Taper Tooling For The Mill
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- Опубліковано 13 кві 2016
- Just another day in the garage. Needed some tooling arbors for the new mill, decided to make my own.
3 end mill holders and 1 slitting saw arbor -- 30 taper in this case. - Наука та технологія
11:40 broke 40 bucks in drills and time spent in order to save on buying a 40 dollar piece. Would totally do the same.
You just can't buy the satisfaction of holding what you need in your hand without having to grind your teeth for a week waiting for it to arrive.
I mean, you can, but have you seen what they charge for express delivery I mean goddamn
@@jerryjantola of course, you work for a week to make the part but that does not matter goddamit
The DI running in towards the slitting saw gave me quite a chuckle. Great vid!
I am loving going through all the old "This Old Tony" videos, and catching up with where you came from as a machinist, knowing roughly how far you've come. It is going to be a sad day when I get through the rest of your library (I predict 1 week tops,) and have to wait for a new video.
Rewatchability is high
if you turn chromoly again the best solution is to use, and I'm sure you as an engineer understand this term, "a metric assload" of coolant
An Imperial Assload is more rigid and last much longer.
An assload is not enough. You are supposed to use at least a metrical fuckton
I really think it calls for a shitload of coolant
Just needs some cool soothing LUBE by the ASSLOAD. That should take away the pain. John, Australia.
@@joandar1 as an Australian after last week we could ALL use an assload of cooling
Using tools to make tools ... I don't know why but watching it is absurdly captivating. Thanks for the videos!
my grandfather was a machinist for the L&N railroad here in Louisville. I like watching guys like you to learn about his job. fascinating! I always thought he was a mean old fart but I assume he had great talent. was a machinist for 40 plus years. thanks for your time and effort.
When we needed to "hack" a piece of custom tooling, we cut the taper, put it in the machine for which it was destined, and used tool holders on that machine to finish it. Concentricity was guaranteed (if you bolted down your tooling properly!)
That's what I was thinking.
Looking for this comment, glad it was made.
Too much common sense in that.
I did think that on making the taper & fitting it with draw bar - then hammering it home to make it a good fit. Then loosening the draw bar, tapping the taper loose and then retightening the draw bar to a normal amount and calling that 'it' for fit - then machining the business end. Thus ensuring the taper is well fitting prior to machining the business end. It's a pity those international tapers have 2 drive dogs. 1 would be better as that'd guarantee refitipeatability orientation.
@@millomweb you could mark one dog and one side of each toolholder
@@jonathanshaw6784 When I get power to my mill, that's my intention.
I like the parts with using a drill for the automatic feed...
Revisiting this vid, cause i need to make some ISO 30 holder as well
Wow, like your brass-hammer-drawbar-wrench combo
Running out the cross-slide to prevent crashes is a good idea! Nice job on the tooling.
+ArtemiaSalina Thanks Artemia!
Your so hard on yourself. So far as i can tell, you're an incredible machinist! You should be proud.
I'll admit. I panicked a bit at the end.
+DammitCoetzee Yeah he got me as well when I saw that saw feeding towards the indicator.
Haha
yeah, i cringed.
its possible to use a rotating ball bearing insert for the inditaor tool.
(or a Diy might be cheaper)
u are not alone
Great job! Love the indicator bit at the end! Know know where to tune when I'm feeling blue and need a laugh, thanks so much for taking the time to put these videos together and adding that comic flare!
this is the kid of quality content that we need on youtube and TV.
I hope you'll keep making interresting videos like this.
An hello from France.
Your videos are very entertaining. I work with metal cutting since I graduated in highschool twenty-five years ago and still love working with these machines. The Schaublin milling is a yet-to-be-true dream at least for me.
That's the best slitting saw I have seen ever much less shop made!! Great work, great video.
Thanks Sam, so far so good.
That's the truest running slitting saw I have seen yet!
Lathe can smell fear...😂😂😂😂🙀👨🏻🔧😜. Tony, I’m not watching tv anymore thanks to you!!! Your hilarious 😆!
The clamp from the V-block "Gave up the goast"...
I love ur vids, so keep on with ur good explanations and work.
Love this video. Also the overarm support, the tool post, these are my favorites. Your stuff on carbide is icing on the cake. Thanks again Tony!
Hello there Tony from deep down across the Pond !!!
Like the style of Your Videos.
No long drawn out delayed Turning Cutting runs. Explanations given. Set up shown. Run executed. Job done. Cool.
Keep 'em rolling
And Thanks for showing and sharing.
All the best
aRM
Thanks for your videos, glad to see someone else making his own tools. My dad was making a really heavy-duty drill press using an automotive transmission, it was huge. Unfortunately he passed away back in 1996 before it was done.
Family wanted the money and could not see letting me run it in his name.
Now that it is 2020 I have a mini engraving machine not large only 300 * 180 * 45 mm it is a steep learning curve converting. AutoCAD drawings to CAM g-code
Re-watching everything from ToT for 2020 Christmas present...thank god I have a stable job
I have truly enjoyed your videos and have learned a good bit from them. I enjoy your humor and the fact that you are not afraid to show when things go south.
Regarding cold bluing of parts. I have done quite a bit of gun smithing and I learned a very simple trick to make cold bluing more effective. Try warming the part up a bit above room temperature. Not enough to effect the grain structure, just enough to make the solution bite deeper. You are spot on about the cleanliness though. Cold bluing solutions are so touchy.
Your work looks great. Stay safe and have fun.
I love how you try to save every one time by speeding up stuff as small as moving something small around
Thanks Tony for sharing this project! I've got an NMTB-30 Wells-Index that I need to make some holders for. This answers some of my discovery questions.... :)
Nice work Tony!👍
i wish you made 1 vid a day.... i love watching your shit
if you dropped the "r" off 'your' that would be a really wierd comment.
Man, I wish I kept up metalwork and engineering. I also wish I had room and money for a machine shop. Making your own tools is the most satisfying thing I can think of
I cant believe you are howling about the cold blue process. You are getting great results for cold blue.
As always, amazing work and great humor.
Great job, Tony! I really like that you're making the tools yourself rather than buying them all.Sincerely,Tom Z
+Tom Zelickman (Inspiration Metalworks) Thanks Tom.. most of what my garage does is make tools for itself :)
Great sense of humor. You get right to the point. None of the typical "Welcome to blah....blah...today we are going to...blah...but first I have 57 things I want to .....blah....." click, next video. I actually watched the whole thing and subscribed. Nice work on both the tool and the video!
Good one! I am just about to turn a bit more Morsetapertooling - You got me motivated ;)
+Stefan Gotteswinter Morse taper I've always found to be a bit trickier.. those are self locking, mine are not. I'd recommend against using wood though, the blueing always turns out so weird. ;)
+This Old Tony LOL
Nice to see you break out the Pratt Burnerd KC15. I have one myself and I love it
I just got one today.... very happy boy
Hi Tony, i work chrome-moly steels alot for my work mostly 4140. to get it to chip well you need a pretty aggresive feed 0.2-0.3mm/rev with that feed and a decent chipbreaker it should come off nicely. even taking inly a few mms of the diameter.
Yup, this. Also, coolant, even mist coolant helps a ton. I have a feeling it was work hardening on him.
awesome info.... thank you. love your channel and the work you do
I screamed loudly at that slitting saw vs the dial indicator. I’ll send you the invoice for the pants cleaner, tony.
Nice wood shelf.
Love this stuff! That's old Tony!
Great vid Tony. I use one of those tapping heads, they can be finicky to set up the correct clutch pressure but generally I give them a solid 7
HUGE insperation, I just made two ISO 30 end mill holders.... 20mm and 25mm inspried by your video.I didn't have a collet big enough to fit the outside OD of the business end of the tool holder so I had to turn an arbor, first 25mm, then took it down to 20mm. I nice snugg fit and set scerws for secruring. they ran true and worked out well with light cuts... 1mm roughing, 0.25 final cuts.Thanks for the ver very cool videos that beginners, homeshop guys and pros can enjoy
for milling slots you could have threaded a bolt in the end of part and indicated off of the flats.
Dang it TOT! I hate the way everything in machining is so easy when you do it. Thanks master from Swe, I'm learnings so mutch from your vids.
Wonderful detail explanation and display thank you sir you are a gentlemen and a scholar.
Ave used a carbide die grinder bit to cut out a broken tap, that may work for that drill bit. Your videos are really helpful thanks for putting in the effort.
Nice job Tony. Enjoyed, thanks for sharing.
+Steve S Thanks for watching Steve!
Great video. Always excited to see your content on my feed! Keep it up brother
+Josh Gallant Thanks Josh!
The Saw Blade Wobbling a little bit. The Joke was so Funny
Just about hurt myself laughing at the end, there. Thanks for the day-brightener!
your videos are really great. And fun, that subtile humor of yours is just so good.
That is a sweet little mill. Except for the lack of a quill it has everything. Power feeds and rapid moves on all axis. Hefty tooling (compared to R8). Arbor operations. Its a real mill as opposed to a Bridgeport which is good for anything until you need to do heavy milling. The only thing better than your setup would be a mini horizontal with a built in rotary table. I’ve never seen one that would fit in the corner of a garage though.
Your videos are the best love to do something like that some day
Rofl, that end bit with the indicator on the saw blade edge checking "run out".
Many Thanks Tony. Great video and editing. Like the PIP inset and how you blasted through the repetitive stuff. Learn a lot from this one, mainly about not being afraid to cut taper tooling. Just worked my first 4140 and was please with the result on my wanna be peanut...That Moly looked like hot cream cheese coming off but was pretty recognizable as medusa razor wire with a bit of color. ~¿@ Your saw was amazingly straight so your tapers and concentricity must have been on the money! Beauty in metal work! Thanks for the hoot at the end. Great builds and Edutainment!! ~PJ
+pjsalchemy Thanks PJ!
Great video, well produced as always!
+LongrangeSweden I appreciate you taking the time to watch Longrange!
You are like the dad we never had growing up. I mean, I have a mechanically inclined dad who taught me a few things, but he is no where near as knowledgeable, precise or polite as you.
good stuff however for the drilled hole drill it while the mass of material is still there. When you get down small there is no place for the heat to go and it gets hotter than hell. One thing you can implement instantly by the way is there are no laws against placing a plastic thing under the chuck for a second and dumping coolant, or better yet put some coolant in water and freeze it into various chunks such as dixie cups or whatever--it works quite well. I do that surface grinding also all the time. But when roughing and the item gets hotter than hell there are no police that will break down the door and arrest you should you dump coolant or use ice to cool it off quickly if in a rush.. I make universal arbors similar to your concept and I rough off alot of material to make the 1 inch shank I stay away .020 and dump coolant over it or ice--and move in for the finish passes on the spot. But by drilling so hot there are strange things that happen--the diameter heats up and first grabs onto the drill then in a second or 2 the total heat expands it--now as you drill deeper--the first part you drilled COOLS AND SHRINKS DOWN ONTO THE UPPER PART OF THE DRILL.. (note where the breakage of the drill occured).. When you go to press or knock the drill out from the other end heat up the outer part FAST AND HOT and knock within a few seconds--the drill may come out.
Awesome video. I learned a lot.
TONY! TONY! TONY!!! Unbelievable! People already started using "T.O.T" BEFORE TODAY. BEFORE I just invented it minutes ago. Crazy freaky man! What do you see in the chips for me TOT? Cheers, Mick 🇦🇺🍪
Great tooling build enjoyed the video thanks
+Tom Bellus Thank you.
Another great video, Thanks Tony!
+Knolltop Farms Thanks Knolltop!
Also Tony please maybe do a little episode about these milling inserts one of these days!
i cut a fair amount of tapers and have never considered using a drill motor to power the compound, that's genius!!!!!
Great VIDEO!!!!
+Metal Tips and Tricks (Dale Derry) Thanks Dale, appreciate it!
great job and talent
very informative and entertaining video.
Thank you.
I like the look of your Rohm mill vice. Your video of the vertex 4" import vice gave me the confidence to buy one, how about a compare and contrast video of the two vices?
Thanks for great video. Btw Behind the lath chuck there is a mores tapper throat to match tapered surfaces with machine surfaces.
Love to watch your progres
Nice work Tony!
+Jeffrey Vastine Why thank you!
Probably a bit late now but I was wondering if you could just press that broken drill bit out? I'm sure it's well and truly jammed in there but I'd be surprised if it was 25 tons of jammed in.
Ain't gonna happen, the Ultimate shear strength of 4145-ChroMoly is about 660 MPa. Assuming that the drill has fused on both sides a good 50 mm in and that it's width is 5 mm the force before it gives is 330 kN, or about 34 metric tons. ChroMoly is hardcore stuff.
Material Properties:
www.makeitfrom.com/material-properties/SAE-AISI-4145-SCM445-G41450-Cr-Mo-Steel
I'm still will to bet with a good hyper therm or similar plasma u could cut that bit in half right between the flutes chisel out what's left done this a few times on broken taps
the drill isn't fused, it galled.
Give it to an astronaut, ask them to take it to the International Space Station and then throw it back to Earth. The impact just may loosen that drill.
@@millomweb if that fails, apply WD-40 and attempt again. repeat until success, or catastrophic destruction of both the part and the surrounding 10 kilometers of terrestrial landmass.
great stuff tony!
I've worked with 50CrMo4 a couple of times, and the experience I've had with it, on the lathe that I usually use (can't remember the model), is that to get the chips to break, I have to take very deep cuts and just 'force' the tool against the material.
2mm depth of cuts always seem to make those irritating meals of spaghetti-metal, but as soon as I change it to 3+mm it starts to break nicely at a feedrate of 0.2-0.3mm/rpm and letting my insert get a longer life, though I don't know whether your lathe would have the power to do that :)
As for coolant, I use a lot of it when working with this material (but as a trainee-machinist I'm not sure whether I should do that, or just wait and let it cool off on it's own like I usually do with regular steel-types).
You are right though, it gets hot as hell :P
Greetings from Denmark :b
Hey, TOT, I'm kind of surprised that you don't have a spark eroder for broken taps, bolts, and drill bits.
They sell them fairly inexpensively through several companies, or there are plans for them online.
nice power feed attachment. i now have another use for my makita drill.
Nice, free tinsel for Christmas decoration!
Hi! This is the year 2020 calling (not a good year btw) - and the end of the video LITERALLY made my heart jump. Thanks 2016!
Hey Tony, For stuff like flipping those for notching in the mill, I have seen guys that make exhaust collectors with multiple pie cuts use those magnetic dial angle finders when cutting pipe. Basically take some putty, glob it on the back of the dial then shove it on the end of the thing you wanna rotate, un clamp, spin, dial in to +/- a degree. You might even be able to use one of those magnetic digital angle finders (don't know if they work up side down).
Very cool, Nice job my man.
+sdjb111 Thanks!
amazing job wow
always amazing
G'day mate. Tell me, how on earth did you know 6 YEARS AGO that I would want info on taper tooling TODAY! Extraordinary 😮 I henceforth proclaim thee T.O.T "The Oracle Tony" Cheers, Mick🇦🇺😵💫
42CrMo4 QT (note the QT!) is a joy to machine. Try this next time.
And -I am on a mission- it is M 12, not 12 mm thead. Even Stefan G. is starting supporting this 'merican crippilisation (You'd say crippling, but that's not sophisticated enough) of the metric system and its infrastructure. End of mission.
Nice job!
As someone in the comments said below, for this type of material a lot of coolant helps and if you want it to chip reduce the rpm..you will find a sweetspot where it chips nicely..i use this material a lot making half shafts for vintage cars..its an excellent choice for your application.
Great job !!!
Eyeball it! EYEBALL it he says! Heretic! That they all came out pretty much perfect and fully functional means NOTHING! ;)
Interesting and entertaining as always, Mr. Tony.
Great video again! I admire your can do it attitude and humour. Please keep up the good work. Currently making a fixed gantry CNC inspired by your build. Would like to see more on the gantry and any modifications you would make to it, now you had some time to get to know each other....
+ReP_Al Thanks Rep! Be sure to share your CNC build and good luck. Only thing I'd change is probably make it a little smaller. My eyes were bigger than my stomach.
great video, I'm always amazed at how much patience you have. this work is incredibly tedious, but rewarding and fun. The best part is watching your process for measuring and setting things up to get really precise parts. Amazing work.
+alex rich Thanks Alex. Glad to have you watching.
If anyone breaks a drill like Tony did, don't use another drill (carbide or otherwise) to get it out. What you want to do is grab one of your old worn carbide endmills and take small pecks with the carbide endmill till you have gotten through enough of the broken drill flute that it just falls apart.
I make a fair bit of my own taper tooling. My mill has a 30INT horizontal spindle, but I converted the vertical to a pneumatic drawbar and that is BT30. (The tapers are, conveniently, identical). My approach has been to make a sleeve for the spindle taper that accepts the 7/24 taper of either tooling. I first made a tapered bush to match the lathe spindle internal taper . (it is almost, but not quite MT4.5, but conveniently self-locking) then in-situ bored that to take my mill tooling tapers. (and marked the point adjacent to peg 1 of the D1-4. You could reference to the key of the L0 on the Student.) That means I can cut the taper as the first op and then pull the tooling back into the lathe spindle with a drawbar and be reasonably confident that it will run true in use.
Holy moly as a new this old tony sub I never knew this old tony made old videos as well as new videos. He really is old.
Great video, good job, and fun to view...we don´t see that often in YT land...
+Udo Willkomm Thanks Udo.. and thanks for watching.
The finish on Tony's lathe never fails to shock me. My lathe needs some tuning up, or something...
Rob Mckennie the finish has to do with the RPM and quality if your cutting tool
@@theAustriaball Don't be silly, we all know it's the power of the magic trigon inserts. :P
@@joshuac6796 which is also known as the "quality of your cutting tool"
4 years late, but when we have to make a toolholder concentric, we buy the blank with taper already cut, rough it out, and then stick a boring bar vertically on the mill table and put the toolholder in the spindle. Turn it on and bore it that way. Perfectly concentric every time
Good job. That's prolly the least runout I've seen on a slitting saw holder
Very impressive work mate,inspiring. I made some tooling myself in 30 taper for my Elliott Milmor Super 16. I got around the concentricity issue by making a 30 taper tool holder for the spindle of my lathe. Was quite a lot of work but means I can guarantee concentric tooling every time. I made a draw bar to suit and it works well. As an asides it also means I can use my 30 taper tooling in my lathe should I want to do some milling or boring in the lathe. Really appreciate you videos mate.
+Andrew Wilson Thanks Andrew. I actually had the same though, make a 'receiver' for the lathe, but I don't have small enough tooling to get down into the small end of that female taper. I bet that holder comes in handy / convenient though.
awesome video
I like the sped up video --- reminds me of the demo vids you see for all the chintzy CNC equipment heh
i like your sense of humour.
+Tiit Saul Thanks Tilt, and thanks for watching.
I struggle to watch your videos, REALLY I do. They're not good for my 'vise envy'
Great video as always! And the fact you show your mistakes is very encouraging for those of us who's name is not Tom Lipton :D
+69hytek Thanks 'hytek -- good to have you watching!
very cool. adapt and overcome at its best