The issue is his strats are mostly based on how he does things with his static, and knowing full well PF will not adjust in the least. The amount of times I've heard "That's not what Hector said in the video" is too damn high, and boom raid wipe. I don't think it's Hector mostly. I think it's PF just doesn't understand the fight conceptually.
Wow, I didn’t know there was an issue. I enjoy Hector guides because it’s almost like the white board strategies a sports coach would give his team. I also watch MTQ for footage and explanation of mechanics. Getting a real world visual can help. Plus somtimes I feel like one person can explain something better to my mind than the other. I just think it’s always a good idea to watch more than one guide.
Wow, I didn’t know there was an issue. I enjoy Hector guides because it’s almost like the white board strategies a sports coach would give his team. I also watch MTQ for footage and explanation of mechanics. Getting a real world visual can help. Plus somtimes I feel like one person can explain something better to my mind than the other. I just think it’s always a good idea to watch more than one guide.
Kinda wild to me that people hate on a guy trying to help them clear the content they would otherwise not understand how to clear since the ones who aren't looking at his guides don't need it.
The problem is that a lot of those people still don't understand how to do the mechanics. It's like giving someone new in town written directions of how to get to the closest grocery store but suddenly there's construction work that closes off a large portion of the main road so they just starve to death in their car waiting for the construction to finish because they didn't understand the local road network.
@@DrZlow yes and we're all very proud of you but that doesn't mean us plebians who use guides shouldn't do savage at all. you need us to make you look better :)
People hating on Hector are the same people who'd lose their minds if he was gone. He's doing a thankless job to give people the confidence to try raiding. Somethings he'll get wrong or better strats will come later - but it's a baseline to help the community.
@@DarkDyllon it's because it was a world race/day 1 strat, thrown together really quickly to get a quick clear. Ilya went out and said "people will make a better strat, use those, don't use this one" But, we all know PF.
Bro i said dont do ilya from the start. I tried what sharingan ended up being but it was too late for me bc i didnt want to go back and do it 8 plus weeks later Also the hivemind that defended him bc id tell him to stop using raw and used nascent which was better (before bloodwhetting)
I've done all types of end game in multiple MMOs and it baffles me how people hate Hector. The dude is a gem in the community and is just giving people options for solving mechanics.
My issue with Hector is that his videos, and if not his then it would be Mr Happy's, or Rinon's, or someone else's, don't give you options. They *become* the option. PF has an issue with forcing a SINGLE strat, even when better strats are available. ive seen this across all NA DCs too.
@@Nazuiko If the strategy works, it doesn't matter whether it is optimal or not. With PF groups you always have to bear in mind that the MOST WIDELY used strategies are used here, as most people are familiar with them. What you do in your own static is up to you and if you want to hunt for the orange and pink parses.
@@CirnoFTW unless PF starts to mix and match different strats together, like you got hector and whatever for M4S. But it's mainly because Hector pumps these guides out ASAP without even having cleared said fights himself. (he still does, he put out the m4s guide fairly sure without clearing the fight, he 100% put out the p8s guide without having cleared the fight) so he just checks PoV's, checks what PF uses, then makes a video, shoves it up to youtube and calls it a day, then puts a shitty disclaimer "remember, these are week 1 strats" which honestly, is not an excuse, he also at some point said that he doesn't want PF to become over reliant on his guides and it being called "hector strats" ... then stop making strats.
Here's the thing guide makers don't think of at the time....... Their guides are good but what they don't account for happening is their guides aren't options......they're the only way. An that's the community that does that.
Hector explains and shows top down pov that is easy to grasp. Seeing it your self once ingame is enough to make any player realise whats going on with his guides. Anyone hating his guides is just a person who is used doing something in a specific way and refuses doing it otherwise any other way
@@madmulk9 Joon actually did the top-down raidplan-style guides first iirc, but he releases maybe one video per tier, like a month after Hector's guide is out.
Reminds me of E9s Happy Brambles for Cloud of Darkness that Happy put out. PF adopting it and weeks later even Happy said that was a week 1 strat and his static switched to a different strat yet PF kept using happy brambles.
Yeah, I agree with that somewhat but he fed them bad info to make them believe his strategies are the only strategies. Like M2 Savage ... everytime I see MK I want to scream of the stupidity. You talk to players, they repeat his bullshit saying they are random. Japanese players don't Mario Kart and there is a reason why they have higher clears then us and make us all look like fools. Because they were smart enough to figure it out for themselves. This is why I tell people to not watch guides. Watching a guide makes you linear and more of a problem to teach then if you came in fresh. I teach people Savage runs and it is always those that watch a guide before hand that are the ones that struggle because they have a preconceived notion in their head on how things work. I mentioned M2 Savage, but I didn't even touch on The Abyssal Fracture (Extreme). He was so big on people memorizing the patterns for the 4 star attacks on the ground (once against rushing the strategy guide), he missed the common sense way to handle it. I spent all week that first week teaching people the proper way to handle them and every one of them said it was better. It was a simple strategy, you just turn your camera 135 degrees (looking behind you on an angle in) and you can literally see the path of the attacks. You don't need markers at that point because you know what is safe as you can literally see it at that point. Meteors, I had to break people out of the MRRM or RMMR crap. I literally had them line up 1, 2, 3, 4 and learn how to see the holes, then plug up the hold based on your number position in parceners. After about 3 attempts, people would have meteors down each time. I explained in detail what they would see and how the holes would position themselves since it is a pattern. 3 times max, we were past it. But if people followed his guide, they would take forever to get them down. So he is ruining the PF community with half baked strategies just to get by because he wants to be the first one out there with them.
I remember the days before hector, the guides were not very good. Only ever showing the perspective from one player and doesn’t explain the concept of the mechanic just how to do it from that one point of view. When hectors guides came out it was a blessing by finally someone who explains the mechanic and then how to solve it. The top down perspective makes it easy to get no matter what role you play. I don’t know how anyone could ever hate hector.
Because his strategies are half baked, wrong, and rushed. M2 Savage is a perfect example of this. Literally PF is depending on MK strategy and it is the WORSE STRATEGY for that mechanic but people won't change because of Hector! Hector has people believing that the mechanic is RANDOM and it isn't, it was just that Hector didn't take the time to understand it! He wanted to get his guide out so fast, he literally screwed the FFXIV community now because people refuse to do anything else. If you Mario Kart anything in FFXIV, you are doing it wrong. There is no strategy that Mario Kart is the best option.
"The community has a big problem learning what to do but not why they are doing it" I mean this sentence alone basically sums up a lot of PF issues lately. Some people are so glued to Hector's guides and the "it can ONLY be done THIS way" and don't realize that there are different ways to skin a cat and sometimes Hector is not the end all be all. People essentially just learn their positions in fights and can't or won't learn to adjust if the comp is different or not ideal. Then they get frustrated when things have to change because of those reasons. I've seen this pattern of mindless behavior for PF has been going on for awhile now...where maybe a year or two ago there were several strats being used and for some reason we have all seem to only use Hector's guides which isn't bad per say but the moment you question or challenge a strat from his guides and suggest a more optimal or different strat, that's when all hell breaks loose and people's minds start to glitch down. It's frustrating
@@SonicridaI think that's fair? Learning a fight on a certain position inevitably gives you muscle memory. You WILL mess up if you suddenly have to go left instead of right while also managing your rotation. Combine that with parties dissolving after two wipes it is totally understandable to be nervous if you are forced to be on a position you aren't used to. Some people will just insist on the position they are comfortable with.
This pretty much sums it up. For example, in m4s with EE1, you can change how positions are in so many ways. But I was forced to give up my way of doing it because we have to use hector or PF strats in case someone is missing. It annoys me so much.
I had this the other week. Doing M2S, we're at Rotten Heart, doing decent damage. Just need to do the mechanic correctly and she will dead before then. BRD (R1) forgets their position goes to mine (H2). It was fine, I thought maybe they forgot their position after a hectic pull. So both me and M2 go a bit further out to not high five him. After the first high five he walk through me to go to his spot and wipes us. This is why I say that people should learn the mechanics not the solutions.
At least in Light, there is a fight between Hector and Q-Go/OQ5 (Rinon adjusted), people cleared with those latter 2, and new players are using Hector 60% of the time.
I am always a fan of the strats that require the least amount of effort. Generally speaking these are the strats that pop up in PF the most, and generally Hector (and his raid team/wherever he gets these strats) are pretty good at finding braindead strats. They dont hit 100% of the time, but generally speaking they are digestable enough for the average PF raider to understand. The diagrams and clear audio explaining the mechanics in a succinct manner only someone who teaches for a living can do also help tremendously.
WE RIDE AT DAWN FOR HECTOR! But seriously, my static uses his guides because he delivers strats in a way we can all understand and digest and I like that a lot of the time, he explains the WHY of the mechanic, not just "stand here".
I remember reading the raidplan for pangenesis and just not getting it - and wiping every time I got there because of it, - until I discovered the three extra pages explaining how the mechanic worked and why the strat solved it and BAM! - within 1-2 attempts where I got used to what to look at and where to go, I started doing it right every time. People severely underestimate how important actually using your brain to understand the mechanic is for executing the strat a lot of times.
Honestly I really appreciate what hector does by trying to give consistent strategies even if they aren't the most optimal. They allow people to progress early on and give a great visuals and explanations for the whole fight. The problem is definitely just people being completely unable to adjust to new strats and solutions for mechanics. The number of times that I got into a reclear party and someone said that they NEED m1 or m2 is insane. There are people that refuse to even learn the fight being on the left instead of the right let alone learning a new strat would help the group. Ultimately people in party finder just need to be more open to change than they are but that's not going to happen.
Hector filled in Thordan unreal reclear I was in one week and was genuinely just such a nice guy it boggles my mind that people get so angry over his guides.
good video bro. i think people are seriously too pretentious about this stuff. this is my first time doing EX and savage and hector's guides were very straightforward in helping me learn mechanics and why we do them. also, he is a good teacher. i like rinon's vids but i have a hard time following him a lot because he's more fast paced and uses some terms that a first timer like myself may not be familiar with yet.
The one thing I appreciate from the Hector guides is that he shows the size & shape of the attacks, which really helps me visualise what I'm trying to dodge & how much margin for error there is.
Hard agree with the sentiment of "do you want to have to learn multiple strats" vs just having one or two common ones, even if they're not perfect. I've never really understood the hate against Hector... myself and many others probably would not be raiding without him =P I also noticed that this tier, there has been adjustments to hector strats with each fight in PF. So it'll be mostly Hector strat with a tweak here and there.
Yeah I think people are not *that* rigid in pf (what's funny is I say that in the video but I don't mind a lot of strats, I just mind bad ones and I know it would make pf harder haha trying to learn multiple with less parties filling too so it's not very conducive to actually playing)
One of the biggest problems, especially for final fuse down, is that the image they used in pastebin, specifically the one shown exactly at 4:18 is a pattern that doesn't happen. Like specifically that one that covers both A and D is NOT a pattern that can ever happen, and it caused our group to keep wiping to that mechanic for hours until we looked at Hector which while not optimal for sure actually used images that showcased patterns in the fight
"the good guides are wrong and you cant clear with them. the bad guides are correct and we dont want to use them because theyre correct" actually insane decision making here, congrats
@@steveh1474 we tried for 2 hours using pastebin and our healers and melee kept making mistakes specifically because that example image was incorrect, then we swapped to hector and cleared on the next pull. Just saying
I’m sorry, but if you wiped for hours just because of the image in the pastebin, you should’ve had a recording or had at least one person in the group recognise the patterns after a small while. The whole point of the pastebin is about positioning (and this was from week 1 where people weren’t sure if the patterns could alternate or not). While it is incorrectly flipped, it shouldn’t have been an issue to identify where to go. Yes, Hector posted the correct image but the pastebin isn’t completely to blame if it took a long time to realise something like that.
@@yassin9782 if I'm studying a textbook on the dates of a war, and they have the wrong dates printed, really shouldn't matter if someone in the class is able to figure out the dates were wrong from context or other sources people are still going to read and trust the textbook because that is the guide for the test. Some people are visual learners and trust what they see
@@Bearpigman I think a closer analogy is a math book showing you a rectangle that's really 1 inch by 2 inches but telling you it's 10 feet by 30 feet. The pastebin shows the theory using an example, you just gotta apply it to the stuff you actually see in game.
I lurk on streams and look at clips a lot, and I noticed a lot of the hate is coming from world first raiders too. One mentioned that Hector did it for money, and got absolutely dogpiled from the community, and I saw a other world first say that his guides were bad because there was no video POV to show it in real time. Back in Endwalker, I saw a Crystal PF (iv999) just stating that Hector was a bad guide maker, and a couple of other horrible remarks. A lot of the haters are elitist players. I am grateful for Hector even if its not the best of the best strats*. You are best to stay in a static if you desire unique and ultra uptime strats. The community does not need to bend to these wills, because its unnecessary.
This is a good reason why MrHappy stopped making guides, community just can't seem to figure out that strats can always be revised or improved upon down the line. No surprise for a raiding community that seem to fail at counting, figuring out directions and don't know the class they are playing
Hector's indubitably one of the better guide makers out there, both him and Joonbob are easily some of my favorites to learn a fight, thanks to the neat visuals and the audio explanations of a mechanic. I believe a lot of the criticisms really just come down to "he made a guide with week 1 strats and now PF doesn't want to adjust to better strats" which, really, is more of a PF issue than a Hector issue imho. Looking at you, p4s "N/S orbs"... That being said, I personally like the relative north FFD strat way more. It makes sense in my head to have "group 1 left, group 2 right" the whole time. As a WHM, I hate having to think "where is North/South corner so I can go to it" instead of automatically going far left/far right. RMMR is just better so melee doesn't eat downtime to pop first fuse.
Hectors guides got me from m1s to wicked thunder enrage in 3 weeks. Surprisingly this hector hate only happens on social media because I haven’t heard complaints in the actual pf.
it's there but most just want to prog and continue and not complain about it, it's also an issue where there is a better strat in circulation, but then Hector uploads and guide and BAM ... it's now "hector strat" again.
@@DarkDyllon Exactly, he rushes the guides and screws up the community by making "JUST GET BY" strategies that are often horrible. I quote M2 Savage using Mario Kart and him convincing people that it is a Random mechanic. Kobe and the whole Japanese community put out WAY BETTER STRATEGIES that were common sense and easy to do, but because Hector has been too arrogant to fix his guides or update them (Admitting his mistakes), PF players suffer because of it!
You are correct that Hector strats, and Hector himself, get too much undue criticism. But since you asked for more context, I'll try to summarize: These days, Hector is careful to reference already-existing strats when creating his guides. This was not always the case. Back in Asphodelos and Abyssos, his guides would occasionally feature a strategy that deviated heavily from the strats used by week 1 groups, and were almost always significantly worse. Take for example his p5s Ruby Glow 5 strat, which locked NA party finder into using horrible, nonsensical downtime spread spots for the entire tier. This led to his EARLY guides gaining a reputation among hardcore players for being detrimental to the raiding scene. That reputation has stuck, despite his guides vastly improving in quality since then. The other issue is about the types of players that gravitate toward Hector's guides. As you pointed out, many of his guides are functionally identical to week 1/pastebin strats, meaning for example that if I put up a PF for m4s and said "Shababin" or "Hector", those would be referencing the same strats. However, the "Shababin" pf would fill with mostly high-skill players who cleared week 1 or 2, whereas the "Hector" pf is 90% of the time going to fill with low-skill players who make it into a trap party. Now of course, that is not Hector's fault and he does not deserve criticism for it, but unfortunately, that's what happens. Hector is an excellent guide-maker and doesn't deserve any of the hate he gets. You'll also never see me join a party that says Hector Strats. Hell, even he once said in an interview with Mr Happy that "Hector" parties are trap parties.
Except that his recent guides still give wrong information like M2 Alarm Pheromones 1. He has people believing that the mechanic is completely random and MK is the only way but in reality, Mario Kart is the worse way to handle it. Because of his guide, we are light years away from catching up with the Japanese Servers who have "SMARTER GUIDES" because they take the time to do it right and learn the mechanics properly before posting a guide. PF is flooded with people who refuse to learn the right now because not only will he not admit he was wrong on his guides and won't fix it, but because of his ego to rush to be the first one out there.
I see this as the community just being stupid. There's really not much to it. I've experienced similar things in World of Warcraft where one strategy became prominent, people eventually stopped knowing how to actually do the mechanic without doing it that particular way. A few expansions later and timewalking comes around. I join the dungeon in question, people do that one strategy that they've learned to do, not actually learning the mechanics and then it's like running into a brick wall, because surprise, it's balanced differently. The group then refuses to listen to my instructions on how to actually beat it and say "this is how we've always done it" to which I responded "not working too great, is it?" A few attempts later they caved in and followed my instructions. Cleared it first attempt without breaking a sweat. People just don't want to learn different strategies. They want to learn this one trick which solves all problems, without even trying to understand the problem itself first. For context, it was a rush strategy which intended to skip mechanics. Very common in dungeons in particular, but also happens on some raid bosses once characters are geared enough. It's not as common that raids are revisited however.
That's honestly really interesting. Kinda wild to think about what would happen if unreal were tweaked in a serious way. And yeah, it's not Hector's fault that people stick to his guides. It's up to the community to learn these fights and how they work
@@Sonicrida Crystal Tower is a good example in FFXIV, the zombie dragon in particular. People just rush it down and wouldn't be able to beat it normally. Some other bosses are in the same position, but I think that's one of the best examples.
This is so curious from a JP perspective where 99% of players use the exact same strats for every fight and the only variance this entire tier is like, same baits vs old baits on M1S. That's it. For parse teams you might see some alternatives but for practice, clears and reclears (the vast majority of content), every party is on the exact same page and you can freely and confidently jump from party to party knowing that the strats will be 100% identical. And besides, most anyone who was doing old baits have since switched to doing same baits anyway because they gave up in the face of the overwhelming number of same bait parties anyway. We even use the same lone bomb safe spot strat that Hector uses lol, specifically for the reasons you mentioned. Everything we do, we do to improve consistency and reduce accidents. And parties will still wipe to sunrise in reclears anyway but it is what it is.
I'd say it is more due to Japan's culture having a conformist mentality that forces everyone to toe the line or face the passive-aggressive wrath of the unofficial blacklist.
Ok so hector strat for m4s vs raidplan strat: bottom line the strats are the same. Literally the only difference is some role placements vary but its such a minor adjustment. The issues so is players who use terms like "usual pf strats" or "my way is better" and can't adapt
I think we all know its a thought shortcut at this point. Some of Hectors EnWa strats weren't super suited towards PF(kinda like M4 Rinon making w1 pf nightmare on Light) but the biggest issue is people blindly following a guide without thinking about how a mech actually works. I was forced to wipe so many times on reclears in last enwa tier because people didn't understand where to recover and would immediately wall after smallest mistake. And thats just one thing, other issues I feel are already nicely explained in the comment section. It's a mindset, it has nothing to do with Hector, but it just happen to be prominent within audience that uses them. Yes, Hector could rephrase things or think about how to accomodate PF better(and I feel like he did, there is a big progress imo compared to last expansion) but in the end he's mostly a scapegoat for the part of the community that often causes a lot of issues when inside of an instance to other people in the party and also tbh he's doping god's work making the raids more accessible by providing well produced visualisation of the fights very early on into the tier.
Part of the reason is his guides used to be a lot less efficient, sloppier with worse strats, which funnily enough back then PF didnt adapt to his guides. And some people just hold a grudge against him, not willing to see him improve. Which he has. His guides arent perfect but it's not going to be. Just mostly hope we're not building a culture in PF where we just adopt the hector guide no matter what.
which is unfortunately is what's happening, since now you got a fairly consistent strat in curculation and then Hector releases his guide and out of nowhere it's "hector strat" in PF (or whatever mix they dream of) my main issue is that someone who didn't clear the fight uploads a guide for the fight, to me, in order to make and understand the fight, you need to have cleared the fight atleast. like it was common knowledge already (even at the time his guide releases for M2S) where the 16 orso bees that appear are baited on random people, 2 for each player. Hector said these are 100% random, but they weren't, so it was established that it wasn't random and that the tank should pull the boss north right before the TB and then everyone stacks together and mario karts around the arena as a group, but then Hector came in and everyone randomly forgot this was an established fact? and went back to it being an FFA. Also, Hectors M4S guide for EE2 was just objectively worse than Rinon's (or the pastebin, since i'm fairly sure Rinon's guide is basically the pastebin) where Hector first explains the entire mechanic (which is lengthy on it's own) and then adds "just remember, what you got hit by +1" but he also uses this for the pairs that you can get. Rinon removed the thinking aspect and just said for support (since I main tank) "if you got hit twice, you go middle, if you got hit 1 or 3 times, you go A" and that's the entire mechanic explained, no needing to think "well, i'm long timer, there for I need to be 2+1" (it's not difficult to be fair, but for PF, you want the most braindead strat possible)
As a player who moved from JP to NA, one of the most important problems I found in NA PF is people never use macros to show the positions of their strat before fight, which can cause a lot problems due to misunderstanding. Sometimes, like when PF says Shababin/Hector, some may join and follow the pastebin final fuse down positions while others follow Hector, which may cause an overlap for melees. A macro can easily solve that before happening: just check where should you stand before the fight so everyone will be on the same page, also have an opportunity to review if your memory is blurred. Also with a macro you don't really need to learn a totally different strat again, just take a look at it and remember it, like how we learn the strats from pastebin/raidplan.
NA player. I've only ever seen someone do the Macro for a Raid diagram thing in my entire time playing this game (Late HW start) was maybe... 3 times tops. And every time it was a golden day cause I didn't have to think about anything. "Oh, T1 or T2? I'm Main Tanking so I'm T1. Okay what's my spots for XYZ" >Read Macro Awesome! We're good to go! No spending 20 minutes discussing spots haha!" I wish we did this... it's so freaking clean...
@@CrazedWhiteGaming Although it's not that efficient but having a raidplan is even much better than not having anything but simply Hector/Pastebin, while the Pastebin link is not attached. 🥶 I understand that after several weeks many people can memorize it well but it's just hilarious we are so against to put anything on to have people take a review in case of anyone forgot anything but to wipe a few times to derust then probably disband > find a new party.
The problem here is not the lack of a macro, it is people being dumb and writing conflicting things in the pf description. You don't need a macro if the (singular) guide everyone follows already set positions. Macros were a thing back when video guides were single-pov crap that maybe sometimes showed the arena fully with positions for mechanics.
@@MyVanir Based on my experience pretty much Japanese guides are also very detailed and provides both explanation and POVs, but macros are still a thing in JP servers so that people who already cleared ahead of the guide release doesn’t need to fully review the guide, also everyone can have an opportunity to have a quick review before reclear
5:10 The MMRR / RMMR difference for fusefield is that if you're doing prios from north CW/CCW, MMRR is easier to do by party list order, but RMMR will tend to make the melee be on the south side of the boss more often, which is where their positionals are. MMRR makes M1 on the north side more often. That being said, my static just naturally did MMRR before hector and our melees have never complained, so it doesn't matter. I agree with the point of the video though, the community has an issue with taking week 1 strats as gospel and then complaining about them later. MrHappy also would make week 1 guides with his group's strats with the same "this is an early strat" warning, and I know people complain about him too since groups would use his strat way after better ones came out (like the happy brambles situation).
This is a static i'm talking about, but we just did "looking at the boss, MT/M1 go left, OT/M2 go right of the boss closest" no idea what the healer/ranged do since I never look back, but I can see them move farther away generally. (granted, I really dislike boss relative strats, since it changes so much compared to true north, think Hector also pioneerd boss relative for the copy cat attacks in M1S (where black cat does the 2 half arena cleaves and then the proximity baits) which is just less consistent to me since true north my position remains static instead of needing to think "alright, i'm looking at the boss, so i'll be behind her"
@@DarkDyllon When you say "ranged go further out" are you sure you're actually thinking of the same mechanic? Fusefield is the one where everyone gets in a circle and steps on fuses, nobody's further out than anyone else (and boss relative = true north). You might be thinking of Final Fusedown, where people get fuses on their heads + bombs explode.
@@tciddados then no, I think i'm talking about the mechanic before Fusefield then, my bad. (M3S confused me a lot anyways due to the names being stupidly similar to one another)
Day 2 Same bait introduce I watch the video, I said same bait strat is genius. When to PF with the same bait parties kick me. Week 6 majority of PF are using same bait m1s.
Funny thing about the RMMR thing is it only effects one melee. The other melee is basically in the exact same spot in every strat. So if you're M2 the strat doesn't matter. It's suppose to ideally give M1 more flexibility with positionals. But M1 on short debuff timer can literally just leave their spot instantly and head to the bottom (as long as they don't hit other fuses). And if you're adventurous you can do that with the long debuff and go back when its your time to pop it. But some people don't like seeing that much movement on their screen so if someone were to just see a melee wiggling around the boss they'd probably panic and mess up the mechanic so people just want RMMR. With how the mechanic is actually setup positionals shouldn't actually be a problem. The order just makes it idiot proof. It's like how in Zoraal Ja you can leave your conga-line position to hit positionals but people want you to sit on the markers because some people panic if they see people moving around instead of waiting to explode.
My only prob with Hector is he uses different markers than all the pastebin/pfers. When everyone does clockspots for everything and the markers dont resemble a clock is wack. Other than that he makes great guide. Use what u like from his stuff and leave the rest.
Playing on Mana DC, not knowing any Japanese. It's a SEA player routine to watch Hector because he explains how a fight work more, then watch POV of Hamkatsu or Nukemaru, etc...while google translating game8 and their Macro. It's not a Hector problem or PF problem, Hector guides has the added bonus of a strat you COULD use. It's a you problem when people are using the strat you didn't want to learn, better or worse. The majority chose a strat, you can't expect the majority of the people playing to spend more time watching and learning many different strats.
The hardest part of savage is the other 7 players. At least one of them will consistently fail and cause others to lose motivation. They no longer care so they start messing up and it just builds until the party disbands and people go into a new party finder group and repeat the cycle. Maybe you'll get lucky this time. Maybe everyone will actually try this time. Maybe you won't get someone who's been trying for hours and can't bring themselves to take a break. Maybe you won't switch classes because you're tired of having everything perfected on this class. Maybe you won't be the next reason.
I use hector for the voice I learn best in person, the issue is people take hector and then add on like 5 different things so at the end is it a really a hector strategy? I think people just post hector in PF to get hits and fill up only to change something while everyone is inside.
Hector strats is not bad, but the amount of people who wanted to shift existing party finder strats just because someone did a video of a different strat is fucked. Providing guides is in no way bad, but making the whole party finder shift to strats to Hector at the end of the day is not good just because they have a video on it and the others dont. Oh cool some week 1 raiders created a whole raid plan/raid strats for party finder, then you will find your time learning what party finder are up to invalidated because it will all be replaced by Hector strats, shit is demoralising to a degree.
I mean, unless that amount of people was entering non-hector pf groups and demanding to change to hector, that's not an issue. It doesn't matter if there are 99 hector groups up or 0, their existence is not relevant to someone who wants to do a different strat.
I did like 2000+ pulls of DSR before clearing it a month later. am i not qualified to talk about any part of it because i didnt clear it? :( people complaining about hector not clearing fights is so dumb lol
RMMR is used to maximize the amount of positionals that both melees can hit. Since both Fusefield strats makes ppl find their place clockwise, if you do MMRR, at least 1 melee will lose a lot of positionals, cuz saving both True North casts for that part is usually not enough. I agree that it doesn't matter that much, as long as ppl clarity what order they're using b4 the pull, but as a melee, RMMR makes us comfier
That makes sense to me! I'll consider adding that in the future haha hopefully people don't have trouble adjusting. Prob doesn't make a difference in your average clear but that's an easy and free adjustment for a little more damage so why not haha
@@Sonicrida Here's another reason why people like RMMR, which is essentially R2M2M1R1 from North Clockwise, is that if the dps prepositioned to their clock spot, they are naturally already in the correct order and only need to shift left or right to find their respective fuses. when the entire fight involves staying at your clock spots a lot, this feels natural. In comparison, in MMRR, the R2 whose clock spot is NW will now awkwardly have to position on the West side (in most cases). I mean, of course I'm speaking from a DPS's perspective, but i can see why the nuance is lost on Tank/Healer because the order makes no difference for them. Really not a big deal, I'm fine doing either, but if i had to choose, RMMR is my preferred method.
Sry but why do you have to waste 2 True Norths for this mechanic? See the Problem is not the Order its people dont even know HOW this mechanic works. Even IF you play RRMM and DPS is on the second set you dont have to sit the whole 40 Seconds on your Clockspot. Just make sure you know WHEN you have to Detonate and WHERE you have to Detonate. Since week 1 our Melees never stood the whole Time on their Clockspot.
@@DantoriusD While yes, you don't have to sit on it for the full duration the difference is PF vs static so for PF putting the melees where they will most likely barely have to move to keep positionals is dramatically less risky than trusting them to get back to their spot in time and not clip somebody elses fuse if they have to cross over it. Especially when PF already has a history of being 2+ mechanics before whatever mechanic they claim to be on. When most of the discussion is about PF using an example from your static isn't that helpful.
@@DantoriusD True! I agree with that when u're comfy with the fight, but we're talking general PF here too. Most ppl who are following the guides perfectly are likely to be progging and will be seeking a clear. Just imagine the mental breakdown if someone step on a wrong fuse when seeking positionals after X member of your party being on the 20th pull + of the day~! LMAO
Hector is a fantastic guide maker for week 1. The way he explains the mechanics with a visual education style is fantastic for learning. Even if i think some of his strats are wack af sometimes in comparison to other strats, I still appreciate that week one knowledge moving forward.
I actually had to make my own strats for Act 2 in P4S because I'm color blind and I couldn't see the "purple" orb at all. It looked clear to me, so my strats for Act 2 are letter based and priority based for Melee (cw/ccw)
Hector saved Party Finder, and made it actually tolerable. In doing this he contributed a great deal to the level of activity in savage raiding in general. He is amazing and we appreciate his guides alot!!
The only added value I see to doing RMMR for fusefield is the first fuse of each set is usually just outside melee range, which can make getting uptime tricky. Which, especially during the first week or two when it's a harsh DPS check, can make or break the pull. At the same time, if you're a week1 clear kinda person, you can more than likely work around that and make the pull work.
I think the issues lies for the largest part by far with the mentality of the raiderbase. They dont want to learn, they want to clear. Preferably yesterday. In my observations it is like a lot are stuck with the idea that only good raiders clear a tier fast, so they are taking shortcuts. And what better shortcut than a cookiecutter strat provided by someone with a history of providing strats that can get you the clear without using a single braincell? Now currently I see a lot of crao flying around about pheromones1 with mariokart versus static spots strat. Which is absolutely hilarious since it seems to boil down to people not wanting to look at&learn the mech, resulting in them blindingly trustin and following the tank, and then blame tank for pulling wrong during mariokart. The comfortzone trap they set up for themselves springs and people are disturbingly okay with it.
I remember noping out of mario karting and just mirroring the group when I decided to try to play blm in m2s. The complaints stopped after the 3rd pull in a row when half the group got slammed by a bee that was baited by the group, simply because they didn't pay attention, while I was free to plant my roots in the ground.
The same baits thing drives me crazy because in week 1 that was what I was doing and wanted to do in my group, but I had people ragequitting calling it stupid etc. And when I asked them why because it's literally easier and asked them what's harder about it they could never give an answer it was just '' ugh... It's different ''. Low and behold, few weeks later Hector updates his guide with same baits and suddenly it's now becoming the pf norm lol...
Can only say we did same baits week one after I saw it in a random video. Otherwise Hector. We had people that didn't get it somehow. But that was a general issue with the Crossing mechanic. But notbody ragequit on us because we searched for same baits
This raid tier is so accessible evne I started it. If I didn'T know of Hector I wouldn't have attempted Thordan, Valigar or Zoraal Ja. He's the #1 Reason why I'm finally able to play this content, and I leveled up massively using the log analysis in a way that allows me to look and see what I did wrong. I'll look at more guides for M3S and see what I can do in osme other situations to adjust e.g. tho. M1S biggest Problem is that people are swearing on TN and no one wants to adjust even if slightly out of position like it's a religion. But... how's that Hectors fault? For suggesting TN? he even in the video says if you wanna TN it you have to always be stingy... better blame a Lalafell Guide maker than your own inadequacy x)
The problem with people being unable to let go of TN is that only melee players are actively encouraged to make it a habit to actually look at the boss sometimes and thus every other role is simply incapable of using the ole Mark I Eyeball to know where to go for their position. Nevermind that the boss's hitbox is way smaller and easier to figure out the direction of than looking around to find the north waymark and orient yourself to your direction.
I'm primarily a learn by doing type of guy, so nothing beats getting out there and progging over and over again. Secondarily, I learn best by watching videos. I know there are other guide makers out there like Rinon and Mizzteq, and I'm sure they have their own advantages or disadvantages. Lord knows I watched a lot of Mizzteq when coming up through the MSQ story and trials as a sprout. However in my view, Hector has become a staple for the video guides, and to me it is the easiest way to--at the very least, get a rundown of the fight and how to resolve mechanics some ways. I am very thankful for his guides as an inexperienced raider and has helped make the Savage raids so much easier. The last thing I ever want to do is read some pastebin, document, page, or otherwise to learn the fight, because that is not how I learn effectively. I won't deny other strats if it is ever needed in PF, but that's only if I know the fight enough to the point where I can adjust for other strats, rather than learning a different one from the start.
I can read a raid plan. I can perform a strat I've never done before. If you learn the mechanic and not the strat, it doesn't matter what people put in their description. Personally, I love it when Hector finally comes out. It unites PF under one plan. If better strats comes out? As this video points out, Hector will release a follow-up video. I agree that people who blindly follow Hector word for word are a problem. But so are the people who complain about him, lol. They themselves also tend to follow one strat, so when Hector comes out and forces them out of their comfort zone, suddenly it's Hector's fault.
but that's exactly the opposite that hector causes. His over-reliance on arena relative positions just makes it so ppl don't need to understand what is happening but just go to marked spots like bots and pray for the best. This kind of approach legitimately teaches players not to learn mechanics and makes them unable to deal with whatever unexpected issue may come up during a fight.
People also complain about him profitting out of other people's strats. But honestly, this argument falls flat when you don't NEED TO PAY TO WATCH HIS GUIDES. It's just a patreon.
also it's literally the community's strats, nobody cares who came up with them, all anyone cares about is if they work or not - anyone who claims ownership over a strat is being a clout goblin with a massive ego
Hector has the BEST and easy to understand guides. I've tried others but Hector diagrams are the best and no one comes close. The people who hate on hector have brain damage
The annoying parts about hector guides is that they are so often slight variations on what pf was already doing. For example, hector m4s vs EU pf m4s is almost exactly the same except the stacks are arranged differently for ee2 and hector has midnight sabbath pairs rotate ccw where pf has them rotate cw. The annoying part is that they are so similar that people will be confusing the two all tier and there will always be that one guy who rotates the opposite way or stacks differently and wastes everyones time.
I've heard a lot of raiders in my fc complain about the hector M3S strats and I could honestly never figure out why. As a healer, I like that I can just point my camera north and go to the same spots every time for fuse down
melees with brains help get positionals. you dont need to be on your fuse until you need to pop it, so a good melee will never need to use more than 1 TN, and even then its only for 1-2 gcds. depending on where they are in the rotation its not even always needed
So i usually do a lot of a tier before hector guides release. People are confused on which strats to use and his strats are generally less optimized than what is already out there. The only complaint i have towards him is to look at 2-3 guides (most used for other datacenters) and at least pick the best ones. For me, there is no benefit for these guides. The only thing it does for me: It makes it harder to clear. I wish he took those extra "5 mins" to look through different strats and choose the best week 1 strat, because it feels bad having the majority of doing shitty strats after using better ones the week prior.
It's not that he uses early strats, it's that he sometimes doesn't seem to understand the strats or just gets them wrong in a hurry to get his video out. Example: M2S defamations were on clockspots, in his video he puts supports on DPS clockspots and DPS on support clockspots.
I think the intent behind RMMR Fusefield is to increase the likelihood of a melee getting a fuse they can hit positionals on. Dunno what the odds are, but it's definitely higher than MMRR.
we go into that mech with two stacks of true north lol, if it's actually the melees who are responsible for that strat, that is crazy when TN is so abundant and positional damage barely even matters anyway especially with DPS checks so low
@kirigherkins Yeah, I mean it's also possible to hit positionals by leaving your spot after you pop your fuse, so long as you don't hit anyone else's. That said, I've never seen a PFer brave enough to leave their fuse after detonation either. I don't think RMMR is a significant gain worth doing outside of a static full of people chasing those miniscule optimizations. All my group did was do RRMM for popping instead so that melee don't have to leave max melee.
I can understand if you disagree with one of his strategies, but like... just use whatever strat you think suits your group best. Make your own PF with it. If it catches on, maybe less people will use the Hector strat. Or join a static that doesn't strictly adhere to a single guide. The static I run uses mostly Hector/PF strats, but we do things differently if someone hears about a better strategy, or if it suits our group better.
Anyone and everyone making guides is appreciated, although I will say there are still some things that do bother me about Hector's guides, and the biggest factor of that is indecisiveness. I understand it's supposed to give people options, but most groups (especially in PF) need a "strict" guideline to follow. This was a pretty apparent issue in the previous tier, when groups would argue about how to resolve Limit Cut in P9S, because Hector encouraged people to use "whichever strat they prefer." Just from personal experience, I find it works better to simply provide the strat you as a guide maker find best - if a group doesn't like it, they will adjust anyway. An issue I had this tier specifically was that other creators had guides released days before his, and him adding/suggesting strats for some mechanics that felt like they were only added so there was something "new" in the video. Two examples coming to my mind are the kbm towers in m3s, and the odd mustard bomb strat in m4s. It's perfectly fine to have "different" strats (and good, actually. That should be the point of multiple guides), but those two especially felt like they overcomplicated very simple mechanics with no honest benefit. There's no need to reinvent the wheel "for the sake of it." That being said, my personal approach is to try and avoid the guides if I don't like the strats. The people here in the comments who are insulting players that don't love Hector's strats should probably take just a moment to think about the fact that they're doing the exact same thing they're criticizing others for.
I know its a bit off topic but you said these savages were very easy compared to the others. As someone who has never attempted doing one before is this set doable?
people always say there are better strats/guide makers but never actually say who lol. why? because its objective thus doesn’t matter at all. You said the issue yourself, its because people learn how to move according to a info graph and not the actual mechanic. The moment something isnt the exact permutation used in a guide people fail mechanics. People don’t learn the how and why or just suck at learning in general. FF guides isn’t making people bad, people are just victim of the american education system.
Personally always preferred Mizzteq's guides, the ways she she explained things just hit my brain better for some reason, and she doesn't really waste time. Hector also works, I understand him most of the time, but iunno I definitely felt his strats were silly sometimes
I think that him posting alternative strats on a separate video that most people won't see may not be very effective. I think it would be cool to see him make an updated guide for the fight and put "OUTDATED" at the start of his old week 1/2 guides so that people will go look for his new one with better and updated strats. That would be a reasonable compromise between people who like the consistency of having one guide to follow and the people who want better strats after week 1. The expectation would be use Hector guides, but don't use the outdated ones.
@@MyVanir You trying to insult others by calling them illiterate is ironic considering that you completely missed the point of what I said. Without any indication that there is an update, people won't even know to look for any supplemental resources that he might provide through links, let alone in a pinned comment. If you've been around the internet for any amount of time, you also should understand that people are significantly less likely to click on links and that this is an ineffective bandaid fix. Suggesting otherwise is disingenuous.
The M3 pastebin strats solve the majority of the mechs with g1/g2 in mind, so RMMR with snake prios make more sense with congruity. Also, MMRR fucks over at least 1 melee with positionals since it pretty much guarantees at least 1 melee will not get neither flank nor rear positionals
Eh, I am m1 in my group and when I can be arsed to care, I just take note where I need to be, chill in positional-land and go there shortly before my turn to pop, 10 seconds of true north is enough to cover you if you know what you are doing there.
@@MyVanir but why do all that when you can just have a better strategy for literally zero cost and effort. You do you, but what you described is the definition of an un-optimized strat.
Hot take: There are pretty good benefits to PF using a singular strat. Everyone is on the same page, so PF PUGs can just get going without having to explain mechanics and positions. Having a singular strategy also allows for people to build up muscle memory to optimize their rotations for fights instead of having to adjust to each individual party's preferred strats. And we all know how incapable most people seem to be with reading PF descriptions, so having a singular strategy for PF removes that issue entirely. And that last one is likely the biggest reason one strategy/guide becomes so prevalent in PF, as it removes the guesswork of which strategy will be used. ngl, it is likely that the people that are complaining about Hector strats becoming so prevalent are the ones that do not need them to begin with, so it can also come off as an elitist mindset. As for my own personal experience, I'm autistic. Having a routine, or in this case, a single strategy to follow, is how I play at my best. I like to know why I am doing things given my natural curosity, but the more important thing is knowing what I am to do (and lets be real, the only why you really need to know is "if you mess up you wipe the party." the minutiae of mechanics just muddies the waters imo. not wiping the party should be motivation enough). So I greatly benefit from one strategy becoming prominent in PF, as it allows me to join any group in PF and perform my best.
until the day when NA pf isnt a steaming pile of shit this won't really be that hot of a take. jp has only 1 set of strats (game8 for the native jp players and tuufless for the en players, and 90% of what tuufless ends up using is game8 anyway) and while there are plenty of pf terrorists and people who do the strats wrong, there are never discussions of what strat to use. half the time people don't even need to specifiy strats in the pf description and can just put 'normal strats' or even not mention strats, then see nobody misunderstand and try something else.
Yeah I don’t hate the guy but people are so latched to his guides it’s wild. Like, M3S has become a hellhole of people just assuming the mechanics so I have to go “Aight how we resolving X Y and Z?” Though tbf the amount of times in pf I see. “Can I be R1? I only know R1” when it literally makes 0 difference in the fights
It can make a difference on spreads - if you went in one specific direction for spreads every time in prog and a buncha reclears, being told to go the other way cold turkey has a high chance of habit forcing you into the wrong direction and causing at least some deaths in most cases. And no, "just don't do that" is a shit argument. The whole game is built on muscle memory and habit for 95% of endgame mechanics. Just like you would forget and go back to regular breathing if told to breathe in through the right nostril and out through the left because normal functioning humans are not manual breathers.
I think the real question is, if people hate his strats so much, why don't they provide a better alternative? I hate to say it, but I feel people don't understand how annoying pastebins can be, and how unclear they are. When I was progging DSR, I honestly fucking hated the Pastebins because the quality for each phase was so wildly inconsistent. You'd go from someone with 29 slides and paragraphs with clear visuals explaining every mechanic, to someone fitting a phase in 12 slides and writing a sentence for each. The Reason people like Hectors strats is they're presented in a clear, understandable way with a pretty high quality video, and its on a platform everyone is familiar and comfortable using to find. Ultimately, if there was a better alternative, people would use it, but there isn't, so we use Hector. I'm glad he makes the content, because its much better then the alternatives currently available.
For your next video tackle the question, "Are Mizzteq's bad pun's in her videos ruining party finder?" That would be just as dumb as people blaming Hector. . .
But then again people will bitch and complain regardless no fucking matter what. People should be grateful that someone even took the time and effort to help the ungrateful people that complain and then STILL use theirs guides.
Love the Hector Guides. Whole FC relies on them for extremes and savage. I sometimes look at ingame footage as well because it helps to see how fast things really are, but honestly, for me, no other guide maker reaches the quality of Hector. And i don't mean strats, idc about those at all in this context. Hector explains the mechanics in voice, has a party list with debuffs, their duration, has the casts (with name) going off and text comments when you should remember something (In -> Out). I'm not hating on others or anything, i just don't watch them as a result, since just showing ingame footage with a random, as in unknown to me, UI layout and a big textbox somewhere explaining what to do isn't as easy to digest. And if I am given the choice I will watch Hector and adapt to whatever better strats emerge, that often get their own short guides from him anyway. And I would agree. Having one or two prominent strats is way better than having 5 completely different ones. Even just figuring out what exactly is different between two strats gets annoying. Nevermind 5. I just wish people wouldn't join a Hector (or QO5 or whatever) >reclear
The problem is that people rely 100% on ONLY the guide and markers. Even just varying them from let's say A to 1 and people can't do anything, and I mean anything, correct anymore
Hector tries his best to be one of the first out which causes slight inaccuracies. Aside from that, I don't have a problem with Hector guides. The main problem is some people getting overconfident along with not realizing their own mistakes. Back in p12s someone I knew kept messing up caloric 1, they never accepted help and whenever I tried to suggest anything they always said "I've watched hector's guide so many times so I'm clear ready".
ffxiv raiders are such babies, they can literally make their own party and specify what strat they want to use, but instead they blame others for using the strat they like.
To be fair, they are also stupid enough to join a pf asking for a strat they don't like and then bitch when you refuse to change the strat to what they want, so making your own party doesn't always work.
Our static mainly uses hector but we have modified some of the strats here or there. I think it's so interesting that people don't seem to care for the strats when most of the time the strats are kind of Self Evident if you've done enough raiding. Bosses can really only do so many things to damage you or switch you up; and a lot of the time the mechanics that you see them do are just mechanics from other fights that have been tweaked and repackaged in some way or another. Like M2S Rotten Heart is just P4S Curtain Call with a different set of timers and movements. I honestly don't think Hector is the problem, before Hector guides I would often use Miztech for everything, it's not really the guide maker it's the guide watcher. I think that the fact that Savage has become a lot more accessible has created a group of players who have rigid ways of doing things either because they don't have the experience or they just don't like change. And I'll be so real I was kind of the same way before I started playing in Savage. But I've grown and gotten better not only as I've played the different tiers but as I started exploring the different roles as well.
okay, and uh, you do realize you dont *need* to be standing on your fuse the entire time, no? Heck, if DPS are short fuse and m1 is first explostion they can go behind the boss for the rest of the mechanic having only used 1 True north
Personally I'm the opposite of what everyone complains about. Hector just explains so much better than a text dump from non-voices videos. I watch hector guide once and understand more than an hour of studying on text based guides like toolbox
The issue is that Hector took a lot from NA, and here in EU, we were doing VERY different things, especially in M4S, to the point that mechanics will be resolved all the way around, Mustard Bomb, or made no sense in a PF setting, extra risk added for no reason at all in spreads by making partnered jobs be far appart(Tanks, Healers, Rangeds, Melees)
in EU m4s, apart from mustard bomb and EE2, everything is basically the same but with different positions, which makes it annoying to swap between hector and raidplan, because muscle memory will wipe you. Unlike in the video said, that most people will go on with hector, there seems to be a 50/50 divide, that will probably not mix.
@@randomaether Bad rep? Where? Not on Light (EU). Last tier was mostly Hector. Everyone I raid with regularly refers to hector. In no time at all groups started searching for hector and now the "new guide" is at a 50/50 on M4S. Given that groups usually don't change strat and the late guide has to fight a uphill battle because of that, thats a pretty huge adoption rate. Not even mentioning M1-3 where 90% seem to go with Hector with maybe an alteration on a single mechanic like fixed defams on m2. To the point if they don't specify which guide to check.. its probably hector. Sorry, with no further context I have no idea where any more risk is added using Hectors M4S. There's partners In EE1+2 but there's enough time and spread/partner doesn't overlap so keeping pairs together isn't important. I agree that EE2 might be easier in the raidplan cause of shorter ways since you can kinda run north/south as supp/dps and adjust from there. Hector you need to check quickly to run from the explosions to either north or south as support and adjusting likely will kill the dps mid, so a sacrifice is better. Mustard is so much better with Hector imo. I had some raidplan people trying to suicide by winging where they run after exchanging debuffs and almost ending up in my explosions because of that. Twice. I had to adjust further back twice cause the tank didn't go to his empty spot and instead stacked between healers. Midnight has partners, but the splits are the same just differ where the groups go and rotate. Autocad is the same, tho towers cannot really be considered partners. Lines idk how they are in raidplan but hectors are business as usual. meele front. group 1 left. So yeah.. i need clarification on the extra risk. Are you on Chaos? Is it actually different there?
@@SayuIchino one raids on chaos. The retarded choice to allow data center travel killed raiding in most data centers all over the world. I will say, however in the context of people not liking hector I have seen a lot of people not follow the hector guide completely. People will put hector down then change how they handle a certain mechanic, like how the tethers in M1S were dealt with before he added that update video. No one did it the hector way and people in fact made fun of it in pf. I will also say a lot of people in pf often say the fight is ruined now after hector releases a guide because the drones will follow it completely. I saw this multiple times in pf chat while waiting for a healer, everyone would talk shit about the hector strats but say they have to start doing it now because it'll become standard. I do think hector's guides are pretty bad in a static setting but in pf they're fine because they're easy to follow. It's the curse of MMOs, everyone goes for the most accessible resource to win. Nobody tries to make their own build with the gear they just follow the BiS guide on the balance it's just that hector is now the raid guide people just follow. People tend to forget that it didn't start with hector anyway, Mr Happy built his career by being the Hector of ARR-SB
@@christhagod > " People will put hector down then change how they handle a certain mechanic, like how the tethers in M1S were dealt with before he added that update video. No one did it the hector way and people in fact made fun of it in pf. " People who can't do fights without a guide telling them what to do in details are mocking a guy because of one strat on one mechanic while using this guy's guide anyway for the rest of the fight. The irony.
I hate a lot of Hectors guides, but I don''t blame HIM for their prominent use. If anything its a testament to how well he speaks, explains and animates his guides. The strats he presents in them are explained clearly and understood by the majority. It's just unfortunate that the strats he chooses to present are often terrible, or simply leave a lot of room for improvement left on the table. There are even some where just a little bit of extra thinking could provide an obvious improvement as such I am glad he's started doing mini-guides for revising some mechanics when better strats emerge from those realizations - but this now also poses a problem with how to communicate which strats to use in PF when majority just say "Hector strat" or whatever, so like, is that base Hector, using any of the supplements, if so which? It can become messy. In an ideal world Hector would take down videos with incorrect, or outdated strats when improvements come along and upload a revision to the guide as a whole. But this would be more work and the guy is already doing his part as a week one guide maker - for better or for worse.
I mean he straight up tells people to not put "Hector Strats" in their pf descriptions, because people have told HECTOR HIMSELF that they're using hector strats in pf and then not clarified the actual strat being used. He releases week one guides, with a clear disclaimer that strategies will change over time, he releases updated guides going over the new strategies, the old strategies are still viable, and some statics may find it easier to continue using them rather than learning new ones, and/or use them to explain the fights to newer people they bring in, taking the guides down when they become "outdated" (they aren't outdated, he's never claimed they're the end all be all or the definitive PF strat) would cause problems for people who WANT to continue doing the fight that way and now need to teach all the strategies they know for each mechanic instead of just linking a video.
I get the frustration, but the problem is not hector, or his guides, it is people who are stubborn, inflexible, and rude in pf. They would keep doing this with or without his guides. Do we just go down the hit list of killing every guide channel, raid plan maker, etc. in the community until we don't have any left as these problematic players just jump to the next set of easy to understand guides after the community burns down the last one? At the end of it all, these players will still exist making your pf experience a nightmare, but there will be even less people in pf who even so much as vaguely understand the fight. Annoying players existed before Hector, and they will exist after Hector, and nothing hector does will change these players because their behavior has nothing to do with the person making the guides they use or the guides they use themselves
One of the things I actually really appreciate about his guides is that he explains the mechanics as well as how he suggests to resolve them. For me, understanding the mechanic helps to adjust if someone messes something up or potentially save the group from a wipe if someone doesn't quite make it to the right spot.
Very true, but tbh I usually don't see just "hector" pfs- they often include things where there is choice. Like Normal Towers on M3. Same Baits M1. Starvy MTTT m1. Autocad etc. etc. is that different on your dc?
My problem honestly isn't Hector, it's the people that push Hector and only Hector. I personally don't understand the cult following for Hector, there are other content creators that make guides earlier than Hector and are better quality than Hector (not rushed) but they don't get the same recognition.
Because Hector is established since a whole Expansion and got this "Shitstorm" only for this current Raidtier. His Guides worked fine for Endwalker. Also he has a really calm Voice,Explaines the Mechanics WHAT they actually do and hes using a Raidplaner Graphic instead of ingame PoV. I really like Yukizuri but he Showing the Mechanic in every possible Outcome not only makes his Videos way longer but way more Confusing especially when you have Prog Footage with dead people so the mechanic was played by someone who wasnt intentional get hit by it.
Starting in P1S and P2S i tried many guides before, and they all have been difficult to understand, until i saw Hector guides which were slow paced with great visuals. Now, after hearing the hate, i came to yukizuri M2S guide for a change, and i would still say that the pace (and lack of commentary) makes me unable to take the info in one or even two takes. Hector might not offer the best strats, but he explains them the best (he and raidplans ofc)
yeah there is nothing wrong with hector, just people blindly using hector only, even when there is some much easier optimizations developed weeks later. I think instead of hector its better to post ”same bait, dps first, tn, thd, starvy mttt”
@@morvereth yea, hector even says not to say "hector strats" in your description and actually say the strat. as he uploads mini-guides to describe multiple strats for resolving the same mechanic, just saying "hector" doesn't even make sense
The problem with pf, is they get stuck in their ways and refuse for whatever reason to budge from the initial strategy even though in plain English it states this is a WEEK ONE STRAT, better ones can come out. I saw the same thing happen during E8S with the infamous ilya strategy for Light rampart. IYKYK. The better strat was Bowtie strat but for whatever reason, PF being the stubborn beast it is refused to adopt it because the ilya strat came out first. I think it comes down to the simple fact that PF thinks it ain't broke so why optimize it, which I guess when you've done it for x amount of weeks 1 way and doing the new one essentially means "reprogging" PF doesn't have the patience for that.
I mean hector guides are pretty much Pastebin with a slight of alteration. If you know the other, its easier to adjust on the either. Not unless theres a 3rd or 4th guide you just heard of then everything goes haywire 😂
No, he's not the problem. Do the strats help clear? Yes. Plain and simple, his guides help. They may not be optimized, but they're easy to follow and give a guideline when trying to clear.
I use Hector guides, they're good. But sometimes Hector doesn't have the approach or mindset of trying to have the optimal or consistent placement of players in his guide and it's clear from this tier's set of guides. M3S with the fuse placement is an example of this, we don't have R1 look North, we have R1 and R2 stay on their respective West/East sides for better consistency. Fortunately, I am in a static so we can swap this around to be more optimal. However, it's ultimately on the PF. As you said, they need to learn WHY they are doing something. Another issue is then expecting PF to say: 'Hector guide, except for.....' and trying to list out and explain the variations, having people adjust to them, wiping, players leaving after maybe 3 pulls, then finding replacements to explain it ALLLLLL over again. Hector's guides do leave a BIT to be desired but overall, they're pretty good. Personally, I use them to understand the mechanics and why, where, and when we move. I type up the boss rotation, the type of action, and how to resolve it so I can understand it. Doing that, using the Hector guide as a reference and any POVs (like MrHappy) to get a better image of mechanics and how to resolve them.
Lmao as if people in pf can even do a fight without a guide. Unless you are in a static that unanimously agrees to create their own strats (which is less than 1% of actual statics) nobody creates their own strats.
Honestly the biggest issue is the number of people who see guides in general as hard and fast rules you MUST follow to clear a fight. They are Guidelines, not requirements, the vast majority of mechanics can be resolved in multiple way, find the way that is right for you and your group
Except this is talking about pf, there is no "you and your group", no one is going to find The One Strat for the specific combination of people in any given party finder.
The main thing that I dislike about the prevalence of Hector guides is that it's completely deleted macros from EU PF culture. This creates so many problems with people not reading the PF description that says Yuki / Rinon / a specific raidplan, assuming hector strats, going to the wrong spot for a mechanic and then killing people and blaming someone else. Pre-Abyssos, when EU was less reliant on Hector's guides, this happened a lot less because a macro would be posted after loading into the instance and it was pretty much impossible for there to be any confusion.
This issue exist the other way around as well. We did Hector M4S and got plenty of raidplan people unable to read the description... sometimes it really feels like its not worth writing there. Sometimes they fail to notice even if you write your strat in chat before loading into the instance. But I also wanna mention: I saw plenty of macros last tier. I had one for every fight pretty sure. This tier not so much. We created our own because of the above issue with raidplan people in hector groups. But I also didn't find a reddit post or similar that collected raidplans and macros in contrast to last tier.
I'm sure this video is good but there's 0 need to watch it because this whole situation is so pointless. Blaming a creator for the actions of people you meet in game is stupid. Hating the band because the fans are insufferable sometimes makes as much sense as this. If there is a shortcoming in the person using Hector's strats, the onus of guilt is on that person. Not Hector. People trying to shift blame onto him are socially inept.
people used to hold up MTQ and Happy as the raidguide makers multiple expansions ago. Happy made one video where he showed a bad strat, his own team stopped using that strat for week two and happy would say on stream "dont use 'happy strat' its bad. even happy himself doesnt use it!" and PF decided to continue using happy strat and hating on happy because it sucked. so he stopped making guides! MTQ had some real life things happening i believe and stopped making guides, but also a lot of her guides would have her explaining how to survive something, and then on screen all you see is her whole team exploding in the colorful chaos of mechanics and she walks away with paladin invuln or just tank privilege. they were only alright for learning a fight, and you had to really pay attention to learn from her. other guide makers like ilya or xeno would have their guides be twice as long or longer than anyone else, and when youre already in PF trying to understand what you just died to, its an absolute pain in the ass to find the mechanic in their videos and see how they solve it. Happy tried to keep it quick because he knew that struggle. Hector does it better, but Joonbob is the king of this. unfortunately Joonbobs guides take months to make, the tier is over before all his guides are out.
He literally warns, week one strats and better could come out. All the strats if done right are pretty sound. The diagrams are really well done.
Yeah I think that's one of the biggest things is that disclaimer honestly I think people are desensitized to it haha
Clearly people don’t pay attention to that disclaimer because some folks still try to do week 1 strats on week 5 for example.
The issue is his strats are mostly based on how he does things with his static, and knowing full well PF will not adjust in the least. The amount of times I've heard "That's not what Hector said in the video" is too damn high, and boom raid wipe. I don't think it's Hector mostly. I think it's PF just doesn't understand the fight conceptually.
Wow, I didn’t know there was an issue. I enjoy Hector guides because it’s almost like the white board strategies a sports coach would give his team. I also watch MTQ for footage and explanation of mechanics. Getting a real world visual can help. Plus somtimes I feel like one person can explain something better to my mind than the other. I just think it’s always a good idea to watch more than one guide.
Wow, I didn’t know there was an issue. I enjoy Hector guides because it’s almost like the white board strategies a sports coach would give his team. I also watch MTQ for footage and explanation of mechanics. Getting a real world visual can help. Plus somtimes I feel like one person can explain something better to my mind than the other. I just think it’s always a good idea to watch more than one guide.
Kinda wild to me that people hate on a guy trying to help them clear the content they would otherwise not understand how to clear since the ones who aren't looking at his guides don't need it.
The problem is that a lot of those people still don't understand how to do the mechanics. It's like giving someone new in town written directions of how to get to the closest grocery store but suddenly there's construction work that closes off a large portion of the main road so they just starve to death in their car waiting for the construction to finish because they didn't understand the local road network.
Problem is that....
if certain people cannot understand the fight should they even do it?
They should stick to grinding fates or whatever
@@DrZlow Using a guide for content doesn't mean you shouldn't be doing it. Don't be a blind running elitist man.
@@Isissa125 sorry, can't help it.
I killed the tier week1 using botched raidplans and my own eyes.
@@DrZlow yes and we're all very proud of you but that doesn't mean us plebians who use guides shouldn't do savage at all. you need us to make you look better :)
People hating on Hector are the same people who'd lose their minds if he was gone.
He's doing a thankless job to give people the confidence to try raiding.
Somethings he'll get wrong or better strats will come later - but it's a baseline to help the community.
Yeah he helps so many people with his work
that is both very true and very incorrect at the same time xD
@@DrZlow I'm sorry ^^ 💙
no, the pf would just lean towards the next other creator that posts their vid up first thats easily watchable
the people complaining about hector guides arent really using hector guides silly
"Stop using Ilya strat." ~ Ilya, creator of Ilya Strat
I was just thinking about this and all the hate he got for e8s
@@tak1145that was a terrible strat tbf
@@tak1145 and for good reason, it was an insanely terrible strat that caused more issues than anything else.
@@DarkDyllon it's because it was a world race/day 1 strat, thrown together really quickly to get a quick clear. Ilya went out and said "people will make a better strat, use those, don't use this one"
But, we all know PF.
Bro i said dont do ilya from the start. I tried what sharingan ended up being but it was too late for me bc i didnt want to go back and do it 8 plus weeks later
Also the hivemind that defended him bc id tell him to stop using raw and used nascent which was better (before bloodwhetting)
I've done all types of end game in multiple MMOs and it baffles me how people hate Hector. The dude is a gem in the community and is just giving people options for solving mechanics.
My issue with Hector is that his videos, and if not his then it would be Mr Happy's, or Rinon's, or someone else's, don't give you options. They *become* the option. PF has an issue with forcing a SINGLE strat, even when better strats are available. ive seen this across all NA DCs too.
@@Nazuiko If the strategy works, it doesn't matter whether it is optimal or not. With PF groups you always have to bear in mind that the MOST WIDELY used strategies are used here, as most people are familiar with them. What you do in your own static is up to you and if you want to hunt for the orange and pink parses.
@@CirnoFTW unless PF starts to mix and match different strats together, like you got hector and whatever for M4S.
But it's mainly because Hector pumps these guides out ASAP without even having cleared said fights himself. (he still does, he put out the m4s guide fairly sure without clearing the fight, he 100% put out the p8s guide without having cleared the fight)
so he just checks PoV's, checks what PF uses, then makes a video, shoves it up to youtube and calls it a day, then puts a shitty disclaimer "remember, these are week 1 strats" which honestly, is not an excuse, he also at some point said that he doesn't want PF to become over reliant on his guides and it being called "hector strats" ... then stop making strats.
@@DarkDyllon there are only three words i have for your accusation and you comment as a whole: "burden of proof"
Here's the thing guide makers don't think of at the time.......
Their guides are good but what they don't account for happening is their guides aren't options......they're the only way. An that's the community that does that.
Hector explains and shows top down pov that is easy to grasp.
Seeing it your self once ingame is enough to make any player realise whats going on with his guides.
Anyone hating his guides is just a person who is used doing something in a specific way and refuses doing it otherwise any other way
Genuinely the only guide maker I can watch since the other guides don't show the mechanics as well illustrated. Him and joonbob.
I think the problem for most people are that some people see the strats and try to do the fight without understanding the mechanic at all.
@@madmulk9 Joon actually did the top-down raidplan-style guides first iirc, but he releases maybe one video per tier, like a month after Hector's guide is out.
@@shuyikeijich5409
It's actually like that.
Hector isnt the problem, the problem is party finder and the hivemind that explodes when you suggest a better strat
Exactly
Reminds me of E9s Happy Brambles for Cloud of Darkness that Happy put out. PF adopting it and weeks later even Happy said that was a week 1 strat and his static switched to a different strat yet PF kept using happy brambles.
Yeah, I agree with that somewhat but he fed them bad info to make them believe his strategies are the only strategies. Like M2 Savage ... everytime I see MK I want to scream of the stupidity. You talk to players, they repeat his bullshit saying they are random. Japanese players don't Mario Kart and there is a reason why they have higher clears then us and make us all look like fools. Because they were smart enough to figure it out for themselves.
This is why I tell people to not watch guides. Watching a guide makes you linear and more of a problem to teach then if you came in fresh. I teach people Savage runs and it is always those that watch a guide before hand that are the ones that struggle because they have a preconceived notion in their head on how things work.
I mentioned M2 Savage, but I didn't even touch on The Abyssal Fracture (Extreme). He was so big on people memorizing the patterns for the 4 star attacks on the ground (once against rushing the strategy guide), he missed the common sense way to handle it. I spent all week that first week teaching people the proper way to handle them and every one of them said it was better. It was a simple strategy, you just turn your camera 135 degrees (looking behind you on an angle in) and you can literally see the path of the attacks. You don't need markers at that point because you know what is safe as you can literally see it at that point. Meteors, I had to break people out of the MRRM or RMMR crap. I literally had them line up 1, 2, 3, 4 and learn how to see the holes, then plug up the hold based on your number position in parceners. After about 3 attempts, people would have meteors down each time. I explained in detail what they would see and how the holes would position themselves since it is a pattern. 3 times max, we were past it. But if people followed his guide, they would take forever to get them down. So he is ruining the PF community with half baked strategies just to get by because he wants to be the first one out there with them.
THIS
I remember the days before hector, the guides were not very good. Only ever showing the perspective from one player and doesn’t explain the concept of the mechanic just how to do it from that one point of view. When hectors guides came out it was a blessing by finally someone who explains the mechanic and then how to solve it. The top down perspective makes it easy to get no matter what role you play. I don’t know how anyone could ever hate hector.
Because his strategies are half baked, wrong, and rushed. M2 Savage is a perfect example of this. Literally PF is depending on MK strategy and it is the WORSE STRATEGY for that mechanic but people won't change because of Hector! Hector has people believing that the mechanic is RANDOM and it isn't, it was just that Hector didn't take the time to understand it! He wanted to get his guide out so fast, he literally screwed the FFXIV community now because people refuse to do anything else.
If you Mario Kart anything in FFXIV, you are doing it wrong. There is no strategy that Mario Kart is the best option.
"The community has a big problem learning what to do but not why they are doing it" I mean this sentence alone basically sums up a lot of PF issues lately. Some people are so glued to Hector's guides and the "it can ONLY be done THIS way" and don't realize that there are different ways to skin a cat and sometimes Hector is not the end all be all. People essentially just learn their positions in fights and can't or won't learn to adjust if the comp is different or not ideal. Then they get frustrated when things have to change because of those reasons. I've seen this pattern of mindless behavior for PF has been going on for awhile now...where maybe a year or two ago there were several strats being used and for some reason we have all seem to only use Hector's guides which isn't bad per say but the moment you question or challenge a strat from his guides and suggest a more optimal or different strat, that's when all hell breaks loose and people's minds start to glitch down. It's frustrating
Yeah I had some people in pf raging at each other because they really wanted to be SE instead of SW and it's just like.....why haha
@@SonicridaI think that's fair? Learning a fight on a certain position inevitably gives you muscle memory. You WILL mess up if you suddenly have to go left instead of right while also managing your rotation. Combine that with parties dissolving after two wipes it is totally understandable to be nervous if you are forced to be on a position you aren't used to. Some people will just insist on the position they are comfortable with.
This pretty much sums it up. For example, in m4s with EE1, you can change how positions are in so many ways. But I was forced to give up my way of doing it because we have to use hector or PF strats in case someone is missing. It annoys me so much.
I had this the other week. Doing M2S, we're at Rotten Heart, doing decent damage. Just need to do the mechanic correctly and she will dead before then. BRD (R1) forgets their position goes to mine (H2). It was fine, I thought maybe they forgot their position after a hectic pull. So both me and M2 go a bit further out to not high five him. After the first high five he walk through me to go to his spot and wipes us. This is why I say that people should learn the mechanics not the solutions.
At least in Light, there is a fight between Hector and Q-Go/OQ5 (Rinon adjusted), people cleared with those latter 2, and new players are using Hector 60% of the time.
I am always a fan of the strats that require the least amount of effort. Generally speaking these are the strats that pop up in PF the most, and generally Hector (and his raid team/wherever he gets these strats) are pretty good at finding braindead strats. They dont hit 100% of the time, but generally speaking they are digestable enough for the average PF raider to understand. The diagrams and clear audio explaining the mechanics in a succinct manner only someone who teaches for a living can do also help tremendously.
WE RIDE AT DAWN FOR HECTOR! But seriously, my static uses his guides because he delivers strats in a way we can all understand and digest and I like that a lot of the time, he explains the WHY of the mechanic, not just "stand here".
I remember reading the raidplan for pangenesis and just not getting it - and wiping every time I got there because of it, - until I discovered the three extra pages explaining how the mechanic worked and why the strat solved it and BAM! - within 1-2 attempts where I got used to what to look at and where to go, I started doing it right every time.
People severely underestimate how important actually using your brain to understand the mechanic is for executing the strat a lot of times.
Honestly I really appreciate what hector does by trying to give consistent strategies even if they aren't the most optimal. They allow people to progress early on and give a great visuals and explanations for the whole fight. The problem is definitely just people being completely unable to adjust to new strats and solutions for mechanics. The number of times that I got into a reclear party and someone said that they NEED m1 or m2 is insane. There are people that refuse to even learn the fight being on the left instead of the right let alone learning a new strat would help the group. Ultimately people in party finder just need to be more open to change than they are but that's not going to happen.
Hector filled in Thordan unreal reclear I was in one week and was genuinely just such a nice guy it boggles my mind that people get so angry over his guides.
good video bro. i think people are seriously too pretentious about this stuff. this is my first time doing EX and savage and hector's guides were very straightforward in helping me learn mechanics and why we do them. also, he is a good teacher. i like rinon's vids but i have a hard time following him a lot because he's more fast paced and uses some terms that a first timer like myself may not be familiar with yet.
The one thing I appreciate from the Hector guides is that he shows the size & shape of the attacks, which really helps me visualise what I'm trying to dodge & how much margin for error there is.
Hard agree with the sentiment of "do you want to have to learn multiple strats" vs just having one or two common ones, even if they're not perfect. I've never really understood the hate against Hector... myself and many others probably would not be raiding without him =P I also noticed that this tier, there has been adjustments to hector strats with each fight in PF. So it'll be mostly Hector strat with a tweak here and there.
Yeah I think people are not *that* rigid in pf (what's funny is I say that in the video but I don't mind a lot of strats, I just mind bad ones and I know it would make pf harder haha trying to learn multiple with less parties filling too so it's not very conducive to actually playing)
One of the biggest problems, especially for final fuse down, is that the image they used in pastebin, specifically the one shown exactly at 4:18 is a pattern that doesn't happen. Like specifically that one that covers both A and D is NOT a pattern that can ever happen, and it caused our group to keep wiping to that mechanic for hours until we looked at Hector which while not optimal for sure actually used images that showcased patterns in the fight
"the good guides are wrong and you cant clear with them. the bad guides are correct and we dont want to use them because theyre correct" actually insane decision making here, congrats
@@steveh1474 we tried for 2 hours using pastebin and our healers and melee kept making mistakes specifically because that example image was incorrect, then we swapped to hector and cleared on the next pull. Just saying
I’m sorry, but if you wiped for hours just because of the image in the pastebin, you should’ve had a recording or had at least one person in the group recognise the patterns after a small while. The whole point of the pastebin is about positioning (and this was from week 1 where people weren’t sure if the patterns could alternate or not). While it is incorrectly flipped, it shouldn’t have been an issue to identify where to go. Yes, Hector posted the correct image but the pastebin isn’t completely to blame if it took a long time to realise something like that.
@@yassin9782 if I'm studying a textbook on the dates of a war, and they have the wrong dates printed, really shouldn't matter if someone in the class is able to figure out the dates were wrong from context or other sources people are still going to read and trust the textbook because that is the guide for the test. Some people are visual learners and trust what they see
@@Bearpigman I think a closer analogy is a math book showing you a rectangle that's really 1 inch by 2 inches but telling you it's 10 feet by 30 feet. The pastebin shows the theory using an example, you just gotta apply it to the stuff you actually see in game.
I lurk on streams and look at clips a lot, and I noticed a lot of the hate is coming from world first raiders too. One mentioned that Hector did it for money, and got absolutely dogpiled from the community, and I saw a other world first say that his guides were bad because there was no video POV to show it in real time. Back in Endwalker, I saw a Crystal PF (iv999) just stating that Hector was a bad guide maker, and a couple of other horrible remarks.
A lot of the haters are elitist players.
I am grateful for Hector even if its not the best of the best strats*. You are best to stay in a static if you desire unique and ultra uptime strats. The community does not need to bend to these wills, because its unnecessary.
This is a good reason why MrHappy stopped making guides, community just can't seem to figure out that strats can always be revised or improved upon down the line. No surprise for a raiding community that seem to fail at counting, figuring out directions and don't know the class they are playing
Such a great community though, by the way.
Hector's indubitably one of the better guide makers out there, both him and Joonbob are easily some of my favorites to learn a fight, thanks to the neat visuals and the audio explanations of a mechanic. I believe a lot of the criticisms really just come down to "he made a guide with week 1 strats and now PF doesn't want to adjust to better strats" which, really, is more of a PF issue than a Hector issue imho. Looking at you, p4s "N/S orbs"...
That being said, I personally like the relative north FFD strat way more. It makes sense in my head to have "group 1 left, group 2 right" the whole time. As a WHM, I hate having to think "where is North/South corner so I can go to it" instead of automatically going far left/far right. RMMR is just better so melee doesn't eat downtime to pop first fuse.
People just have stupid opinions in general. Remember Happy Brambles? Ilya E8S? Same shit. I personalyl just mute people who talk about guide makers.
Hectors guides got me from m1s to wicked thunder enrage in 3 weeks. Surprisingly this hector hate only happens on social media because I haven’t heard complaints in the actual pf.
it's there but most just want to prog and continue and not complain about it, it's also an issue where there is a better strat in circulation, but then Hector uploads and guide and BAM ... it's now "hector strat" again.
@@DarkDyllon Exactly, he rushes the guides and screws up the community by making "JUST GET BY" strategies that are often horrible. I quote M2 Savage using Mario Kart and him convincing people that it is a Random mechanic. Kobe and the whole Japanese community put out WAY BETTER STRATEGIES that were common sense and easy to do, but because Hector has been too arrogant to fix his guides or update them (Admitting his mistakes), PF players suffer because of it!
You are correct that Hector strats, and Hector himself, get too much undue criticism. But since you asked for more context, I'll try to summarize:
These days, Hector is careful to reference already-existing strats when creating his guides. This was not always the case. Back in Asphodelos and Abyssos, his guides would occasionally feature a strategy that deviated heavily from the strats used by week 1 groups, and were almost always significantly worse. Take for example his p5s Ruby Glow 5 strat, which locked NA party finder into using horrible, nonsensical downtime spread spots for the entire tier. This led to his EARLY guides gaining a reputation among hardcore players for being detrimental to the raiding scene. That reputation has stuck, despite his guides vastly improving in quality since then.
The other issue is about the types of players that gravitate toward Hector's guides. As you pointed out, many of his guides are functionally identical to week 1/pastebin strats, meaning for example that if I put up a PF for m4s and said "Shababin" or "Hector", those would be referencing the same strats. However, the "Shababin" pf would fill with mostly high-skill players who cleared week 1 or 2, whereas the "Hector" pf is 90% of the time going to fill with low-skill players who make it into a trap party. Now of course, that is not Hector's fault and he does not deserve criticism for it, but unfortunately, that's what happens.
Hector is an excellent guide-maker and doesn't deserve any of the hate he gets. You'll also never see me join a party that says Hector Strats. Hell, even he once said in an interview with Mr Happy that "Hector" parties are trap parties.
Much of EU's M1-3 is just Hector right now. If you refuse to do Hector, EU PF is pretty much unusable
Except that his recent guides still give wrong information like M2 Alarm Pheromones 1. He has people believing that the mechanic is completely random and MK is the only way but in reality, Mario Kart is the worse way to handle it. Because of his guide, we are light years away from catching up with the Japanese Servers who have "SMARTER GUIDES" because they take the time to do it right and learn the mechanics properly before posting a guide. PF is flooded with people who refuse to learn the right now because not only will he not admit he was wrong on his guides and won't fix it, but because of his ego to rush to be the first one out there.
I see this as the community just being stupid. There's really not much to it. I've experienced similar things in World of Warcraft where one strategy became prominent, people eventually stopped knowing how to actually do the mechanic without doing it that particular way. A few expansions later and timewalking comes around. I join the dungeon in question, people do that one strategy that they've learned to do, not actually learning the mechanics and then it's like running into a brick wall, because surprise, it's balanced differently.
The group then refuses to listen to my instructions on how to actually beat it and say "this is how we've always done it" to which I responded "not working too great, is it?"
A few attempts later they caved in and followed my instructions. Cleared it first attempt without breaking a sweat.
People just don't want to learn different strategies. They want to learn this one trick which solves all problems, without even trying to understand the problem itself first.
For context, it was a rush strategy which intended to skip mechanics. Very common in dungeons in particular, but also happens on some raid bosses once characters are geared enough. It's not as common that raids are revisited however.
That's honestly really interesting. Kinda wild to think about what would happen if unreal were tweaked in a serious way.
And yeah, it's not Hector's fault that people stick to his guides. It's up to the community to learn these fights and how they work
@@Sonicrida Crystal Tower is a good example in FFXIV, the zombie dragon in particular. People just rush it down and wouldn't be able to beat it normally. Some other bosses are in the same position, but I think that's one of the best examples.
This is so curious from a JP perspective where 99% of players use the exact same strats for every fight and the only variance this entire tier is like, same baits vs old baits on M1S. That's it. For parse teams you might see some alternatives but for practice, clears and reclears (the vast majority of content), every party is on the exact same page and you can freely and confidently jump from party to party knowing that the strats will be 100% identical.
And besides, most anyone who was doing old baits have since switched to doing same baits anyway because they gave up in the face of the overwhelming number of same bait parties anyway. We even use the same lone bomb safe spot strat that Hector uses lol, specifically for the reasons you mentioned. Everything we do, we do to improve consistency and reduce accidents. And parties will still wipe to sunrise in reclears anyway but it is what it is.
I'd say it is more due to Japan's culture having a conformist mentality that forces everyone to toe the line or face the passive-aggressive wrath of the unofficial blacklist.
Ok so hector strat for m4s vs raidplan strat: bottom line the strats are the same. Literally the only difference is some role placements vary but its such a minor adjustment. The issues so is players who use terms like "usual pf strats" or "my way is better" and can't adapt
I think we all know its a thought shortcut at this point. Some of Hectors EnWa strats weren't super suited towards PF(kinda like M4 Rinon making w1 pf nightmare on Light) but the biggest issue is people blindly following a guide without thinking about how a mech actually works. I was forced to wipe so many times on reclears in last enwa tier because people didn't understand where to recover and would immediately wall after smallest mistake. And thats just one thing, other issues I feel are already nicely explained in the comment section.
It's a mindset, it has nothing to do with Hector, but it just happen to be prominent within audience that uses them.
Yes, Hector could rephrase things or think about how to accomodate PF better(and I feel like he did, there is a big progress imo compared to last expansion) but in the end he's mostly a scapegoat for the part of the community that often causes a lot of issues when inside of an instance to other people in the party and also tbh he's doping god's work making the raids more accessible by providing well produced visualisation of the fights very early on into the tier.
Part of the reason is his guides used to be a lot less efficient, sloppier with worse strats, which funnily enough back then PF didnt adapt to his guides. And some people just hold a grudge against him, not willing to see him improve. Which he has. His guides arent perfect but it's not going to be. Just mostly hope we're not building a culture in PF where we just adopt the hector guide no matter what.
which is unfortunately is what's happening, since now you got a fairly consistent strat in curculation and then Hector releases his guide and out of nowhere it's "hector strat" in PF (or whatever mix they dream of)
my main issue is that someone who didn't clear the fight uploads a guide for the fight, to me, in order to make and understand the fight, you need to have cleared the fight atleast.
like it was common knowledge already (even at the time his guide releases for M2S) where the 16 orso bees that appear are baited on random people, 2 for each player.
Hector said these are 100% random, but they weren't, so it was established that it wasn't random and that the tank should pull the boss north right before the TB and then everyone stacks together and mario karts around the arena as a group, but then Hector came in and everyone randomly forgot this was an established fact? and went back to it being an FFA.
Also, Hectors M4S guide for EE2 was just objectively worse than Rinon's (or the pastebin, since i'm fairly sure Rinon's guide is basically the pastebin)
where Hector first explains the entire mechanic (which is lengthy on it's own) and then adds "just remember, what you got hit by +1" but he also uses this for the pairs that you can get.
Rinon removed the thinking aspect and just said for support (since I main tank) "if you got hit twice, you go middle, if you got hit 1 or 3 times, you go A" and that's the entire mechanic explained, no needing to think "well, i'm long timer, there for I need to be 2+1" (it's not difficult to be fair, but for PF, you want the most braindead strat possible)
I think the main issue is rhat people memorize the guide and don't study the actual fight.
As a player who moved from JP to NA, one of the most important problems I found in NA PF is people never use macros to show the positions of their strat before fight, which can cause a lot problems due to misunderstanding. Sometimes, like when PF says Shababin/Hector, some may join and follow the pastebin final fuse down positions while others follow Hector, which may cause an overlap for melees. A macro can easily solve that before happening: just check where should you stand before the fight so everyone will be on the same page, also have an opportunity to review if your memory is blurred. Also with a macro you don't really need to learn a totally different strat again, just take a look at it and remember it, like how we learn the strats from pastebin/raidplan.
NA player. I've only ever seen someone do the Macro for a Raid diagram thing in my entire time playing this game (Late HW start) was maybe... 3 times tops. And every time it was a golden day cause I didn't have to think about anything. "Oh, T1 or T2? I'm Main Tanking so I'm T1. Okay what's my spots for XYZ" >Read Macro Awesome! We're good to go! No spending 20 minutes discussing spots haha!"
I wish we did this... it's so freaking clean...
@@CrazedWhiteGaming Although it's not that efficient but having a raidplan is even much better than not having anything but simply Hector/Pastebin, while the Pastebin link is not attached. 🥶 I understand that after several weeks many people can memorize it well but it's just hilarious we are so against to put anything on to have people take a review in case of anyone forgot anything but to wipe a few times to derust then probably disband > find a new party.
The problem here is not the lack of a macro, it is people being dumb and writing conflicting things in the pf description. You don't need a macro if the (singular) guide everyone follows already set positions. Macros were a thing back when video guides were single-pov crap that maybe sometimes showed the arena fully with positions for mechanics.
@@MyVanir Based on my experience pretty much Japanese guides are also very detailed and provides both explanation and POVs, but macros are still a thing in JP servers so that people who already cleared ahead of the guide release doesn’t need to fully review the guide, also everyone can have an opportunity to have a quick review before reclear
Man make diagrams so good that he gets hated
5:10 The MMRR / RMMR difference for fusefield is that if you're doing prios from north CW/CCW, MMRR is easier to do by party list order, but RMMR will tend to make the melee be on the south side of the boss more often, which is where their positionals are. MMRR makes M1 on the north side more often. That being said, my static just naturally did MMRR before hector and our melees have never complained, so it doesn't matter.
I agree with the point of the video though, the community has an issue with taking week 1 strats as gospel and then complaining about them later. MrHappy also would make week 1 guides with his group's strats with the same "this is an early strat" warning, and I know people complain about him too since groups would use his strat way after better ones came out (like the happy brambles situation).
This is a static i'm talking about, but we just did "looking at the boss, MT/M1 go left, OT/M2 go right of the boss closest" no idea what the healer/ranged do since I never look back, but I can see them move farther away generally. (granted, I really dislike boss relative strats, since it changes so much compared to true north, think Hector also pioneerd boss relative for the copy cat attacks in M1S (where black cat does the 2 half arena cleaves and then the proximity baits) which is just less consistent to me since true north my position remains static instead of needing to think "alright, i'm looking at the boss, so i'll be behind her"
@@DarkDyllon When you say "ranged go further out" are you sure you're actually thinking of the same mechanic? Fusefield is the one where everyone gets in a circle and steps on fuses, nobody's further out than anyone else (and boss relative = true north). You might be thinking of Final Fusedown, where people get fuses on their heads + bombs explode.
@@tciddados then no, I think i'm talking about the mechanic before Fusefield then, my bad. (M3S confused me a lot anyways due to the names being stupidly similar to one another)
@@DarkDyllon Is "stay behind boss" that hard for you? Are you closing your eyes to not see the boss in the fight?
@@MyVanir what are you talking about?
Day 2 Same bait introduce I watch the video, I said same bait strat is genius. When to PF with the same bait parties kick me. Week 6 majority of PF are using same bait m1s.
Funny thing about the RMMR thing is it only effects one melee. The other melee is basically in the exact same spot in every strat. So if you're M2 the strat doesn't matter.
It's suppose to ideally give M1 more flexibility with positionals. But M1 on short debuff timer can literally just leave their spot instantly and head to the bottom (as long as they don't hit other fuses). And if you're adventurous you can do that with the long debuff and go back when its your time to pop it. But some people don't like seeing that much movement on their screen so if someone were to just see a melee wiggling around the boss they'd probably panic and mess up the mechanic so people just want RMMR.
With how the mechanic is actually setup positionals shouldn't actually be a problem. The order just makes it idiot proof. It's like how in Zoraal Ja you can leave your conga-line position to hit positionals but people want you to sit on the markers because some people panic if they see people moving around instead of waiting to explode.
My only prob with Hector is he uses different markers than all the pastebin/pfers. When everyone does clockspots for everything and the markers dont resemble a clock is wack. Other than that he makes great guide. Use what u like from his stuff and leave the rest.
Playing on Mana DC, not knowing any Japanese. It's a SEA player routine to watch Hector because he explains how a fight work more, then watch POV of Hamkatsu or Nukemaru, etc...while google translating game8 and their Macro.
It's not a Hector problem or PF problem, Hector guides has the added bonus of a strat you COULD use. It's a you problem when people are using the strat you didn't want to learn, better or worse. The majority chose a strat, you can't expect the majority of the people playing to spend more time watching and learning many different strats.
The hardest part of savage is the other 7 players. At least one of them will consistently fail and cause others to lose motivation. They no longer care so they start messing up and it just builds until the party disbands and people go into a new party finder group and repeat the cycle. Maybe you'll get lucky this time. Maybe everyone will actually try this time. Maybe you won't get someone who's been trying for hours and can't bring themselves to take a break. Maybe you won't switch classes because you're tired of having everything perfected on this class. Maybe you won't be the next reason.
I use hector for the voice I learn best in person, the issue is people take hector and then add on like 5 different things so at the end is it a really a hector strategy? I think people just post hector in PF to get hits and fill up only to change something while everyone is inside.
Hector strats is not bad, but the amount of people who wanted to shift existing party finder strats just because someone did a video of a different strat is fucked. Providing guides is in no way bad, but making the whole party finder shift to strats to Hector at the end of the day is not good just because they have a video on it and the others dont. Oh cool some week 1 raiders created a whole raid plan/raid strats for party finder, then you will find your time learning what party finder are up to invalidated because it will all be replaced by Hector strats, shit is demoralising to a degree.
I mean, unless that amount of people was entering non-hector pf groups and demanding to change to hector, that's not an issue. It doesn't matter if there are 99 hector groups up or 0, their existence is not relevant to someone who wants to do a different strat.
@@MyVanir I shouldve added that I was referring to the state of Materia Datacentre in Anabaseios
I did like 2000+ pulls of DSR before clearing it a month later. am i not qualified to talk about any part of it because i didnt clear it? :( people complaining about hector not clearing fights is so dumb lol
Don't blame anything on Hector, the problem is many people can't think for themselves and uses his guide verbatim.
RMMR is used to maximize the amount of positionals that both melees can hit. Since both Fusefield strats makes ppl find their place clockwise, if you do MMRR, at least 1 melee will lose a lot of positionals, cuz saving both True North casts for that part is usually not enough.
I agree that it doesn't matter that much, as long as ppl clarity what order they're using b4 the pull,
but as a melee, RMMR makes us comfier
That makes sense to me! I'll consider adding that in the future haha hopefully people don't have trouble adjusting. Prob doesn't make a difference in your average clear but that's an easy and free adjustment for a little more damage so why not haha
@@Sonicrida Here's another reason why people like RMMR, which is essentially R2M2M1R1 from North Clockwise, is that if the dps prepositioned to their clock spot, they are naturally already in the correct order and only need to shift left or right to find their respective fuses. when the entire fight involves staying at your clock spots a lot, this feels natural.
In comparison, in MMRR, the R2 whose clock spot is NW will now awkwardly have to position on the West side (in most cases).
I mean, of course I'm speaking from a DPS's perspective, but i can see why the nuance is lost on Tank/Healer because the order makes no difference for them. Really not a big deal, I'm fine doing either, but if i had to choose, RMMR is my preferred method.
Sry but why do you have to waste 2 True Norths for this mechanic? See the Problem is not the Order its people dont even know HOW this mechanic works. Even IF you play RRMM and DPS is on the second set you dont have to sit the whole 40 Seconds on your Clockspot. Just make sure you know WHEN you have to Detonate and WHERE you have to Detonate. Since week 1 our Melees never stood the whole Time on their Clockspot.
@@DantoriusD While yes, you don't have to sit on it for the full duration the difference is PF vs static so for PF putting the melees where they will most likely barely have to move to keep positionals is dramatically less risky than trusting them to get back to their spot in time and not clip somebody elses fuse if they have to cross over it. Especially when PF already has a history of being 2+ mechanics before whatever mechanic they claim to be on. When most of the discussion is about PF using an example from your static isn't that helpful.
@@DantoriusD True! I agree with that when u're comfy with the fight, but we're talking general PF here too. Most ppl who are following the guides perfectly are likely to be progging and will be seeking a clear. Just imagine the mental breakdown if someone step on a wrong fuse when seeking positionals after X member of your party being on the 20th pull + of the day~! LMAO
"I don't understand how RMMR and MMRR is different" - enough said, you just don't understand.
Hector knocked up my wife, stole my wallet, and ate my leftovers. So i swore never to use his guides. 😢
She is happier now than ever, that money is invested wisely and you were saved from eating those leftovers the day after and getting food poisoning.
Imho problem isn't Hector, is pf refusing to adapt to new, better strats bc Hector haven't made a video about said strats yet
Also, to be fair, Hector is not making an "thankless" job, UA-cam partner exist, and Hector guides have 500k+ views
Hector is a fantastic guide maker for week 1. The way he explains the mechanics with a visual education style is fantastic for learning. Even if i think some of his strats are wack af sometimes in comparison to other strats, I still appreciate that week one knowledge moving forward.
Hector has helped me through criterion and explains mechanics very well. Bless you Hector wherever you are ✨
I actually had to make my own strats for Act 2 in P4S because I'm color blind and I couldn't see the "purple" orb at all. It looked clear to me, so my strats for Act 2 are letter based and priority based for Melee (cw/ccw)
Hector saved Party Finder, and made it actually tolerable. In doing this he contributed a great deal to the level of activity in savage raiding in general. He is amazing and we appreciate his guides alot!!
The only added value I see to doing RMMR for fusefield is the first fuse of each set is usually just outside melee range, which can make getting uptime tricky. Which, especially during the first week or two when it's a harsh DPS check, can make or break the pull. At the same time, if you're a week1 clear kinda person, you can more than likely work around that and make the pull work.
How is getting uptime tricky, literally just pop it between gcds. Even if I needed to do two passes on monk gcd, I still got it before the gcd was up.
I think the issues lies for the largest part by far with the mentality of the raiderbase. They dont want to learn, they want to clear. Preferably yesterday. In my observations it is like a lot are stuck with the idea that only good raiders clear a tier fast, so they are taking shortcuts. And what better shortcut than a cookiecutter strat provided by someone with a history of providing strats that can get you the clear without using a single braincell? Now currently I see a lot of crao flying around about pheromones1 with mariokart versus static spots strat. Which is absolutely hilarious since it seems to boil down to people not wanting to look at&learn the mech, resulting in them blindingly trustin and following the tank, and then blame tank for pulling wrong during mariokart. The comfortzone trap they set up for themselves springs and people are disturbingly okay with it.
I remember noping out of mario karting and just mirroring the group when I decided to try to play blm in m2s. The complaints stopped after the 3rd pull in a row when half the group got slammed by a bee that was baited by the group, simply because they didn't pay attention, while I was free to plant my roots in the ground.
The same baits thing drives me crazy because in week 1 that was what I was doing and wanted to do in my group, but I had people ragequitting calling it stupid etc.
And when I asked them why because it's literally easier and asked them what's harder about it they could never give an answer it was just '' ugh... It's different ''.
Low and behold, few weeks later Hector updates his guide with same baits and suddenly it's now becoming the pf norm lol...
Can only say we did same baits week one after I saw it in a random video. Otherwise Hector. We had people that didn't get it somehow. But that was a general issue with the Crossing mechanic. But notbody ragequit on us because we searched for same baits
This raid tier is so accessible evne I started it. If I didn'T know of Hector I wouldn't have attempted Thordan, Valigar or Zoraal Ja. He's the #1 Reason why I'm finally able to play this content, and I leveled up massively using the log analysis in a way that allows me to look and see what I did wrong.
I'll look at more guides for M3S and see what I can do in osme other situations to adjust e.g. tho.
M1S biggest Problem is that people are swearing on TN and no one wants to adjust even if slightly out of position like it's a religion.
But... how's that Hectors fault? For suggesting TN? he even in the video says if you wanna TN it you have to always be stingy... better blame a Lalafell Guide maker than your own inadequacy x)
The problem with people being unable to let go of TN is that only melee players are actively encouraged to make it a habit to actually look at the boss sometimes and thus every other role is simply incapable of using the ole Mark I Eyeball to know where to go for their position. Nevermind that the boss's hitbox is way smaller and easier to figure out the direction of than looking around to find the north waymark and orient yourself to your direction.
I'm primarily a learn by doing type of guy, so nothing beats getting out there and progging over and over again.
Secondarily, I learn best by watching videos. I know there are other guide makers out there like Rinon and Mizzteq, and I'm sure they have their own advantages or disadvantages. Lord knows I watched a lot of Mizzteq when coming up through the MSQ story and trials as a sprout. However in my view, Hector has become a staple for the video guides, and to me it is the easiest way to--at the very least, get a rundown of the fight and how to resolve mechanics some ways. I am very thankful for his guides as an inexperienced raider and has helped make the Savage raids so much easier.
The last thing I ever want to do is read some pastebin, document, page, or otherwise to learn the fight, because that is not how I learn effectively. I won't deny other strats if it is ever needed in PF, but that's only if I know the fight enough to the point where I can adjust for other strats, rather than learning a different one from the start.
I can read a raid plan. I can perform a strat I've never done before. If you learn the mechanic and not the strat, it doesn't matter what people put in their description. Personally, I love it when Hector finally comes out. It unites PF under one plan. If better strats comes out? As this video points out, Hector will release a follow-up video.
I agree that people who blindly follow Hector word for word are a problem. But so are the people who complain about him, lol. They themselves also tend to follow one strat, so when Hector comes out and forces them out of their comfort zone, suddenly it's Hector's fault.
but that's exactly the opposite that hector causes. His over-reliance on arena relative positions just makes it so ppl don't need to understand what is happening but just go to marked spots like bots and pray for the best. This kind of approach legitimately teaches players not to learn mechanics and makes them unable to deal with whatever unexpected issue may come up during a fight.
People also complain about him profitting out of other people's strats.
But honestly, this argument falls flat when you don't NEED TO PAY TO WATCH HIS GUIDES.
It's just a patreon.
also it's literally the community's strats, nobody cares who came up with them, all anyone cares about is if they work or not - anyone who claims ownership over a strat is being a clout goblin with a massive ego
Hector has the BEST and easy to understand guides. I've tried others but Hector diagrams are the best and no one comes close. The people who hate on hector have brain damage
The annoying parts about hector guides is that they are so often slight variations on what pf was already doing. For example, hector m4s vs EU pf m4s is almost exactly the same except the stacks are arranged differently for ee2 and hector has midnight sabbath pairs rotate ccw where pf has them rotate cw.
The annoying part is that they are so similar that people will be confusing the two all tier and there will always be that one guy who rotates the opposite way or stacks differently and wastes everyones time.
I've heard a lot of raiders in my fc complain about the hector M3S strats and I could honestly never figure out why. As a healer, I like that I can just point my camera north and go to the same spots every time for fuse down
RMMR helps melee get positionals. Otherwise they function identically.
melees with brains help get positionals. you dont need to be on your fuse until you need to pop it, so a good melee will never need to use more than 1 TN, and even then its only for 1-2 gcds. depending on where they are in the rotation its not even always needed
So i usually do a lot of a tier before hector guides release. People are confused on which strats to use and his strats are generally less optimized than what is already out there. The only complaint i have towards him is to look at 2-3 guides (most used for other datacenters) and at least pick the best ones.
For me, there is no benefit for these guides. The only thing it does for me: It makes it harder to clear. I wish he took those extra "5 mins" to look through different strats and choose the best week 1 strat, because it feels bad having the majority of doing shitty strats after using better ones the week prior.
It's not that he uses early strats, it's that he sometimes doesn't seem to understand the strats or just gets them wrong in a hurry to get his video out. Example: M2S defamations were on clockspots, in his video he puts supports on DPS clockspots and DPS on support clockspots.
I think the intent behind RMMR Fusefield is to increase the likelihood of a melee getting a fuse they can hit positionals on. Dunno what the odds are, but it's definitely higher than MMRR.
we go into that mech with two stacks of true north lol, if it's actually the melees who are responsible for that strat, that is crazy when TN is so abundant and positional damage barely even matters anyway especially with DPS checks so low
@kirigherkins Yeah, I mean it's also possible to hit positionals by leaving your spot after you pop your fuse, so long as you don't hit anyone else's. That said, I've never seen a PFer brave enough to leave their fuse after detonation either. I don't think RMMR is a significant gain worth doing outside of a static full of people chasing those miniscule optimizations. All my group did was do RRMM for popping instead so that melee don't have to leave max melee.
Players in jp server usually use hector vid for mechanic explanation only as we anonymously agreed to use game8 or nekumaru guide
The trouble isn't the people making the guides............It's the community itself.
It's the way it's always been.
I can understand if you disagree with one of his strategies, but like... just use whatever strat you think suits your group best. Make your own PF with it. If it catches on, maybe less people will use the Hector strat. Or join a static that doesn't strictly adhere to a single guide. The static I run uses mostly Hector/PF strats, but we do things differently if someone hears about a better strategy, or if it suits our group better.
Anyone and everyone making guides is appreciated, although I will say there are still some things that do bother me about Hector's guides, and the biggest factor of that is indecisiveness. I understand it's supposed to give people options, but most groups (especially in PF) need a "strict" guideline to follow. This was a pretty apparent issue in the previous tier, when groups would argue about how to resolve Limit Cut in P9S, because Hector encouraged people to use "whichever strat they prefer." Just from personal experience, I find it works better to simply provide the strat you as a guide maker find best - if a group doesn't like it, they will adjust anyway.
An issue I had this tier specifically was that other creators had guides released days before his, and him adding/suggesting strats for some mechanics that felt like they were only added so there was something "new" in the video. Two examples coming to my mind are the kbm towers in m3s, and the odd mustard bomb strat in m4s. It's perfectly fine to have "different" strats (and good, actually. That should be the point of multiple guides), but those two especially felt like they overcomplicated very simple mechanics with no honest benefit. There's no need to reinvent the wheel "for the sake of it."
That being said, my personal approach is to try and avoid the guides if I don't like the strats. The people here in the comments who are insulting players that don't love Hector's strats should probably take just a moment to think about the fact that they're doing the exact same thing they're criticizing others for.
I know its a bit off topic but you said these savages were very easy compared to the others. As someone who has never attempted doing one before is this set doable?
people always say there are better strats/guide makers but never actually say who lol. why? because its objective thus doesn’t matter at all. You said the issue yourself, its because people learn how to move according to a info graph and not the actual mechanic. The moment something isnt the exact permutation used in a guide people fail mechanics. People don’t learn the how and why or just suck at learning in general. FF guides isn’t making people bad, people are just victim of the american education system.
Personally always preferred Mizzteq's guides, the ways she she explained things just hit my brain better for some reason, and she doesn't really waste time. Hector also works, I understand him most of the time, but iunno I definitely felt his strats were silly sometimes
I think that him posting alternative strats on a separate video that most people won't see may not be very effective. I think it would be cool to see him make an updated guide for the fight and put "OUTDATED" at the start of his old week 1/2 guides so that people will go look for his new one with better and updated strats.
That would be a reasonable compromise between people who like the consistency of having one guide to follow and the people who want better strats after week 1. The expectation would be use Hector guides, but don't use the outdated ones.
He usually adds links to the new videos in a pinned comment or the video description. FF14 players being illiterate is not his fault.
@@MyVanir You trying to insult others by calling them illiterate is ironic considering that you completely missed the point of what I said. Without any indication that there is an update, people won't even know to look for any supplemental resources that he might provide through links, let alone in a pinned comment. If you've been around the internet for any amount of time, you also should understand that people are significantly less likely to click on links and that this is an ineffective bandaid fix. Suggesting otherwise is disingenuous.
The M3 pastebin strats solve the majority of the mechs with g1/g2 in mind, so RMMR with snake prios make more sense with congruity.
Also, MMRR fucks over at least 1 melee with positionals since it pretty much guarantees at least 1 melee will not get neither flank nor rear positionals
Eh, I am m1 in my group and when I can be arsed to care, I just take note where I need to be, chill in positional-land and go there shortly before my turn to pop, 10 seconds of true north is enough to cover you if you know what you are doing there.
@@MyVanir but why do all that when you can just have a better strategy for literally zero cost and effort. You do you, but what you described is the definition of an un-optimized strat.
As someone who raids on Crystal, I’ve never seen a reference to pastebin strats. Is that an Aether thing?
It's a week 1 thing. They start to phase out once guide makers come out with a guide unless someone wants to stick with the pastebin strats.
Hot take:
There are pretty good benefits to PF using a singular strat. Everyone is on the same page, so PF PUGs can just get going without having to explain mechanics and positions. Having a singular strategy also allows for people to build up muscle memory to optimize their rotations for fights instead of having to adjust to each individual party's preferred strats. And we all know how incapable most people seem to be with reading PF descriptions, so having a singular strategy for PF removes that issue entirely. And that last one is likely the biggest reason one strategy/guide becomes so prevalent in PF, as it removes the guesswork of which strategy will be used.
ngl, it is likely that the people that are complaining about Hector strats becoming so prevalent are the ones that do not need them to begin with, so it can also come off as an elitist mindset. As for my own personal experience, I'm autistic. Having a routine, or in this case, a single strategy to follow, is how I play at my best. I like to know why I am doing things given my natural curosity, but the more important thing is knowing what I am to do (and lets be real, the only why you really need to know is "if you mess up you wipe the party." the minutiae of mechanics just muddies the waters imo. not wiping the party should be motivation enough). So I greatly benefit from one strategy becoming prominent in PF, as it allows me to join any group in PF and perform my best.
until the day when NA pf isnt a steaming pile of shit this won't really be that hot of a take. jp has only 1 set of strats (game8 for the native jp players and tuufless for the en players, and 90% of what tuufless ends up using is game8 anyway) and while there are plenty of pf terrorists and people who do the strats wrong, there are never discussions of what strat to use. half the time people don't even need to specifiy strats in the pf description and can just put 'normal strats' or even not mention strats, then see nobody misunderstand and try something else.
Yeah I don’t hate the guy but people are so latched to his guides it’s wild. Like, M3S has become a hellhole of people just assuming the mechanics so I have to go “Aight how we resolving X Y and Z?”
Though tbf the amount of times in pf I see. “Can I be R1? I only know R1” when it literally makes 0 difference in the fights
It can make a difference on spreads - if you went in one specific direction for spreads every time in prog and a buncha reclears, being told to go the other way cold turkey has a high chance of habit forcing you into the wrong direction and causing at least some deaths in most cases. And no, "just don't do that" is a shit argument. The whole game is built on muscle memory and habit for 95% of endgame mechanics. Just like you would forget and go back to regular breathing if told to breathe in through the right nostril and out through the left because normal functioning humans are not manual breathers.
I think the real question is, if people hate his strats so much, why don't they provide a better alternative?
I hate to say it, but I feel people don't understand how annoying pastebins can be, and how unclear they are. When I was progging DSR, I honestly fucking hated the Pastebins because the quality for each phase was so wildly inconsistent. You'd go from someone with 29 slides and paragraphs with clear visuals explaining every mechanic, to someone fitting a phase in 12 slides and writing a sentence for each.
The Reason people like Hectors strats is they're presented in a clear, understandable way with a pretty high quality video, and its on a platform everyone is familiar and comfortable using to find.
Ultimately, if there was a better alternative, people would use it, but there isn't, so we use Hector. I'm glad he makes the content, because its much better then the alternatives currently available.
Personally I use a modified Hector for p9s and keep as off tank (So it would tech be Same partners strat)
Basically I eat both Ascendant fists
For your next video tackle the question, "Are Mizzteq's bad pun's in her videos ruining party finder?"
That would be just as dumb as people blaming Hector. . .
But then again people will bitch and complain regardless no fucking matter what. People should be grateful that someone even took the time and effort to help the ungrateful people that complain and then STILL use theirs guides.
Love the Hector Guides. Whole FC relies on them for extremes and savage.
I sometimes look at ingame footage as well because it helps to see how fast things really are, but honestly, for me, no other guide maker reaches the quality of Hector.
And i don't mean strats, idc about those at all in this context.
Hector explains the mechanics in voice, has a party list with debuffs, their duration, has the casts (with name) going off and text comments when you should remember something (In -> Out).
I'm not hating on others or anything, i just don't watch them as a result, since just showing ingame footage with a random, as in unknown to me, UI layout and a big textbox somewhere explaining what to do isn't as easy to digest. And if I am given the choice I will watch Hector and adapt to whatever better strats emerge, that often get their own short guides from him anyway.
And I would agree. Having one or two prominent strats is way better than having 5 completely different ones. Even just figuring out what exactly is different between two strats gets annoying. Nevermind 5.
I just wish people wouldn't join a Hector (or QO5 or whatever) >reclear
hate it , love it , its the #1 week first guides.
The problem is that people rely 100% on ONLY the guide and markers. Even just varying them from let's say A to 1 and people can't do anything, and I mean anything, correct anymore
Hector tries his best to be one of the first out which causes slight inaccuracies. Aside from that, I don't have a problem with Hector guides.
The main problem is some people getting overconfident along with not realizing their own mistakes. Back in p12s someone I knew kept messing up caloric 1, they never accepted help and whenever I tried to suggest anything they always said "I've watched hector's guide so many times so I'm clear ready".
ffxiv raiders are such babies, they can literally make their own party and specify what strat they want to use, but instead they blame others for using the strat they like.
To be fair, they are also stupid enough to join a pf asking for a strat they don't like and then bitch when you refuse to change the strat to what they want, so making your own party doesn't always work.
Our static mainly uses hector but we have modified some of the strats here or there. I think it's so interesting that people don't seem to care for the strats when most of the time the strats are kind of Self Evident if you've done enough raiding. Bosses can really only do so many things to damage you or switch you up; and a lot of the time the mechanics that you see them do are just mechanics from other fights that have been tweaked and repackaged in some way or another.
Like M2S Rotten Heart is just P4S Curtain Call with a different set of timers and movements.
I honestly don't think Hector is the problem, before Hector guides I would often use Miztech for everything, it's not really the guide maker it's the guide watcher. I think that the fact that Savage has become a lot more accessible has created a group of players who have rigid ways of doing things either because they don't have the experience or they just don't like change. And I'll be so real I was kind of the same way before I started playing in Savage. But I've grown and gotten better not only as I've played the different tiers but as I started exploring the different roles as well.
rmmr is more likely to put melee near the rear/flank line for the boss. it is a uptime strat.
okay, and uh, you do realize you dont *need* to be standing on your fuse the entire time, no? Heck, if DPS are short fuse and m1 is first explostion they can go behind the boss for the rest of the mechanic having only used 1 True north
Personally I'm the opposite of what everyone complains about. Hector just explains so much better than a text dump from non-voices videos. I watch hector guide once and understand more than an hour of studying on text based guides like toolbox
The issue is that Hector took a lot from NA, and here in EU, we were doing VERY different things, especially in M4S, to the point that mechanics will be resolved all the way around, Mustard Bomb, or made no sense in a PF setting, extra risk added for no reason at all in spreads by making partnered jobs be far appart(Tanks, Healers, Rangeds, Melees)
And he has bad rep over here due to this
in EU m4s, apart from mustard bomb and EE2, everything is basically the same but with different positions, which makes it annoying to swap between hector and raidplan, because muscle memory will wipe you. Unlike in the video said, that most people will go on with hector, there seems to be a 50/50 divide, that will probably not mix.
@@randomaether Bad rep? Where? Not on Light (EU). Last tier was mostly Hector. Everyone I raid with regularly refers to hector. In no time at all groups started searching for hector and now the "new guide" is at a 50/50 on M4S. Given that groups usually don't change strat and the late guide has to fight a uphill battle because of that, thats a pretty huge adoption rate. Not even mentioning M1-3 where 90% seem to go with Hector with maybe an alteration on a single mechanic like fixed defams on m2. To the point if they don't specify which guide to check.. its probably hector.
Sorry, with no further context I have no idea where any more risk is added using Hectors M4S.
There's partners In EE1+2 but there's enough time and spread/partner doesn't overlap so keeping pairs together isn't important. I agree that EE2 might be easier in the raidplan cause of shorter ways since you can kinda run north/south as supp/dps and adjust from there. Hector you need to check quickly to run from the explosions to either north or south as support and adjusting likely will kill the dps mid, so a sacrifice is better.
Mustard is so much better with Hector imo. I had some raidplan people trying to suicide by winging where they run after exchanging debuffs and almost ending up in my explosions because of that. Twice. I had to adjust further back twice cause the tank didn't go to his empty spot and instead stacked between healers.
Midnight has partners, but the splits are the same just differ where the groups go and rotate.
Autocad is the same, tho towers cannot really be considered partners.
Lines idk how they are in raidplan but hectors are business as usual. meele front. group 1 left.
So yeah.. i need clarification on the extra risk.
Are you on Chaos? Is it actually different there?
@@SayuIchino one raids on chaos. The retarded choice to allow data center travel killed raiding in most data centers all over the world.
I will say, however in the context of people not liking hector I have seen a lot of people not follow the hector guide completely. People will put hector down then change how they handle a certain mechanic, like how the tethers in M1S were dealt with before he added that update video. No one did it the hector way and people in fact made fun of it in pf.
I will also say a lot of people in pf often say the fight is ruined now after hector releases a guide because the drones will follow it completely. I saw this multiple times in pf chat while waiting for a healer, everyone would talk shit about the hector strats but say they have to start doing it now because it'll become standard.
I do think hector's guides are pretty bad in a static setting but in pf they're fine because they're easy to follow. It's the curse of MMOs, everyone goes for the most accessible resource to win. Nobody tries to make their own build with the gear they just follow the BiS guide on the balance it's just that hector is now the raid guide people just follow. People tend to forget that it didn't start with hector anyway, Mr Happy built his career by being the Hector of ARR-SB
@@christhagod > " People will put hector down then change how they handle a certain mechanic, like how the tethers in M1S were dealt with before he added that update video. No one did it the hector way and people in fact made fun of it in pf. "
People who can't do fights without a guide telling them what to do in details are mocking a guy because of one strat on one mechanic while using this guy's guide anyway for the rest of the fight. The irony.
I hate a lot of Hectors guides, but I don''t blame HIM for their prominent use. If anything its a testament to how well he speaks, explains and animates his guides. The strats he presents in them are explained clearly and understood by the majority. It's just unfortunate that the strats he chooses to present are often terrible, or simply leave a lot of room for improvement left on the table. There are even some where just a little bit of extra thinking could provide an obvious improvement as such I am glad he's started doing mini-guides for revising some mechanics when better strats emerge from those realizations - but this now also poses a problem with how to communicate which strats to use in PF when majority just say "Hector strat" or whatever, so like, is that base Hector, using any of the supplements, if so which? It can become messy.
In an ideal world Hector would take down videos with incorrect, or outdated strats when improvements come along and upload a revision to the guide as a whole. But this would be more work and the guy is already doing his part as a week
one guide maker - for better or for worse.
I mean he straight up tells people to not put "Hector Strats" in their pf descriptions, because people have told HECTOR HIMSELF that they're using hector strats in pf and then not clarified the actual strat being used. He releases week one guides, with a clear disclaimer that strategies will change over time, he releases updated guides going over the new strategies, the old strategies are still viable, and some statics may find it easier to continue using them rather than learning new ones, and/or use them to explain the fights to newer people they bring in, taking the guides down when they become "outdated" (they aren't outdated, he's never claimed they're the end all be all or the definitive PF strat) would cause problems for people who WANT to continue doing the fight that way and now need to teach all the strategies they know for each mechanic instead of just linking a video.
I get the frustration, but the problem is not hector, or his guides, it is people who are stubborn, inflexible, and rude in pf. They would keep doing this with or without his guides. Do we just go down the hit list of killing every guide channel, raid plan maker, etc. in the community until we don't have any left as these problematic players just jump to the next set of easy to understand guides after the community burns down the last one? At the end of it all, these players will still exist making your pf experience a nightmare, but there will be even less people in pf who even so much as vaguely understand the fight. Annoying players existed before Hector, and they will exist after Hector, and nothing hector does will change these players because their behavior has nothing to do with the person making the guides they use or the guides they use themselves
One of the things I actually really appreciate about his guides is that he explains the mechanics as well as how he suggests to resolve them. For me, understanding the mechanic helps to adjust if someone messes something up or potentially save the group from a wipe if someone doesn't quite make it to the right spot.
Very true, but tbh I usually don't see just "hector" pfs- they often include things where there is choice. Like Normal Towers on M3. Same Baits M1. Starvy MTTT m1. Autocad etc. etc. is that different on your dc?
My problem honestly isn't Hector, it's the people that push Hector and only Hector. I personally don't understand the cult following for Hector, there are other content creators that make guides earlier than Hector and are better quality than Hector (not rushed) but they don't get the same recognition.
Because Hector is established since a whole Expansion and got this "Shitstorm" only for this current Raidtier. His Guides worked fine for Endwalker. Also he has a really calm Voice,Explaines the Mechanics WHAT they actually do and hes using a Raidplaner Graphic instead of ingame PoV. I really like Yukizuri but he Showing the Mechanic in every possible Outcome not only makes his Videos way longer but way more Confusing especially when you have Prog Footage with dead people so the mechanic was played by someone who wasnt intentional get hit by it.
Starting in P1S and P2S i tried many guides before, and they all have been difficult to understand, until i saw Hector guides which were slow paced with great visuals.
Now, after hearing the hate, i came to yukizuri M2S guide for a change, and i would still say that the pace (and lack of commentary) makes me unable to take the info in one or even two takes.
Hector might not offer the best strats, but he explains them the best (he and raidplans ofc)
yeah there is nothing wrong with hector, just people blindly using hector only, even when there is some much easier optimizations developed weeks later. I think instead of hector its better to post ”same bait, dps first, tn, thd, starvy mttt”
@@morvereth yea, hector even says not to say "hector strats" in your description and actually say the strat. as he uploads mini-guides to describe multiple strats for resolving the same mechanic, just saying "hector" doesn't even make sense
I think his raidplan format makes mechanics clear and easy to understand for a lot of players. The presentation is excellent for visualization.
The problem with pf, is they get stuck in their ways and refuse for whatever reason to budge from the initial strategy even though in plain English it states this is a WEEK ONE STRAT, better ones can come out. I saw the same thing happen during E8S with the infamous ilya strategy for Light rampart. IYKYK. The better strat was Bowtie strat but for whatever reason, PF being the stubborn beast it is refused to adopt it because the ilya strat came out first. I think it comes down to the simple fact that PF thinks it ain't broke so why optimize it, which I guess when you've done it for x amount of weeks 1 way and doing the new one essentially means "reprogging" PF doesn't have the patience for that.
I mean hector guides are pretty much Pastebin with a slight of alteration. If you know the other, its easier to adjust on the either. Not unless theres a 3rd or 4th guide you just heard of then everything goes haywire 😂
No, he's not the problem. Do the strats help clear? Yes. Plain and simple, his guides help. They may not be optimized, but they're easy to follow and give a guideline when trying to clear.
I use Hector guides, they're good. But sometimes Hector doesn't have the approach or mindset of trying to have the optimal or consistent placement of players in his guide and it's clear from this tier's set of guides. M3S with the fuse placement is an example of this, we don't have R1 look North, we have R1 and R2 stay on their respective West/East sides for better consistency.
Fortunately, I am in a static so we can swap this around to be more optimal.
However, it's ultimately on the PF. As you said, they need to learn WHY they are doing something. Another issue is then expecting PF to say:
'Hector guide, except for.....' and trying to list out and explain the variations, having people adjust to them, wiping, players leaving after maybe 3 pulls, then finding replacements to explain it ALLLLLL over again.
Hector's guides do leave a BIT to be desired but overall, they're pretty good. Personally, I use them to understand the mechanics and why, where, and when we move. I type up the boss rotation, the type of action, and how to resolve it so I can understand it. Doing that, using the Hector guide as a reference and any POVs (like MrHappy) to get a better image of mechanics and how to resolve them.
Lmao as if people in pf can even do a fight without a guide. Unless you are in a static that unanimously agrees to create their own strats (which is less than 1% of actual statics) nobody creates their own strats.
Honestly the biggest issue is the number of people who see guides in general as hard and fast rules you MUST follow to clear a fight. They are Guidelines, not requirements, the vast majority of mechanics can be resolved in multiple way, find the way that is right for you and your group
Except this is talking about pf, there is no "you and your group", no one is going to find The One Strat for the specific combination of people in any given party finder.
The main thing that I dislike about the prevalence of Hector guides is that it's completely deleted macros from EU PF culture.
This creates so many problems with people not reading the PF description that says Yuki / Rinon / a specific raidplan, assuming hector strats, going to the wrong spot for a mechanic and then killing people and blaming someone else.
Pre-Abyssos, when EU was less reliant on Hector's guides, this happened a lot less because a macro would be posted after loading into the instance and it was pretty much impossible for there to be any confusion.
This issue exist the other way around as well. We did Hector M4S and got plenty of raidplan people unable to read the description... sometimes it really feels like its not worth writing there. Sometimes they fail to notice even if you write your strat in chat before loading into the instance.
But I also wanna mention: I saw plenty of macros last tier. I had one for every fight pretty sure.
This tier not so much. We created our own because of the above issue with raidplan people in hector groups. But I also didn't find a reddit post or similar that collected raidplans and macros in contrast to last tier.
I'm sure this video is good but there's 0 need to watch it because this whole situation is so pointless. Blaming a creator for the actions of people you meet in game is stupid. Hating the band because the fans are insufferable sometimes makes as much sense as this. If there is a shortcoming in the person using Hector's strats, the onus of guilt is on that person. Not Hector. People trying to shift blame onto him are socially inept.
people used to hold up MTQ and Happy as the raidguide makers multiple expansions ago. Happy made one video where he showed a bad strat, his own team stopped using that strat for week two and happy would say on stream "dont use 'happy strat' its bad. even happy himself doesnt use it!" and PF decided to continue using happy strat and hating on happy because it sucked. so he stopped making guides!
MTQ had some real life things happening i believe and stopped making guides, but also a lot of her guides would have her explaining how to survive something, and then on screen all you see is her whole team exploding in the colorful chaos of mechanics and she walks away with paladin invuln or just tank privilege. they were only alright for learning a fight, and you had to really pay attention to learn from her.
other guide makers like ilya or xeno would have their guides be twice as long or longer than anyone else, and when youre already in PF trying to understand what you just died to, its an absolute pain in the ass to find the mechanic in their videos and see how they solve it.
Happy tried to keep it quick because he knew that struggle. Hector does it better, but Joonbob is the king of this. unfortunately Joonbobs guides take months to make, the tier is over before all his guides are out.
Hector isnt the problem, you explained that very well.
problem is that ffxiv players just suck at the game.