How OP would a Dragon/Fire Charizard be in Pokemon Yellow?
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- Опубліковано 22 січ 2024
- Charizard is one of the coolest Gen 1 Pokemon. It's also obviously a dragon. And yet, it never received the Dragon-type until it got a Mega Evolution as Mega Charizard X. But if we gave it its rightful typing in Gen 1, would it become the true Dragon King of Gen 1?
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Using three Swords Dances and being hit by six Flashes, Swift did almust quintuple damage thanks to the badge boost glitch.
Whats the badge boost glitch
@@GoldePantsIn gen 1, multiple badges give stat boosts. For example Boulderbadge (Brock gym) gives an attack boost. The glitch is that every time your stats get increased or lowered by a move, the badge boost is reapplied. So every time your Pokemon gets Leered/Flashed/etc, all of its stats are increased meaning you do a lot more damage and are faster if you are hit multiple times by stat changing moves
@@GoldePantsWhat Ghi says is correct--and its as broken as it sounds. I once literally took apart the entire Elite 4 with just a LVL 42 Starmie on 0 EXP--the badge boosts were THAT good!
@@GoldePants The Boulder Badge boosts Attack, the Thunder Badge boosts Defense, the Soul Badge boosts Speed, the Volcano Badge boosts Special.
If one of your stats get modified, the other stats are recalculated with the badge boosts when applicable.
Badge boosts are 12.5%, and it's that amount that gets added every time a stat gets modified. This does not add to the modified stat.
Example: If your Defense gets lowered, your Attack goes up by another 12.5%.
Yeah the badge boost glitch makes Swift legit good against Sabrina, even if she uses Reflect, it just doesn't matter
The reason Charizard isn't a Dragon is because the dragon typing is supposed to sort of be a surprise when you find Lance. It's even more elusive than the legendaries to encounter dragons. They're meant to be seen as a mythical typing.
More likely the Dragon type was an afterthought, similar to how Rock & Ground clearly weren't originally meant to be 2 different types given how many Rock/Ground mon there are.
Absolutely agree with that, but then they basically put no dragons in the game and no dragon moves to use. And honestly, if that was the goal they should have made Dratini only available in Cerulean Cave, but in actuality it's catchable in the Safari Zone and purchase able at the Rocket Game Corner
It has wings and it’s tail is on fire. Fire/flying makes complete sense. Charizard doesn’t have to be a dragon type, the same as Meowth doesn’t need to be a cat type.
@@MattWarb The difference is there is no cat type, but there is a dragon type and the firebreathing dragon-looking pokemon *probably* should be a dragon.
@@RBYPokemonChallengesSure, but put yourself in the shoes of kids when this game was new. Dratini was already pretty rare, and it doesn’t evolve into Dragonite until an absurdly high level-the highest in the game, in fact, and from a Pokemon that’s at a relatively low level compared to the rest of your team at the point that you find it. Furthermore, consider the original vision of this game. It wasn’t meant to be the modern competitive version of the game people think of now. The base game was designed as a single player experience that had the added immersion of being able to catch and use every monster that appears. Dragonite was supposed to be a wall that doesn’t have much in the way of clever workarounds to trounce-it is immune to every starter type and is only weak to ice (a late game type). This perspective is further bolstered by the defence-focused stat distribution of Dragonite.
Really, a lot of things people (zoomers) don’t understand about Gen 1 is fully rational when you consider that the game was built as a traditional JRPG that just so happened to allow for collecting all the monsters and facilitated socialising with the link cable. The design concept for these games was to recapture the sense of adventure the director felt was being lost to urbanisation in Japan. That’s why you explore all sorts of dungeons, get to collect monsters like catching bugs, and trade and battle with other players to promote meeting people in real life (like the old days he Satoshi Tajiri lived through).
One of the best uses of rare candies in gen 1 is to avoid levelling up mid battle and resetting the badge boost. Saving 2 rare candies, instead of using everything before Lorelei, is a good practice. 1 candy for Lance and the other for champion is often a good idea.
For sure. In this case, it wasn't really necessary on the Champion, but the Lance fight would have been better with one more RC on the bag
I really wish to see how overpowered _Gyarados_ would be if its second type was Dragon instead. It would improve Gyara's defensive profile quite a bit, with the only real loss being that ground immunity, and gen 1 gyara has a kinf of insane statline. Sure, it still would have the issue of not having a real stab move to use that huge attack stat, but between the HP, Special and Attack, it would be a very bulky and very strong mixed attacker (it already is one) with a decent speed tier and no real exploitable weaknesses or even actual type weaknesses (reminder that the only weakness of dragon+water before the introduction of the fairy type was Dragon, which... lacks a damaging move in gen 1 not called Dragon Rage).
I have already done this run and it's in the series upcoming.
@@RBYPokemonChallenges We will watch your career with great interest.
"I put my head below your body and I dig. You dig? We dig."
Aw yeah 😂
26:15 Blaines team in the anime was Rhydon (for some reason), Ninetales, and Magmar. It would've been cool if Blaine had Magmar in Yellow if for no other reason than you can't get it in Yellow, only Blue.
Trying to make sense of the anime is an exercise in insanity. There was 0 care put into making anything make logical sense. There's a reason one of the most popular fan theories is Ash died/was put into a coma in the by pikachu and the rest of the series was just a dream.
Rhydon because supposedly its rocky skin could survive handily in a volcano.
That's what I thought as a kid, at least.
@@goldenhate6649 Yeah, no point in trying to make sense of the anime. Fire types have a winning record against water types in the anime.
I forgot about the lightning-rod Rhydon being OHKOed by Pikachu lol. Anime was so ridiculous 😂. But I still say he should have had Magmar (which they fixed in Gen 2)
@@RBYPokemonChallenges To be fair, abilities didn't exist when the first anime came out.
What a great way to start the challenges for this year. Charizard was the dragon starter that we never got😂. It was really epic to watch Charizard get a better time,and the better Lance experience.
Hyper beam and swords dance were a great combo for the very end.
Dragon is such an op type that gen 1 ai just gives up.😂😂😂 Thanks for making this awesome video and thumbnail, because Charizard is definitely a Chad.
Chad-izard lol. Yeah this was fun to test out and see how much it improved
There's something that delights me about the only true Dragon in gen 1 being a silly noodle-into-big-friend line. Not the sea serpent, or the fire dragon, or the ancient wyvern. Just an amicable fella and his snake kids.
I love Dragonite dudes got himbo energy and I'm here for it
I was always the opposite. I wanted more dragons. But the again, I played Final Fantasy games religiously before Pokemon came out
Charizard can't learn Fly in Red/Blue, It was addressed in Yellow. It learns Wing Attack as of GSC. Gust, Thunder, and Twister can hit foes using Fly as of GSC. Gust and Twister hits foes using Fly for double damage as of GSC.
Ive always felt that fly should hit opponents in the air, & dig should hit opponents that are underground
@@bitterzombieEarthquake, Magnitude, and Fissure hits Dig users for double damage as of GSC. Surf and Whirlpool hits Dive users for double damage.
They also fixed Flamethrower making it level 34 instead of the insanity that is the gen 1 level it learns it at. If only they had fixed the other fire types in the game like vulpix and growlithe that also learn moves like flamethrower waaaay too late to be useful in normal runs.
"What do you mean, my FLYING, fire-breathing lizard CAN'T LEARN FLY?!"
Every kids' first R/B playthrough.
The reason it couldn't learn them was most likely for balancing since it would make Charizard the obvious pick in every run of the game. Charizard is already considered the best kanto starter. Imagine if that was objectively the case. The reason they allowed it to learn Fly in Yellow was because it was a wild Pokemon you had to catch instead of a Pokemon given to you at the start of the game.
First thought? Charizard as a Dragon is a solid defensive buff generally (Misty and Lance's Gyarados are the bane of many Fire Types, but Water is only 1x; Rock is only 2x, Electric is 1/2, and Grass is now 1/4), but the Ground moves (Viridian Gio, Champion Sandslash, maybe Bruno?) are going to be an issue. Lorelei might be easier if you can get to Slowbro easier, but Dewgong's and Cloyster's Ice Moves will still be 2x (yay, Gen1 shenanigans!).
Post-Video follow-up: slammed 1 too many Rare Candies at Lorelei (and speaking of her... oh, modified Dewgong AI)? Do a bunch of those resets go away if you use one right before Lance to not level up mid-fight? Either way, that burn on Sandslash to drop its attack on that Earthquake was clutch. I am not sure you have the sustain for a clean finish, otherwise.
All fair points. Definitely could have saved 1 Rare Candy. The Sandslash was clutch AF, but I think we can take one EQ without fainting, or at worst KO with a Crit.
Posted the minute I open UA-cam to look for a bedtime video. Godlike
God tier of Pokemon challenges
Pokemon runs at bedtime are super effective!
you know, if you wanna take this a step further, you can also make it so that Dragon Rage is 40 base power instead of dealing a flat 40 damage, that way they can make use of STAB
This run makes me wonder how the game modified Lance's Good AI. Dragon Rage should have played into it, so I get that he selected it on Gyarados far more than normal. I am trying to figure out why he used Hydro Pump, at all, even though he can "see" it would only be neutral damage instead of the Super-Effective Dragon Rage (even though Neutral STAB Hydro Pump off Gyarados's base 100 Special was hitting harder)?
The irony is that his winning run just had two Pump misses and zero uses of Dragon Rage.
@@travisalexander6440 From my understanding, Gen 1's checks for type-effectiveness are a bit wonky. When it checks type effectiveness, it will scan your Pokemon's types in a specific order. In this case, the game sees that Water is super-effective against Fire first, so it just assumes Hydro Pump is super-effective and doesn't actually look at the Dragon typing to notice that Water is actually neutral.
Lockirby2 is absolutely right. I'm going 5o dive into this more when I do the upcoming Lorelei AI run, but basically the game only checks the type effectiveness of one type against another based on a lookup table, and it just goes with the first result. almost all Dragon-type interactions are at the very bottom of the list.
@RBYPokemonChallenges I get it, but what confuses me in that case is that Gyarados used Dragon Rage, at all. Should it not have just spammed Hydro Pump? There were a few of those outings where it used 3 straight Dragon Rages on you.
40? Why not 80?
In gen 1, it wouldn't be OP at all. It would be still weak to ice as fire don't resist ice yet. That means it would still be weak to Starmie & Lapras. Plus, it would lose its ground immunity. That would affect its viability in UU & NU. Gaining Dragon type would let it resist electric type. But thats not enough to make it "OP".
Its different story in gen 2 & beyond though
For competitive, I absolutely agree. The weakness to ice means that it would gain virtually no benefit, and the weakness to ground would result in it getting wrecked by physical attackers as well. But this is Pokemon Yellow, not competitive.
@@RBYPokemonChallenges also the only dragon moves i think at the time were dragon rage and maybe twister
Gyarados will be interesting to see as if I recall correctly it was supposed to be Water/Dragon but the type combo was determined to be OP since it was only weak to Dragon and the only Dragon move was Dragon Rage
Fact! The question is if Water STAB is that good or not
@@RBYPokemonChallengesIt is good. Not quite as good as normal or psychic, but it has pretty good neutral coverage and good moves in hydro pump and surf. Gyarados probably doesn't even need water stab though, to be fair, between its Starmie-level Special stat, bolt-blizz coverage, and that big physical attack for meaty hyper beams and body slams. It will benefit from it, of course, it doesn't have psychic or recovery unlike starmie so it probably doesn't have enough moves it wants hard enough to drop water STAB.
Yeah, I found some spots where the extra power of Hydro Pump makes a pretty big difference over Surf in my last Gyarados run. But STAB Water is very useful in a playthrough
What a cool idea for a video, I can't wait to see how it does
Hope you like it!
wouldnt he be weak to ice too since fire didnt resist ice in gen one
Yes, that's true
Flying was already weak to Ice so it's omission is fairly irrelevant since nothing changes there anyway.
Yeah, it's mentioned in the Lorelei fight. The screenshot at that point was taken from the official Pokemon.com Pokedex, but I missed that they were basing on most recent gens
I always thought the idea of having TRI-types would be interesting - for example - A Charizard qualifies as such being Fire/Flying/Dragon. This concept could be expanded- to Pokémon that can be instantiated as multiple types as long as they meet the criteria.
Tri-typing would be amazing. I also think a game with more than 4 moves would be insane
Hello. I have a challenge that you might be the only person who could pull it off. Play Yellow starting with a Mewtwo. Use your normal rules plus add the following:
1. You cannot use any Pokémon Centers.
2. You cannot buy any items. 3. You cannot reset.
4. Whenever Mewtwo dies, you completely restart your run from the beginning with whatever level and stats you died with.
The goal is to see how long it takes and how many restarts it would take to complete the game this way.
I have not tried the No Center run with it, but it definitely could be interesting.
0xD16F and 0xD170 are the RAM ddresses for the typings of the Pokemon in slot 1 of your party in Pokemon Yellow. It's 0xD170 and 0xD171 in Red and Blue. The German versions of RBY has a slight offset in the addresses. We can use a Game Genie to hack the Starts, but we have the Universal Pokemon Randomizer to do just that without any unintended side-effects. We get a randomized Pokemon during the opening spiel as intended by the Universal Pokemon Randomizer.
Didn't know about he different addresses in German RBY
Commenting after the introduction. It was not mentioned but in RBY Fire does not resist Ice, so Fire/Dragon is still weak to Ice, which could potentially matter against Lorelei as well as Blue's Cloyster/Vaporeon.
Yeah, I mentioned this before the Lorelei fight, wasn't paying enough attention that the Pokemon Website's Pokedex does doesn't include Ice as a weakness
I wonder how he would do in the remakes. He would learn dragon rage as a charmeleon and let him learn outrage as a charizaed, he will get dragon claw in victory road and seeing how his special higher than his attack he will get stab as well. Would be nice to see a fire red version
Definitely something to think about!
Charizard needs a regional variant that makes him a dragon type not just some mega evolution
100% agree. Since regional varients were introduces there's no reason for Exeggutor to be a Dragon when Charizard isn't....
Spyro The Dragon is top tier
Absolutely! He is actually pretty incredible, though very reliant on TMs. for the record, the optional battles taken were basically do e for fair comparison with Aerodactyl and not really necessary.
Y’all gave Charizard pecs and biceps 😂 the crazy or rather funniest thing about that is that they don’t even look that bad if you didn’t know what one look like this is design could pass LMAO
He's jacked
If you can redo types, then if you did a dragonite run again, have him be normal/flying. He doesn't benefit much from the dragon typing except for resistances to the starter types. And being part normal would give Wrap and Hyper Beam STAB.
Maybe along this line, it may be fun to see which pokemon would benefit from a different typing altogether. What if Gengar was just Ghost? Or Ghost/Psychic? What if Gyarados was Water/ Dragon? If Zubat was Bug/Dragon? Idk. Lol
I actually like the idea of Dragonite as a Normal/Dragon type. Its wings are too weak to Fly anyway.
@RBYPokemonChallenges That too. No one really runs Wing Attack or fly. I just want to see how STAB normal moves will do. Lol
Before watching the video:
i think it's actually worse. You gain a wekness (ground) and you are still weak against ice as it was with flying, you are also still weak to rock even if jus a x2
The only notable difference is getting a resistance to electric instead of a weakness and neutral dmg from water, you also lose fighting resistance
All true, The question is really how much each of those changes actually matter and how the AI responds to the type change
@@RBYPokemonChallenges it's gen 1 so the only answer can be: surprise! Let's spin this wheel 🤣
For sure. There is a set list it goes through which leads to some really funky interactions
@@RBYPokemonChallenges *barrier intensifies*
If Gen One had even Dragonbreath, it would help out a lot.
Yeah, I plan to repeat i later gens with more Dragon moves.
Charizard as a Dragon Type would’ve been so crazy if more Dragon Moves existed in Gen 1 😱😱😱
Literally a worse type in gen 1. At least the flying type’s ground resist is pretty relevant.
Would have been cool to have Charizard be fire/dragon (gaining dragon claw in gen 3 at 34, flamethrower at 40 ish), blastoise be water/ground learning earthquake and Venusaur being the same, but learning sludge bomb and giga drain or petal dance to actually give it presence beyond misty.
Yes her dewgong is no joke . Was interesting to watch as you gave me some tips // moves that i wouldn't normally use myself.
if ever try do chazard run again.
I did this run on pokemon fire red end up with lvl 69 charzard complete pokemon league
Level 69!? You legend!!!
Nice.
Honestly, as much as I love Charizard, I’m okay with it being a Fire/Flying-type. Dragon would have been too overpowered for a starter Pokémon anyway. However, there was no excuse not to make Gyarados a Dragon-type. I guess the logic behind it was since Magikarp was so common in RBY, accessing a Dragon-type Pokémon would have been too easy and Gamefreak wanted to make Dragon a rare and powerful type. The simple fix would’ve been to make Magikarp a rare find like Dratini.
The Flying-type on Charizard at least makes sense. It sprouts wings in the final form and it gets access to a lot of Flying moves (although for some odd reason it could not learn Fly in Red & Blue). But the Flying-type was slapped onto Gyarados because nothing else aside from Dragon made sense. Yes, it does levitate but it’s not a good enough reason for it to have the Flying-type over Dragon. Unlike Charizard, it doesn’t even get access to a lot of Flying moves. Hell, it didn’t even get a Flying move until Generation IV, and all it got was Bounce. However, Gyarados has had access to Dragon moves since Generation I!
Gamefreak needs to change Gyarados to a Water/Dragon-type. They changed the types of the Jigglypuff and Clefairy lines so why not Gyarados? Charizard at least got access to the Dragon-type via Mega-Evolution but Gyarados hasn’t gotten anything of the sort.
Yeah, K think the Dark type being put on to Mega Gyarados was a further slap in the face to it, because they had a perfect excuse to finally make it a Dragon. I can agree that the Flying type make more sense on Charizard. The Gyarados typing just seems bad no matter how you look at it.
That Joey Wheeler laugh
Ha ha!
Is everyone using Scott’s Thoughts layout now? Cool. :)
Built on Gamehook, but not quite the same 😂
What a great idea for a video, Hope it goes well
Thank you!
@@RBYPokemonChallenges Your welcome
If Pokémon had tri or Quadra types, Charizard would be dragon
Agreed, we need tri/quad types!
Time to watch the linked vod where you do live commentary. GO-GO GADGET BRUNO AI
😂. Aw yeah!
Dragon type doesn't mean much when the only dragon type move is dragon rage. A move that will only ever do 40 damage
Yeah, didn't bother with Dragon Rage at all. It would help a lot for like the first two Gyms, but it's basically worthless after that
To me, it makes perfect sense for Charizard to be a Dragon-type. But it would make absolutely ZERO sense for Gyarados to be Dragon-type, as it is not meant to be a dragon, but a leviathan. Speaking of which, his French name is Léviator.
The justification for the Gyarados Dragon type comes from an old Chinese/Japanese myth, when an Emperor damned a river stopping carp from swimming to an upstream lake. When he took pity on them, be promised that any carp strong enough to jump over the dam would be made into a Dragon.
Idk that it would make him much better!
It was very interesting to test it out!
What sort of pluggin or overlay are you using because that shit looks nuts with the amount of info it gives you, and if that's just you editing the info in than that's crazy 😂😂
I use a self-coded overlay built on the gamehook.io real-time data prpgram. I am preparing to release an updated version as an alpha to Channel Members/Patrons, after which hopefully I can get it ready for community challenges in the future
At heart His evolution line is a dragon (many stuff Charmy do is traditionally dragon stuff and charmander looks adorable with dragon hoodies)
Yeah, Charmy deserves to be 🐉
@@RBYPokemonChallenges Certainly so for me is also Dragon 🐉 (also current stuff gamefreak are making dragons even if follow stuff in real just doesn’t feel right for be dragón alolan executtor is one of those fails (cuz was easy to get))
How did Earthquake hit Venomoth? Isn't it Psychic/Flying?
Dragon/Fire actually...
Venomoth is Bug/Poison
What song is playing at 26:26?
Motivated by Cloud from Streambeats
Maybe with the year of the Dragon we will get a Dragon/Fire Charizard regional evolution (Not a temporary form) with legends jhoto or Unova
We can only hope!
Dragon doesn’t do anything for a Pokémon offensively in gen 1….
But it does offer resistances to the elemental types…
Fire does synergizes really well with dragon in later gens both offensively and defensively..
Dragon is weak to itself, ice and fairy… the latter 2 fire both resist…
Fire types also hit steels for super effective which usually resist dragon…
However in gen 1 steel and fairy type don’t exist and fire doesn’t resist ice for whatever reason…
So the only benefit charizard would get is losing its water weakness and trading ground immunity for weakness
True, but the bigger effect is how the trainer AI responds to the typing. There are many spots where the Gen 1 AI's way of checking type effectiveness and resistance causes it to use really back moves against these strange dual-types.
Pokemon fans: Screw Venusaur and Blastoise we need to make Charizard the best starter. heck They need to get rid of misty, brock and Giovanni so Charizard can have an easy time with Kanto
I mean it did have an easy take with Kanto anyhow 😂. It's Lance that is the Charizard killer....
I wonder if Lorelei would have been more consistent if you had held on to Dig instead of slamming Earthquake right away, and even if she was if it would be worth the extra time spent in fights between? It would have the same turn order as using Fly, which would leave you with a bunch more health to tank something from Cloyster, and possibly allow you to get through at a lower level to use some of the candies a little later.
"I wonder if Lorelei would have been more consistent if you had held onto Dig instead of slamming earthquake right away?"
What were you writing here? "...and even if she was if it would be worth the extra time spent in fights between?"
@@wewhoareabouttodiesaluteyo9303 If he held on to Dig, it would be hitting with the same power as Earthquake, so no damage loss, just time loss in a race because it takes extra turns in every fight that he uses Dig instead of Earthquake in between Silph Co and Bruno.
With Dig in Lorelei's fight he could use the same out speed Dewgong to invulnerability, then damage to trigger sleep on turn 2 that he did with base Charizard (Dig works enough like Fly), meaning he could advance to the rest of the fight at full health after setup instead of low health, meaning he might be able to tank a hit later (say, from Cloyster since it is defensively bulky enough to survive any single hit at the lower level he first faced Lorelei at) which would mean he could have gotten through the fight with rare candies intact and used them before Lance, possibly preventing the unfortunate losses to losing badge boosts before Aerodactyl.
I then wondered if the greater consistency and/or earlier level getting past Lorelei and Lance would make up for the time loss from the extra turns taken across multiple fights. Points would be lost from speed, but at that point Charizard would be deep enough in to the game to just finish up using Dig and save a full point by not using Earthquale at all, and it may or may not have saved a few fractions of a point by having fewer resets using a more likely luck based strategy.
Yeah the Dig strat would have made sense. I opted for EQ because we also have to deal with possible confusion from Blaine's Ninetales, and Dig while confused is terrible. But honestly, outside of a couple of test attempts against Lorelei, she really wasn't that hard after setup and Hyper Beam
Would’ve preferred Charmander evolving into Dragon Charizard- match the player experience as though Charizard was a fire dragon in actual game
Could be a fun future run. I've messed around a bit with evolving from. base forms in solo challenges in a separate project. It definitely adds a fun dimension to solo runs, but for this channel I generally will start with whatever is on the thumbnail
Way better, nullifying the water resist for Misty and Lorelei is huge
Fact, especially because the way the glitchy AI type effectiveness calculation works on Gen 1, they still THINK water is super effective, allowing for some cheesing the AI in those fights
still getting that ice weakness for lorelai too though
Make butterfree also Bug dragon
I think you're thinking of Venomoth, the original Dragon-type....
4:02 and 9:26 and 12:30 he said rip 😂
9:38 he said noooooo 😂
Noooo... RIP
I’m guessing Dragon type Charizard wouldn’t be overpowered at all in Yellow. Offensively it’s mostly useless since the only Dragon move deals fixed damage. Defensively it’s decent, with it being better at taking Water, Electric, and Rock moves (although you won’t even have Charizard for the Misty or Surge fights without a ton of grinding, and Lorelei is still going to wreck you with Ice moves) but also gaining a Ground weakness. You’re still just going to be using mostly Fire moves with an occasional Normal or Ground move, and you don’t even get STAB on Fly now. I just can’t see it being that much better than regular Charizard.
The big change is not in the actual resistances, but how the AI responds to them. The AI still prioritizes water moves even though they are neutral, for example.
"You lost me at 4 part series"
To each their own, cheers!
Given how many people I've seen Badge Boost a Flamethrower or Fireblast to take advantage of Cloister's weak special, I can't help but wonder if Hyperbeam was waste of time against it
I mean, it still has 90 base special... I went for Hyper Beam because of the 4x to Attack from Swords Dance, so I think it was the better lay with the boosts.
@@RBYPokemonChallenges That's not a bad assessment until you factor in the time spent on getting the coins for Hyperbeam. Then it becomes a "now I have to sit down and run numbers" which is more of a chore than some want to deal with.
Honestly, not being able to buy coins in larger quantities at once was such a huge time vampire, and definitely a major headache when I was a kid.
I feel for any run that has to do it
True, but it's easy to get enough money for it. You just have to then sit and buy coins for a while. 4x speed and an auto-A button helps
I still think Dratini and dragonair should have evolved into a water/dragon gyarados (OP, considering no typed weaknesses). Meanwhile, Magikarp should have evolved into Dragonite, now with the Fairy/Dragon type (given its based on a fairy tale about a fish becoming a dragon).
That would be amazing
Nice job! Welcome to 2024!
Happy new year!
Ngl, cant wait for Gyarados
Oh yeah!
Time to see if it's gonna be as "broken" as every one says it would've been
For sure. It's a quite interesting comp
On your weakness chart you missed out ice type since fire doesnt resist ice in gen 1 although it would be weak to ice regardless of being flying or dragon
Yeah, it was an error in the intro, I mentioned this just before Lorelei though
Why are you leering at onix and then using ember?
Leering to avoid damaging it while it uses Bide.
If it was gen 1 competitive most people had thunder move Pokemon but new or Mewtwo n a icebeam was all u would've needed even a Articuno would be at drazard
Absolutely true. Dragonite was only competitively viable with Agility + Wrap in OU, and that got banned quick because of how annoying it was
Earthquake is stronger than Body Slam.
Max Ethers and Max Elixirs are useful on moves with more than 10 PP. Including PP Ups used on moves with 10 PP at start.
For sure! I eliminated Body Slam when I felt it was no longer useful.
If Charizard is now a dragon, and dragons aren't limited to a single pokemon in a single fight, then the type needs to be fixed. A dragon 40pwr move, a 60pwr move, slam becoming Dragon, etc. The type wasn't built out well because it didn't need to be.
So what if you actually played with the dragon type balanced? Would it be even MORE cracked if this got STAB useful dragon moves all through the midgame
I need to look more into backporting moves into Gen 1. A project for a later date, for sure!
I was watching that other channel you had recommended and apparently, he is going to redo Pokemon Yellow, legally; however, this thought came across my mind. What if we ran a CHECK on gym leaders and Elite Four members in the original games meaning if one were to pit each gym leader against the other, would you still be able to get the hierarchy that we see from a player standpoint? For instance, Brock would lose to Misty because water over rock. But could Lt. Surge beat Brock? Could Sabrina beat Erika and Koga? Who is weaker between the two, Koga or Erika? Does Blaine lose to Giovanni and are any of these gym leaders able to beat the Elite Four fully or would any of them be able to beat the first Elite 4 member? Does each Elite Four member belong in their respective place? Should Bruno be first? Should it really be Lorelei, Bruno, Agatha, Lance, and the Rival? Or can any one of them beat the other which would result in a change of hierarchy? These are questions that need answering.
Yeah, I always felt the league was backwards. Lorelei clearly beats Lance, for example, and Bruno-s Onix can take out Agatha
@@RBYPokemonChallenges Are you sure that Lorelei can beat Lance? If Lance has higher leveled Pokemon, his Gyarados can put up quite a punch. I would think with hyper beam, they could take out the Dewgong, Slowbro, and maybe the Cloyster. When it gets to his Dragonair or Dragonites, depending on if they go first or Lorelei's Lapras, Cloyster and Jynx; they could always Thunderbolt or Thunder their way through. Do not forget that they too have Hyperbeam.
Gen 1 fire type has no ice resistance so both Charizards are also weak to ice in gen 1
Yeah, I mentioned it before Lorelei. Sorry for the incomplete graphic is the 8ntro
Fire did not resist Ice in Gen 1, so Charizard would have also been weak to Ice.
Yep, mentioned that before Lorelei, sorry for the omission in the intro
It’s still weak to ice, because fire doesn’t resist ice GEN one
Yep, mentioned that before Lorelei
It would be worse
It loses its ground immunity and still weak to ice and rock and now ground as well
Plus Gen 1 has no Dragon STAB move to take advantage of besides Dragon Petit Cup
It would be one of the best Zapdos answers however though.
I agree, but since this is a solo run, there are other considerations, specifically how the trainer AI responds to the Dragon typing, and those interactions can be very weird.
Imagine charizard waking up, to ash and dust…
It already wakes up/opens up to Ash. Oh you mean...ash..like charred up remains...:/
Lol
I don't think it makes Gen 1 Charizard any better. Dragon type had zero worthwhile attacks, so it's just a shift in his defenses. Losing immunity to Earthquake and other ground moves is the biggest thing it does, as he stays 2x weak to blizzard spam thanks to Gen 1 fire being neutral to ice. Going from 4x to 2x weak to rock and 2x to neutral on water is a plus, but I think dying to EQ is not worth that. Electric from weak to resisted is a nice addition, though.
Ultimately a fire/dragon charizard can find easier places to switch in, but he becomes prey to one of the most commonly spammed attacks, instead of being immune to it.
But this is not competitive, my guy. We're talking full game solo run
Even if charizard was part dragon type in gen 1, it still doesn’t change that it wouldn’t b able to take advantage of with one damaging dragon type move, gf could’ve added more tbh
That's a fact! I always felt Dragon type was the most underwhelming on Gen 1 because it had not STAB moves
@@RBYPokemonChallenges dragon rage only did 40 hps of damage, I mean it was useful when battling petit cup and pika cup in Pokémon stadium but that’s it, gen 2 better outrage followed by dragon claw breath pulse dragon rush etc
What is gsmehook
Gamehook is a (now offline) software that enables us to directly access RAM of the game. It can be used somewhat like a GameShark for setting moves and DVs, etc, but is also used to read the game data and directly output it to the overlay that I use while playing
the obvious why Charizard is not Dragon coz it makes it not weak to Water... i guess its a rule that a Starter should always be has disadvantage against the other Starter it's meant to be weak against... the only reason Empoleon gets a pass on not being weak to Grass is because Torterra gained Ground type
Yeah I get that aspect in terms of game design, but I'm terms of graphic design, it's just bad because they had other fire types to use as a starter if they'd wanted to, and Charizard is clearly a dragon
Can you try Gyarados Water Dragon? What if they lit take the story in real life into pokemon. For me Gyarados deserves dragon type its furious and destructive like Blue Eyes and destroyed entire City like Smaug destroying Dale and Erebor. It would make its Dragon dance and dragon moves more effective, water would be not effective and it wouldn't be weak against rock type which is weird coz its a water type that should be stronger than rock which it is. Also it could resist electric types more. I would really wanna see how good Gyarados would be with a dragon type. :D
This is upcoming!
1:15 I'm sorry, Mew's my favorite Pokemon, and what's this all about? :o
Basically, to compare just typing and typical movesets evenly, I am using a Mew of every type to complete a solo run and tier up each of the 15 types in Gen 1. Mew has even offensive and defensive stats, so it's a chance to look just at how the typing and best average moveset of the type stacks up.
The rules are that Mew gets the strongest 100% accurate ( or as close as possible) same-type move of the type in question (electric Mew gets Thunderbolt, bug Mew gets Twin Needle, etc), then it gets one Normal-type move that is learned by the majority of Pokemon of that type, one badge boosting move that is learned by the majority of Pokemon of that type, and one coverage move that is common among that type ( electric Mew got Submission, Bug Mew got Mega Drain, etc). No other TMs or level up moves are permitted, and everything else is my standard rules.
Fire doesn’t resist ice in gen 1 so it still takes super effective damage from ice moves altho it does lose its water weakness…
And also only 2x weak to rock but gains a ground weakness….
All true! The type effectiveness in the intro was taken from Pokemon.com, so it excluded the Ice weakness. I mentioned about the Ground ad Ice weaknesses elsewhere in the video.
The other ones are Gyarados, Exeggute and Fearow?
Gyarados looks like a water/dragon. Exeggute is a got dang palm tree. It should be grass, no idea how it is poison or psychic or whatever else it is. Fearow is a stork.
I showed the others in the intro. Still thinking about Exeggutor....
@@RBYPokemonChallenges Oh in the picture! Thank you, I'm looking forward to it. Especially to my favourite fossil ❤
Don't forget both Char and dragon Char are weak to ice in gen 1!
Yeah not mentioned there, but I mentioned it pre-Lorelei
How it not weak to water when it’s still a fire type?
Dragons resist water, so it neutralizes. I am not sure, but it _seems_ like the idea is them resisting the traditional elements (electricity is usually grouped with air, likewise grass with Earth, so it's still in that theme)
Exactly this.
Make this for others gens please, you give me a ideia i going to make a team PWT with Zard, Gyarados and aerodactyl with Draco Meteor and Outrage
For sure, trying I. other gens could be fun, especially when dragon type moves are more common
13:26: What were those "er"s on the left?
The game's ram let's you set names up to 10 characters via Gamehook, but only 7 characters in a standard game, so the game attempts to wrap the extra characters
Oooo what are your four other picks for gen one dragon types? Obviously Charizard and Gyarados but who else? I saw someone calling Arbok in a video the other day I thought that was pretty lame 😂
...Exggecutor?
Seadra and Aerodactyl are the other 2.
Oh yeah arydactyl , was thinking lapras lol
Oh yeah that makes sense. I still vote we have an exeggutor video though, she will not be happy losing her Psychic typing
@@JamesSonOfBaboonzoSeadra evolves into Kingdra in gen 2 so no it would be Gyarados
@@ncisfan1002 At 0:22 he literally shows the thumbnails naming the 4 Pokemon he considers dragons alongside the Dragonite line. Charizard, Gyarados, Seadra and Aerodactyl.
dragon is an mechanicly over rated type in RBY, even with the moves to use it its a normal that does not have a ghosts be imune to it and resisted by rock. with the vanila RBY moves, dragonite perfers to be normal instead of dragon
I would agree that Dragon-type on its own isn't really that good in Gen 1. But it's the interactions with other types and the ways that impacts the trainer AI 5hat makes the biggest difference.
Basically, how it always should have been. The kanto starters, Gyarados and Aerodactyl should have been part dragon.
Does it go against dragon types being rare? Not really, kinda, but not really. Since you don't see many starte pokemon or Aerodactyl. And Gyarados is pretty rare as well (since hardly anyone in games wants to train the useless magikarps and succesfully evolves it into a Gyarados).
Would it make sense? Yes.
Would them being dragon make them broken? Really depends. Maybe due to the lack of dragon moves. But not really. The meta would still be Tauros hyper beam etc.
I generally agree. Competitively, the meta remains Normal types and bolt/beam. In the base game, the Devs would have had to program the AI to better consider dual typings and balance the type out. I think Dragon type was so underdeveloped in Gen 1 partially because they only put one Dragon type in the game.
@@RBYPokemonChallenges that makes a lot of sense, yeah.
Ah yes, the dragon type charizard is the same as the normal charizard at level 9 against the geodude and onix of brock, neither of which uses a ground or rock type move and at level 9 it would still be a charmander, thus making it a complete waste of time comparing them... i hope this video gets better
I'm doing this the same as other content on my channel where I start with the Pokemon in the thumbnail and use it for the whole run, but I'm playing around with doing runs where I start unevolved and evolve throughout the run. May or may not do it that was in the future.
@@RBYPokemonChallenges i was just being nitpicky for a bit of fun. Alternative is to play as dragon-fire charmander that evolves but i am not sure if that is even possible.
Anyway, was a good vid overall 👍
Legit such a cool idea! Cheers for puttin a solution to a 30 odd year debate l😅
It was worth it to at least try!
YAAAAAS
Thank you so much, I saw this comment when I released 8t and it always feels so good when people are excited for the new video!
The anime came after the game no?
Kinda? The games came before the anime in Japan, but in the US, they came out around the same time. And Yellow came out after the show started regardless.
Yellow was definitely at least during production of Indigo League and Manga. They knew enough to know Kogas team at least at the time of release
@blastification2 ah yeah, I forgot about the last part. Thanks
initial guess: better
Fair guess! Let's Go!!!
The Magikarp into Gyarados is literally based on a myth of a fish swimming up a waterfall and then turning into a dragon. Dragon type exists so Gyarados should have been a Dragon. Locking the evolution behind level grinding to 40 would solve basically every game breaking element with a Water/Dragon in gen 1 since the game was made for single player play through without having all Pokémon be viable. The Electric weakness exchanged for neutral damage from Fighting amd Ground is the only thing that matters as a change. Rock moves miss too much (and Rock Pokémon suck in general), and Bug and Dragon moves don't really exist.
Absolutely. That one is upcoming, as shown on the kntro.
before i watch: i dont think a dragon type charizard would be very op at all, not only is there a single dragon move in the whole game (which does fixed damage) the typing also doesnt do it many favors defensively. fire not resisting ice in g1 means its weak to ice either way, and while it does lose its quad weakness to rock there are only 2 moves anyway, both with less than 100% accuracy. it loses its invulnerability to earthquake as well, which is also not resisted by dragon. so overall a dragon charizard would be good in any gen EXCEPT 1
alright well i guess that went better than expected, though i feel like a pure fire zard wouldnt be too far behind
We shall see....
Not as much of an improvement as if you gave Dragon type to Gyarados. That thing has a serious 4x weakness to electric (in the RBY bolt beam metagame) and no benefit from flying type STAB even in gen 2. A Dragon/Water Gyarados would be only weak to Dragon which doesn't have a real move (Dragon rage is set damage). It would have two quad resist to water and fire making it have amazing switch ins. It would immediately shoot up to OU. Looking for that playthrough, using a pokemon with literally no weaknesses (and Gyarados is better before the special split because it has 100 base special attack and defense and can use both physical and special attacks well)
Zard on the other hand doesn't benefit because losing ground immunity for neutral water and electric is a wash.
I have completed the Gyarados run as well, which will be very interesting to dive into in the next one
I'm not usually this kind of guy, but... shouldn't the nickname be Chargon?
😂 yeah, but I was keeping the names and lengths consistent for each Pokemon in the series. Drazard, Dractyl, Drakarp, Draking
My bet: slightly better, but not hugely.
We shall see!
I think she hates u using Swords dance Charizard coz u bullying the Abra. poor Abra xD Just taking photos of flashes while u dancing with swords on a special attacker Charizard ouo
But we just let he flash us ad the used Swift.... Gotta be Swift when she's Flashing you...
Char , gyarados , Lapras ,annnnnd seadra
Ooos forgot about aerodakkkktilll
Yeah not sure if Lapras has a justification as a dragon... but it does learn Dragon Rage
I hate Blane not using Magmar and I hate that Arcanine is not a legendary in Kanto coz the pokemon title for Arcanine is Legendary even shows in the legendary stone tablet that Ash saw on the first pokemon center. U dont show something like that and pretend its a legendary. Arcanine also tells how extremely fast it is that it got signature move Extreme Speed.
Yeah, I talked about his back when I did the Arcanine Minimum Battles run. The they really did Arcanine dirty by making Entei the Legendary Fire type i Gen 2.....
Charizard isn't dragon type because it's a dinosaur, not a dragón.
A winged, fire-breathing dinosaur? Sounds an awful lot like a dragon to me....
@@RBYPokemonChallenges right. But out of those 3 types I think that the "less necessary" one is dragón.
Charizard should be fire dragon with levitate
Gyarados should be water dragon with levitate
Aerodactl should be rock dragon with levitate
change my mind
In original gen1 though, Charizard being Fire Dragon is actually worse, for having weakness to both ice & ground now.
Being double weak to rock is also only relevant in 8th gym battle only as Fire Flying, which isn't a huge deal
True, though it being able to take on water moves is pretty big for it, while also being able to handle thunder moves.
It already had Ice weakness because Flying is weak to Ice, so the only weakness it gained is Ground. (And I guess it's no longer 4x resistant to Bug or resistant to Fighting...which matters precisely not at all, because Gen 1.)
@@DoctorNovakaine Oh ye, my bad about the ice weakness. But yeah changing charizard into dragon in gen1 OG, wouldn't make him much better. Earthquake/Dig is much more popular and strong than let's say rock slide. Still gaining resistance to electric. Not a gamer changer type for charizard to be fair
@@DoctorNovakaine He didn't say it gains ice weakness, just that it would now have ice weakness AND ground weakness.
I'm sure gyarados would rather keep intimidate than trade it for a dragon typing, even if it grants a few more resistances and a different stab.
Maybe but the FIRE type still make it useless against Brock and Misty the first 2 gyms.
Brock doesn't know rock moves and dragon resists water, so water moves are neutral. I don't think either of them will be a problem.
Charmander being bad against Brock is such a misconception. Ember can easily take out Brock's Onyx since it's special defense is so bad.
Yeah, the only reason Charmander can't do Brock on minimum battles is because it learns Ember at level 9, which it can't reach on minimum battles. Any Fire mon with Ember can do it with good enough burn luck.
@@DoctorNovakaine Actually burn doesn't work against Brock since he has infinite full heals 😭
Oh, but it does! Just in a different way. You see, each time you burn him, it halves his Attack stat. After a full heal, as second burn halves his Attack stat again and so on. Also, burning Onix while using Bide in Yellow will cause Brock to take burn damage u til after he releases energy from Bide, because he doesn't full heal while Bide is active.
well it would no longer be immune to EQ and it would still be weak to ice....so still crap
We shall see...