Exactly. The toxic side of social media is that it fosters "competitive comparison culture." We should not forget that being a drummer is not just about being a drummer - it's about making music.
but the other side is that competition pushes you to be better, so if you want to be great you probably have to dance with it. That paradox is what the whole video is about.
@@8020drummer 10:24 ... did you ever compare hi class football (soccer) games from the 70s to today? this push in excellence is found everywhere in our lives and society, propably caused by access to knowledge, teachers, technologie... we are standing on the shoulders of giants. to be honest your greatest success in life will possibly be this channel, embrace it! are you a good drummer? good enought for what? just keep it up and enjoy while it lasts... hope you don't choke to death on your own vomit in the back of a car too early. It's just a game... Listen to Alan Watts & chill man XD
One of my new favorite drum videos. Nate you bring the philosophy to the drums and have a unique perspective that's so worth hearing. Your message speaks directly to me personally, especially after over 30 years of playing and part of that semi-pro. At some point you have to specialize and then find your sound. I'm on that journey within the scope of playing covers... Which is a challenge within itself. It's an interesting, frustrating (similar to working out) but fun endeavor to see your progress over years. Your absolutely bang on about the obsession... I call it the hunger. If I don't play nearly everyday I get the hunger and it just has to be satiated.
Agreed-just make music, first and foremost-the music you hear in your own head-believe in it. Individuality will gradually follow as will improved technique. Jack DeJohnette once said something to the effect that his “style” is simply to listen carefully and deeply to the music his bandmates are making and then respond intuitively-not “thinking”. We all have idols but we all gotta do our own thing.🤷🏻
Being past the 70 mark in life, most of my drumming apart from teaching, is attempting to (as best as I can ) maintain skills and not to think about "glory days" or expect too much and gig when I can
There was a moment a while back: I was at a theatre production of Glengarry Glen Ross and the sound design was ALL drums…fast, frenetic, fiercely creative solo jazz drums. This was shortly after the movie Birdman came out so the composer was probably hitting that trend. Anyway I ran down the program and it turned out a buddy of mine was listed as the sound designer. Now, I used to get calls from him to do sessions for EXACTLY this kind of thing and at this time I had taken quite a long time out of playing and was definitely not in the scene at all. I was initially kinda bummed and then thought “ahh well, he didn’t call me for this session and whoever THIS guy is he’s WAY BETTER THAN ME, so fair game”. I quickly reconciled the reality check and sent a txt to my guy the sound designer. “Hey man nice stuff in Glenngary Glen Ross” He replied “Thanks man…who do you reckon the drummer is?” I then replied with a few names of guys around that I thought sounded THAT GOOD. He replied “It’s you dickhead” I called him at the end of the show and as it turned out the director of the show had changed his mind mid tech and my guy had to use some old stock recordings to get on the Birdman trend. It was stuff I had recorded with him in a studio in South Korea a year or two previous. Anyway, from that point onwards I stopped worrying about how I sounded and started enjoying the fact that whatever I was doing I was doing something ok. I managed to hear myself in a truly objective way without knowing it was me and I really liked myself.
These are the videos I care about most. As you well know by now, I spend way too much time thinking about this stuff, so seeing someone else troubling themselves over the minute details of what it takes to be great, and then attempting to articulate those minutia to the world is kind of calming.
you're too kind! And you're also an avatar to me that someone can get to an elite level with hard work and discipline. The way you've leveled up in recent years is pretty amazing
I used to be obsessed with being the best drummer in my area. I did achieve that and I have done a ton of session work and belong to an agency out of Philly. One day something clicked for me that said, playing a million beats a minute is boring and annoying to most people. The only people that really appreciate a billion chops are other drummers. I decided I would never overplay again and only play for the music. Guess what, I found people appreciate a drummer that plays a killer tight pocket over a million hits. Take Jeff Porcaro for example. The dude was one of the most sought after drummers for years simply because he had a killer pocket and only played tasty fills ONLY when it felt right but he never overplayed. In the context of a song, being a tight drummer is the ONLY thing that matters.
Right sure but you realize its from taking away what you are potentially capable of playing to leave what's raw and bare as opposed to being technically limited to play simply. Without the capacity for those chops those drummers would be moot. Its what they don't say not what they are incapable of saying..
This is the conclusion I came to. There are so many incredible drummers, and I'm not going to catch them. But the average Joe listener has no clue what's going on there anyway. Non-drumming musicians have no clue, either. Chops and deep skills ARE amazing, but only to other drummers. Nobody else even comprehends what's happening. Tight pockets and consistency is all they notice.
I can relate to that work/life balance. I'm approaching my mid-50s. At this point in my life, I just want to keep my chops up, learn new things for my own benefit, and play with others when I can. In short, it's more for my own enjoyment. By the way, I enjoy this type of video. It's healthy to have discussions like this.
I think being an amazing chopsmeister and getting to show off your skills at every opportunity you have behind the drum kit is one way to get some satisfaction out of drumming. Another way, though, is to collaborate with others to create music that isn't necessarily designed to show off fancy chops, but is meant to make an original statement and to be beautifully composed. Then it's less about gaining chops to show off with and more about how to sustain the mood of the music you're playing. I always want to improve my chops, but at the same time, I'm not obsessed with showing off chops (which is a good thing becuase I'm not all that technically advanced!). What I really want to accomplish is to collaborate with others to play music that I would actually enjoy listening to. These days, I'm less interested in listening to music that seems to put a high priority on showing off the player's chops. I want to feel the mood of what folks are doing and go to a place I haven't been when I listen to the music. Music to me is a kind of drug, and I'm more interested in the effects it can produce, rather than being aware of the craft of how it's made...
Thanks for the video. I think I’m taking the “tortoise” route myself, and your videos and courses help me focus the smaller amount of time I have to practice. Even with 30-90 minutes a day, I can track my own progress and feel confident in my playing. I just want to be as good as I can be without being a full time musician.
I wish I'd be able to average more than 30m a day 😅 But I still feel a lot of difference every month of playing. It's crazy what a few new ideas (for example watching these videos), a good practice regimen and recording myself did to my playing
man youre so right, i like to use jordan peterson's quote "compare yourself to who you were yesterday not to who anyone else is today" and in my darkest hours its been the light at the end of the tunnel. my story is funny since i havent been playing that long (5 years) but a year and a half ago i decided i wanted to try to achieve 300bpm with both my hands and feet with no gimmicks or triggers etc. (im a death metal dude hehe) and also trying to find my own voice within it all being super extreme and stuff. crazy to think im almost there and playing at 270 bpm has become somewhat of a new comfort zone and i relate so much to what you say that the goal keeps growing as you get closer to it like an infinite rabbit chase! i started to post on the socials but often times the whole atmosphere in the social med realm felt weird/competitive/ridiculous and pushed buttons in me i didnt want being pushed and its crazy what the chase of popularity can do to the mind. ive felt recently like just deleting instagram and youtube and becoming a full time hermit but i also think i have something special going on and wanna put it out there to find some other sick dudes to collab with and other sick dudes to inspire. strange world were living in with all these "tools" that can do as much damage as they can do good depending on how you use them and or if you let them use you. even though our styles are leagues apart ive always loved your channel and your playing and was super happy when you played at meinl!! watching this has given me some much needed inspiration and im so happy youve stayed true to yourself and have made and effort to improve but not to change your essence! cheers dude, message got kinda deep and long but thanks! keep shredding 🤟🤟🤟
I started drums in my mid 20s 4 years ago. I just accepted the fact that I’ll never hit the level i want to because I’m a late starter. Only thing I can do is just be the better than yesterday and that in itself keeps me motivated.
@@8020drummerI am in a very similar station as this man, currently 25/26 been playing about 2 and a half years with what time I have I put about 2 hours on average most days if not everyday on the kit. Is this normal? Is this enough? What do you think of this because often wonder if it’s cursed for me too since I’m a late starter ?
@@8020drummer For the first 2 years 4 hours 4-5 days a week and the pass 2 years I have more responsibilities so 1.5 -2 hours a day 5-6 days a week. I aspire to the level of Matt Garstka and Larnell Lewis.
I've been watching you for years and you've truly gotten so much better. Cleaner time, more refined touch, faster, more vocab, and more powerful. your videos about what separates us from the greats years ago really opened my eyes and gave me the reality check I needed. im still not where I want to be but you've helped me improve exponentially to the point where im better than a lot of ppl I looked up to so thank you for that. these conversations need to happen more often
I started watching you about 3 yrs ago when I decided to become more than someone who can play.....'sorta' to someone who understands drumming and aspires to be a musician. This is your best video in my humble opinion and I understand Its a 'right time, right place' thing. If ya feel as if you should do a video on the importance of solid singles, do it! Cuz that's you-like it or not. 🤘😝
great work Nate and congrats on your channel, staggering amount of work. Thanks for your inspiration to older drummers struggling to be any good - lots to absorb here. Keep it up man!
Great video!! This applies to many things in life. I could wax on with a philosophical tome but I'll just say this. Jeff Porcaro didn't do drum solos and didn't like drum solos. What did he he do? He helped make music that has moved millions upon millions of people and according to first hand accounts was a wonderful person to be around.
After 3+ years of 2 hours a day I'm very happy with my progress. Because it has been progress. Incremental, day by day, week by week, I'm getting better. I'm not in it to be a social media drumming darling. I do it because I see improvement. I do it because I love to play music with others, and sound good doing it. That makes me happy. And who are those people to be calling out "mid".. that's just gatekeeping from people who probably feel small themselves.
I agree with your assessment and appreciate you voicing your counsel on this topic. Steady slow progress is always a sure bet and yields valuable fruit.
I'm always inspired by your content, I really appreciate and benefit from your comprehensive and deeper analysis of drumming. But this time, this video inspired me like no other, thanks. I am now practice, practice, practicing with even more purpose. Since I watched it the other day. It is such a motivator that I plan to watch it multiple times until I make it my internal mantra. Too much, I think not.
Thank you! I am a new drummer, and I'm learning songs now. I've been trying to play like the drummers in the band. After watching this, I went and played, relaxed, and enjoyed it so much. Was it technically perfect....no. I see now that I can play these using my own voice and just feel the song. The technicality will come. It was so much more enjoyable practicing 😃🥁🤘
now THIS is what resonates! I've been spending a lot of time lately just thinking about these things a bit too much. It all eats away the creativity and the ability to make beautiful music. It's sooooo important to talk about all this stuff, the mental side of drumming, the different aspects of life as a drummer, and so on. There are countless ways to play the drums, and trusting your own voice and vision is not always easy with all the pressure going on. Being a drummer is being a musician, and being a musician is being a human. Thank you for speaking about all this. This was a great video.
Thanks for the insights!! Well said. I've been playing for 30+ years and couldn't have said it any better! Yes keep sharing it's great to hear someone being human.
Golden. Your insights here are subtle yet profound. Yes, it’s the paradox, or maybe countless paradoxes: obsession, calmness, healthy comparison, awareness of weaknesses, focus on precision, acceptance of my flaws, enjoyment of my own personal journey, discipline to take myself where I want to go, for however long it takes to get there. These seemingly disparate concepts needn’t be contradictory (and certainly not controversial). They’re each vital ingredients in this gourmet dish I’m cooking up, even when I’m only cooking for one. Thank you, Nate.
I love your videos, these more 'mental aspect of the game' ones especially, that you present both sides, pros&cons, of any one aspect of any of this (internet peer pressure for ex.) and I'm not even a drummer! But I am definitely on, and in a way at age 60 finishing up some phase of, the long game course of 'a few hours a day for a lot of years' thing. Keep up the great work, it's inspiring.
Nate i think this is your best video yet. You`re focusing more on yourself than on others so it makes it more relatable. One thing i would add is that life is not that short and people often seem to forget that in a lifetime one can put a gargantuan body of work into something but it just takes time. And that`s alright, it should take time and it should be more about the process than checkpoints.
Awesome video Nate! I’m definitely struggling with this exact paradox. As the guy that’s trying to keep a worklife balance I feel I’m somewhere in the middle. My obsessed nature keeps me in the 2 to 3 hours a day practice routine, but I feel it’s not enough to get to where I want to be.
Thank you! As someone who isn't trying to become a chopper, but just wants to groove and throw in the occassional "oh shit" when the music asks for it, I really appreciate you taking time to validate this journey. I think reminders like this can be just as important as exercise guidance
Hi, I caught this and just wanted to thank you for your down to earth and honest approach to this issue. I know that it isn't easy at any level , to deal with wanting to be better and all of the things that get in the way of getting into the woodshed, or playing out etc. I am very glad I came across your channel early in my playing (I am headed into just my third year) and I have to say that your body of work has really been a great guide to getting in, practicing and finding new ways to challenge and develop my stuff. I still SUCK! I'm fifty now, I know there is a ceiling to where I can get (or a better way to say it, I am eminently aware of the end we all face) but I go in knowing that I have a rough work life family and art to answer to. I just go in and try to be my best self. That is no easy thing, but it is easier knowing there are a lot of folks in this community doing the same thing. Anyways, thank you for your bravery in doing this video, and I wish you inspiration and headspace. (This goes for everyone, let's go!!!)
Thank you for this video. I am one of those people who practiced 1.5hr per day for years and now have to schedule a day off. The day off makes me like drumming more. Also I'm in two bands. One of them a church, the other a local ccm cover band and I work full-time. Your video helped me to find perspective on my own playing and content skills. Thanks again Nate, love the Chanel.
Great video and fair play for being so frank and honest... me I just want to develop my own simple sound and have fun playing and I feel inspired to do so after this vid!
Another great insight. There is such a wide spectrum of learning to cover. I take my time, practice a lot on my hands, holding the sticks, finger technique, dynamics. When I learnt in the late 70's I had in the region of 5 professional players as teachers, guys who were making albums touring, having hit records (Gentle Giant, Honky). Not a one gave any insight on how to hold the sticks correctly.... I find that astonishing. My 'thing' was hitting hard, which is the absolute antithesis to becoming good. So I'm reteaching myself. It's slow progress but I'm feeling good about it. One area that is for me probably the least discussed and I believe does separate the good from the great is the black box - the workings of the brain. I recall being told by a fabulous guitarist I was working for that I was thinking too much and blocking my flow. I agree to a certain extent, because if one has a firm foundation of the basics in place and an ear for complementing the music, if you can allow your mind free of the insecurities from external influences you could go an awfully long way and be very employable. For example, I remember from the 80's, seeing a gigging drummer playing exemplary drums (beautifully tuned kit) without using any sub divisions smaller than 8th notes. I know today that may appear strange, but is was someone maximising the music while not worrying about scrutiny from others. Just a thought. Keep up the great work!
Analytics aside, I think more people appreciate these deeper reflection vlogs than you realize. I need these reminders that I have a chance despite not being a full time musician.
Firstly, I would take those 3 free coaching courses. I did, and they definitely helped. This video made me think of a Sweetwater promotional thing I saw a long time ago where drummer X and Y (huge social media stars at the time) went to Sweetwater and were trying to play a bunch a hobbyists drummer's stuff. I was surprised to see that they were failing epically! It got me thinking that once you are intermediate or "mid" you have a sound that no one replicates as well as YOU! I personally love that. After a while, all of your influences, specific patterns, stickings, grid work you practice, and tendencies cuisinart into something that is very uniquely you.
Loved the video, articulated my daily battle very well. I'm a 2-3 hours a day guy, on average, sometimes less, sometimes more but rarely, if ever, not at all. I have a family with 2 kids and 2 jobs and usually I can't manage more than 3 hours cumulative practice per day. I am obsessed with getting better, I sacrifice sleep in order to do it and in the last 10 years I've made major strides forward in my playing and changed the direction that I was going in radically. But at heart, I do it because I love it, nothing more. On your point about drummers on average getting better in the last 10 years, I do sound at a local venue and have done for 20 odd years now and I absolutely concur that the standard of musicianship has improved dramatically in that time. Although I wouldn't necessarily say the same about the quality of the music, but that's another topic I guess. Keep these videos coming Nate, it's been great to watch your improvement on the thing you love.
Oh yeah! I've long been pretty good at jamming, a sort of Bill Bruford influence without the proper training to do it really well has been my basis long time. Drums are my most recent discipline in music, muilti instrumentalist since I was 8 years old. I learned basic drumming in my teens and stayed beginner and a little bit intermediate for being able to follow odd time signatures until just about a year ago when I started focus on upping my drum cred. More of a challenge for me to keep basic beats. I could jam and play musically relevant things, but not the same thing twice and had a hard time holding any particular beat. Enter Bowie, where I studied him in singer songwriter style for a few years to get some lost skills back and recently started to really dig into the drums and they're not as easy as they may sound when paying more attention to the vocals and chords. The thing now is to train steadiness in really syncopated right foot patterns and snare back beat pops, then work on the offbeat hi hat barks. Step by step is how it's done with a crazy human trick like playing drum kit. Then, in between bands with nowhere to set up my kit I still practice every day with great drummers in my headphones sitting in a chair and just tapping feet and slapping knees to get the patterns and dynamics trained up so when I get back to my kit I have less things to tune up and just apply the already well practiced patterns to the kit.
Fantastic video. Thank you for giving someone like me, 46 years old and playing for one year, some hope and a little kindling to keep the fire going. It’s a struggle to have the mental focus and physical energy to play an hour everyday, walking the tight rope of social media being inspiring or deflating, and wondering if it’s too late in my life to bother. Let’s just say I didn’t know what I was getting myself into when I casually thought I wanted to learn to play the drums because “playing with all 4 limbs independently intrigued me.” 😆
All that, all that 🙌 and i've to say Sir, you where always that dude that has the most naturally like lofi drum sound and touch ever. Even when you'd played straight ahead 🤌 absolutely unique 🔥 like it's already sampled 🔥 goosebumpy ❤
Currently on the 60 min per week approach. Between running a business, and being a husband/father of 3, the dream of playing drums with my own "voice" is on the super slow/steady plan. And I'm perfectly OK with that 🐢🤘
I think about quitting ALL the time. Especially after a gig. I fantasize about quitting - about giving all my gear away and keeping a snare as an art piece. .... and then I go practice.
@@8020drummer And I think it at least generally applies to being good at my engineering profession as well...almost anything that involves performance. There has to be some balance of drive to immerse yourself, which often comes from a significant amount of self criticism but then one can't just be so disappointed that it kills the drive to feel confident sharing and have fun with others. Personally, I've been overly limited by the criticism aspect to such an extent that I actually think I sound better in a recording than I thought I sounded when playing the recorded piece. It seems like that's usually the opposite for most people.
Dude I'm loving your content since six oder seven years. first comment by the way, been lurking :P Thanks fot the great advices and your helpfull thoughts.
i feel like were on a similar page on this subject. i always feel like salieri in the amadeus movie. i have enormous passion for drums and trying my best to learn it however not so talented and began drumming very late at 35. all pro drummers talk about talent is not a thing but i object. there are those guys ot there who were subjected to music in a very early age and their heart pump in a groove. i wish i were one ofem. anyways. thats a journey and im determned to continue untill i die. even thou i cannot reach a level of a even a mid class drummer i enjoy the progress. when i first learned diddles and paradiddles i thought i could spend 10 years just to play them. fortunatelly there are dozens of them :)
the comparison for success, seeing so many people who rip it. I am like okay not working. Forgetting I just love to sit done and jam not liking general practice
Oh this hits a little too close to home 😅 I have been playing for nearly 20 years now, but I am still nowhere near a midlevel drummer (by UA-cam standards). But I got somewhere in life, I graduated, got a good job and live together with my SO, maybe become parents in a while. Drumming was always a hobby and I noticed a while ago that those high gloss drummers on UA-cam popped up left and right and told everyone "IF YOU WANNA GIT GUD DRUMMING MUST BECOME YOUR LIFE!!!". But I already have a life, and I am fine with drumming just being a hobby. I joined my first band a year ago and yeah, I noticed that I really enjoy playing with others and that I am good enough to do so. Still, I am learning new stuff to get better, but like you said: I am more of a tortoise. And a slow one and that. Also, you said that after 3 YEARS you liked your chops. 3 YEARS. First time I ever heard an honest time frame for that.
Wow, that was great, but hard for an old timer like me to follow. Just past 60 years since I began with sticks. There was drum corps at age 10, high school band for 4 years, 5 years out of high school playing 7 nights a week on tour, the next 43 years playing weekends in bar bands. Retired from day job and raising 4 adopted kids, and back to playing many gigs now at age 68. I never got to the level I wished for, but got good enough to keep at it, bc I simply love playing. I would say my chops are adequate for what I need to move the music along and say it. Did the last 2 gigs with a new keyboard player, who called me to tell me I had great feel. It always came easy to me, and honestly mostly never practiced, just play for fun. A strange story, I heard about some drummer named Dino Donelli who tossed his sticks up, and twirled. And because I was a huge Cobham fan, taught my self open handed so I'd have a free right hand to throw my right stick up skyward, while playing with just my left. I decided years ago, that this would be my "thing". I knew I would never be great or a master, so I make music, entertain, and have a blast. One of my coworkers came to a gig after hearing me say, I am playing with the band this weekend many times. When he saw me play he said to me: "You used to say you played drums, but I never dreamed you could do that!" I am going to play as long as I can.
This is the most ‘real’ drum video I’ve ever seen. No shit. The lesson here is applicable across all aspects of life… career, relationships, education, etc. Commitment is central to any endeavor, but success is not guaranteed. I’m *way* too scared to post much of my drumming online. Who wants to see a 60+ year old white dude who is not Weckl or Gadd play the drums, anyway? Really all I want to accomplish on the drums at this point is to be able to play a 16th note hihat groove really comfortably at 100 bpm. Is that too much to ask? How long does it take to get there? FWIW I have NEVER considered quitting. The music makes me want to dig in even more…
Newer drummers will watch a drummer on a mic’ed set and even though they play the same notes it just doesn’t stack up in sound when they play it at home. Then there’s the ten second clip drummers with 20 takes.
Exactly. The toxic side of social media is that it fosters "competitive comparison culture." We should not forget that being a drummer is not just about being a drummer - it's about making music.
but the other side is that competition pushes you to be better, so if you want to be great you probably have to dance with it. That paradox is what the whole video is about.
@@8020drummer 10:24 ... did you ever compare hi class football (soccer) games from the 70s to today? this push in excellence is found everywhere in our lives and society, propably caused by access to knowledge, teachers, technologie... we are standing on the shoulders of giants.
to be honest your greatest success in life will possibly be this channel, embrace it! are you a good drummer? good enought for what? just keep it up and enjoy while it lasts... hope you don't choke to death on your own vomit in the back of a car too early. It's just a game... Listen to Alan Watts & chill man XD
One of my new favorite drum videos. Nate you bring the philosophy to the drums and have a unique perspective that's so worth hearing.
Your message speaks directly to me personally, especially after over 30 years of playing and part of that semi-pro.
At some point you have to specialize and then find your sound. I'm on that journey within the scope of playing covers... Which is a challenge within itself. It's an interesting, frustrating (similar to working out) but fun endeavor to see your progress over years. Your absolutely bang on about the obsession... I call it the hunger. If I don't play nearly everyday I get the hunger and it just has to be satiated.
Agreed-just make music, first and foremost-the music you hear in your own head-believe in it. Individuality will gradually follow as will improved technique. Jack DeJohnette once said something to the effect that his “style” is simply to listen carefully and deeply to the music his bandmates are making and then respond intuitively-not “thinking”. We all have idols but we all gotta do our own thing.🤷🏻
Being past the 70 mark in life, most of my drumming apart from teaching, is attempting to (as best as I can ) maintain skills and not to think about "glory days" or expect too much and gig when I can
There was a moment a while back:
I was at a theatre production of Glengarry Glen Ross and the sound design was ALL drums…fast, frenetic, fiercely creative solo jazz drums. This was shortly after the movie Birdman came out so the composer was probably hitting that trend. Anyway I ran down the program and it turned out a buddy of mine was listed as the sound designer. Now, I used to get calls from him to do sessions for EXACTLY this kind of thing and at this time I had taken quite a long time out of playing and was definitely not in the scene at all. I was initially kinda bummed and then thought “ahh well, he didn’t call me for this session and whoever THIS guy is he’s WAY BETTER THAN ME, so fair game”. I quickly reconciled the reality check and sent a txt to my guy the sound designer.
“Hey man nice stuff in Glenngary Glen Ross”
He replied
“Thanks man…who do you reckon the drummer is?”
I then replied with a few names of guys around that I thought sounded THAT GOOD.
He replied
“It’s you dickhead”
I called him at the end of the show and as it turned out the director of the show had changed his mind mid tech and my guy had to use some old stock recordings to get on the Birdman trend. It was stuff I had recorded with him in a studio in South Korea a year or two previous. Anyway, from that point onwards I stopped worrying about how I sounded and started enjoying the fact that whatever I was doing I was doing something ok.
I managed to hear myself in a truly objective way without knowing it was me and I really liked myself.
These are the videos I care about most. As you well know by now, I spend way too much time thinking about this stuff, so seeing someone else troubling themselves over the minute details of what it takes to be great, and then attempting to articulate those minutia to the world is kind of calming.
you're too kind! And you're also an avatar to me that someone can get to an elite level with hard work and discipline. The way you've leveled up in recent years is pretty amazing
The best thing about 80/20 is that after watching a few videos, I actually want to go play or practice. Just for the joy of it.
I used to be obsessed with being the best drummer in my area. I did achieve that and I have done a ton of session work and belong to an agency out of Philly. One day something clicked for me that said, playing a million beats a minute is boring and annoying to most people. The only people that really appreciate a billion chops are other drummers. I decided I would never overplay again and only play for the music. Guess what, I found people appreciate a drummer that plays a killer tight pocket over a million hits. Take Jeff Porcaro for example. The dude was one of the most sought after drummers for years simply because he had a killer pocket and only played tasty fills ONLY when it felt right but he never overplayed. In the context of a song, being a tight drummer is the ONLY thing that matters.
Right sure but you realize its from taking away what you are potentially capable of playing to leave what's raw and bare as opposed to being technically limited to play simply. Without the capacity for those chops those drummers would be moot. Its what they don't say not what they are incapable of saying..
This is the conclusion I came to. There are so many incredible drummers, and I'm not going to catch them. But the average Joe listener has no clue what's going on there anyway. Non-drumming musicians have no clue, either. Chops and deep skills ARE amazing, but only to other drummers. Nobody else even comprehends what's happening. Tight pockets and consistency is all they notice.
i on the other hand find playing a million beats per minute in fact not boring at all actually
@@YOUARESOFT. Totally your choice.
My favorite 80/20 video yet! The most valuable lesson videos aren’t always about rudiments 😎
Darapiddle
I can relate to that work/life balance. I'm approaching my mid-50s. At this point in my life, I just want to keep my chops up, learn new things for my own benefit, and play with others when I can. In short, it's more for my own enjoyment.
By the way, I enjoy this type of video. It's healthy to have discussions like this.
I can relate! I’m 62. I play in a rock band with guys that may be 20 years younger but mentally I still feel like I’m 29
1:23 getting good as a PARENT
. WHILE RAISING A KID! thats next level
I think being an amazing chopsmeister and getting to show off your skills at every opportunity you have behind the drum kit is one way to get some satisfaction out of drumming. Another way, though, is to collaborate with others to create music that isn't necessarily designed to show off fancy chops, but is meant to make an original statement and to be beautifully composed. Then it's less about gaining chops to show off with and more about how to sustain the mood of the music you're playing. I always want to improve my chops, but at the same time, I'm not obsessed with showing off chops (which is a good thing becuase I'm not all that technically advanced!). What I really want to accomplish is to collaborate with others to play music that I would actually enjoy listening to. These days, I'm less interested in listening to music that seems to put a high priority on showing off the player's chops. I want to feel the mood of what folks are doing and go to a place I haven't been when I listen to the music.
Music to me is a kind of drug, and I'm more interested in the effects it can produce, rather than being aware of the craft of how it's made...
Thanks for the video. I think I’m taking the “tortoise” route myself, and your videos and courses help me focus the smaller amount of time I have to practice. Even with 30-90 minutes a day, I can track my own progress and feel confident in my playing. I just want to be as good as I can be without being a full time musician.
I wish I'd be able to average more than 30m a day 😅
But I still feel a lot of difference every month of playing. It's crazy what a few new ideas (for example watching these videos), a good practice regimen and recording myself did to my playing
man youre so right, i like to use jordan peterson's quote "compare yourself to who you were yesterday not to who anyone else is today" and in my darkest hours its been the light at the end of the tunnel.
my story is funny since i havent been playing that long (5 years) but a year and a half ago i decided i wanted to try to achieve 300bpm with both my hands and feet with no gimmicks or triggers etc. (im a death metal dude hehe) and also trying to find my own voice within it all being super extreme and stuff. crazy to think im almost there and playing at 270 bpm has become somewhat of a new comfort zone and i relate so much to what you say that the goal keeps growing as you get closer to it like an infinite rabbit chase! i started to post on the socials but often times the whole atmosphere in the social med realm felt weird/competitive/ridiculous and pushed buttons in me i didnt want being pushed and its crazy what the chase of popularity can do to the mind.
ive felt recently like just deleting instagram and youtube and becoming a full time hermit but i also think i have something special going on and wanna put it out there to find some other sick dudes to collab with and other sick dudes to inspire. strange world were living in with all these "tools" that can do as much damage as they can do good depending on how you use them and or if you let them use you.
even though our styles are leagues apart ive always loved your channel and your playing and was super happy when you played at meinl!! watching this has given me some much needed inspiration and im so happy youve stayed true to yourself and have made and effort to improve but not to change your essence! cheers dude, message got kinda deep and long but thanks! keep shredding 🤟🤟🤟
Thank you for digging into the thoughts floating around my head. That's how you get the gig!
This is what UA-cam used to be for for me. People inspiring you to go practice. I find it harder to find that stuff these days.
Brilliant observation and insight...!!!!
....Excellent!
I started drums in my mid 20s 4 years ago. I just accepted the fact that I’ll never hit the level i want to because I’m a late starter. Only thing I can do is just be the better than yesterday and that in itself keeps me motivated.
how many hours a day do you practice and what level are you shooting for (like name players)
@@8020drummerI am in a very similar station as this man, currently 25/26 been playing about 2 and a half years with what time I have I put about 2 hours on average most days if not everyday on the kit. Is this normal? Is this enough? What do you think of this because often wonder if it’s cursed for me too since I’m a late starter ?
@@8020drummer For the first 2 years 4 hours 4-5 days a week and the pass 2 years I have more responsibilities so 1.5 -2 hours a day 5-6 days a week. I aspire to the level of Matt Garstka and Larnell Lewis.
I've been watching you for years and you've truly gotten so much better. Cleaner time, more refined touch, faster, more vocab, and more powerful. your videos about what separates us from the greats years ago really opened my eyes and gave me the reality check I needed. im still not where I want to be but you've helped me improve exponentially to the point where im better than a lot of ppl I looked up to so thank you for that. these conversations need to happen more often
Needed to hear this, thanks for more great insight
I love the psychological headspace video. Of course excellent drumming too
THANK YOU for taking the time and your resources to make this video, as I can TOTALLY relate. On a mission, but it's my own :-)
Great video! This was exactly what I needed to watch today. Thanks!
Loved the video, thank you for making this kind of content (apart from the other more 'practical' stuff, which is also amazing)
I started watching you about 3 yrs ago when I decided to become more than someone who can play.....'sorta' to someone who understands drumming and aspires to be a musician. This is your best video in my humble opinion and I understand Its a 'right time, right place' thing. If ya feel as if you should do a video on the importance of solid singles, do it! Cuz that's you-like it or not. 🤘😝
I love this video!!!! Great summary of so many thoughts I've had.
What I needed to hear. Thanks!!!
great work Nate and congrats on your channel, staggering amount of work. Thanks for your inspiration to older drummers struggling to be any good - lots to absorb here. Keep it up man!
Solid essay, Nate. Keep doing your thing, even if just to piss off the haters.
Great video!! This applies to many things in life. I could wax on with a philosophical tome but I'll just say this. Jeff Porcaro didn't do drum solos and didn't like drum solos. What did he he do? He helped make music that has moved millions upon millions of people and according to first hand accounts was a wonderful person to be around.
This is a great conversation!!! Love it
Brilliant video 🔥🔥🔥
Love your videos dude 👊
After 3+ years of 2 hours a day I'm very happy with my progress. Because it has been progress. Incremental, day by day, week by week, I'm getting better. I'm not in it to be a social media drumming darling. I do it because I see improvement. I do it because I love to play music with others, and sound good doing it. That makes me happy. And who are those people to be calling out "mid".. that's just gatekeeping from people who probably feel small themselves.
Great video, thanks! The complex feelings or struggles many musicians are in very good packed in words. Thanks
LOVE this vid - thanks for tackling this touchy, convoluted subject.
I agree with your assessment and appreciate you voicing your counsel on this topic. Steady slow progress is always a sure bet and yields valuable fruit.
I'm always inspired by your content, I really appreciate and benefit from your comprehensive and deeper analysis of drumming. But this time, this video inspired me like no other, thanks. I am now practice, practice, practicing with even more purpose. Since I watched it the other day. It is such a motivator that I plan to watch it multiple times until I make it my internal mantra. Too much, I think not.
Thank you! I am a new drummer, and I'm learning songs now. I've been trying to play like the drummers in the band. After watching this, I went and played, relaxed, and enjoyed it so much. Was it technically perfect....no. I see now that I can play these using my own voice and just feel the song. The technicality will come. It was so much more enjoyable practicing 😃🥁🤘
now THIS is what resonates! I've been spending a lot of time lately just thinking about these things a bit too much. It all eats away the creativity and the ability to make beautiful music. It's sooooo important to talk about all this stuff, the mental side of drumming, the different aspects of life as a drummer, and so on. There are countless ways to play the drums, and trusting your own voice and vision is not always easy with all the pressure going on. Being a drummer is being a musician, and being a musician is being a human. Thank you for speaking about all this. This was a great video.
Thanks for the insights!! Well said. I've been playing for 30+ years and couldn't have said it any better! Yes keep sharing it's great to hear someone being human.
Golden. Your insights here are subtle yet profound. Yes, it’s the paradox, or maybe countless paradoxes: obsession, calmness, healthy comparison, awareness of weaknesses, focus on precision, acceptance of my flaws, enjoyment of my own personal journey, discipline to take myself where I want to go, for however long it takes to get there. These seemingly disparate concepts needn’t be contradictory (and certainly not controversial). They’re each vital ingredients in this gourmet dish I’m cooking up, even when I’m only cooking for one. Thank you, Nate.
I love your videos, these more 'mental aspect of the game' ones especially, that you present both sides, pros&cons, of any one aspect of any of this (internet peer pressure for ex.) and I'm not even a drummer! But I am definitely on, and in a way at age 60 finishing up some phase of, the long game course of 'a few hours a day for a lot of years' thing. Keep up the great work, it's inspiring.
Really enjoyed this cast.
Nate i think this is your best video yet. You`re focusing more on yourself than on others so it makes it more relatable. One thing i would add is that life is not that short and people often seem to forget that in a lifetime one can put a gargantuan body of work into something but it just takes time. And that`s alright, it should take time and it should be more about the process than checkpoints.
All great topics👏👏👏
Loved this. Definitely spoke to me as a drummer with dreams of getting solid, but over the course of decades.
Awesome video Nate! I’m definitely struggling with this exact paradox. As the guy that’s trying to keep a worklife balance I feel I’m somewhere in the middle. My obsessed nature keeps me in the 2 to 3 hours a day practice routine, but I feel it’s not enough to get to where I want to be.
Thank you! As someone who isn't trying to become a chopper, but just wants to groove and throw in the occassional "oh shit" when the music asks for it, I really appreciate you taking time to validate this journey. I think reminders like this can be just as important as exercise guidance
Hi, I caught this and just wanted to thank you for your down to earth and honest approach to this issue. I know that it isn't easy at any level , to deal with wanting to be better and all of the things that get in the way of getting into the woodshed, or playing out etc.
I am very glad I came across your channel early in my playing (I am headed into just my third year) and I have to say that your body of work has really been a great guide to getting in, practicing and finding new ways to challenge and develop my stuff.
I still SUCK! I'm fifty now, I know there is a ceiling to where I can get (or a better way to say it, I am eminently aware of the end we all face) but I go in knowing that I have a rough work life family and art to answer to. I just go in and try to be my best self. That is no easy thing, but it is easier knowing there are a lot of folks in this community doing the same thing.
Anyways, thank you for your bravery in doing this video, and I wish you inspiration and headspace. (This goes for everyone, let's go!!!)
Finally found a golden channel for drums
Keep up thee gr8 work ✨🫡🥁
Great video Nate
So glad u brought this, how long b4 i get really, really good, topic.
Thank you for this video. I am one of those people who practiced 1.5hr per day for years and now have to schedule a day off. The day off makes me like drumming more. Also I'm in two bands. One of them a church, the other a local ccm cover band and I work full-time. Your video helped me to find perspective on my own playing and content skills. Thanks again Nate, love the Chanel.
Excellent video on a really interesting topic
This video was great!!!
real talk. as usual... thank you
Great video and fair play for being so frank and honest... me I just want to develop my own simple sound and have fun playing and I feel inspired to do so after this vid!
Another great insight. There is such a wide spectrum of learning to cover. I take my time, practice a lot on my hands, holding the sticks, finger technique, dynamics. When I learnt in the late 70's I had in the region of 5 professional players as teachers, guys who were making albums touring, having hit records (Gentle Giant, Honky). Not a one gave any insight on how to hold the sticks correctly.... I find that astonishing. My 'thing' was hitting hard, which is the absolute antithesis to becoming good. So I'm reteaching myself. It's slow progress but I'm feeling good about it. One area that is for me probably the least discussed and I believe does separate the good from the great is the black box - the workings of the brain. I recall being told by a fabulous guitarist I was working for that I was thinking too much and blocking my flow. I agree to a certain extent, because if one has a firm foundation of the basics in place and an ear for complementing the music, if you can allow your mind free of the insecurities from external influences you could go an awfully long way and be very employable. For example, I remember from the 80's, seeing a gigging drummer playing exemplary drums (beautifully tuned kit) without using any sub divisions smaller than 8th notes. I know today that may appear strange, but is was someone maximising the music while not worrying about scrutiny from others. Just a thought.
Keep up the great work!
Analytics aside, I think more people appreciate these deeper reflection vlogs than you realize. I need these reminders that I have a chance despite not being a full time musician.
Firstly, I would take those 3 free coaching courses. I did, and they definitely helped. This video made me think of a Sweetwater promotional thing I saw a long time ago where drummer X and Y (huge social media stars at the time) went to Sweetwater and were trying to play a bunch a hobbyists drummer's stuff. I was surprised to see that they were failing epically! It got me thinking that once you are intermediate or "mid" you have a sound that no one replicates as well as YOU! I personally love that. After a while, all of your influences, specific patterns, stickings, grid work you practice, and tendencies cuisinart into something that is very uniquely you.
Love this❤
Loved the video, articulated my daily battle very well. I'm a 2-3 hours a day guy, on average, sometimes less, sometimes more but rarely, if ever, not at all. I have a family with 2 kids and 2 jobs and usually I can't manage more than 3 hours cumulative practice per day. I am obsessed with getting better, I sacrifice sleep in order to do it and in the last 10 years I've made major strides forward in my playing and changed the direction that I was going in radically. But at heart, I do it because I love it, nothing more.
On your point about drummers on average getting better in the last 10 years, I do sound at a local venue and have done for 20 odd years now and I absolutely concur that the standard of musicianship has improved dramatically in that time. Although I wouldn't necessarily say the same about the quality of the music, but that's another topic I guess. Keep these videos coming Nate, it's been great to watch your improvement on the thing you love.
Oh yeah! I've long been pretty good at jamming, a sort of Bill Bruford influence without the proper training to do it really well has been my basis long time. Drums are my most recent discipline in music, muilti instrumentalist since I was 8 years old. I learned basic drumming in my teens and stayed beginner and a little bit intermediate for being able to follow odd time signatures until just about a year ago when I started focus on upping my drum cred.
More of a challenge for me to keep basic beats. I could jam and play musically relevant things, but not the same thing twice and had a hard time holding any particular beat. Enter Bowie, where I studied him in singer songwriter style for a few years to get some lost skills back and recently started to really dig into the drums and they're not as easy as they may sound when paying more attention to the vocals and chords. The thing now is to train steadiness in really syncopated right foot patterns and snare back beat pops, then work on the offbeat hi hat barks. Step by step is how it's done with a crazy human trick like playing drum kit.
Then, in between bands with nowhere to set up my kit I still practice every day with great drummers in my headphones sitting in a chair and just tapping feet and slapping knees to get the patterns and dynamics trained up so when I get back to my kit I have less things to tune up and just apply the already well practiced patterns to the kit.
Woodmansey and Davis the period of Bowie under consideration. Boris Williams period of The Cure also a present study. Then Bob Marley, Natty Dread.
Hey, Nate! Just Great ! You're pure Zen .
Good topic. I'm always fighting the losing battle of finding a life balance as an older parent and accomplishing the drum goals I'd like to achieve.
Great video
Fantastic video. Thank you for giving someone like me, 46 years old and playing for one year, some hope and a little kindling to keep the fire going. It’s a struggle to have the mental focus and physical energy to play an hour everyday, walking the tight rope of social media being inspiring or deflating, and wondering if it’s too late in my life to bother.
Let’s just say I didn’t know what I was getting myself into when I casually thought I wanted to learn to play the drums because “playing with all 4 limbs independently intrigued me.” 😆
All that, all that 🙌 and i've to say Sir, you where always that dude that has the most naturally like lofi drum sound and touch ever. Even when you'd played straight ahead 🤌 absolutely unique 🔥 like it's already sampled 🔥 goosebumpy ❤
Awesome vid bro❤ not sure anyone would leave negative feedback. You’re an awesome teacher
Wonderful vid
Keep speaking the truth and being relatable!
This was one of the best eps
Currently on the 60 min per week approach. Between running a business, and being a husband/father of 3, the dream of playing drums with my own "voice" is on the super slow/steady plan. And I'm perfectly OK with that 🐢🤘
That’s me too! I am pretty sure I’m better than I was 2 years ago,….. but maybe not. At least I’m not worse. I can tell that much.
Keep making these.
I think about quitting ALL the time. Especially after a gig. I fantasize about quitting - about giving all my gear away and keeping a snare as an art piece. .... and then I go practice.
Yes. We did a thing!
Thank you for this video, breakdowns are cool but life experience and wisdom trumps that, this is gold
Really good point and interesting analysis.
Sure I'm not the only one to say this applies to other instruments and other skills as well.
Of course. I’d imagine it follows 1:1 for any discipline where you’re improvising and you need years of practice to develop the skill
@@8020drummer And I think it at least generally applies to being good at my engineering profession as well...almost anything that involves performance. There has to be some balance of drive to immerse yourself, which often comes from a significant amount of self criticism but then one can't just be so disappointed that it kills the drive to feel confident sharing and have fun with others.
Personally, I've been overly limited by the criticism aspect to such an extent that I actually think I sound better in a recording than I thought I sounded when playing the recorded piece. It seems like that's usually the opposite for most people.
Thanks Nate
really enjoyed this video!
this was a very good video
I really really dug this
Hi Nate, I love your videos! Every one is playing the Linear Grooves at this point SO I WILL LEARN ALSO AND JOIN GANG!
Great vid....very relatable to probably 90% of us drummers out there.
Dude I'm loving your content since six oder seven years. first comment by the way, been lurking :P Thanks fot the great advices and your helpfull thoughts.
i feel like were on a similar page on this subject. i always feel like salieri in the amadeus movie. i have enormous passion for drums and trying my best to learn it however not so talented and began drumming very late at 35. all pro drummers talk about talent is not a thing but i object. there are those guys ot there who were subjected to music in a very early age and their heart pump in a groove. i wish i were one ofem. anyways. thats a journey and im determned to continue untill i die. even thou i cannot reach a level of a even a mid class drummer i enjoy the progress. when i first learned diddles and paradiddles i thought i could spend 10 years just to play them. fortunatelly there are dozens of them :)
Yo N8 this video was helpful as fuck: currently working through some burn out and this helps allot.
This is a great video. It was simply a matter of time before "church chops" became the holy grail
the comparison for success, seeing so many people who rip it. I am like okay not working. Forgetting I just love to sit done and jam not liking general practice
Oh this hits a little too close to home 😅 I have been playing for nearly 20 years now, but I am still nowhere near a midlevel drummer (by UA-cam standards). But I got somewhere in life, I graduated, got a good job and live together with my SO, maybe become parents in a while. Drumming was always a hobby and I noticed a while ago that those high gloss drummers on UA-cam popped up left and right and told everyone "IF YOU WANNA GIT GUD DRUMMING MUST BECOME YOUR LIFE!!!". But I already have a life, and I am fine with drumming just being a hobby. I joined my first band a year ago and yeah, I noticed that I really enjoy playing with others and that I am good enough to do so. Still, I am learning new stuff to get better, but like you said: I am more of a tortoise. And a slow one and that. Also, you said that after 3 YEARS you liked your chops. 3 YEARS. First time I ever heard an honest time frame for that.
Wow, that was great, but hard for an old timer like me to follow. Just past 60 years since I began with sticks. There was drum corps at age 10, high school band for 4 years, 5 years out of high school playing 7 nights a week on tour, the next 43 years playing weekends in bar bands. Retired from day job and raising 4 adopted kids, and back to playing many gigs now at age 68. I never got to the level I wished for, but got good enough to keep at it, bc I simply love playing. I would say my chops are adequate for what I need to move the music along and say it. Did the last 2 gigs with a new keyboard player, who called me to tell me I had great feel. It always came easy to me, and honestly mostly never practiced, just play for fun. A strange story, I heard about some drummer named Dino Donelli who tossed his sticks up, and twirled. And because I was a huge Cobham fan, taught my self open handed so I'd have a free right hand to throw my right stick up skyward, while playing with just my left. I decided years ago, that this would be my "thing". I knew I would never be great or a master, so I make music, entertain, and have a blast. One of my coworkers came to a gig after hearing me say, I am playing with the band this weekend many times. When he saw me play he said to me: "You used to say you played drums, but I never dreamed you could do that!" I am going to play as long as I can.
6:43 Love Brannen!
Good thoughts 👍
Dig it!
Do you train jits? Them ears lookin fantastic! Osssss
This is the most ‘real’ drum video I’ve ever seen. No shit. The lesson here is applicable across all aspects of life… career, relationships, education, etc. Commitment is central to any endeavor, but success is not guaranteed.
I’m *way* too scared to post much of my drumming online. Who wants to see a 60+ year old white dude who is not Weckl or Gadd play the drums, anyway?
Really all I want to accomplish on the drums at this point is to be able to play a 16th note hihat groove really comfortably at 100 bpm. Is that too much to ask? How long does it take to get there?
FWIW I have NEVER considered quitting. The music makes me want to dig in even more…
Newer drummers will watch a drummer on a mic’ed set and even though they play the same notes it just doesn’t stack up in sound when they play it at home. Then there’s the ten second clip drummers with 20 takes.
Thank you 80/20!
Gracias
I was in jail for two years
Practiced tapping on my knees to the radio every day
I am both literally and metaphorically unhinged