- cant react to landmine/windlass - cant study my opponent movements/build/strategy - cant rotate or use map knowledge - can W key - can camp/gank/third party more what a healthy idea to try to copy a popular military sim!
Most people want low TTK but they want it as an exception rather than the norm-A double headshot from a ranger, or a cheeky powerful and hard to use skill..... Low TTK as a baseline is a terrible idea when the systems of skill expression are not fully fleshed out.
It needs a healthy balance. Before this patch barb could headshot up to 5x in HR with a felling axe and not kill a fighter Now im one shotting everyone no matter what. Im not sure why they cant figure out that a two hand should be 2 headshots or 3 to 5 body shots. A one hand should be a few wxtra swings from a 2h.
fast ttk sucks hard. This is not a shooter, this is a fighting game, fights need to be longer, multiple dodges blocks hits to finally get the kill feels more rewarding, low ttk promotes camping, 3rd party and rat gameplay. weve known this for a long time. Even in BR games thats the case, compare Apex legends and its time to kill with pubg, apex fights are so much mroe intense and dynamic, sure the movement is a part of that but the ttk is a huge factor, in and out, heal and go back in, push and retreat.
@@subjectdelta5348 Agreed. Right now, there's much less skil expression than before. Everyone seems to agree, except (surprise surprise) Rangers, Wizards, Barbs.
game was the most balance it ever was before before this patch all that was need was true dmg to be turned down bow should not be able to just sit a angle with a arrow drawn back and more static mr on armor across the board would have been peak
ROFL, no, no and no, the game has literally never been balanced, ever! they Devs have said repeatedly they are not focused on balance yet ffs... Only one on cack is you...
@ParadoxISPower yes yes you and your dozen friends who think the patch is good will have lots of fun playing alone when it kills the game trying to make it a battle royal
Loot buff brought TONS of people back into the game. Some of my friends' most fun runs ever, people who've never even put on full epic+ before. It felt amazing ignoring blue after blue in normals, and it doesn't do a damn thing to lower the value of clearly good rare drops/craftables.
I understand what you mean and I'm noticing benefits of this as well. I just think maybe there's a middle ground where gear is still closer in stats between each quality tier, but there's still a point to searching for bis or legendaries etc. I don't like that crafted gear is the best.
The game feels better than it ever has. Things feel a lot more balanced (aside obviously from Barbarian but a Fighter could probably do what they're doing, better) and engaging. Gear fear is gone, so a lot of people who have honed their skills in the balanced 1v1s of
@@duncangreywaterstop the CAP. Any one of those "pros" will beat the sh1t out of you even if they were full naked and playing with 1 hand. They basicly said: Oh you been grinding all that loot for days and days ? Good, now throw it on the garbage because its basicly useless now. You dont do that, specially at the middle of the season. Oh but the game is beta, alpha, whatever they call it nowadays! Yes, and its been like that for 2 years now. Thats a good excuse for lazyness and incompetence, nothing else. There are people with over 2000 hours on this game, its more than fair that they should be rewarded for their grind.
@@duncangreywater i already didnt have gear fear after the loot buffs. Purples dropped like candy. the only difference is i was happily looting back then. now i am not. Nothing changed except how enjoyable looting is. I had epic equivelant gear already with minimal effort but it felt rewarding. Now it doesnt
It's kind of wild that as soon as SDF takes hard charge of the game and starts implementing his dream for the game, he immediately releases one of the worst received patches in a long time.
@@NaderinZim Yeah, let's casually forget all good he did to create the game that we all are here for in the first place. Can you check yourself? Can we think how many games die before reaching a quarter of what DnD already had? Can you really weight all emotions this game gave to you unbiased and still say all SDF ever had in his mind was bad? Idk, man. I think it's a lot of pressure to do a dream project with a substantial audience the right way for everyone. I think his intentions are good, I'm inclined to give him the right to make mistakes, the game can't became really good otherwise. Curious what his next step might be ).
@@shipso6116 The only good idea he ever had was to make a PVPVE first person dungeon crawler, that's it. He has no direction on how to balance the game, or even what the end goal is, every bad idea that was ever implemented on this game (low ttk, multiclass, ranger meta, rogue meta) was mainly his idea, you can literally trace those messages back on discord, and most of his team was against all of those ideas, so what does it say about him?
I have wanted nothing more than for SDF to be fired since the dawn of his first post. The man has been destroying this game for over a year and we've finally hit a tipping point. Let. Him. Go.
@@kyleyost1370 SDF is the main developer and the boss, i dont think he can get fired, and i persornally dont hate it that mutch, but this patch was terrible.
I think a better implementation of the baked in stats change would have been Poor: 2 base stat Common: 3 base stat, no rolls Uncommon: 3 base stat, 2 rolls Rare: 4 base stat, 2 rolls Epic: 4 base stat, 3 rolls Legendary: 5 base stat, 3 rolls Unique: 5 base stat, 4rolls Also armour/MR would scale very slowly between grades This way legendaries are only 2 times better than uncommon instead of being like 5X better like they were before As well as squishing weapon damage to match, so weapon damage tops out at legendary but gets an extra roll on unique, with common being brought up to uncommon from before. I understand that this would make base stat dependent classes such as wizard or Druid weak in low tier gear but they would need to be rebalanced to fit the new gear. Also nerf those new barbarian changes wtf, dude got like 5 buffs and also everyone is easier to one shot, crazy.
Was thinking the exact same thing- it flattens the gear diff a bit but still doesn't change the game enough to piss people off. But to be more realistic, the devs would approve more of this: [Rarity] [Base value], [random rolls] common: 2, 0 Uncommon 2, 1 Rare 3, 1 Epic 3, 2 Legendary 4, 2 Unique 5, 3
How can we as a community who don't design games come up with much much better balancing theory than the people who do it for a living. It's sad. Who knows what they're thinking over there
This change seems like it's just setting up for random modifier changes/reforge system. If the potential values of random modifies are increased on higher quality gear then the gear gap will return through the mods in a more refined way than it is now
I like this idea and thought similar myself. But not they have a tendency to make drastic changes, double warlock magic healing effectiveness, buff barb base strength by 25%, buff rage by 50%... like take it slow damn. Making legendaries go from BIS to literal pis compared to a green all in one go its just crazy
Playtest one player here. This is by far the most destructive patch I have witnessed. If you can queue up in a common squire kit and come within 10% dps/durability of a fully customized kit using uniques and frostlight, there is absolutely no incentive to do anything but exactly that. There is no longer any incentive to queue HR besides ap for demigod. There is absolutely no incentive in challenging yourself in PvE/bossing when harder content no longer equals stronger loot. Players will do missions to upgrade squire gear, put in MAYBE 100-200 hours of squire pvp, get bored and move on. On a personal note, my 200k gold arena kit I've spent all wipe working on was rendered essentially useless in a single patch.
Had a kit that was bis blue for rogue before patch lost to a squire kit barb in hr, stabbed him 3 times and died in a single bardiche hit. He still had half health
We rogues suffer sou much even if we dont play hide … hide alone is shit if you dont land clear 3 headshots (i run sttileto) + perfect kite -knifes crosbow
The loot buff alone already meant i had easy access to epic quality gear as a new player. They accidentally achieved the desired outcome in a fun natural way. Then followed it up with "The plan" which destroyed the whole system lmfao.
@partingofways the increased loot patch was the 2nd worst patch the game has ever seen behind this one. Finding 4 oranges a match in normals from regular chest and mini bosses, makes all other gear and content useless. Why loot marvelous chest or kill bosses or pvp or play HR if you can loot oak chests for legendaries?😂 neither of yall know what the game actually needs.
@@Odyssey636 Your comment is how I know you have no idea what you are talking about. Just because you have a chance at a legendary doesn’t mean you will always get on or if it will be good. Rolls still matter. You can easily find a rare or epic that has really good stats and that is worth using over a badly rolled legendary. Also, HR still significantly increased the loot rarity, same with bosses. Doing those 2 things increases your chances of finding a UNIQUE. If you did more than play normals for PVP, you would understand that I’m sure.
I am someone who until 2 weeks ago only used blue sets in high rollers. I have killed people much more geared than me. After the loot buffs i finally started running purple and even some legendaries because i had so many and it was easier to just play the game and die with them than to try and sell for gold. If i died i would zero to hero an inferno run and be largely ready to go again. maybe id have to fill in 1 or two items from the market but thats fine. I played the game a shitload looted a shitload and it felt like a fun rewarding gameplay loop. Even if i died in HR i knew it was easy to get again and it was fun to get again. I had epic equivelant items and better just by playing a tiny bit. Now i dont loot. I dont kill mobs i dont loot and i dont have fun. I still have epic quality items. i just didnt have to go get them myself. which is worse. I want a reason to play the game. i want progression. I had just started feeling confident enough to maybe use good gear. Now there is nothing to upgrade to or farm for. It is a call of duty lobby where i drop in with my premade kit and instead of fighting for 10min straight like COD i run around for 10min and spend max 30 seconds actually fighting.
This is what I was thinking. If you turn a corner and get one shot in Counter Strike, the time until your next fight is 15-30 seconds. If you turn a corner and get one shot in Dark and Darker that's 10+ minutes. It's going to get incredibly boring incredibly fast when there's no reward, no incentive, and ttk is so low yet time to your next chance at a fight is so long.
Yeah i mean your wrong about the top part tho. You shouldnt be able to run a single run of normal inferno and get full purples and oranges for HR. It actually makes gear just as useless as the current squire meta. Neither of these patches were good.
I just realized, if they get rid of random affixes, they could make enchanting and gem slots a thing. but until that time comes into play they need to keep random affixes lmao
Whats the point on playing the game then? You get your gear with the exact rolls you want, now what? You play 3-4 games and you will get bored, nothing else to do.
I really like the direction they're going from a pvp perspective. However I do agree that secondary stats need more flavor. I think legendary gear should be able to roll a pve damage. kinda like silver weapons with undead. Maybe they roll more damage to certain bosses. Maybe the roll def against certain bosses. Maybe the same for minor bosses and regular mobs. Also you have to remember they did mention sockets and gems. They prob should have waited until that was ready but this dev team likes to get data when things are fully implemented.
Dark and Darker is shot lol jk. I understand everyone having a knee jerk reaction to this (mostly hardcore players) but I think there some upsides to this patch. This patch also removed the fear in the play button, gear fear and removed the gear gap all together. Most people are able to fight and most fights will be "skill base". I honestly want to see where this patch goes. They need to balance somethings and bring barb back down abit. I also hear skinny pete likes this patch too so some hardcore players don't mind it. Right now I'm a casual for sure, I spend most of my time playing other fun extraction games ;P but it feels good that i can just join a game and not worry about such fears or issues because I don't grind 24/7. I don't want them to stop and change everything out back of panic because of the knee jerk reaction people are having. I wanna see where this road leads and go down this path, hell with some talent trees or stuff this could be good who knows.
Fun fact this is another nerf for druid as the maximum str you could achieve is down by a substantial amount. So where they struggled (HR) they are EVEN worse. Most of the druids I know have uninstalled and quit, myself included. RIP DaD, was fun.
That player base numbers and steam reviews going from Very good to Mixed really shows how good the patch was. 7k people in dungeon and 8k in lobby. Last time i saw those numbers were in the end of seasons, after ap grind is over
Hear me out.. How about they release stuff when it's ready and not treat the players like rat labs with something that doesn't work for possibly weeks They have test servers they didn't bother to use , it really wasn't ready for live
So your talking about changes which are not even in this patch. Gem features and socketing are not in this patch. So we might be "thinking short term about this update". But you aren't thinking about this update AT ALL, you're ignoring all the bad and in a fantasy world of possibilities that aren't even here to critique or judge yet.
This patch puts more emphasis on the skill and, while sill important, de-emphasizes the gear. The gear still matters. You get 4 random stat rolls on the legendary gear, and you have 10 pieces of the gear: head, chest, back, hands, legs, feet, ring1, ring2, neck, weapon1 - so that's like 40 more extra stats vs a player in Squire gear. It all adds up and provides a meaningful difference. For example, +3hp on 10 pieces of gear would net +30hp, +1.5% magical damage would net +15% magical damage, and +3% buff duration would net +30% if it's on all 10 pieces, etc. Having 4 such stat rolls on every piece, 40 extra stats, is an advantage. However, in contrast to how it was before this patch, no longer does a player with higher gs win a fight against a lower gs gear player by default. You can't just roll over players because you have 600+gs gear when they are 225gs. Make a mistake and you might die. So while the random stats do give you an advantage in a fight, you must still be a skilled player to win the fight. Gone are the days of being carried by the gear while playing like shit, or, to change the POV - the days of dying to a shitty player in a better gear. This patch makes the game more skill-based rather than loot/RTM based. Instead of the stat-checking players, you are now skill-checking them. A legendary kit in the hands of a skilled player will do wonders. A legendary kit in the hands of an unskilled player will be quickly lost. Similarly, a skilled player in commons can kill an unskilled player in legendaries. This patch brings the vision sdf had of a lower geared player being able to kill higher geared player though the sheer power of skill. It feels a bit bad to die so fast in this patch though. You die in 1-2 hits, instead of 2-4 hits like before - less chance to re-group or disengage and heal back up if you get jumped on.
Yeah I'm super confused on how people think we'll get more new players when you have people grinding for 14 hours a day getting BiS kits vs someone who is good at the game and put together a decent kit, but not an old 30k kit. Not to mention OnePegs comment about how a 2 stat legendary ring is now worthless and not even worthwhile to put up on the shop....which is borderline what we had anyway because so much high tier loot flooded the market that prices tanked hard. I mean the vast majority of legendary gear was around 100gold per piece(depending) before this update even dropped. My thing is that this feels like the loot update felt good because it benefited everyone that played, but this update hurts the people playing for 8 hours day, so they don't enjoy it now. This was always a PvP game for me. I enjoy the dungeoneering and getting loot, and nothing has really changed on that aspect except now you don't make as much gold as you could before, and you don't have as much as an advantage for playing a longer period of time vs. just being good at the game. I'd be fine with some tweaks, but shortening the top and bottom ends seems to have made fights way more enjoyable.
I agree, mainly ttk is too low, the change wouldve arrived VERY differently without the hp nerf. A lot of the frustration is also players that have grinded for their insane gear being fucked over by it, which i understand, but it has nothing to do with game balance, and is an argument of a different conversation than game balance.
@@theswamps6589 i think double max HP gear or double ms gear should not exist and these is the most meaningful balance change. Its too much stats pressed in one item.
I had a lot of saved up BIS legendary kits with max stats prior to wipe, I think it's fine other people get to play on a level playing field, just need to retune the classes that are busted because of this now
He left the game the first time they nuked gear lol all the weapon damage and all attributes to be fair it needed to go but this is fucking wild now @@devinland5160
Yeah it's a little petty that i'm feeling pretty vindicated, as I recall; I was arguing with you on your stream that this gear squish would be horrible for the game. Yet you said gear didn't matter...sometimes you don't realize what you're asking for until you get it.
I responded to another commenter about this. This is not a gear squish. This in essence eliminated gearing all together for several reasons. This is more drastic than I was arguing for then, if you go back and look. And yeah, you’re being petty
@@Onepeg this has definitely not removed gearing, think about having fully epic/legendary gear with 2-3 relevant rolls each compared to none, the difference is still MAJOR. up to 4/6 hp on every piece, phys power on every piece, phys bonus on every, dex/agi action speed on every piece etc. This still adds up to possibly 50-60 additional HP which is gigantic, 40-50% damage bonus with is gigantic, with agi or dex/ action speed rolls also about 3-5% movespeed and a ton of action speed (up to 30 ish i think) which is gigantic, and you can check multiple of those boxes. With good gear your power is still about 50% higher, with perfect gear more than that, how is that irellevant. I think you make good points but then you exagarate them immensely. I can agree that this is overboard, but i also think the gear stats were always very surface level and didnt really have any depth, they increased power, but did not really alter the gameplay (maybe action speed a little bit). I think what we really need for this change to make sense is more interesting stats, and a higher ttk.
Common armor ratings + -15 HP + Epic weapon damages is a total disaster, the TTK is literally on par with any modern Call of Duty right now. I think this is a disaster and they need to revert quite a few things and rebalance from the previous hotfix #68 baseline in a more incremental and healthier fashion.
I love barbarian as i am a barbarian main, but i realistically shouldn't be going from average 2-3 kills to 7-8 kills a game all of a sudden. The two hander, axe specialization and executioner combo with the rage buff allows over 100 damage, 170+ with headshot. it's actually ridiculous. Also the fact that pdr and health nerf didn't make it any better. We finna see barb nerfs real quick. Enjoy it while it lasts for a week lads.
You were just saying recently, something to the effect of, anyone that is against the loot overhaul and squashing loot disparity just enjoys out gearing people. As someone who enjoys the excitement of a loot based game feeling rewarding to loot, I’m glad you’re realizing the inherent flaw in making all gear the same. Sure fights feel like you have a chance even in base gear but you completely remove the thrill of delving deeper to loot. Kinda the whole point of the game. I guess some people have to feel it to get it.
Yeah i definitely understand the frustration. Hell, gear checking used to be so bad me and the guys would join with relatively good gear, grimsmiles etc. But a team with 50k sets each would roll right over you lmao. So a SLIGHT balance to higher end gear was in order.. but this is insane.. there's almost no reason to pick up things since they'll onlynbe slightly better than your green items lol. You can equip a ranger with 40 str and full true phys for a fraction of the price before and they will LITERALLY one shot even a well geared wizard due to hp nerfs.. and barbarians one shot people easily too
so I DID say that. I did NOT expect they were going to go this far with it, though. It's kinda over the top lol. IF it felt more balanced, I think I wouldn't have as much issue with it as I do. Right now the gear feels almost exactly the same regardless of tier. I was an advocate for "more normalization" but this feels almost like "complete normalization"
I think one of the the way to return some strength to quality loot is to have higher cap at modifiers, if u have green bow u get at best 2 awd. when u are holding legendary, ur weapon can get up to 5 or 6.
@@jestLipa thats true, i think it doesnt hold relevance to overall balance, but this is a big factor why its so poorly received, at the start of a season more people would be willing to give the overhaul a chance.
For me the gear hasn't even been relevant, idk if that makes me sound like a timmy or w/e but I'm a fighting game player, I'm here for the depth and the skill ceiling. I love a game that rewards knowledge and skill above rng and the gear changes allow that pretty well. Though I do agree that it feels like progression in terms of gear is non-existent now, I skip over green and blues in low lobbies now because like who gives a shit if it has a bad roll, it doesn't increase the base value anymore. I also think barb is a tad overtuned, it needs to be dialed back or everyone else needs to be slightly shoved forward. I feel like they're pushing the game away from the slow and clunky experience I originally thought was the intended vision of the devs, now it feels like they're hard leaning into it being more quick wit and overall skill-based combat exchanges. I only have about 400-500 hours in the game but I've owned it since it was first purchaseable and I've played a lot of games in my 34 years of life, I am hopeful there will be a followup patch that makes things more clear. right now it's just kinda silly to play around with tho. I've been playing druid all season for quests and it feels kinda whack rn cause everyone gets to feel really cool with the gear changes and I just get like... more spear and bear. If I try to stack AGI and play panther I'm gonna get onetapped by a barb and stop doing it lmao
I feel like the PvP in this game is not flushed out enough for the game to be PvP focused in the first place. Just play Chivalry 2 if you want a good PvP melee sword fighting game, because gear doesn’t matter in dark and darker anymore
Gear dif wasn't too bad to begin with if I'm being honest. Even if someone brought in bis I could still kill them if they played it wrong..now there is no gain in bossing, looting or killing players and the melee is very unsatisfying now
i still got gear diff last night.. :D wanted to try rondel fighter and load in HR.. first guy i see is another rondel fighter with better item rolls... gear diffed me big time. stab for stab his rolls win
@@ripperfisher182250 gear diff was extremely bad idk what youre talking about... The same gear in higher rarity and with better rolls culd make the difference between 98% ms and 30% pdr to 106% ms and 60% pdr, from 20 dmg per hit to 40 dmg per hit. from 120 hp to 180 hp. with those stat differences winning a fight is almost impossible, except for the very very very high skilled players.
You're just flat out wrong on "capping out at epic" for weapons and stuff. Melee weapons have tons of other modifiers that increase damage. Power, additional damage, physical damage bonus, armor pen, that's 4 just for damage, and it's not even including health yet. Casters can also get magic pen and magic damage bonus, and these work multiplicatively.
Almost true except I'm pretty sure casters can't roll magic pen because its a static stat on spellbooks & staffs. They could still roll magic power, magic pen, & magic damage bonus though
can you afford the gear that has 4 rolls that are not trash ? nothing changed except that mid gear is dead you either go full squire kit or 30k kit wich gives you the stats you need to make a difference
Just a thought tho. They rolled specific stats into "families" which can't roll multiples in the same family. I.e additional move speed and move speed bonus. So I'm not sure how they determined what's in what family. But it may only be 1 damage stat allowable. Not doubles
in terms of searching gear nothing change. You still wanna find legendaries with good affixes like before. Even before you might slot an purple over a legendary if the stats are better.
Go fight a sweaty guy with your new weapon then. I got like 30 or some thing Kills on High Roll today in like 4 games, ive never seen so many noobs on HR on my life. Most of them with "big new weapons". People are insanely bad at this game and this will only facilitate things for good players. Ill give it 1 week till players find out wasnt gear diff after all, it was always skill diff.
Noobs had good weapons last patch after the buffs. it was fun as fuck to loot the good shit and then send it HR. Now the good shit is in my squire. Which sounds great! now you can just send pvp right? but then you remember this is a dungeon diving looter. Not call of duty. And this patch pretty much made it a different game entirely and yall are confused why the community doesnt wanna play an entirely different game? like wtf?
I disagree with all the hate this update is receiving. The main issue with rust was it was promoting complete video game addiction. This game was doing the same exact thing with people grinding endlessly to get extreme bis legendary gear. Now this new update causes us to rely on skill and skill alone. I died with a 3k gold kit to an absolutely terrible player, he had 0 skill, but ended up being faster than me and one rapping my head because he had a 15k fighter kit. Now it’s skill only. I love the new update!!
only thing i can think of after seeing this is they plan to do a major rework/overhaul of stats and for them to do that they need clean slates (as in no extra gear stats) whether thats the case or not only time can really tell
I don't dislike it at all, however I am perplexed by the barbarian's buffs at this current time this early in the process. Played a couple matches earlier today and definitely noticed faster npc kills. Since the loot increase patch recently, I finally was able to get the rare weapons quest done, which gave me some weapons I never had before. Perhaps in some way, I can see that this patch makes gear more middle-ground and more focus on player skill instead of always relying on just the stats. The gear tiers seems more progressively "enhanced" by additional stat rolls, but would be nice if legendaries and uniques were a little more special..maybe maybe like randomized elemental damaging effects on them, like this legendary sword has fire damage in addition, and can cause burn effect per swing etc. Idk. Playing older rpgs, like the elder scrolls with some weapon enchants having different effects seem neat. Something to make at least some, or whatever, more cool. Maybe even have the effect show on the weapon visually also. Would be cool to see a armored cleric with a big maul that's on fire or whatever else.
and this is why players who havent completed 2 quests for the same vendor arent the ones the game should be balanced and tuned around. Yes people got gear checked if you watch any content or play the game at a mid level though you know that wasnt the case 70-80% of the time. it took skill to get the better gear in the first place did it not?
Nope it didn't. It took time. You could go into normals ruins cheese every mob, extract with 400g-800g treasures. Repeat it 10 times - now you got the kit. I'll say it's not a very fun game experience)
@@idkidc8429 its should not be balanced around the lowest end of players, but also not around the highest end of players. It should be balanced around the higher middle. They successfully improved early game power, and reduced late game power, they did go overboard in some ways. Still theres no argument to be made against this putting the focus more on skill rather than gear. Gear checking has been a huge problem IMO, and I think everyone knows it. The fact that insane players could still kill fully kitted ones with squire gear before, is irrelevant to overall game balance. Increase TTK, by either lowering damage across the board (20-30%) which would hurt some classes more than others and hurt the pve speed. Or Increase TTK by giving players more baseline health. I think the second option is better or actually a mix of the two, decreasing overall damage by 10% and increasing baseline health by 15-20%.
I’m happy that squire gear feels good and not sluggish/slow but I am kinda sad that when I loot I don’t feel like I’m gaining anything. Also I’ve been mostly damage skills since TTK is so fast
Weren't they talking about adding gem sockets and the like? Maybe its so you can custom tailor your "roles", you can get the direction of a build with your own stat gems or whatever
I love being a pdr fighter with no hp and running into a barb. Feels great getting 2 shot. Played several hours Friday night on duo's, ran into 1 bard and 1 fighter, both of them had barbs with them, the other 12 teams were dual barbs.
I think (and hope) that the devs have a plan to flesh out the new system further, until then im not going to make a judgement on the game long term. I do agree this is a shitty way to release the updates, it should have been in one huge patch.
In my opinion, this is just the most obvious example of they still have the Nexon mindset. they’re throwing older players by the wide side in order to try to draw in new players instead of making a move for the game they’re making a move for their business. I feel like they had a low player continuance rate because people were getting shit on in gear and not buying the full version and that’s why they made this change. Nothing to to do with any “ vision”
When the patch dropped, my friend and I ran as a bard and barb and we managed to get the barb at 315ms with his bardiche out and we just steam rolled most teams we came across unless they were running double barb or high strength rogues
I didn't read any patch notes since I play this game rather casually, but I was wondering why there were so man more deaths in every single round I played today. Only after playing duos and getting 1 to 2 tapped by a barb with my friend I remembered that nearly every single kill I saw was with a bardiche or felling axe. Now it makes sense why that happened and I can't believe the devs actually looked at this and though it was a good idea lmao
not just that but you can also not find copperlight gear. Reducing the insentive to open chests further. The chances you get something good rolled from a chest now worth picking up instead of a crafted item is euqal to none
I feel they should incentivize playing on the Test Servers and adding these types of things to that. Similar to WoW PTR, they gain so many data points that they can either pull the plug or not just go full in like this. Give Test Server players Redeem Tokens, Bluestone shards (capped to 5 a wipe is still lackluster), etc.
as a returning player who came back a few weeks ago to finally enjoy wizard play in trios ect, im heartbroken. this patch makes wiz back to being the worse since we dont live longer than 1 auto attack...
Feels like we went backwards. I could see this being the state of the game when it first comes out, then go to how it was when they develop progression. Instead, we've gone in reverse.
The entire community banded together and bought the game just to support the devs during the lawsuit. And the way they repay us is by treating us like lab rats and going completely against everything we've ever enjoyed...
i wish they would just give everyone in test servers infinite everything regarding resources, gold and xp and put new patches out there first. Let people take all changes to their logical conclusion instantly on the test server before dropping it on main server. People cant be bothered to grind out on test server, but if everything was available they could just go ham and really stress test everything and all problems would become apparent very fast.
It seems like everyone is jumping on the hate bandwagon before SDF has even had the opportunity to finish the implementation of their vision. I think we should realise that SDF is still cooking and this is just one piece of the pie. Have more faith in Ironmace, they have done right by their community up to this moment.
Wizards, in addition to not having 1/20 of the utility, defensive and area control spells they should have, are now even more fragile and powerless with this -15hp....
They should have left the base stats with linear progression as it was and just squished the random rolls. Make 2 base stat max out at 1 make 5% power bonus max out at 1%, make 3 phys/magic power max out at 1 etc. This would close the gap alot, but maintain that a higher rarirty almost always constitutes an upgrade over a lower rarity item. Most people have access to bad rolled epics and legendaries anyways, especially after the recent changes to drop rates, so the main difference would still be good or bad rolls.
Skinny Pete dunking on people, who would have thought. I'll remind you that patch was supposed to make fights less of a gear check. He obviously wins more because he swings at people and runs away from them. He's also good at it.
4:36 Speaking as a former bear Druid main, I hate this patch. Bear is unplayably slow to hit. Unless you rush someone & hit them before they realize you're there, or unless they're completely trapped, I'm not landing more than a single heavy attack w/ bear. Any class in the game will be able to turn around & walk away to dodge every heavy attack once they're aware of my prescence. "But barbs & fighters have to melee you, so you deal huge damage to them, right?" Nope. Pathch 69 Barb can 1 tap headshot a bear w/ a bardiche. A fighter w/ a month of experiemce parrying will be able to parry bear heavy attack, which = instant death after the health nerf. Even w/out parry they only need to land 3 longsword hits to kill. This patch was DEFINITIVELY NOT A DRUID BUFF in the slightest. Made an already obscenely difficult class (since patch 67), to utterly unplayabale. I can no longer play solos. Everything hits harder & faster than bear. Every two-handed weapon one-taps panther, all others 2 tap (except maybe daggers?). Ranger shotgun now 1 taps druid. Disgusting. Only take 2 bow shots to kill druid in panther form, 3 in human, & 4-5 in bear depending on the bow they're using. This made an already terrible situation for Druid utterly hopeless.
You are the first person that made a compelling argument. I think you explained it very well. I have enjoyed the patch so far but I am kinda new to the game. You brought a good point of view from a veteran players pov
More communication via what the end idea kind of looks like 100% agree. With how large of a shift this is going to be should of opened up with a letter or something to help curb the outcry. I do think this is all being done with the end goal being server mix in ques. It makes a lot of sense and had been a talking point for a while. TLDR if you want to add in fresh players from layer to layer without making more dungeons, you need to que in people, but it's impossible to do it as it is now with gear that is currently in the game. This goal removes a ton of problems such as teaming in HR as going down would shake up the roster of players, you would get to fight more people hence lowering ttk as fuller lobbies means you got a problem of 3rd parties more often, levels could be made larger again as more people to fill them out. Opens to all of that, but now you are left with the problem of making that loot valuable again, and unfortunately that's the part that's still cooking.
You are one of the very few people who play dark and darker who have solid, articulate opinions. You’re not crying and saying you’re going to jump ship, you provide clear cut examples as to why the patch is a failure and why you’re unhappy. You don’t parrot what everyone else thinks and provide some of the best commentary on this game. Keep it up
@@Onepeg Sorry, I don't understand this explanation. They had the movement speed before the patch too, so I don't understand why it's suddenly good now.
I crafted 8 Spectral bags and purchased/found 150 peices of legendary and epic grade gear with double max HP and move speed rolls for this update to happen and now I don't want to play at all anymore.
This is such a departure from what I loved about the playtests, they aren't focusing on improving what we love but changing it to their 'vision'-Which is fine, but I'm personally not interested in it.
This is defo feels like it's undercooked, especially after you mentioned what sdf said in general chat. If I understood them correctly, it could be the base experience and then they will add a way to socket or enchant items like in poe. Iets just think of it as a long experiment (even tho they said otherwise, could be language barrier), they are now testing the balance of base gear mostly. But this will def alienate a huge % of the player base.
What i find interesting is that its good but also feels bad, it balances the game out more and stops player from running all 1 stat an being god tier powerful. but also it caps the creativity of the builds.
my biggest issue as a fairly new player, i have around 100 hours is now whenever i see a barb i know i instantly have to run away or try to hide from them, Im decent at pvp, i probably win around 60 to 70% of my fights but now i loose 90% of the time without being able to do anything about it
I just dont understand sdfs obsession with trying to force the fast ttk. I want to enjoy the combat not have it be over in 0.2 seconds
- cant react to landmine/windlass
- cant study my opponent movements/build/strategy
- cant rotate or use map knowledge
- can W key
- can camp/gank/third party more
what a healthy idea to try to copy a popular military sim!
Most people want low TTK but they want it as an exception rather than the norm-A double headshot from a ranger, or a cheeky powerful and hard to use skill..... Low TTK as a baseline is a terrible idea when the systems of skill expression are not fully fleshed out.
It needs a healthy balance. Before this patch barb could headshot up to 5x in HR with a felling axe and not kill a fighter
Now im one shotting everyone no matter what. Im not sure why they cant figure out that a two hand should be 2 headshots or 3 to 5 body shots. A one hand should be a few wxtra swings from a 2h.
fast ttk sucks hard.
This is not a shooter, this is a fighting game, fights need to be longer, multiple dodges blocks hits to finally get the kill feels more rewarding, low ttk promotes camping, 3rd party and rat gameplay.
weve known this for a long time.
Even in BR games thats the case, compare Apex legends and its time to kill with pubg, apex fights are so much mroe intense and dynamic, sure the movement is a part of that but the ttk is a huge factor, in and out, heal and go back in, push and retreat.
@@subjectdelta5348 Agreed. Right now, there's much less skil expression than before. Everyone seems to agree, except (surprise surprise) Rangers, Wizards, Barbs.
Game was literally feeling very well balanced last patch. The devs are smoking actual crack with this latest patch frfr lmao
The devs are literally dumb.
Everyone who's been here long enough knows how stupid they are.
game was the most balance it ever was before before this patch all that was need was true dmg to be turned down bow should not be able to just sit a angle with a arrow drawn back and more static mr on armor across the board would have been peak
the only thing the game needed with patch 68 was more skills and perks + nerf to pdr fighter and ranged combat.
ROFL, no, no and no, the game has literally never been balanced, ever! they Devs have said repeatedly they are not focused on balance yet ffs... Only one on cack is you...
@ParadoxISPower yes yes you and your dozen friends who think the patch is good will have lots of fun playing alone when it kills the game trying to make it a battle royal
Did they fucking forget why they nerfed barbarian in the first place? Amnesia-mace
Pretty sure it's even worse than old Barb cuz they at least didn't get 15% ms
bcz ppl suck at barb and die doe has no armor or being too slow against ranger.
@@friendlyroughai3319 right people who don’t know what gear is good on barb are slow
@@braydenbreslaw8738 no rage was just changed back to how it use to be also old rage was better minus 15% pdr was trash back in the day
Loot buff brought TONS of people back into the game. Some of my friends' most fun runs ever, people who've never even put on full epic+ before. It felt amazing ignoring blue after blue in normals, and it doesn't do a damn thing to lower the value of clearly good rare drops/craftables.
I understand what you mean and I'm noticing benefits of this as well. I just think maybe there's a middle ground where gear is still closer in stats between each quality tier, but there's still a point to searching for bis or legendaries etc. I don't like that crafted gear is the best.
The game feels better than it ever has. Things feel a lot more balanced (aside obviously from Barbarian but a Fighter could probably do what they're doing, better) and engaging. Gear fear is gone, so a lot of people who have honed their skills in the balanced 1v1s of
@@duncangreywaterstop the CAP. Any one of those "pros" will beat the sh1t out of you even if they were full naked and playing with 1 hand.
They basicly said: Oh you been grinding all that loot for days and days ? Good, now throw it on the garbage because its basicly useless now. You dont do that, specially at the middle of the season.
Oh but the game is beta, alpha, whatever they call it nowadays! Yes, and its been like that for 2 years now. Thats a good excuse for lazyness and incompetence, nothing else.
There are people with over 2000 hours on this game, its more than fair that they should be rewarded for their grind.
@@alexandreiss0agr276 no there's actually a lot of players who rmt for the gear check. Those are the ppl you can out skill all day.
@@duncangreywater i already didnt have gear fear after the loot buffs. Purples dropped like candy. the only difference is i was happily looting back then. now i am not. Nothing changed except how enjoyable looting is. I had epic equivelant gear already with minimal effort but it felt rewarding. Now it doesnt
It's kind of wild that as soon as SDF takes hard charge of the game and starts implementing his dream for the game, he immediately releases one of the worst received patches in a long time.
It's almost as if he always had bad takes and ideas about balance. Remember, he pushed hard for multiclass, and loved it when it was implemented.
@@NaderinZim Yeah, let's casually forget all good he did to create the game that we all are here for in the first place. Can you check yourself? Can we think how many games die before reaching a quarter of what DnD already had? Can you really weight all emotions this game gave to you unbiased and still say all SDF ever had in his mind was bad? Idk, man. I think it's a lot of pressure to do a dream project with a substantial audience the right way for everyone. I think his intentions are good, I'm inclined to give him the right to make mistakes, the game can't became really good otherwise. Curious what his next step might be ).
@@shipso6116 The only good idea he ever had was to make a PVPVE first person dungeon crawler, that's it. He has no direction on how to balance the game, or even what the end goal is, every bad idea that was ever implemented on this game (low ttk, multiclass, ranger meta, rogue meta) was mainly his idea, you can literally trace those messages back on discord, and most of his team was against all of those ideas, so what does it say about him?
This patch needs returned to the Chef. And the chef returned to a new line of work.
TTK specifically is terrible.
I have wanted nothing more than for SDF to be fired since the dawn of his first post. The man has been destroying this game for over a year and we've finally hit a tipping point. Let. Him. Go.
@@kyleyost1370 SDF is the main developer and the boss, i dont think he can get fired, and i persornally dont hate it that mutch, but this patch was terrible.
He will single handedly bury the game.
Demote SDF to dishwasher.
I think a better implementation of the baked in stats change would have been
Poor: 2 base stat
Common: 3 base stat, no rolls
Uncommon: 3 base stat, 2 rolls
Rare: 4 base stat, 2 rolls
Epic: 4 base stat, 3 rolls
Legendary: 5 base stat, 3 rolls
Unique: 5 base stat, 4rolls
Also armour/MR would scale very slowly between grades
This way legendaries are only 2 times better than uncommon instead of being like 5X better like they were before
As well as squishing weapon damage to match, so weapon damage tops out at legendary but gets an extra roll on unique, with common being brought up to uncommon from before.
I understand that this would make base stat dependent classes such as wizard or Druid weak in low tier gear but they would need to be rebalanced to fit the new gear.
Also nerf those new barbarian changes wtf, dude got like 5 buffs and also everyone is easier to one shot, crazy.
Was thinking the exact same thing- it flattens the gear diff a bit but still doesn't change the game enough to piss people off.
But to be more realistic, the devs would approve more of this:
[Rarity] [Base value], [random rolls]
common: 2, 0
Uncommon 2, 1
Rare 3, 1
Epic 3, 2
Legendary 4, 2
Unique 5, 3
How can we as a community who don't design games come up with much much better balancing theory than the people who do it for a living. It's sad. Who knows what they're thinking over there
This change seems like it's just setting up for random modifier changes/reforge system. If the potential values of random modifies are increased on higher quality gear then the gear gap will return through the mods in a more refined way than it is now
the buff too two hander perk was good everything else was not needed barbarian main also from play test 1
I like this idea and thought similar myself. But not they have a tendency to make drastic changes, double warlock magic healing effectiveness, buff barb base strength by 25%, buff rage by 50%... like take it slow damn. Making legendaries go from BIS to literal pis compared to a green all in one go its just crazy
Playtest one player here. This is by far the most destructive patch I have witnessed. If you can queue up in a common squire kit and come within 10% dps/durability of a fully customized kit using uniques and frostlight, there is absolutely no incentive to do anything but exactly that. There is no longer any incentive to queue HR besides ap for demigod. There is absolutely no incentive in challenging yourself in PvE/bossing when harder content no longer equals stronger loot. Players will do missions to upgrade squire gear, put in MAYBE 100-200 hours of squire pvp, get bored and move on. On a personal note, my 200k gold arena kit I've spent all wipe working on was rendered essentially useless in a single patch.
Touch grass bruh :)
@@zicero7474 Well there's never been a better time to do so but also 🖕
i feel you, frostlight plate armor set with armor and hp rolls, had 70% pdr b4 patch now i top out on 56% it just feels bad
@@zicero7474says the guy in the comments of a video discussing a patch nerd calling a nerd nerd
@@zicero7474 Well thanks to SDF there's never been a better time to touch grass lol
Had a kit that was bis blue for rogue before patch lost to a squire kit barb in hr, stabbed him 3 times and died in a single bardiche hit. He still had half health
We rogues suffer sou much even if we dont play hide … hide alone is shit if you dont land clear 3 headshots (i run sttileto) + perfect kite -knifes crosbow
Yeah as bard I've been 2-3 hitting rogues lol. With all my buffs I'm at 23% phys damage bonus.
Mosquito is the only way to play rogue safely and now barb can just break your entire other play-style by clicking E or Q
Another onepeg L
I think I was the barb lmao 😂
Pvp and looting players bis was what made the game fun now we all got the same shit. What's the point of even having loot now..
its actually just pointless, like nothing matters at all, even gold became kinda useless if u think about it
the game sucks we are just addict.- i swear the pvp is so fucking trash and pointless in this game
I appreciate the “idea,” but the way it was with increased loot finally felt sooo exciting, now it’s like whats the point.
The loot buff alone already meant i had easy access to epic quality gear as a new player. They accidentally achieved the desired outcome in a fun natural way. Then followed it up with "The plan" which destroyed the whole system lmfao.
@partingofways the increased loot patch was the 2nd worst patch the game has ever seen behind this one.
Finding 4 oranges a match in normals from regular chest and mini bosses, makes all other gear and content useless.
Why loot marvelous chest or kill bosses or pvp or play HR if you can loot oak chests for legendaries?😂 neither of yall know what the game actually needs.
@@Odyssey636 Your comment is how I know you have no idea what you are talking about. Just because you have a chance at a legendary doesn’t mean you will always get on or if it will be good. Rolls still matter. You can easily find a rare or epic that has really good stats and that is worth using over a badly rolled legendary. Also, HR still significantly increased the loot rarity, same with bosses. Doing those 2 things increases your chances of finding a UNIQUE. If you did more than play normals for PVP, you would understand that I’m sure.
I am someone who until 2 weeks ago only used blue sets in high rollers. I have killed people much more geared than me. After the loot buffs i finally started running purple and even some legendaries because i had so many and it was easier to just play the game and die with them than to try and sell for gold. If i died i would zero to hero an inferno run and be largely ready to go again. maybe id have to fill in 1 or two items from the market but thats fine. I played the game a shitload looted a shitload and it felt like a fun rewarding gameplay loop. Even if i died in HR i knew it was easy to get again and it was fun to get again. I had epic equivelant items and better just by playing a tiny bit.
Now i dont loot. I dont kill mobs i dont loot and i dont have fun. I still have epic quality items. i just didnt have to go get them myself. which is worse. I want a reason to play the game. i want progression. I had just started feeling confident enough to maybe use good gear. Now there is nothing to upgrade to or farm for. It is a call of duty lobby where i drop in with my premade kit and instead of fighting for 10min straight like COD i run around for 10min and spend max 30 seconds actually fighting.
This is what I was thinking. If you turn a corner and get one shot in Counter Strike, the time until your next fight is 15-30 seconds. If you turn a corner and get one shot in Dark and Darker that's 10+ minutes. It's going to get incredibly boring incredibly fast when there's no reward, no incentive, and ttk is so low yet time to your next chance at a fight is so long.
Yeah i mean your wrong about the top part tho.
You shouldnt be able to run a single run of normal inferno and get full purples and oranges for HR. It actually makes gear just as useless as the current squire meta.
Neither of these patches were good.
I just realized, if they get rid of random affixes, they could make enchanting and gem slots a thing. but until that time comes into play they need to keep random affixes lmao
Whats the point on playing the game then? You get your gear with the exact rolls you want, now what? You play 3-4 games and you will get bored, nothing else to do.
that is their plan is to add slots and remove rolls
If they add slots we’re gonna run into the exact same problem we had before
I think they should have buffed the gear base not butcher it, for example, to close the gear gap, make the scale from 4-10
As of the random rolls you could have them only roll 1 or 2, not scale with rarity for the random rolls
We need this man as a dev, still a better idea than nerfing the game as a whole
Died to barbs 5 times back to back today with a single shot as a fully geared warlock. Probably lost like 50k worth of gear. 😅
I really like the direction they're going from a pvp perspective. However I do agree that secondary stats need more flavor. I think legendary gear should be able to roll a pve damage. kinda like silver weapons with undead. Maybe they roll more damage to certain bosses. Maybe the roll def against certain bosses. Maybe the same for minor bosses and regular mobs. Also you have to remember they did mention sockets and gems. They prob should have waited until that was ready but this dev team likes to get data when things are fully implemented.
Dark and Darker is shot lol jk. I understand everyone having a knee jerk reaction to this (mostly hardcore players) but I think there some upsides to this patch. This patch also removed the fear in the play button, gear fear and removed the gear gap all together. Most people are able to fight and most fights will be "skill base". I honestly want to see where this patch goes. They need to balance somethings and bring barb back down abit. I also hear skinny pete likes this patch too so some hardcore players don't mind it.
Right now I'm a casual for sure, I spend most of my time playing other fun extraction games ;P but it feels good that i can just join a game and not worry about such fears or issues because I don't grind 24/7. I don't want them to stop and change everything out back of panic because of the knee jerk reaction people are having. I wanna see where this road leads and go down this path, hell with some talent trees or stuff this could be good who knows.
what was the problem playing normals then?
Did you miss the part skinny Pete mains barbarian obv he likes it
Skinny Pete pretty much exclusively pvps
they are removing loot from their looter/shooter.... interesting choice
Fun fact this is another nerf for druid as the maximum str you could achieve is down by a substantial amount. So where they struggled (HR) they are EVEN worse. Most of the druids I know have uninstalled and quit, myself included. RIP DaD, was fun.
Cry cryer
I do just fine as druid in HR you have a ailment called skill issue
that called skill issue
That player base numbers and steam reviews going from Very good to Mixed really shows how good the patch was. 7k people in dungeon and 8k in lobby. Last time i saw those numbers were in the end of seasons, after ap grind is over
you guys are thinking very short term about this update i’m excited to see how they are expand with the gem features and socketing
They couldn’t even handle quivers. They cannot handle gem features and socketing.
Hear me out.. How about they release stuff when it's ready and not treat the players like rat labs with something that doesn't work for possibly weeks
They have test servers they didn't bother to use , it really wasn't ready for live
Short term is what matters if the game dies before long term gets here 😂
@@Odyssey636the game was already dying before this patch. Since steam release they’ve been losing close to 10k players monthly.
So your talking about changes which are not even in this patch. Gem features and socketing are not in this patch. So we might be "thinking short term about this update". But you aren't thinking about this update AT ALL, you're ignoring all the bad and in a fantasy world of possibilities that aren't even here to critique or judge yet.
This patch puts more emphasis on the skill and, while sill important, de-emphasizes the gear.
The gear still matters. You get 4 random stat rolls on the legendary gear, and you have 10 pieces of the gear: head, chest, back, hands, legs, feet, ring1, ring2, neck, weapon1 - so that's like 40 more extra stats vs a player in Squire gear. It all adds up and provides a meaningful difference. For example, +3hp on 10 pieces of gear would net +30hp, +1.5% magical damage would net +15% magical damage, and +3% buff duration would net +30% if it's on all 10 pieces, etc. Having 4 such stat rolls on every piece, 40 extra stats, is an advantage.
However, in contrast to how it was before this patch, no longer does a player with higher gs win a fight against a lower gs gear player by default. You can't just roll over players because you have 600+gs gear when they are 225gs. Make a mistake and you might die. So while the random stats do give you an advantage in a fight, you must still be a skilled player to win the fight. Gone are the days of being carried by the gear while playing like shit, or, to change the POV - the days of dying to a shitty player in a better gear. This patch makes the game more skill-based rather than loot/RTM based. Instead of the stat-checking players, you are now skill-checking them. A legendary kit in the hands of a skilled player will do wonders. A legendary kit in the hands of an unskilled player will be quickly lost. Similarly, a skilled player in commons can kill an unskilled player in legendaries.
This patch brings the vision sdf had of a lower geared player being able to kill higher geared player though the sheer power of skill.
It feels a bit bad to die so fast in this patch though. You die in 1-2 hits, instead of 2-4 hits like before - less chance to re-group or disengage and heal back up if you get jumped on.
Yeah I'm super confused on how people think we'll get more new players when you have people grinding for 14 hours a day getting BiS kits vs someone who is good at the game and put together a decent kit, but not an old 30k kit.
Not to mention OnePegs comment about how a 2 stat legendary ring is now worthless and not even worthwhile to put up on the shop....which is borderline what we had anyway because so much high tier loot flooded the market that prices tanked hard. I mean the vast majority of legendary gear was around 100gold per piece(depending) before this update even dropped.
My thing is that this feels like the loot update felt good because it benefited everyone that played, but this update hurts the people playing for 8 hours day, so they don't enjoy it now.
This was always a PvP game for me. I enjoy the dungeoneering and getting loot, and nothing has really changed on that aspect except now you don't make as much gold as you could before, and you don't have as much as an advantage for playing a longer period of time vs. just being good at the game. I'd be fine with some tweaks, but shortening the top and bottom ends seems to have made fights way more enjoyable.
I agree, mainly ttk is too low, the change wouldve arrived VERY differently without the hp nerf.
A lot of the frustration is also players that have grinded for their insane gear being fucked over by it, which i understand, but it has nothing to do with game balance, and is an argument of a different conversation than game balance.
@@theswamps6589 i think double max HP gear or double ms gear should not exist and these is the most meaningful balance change. Its too much stats pressed in one item.
It doesn’t emphasize skill lol if u were good at the game u could get good gear now it just has no meaning
I had a lot of saved up BIS legendary kits with max stats prior to wipe, I think it's fine other people get to play on a level playing field, just need to retune the classes that are busted because of this now
It was good when it lasted boys time for a long break
Rip mendo was onto something :(
same :(
What do you mean mendo was onto something? Did he stop playing before this dogshit patch rolled out
@@devinland5160 he stopped playing like a year ago lmao
Ahhh the guy who wanted +70 damage and + 30 all in the game.
Yea fck em.
He left the game the first time they nuked gear lol all the weapon damage and all attributes to be fair it needed to go but this is fucking wild now @@devinland5160
Yeah it's a little petty that i'm feeling pretty vindicated, as I recall; I was arguing with you on your stream that this gear squish would be horrible for the game. Yet you said gear didn't matter...sometimes you don't realize what you're asking for until you get it.
I responded to another commenter about this. This is not a gear squish. This in essence eliminated gearing all together for several reasons.
This is more drastic than I was arguing for then, if you go back and look.
And yeah, you’re being petty
@@Onepeg this has definitely not removed gearing, think about having fully epic/legendary gear with 2-3 relevant rolls each compared to none, the difference is still MAJOR.
up to 4/6 hp on every piece, phys power on every piece, phys bonus on every, dex/agi action speed on every piece etc.
This still adds up to possibly 50-60 additional HP which is gigantic, 40-50% damage bonus with is gigantic, with agi or dex/ action speed rolls also about 3-5% movespeed and a ton of action speed (up to 30 ish i think) which is gigantic, and you can check multiple of those boxes.
With good gear your power is still about 50% higher, with perfect gear more than that, how is that irellevant.
I think you make good points but then you exagarate them immensely.
I can agree that this is overboard, but i also think the gear stats were always very surface level and didnt really have any depth, they increased power, but did not really alter the gameplay (maybe action speed a little bit).
I think what we really need for this change to make sense is more interesting stats, and a higher ttk.
@@theswamps6589 "This still adds up to possibly 50-60 additional HP which is gigantic" surviving one extra felling axe hit is not gigantic.
Common armor ratings + -15 HP + Epic weapon damages is a total disaster, the TTK is literally on par with any modern Call of Duty right now. I think this is a disaster and they need to revert quite a few things and rebalance from the previous hotfix #68 baseline in a more incremental and healthier fashion.
good take.
I love barbarian as i am a barbarian main, but i realistically shouldn't be going from average 2-3 kills to 7-8 kills a game all of a sudden. The two hander, axe specialization and executioner combo with the rage buff allows over 100 damage, 170+ with headshot. it's actually ridiculous. Also the fact that pdr and health nerf didn't make it any better. We finna see barb nerfs real quick. Enjoy it while it lasts for a week lads.
Ooooh boy I can't wait to hop into a high roller game to get spawn rushed and one shot by a barb
You were just saying recently, something to the effect of, anyone that is against the loot overhaul and squashing loot disparity just enjoys out gearing people. As someone who enjoys the excitement of a loot based game feeling rewarding to loot, I’m glad you’re realizing the inherent flaw in making all gear the same. Sure fights feel like you have a chance even in base gear but you completely remove the thrill of delving deeper to loot. Kinda the whole point of the game. I guess some people have to feel it to get it.
Yeah i definitely understand the frustration. Hell, gear checking used to be so bad me and the guys would join with relatively good gear, grimsmiles etc. But a team with 50k sets each would roll right over you lmao. So a SLIGHT balance to higher end gear was in order.. but this is insane.. there's almost no reason to pick up things since they'll onlynbe slightly better than your green items lol. You can equip a ranger with 40 str and full true phys for a fraction of the price before and they will LITERALLY one shot even a well geared wizard due to hp nerfs.. and barbarians one shot people easily too
so I DID say that. I did NOT expect they were going to go this far with it, though. It's kinda over the top lol. IF it felt more balanced, I think I wouldn't have as much issue with it as I do. Right now the gear feels almost exactly the same regardless of tier. I was an advocate for "more normalization" but this feels almost like "complete normalization"
@@Onepegodd question -- is this some kind of weird "Trick or Treat" week thing??
@@Onepeg I respect that
There needs a middle ground between what we had last week and what we have this week
gear disparity is what created gear variety.
now loot is fucking boring.
Cry cryer
Thanks for all the info my man! I sure hope things improve, it's looking grim
only thing i don’t vibe with is removal of -125, that’s where i lived lol
whats the point when theres really no difference between squire and blues
I have been doing 225 and under and it is good so far.
@@trik68 yea now that you mention it that makes sense
@@HockADocka-Adventures i haven’t got to play yet, but from people’s comments it seems like they wouldn’t need it
You vibe with barbarian being stupid op?
If they don’t fix this the game is cooked
Hoping this patch makes more sense when they finish what they started in the next patches, but the timing here is pretty awful.
I think one of the the way to return some strength to quality loot is to have higher cap at modifiers, if u have green bow u get at best 2 awd. when u are holding legendary, ur weapon can get up to 5 or 6.
Also such huuuuge change should be put at the start of the season, this dictates way 2 much about how we itemize to implement it mid season
@@jestLipa thats true, i think it doesnt hold relevance to overall balance, but this is a big factor why its so poorly received, at the start of a season more people would be willing to give the overhaul a chance.
For me the gear hasn't even been relevant, idk if that makes me sound like a timmy or w/e but I'm a fighting game player, I'm here for the depth and the skill ceiling.
I love a game that rewards knowledge and skill above rng and the gear changes allow that pretty well.
Though I do agree that it feels like progression in terms of gear is non-existent now, I skip over green and blues in low lobbies now because like who gives a shit if it has a bad roll, it doesn't increase the base value anymore.
I also think barb is a tad overtuned, it needs to be dialed back or everyone else needs to be slightly shoved forward.
I feel like they're pushing the game away from the slow and clunky experience I originally thought was the intended vision of the devs, now it feels like they're hard leaning into it being more quick wit and overall skill-based combat exchanges.
I only have about 400-500 hours in the game but I've owned it since it was first purchaseable and I've played a lot of games in my 34 years of life, I am hopeful there will be a followup patch that makes things more clear.
right now it's just kinda silly to play around with tho.
I've been playing druid all season for quests and it feels kinda whack rn cause everyone gets to feel really cool with the gear changes and I just get like... more spear and bear.
If I try to stack AGI and play panther I'm gonna get onetapped by a barb and stop doing it lmao
I feel like the PvP in this game is not flushed out enough for the game to be PvP focused in the first place. Just play Chivalry 2 if you want a good PvP melee sword fighting game, because gear doesn’t matter in dark and darker anymore
@@tincan5058😂 acting like chivarlys pvp is good is your first problem
They removed getting gear diff at least
Gear dif wasn't too bad to begin with if I'm being honest. Even if someone brought in bis I could still kill them if they played it wrong..now there is no gain in bossing, looting or killing players and the melee is very unsatisfying now
Yes, now you will get skill diff and still find a reason to cry.
i still got gear diff last night.. :D wanted to try rondel fighter and load in HR.. first guy i see is another rondel fighter with better item rolls... gear diffed me big time. stab for stab his rolls win
@@kostadinbodurov7430 sure buddy. its always gear diff right ? when you all died before to naked warlocks was also gear diff right?
@@ripperfisher182250 gear diff was extremely bad idk what youre talking about...
The same gear in higher rarity and with better rolls culd make the difference between 98% ms and 30% pdr to 106% ms and 60% pdr, from 20 dmg per hit to 40 dmg per hit. from 120 hp to 180 hp.
with those stat differences winning a fight is almost impossible, except for the very very very high skilled players.
You're just flat out wrong on "capping out at epic" for weapons and stuff. Melee weapons have tons of other modifiers that increase damage. Power, additional damage, physical damage bonus, armor pen, that's 4 just for damage, and it's not even including health yet. Casters can also get magic pen and magic damage bonus, and these work multiplicatively.
Almost true except I'm pretty sure casters can't roll magic pen because its a static stat on spellbooks & staffs. They could still roll magic power, magic pen, & magic damage bonus though
can you afford the gear that has 4 rolls that are not trash ? nothing changed except that mid gear is dead you either go full squire kit or 30k kit wich gives you the stats you need to make a difference
Just a thought tho. They rolled specific stats into "families" which can't roll multiples in the same family.
I.e additional move speed and move speed bonus.
So I'm not sure how they determined what's in what family. But it may only be 1 damage stat allowable. Not doubles
@@tphil5901 i think that only applies to health rolls and move speed rolls damage rolls you can still get them all
in terms of searching gear nothing change. You still wanna find legendaries with good affixes like before. Even before you might slot an purple over a legendary if the stats are better.
The barb buffs are Dumb as F , But I'm loving the sweaty players crying because noobs now get decent base stat weapons .
Go fight a sweaty guy with your new weapon then.
I got like 30 or some thing Kills on High Roll today in like 4 games, ive never seen so many noobs on HR on my life. Most of them with "big new weapons". People are insanely bad at this game and this will only facilitate things for good players.
Ill give it 1 week till players find out wasnt gear diff after all, it was always skill diff.
Noobs had good weapons last patch after the buffs. it was fun as fuck to loot the good shit and then send it HR. Now the good shit is in my squire. Which sounds great! now you can just send pvp right? but then you remember this is a dungeon diving looter. Not call of duty. And this patch pretty much made it a different game entirely and yall are confused why the community doesnt wanna play an entirely different game? like wtf?
I disagree with all the hate this update is receiving. The main issue with rust was it was promoting complete video game addiction. This game was doing the same exact thing with people grinding endlessly to get extreme bis legendary gear. Now this new update causes us to rely on skill and skill alone. I died with a 3k gold kit to an absolutely terrible player, he had 0 skill, but ended up being faster than me and one rapping my head because he had a 15k fighter kit. Now it’s skill only. I love the new update!!
only thing i can think of after seeing this is they plan to do a major rework/overhaul of stats and for them to do that they need clean slates (as in no extra gear stats) whether thats the case or not only time can really tell
my thoughts as well.
yes more interesting stats would be great, not just hit harder, take more hits.
More stealth changes? Wonder how much the playerbase has to complain for them to stop doing this.
I don't dislike it at all, however I am perplexed by the barbarian's buffs at this current time this early in the process. Played a couple matches earlier today and definitely noticed faster npc kills. Since the loot increase patch recently, I finally was able to get the rare weapons quest done, which gave me some weapons I never had before.
Perhaps in some way, I can see that this patch makes gear more middle-ground and more focus on player skill instead of always relying on just the stats. The gear tiers seems more progressively "enhanced" by additional stat rolls, but would be nice if legendaries and uniques were a little more special..maybe maybe like randomized elemental damaging effects on them, like this legendary sword has fire damage in addition, and can cause burn effect per swing etc. Idk. Playing older rpgs, like the elder scrolls with some weapon enchants having different effects seem neat. Something to make at least some, or whatever, more cool. Maybe even have the effect show on the weapon visually also. Would be cool to see a armored cleric with a big maul that's on fire or whatever else.
and this is why players who havent completed 2 quests for the same vendor arent the ones the game should be balanced and tuned around. Yes people got gear checked if you watch any content or play the game at a mid level though you know that wasnt the case 70-80% of the time. it took skill to get the better gear in the first place did it not?
Nope it didn't. It took time. You could go into normals ruins cheese every mob, extract with 400g-800g treasures. Repeat it 10 times - now you got the kit. I'll say it's not a very fun game experience)
@@idkidc8429
its should not be balanced around the lowest end of players, but also not around the highest end of players.
It should be balanced around the higher middle.
They successfully improved early game power, and reduced late game power, they did go overboard in some ways.
Still theres no argument to be made against this putting the focus more on skill rather than gear.
Gear checking has been a huge problem IMO, and I think everyone knows it.
The fact that insane players could still kill fully kitted ones with squire gear before, is irrelevant to overall game balance.
Increase TTK, by either lowering damage across the board (20-30%) which would hurt some classes more than others and hurt the pve speed.
Or Increase TTK by giving players more baseline health.
I think the second option is better or actually a mix of the two, decreasing overall damage by 10% and increasing baseline health by 15-20%.
1 longbow shot against my wizard literally takes me out of the fight instantly
I’m happy that squire gear feels good and not sluggish/slow but I am kinda sad that when I loot I don’t feel like I’m gaining anything. Also I’ve been mostly damage skills since TTK is so fast
Weren't they talking about adding gem sockets and the like? Maybe its so you can custom tailor your "roles", you can get the direction of a build with your own stat gems or whatever
You don't let a person with 20/400 vision drive.
As a warlock with champion armor, I got one shot from full health by a white felling axe barbarian
I love being a pdr fighter with no hp and running into a barb. Feels great getting 2 shot. Played several hours Friday night on duo's, ran into 1 bard and 1 fighter, both of them had barbs with them, the other 12 teams were dual barbs.
Yea, they F-ed this one
I think (and hope) that the devs have a plan to flesh out the new system further, until then im not going to make a judgement on the game long term. I do agree this is a shitty way to release the updates, it should have been in one huge patch.
If the barbarian can catch them before getting slapped in the face with an arrow from a ranger lol
Grayson said in gen chat that they did this and they knew the reaction and he also said where is the fun in having an advantage with gear
In my opinion, this is just the most obvious example of they still have the Nexon mindset. they’re throwing older players by the wide side in order to try to draw in new players instead of making a move for the game they’re making a move for their business. I feel like they had a low player continuance rate because people were getting shit on in gear and not buying the full version and that’s why they made this change. Nothing to to do with any “ vision”
When the patch dropped, my friend and I ran as a bard and barb and we managed to get the barb at 315ms with his bardiche out and we just steam rolled most teams we came across unless they were running double barb or high strength rogues
I didn't read any patch notes since I play this game rather casually, but I was wondering why there were so man more deaths in every single round I played today. Only after playing duos and getting 1 to 2 tapped by a barb with my friend I remembered that nearly every single kill I saw was with a bardiche or felling axe. Now it makes sense why that happened and I can't believe the devs actually looked at this and though it was a good idea lmao
not just that but you can also not find copperlight gear. Reducing the insentive to open chests further. The chances you get something good rolled from a chest now worth picking up instead of a crafted item is euqal to none
"Copperlight Ore" - 14:22 I was confused af when he said that shit
I feel they should incentivize playing on the Test Servers and adding these types of things to that. Similar to WoW PTR, they gain so many data points that they can either pull the plug or not just go full in like this. Give Test Server players Redeem Tokens, Bluestone shards (capped to 5 a wipe is still lackluster), etc.
as a returning player who came back a few weeks ago to finally enjoy wizard play in trios ect, im heartbroken. this patch makes wiz back to being the worse since we dont live longer than 1 auto attack...
They mentioned something about sockets for gear down the line? Maybe that will be what they push for customization?
this video sums up my experience as a wizard this patch entirely, quite miserable to play against rangers and barbs
Feels like we went backwards. I could see this being the state of the game when it first comes out, then go to how it was when they develop progression. Instead, we've gone in reverse.
The entire community banded together and bought the game just to support the devs during the lawsuit. And the way they repay us is by treating us like lab rats and going completely against everything we've ever enjoyed...
last patch was really fun, i think slowly introducing gear changes while keeping last patch would be good. also this barb change is INSANE
As a music man, that has played since before it was added. I like this update. I no longer feel like I’m being stat checked.
I like the removal of double stacked bonuses especially the move speed but the rest is beyond explanation.
As someone who hasn’t played this wipe since day 1 it’s nice having my base kit basically be purples. Feels bad for everyone else I’m sure though
Maybe it's going from a Random roll-on gear to a static roll-on gear? Where each piece will have specific rolls it could have on it?
i wish they would just give everyone in test servers infinite everything regarding resources, gold and xp and put new patches out there first. Let people take all changes to their logical conclusion instantly on the test server before dropping it on main server. People cant be bothered to grind out on test server, but if everything was available they could just go ham and really stress test everything and all problems would become apparent very fast.
I don't know... Given my standpoint, I like the majority of that projected end result.
It seems like everyone is jumping on the hate bandwagon before SDF has even had the opportunity to finish the implementation of their vision. I think we should realise that SDF is still cooking and this is just one piece of the pie. Have more faith in Ironmace, they have done right by their community up to this moment.
Update: They just removed gear score requirement on High-Roller.
I like the changes. The quality of gear only becomes more "enchanted" as rarity scales. Armor is armor, weapons are weapons. (Barb orvertuned tho)
I got two tapped by a barb, even when i had 65% pdr. He took half my health with leg shot then finished me off with a body shot
Wizards, in addition to not having 1/20 of the utility, defensive and area control spells they should have, are now even more fragile and powerless with this -15hp....
This update is a start to an actually balanced game
I suppose you could call this patch a dutch oven
They should have left the base stats with linear progression as it was and just squished the random rolls. Make 2 base stat max out at 1 make 5% power bonus max out at 1%, make 3 phys/magic power max out at 1 etc. This would close the gap alot, but maintain that a higher rarirty almost always constitutes an upgrade over a lower rarity item. Most people have access to bad rolled epics and legendaries anyways, especially after the recent changes to drop rates, so the main difference would still be good or bad rolls.
Its so hard to click on the start button now
Catering to dads with jobs.
Well they do have the money
Skinny Pete dunking on people, who would have thought. I'll remind you that patch was supposed to make fights less of a gear check. He obviously wins more because he swings at people and runs away from them. He's also good at it.
THE GEAR WAS FINE, they just needed gear score lobbies back in HR. When 200 lobbies were a thing HR was the most played game mode in the discord.
Same thing happend in league where it was all about oneshot and people got tired of it...
4:36 Speaking as a former bear Druid main, I hate this patch. Bear is unplayably slow to hit.
Unless you rush someone & hit them before they realize you're there, or unless they're completely trapped, I'm not landing more than a single heavy attack w/ bear.
Any class in the game will be able to turn around & walk away to dodge every heavy attack once they're aware of my prescence.
"But barbs & fighters have to melee you, so you deal huge damage to them, right?"
Nope. Pathch 69 Barb can 1 tap headshot a bear w/ a bardiche. A fighter w/ a month of experiemce parrying will be able to parry bear heavy attack, which = instant death after the health nerf.
Even w/out parry they only need to land 3 longsword hits to kill.
This patch was DEFINITIVELY NOT A DRUID BUFF in the slightest.
Made an already obscenely difficult class (since patch 67), to utterly unplayabale.
I can no longer play solos. Everything hits harder & faster than bear.
Every two-handed weapon one-taps panther, all others 2 tap (except maybe daggers?).
Ranger shotgun now 1 taps druid. Disgusting. Only take 2 bow shots to kill druid in panther form, 3 in human, & 4-5 in bear depending on the bow they're using.
This made an already terrible situation for Druid utterly hopeless.
sdf really didnt use his critical thinking skills when he released this patch and it shows....
You are the first person that made a compelling argument. I think you explained it very well. I have enjoyed the patch so far but I am kinda new to the game. You brought a good point of view from a veteran players pov
More communication via what the end idea kind of looks like 100% agree. With how large of a shift this is going to be should of opened up with a letter or something to help curb the outcry. I do think this is all being done with the end goal being server mix in ques. It makes a lot of sense and had been a talking point for a while. TLDR if you want to add in fresh players from layer to layer without making more dungeons, you need to que in people, but it's impossible to do it as it is now with gear that is currently in the game. This goal removes a ton of problems such as teaming in HR as going down would shake up the roster of players, you would get to fight more people hence lowering ttk as fuller lobbies means you got a problem of 3rd parties more often, levels could be made larger again as more people to fill them out. Opens to all of that, but now you are left with the problem of making that loot valuable again, and unfortunately that's the part that's still cooking.
You are one of the very few people who play dark and darker who have solid, articulate opinions. You’re not crying and saying you’re going to jump ship, you provide clear cut examples as to why the patch is a failure and why you’re unhappy. You don’t parrot what everyone else thinks and provide some of the best commentary on this game. Keep it up
I'm dumb, can someone explain me in simple terms why the copperlight gear is now suddenly good?
movement speed as a base stat on all pieces.
@@Onepeg Sorry, I don't understand this explanation. They had the movement speed before the patch too, so I don't understand why it's suddenly good now.
@@butterbee2384 it has the same stats as any rarity piece now
I crafted 8 Spectral bags and purchased/found 150 peices of legendary and epic grade gear with double max HP and move speed rolls for this update to happen and now I don't want to play at all anymore.
but you agree that double max HP and double movement speed is not rally balanced right?
Bro the game was feeling so good and the only good thing out of this is that the wanderer tunic is a bit better
This is such a departure from what I loved about the playtests, they aren't focusing on improving what we love but changing it to their 'vision'-Which is fine, but I'm personally not interested in it.
All these changes and still this whole season I've only killed toothless yetis
6:20 well, he won a lot anyways before the parch
This is defo feels like it's undercooked, especially after you mentioned what sdf said in general chat.
If I understood them correctly, it could be the base experience and then they will add a way to socket or enchant items like in poe.
Iets just think of it as a long experiment (even tho they said otherwise, could be language barrier), they are now testing the balance of base gear mostly.
But this will def alienate a huge % of the player base.
18:23 never mind you just summed up my thoughts in a few words XD
I want what ever Terry and SDF are smoking.
What i find interesting is that its good but also feels bad, it balances the game out more and stops player from running all 1 stat an being god tier powerful. but also it caps the creativity of the builds.
my biggest issue as a fairly new player, i have around 100 hours is now whenever i see a barb i know i instantly have to run away or try to hide from them, Im decent at pvp, i probably win around 60 to 70% of my fights but now i loose 90% of the time without being able to do anything about it
380 hours, regretting every single hour I spent on this shit istg....