I agree, the Livewire is the motorcycle of the century. To the best of my knowledge it us the first electric motorcycle built by a legacy manufacturer. More importantly it is the epitome of motorcycle design combined with impressive electric/electronic systems engineering.
Dude, your videos are so good. Well designed slides, well narrated, and no fluff - every word counts, packed with useful information, and a no-nonsense delivery. No hype, just sensible discussion. Love it. Good stuff on batteries in this video. Thank you for posting. I don’t have a LiveWire, but pre-ordered a Del Mar on the first day. The Del Mar is going to be a blast. They sent me a print of one of their Del Mar marketing photographs - I’ve got it framed and hanging on the wall in my office. Your useful insight on motorcycles and electrics is exceptional. Keep ‘em rolling!!
I own a Livewire here in Australia. 8,000 miles and no problems. Overnight charging and DC fast charging are no problem so far. Super quick. Always a talking point at Cafe's everywhere! Heap of fun. been riding for 62 years, owned 64 motorcycles.
Thank you for sharing. I recently purchased a new 2022 LiveWire One. I am a very happy Ford Mach-e GT owner and this platform has set my personal expectation of EV performance, reliability, connectivity and range as advertised by the manufacturer. LiveWire One's hardware is amazing. The fit and finish, components and build quality are of a premium motorcycle. The connectivity and software support on the other hand are wanting. This week my servicing dealer did a software upgrade on a new bike, so now it will charge at an Electify America charge point without a phone call to an in house tech support. But! A big but, my iPhone 15 pro will not pair and the LiveWire App will not activate, still. My Mach-e ownership has taught me how important connectivity is, so I wonder what's it worth?
my 2022 LW1 is having its battery pack replaced under warranty right now. only 2500 miles on my bike. it was sitting under my deck in 40-50 degree weather for a month and a half at 100% charge and i went to drive it and it gave errors after a mile and had to tow it and samsung claims i needed a new battery. been without a bike for 2 months
Great presentation, thanks for the research and for the info at the Malibu showroom last week. Your input was very valuable and tipped me in the direction of getting one myself and she arrives in a few days, keep up the good work!
Yep, all components are the same for the battery. The HD LiveWires and LiveWire ONEs are were/are made in the same Pennsylvania plant next to every other harley-Davidson bike
I don't know, the 2020 ELW used battery part number: 66000189 BATTERY, high voltage The 2021 LW1 uses part number: 660A2 - EV High Voltage Battery 66000334 There is a difference, I have no idea what that is.
Great information, although I'll keep my fingers crossed that you end up being mistaken about Harley not giving the LiveWire One a bit of a refresh. I would hope Harley gives the One a battery pack increase whenever Samsung SDI makes denser cells available. As you know, Zero & Energica have increased their battery packs since the LiveWire One's debut. To remain competitive I would think the One's battery capacity must increase if Harley hopes to get at least 7 years of production out of it.
Samsung SDI has battery cells with much higher energy density than their 2017 chemistry in the LiveWire. The longer the introduction of the Arrow platform is delayed, the bigger the mistake LiveWire has made in terminating development of the the LiveWire ONE.
@@freedomiseverything Where has LiveWire specifically said the One's batteries will never be upgraded during the model's run and all One development has been terminated? Source please.
I had to buy my LiveWire used from south California as a demo bike. I just had to have white and was told it’s one of the only white ones in the country. I didn’t understand that at the time, but now I’m extremely sad to hear it’s over already as well proud i have one. Like a unicorn. I bet many of your viewers have rode it as a demo cause it came with 2,000 milles on it. I really appreciate your video’s and it’s not exactly my first bike, but my last bike was 10 years ago at 300cc. So i might as well be a beginner. Thank you for what your doing, please keep it up! God bless!
Has anyone done a teardown of a Livewire pack? I was the engineer who designed the battery for the marketing prototype Livewires back in 2013 while working at Mission Motors. We also used SDI cells. I've always been interested in knowing how much (if any) of our architecture made it through to production.
I don't know of any teardowns on the pack. However, I think virtually everything on the production LiveWire electronics was based on the work done at Mission Motors. After all these years, Jon B. is still at LIveWire as VP of Marketing. He would know. I have encouraged him to write a book about electric motorcycles. He's seen it all. The original Mission Motors bike was on display at Bike Shed in Los Angeles a few months ago. It's an amazing machine. You guys were way ahead of your time...
@@freedomiseverything thanks, I'm probably most proud of the Mission R's Laguna Seca outright EV record that stood for 10 years. I recently found out that Marelli did the production Livewire's battery and power electronics. Geometrically the bike is very similar -- the longitudinal bevel gear layout was actually conceived in a Mission/H-D working session while building the predecessor to the LiveWire prototype (six unbranded market test vehicles in 2010). But with a global automotive firm doing the design work, the power electronics are likely completely different. The LW prototypes used an Infineon IGBT based inverter -- an evolution of the one in the Mission R -- and was shared with the Mugen Shinden TT race bikes from 2013-2015 (possibly further). The LW motor was an 55kW induction motor, which was later reworked into a PMAC for the Mugen effort. The Mission R is still on the road owned by another former engineer of the company. Good times. I would love to contribute to any sort of historical record to capture all this. Most of this core tech development happened before Jon B worked at Mission, he was mostly there for the ill-fated "Mission Motorcycles" era -- dark days -- but also worth a book!
There have been a few pack replacements that I’m aware of, however it seemed it was due to owner negligence (left out in sub freezing temps for months at 100% SoC) rather than hardware quality
Did you take the thumbnail to your video from my "I got my new battery module!" video, where I show the BMW I3 module? Because I checked and it is from it.
Interesting video Jack. Have you or Preston tried charging at a Tesla station yet with the new Magic Adaptor? I know the community would love to see a video on how well that works.
Preston lives 70 miles from the Magic Dock Tesla charger that just opened up in NorCal. Unfortunately, his bike was in the shop getting a new drive belt when it opened a few days ago (too many wheelies). I was surprised that LiveWire replaced it under warranty. Preston is in SoCal this weekend visiting us. But, he will back home on Monday and promises to get me the picture of his bike charging at the Tesla charger.
@@freedomiseverything Interesting he can do wheelies. Ive seen others say it can't be done. I know the bike has the power but how is he doing it? Does he have to change anything on the bike in order to do it or is he just hitting it and pulling up?
I have a question. At about @11:20 if the battery pack is like you say, and 20% on top is software limited. Then shouldn't it fast charge all the way to 100%? Since your son fast charges, is he seeing fast charging all the way to 100%?
Excellent video. I really love your presentation style. Question for you and the community. Does the HD LiveWire/LiveWire One have a battery heater in it? I've noticed a bit of a sluggish start for the first few minutes riding after starting on a cold 40F morning. The Teslas have a preconditioning feature that would heat the battery pack up before you start driving the car. Do you know if the LiveWire has a battery heater? My guess is it doesn't since when it gets that cold a lot of riders are storing their bikes for the winter (me included lol).
I don't think the LiveWire has a battery heater. I've installed a plug on mine so that I can run an electric jacket in the winter. I put a higher priority on a rider heater!...
Hey can you do a video on how HD managed to drop the price of the livelier without really changing anything at all about the bike. Were they just that over priced before or did they figure out another way to make the cost savings on initial purchase.
some DC stations show info about voltage pack - so if you know how many cell in series you can calculate max capacity battery pack in energica 2020 for example 100% is 4,13-4,16V - almost total 0% 3,07-3,13 (energica has 80S battery pack - 288V nominal)
The LiveWire ONE iphone app shows the voltage when the bike is charging. I'm not sure, but I think it shows about 295 volts when it first starts out from a low state of charge. I'll report exactly what it says next time I DC Fast charge.
@@freedomiseverything I base only on info from google - its says nominal voltage on livewire pack is 254V - in Energica you dont know anything unless you install obd2 dongle and use non official app to check voltages - on livewire 295V on low state seems high as (254V is true this is 70S pack) energica has 80S and i got about 250V on "true" 0%)
Like your detailed specs and analysis on the packs. Learned something on my Energica pack now. It's 3 years and on 13K km. SoH says 100% too. It is a bit weird though. Cause my car EV's do show some percentage loss, as expected. So I'm not sure is its the software doing this. My 11kWh EVA isn't overheating. The Ribelle 22kWh do overheat. The Experia seem to have solved it.
Hmm... Energica doesn't use cylindrical cells. A quick Google shows you the CRP designed frames they use to frame their pouches. They used Samsung SDI until 2022. In 2023 they've gone to a more efficient formulation from a new supplier, still using framed pouches.
I should know better than to question your knowledge about Energica, but, here goes. "Samsung SDI" has never had any relationship with Energica of any kind. You are confusing the relationship with "Samsung" which provides displays and Bluetooth connectivity for Energica. Harley-Davidson has had a decade long relationship with "Samsung SDI." As an example, here is a press release on the "Samsung SDI" website: www.samsungsdi.com/sdi-news/2006.html?idx=2006 Other than some loose talk on Energica forums, there is nothing on a Google search linking Energica and "Samsung SDI" . I do not know who the supplier is for Energica's battery packs. However, it is very clear that changes where made in 2023 that greatly improved the packs thermal performance. On another note, how far does your Experia go with luggage attached at a sustained 70 MPH before it goes into limp mode?
I was trying to highlight was that Energica does not use cylindrical cells; they use battery pouches. There is a CRP web page about their development of a custom battery pouch frame. Energica keeps their battery supplier agreements confidential. When we rode our Experias from California to Florida (with fully loaded cases), we rode about 100 miles at a time at 70-75 mph. That often resulted having roughly 20% left on our battery. Quick math shows that would mean a full discharged range of about 125 miles. Energica claimed during their Dolomites press ride that it should get about 130 miles at 70 mph. I see no reason that is not possible (though wind is a big-time factor affecting these results). WMTC Testing, which averages to a slightly slower speed, showed a range of 138 miles.
The thermal issues of Energica batteries haven't been properly characterized. All batteries face similar thermal heat generation when discharged or charged at high rates. Zero and Harley limit charging and discharge rates to reduce heat generation. Energica allows for both higher discharge and charge rates, which results in increased heat generation. Energica uses internal sensors to allow charging at the maximum rate the battery can safely handle at any time, reaching up to 24-26kW under ideal conditions, but limiting that rate appropriately for the level of heat remaining. Owners report that manually limiting discharge and charge rates to match those of a Zero or Harley eliminates any noticeable heat retention, resulting in similar performance (meaning you can charge all day at 12-15kW).
@@OrlandoRick That's much more range than I was expecting, even if you go into limp mode at 10%. At a sustained 70 MPH, I can go about 70 miles on the LiveWire ONE before I get to about a 5% state of charge. At a sustained 45 MPH, I can go 177 miles before I hit 5%. The Experia looks really cool. With that kind of range and MSC, it looks better to me all the time. Maybe....
@@freedomiseverything Yes, but wind remains a major factor affecting the range when driving at speed. Today, we experienced massive headwinds on I-95, causing the Wh per mile to increase from around 140Wh to 310Wh per mile as we battled against the wind. The range estimator initially showed around 100 miles remaining, but due to the wind, it decreased to 65 miles. This means that we would have barely been able to travel 90 miles on a 100% to 0% run! This is why we aim for a 100-mile target during highway runs, knowing that we can reach that distance one way or another, even if we need to slow down.
Great insight and a fascinating theory Jack. It seems bizarre to think the LW has capacity “locked out” but as their first bike entering the EV space it makes sense that they would want long life and high performance. Do you have any evidence that your 22kWh claim is true? (No offence!) BTW, along with some other riders I have had regen stop working after fully charging 4 times now in 15000 km. This makes me suspect if your claims are correct that it might be 10% locked out at 100% SOC and 20% at the bottom end rather than the other way round as you suggest. This would also align well with stationary battery theory and (perhaps) explain why occasionally after a deep discharge and slow recharge a cell balance has happened pushing SOC higher, and explaining my loss of regen. What does perplex me is IF your 10/20 lockout theory is correct it should/could allow much faster DC recharging but that’s not the case. Throttling of charge power occurs as if the battery is truly at close to 100%. Keep digging Jack, I think this is the elephant in the room for LWs!
You might be right. My theories are only speculation. It could very well be that the top end is closer to 90%. I've never ridden the bike more that about 500 miles in a day. I've made four round trips from Los Angles to San Francisco and back. I've never lost full regen.
I agree, the Livewire is the motorcycle of the century. To the best of my knowledge it us the first electric motorcycle built by a legacy manufacturer. More importantly it is the epitome of motorcycle design combined with impressive electric/electronic systems engineering.
Dude, your videos are so good. Well designed slides, well narrated, and no fluff - every word counts, packed with useful information, and a no-nonsense delivery. No hype, just sensible discussion. Love it.
Good stuff on batteries in this video. Thank you for posting. I don’t have a LiveWire, but pre-ordered a Del Mar on the first day. The Del Mar is going to be a blast. They sent me a print of one of their Del Mar marketing photographs - I’ve got it framed and hanging on the wall in my office.
Your useful insight on motorcycles and electrics is exceptional. Keep ‘em rolling!!
I own a Livewire here in Australia. 8,000 miles and no problems. Overnight charging and DC fast charging are no problem so far. Super quick. Always a talking point at Cafe's everywhere! Heap of fun. been riding for 62 years, owned 64 motorcycles.
Much respect to you, sir. I'm looking forward to matching your record in a dozen years!...
Thank you for sharing. I recently purchased a new 2022 LiveWire One. I am a very happy Ford Mach-e GT owner and this platform has set my personal expectation of EV performance, reliability, connectivity and range as advertised by the manufacturer. LiveWire One's hardware is amazing. The fit and finish, components and build quality are of a premium motorcycle. The connectivity and software support on the other hand are wanting. This week my servicing dealer did a software upgrade on a new bike, so now it will charge at an Electify America charge point without a phone call to an in house tech support. But! A big but, my iPhone 15 pro will not pair and the LiveWire App will not activate, still. My Mach-e ownership has taught me how important connectivity is, so I wonder what's it worth?
Very informative Mr. Reynolds thank you for doing the research and posting your thoughts and concepts.
Thanks for another informative video Jack.
my 2022 LW1 is having its battery pack replaced under warranty right now. only 2500 miles on my bike. it was sitting under my deck in 40-50 degree weather for a month and a half at 100% charge and i went to drive it and it gave errors after a mile and had to tow it and samsung claims i needed a new battery. been without a bike for 2 months
Great content J! Nice seeing you like always
Great presentation, thanks for the research and for the info at the Malibu showroom last week. Your input was very valuable and tipped me in the direction of getting one myself and she arrives in a few days, keep up the good work!
Have about 9300 miles (15000km) on my 2020 Harley Livewire , I am assuming they have the same (or simular) batteries as the current Livewire One.
Yep, all components are the same for the battery. The HD LiveWires and LiveWire ONEs are were/are made in the same Pennsylvania plant next to every other harley-Davidson bike
I don't know, the 2020 ELW used battery part number:
66000189 BATTERY, high voltage
The 2021 LW1 uses part number:
660A2 - EV High Voltage Battery 66000334
There is a difference, I have no idea what that is.
Great information, although I'll keep my fingers crossed that you end up being mistaken about Harley not giving the LiveWire One a bit of a refresh. I would hope Harley gives the One a battery pack increase whenever Samsung SDI makes denser cells available. As you know, Zero & Energica have increased their battery packs since the LiveWire One's debut. To remain competitive I would think the One's battery capacity must increase if Harley hopes to get at least 7 years of production out of it.
Samsung SDI has battery cells with much higher energy density than their 2017 chemistry in the LiveWire. The longer the introduction of the Arrow platform is delayed, the bigger the mistake LiveWire has made in terminating development of the the LiveWire ONE.
@@freedomiseverything Where has LiveWire specifically said the One's batteries will never be upgraded during the model's run and all One development has been terminated? Source please.
I had to buy my LiveWire used from south California as a demo bike. I just had to have white and was told it’s one of the only white ones in the country. I didn’t understand that at the time, but now I’m extremely sad to hear it’s over already as well proud i have one. Like a unicorn. I bet many of your viewers have rode it as a demo cause it came with 2,000 milles on it. I really appreciate your video’s and it’s not exactly my first bike, but my last bike was 10 years ago at 300cc. So i might as well be a beginner. Thank you for what your doing, please keep it up! God bless!
God bless you too. Ride safe. I'm never gonna sell my LiveWire ONE!!!
Has anyone done a teardown of a Livewire pack? I was the engineer who designed the battery for the marketing prototype Livewires back in 2013 while working at Mission Motors. We also used SDI cells. I've always been interested in knowing how much (if any) of our architecture made it through to production.
I don't know of any teardowns on the pack. However, I think virtually everything on the production LiveWire electronics was based on the work done at Mission Motors. After all these years, Jon B. is still at LIveWire as VP of Marketing. He would know. I have encouraged him to write a book about electric motorcycles. He's seen it all. The original Mission Motors bike was on display at Bike Shed in Los Angeles a few months ago. It's an amazing machine. You guys were way ahead of your time...
@@freedomiseverything thanks, I'm probably most proud of the Mission R's Laguna Seca outright EV record that stood for 10 years. I recently found out that Marelli did the production Livewire's battery and power electronics. Geometrically the bike is very similar -- the longitudinal bevel gear layout was actually conceived in a Mission/H-D working session while building the predecessor to the LiveWire prototype (six unbranded market test vehicles in 2010). But with a global automotive firm doing the design work, the power electronics are likely completely different. The LW prototypes used an Infineon IGBT based inverter -- an evolution of the one in the Mission R -- and was shared with the Mugen Shinden TT race bikes from 2013-2015 (possibly further). The LW motor was an 55kW induction motor, which was later reworked into a PMAC for the Mugen effort. The Mission R is still on the road owned by another former engineer of the company. Good times. I would love to contribute to any sort of historical record to capture all this. Most of this core tech development happened before Jon B worked at Mission, he was mostly there for the ill-fated "Mission Motorcycles" era -- dark days -- but also worth a book!
There have been a few pack replacements that I’m aware of, however it seemed it was due to owner negligence (left out in sub freezing temps for months at 100% SoC) rather than hardware quality
Ben you must have quite a few miles on yours eh?
@@elbowsout6301 23k and 4.5k miles so far on my bikes
Looks like I’ve dropped to 4th place. Time for you to ride out to Bike Shed so we can get a group picture with you! I super enjoy your videos.
@@freedomiseverything That’d be a fun ride for sure! VA to CA
@@AdventuresonZero agree, your videos rule Ben
Did you take the thumbnail to your video from my "I got my new battery module!" video, where I show the BMW I3 module? Because I checked and it is from it.
Interesting video Jack. Have you or Preston tried charging at a Tesla station yet with the new Magic Adaptor? I know the community would love to see a video on how well that works.
Preston lives 70 miles from the Magic Dock Tesla charger that just opened up in NorCal. Unfortunately, his bike was in the shop getting a new drive belt when it opened a few days ago (too many wheelies). I was surprised that LiveWire replaced it under warranty. Preston is in SoCal this weekend visiting us. But, he will back home on Monday and promises to get me the picture of his bike charging at the Tesla charger.
@@freedomiseverything Interesting he can do wheelies. Ive seen others say it can't be done. I know the bike has the power but how is he doing it? Does he have to change anything on the bike in order to do it or is he just hitting it and pulling up?
Excelent video, Energica rider here. Jack you do look familiar, maybe we have met in Malibu while charging our bikes. I'll ask next time I see you!
Love this video Jack! very informative, btw doing my bday at bikeshed on 3/18 at 6pm, swing by if youre free.
Thanks for the invite. I'll be there!...
I have a question. At about @11:20 if the battery pack is like you say, and 20% on top is software limited. Then shouldn't it fast charge all the way to 100%? Since your son fast charges, is he seeing fast charging all the way to 100%?
Do you happen to have the cell part number from samsung? I'm kind of curious if they would sale the cell to an individual or another company.
Excellent video. I really love your presentation style. Question for you and the community. Does the HD LiveWire/LiveWire One have a battery heater in it? I've noticed a bit of a sluggish start for the first few minutes riding after starting on a cold 40F morning. The Teslas have a preconditioning feature that would heat the battery pack up before you start driving the car. Do you know if the LiveWire has a battery heater? My guess is it doesn't since when it gets that cold a lot of riders are storing their bikes for the winter (me included lol).
I don't think the LiveWire has a battery heater. I've installed a plug on mine so that I can run an electric jacket in the winter. I put a higher priority on a rider heater!...
Fantastic information. Keep it coming, please!
Hey can you do a video on how HD managed to drop the price of the livelier without really changing anything at all about the bike. Were they just that over priced before or did they figure out another way to make the cost savings on initial purchase.
some DC stations show info about voltage pack - so if you know how many cell in series you can calculate max capacity battery pack
in energica 2020 for example 100% is 4,13-4,16V - almost total 0% 3,07-3,13 (energica has 80S battery pack - 288V nominal)
The LiveWire ONE iphone app shows the voltage when the bike is charging. I'm not sure, but I think it shows about 295 volts when it first starts out from a low state of charge. I'll report exactly what it says next time I DC Fast charge.
@@freedomiseverything I base only on info from google - its says nominal voltage on livewire pack is 254V - in Energica you dont know anything unless you install obd2 dongle and use non official app to check voltages - on livewire 295V on low state seems high as (254V is true this is 70S pack) energica has 80S and i got about 250V on "true" 0%)
Wow great breakdown!❤ more reasons to buy a livewire one
Like your detailed specs and analysis on the packs.
Learned something on my Energica pack now. It's 3 years and on 13K km. SoH says 100% too. It is a bit weird though. Cause my car EV's do show some percentage loss, as expected. So I'm not sure is its the software doing this.
My 11kWh EVA isn't overheating. The Ribelle 22kWh do overheat. The Experia seem to have solved it.
Hmm... Energica doesn't use cylindrical cells. A quick Google shows you the CRP designed frames they use to frame their pouches. They used Samsung SDI until 2022. In 2023 they've gone to a more efficient formulation from a new supplier, still using framed pouches.
I should know better than to question your knowledge about Energica, but, here goes.
"Samsung SDI" has never had any relationship with Energica of any kind. You are confusing the relationship with "Samsung" which provides displays and Bluetooth connectivity for Energica.
Harley-Davidson has had a decade long relationship with "Samsung SDI." As an example, here is a press release on the "Samsung SDI" website:
www.samsungsdi.com/sdi-news/2006.html?idx=2006
Other than some loose talk on Energica forums, there is nothing on a Google search linking Energica and "Samsung SDI" . I do not know who the supplier is for Energica's battery packs. However, it is very clear that changes where made in 2023 that greatly improved the packs thermal performance.
On another note, how far does your Experia go with luggage attached at a sustained 70 MPH before it goes into limp mode?
I was trying to highlight was that Energica does not use cylindrical cells; they use battery pouches. There is a CRP web page about their development of a custom battery pouch frame. Energica keeps their battery supplier agreements confidential.
When we rode our Experias from California to Florida (with fully loaded cases), we rode about 100 miles at a time at 70-75 mph. That often resulted having roughly 20% left on our battery. Quick math shows that would mean a full discharged range of about 125 miles. Energica claimed during their Dolomites press ride that it should get about 130 miles at 70 mph. I see no reason that is not possible (though wind is a big-time factor affecting these results). WMTC Testing, which averages to a slightly slower speed, showed a range of 138 miles.
The thermal issues of Energica batteries haven't been properly characterized. All batteries face similar thermal heat generation when discharged or charged at high rates. Zero and Harley limit charging and discharge rates to reduce heat generation. Energica allows for both higher discharge and charge rates, which results in increased heat generation. Energica uses internal sensors to allow charging at the maximum rate the battery can safely handle at any time, reaching up to 24-26kW under ideal conditions, but limiting that rate appropriately for the level of heat remaining. Owners report that manually limiting discharge and charge rates to match those of a Zero or Harley eliminates any noticeable heat retention, resulting in similar performance (meaning you can charge all day at 12-15kW).
@@OrlandoRick That's much more range than I was expecting, even if you go into limp mode at 10%. At a sustained 70 MPH, I can go about 70 miles on the LiveWire ONE before I get to about a 5% state of charge. At a sustained 45 MPH, I can go 177 miles before I hit 5%.
The Experia looks really cool. With that kind of range and MSC, it looks better to me all the time. Maybe....
@@freedomiseverything Yes, but wind remains a major factor affecting the range when driving at speed. Today, we experienced massive headwinds on I-95, causing the Wh per mile to increase from around 140Wh to 310Wh per mile as we battled against the wind. The range estimator initially showed around 100 miles remaining, but due to the wind, it decreased to 65 miles. This means that we would have barely been able to travel 90 miles on a 100% to 0% run!
This is why we aim for a 100-mile target during highway runs, knowing that we can reach that distance one way or another, even if we need to slow down.
loving your videos bud
Great insight and a fascinating theory Jack. It seems bizarre to think the LW has capacity “locked out” but as their first bike entering the EV space it makes sense that they would want long life and high performance. Do you have any evidence that your 22kWh claim is true? (No offence!) BTW, along with some other riders I have had regen stop working after fully charging 4 times now in 15000 km. This makes me suspect if your claims are correct that it might be 10% locked out at 100% SOC and 20% at the bottom end rather than the other way round as you suggest. This would also align well with stationary battery theory and (perhaps) explain why occasionally after a deep discharge and slow recharge a cell balance has happened pushing SOC higher, and explaining my loss of regen. What does perplex me is IF your 10/20 lockout theory is correct it should/could allow much faster DC recharging but that’s not the case. Throttling of charge power occurs as if the battery is truly at close to 100%. Keep digging Jack, I think this is the elephant in the room for LWs!
You might be right. My theories are only speculation. It could very well be that the top end is closer to 90%. I've never ridden the bike more that about 500 miles in a day. I've made four round trips from Los Angles to San Francisco and back. I've never lost full regen.
Store it in a steel drum
Nothing is 100%
How many failures do you know of?