This was great! but it also made me realize as someone who has worked so hard to heal from deep trauma that I dont want to be the one “studying” to learn how to talk to my avoidant partner. If I did the work (and Ive been through much more trauma than he has) why am I again having to learn the ropes? this helped me realize this is not the relationship for me as I want someone who has done the work by and for himself instead of me or our relationship. Very very helpful!
Your message made me realise that I m a drama queen OR the victim of a narc for the 2nd time.... Coz thats something I d never write because love is forever and ever and if you can separate that means you never loved in the first and you are a hypocrite and so we stick together and go through difficulties and if you can't do the job then I understand it might be hard for you so I ll do your part too
@@hspinnovators5516 Wow, just know you have made my day. Therapy is like a second slap in the face. I'm reversing the damage my parents did to me as a child.
Right out the gate, your cabin analogy made me laugh only because it describes my current situationship. I absolutely adore my SO , but he is so avoidant he can push me away without blinking an eye. It has taken me over a year to adjust to it and not take it personally. I will admit the lack of close intimate connection is the hardest for me.
The ethically avoidant aspect hits home. I know a big part of the reason that mine broke up with me was that she couldn't help but pull away, but she could see how much she was hurting me by doing so . . . which of course just heightened her overwhelm.
This was a great video, and so useful. I really like the work that Adam Smith is offering. I do feel like this offering will open the door for avoidantly leaning people and their partners to walk into (which can sometimes be an impossible task), but that in order to make actual lasting nervous system changes to deeply held insecure patterns of relating and connecting, we must engage in an embodied healing process that calls us to FEEL our way in the present moment towards healing. Otherwise, we're just talking about our experience, like watching from far above, without actually fully engaging in it with our whole bodies. I think this is how lasting changes are made.
Your TITLE gave me a huge aha moment. Love leads to pain. I suddenly realized what is happening in my relationship. My partner grew up in a rough childhood (alcohol), enmeshed family, tends to ghost relationships or picks other avoidants to be with. No risk. He was forced into a young sham marriage by his family, about which he feels great shame. He is anti marriage. Can’t hold a normal relationship. His closest safest person (mom) died. His best friend since they were kids together, died. For him, love and attachment and friendship and marriage and even family, all those things lead to pain. But he loves me, though he doesn’t say it. And that’s ok. For me, a fearful/disorganized avoidant, I get it. I finally get it. I was avoiding pushing about the future, but I didn’t understand why he refuses to acknowledge any feelings. I’m the one he shares with, reveals old dark secrets to, laughs with. I’ve shared much of my dark history and pain with him. He is very stoic. He cannot handle managing my emotions but that’s ok. I am not codependent on him. I thought maybe one day he could love me or tell me he does. It’s been years already. I keep waiting for him to love me or leave me. It keeps my anxiety sky high. But now I realize he does love me, but can never admit to it. Because then it will become doomed in his scared little boy mind because it will “lead to pain”. I’m doing the work on myself but I’ve come to the conclusion he won’t. He has a very macho exterior. His self preservation is super strong. I don’t know if we will last a day more or years more, but I guess I finally feel some peace because of THIS episode. All I wanted was for him to love me. The one thing he cannot do is ever admit to himself that he already does. It would lead to catastrophic thoughts. That something bad will happen to me if he does. I feel so much relief! I know it sounds weird to be relieved that the man I love will never admit to me or himself that he loves me. But, it means it’s not me. That I am not doing something wrong to keep love away. I try so hard for him, for us. I’ve always accepted him as he is, flawed but also perfectly human. It is me who I could not accept.
@attachmentadam Ive watched all your videos Adam for the past 6 months and this is the one that finally got me to buy your course. Thank you Adam, thank you Mark.
Wow, that statement about Anxiously attached people slaming accountability suggestions. I am anxious att. I don't relate at all. I want to be accountability. I loved this conversation. Thank you both.
@@markgroves oh sorry for the confusion!! Yes you are right. Canada is also a censorship beast of its own especially with the dictator you guys have over there
This is a brilliant video! I have shared it and I'm hoping it isn't too late. Thank you for sharing information and being informative to help others who are struggling.
19:16 I play chess and that is exactly how i play chess. When analyzing a position and thinking of the next moves i pick out the three best moves. Then the three best responses my opponent could make to those three. Then my three options i could pick between for ~those 27 moves. So on and so forth. Crazy how much the avoidants thought process reflects this.
Recently discovered that I have a disorganised attachment style. So many things make so much sense with this knowledge. I am struggling to find legitimate help in my local area (obviously with the trust issues ha ha). This is very helpfull thank you! x
What are some specific behaviour examples you can share that an anxious attachment style person should be regulating by themselves and what are some that are acceptable behaviours to co regulate with a partner?
This was fantastic! Thank you.. as a healing anxious gal, the personal accountability is as uncomfortable as pt after surgery:) but with exponential healing!💜 grant yourself accountability!!:) Did I miss level 4 trust truth..?? Or was there only 3..? 😬
Adam is great but an auditory. really thinking these are a big part of the devastation of the culture of the world today and need by all even secure attachment people to understand the people around them More 👍
I've been watching these videos for a while and I've come to the conclusion that this is absolute bullshit. Why do I have to bend over backwards and kill myself for a scrap of affection. It's been years, my husband won't budge and I'm DONE because I would rather live alone than constantly feel like shit because he WILL NEVER CHANGE. AVOIDANTS DON'T CHANGE and anyone who says otherwise just wants your MONEY. I will throw an awesome divorce party and live my life free and clear. I have cats, friends and family and none of the time I've invested in my marriage was worth it. None of this so called advice will give you want you want. Break the cycle.
Adam's channel has themed playlists. One is dedicated to Avoidant attachment. In that, there are one or two about Avoidant women specifically. But like any other insecure attachment style - The key behavior tendencies are unisex, & very similar between men & women. The only differences really being variations for individual personalities & context of their roles. The info for Avoidant men or Anxious women can typically be re-applied over to the opposite sex... just tweak the wording 😉. In a broad sense, Avoidant women can come off as seeming more aggressive, no nonsense, "masculine", "boss lady", or "tomboy". In current vernacular "stuck in their masculine". Anxious men can be the more nervous type who give more "sensitive" or "nurturing" vibes... maybe a touch effeminate in some ways in relationships, even if they are a "guy's guy" otherwise. In current vernacular, "stuck in their feminine".
If I had to choose between the two insecure attachment as a man. I'll choose to be the dismissive one. Because, being an anxious attached man, is the biggest red flags to many women, coz I often seen as "nice guy"
No. I broke up with my DA partner and he has been contacting me for months. I finally get in touch with him and he tells me he loves me and then ghosts me. This is a cycle for them. It repeats. I believe they need to have something traumatizing them to look inward and get help. Like an ephiphany
I would get so hurt by this comparison and my partners reaction to it that I would freak out . Intentions are important , if he was talking , engaging ,just because he compared our precious love to business , not out of love and affection to me , it would mean nothing to me. This woman should divorce this man who is neglecting her.
It means being able to sit with another and breath together... to find balance and calm together. To dialogue without getting reactive. Check out my episode with Sarah Baldwin called "The nervous system explained"
What a put down to say anxious follow podcasts like yours. You don't think secure attachments don't like to learn? You're probably one of these that think secure people don't get with Avoidants?
@@Apbt-rv7zw - it’s by no means meant as a put down. Anxiously attached people tend to seek relationship knowledge far more than secure or avoidantly attached people. I appreciate all the people who listen to you and watch my podcast! obviously not everyone who listens to it is anxious. Which is the beauty of discernment and the ability to know what is true about you versus what is not.
I really appreciate this conversation. Some hard, but necessary truths. But also thank you for validating the pain caused by someone distancing.. I deeply needed that ❤️🩹💔
This was great! but it also made me realize as someone who has worked so hard to heal from deep trauma that I dont want to be the one “studying” to learn how to talk to my avoidant partner. If I did the work (and Ive been through much more trauma than he has) why am I again having to learn the ropes? this helped me realize this is not the relationship for me as I want someone who has done the work by and for himself instead of me or our relationship. Very very helpful!
Your message made me realise that I m a drama queen OR the victim of a narc for the 2nd time....
Coz thats something I d never write because love is forever and ever and if you can separate that means you never loved in the first and you are a hypocrite and so we stick together and go through difficulties and if you can't do the job then I understand it might be hard for you so I ll do your part too
Loved this, I put my hand up as an avoidant in therapy, it is HARD work.
Proud of you for doing the work! I wish you success.
@@bumblebee_ms Just know you stand out beyond the others. Very proud of you as getting there is half the work. It's possible
@@Weismant81 Thank you soooo much.
@@hspinnovators5516 Wow, just know you have made my day. Therapy is like a second slap in the face. I'm reversing the damage my parents did to me as a child.
Just recognizing that you have a problem is like half the work already. Keep at it
Amazing insight that should be taught beginning in Middle School. So wish I’d had this language and knowledge sooner in life
Right out the gate, your cabin analogy made me laugh only because it describes my current situationship. I absolutely adore my SO , but he is so avoidant he can push me away without blinking an eye. It has taken me over a year to adjust to it and not take it personally. I will admit the lack of close intimate connection is the hardest for me.
Always fascinated by Adams confidence in relating. And…he has the proof. Five children and it’s beautiful to me.
The ethically avoidant aspect hits home. I know a big part of the reason that mine broke up with me was that she couldn't help but pull away, but she could see how much she was hurting me by doing so . . . which of course just heightened her overwhelm.
This was a great video, and so useful. I really like the work that Adam Smith is offering.
I do feel like this offering will open the door for avoidantly leaning people and their partners to walk into (which can sometimes be an impossible task), but that in order to make actual lasting nervous system changes to deeply held insecure patterns of relating and connecting, we must engage in an embodied healing process that calls us to FEEL our way in the present moment towards healing. Otherwise, we're just talking about our experience, like watching from far above, without actually fully engaging in it with our whole bodies.
I think this is how lasting changes are made.
Your TITLE gave me a huge aha moment. Love leads to pain. I suddenly realized what is happening in my relationship. My partner grew up in a rough childhood (alcohol), enmeshed family, tends to ghost relationships or picks other avoidants to be with. No risk. He was forced into a young sham marriage by his family, about which he feels great shame. He is anti marriage. Can’t hold a normal relationship. His closest safest person (mom) died. His best friend since they were kids together, died. For him, love and attachment and friendship and marriage and even family, all those things lead to pain. But he loves me, though he doesn’t say it. And that’s ok. For me, a fearful/disorganized avoidant, I get it. I finally get it. I was avoiding pushing about the future, but I didn’t understand why he refuses to acknowledge any feelings. I’m the one he shares with, reveals old dark secrets to, laughs with. I’ve shared much of my dark history and pain with him. He is very stoic. He cannot handle managing my emotions but that’s ok. I am not codependent on him.
I thought maybe one day he could love me or tell me he does. It’s been years already. I keep waiting for him to love me or leave me. It keeps my anxiety sky high. But now I realize he does love me, but can never admit to it. Because then it will become doomed in his scared little boy mind because it will “lead to pain”. I’m doing the work on myself but I’ve come to the conclusion he won’t. He has a very macho exterior. His self preservation is super strong. I don’t know if we will last a day more or years more, but I guess I finally feel some peace because of THIS episode. All I wanted was for him to love me. The one thing he cannot do is ever admit to himself that he already does. It would lead to catastrophic thoughts. That something bad will happen to me if he does. I feel so much relief! I know it sounds weird to be relieved that the man I love will never admit to me or himself that he loves me. But, it means it’s not me. That I am not doing something wrong to keep love away. I try so hard for him, for us. I’ve always accepted him as he is, flawed but also perfectly human. It is me who I could not accept.
Well said
Thank you so much, gentlemen! This is the most helpful podcast on avoidants.
Really love this Mark. Your opening remarks are so healing. Thank you for sharing your wisdom, story and content generally
Thankfully the counseling program I graduated from was all attachment. We studied a lot of Sue Johnson's stuff.
@@Supsup7777 - I had the pleasure of interviewing her right before she passed. Such an incredible human and her work is truly tremendous.
@@markgroves awe I love that. ❤️
@attachmentadam Ive watched all your videos Adam for the past 6 months and this is the one that finally got me to buy your course. Thank you Adam, thank you Mark.
Omg that seashell story is going to stick with me forever
Wow, that statement about Anxiously attached people slaming accountability suggestions. I am anxious att. I don't relate at all. I want to be accountability. I loved this conversation. Thank you both.
Same it’s one of my main things lately
Really enjoying your content Mark!! Love that even though you live in California you aren’t pushing woke ideologies and you care about free speech
@@RivyO - thank you! Although I don’t live in California… Lol. I’m Canadian. I split my time between Calgary and Coeur d’Alene, Idaho.
@@RivyO - but Canada certainly has a lot of the ideological extremes that California has
@@markgroves oh sorry for the confusion!! Yes you are right. Canada is also a censorship beast of its own especially with the dictator you guys have over there
@@markgroves its national dead indian day, where canada blames catholic church and where we honour buried indians who do not exist.. CANADA IS TRASH.
Define 'woke'
This is a brilliant video! I have shared it and I'm hoping it isn't too late. Thank you for sharing information and being informative to help others who are struggling.
I am an anxious and I appreciate this so much!
19:16
I play chess and that is exactly how i play chess. When analyzing a position and thinking of the next moves i pick out the three best moves. Then the three best responses my opponent could make to those three. Then my three options i could pick between for ~those 27 moves. So on and so forth. Crazy how much the avoidants thought process reflects this.
Fantastic.
Adam you are amazing!
I am FA and my fiancé is DA.
I will implement everything you said.
Thank you so much.
Adam, which of your podcasts do you recommend sharing with your avoidant partner?
Share his videos. What Avoidant men need to be fulfilled
In his videos…..he always recommends How to love an avoidant man. It’s an informative video for both parties.
Recently discovered that I have a disorganised attachment style. So many things make so much sense with this knowledge. I am struggling to find legitimate help in my local area (obviously with the trust issues ha ha). This is very helpfull thank you! x
What is a proposition of risk mitigation? I mean I understand the theory, but how about a sample script.
this is so good. Thank you for this!
Could you please post the 4 levels of Trust. Thanks..so much great info!
I did a test that one of your guests suggested from Illinois very interesting
Excellent! : )
OK I'm going out there to find out how to speak the language men speak. Wish me luck! LOVE
The sea shell story 😂😂😂 . I get it now. What a great story hahaha
What are some specific behaviour examples you can share that an anxious attachment style person should be regulating by themselves and what are some that are acceptable behaviours to co regulate with a partner?
This was fantastic! Thank you.. as a healing anxious gal, the personal accountability is as uncomfortable as pt after surgery:) but with exponential healing!💜 grant yourself accountability!!:)
Did I miss level 4 trust truth..?? Or was there only 3..? 😬
What about avoidant women 👉👈
I relate so much to everything being said even though I'm a woman. That makes me wonder why my brain seems more masculine than feminine.
I think it would be very informative if their who's video showing secure attachment for u
Love the intro ❤️
FYI…The link to the course is incorrect. It’s wanting me to sign up to be affiliate.
Adam is great but an auditory. really thinking these are a big part of the devastation of the culture of the world today and need by all even secure attachment people to understand the people around them More 👍
I've been watching these videos for a while and I've come to the conclusion that this is absolute bullshit. Why do I have to bend over backwards and kill myself for a scrap of affection. It's been years, my husband won't budge and I'm DONE because I would rather live alone than constantly feel like shit because he WILL NEVER CHANGE. AVOIDANTS DON'T CHANGE and anyone who says otherwise just wants your MONEY. I will throw an awesome divorce party and live my life free and clear. I have cats, friends and family and none of the time I've invested in my marriage was worth it. None of this so called advice will give you want you want. Break the cycle.
Your judging 20% of the population based on your experience with one person?
@@Not_a_witch Yes.
The Cabin story is hilarious!! but I could not do it. ITS TOO HARD. I wish him well. This is not for me
21:25 the seashell story
Makes sense ❤
Wow thanks
When is the How to Love an Avoidant Woman coming?
Adam's channel has themed playlists. One is dedicated to Avoidant attachment. In that, there are one or two about Avoidant women specifically.
But like any other insecure attachment style - The key behavior tendencies are unisex, & very similar between men & women. The only differences really being variations for individual personalities & context of their roles.
The info for Avoidant men or Anxious women can typically be re-applied over to the opposite sex... just tweak the wording 😉.
In a broad sense, Avoidant women can come off as seeming more aggressive, no nonsense, "masculine", "boss lady", or "tomboy". In current vernacular "stuck in their masculine".
Anxious men can be the more nervous type who give more "sensitive" or "nurturing" vibes... maybe a touch effeminate in some ways in relationships, even if they are a "guy's guy" otherwise. In current vernacular, "stuck in their feminine".
@johnkaiser6710 he just did a live chat about that in the last day or 2 on his channel. Should be easy to find right now.
When I try to self regulate he starts to feel abandoned and resents my artwork or other people I talk to what am I supposed to do with that?
I know an avoidand man who grew up during a war at the age of 11 to 14
If I had to choose between the two insecure attachment as a man. I'll choose to be the dismissive one.
Because, being an anxious attached man, is the biggest red flags to many women, coz I often seen as "nice guy"
My DA has friendzoned me, moved in together and still shows up as BF but without any intimacy !! Why? He’s keeping me stuck ? Does he love me
No. I broke up with my DA partner and he has been contacting me for months. I finally get in touch with him and he tells me he loves me and then ghosts me. This is a cycle for them. It repeats. I believe they need to have something traumatizing them to look inward and get help. Like an ephiphany
I would get so hurt by this comparison and my partners reaction to it that I would freak out . Intentions are important , if he was talking , engaging ,just because he compared our precious love to business , not out of love and affection to me , it would mean nothing to me. This woman should divorce this man who is neglecting her.
He must learn to speak my language to .
❤
What does co- regulate mean in relationship?
It means being able to sit with another and breath together... to find balance and calm together. To dialogue without getting reactive. Check out my episode with Sarah Baldwin called "The nervous system explained"
@@markgroves Thank you!
What a put down to say anxious follow podcasts like yours. You don't think secure attachments don't like to learn?
You're probably one of these that think secure people don't get with Avoidants?
@@Apbt-rv7zw - it’s by no means meant as a put down. Anxiously attached people tend to seek relationship knowledge far more than secure or avoidantly attached people.
I appreciate all the people who listen to you and watch my podcast! obviously not everyone who listens to it is anxious. Which is the beauty of discernment and the ability to know what is true about you versus what is not.
All of the above 😅
Hippie dippy is a judgement and degrading word.
I really appreciate this conversation. Some hard, but necessary truths. But also thank you for validating the pain caused by someone distancing.. I deeply needed that ❤️🩹💔
Jordan Peterson ? No thanks. I listened to this only for Adam!
Omg that seashell story is going to stick with me forever
He must learn to speak my language to .