with a mental health disorder? What medications would you prescribe somebody with a narcissistic personality disorder? A psychiatrist would be unnecessary in this instance.
I clocked her as one before she even spoke. Autism rizz at work once again lol. No but for real, she's insane. Look in her eyes and look at her body language and how she tries to police everyone around her, and her subtle little passive aggressive jab at the guy who mistakenly walked forward for the final(?) question. I would not trust her in a room with ANYONE.
@@HH-mr3iq
I think they meant there’s a reason Chelsea is a “life coach” instead of a qualified psychiatrist
hahahaha
The blonde cheater lady presents all her opinions as such fact it’s so unsettling I’m glad the cheated on people were not letting her gaslight them
She like presented herself as an expert. I wonder if she's in psychology or has a degree or appointed herself as a counselor. That's wild. Even if she has a degree in that makes her opinions even more wild. I mean she basically made sense, yes you need to be a complete person who loves yourself to be in a relationship. But everything else was just weird.
She's narcissistic. Period. I mean, textbook. Yikes
These cheaters scare me. I think unless you go through a lot of work on yourself a destructive pattern will always be repeated. So much manipulation, lack of respect for others, and lies
This WHOLE time I was thinking “I need to know the blonde lady’s occupation bc I just KNOW she’s a therapist” bc the therapy speak was driving me crazy, and FINALLY at 58 minutes in she says “the people I counsel” lol I feel so validated
its actually so sad when you truly think about it bc there are so many therapists warping peoples minds to think certain behavior is normal or not hurtful. i hated her talking about how everyone should be basically selfish no matter what. “always put myself first” thats not how most marriages, work, other relationships…i could go on, but that is literally the worst advice/thing i heard in this video. bc thats how people cheat, they are not thinking about anyone outside themselves
I doubt she's are real certified therapist, shes a life coach I bet lol
Yoooo I felt the same wayyy 😂
She’s not a therapist. She has a podcast and runs social media pages called, The Other Woman & The Wife.
I doubt she’s an actual therapist she seems too much of a know it all
Chris saying he cheated because he didn't have a father figure... Bruh that makes no sense 💀 i know plenty people without father figures who don't cheat, just making up excuses
It's only one piece of the puzzle that I'm trying to figure out. I don't blame my actions on any one part of my past. I take full accountability for my actions. I'll always be a work in progress. ✌🏻
It reminds of that meme where guys say "I cheated because my grandma died two years ago and I didn't have a dad and one time my mom put me on restriction and I had a dog that was hit by car" or something lol
Like what bro?!
People who come from single parent households are statistically much more likely to cheat. It's not an excuse, but it does explain what makes some people more prone to cheating than others. Understanding human psychology and behaviour is not the same as justifying it.
@@chrissiroisit’s almost like you didn’t delve deeper and give more clarification that made sense lol
@elisestevenson9120 him saying that he didn’t have a father was not his excuse for why he cheated. It was a prefacing statement into the real reason that was he was raised by and primarily surrounded by women and learned to crave their attention and what not. THAT was the reason he was a cheater.
@@MrStevo411 well, it wasn't like this was going to answer all of the questions. It was a very limited discussion and there are so many pieces that go into our dysfunctions. I'm on a quest to just be a better person and being a part of this conversation was interesting to say the least. ✌🏻
Chelsea said “ I matter most over anybody else and I come first” then said “ telling your partner you cheated is wrong because you’re just relieving yourself of guilt and shame” BUT THEN SAID “ its wrong to tell your partner because you’re going to cause trauma” according to her, telling her partner would’ve been the best thing for her since she looks out for number 1 but she contradicts herself by saying she’s trying to spare the emotions of the other person. She’s literally contradicting herself just to justify her actions in every prompt 🤦♂️
nailed it.
She sure did a lot of mental and word gymnastics to justify her narrative and bring everything back to her at literally every turn.
She’s a known sociopath.
Exactly.
If only she trained in actual gymnastics🌚 she would’ve dominated the Olympics 🤣
Chelsea is giving “yea i cheated and i’ll do it again.”
Ariana Grande vibes 😅
She for the streets…
LMAOOO😂@@osmanyousif7849
She probably blamed the partner when he found out
Buddy @20:50 she admits it. No conspiracy there. She has a side dude she is screwing even though she is married with 3 kids
I felt like the cheaters spoke the most and drove the conversation, especially Chelsea. I wish this was moderated better.
Agreed! Why did he keep giving Chelsea the floor?? She was clearly manipulating the conversation and overriding other people an problematic ways. I would have loved to hear more from the less talkative folks in the room
@@juiceycrutrue. Wanted to hear more from Leon and the others
Same 100% agree
Well everybody sort of already knows the generalized opinion of those that were cheated on. But no one really knows much behind the thoughts of those that were cheaters. So I feel like it was nice to hear more of their viewpoint... 🤷♂️
Yeah, they really are trying to justify their behavior. It’s even worse when you consider that some of their spouses have allowed it to happen, meaning that they’re enabling them.
Cheating is cowardly at best, sadistic at worst
real
Keith has been gaslighted so much that it’s sad
the moderator is giving chelsea way too much airtime lmao
She probably slept with him 😂
@babyb7001 you messy for that
@@babyb7001 My goodness. The door is open...GET OUT 😭
Because she made the most sense - correct or not.
@@aditi22012 hi Chelsea 👋
Chelsea's answers scream that she doesn't think she really did anything wrong... she got a beautiful life out of cheating, basically. The thing is, she didn't have to cheat to get that life!! Just don't cheat. It's cowardly and low class. Own your ugliness (the kind on the inside) and teach others through acknowledging your mistakes.
she acts as if there is NOTHING wrong with what she did. i’m not qualified to diagnose anyone by any means but her justifications seem very narcissistic to me. the mental gymnastics she does is on another level. it seems like she learned nothing from her actions and it’s insane to see someone who clearly made a mistake not see it that way…
A beautiful life, how?
This is the thing...I understand falling out of love or falling in love with someone else but before you act on it...be a goddamn adult and go through the garbage and pain of a breakup. Who wouldn't rather be broken up with than cheated on? It's just chickensh*t to do that to someone you supposedly love.
Not only did she do mental gymnastics. I was under the impression she works as a therapist or life or coach or something based on her responses in this video, basically, she teaches these mental gymnastics to other people. Her interruptions were "this is wrongspeak, use language that makes what I did look less bad".
@@jaimemarrero3982she has a podcast and runs social media pages called, The Other Woman & The Wife. She has no therapy background.
Once you cheat relationship is over.. You can forgive, but you never forget. Which will eventually end the relationship.
💯 that’s it; that’s all!
That's so true . You never can trust that person ever again. It's over
Yup, game over. Trust will never be restored.
chelsea just said she does everything for her, she’s selfish and she has to fulfill herself but then when it came down to confession to cheating she says she’s not gonna do it to save their feelings but it sounds like she just doesn’t wanna take the blame.
Ain’t no way people are defending cheaters 😭
Idc cheating on men is based
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat 🤢
fr
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweatwhat...
@@TaylorswiftarmpitsweatLeast insane Taylor swift fan.
The guy in stripes is so hurt :( , I fell sorry for him. This is the reason why cheating on someone is not a joke or a mistake, you are actively hurting someone who is trusting on you.
Can't believe this even needs an hour long discussion, it's always yes.
The discussion was more than just the title of the video.
I feel like there is one, single exception: Abusive relationships.
No
@@_CetarialThere isn’t any. If anything you’re putting yourself in a huge position of danger if the abuser finds out. If you’re in a abusive relationship, you’re mind should be on survival and trying to get out of that relationship.
@@xsenpai5179YES
Don't be in a relationship if you are going to cheat period!!! All these cheaters sound like narcissists!
When someone cheats and the conversation is about cheating, there is no blame game: the cheater is responsible for their decision and action and so they are to "blame."
Unless they are Chelsea 😒
I was shocked that whoever said that they "don't want to play the blame game" but are unironically playing the blame game. Cheaters just never want to take 100% responsibility!
exactly. it makes me sad that keith thought that he was partially responsible for raven cheating, and it kinda seems like she put that idea in his head. i mean the fact they're still together says a lot too.
@@rosie2871i mean, there may be more things involved, and those things may not all be the fault of the cheater, but in the end the choice to cheat is fully of the cheater. If she was feeling emotionally abandoned, she should have talked to him, and either he would want to fix that and support her emotionally , or don't care about her emotions, and she would realize they should just divorce, but she did not, she jumped straight to the cheating, and that makes it all her fault
@@San-lh8us are you agreeing with me or disagreeing lmao
“what if someone was suicidal?” so not only did you cheat on someone that was your partner, but someone that was suicidal. i think that there are several preventable stages you would face before you even got to the point where you ask yourself “should i tell my suicidal partner i cheated?”
“We all played a part”
Hard disagree. You don’t get to hold someone accountable for the shitty decision you made.
Not happy? Speak to your significant other. Issues still persist with no resolution or effective communication? Then end the relationship. Not hard.
no seriously when Chelsea said that I was floored
@@slypickle01 this episode is making me so mad lol
Apparently shame is too much that they’d rather rationalize their actions than actually communicate their unsatisfactory feelings.
It’s pretty avoidant and pretty cowardly.
She isn’t fooling anyone but herself with these pseudo-intellectualizations.
"we all played a part" - honey, I was at home waiting for my husband to come home, what part are speaking about??
exactly, its just theyre too scared to do so
Leon deserves all the happiness, bless him.
An hour long video? What are the cheaters even gonna say? this is gonna be humiliating😭😭😭😭
Maybe the whole point of the video is to give some perspective instead of immediately assuming ill intentions of people so quicky.
@Nintendoshi ur tripping 😭 intentions dont matter when your hurting someone the "intention" doesn't make hurting someone, the betrayal of trust etc etc any better. It's wrong on base level u the problem if u can't see that
@@a.k2354i agree and i think cheating in itself is VERY intentional.
exactly
The title might be “Is it wrong” but they ask a lot of deeper questions around emotional cheating, love for a cheater, and forgiveness. It’s actually very humanizing to hear for those that have been cheated on. Maybe watch the video before leaving a comment
Here for my boy Leon. He held this ep down.
exactly, he was such a grounding voice of reason
Half those cheaters were just delusional. Chelsea would say anything to justify her behavior.
Me, too, honestly. He seemed like the only one getting to the heart of the issues.
@@Ray03595, to be fair, all cheaters are pretty delusional.
Loved Leon, genuinely engaged with the prompts and seemed open to learn over just parroting his beliefs. He asked great questions and showed respect to everyone.
He was the best casting
True
Wow Chelsea, reeking of narcissism from every pore. Even the fact, that she said that she hasn‘t loved anyone or the fact that falling in love is a choice „because you let it happen“. YIKES Her Ex-Partner dodged a shotgun by being cheated on by her.
A lot of people use the word “narcissist” too loosely. Chelsea is absolutely a textbook narcissist
100 percent. I mean even turning it around and blaming the other person for what she did.
I like her 😂damn her narcissism is working
@@starsigngirl9789you’d be manipulated very easily.
@@starsigngirl9789Rule of thumb, if someone says they’re a cheater they’re typically a liar and deceitful which comes along with a cunning way of speaking and are often seemingly very honest (manipulative).
And she totally has a savior complex with her counseling job
Raven FREQUENTLY posts on social media about how she cheated on her husband and he forgave her. I’m a Christian myself, but I found her points in this video just as infuriating. Attraction is natural. Just because you don’t say it out loud doesn’t mean that you are not attracted to men other than your husband.
Fr her argument that she can't be interested in other men because she's a christian woman is a bit cringe. Hun already cheated, she was interested in someone else, but she's unwilling to admit it which makes me think she hasn't grown as much as she advertises.
he looks so sad in this video
@@jacobfschafferFelt like he was blaming himself for what happened, it was hard to watch🙁
Exactly. And finding someone attractive doesn't necessarily mean that now you want to cheat on your partner. Attraction is natural, but cheating is choice.
But telling someone straight up is so weird lol
Chelsea is so smug… her condescending smile questioning the other girl about her religion was insaneee
Chelsea disagreed with a lot of people in this video but she only seemed to treat Raven with such condescension and rudeness. Interesting.
Just out of curiosity, do you know how far in the video she made fun of religion? I can not find it.
@@shelbyschroder4140start at 30 minutes and it’s a few seconds after that
@@shelbyschroder4140 start at 30 minutes and it’s a few seconds after and lmk your thoughts lol
@@Ray03595exactly Raven even said ‘please calm down’ because the second raven spoke Chelsea automatically started speaking over her. And even after she had that smug look on her face
She says that not telling them is not taking accountability… did you forget about the risk of STDs? Did you get tested? Not only breaking that person‘s trust, but you’re also putting their health in danger.
Chelsea has this arrogant, “enlightened” energy that makes it seem like she thinks her way of thinking is THE way of thinking
So does Raven, I think that’s why they butted heads 😂
I’d say that’s more Raven
@@MarcoAce13 her too she’s that’s stereotypical holier than thou Christian
A lot of people think their way of thinking is the only way, just look at the comments sections. Everyone who disagrees with Chelsea's perspective is insulting and ridiculing her rather than just agreeing to disagreeing.
@@ElectronicCalifornia when people have an arrogant or hypocritical attitude it’s naturally repulsive to others. That’s what people are reacting to, and there’s nothing wrong with that. It (should) serve as a social learning tool for the person to become more empathetic in the future.
Cheaters keep talking about themselves and their growth and whatever trying to validate their actions but they didnt touch on how their actions affected their ex partners. Getting cheated on destroys part of your soul and your heart, it will make you wary in all your future relationships. Therapy helps but it will never fully remove the little thought at the back of your head telling you that your partner might cheat. On my side, i have no interest in having any kind of relationship or friendship with someone who cheated.
Why is Chelsea talking to everyone like she's a therapist or life coach. It's awkward.
She is actually now a relationships therapist on UA-cam and Instagram. Lol.
Life coaches without any educational credentials are just con artists.
@@Stellalovely1😮 deadass?
it’s still so weird because she isn’t THEIR life coaches she just is one
She is one. But she shouldn’t be 💀
Apparently Chelsea is getting sued lmaooo, Chelsea has a history of posting another womens private messages and reading them in front of the internet. Please don’t ever even considered what she is saying in this video, she makes fun of women being cheated on and tries to perpetuate the idea that being blamed for cheating is archiac when in reality cheating is one the modest detrimental things that can affect a human being.
The cheaters said exactly what you think they'd say.
None of them said the obvious
figured
thanks i didn't want to watch the full video but the title was interesting enough to click😭😭
yeah literally. i was hoping there would be cheaters that evolved into better people and take responsibility for what they did, etc but nope
@@rosie2871 i was hoping some of the cheated on would take responsibility for the fact they didn't satisfy their partners and evolve to do better, but it never got bought up
I love how she identifies as a serial cheater like it's an illness she has that she can't stop.
I feel like she has a sex addiction.
Tbf a lot of serial cheaters have underlying trauma that they're not fully dealing with. I think they should seek therapy so that they can find happiness in themselves.
LMAOO
The thing is some people cheat and yes it about something else than the cheating sadly I am with a husband who is on the spectrum and have a hard time understand his own feelings. Now, he ain't a cheater but I understand and saw a serial cheater does not understand why they did cheat because they don't understand their behaviors so naturally they repeat it. It goes hand and hand with many behaviors not only cheating.
Like she doesn’t have to be in a relationship. She can do her own thing.
Appreciating the beauty of somebody is not the same thing as feeling attracted to them.
I agree!
Well their point is that you're going to attracted to others
"I like to stear clear of the blame game because we all play a part." That's literally just saying everyone is to blame. That is the blame game. These cheaters should be on the Olympic mental gymnastics team. If you decided to cheat, you are to blame. The only person who could have stopped you from cheating is you. To say otherwise is delusional.
Love the discussion and respect to everyone who participated but one thing that I noticed is that most of the people who have cheated have replaced the definition of " love" with "infatuation"
Exactly. One of them even said she was in love with two people at once. By definition, that’s impossible lol
I feel bad for anyone in a relationship with Chelsea.
You can bet money that there was a counceller (just like Chelsea) involved, when Keith figures it out he's gona be pissed. Been there done that, his partner Raven is a sociopath. Letting Chelsea participate tainted the discussion.
Same with that Raven girl, she's insufferable with her Christian superiority and gaslighting Keith.
Sameeee
Why? She seems pretty smart
@@MarcoAce13she contradicts herself a lot bro. She said she cares about herself more than anyone else but she wouldn’t tell her partner because it might hurt them even tho ACCORDING TO HER (she said this) confessing your cheating relieves your guilt and shame.
What's wild to me is that some partners would cheat and then, they can look at you in the eyes and act like nothing happened. That's some psychotic stuff!
more neurotic but okay
This part. I was gaslit and I had to gather the proof myself because they refused to tell me. Like not telling someone you cheated is WILD. Especially like if you were intimate since! Like damn lemme know if I need to get checked!!!
I love how Chelsea is walking around in circles. At one moment saying you cant play the blame game because 'everyone is at fault' and on another saying that you should "shirk off blame because what someone else does is a reflection of them, not you'.
Just from those first 12 minutes I know she's someone who moves goalposts and alters reality to excuse guilt from cheaters.
Short answer is yes
Nope, cheating is justified against men.
Yep, cheating is wrong in any context of life
Exactly,short and simple 😅
Long answer is also yes
@@Taylorswiftarmpitsweat nice name😅.
Yes it is.
If you make a commitment to your partner, then break said commitment. That is 100% wrong.
It is NEVER WRONG to break a commitment if that relationship is no longer serving you. Your own personal, mental, physical, and spiritual well-being is sooooo much more important!
And a divorce would, by definition, be a breaking of a commitment. So every person who chooses to leave their partner is doing something wrong by your statement.
@@katiedid1983 Incorrect. Once a partner cheats. The foundation for which the relationship is based on has been broken.
Does that include breaking your commitment to intimacy with your partner? If one partner is not keeping up their end of the relationship, why should the other?
@vr6gls you said it is always 100% wrong to break a commitment to your partner but you don't have to CHEAT to break a commitment. A marriage is a vow or commitment to be with someone forever but if that relationship falls apart and the people in it aren't being served in that relationship any longer breaking that commitment is not wrong. Keeping that commitment and forcing 2 people who are unhappy to stay in it, that would be wrong.
Raven and Keith being a couple was a PLOT TWIST! She talking about “I’m a Christian” and cheated in a marriage?!
And they have children smh 😢😢😢
I hate when ppl try to run to religion after doing something horrible. It’s so played.
So Christians are perfect??? What??? Lol
That part!!
@@ravethomasthomashartwell girl no, but almost all of us know someone who has made a big mistake and then they try to quickly get forgiven and not face consequences by pushing the hurt party into Christian forgiveness. It’s toxic.
I always suffered through forgiveness and healed through anger. Everyone is different. Stop with the forgiving thing.