Hi Chad, having about 50 years experience as a thermal engineer, just a minor comment on filling the 1/4 inch gaps with 3 inches of foam. I would recommend not filling the full 3" thickness with the foam, but rather just enough thickness, say 1/4", to block air exchange between the outer air volume next to the outer wall and the air volumes in the 1/4 inch gap, leaving the remaining 2.75" of gap with a trapped air volume. Reason being, air is a much better insulator than any insulation material. And with gaps less than about 3/4 inch convection is negligible and the dominant mode of heat transfer will be air conduction, a much better insulator than if that volume was filled with foam. Not a big deal tho since your overall crack area for the 1/4" gaps is small compared to the total insulated wall area. Also if the foam board were available with aluminum foil on one or both sides of the boards, it would increase your overall effective R value even more by greatly reducing any thermal radiation transfer across the external gap (foam board to outer wall) and internal foam board surface to room interior. Just food for thought. But I love your overall approach for avoiding condensation on the outer wall. Good job!
Thank you for the information. There’s so much different info out there addressing this subject it’s a bit overwhelming 😆. We’re considering building a new shop much larger than this one and will see how this one performs.
Do you think this outperforms R19 batt insulation ? I would use the 4’ wide rolls if I go that route. I know the R value is different. But which one performs Better? Thanks
@@elderfarms The problem with using air alone in a large wall cavity is the cavity would be large enough so you would get convection (air flow) from warm to cold surfaces and that would destroy the insulation R-value. As SpudW suggests, the narrow horizontal cavities 1/4" high would not support convection over the 3" thickness and the spray foam at the outside and inside of the cavity will keep wind from moving air through the cavity.
I'm at drywall contractor and my daughter helps me all the time. Great to see your daughters learning some life skills. Good job girls and dad. Love the video.
Congrats for being an awesome father. I found my daughter is very receptive to things I show her, including bird hunting and shooting. Your daughters are very fortunate to have you spend time with them and teach important skills. Stay warm.
Greatest part about this is the teachings the the kids are receiving in my opinion. They'll remember helping their rest of their lives. Also, when you set up the wall metal, lay it on horses 10 or so sheets clamped together, layout your purlin location, snap lines, and pre drill several sheets at a time. Even though you might be using self tapping screws, it'll make life a lot easier. Nice looking shop y'all!
😂 we definitely won’t allow our children to loaf around and watch desperate housewives all day! 😂 They do have their daily chores and schoolwork and the rest of the day doing what they want minus electronics. They are happy kids who use their own individual imaginations to keep from being bored. They all have their own hobbies.
Instead of sinking the screws 1", just throw some larger washers on the screws. Drive the screw until the washer dimples the foam board (don't break the facing). Other thing to consider is if you are doing 3", you can double layer 1.5" foam board and stagger your seams. This helps air seal
I love that you gave your daughter good safety and work instructions for the oscillating tool; and repeated not to touch anywhere near that blade and to keep good control of it. She can then build confidence in using them why also respecting what they can do both good and bad.
Commercial contractor here - have foam board stacked to the ceiling as I'm preparing to insulate my shop walls in the same manner as you did. Before starting this weekend, I decided to do a quick search for anyone who's used rigid (spray foam quote was 15k for a 30x60x14 shop, yikes!). Point is that I'm very happy to have found this video - some of the little tips and tricks you shared as you learned your way through this are going to save me a LOT of time and headache. Never thought to leave a gap on the sides - what a great thought as my biggest concern is keeping it tight in order to maintain its effectiveness. Had also been contemplating having an air gap between back of panel and insulation board similar to yours - I think that's the right approach, sir. Thank you for sharing your experience at such a high level of detail, and for including some justification for why you did certain things the way you did. Dad of two girls as well and that's great that you're showing them the way! Great looking job and thanks again kind sir.
I've used rigid foam for a number of applications. I even built a refrigerated cabinet for storing vegetables for an organic farmer. For cutting, I tried several things and settled on one. I had a 2" wide x 4" inch long putty knife. I slightly sharpened the 4" side (not even to a knife edge) and it slid through the foam like butter. I used my 48" aluminum t-square for a straight edge.
You made me smile when you were showing your daughter how to do it! Tell her her braided hair looked great! I have 3 girls of my own, all growed-up. Miss those times of teaching them new stuff.
Awesome, i too may need to do the same. My garage is large like yours. You may check into steel wool to shove in holes for mice. Learn long ago from old country folks. Works great, it hurts them to much to chew it.
I did this but I used 2, 1-1/2” thick panels stacked to make 3” where the seems were offset so there was no air leakage and no need to spray the gaps with extra foam
Good thinking. The problem with spray foam between sections is expansion: where does material go, and will it cause problems? Doing this to the underside of the roof for example could block air wash completely - so much for ridge caps doing anything useful. Dedicated foamboard adhesive reacts with minimal expansion. As for sealing around electrical boxes, I like firestop: goes in with a caulking gun and tacks nicely - it only expands in event of fire.
This is what I came up with for my pole building after the sky high spray foam quote . Super nice to see someone besides me used this technique. Looks great ..Thank for making the video
As a fire inspector very glad you are placing the foam behind a thermal barrier. That foam will turn the place into the Station Nightclub if left exposed. ALSO.....great fathering. My teen daughter is very comfortable with power tools and helps build all the time. Even has her own chainsaw.
Is the 1 1/2” space between the back of the foam sheet and the inside of the metal wall the “thermal barrier”? And if so, how does that prevent the foam from burning in a fire?
Hey Chad. Your girls are learning so much from you and getting the hands-on experience with everything they do. That's just so awesome! So proud of them. Take care.
Spend the money on interior girts! Well worth it! You have come So far. Not doing so will compromise your whole project. The screw heads taking cold temps from the outside girt will likely get very cold And condense inside your building . Hand the steel on board that is Inside the insulation. Less bridges and less problems!
I'm glad i saw your video. Just got a metal storage building and needed to find a way to stop the sweating. Nice to teach your daughters, my dad thought we we're to stupid
Sometimes it’s hard for dads to get on their daughter’s level and understand them and not make them feel like we think they’re stupid. Sometimes my daughters question my thoughts.
He used 3” thick Owens-Corning Foamular 250 sheets with R-15. 1) 11:42 Scoring the panels and then breaking them apart will result in an uneven edge. Best to cut with table saw, circular saw, electric kitchen knife, or even a regular hand saw for wood. 2) He installed the sheets over some horizontal 1X’s so there’s a 1 1/2” air gap between the inside of the metal walls and the back of the 3” thick foam panels. This air gap should allow any possible moisture to dry up. 3) All foam panels were cut so there was a 1/4” gap between the edges. This 1/4” gap made it much easier to fit the panels. 4) 6:17 The spray foam that bled out was easily trimmed off after drying later using a multi tool. Keep it flat! 5) 14:24 He left a gap around the wall outlets and stuffed it with regular pink FG insulation so he get replace or modify later. 6) Some in comments used two 1 1/2” thick sheets STAGGERED to avoid the gap between sheets and filling with foam and trimming later. See the comments that I liked below for more information.
Great video! Thanks for sharing your experience. I'll be putting up an identical steel building and the difference in cost with and without the insulation options is HUGE. I like the way you did it. Much appreciated.
I have great respect for any man that will teach his girls as well as his boys real life skills they can take with them long after we are gone! More men should be doing this. Raising helpless women is not setting forth a good example for our women. This man is a testimony of how to teach your women to survive and to thrive! My respect and salute goes to you sir and your girls. Damn proud of you and of them! Press on!
Hello Chad and your lovely family wow you did a very great job and your lovely girls help dad I know you are very busy with work but I hope you won't wait so long to post a new video just say I just enjoy watching you with your beautiful children they really love you daddy you are so blessed may God keep on blessing you and your beautiful wife and children Rosa
Only thing I'd suggest doing differently is using 1.5" foam in two layers with the seams staggered. It's more cutting, but then you can skip the spray foam to save some money. Nail the first layer on, then use adhesive on the second layer.
@@sizelov That could add up for a larger shops but it is only about $15 more for a 12x40' wall. Adhesive is probably about the same cost as spray foam but you would use more. My guess is all things being equal it is the same price and about the same time but probably better results.
Great video. You really covered a lot of important issues. My building is going up right now. First priority for me is the rat guard. Thanks from middle Tennessee.
Greetings from Milan Mi. Thanks for sharing what you learned. I agree that this stuff will be much more future proof if you needed to make repairs or change something.
I converted my 28x28 stick built two car garage that has traditional 8-ft studs for the walls but it's on a 18-in cinder block perimeter so it gives me almost 10 ft tall ceilings and I converted that to a and the plan is to use insulated sheets on the inside and then brick the inside with real brick veneer about a third of an inch thick. So it'll look like a Brooklyn loft but it has traditional fiberglass insulation in the walls and then we're using 2 inches of foam on the interior walls. So it'll still breathe out to the outside. But the interior will be and even with just the r19 walls and r38 ceiling, it only takes a small air conditioner to keep it cool
Did something similar redoing my walls. 2 1"inch layers using canned foam as the adhesive. Then Rockwool over the top of it. (R25) Make sure your air gap can drain out the bottom or your water will fill up with water. Also make sure there are critter screens on both the top and bottom so you can avoid unwanted guests.
Could use GE silicon to hold the foam board together. The reason moisture gets between the wall is because if the dew point (63 degrees) lies between the inside temperature and the temperature outside there will be condensation in the wall. You are correct about keeping the temperature the same as the outside temperature.
You're lucky if you can get those 4x8 sheets for $65. It's crazy that there isn't a more affordable option. Smart to maintain an air gap and not put foam boards against the metal.
Looks awesome. I love saving large amounts of money for something so simple to do. You could have even put another 1 1/2 inch foam board in front of that one and made it even better.
Nice job. Too late now but for anybody else, use a boric acid powder or solution on the steel behind the foam to kill bugs especially carpenter ants which love to make homes in the foam. I would also use the high expansion great stuff behind the vertical 6x6 to slow down mice using the the girts for runs.
My brother did spray foam on his house. He got an estimate and realized it was cheaper to by the gear and do it himself. He’s a builder contractor and has his own company. Since he has done his and his three kids houses at cost. I have a 130 year old house we plan to do this summer. I was planning ridged foam board but it’s faster and easier to do foam.
ya'll did a very good job keep up the good work and keep warm. look out for a polar votex coming down and to the south. be bless and love and safe. thanks for the young ladies help you out that is great,
I did basically the same thing you did on my 40' x 60' x 16' pole building worlshop, except I used 4 inch thick panels. I bought the flat roof foam panels (foil on both sides) from an Amish roofer who buys factory seconds. The defects were nearly impossible to find. I didn't find it that hard to cut them to fit snug between the poles. Used a circular saw with an old dull blade set to maximum depth, then finished with a foam cutting hand saw (very wide blade). I also slid 1.5 inch thick pieces behind the poles and between the girts, extending about 6 inches beyond each side of the poles. Before I found the 4 inch panels I started with 40 sheets of 1.5 inch on my back wall, installing 3 layers and overlapping the seams. Then I found the thicker panels and did my remaining 3 walls with 91 sheets of 4 inch thick panels (they came in wrapped stacks of 10 or 11 sheets). Much cheaper than spray, but MUCH more labor, dust, and time to install. My ceiling has R-38 fiberglass, purchased in the winter (off season) when it went on sale for 1/2 price.
@@laceymathers445 It works well for my workshop. With the heat off, it stays at about 50 degrees, even on a cold winter day (20 degrees and windy). One LP infrared heater brings it up to 60 in less than an hour. I have 2 insulated overhead doors, each 12 ft x 12 ft, 1 walkthrough door. As long as you have a complete thermal break in the ceiling, walls and down to below the floor, it shouldn’t be overly expensive to heat.
I've had to remodel and/or make changes to an existing build that had spray foam. Let me tell you it was a pain in the butt. It sticks to everything. Wires studs sheathing you did the right thing
Thank you! This was very helpful for me since I have never done this before and am getting ready to do my shed before winter here in the upper part of Lower Michigan. Very informative and GREAT tips and tricks!
Another great episode! Excellent tutorial on the foam insulation. Autumn looks like she has grown a foot over the winter ❄️we didn't recognize her at first ❤
I, too hate getting heat loss through my crack. I also have problems with putting my foam in that tight crack. I wish I had widened that crack to 1/4" before putting my foam in there. Thanks for the advice on filling that crack!
cuts very nice. though the thicker the foam the harder it gets to keep it square. slight pressure side to side against the jigsaw will cause the blade to deflect and you get a wavy edge. takes a bit of practice getting used to it but its worth it.
Fun fact, those oscillating tools (I call them buzz saws) were originally developed for the medical industry for cutting into rigid cast material. They needed something that wouldn't hurt their patients' limbs when removing the casts, and these don't. They sound mean, but you can gently touch your finger to the tip while it's running and you won't be hurt.
I apologize for being late always love watching what you and everyone all your wonderful kids and your wife as well and all your animals and dogs as well love you all
Also, covering the screws in the foam is a good idea because metal is a conductor, so they are your weakest points regarding the transfer of heat. In fact, on jobs I've done similar to yours, I have removed most or all of the screws and relied on the adhesive nature of the canned spray foam to support the sheets. If you use more than 1 layer of foam, you can lessen the effect of the canned spray foam with staggered joints.
Great Video! I’ll chime in with others, that I serious doubt the 1/4” gap and fill buys you anything, particularly since you taped over the gaps at the end anyway. Had you cut the boards with a (for example) track saw, any gap would have been very small, resulting in a very small space where convective cooling would be nothing. The tape then seals up the cracks so no drafts escape through the crack. Alternatively, if you really wanted to have a double block for insurance, get one of the window and door foam sealants, and just put a bead of it down the middle of the top edge of a bottom foam board before placing the next higher up foam board atop it. Make sure to get only window and door foam sealant as it has limited expansion (regular foam would push your two boards apart). Doing your 1/4” foam gap on the ends abutting the vertical posts is likely a best way to seal that edge as it will also a fix the foam board to the vertical post. Anyhow, great vid and thanks for the insight vs blown foam!
Hey Chad. Been following along since yous started the project. I also have a 30x40. All it's got is bubble wrap between the tin & perlins. I think this is the ticket the way you did it. No studs for bats. Easy to apply wall coverings. 1 section at a time in between the posts. My only problem is the ceiling. No eves or overhangs= no ventilation for a ceiling application. May also try this method in between top of trusses underneath roof. Or I may do blanket insulation up there. Plus, my wood stove pipe runs out the side wall 1foot above the bottom of trusses. Nice job! Look forward to seeing the finished shop! Thanks for the great info as well!
You’d definitely want some sort of ventilation up there. We are about to put out a video on our other channel possibly tomorrow on how we are doing the ceiling. If you don’t know our other channel is Great American Northern Garage. Have a great weekend!
Looking a lot different from when you first bought the property!! Great job, your girls are awesome to help and learn along the way. All the best up there...
Yes, mice chew through anything, almost. I kept fixing, with spray foam, a hole they were coming in. I finally stuck some course steel wool, then spray foam. They never came in again. Good looking job - I too checked spray foam for cargo trailer I'm finishing, and yes, it was prohibitive$$! I used Pink Foam too. Cheers from Lapeer, Michistan.
WOW. Beautiful job. You and the girls have been pretty busy. Looks GREAT. Nicely done. Way better looking than the regular messy insulation or the spray stuff. Very nice lines and flat surface. Everything runs in unison together. Love you guys.❤️🥰 Give my girls a high five 🤗
Nice video. I have used both spray foam and rigid foam board. My spray foam was a DIY kit I thought it would do a large area of my workshop 350 to 400 sqft. it only covered about 10% of my estimated area. The cans were empty 😮. I was so disappointed and so frustrated. We now laugh about it. I have learned a 4x8 sheet covers 32 sqft every time. Also it really is 2 or 3” thick. Glad to see your kids on the job too. I have 5 (4 girls and 1 boy). They always worked with me and learned how to run tools. You are a good dad! You are a gifted teacher also.
i used your ide for this however i first used the 1-1/2 white foam with the alum on one side. i cut them to fit between the perlings and slid them behind the post even and into the corners,
when i insulated my heated pole shed cabinet shop i put inch and a half of the cheap white styrofoam between the purlins . i used long screws and ran studs vertically and screwed them to the purlins on two foot centers .next i cut two inch pink and put between the studs . i put 5/8 osb on to hang my cabinets and jigs and racking from . the shop is heated with wiresbo and the electric boiler averages 75 dollars a month in the MN winters once i enrolled in the off peak program . you have to be careful not to screw too far and into the exterior metal but that went good once i had the right length screws . the ribs of the metal allowed moisture to transfer outside . I've added windows and ran electrical post insulateing and never found any condensation . it was labor intensive but that what evenings are for . i still have 3 and a half inches between my pink and my osb . comes in handy when i want to run wiring for new tooling or make changes .
Greetings from the Keweenaw Peninsula!!! Nice job insulating your pole barn. Last summer built a 32X48 garage and yes next summer insulation time and heat.
The best to cut it with believe it or not is an electric bread knife, LOL. Nice work on the Shop. I plan on doing pretty much the same thing on mine when i get to it. People always forget maintainability when building things.
So back in 2017 we decided that we wanted to insulate our wood sided pole barn. We looked into the spray foam idea also. We found a company that delt in recovered/Recycled foam board insulation similar to this manufacturer. Was every sheet 100% like new?? No. But at 1/3 of the cost of new we couldn't pass it up. As cutting it, We used a cheap Craftsmen table saw, And it worked great.
I have used metal screen on the bottom of the walls to keep mice out with great success. Years ago I learned it is entirely possible to get a structure too tight to where the air goes bad especially with a wood stove . People have died from this / see air to air heat exchangers. They can be built with coraplast core. I have also gotten into building 4” air lines in under the floor to the stove and make the stove airtight.
Hell, MI, ha-ha-ha. My Dad used to say he went through Hell (MI) to get to Climax (MI). I responded he should have taken Hwy 69, would have been quicker!
Crude joke but if any youngsters are offended, I would say how do they know what the joke is about? It's like the time the song Mony-mony by Billy idol played at a Piston's game. The Dad behind me got in my face about the chorus and I said, I was saying "Hey, get paid get a truck". He looked pretty stupid when I asked what did his pre-teen think I was saying and how does he know what the dirty words are? Boom!
Great to see your daughters in there working with you. Learning to handle tools and solve problems at a young age will serve them well for the rest of their lives!
Thank you for posting!! I am considering building a dome using 2x6's for struts. I"ve come up with a very good concept for the hubs using 3" ABS pipe and bolts. I thought spray foam would be the way to go, but in the back of my mind I still had foam panels because they can be removed, and your video has pretty much cinched the idea. I recently discovered the sheathing tape and combined with the "Great Stuff" spray I think your construction method is what I need for my dome project. Thank You again.
You don't need to put great stuff sealant in between gaps of less than an inch. You just need to tape them over. 99% of their wall is covered by the boards and if you just tape them and seal the air from flowing into the condition to space, those gaps are going to give negligible. You won't even be able to measure the difference between using the great stuff spray foam and not using it. Trust me on this. Basically what I did with my garage was I insulated the walls and the ceiling with traditional fiberglass insulation and then i put building wrap on the inside not on the outside of the building but on the inside and because there is no airflow between the outside and the inside. It's just as good as it's super good. Only cost me 1500 bucks to have somebody else do it. So I'm telling you it's you don't need to use great stuff in between the panels. That's way too much of a detail. You don't need to go through that. That's two labor intensive. Just cut the panels. One quarter inch shy and then put them up and then you just use the tape to seal all the seams and you stop any airflow. It's not going to make a difference if you use great stuff it's just going to increase your labor in your cost
Nice Video and good direction for sure - here is the/a spray foam reference - and I am on board with the installation that you show! It will work well! I have sprayed a few hundred barns in the last 20 years in northern Ohio and always wish for folks to enjoy their buildings. Seems like every barn is built a little different and used in many ways. $4000 is the number I would have been around for your walls at that R value. As has been the case over time my chemical cost runs real close to what you paid for sheets and accessories! I would have also installed baffles at the soffit and sealed them in with foam as I sprayed the walls! Always, always, always be mindful of having quality air in your space, gaining combustion air from outside and understanding how you are managing humidity!
Nice presentation I was going to use foam board and I needed an explanation of how to actually fasten it and use it thank you your presentation was great
you did it right if you build the inside of your building first insulate it then put your siding on if you had put bubble foil next to the metal sheets that is good as it gets
Way to go Dad. Your girls are learning math, survival skills, feedback with love, and many wonderful things for life. Thank you for being there.
Hi Chad, having about 50 years experience as a thermal engineer, just a minor comment on filling the 1/4 inch gaps with 3 inches of foam. I would recommend not filling the full 3" thickness with the foam, but rather just enough thickness, say 1/4", to block air exchange between the outer air volume next to the outer wall and the air volumes in the 1/4 inch gap, leaving the remaining 2.75" of gap with a trapped air volume. Reason being, air is a much better insulator than any insulation material. And with gaps less than about 3/4 inch convection is negligible and the dominant mode of heat transfer will be air conduction, a much better insulator than if that volume was filled with foam. Not a big deal tho since your overall crack area for the 1/4" gaps is small compared to the total insulated wall area. Also if the foam board were available with aluminum foil on one or both sides of the boards, it would increase your overall effective R value even more by greatly reducing any thermal radiation transfer across the external gap (foam board to outer wall) and internal foam board surface to room interior. Just food for thought. But I love your overall approach for avoiding condensation on the outer wall. Good job!
Thank you for the information. There’s so much different info out there addressing this subject it’s a bit overwhelming 😆. We’re considering building a new shop much larger than this one and will see how this one performs.
Do you think this outperforms R19 batt insulation ? I would use the 4’ wide rolls if I go that route. I know the R value is different. But which one performs
Better? Thanks
Not to argue with you but if air was a much better insulator, no one would put insulation in the walls. Just air
@@elderfarms The problem with using air alone in a large wall cavity is the cavity would be large enough so you would get convection (air flow) from warm to cold surfaces and that would destroy the insulation R-value. As SpudW suggests, the narrow horizontal cavities 1/4" high would not support convection over the 3" thickness and the spray foam at the outside and inside of the cavity will keep wind from moving air through the cavity.
Batt insulation is a little better than newspaper...but not much.
I'm at drywall contractor and my daughter helps me all the time. Great to see your daughters learning some life skills. Good job girls and dad. Love the video.
Congrats for being an awesome father. I found my daughter is very receptive to things I show her, including bird hunting and shooting. Your daughters are very fortunate to have you spend time with them and teach important skills. Stay warm.
Greatest part about this is the teachings the the kids are receiving in my opinion. They'll remember helping their rest of their lives. Also, when you set up the wall metal, lay it on horses 10 or so sheets clamped together, layout your purlin location, snap lines, and pre drill several sheets at a time. Even though you might be using self tapping screws, it'll make life a lot easier. Nice looking shop y'all!
😂 we definitely won’t allow our children to loaf around and watch desperate housewives all day! 😂 They do have their daily chores and schoolwork and the rest of the day doing what they want minus electronics. They are happy kids who use their own individual imaginations to keep from being bored. They all have their own hobbies.
Instead of sinking the screws 1", just throw some larger washers on the screws. Drive the screw until the washer dimples the foam board (don't break the facing).
Other thing to consider is if you are doing 3", you can double layer 1.5" foam board and stagger your seams. This helps air seal
Yep, they make plastic and thin galvanized washers for just this purpose
I love that you gave your daughter good safety and work instructions for the oscillating tool; and repeated not to touch anywhere near that blade and to keep good control of it. She can then build confidence in using them why also respecting what they can do both good and bad.
Commercial contractor here - have foam board stacked to the ceiling as I'm preparing to insulate my shop walls in the same manner as you did. Before starting this weekend, I decided to do a quick search for anyone who's used rigid (spray foam quote was 15k for a 30x60x14 shop, yikes!).
Point is that I'm very happy to have found this video - some of the little tips and tricks you shared as you learned your way through this are going to save me a LOT of time and headache. Never thought to leave a gap on the sides - what a great thought as my biggest concern is keeping it tight in order to maintain its effectiveness. Had also been contemplating having an air gap between back of panel and insulation board similar to yours - I think that's the right approach, sir.
Thank you for sharing your experience at such a high level of detail, and for including some justification for why you did certain things the way you did. Dad of two girls as well and that's great that you're showing them the way! Great looking job and thanks again kind sir.
Thanks Justin! Hope you get your insulation done before the cold! Take care!
As soon as I heard you talk, I knew you were from Michigan... it's like I'm listening to someone from my hometown
I've used rigid foam for a number of applications. I even built a refrigerated cabinet for storing vegetables for an organic farmer. For cutting, I tried several things and settled on one. I had a 2" wide x 4" inch long putty knife. I slightly sharpened the 4" side (not even to a knife edge) and it slid through the foam like butter. I used my 48" aluminum t-square for a straight edge.
You just answered a bunch of questions I was having about my own situation. Great information. I love what you are doing. Keep doing it!
Glad I could help! Take care and good luck on your project
You made me smile when you were showing your daughter how to do it! Tell her her braided hair looked great! I have 3 girls of my own, all growed-up. Miss those times of teaching them new stuff.
Awesome, i too may need to do the same. My garage is large like yours. You may check into steel wool to shove in holes for mice. Learn long ago from old country folks. Works great, it hurts them to much to chew it.
But doesn't it rust into powder from humid air?
I did this but I used 2, 1-1/2” thick panels stacked to make 3” where the seems were offset so there was no air leakage and no need to spray the gaps with extra foam
Was this about the same price as 3”?
Good thinking. The problem with spray foam between sections is expansion: where does material go, and will it cause problems? Doing this to the underside of the roof for example could block air wash completely - so much for ridge caps doing anything useful. Dedicated foamboard adhesive reacts with minimal expansion.
As for sealing around electrical boxes, I like firestop: goes in with a caulking gun and tacks nicely - it only expands in event of fire.
This is what I came up with for my pole building after the sky high spray foam quote . Super nice to see someone besides me used this technique. Looks great ..Thank for making the video
Thank you
As a fire inspector very glad you are placing the foam behind a thermal barrier. That foam will turn the place into the Station Nightclub if left exposed. ALSO.....great fathering. My teen daughter is very comfortable with power tools and helps build all the time. Even has her own chainsaw.
No.. it won't.
@@hillaryclinton1314 yes, it will. it burns like napalm.
Is the 1 1/2” space between the back of the foam sheet and the inside of the metal wall the “thermal barrier”? And if so, how does that prevent the foam from burning in a fire?
I am totally jealious you having all that family help.
Make yourself a family to help you.
Very Detailed! Great job in explaining your actions and including your daughters in the action! Great job as a father! Keep up the good work!
Thank you.
I LOVE the you are teaching your girls to do this...!!!
Hey Chad. Your girls are learning so much from you and getting the hands-on experience with everything they do. That's just so awesome! So proud of them. Take care.
Thank you Julie! You take care too! Hope you’re having a great weekend so far!
Your doing an awesome job and it looks like your helpers are learning and having a great time with dad take care
Spend the money on interior girts! Well worth it! You have come
So far. Not doing so will compromise your whole project. The screw heads taking cold temps from the outside girt will likely get very cold
And condense inside your building . Hand the steel on board that is Inside the insulation. Less bridges and less problems!
I'm glad i saw your video. Just got a metal storage building and needed to find a way to stop the sweating. Nice to teach your daughters, my dad thought we we're to stupid
Sometimes it’s hard for dads to get on their daughter’s level and understand them and not make them feel like we think they’re stupid. Sometimes my daughters question my thoughts.
He used 3” thick Owens-Corning Foamular 250 sheets with R-15.
1) 11:42 Scoring the panels and then breaking them apart will result in an uneven edge. Best to cut with table saw, circular saw, electric kitchen knife, or even a regular hand saw for wood.
2) He installed the sheets over some horizontal 1X’s so there’s a 1 1/2” air gap between the inside of the metal walls and the back of the 3” thick foam panels. This air gap should allow any possible moisture to dry up.
3) All foam panels were cut so there was a 1/4” gap between the edges. This 1/4” gap made it much easier to fit the panels.
4) 6:17 The spray foam that bled out was easily trimmed off after drying later using a multi tool. Keep it flat!
5) 14:24 He left a gap around the wall outlets and stuffed it with regular pink FG insulation so he get replace or modify later.
6) Some in comments used two 1 1/2” thick sheets STAGGERED to avoid the gap between sheets and filling with foam and trimming later. See the comments that I liked below for more information.
Great video! Thanks for sharing your experience. I'll be putting up an identical steel building and the difference in cost with and without the insulation options is HUGE. I like the way you did it. Much appreciated.
I used a Japanese saw to cut that stuff a while back ....the blade is much thinner, cuts like butter.
Excellent job describing why & how!
I have great respect for any man that will teach his girls as well as his boys real life skills they can take with them long after we are gone! More men should be doing this. Raising helpless women is not setting forth a good example for our women. This man is a testimony of how to teach your women to survive and to thrive! My respect and salute goes to you sir and your girls. Damn proud of you and of them! Press on!
Thank you Mark! Have a great night!
Hello Chad and your lovely family wow you did a very great job and your lovely girls help dad I know you are very busy with work but I hope you won't wait so long to post a new video just say I just enjoy watching you with your beautiful children they really love you daddy you are so blessed may God keep on blessing you and your beautiful wife and children Rosa
Thanks so much Rosa.
@@9252LIFE 😉☺️💚💜💙you are so welcome I just love watching your beautiful young ladies
Only thing I'd suggest doing differently is using 1.5" foam in two layers with the seams staggered. It's more cutting, but then you can skip the spray foam to save some money. Nail the first layer on, then use adhesive on the second layer.
Oh boy, you sure wouldn't do that if valued your time.
@@jamescole3152 faster than trying to fill the gap between sheets with expanding foam.
@@jamescole3152 also money... the 1.5 inch is more expensive lmao. And no expanding foam is way faster, just don't bother cutting it off, leave it.
@@gg-gn3re current price at Menards 2x1.5" is only $1.04 more expensive, than 1x3", so pretty close in cost.
@@sizelov That could add up for a larger shops but it is only about $15 more for a 12x40' wall. Adhesive is probably about the same cost as spray foam but you would use more. My guess is all things being equal it is the same price and about the same time but probably better results.
Awesome to include the kids. Parenting done right!
Wow, y'all are really makin' this garage a super professional place to build the cars that I am still dying for. Great job!
Thank you Paulla!
I'm SOO GLAD you guys aren't STRUGGLING anymore like you were before! You're actually making progress and that has to feel really good!??
Oh man yes ! It’s nice not spinning our wheels all the time for sure!
Great video. You really covered a lot of important issues. My building is going up right now. First priority for me is the rat guard. Thanks from middle Tennessee.
you and your crew are doing a heckuva job
Thanks Rob!
I built a life size wooly mammoth using about a hundred cans of spray foam and other stuff. It came out great but was a learning experience
Greetings from Milan Mi. Thanks for sharing what you learned. I agree that this stuff will be much more future proof if you needed to make repairs or change something.
I converted my 28x28 stick built two car garage that has traditional 8-ft studs for the walls but it's on a 18-in cinder block perimeter so it gives me almost 10 ft tall ceilings and I converted that to a and the plan is to use insulated sheets on the inside and then brick the inside with real brick veneer about a third of an inch thick. So it'll look like a Brooklyn loft but it has traditional fiberglass insulation in the walls and then we're using 2 inches of foam on the interior walls. So it'll still breathe out to the outside. But the interior will be and even with just the r19 walls and r38 ceiling, it only takes a small air conditioner to keep it cool
Did something similar redoing my walls. 2 1"inch layers using canned foam as the adhesive. Then Rockwool over the top of it. (R25)
Make sure your air gap can drain out the bottom or your water will fill up with water. Also make sure there are critter screens on both the top and bottom so you can avoid unwanted guests.
Hello, nice to see you are moving along with the Garage. It looks great. Blessings
Thank you Margaret. We hope you’re doing well. Have a great weekend
Agree. As long as you are not getting air inflow from the gaps the effect is relatively negligible with that low insulation value foam.
Could use GE silicon to hold the foam board together. The reason moisture gets between the wall is because if the dew point (63 degrees) lies between the inside temperature and the temperature outside there will be condensation in the wall. You are correct about keeping the temperature the same as the outside temperature.
I know the video was about spray foam but that clip of your trees!!! Those trees and snow ❤❤❤.
Yeah it sure is beautiful out there this time of year!
You're lucky if you can get those 4x8 sheets for $65.
It's crazy that there isn't a more affordable option.
Smart to maintain an air gap and not put foam boards against the metal.
I'm getting ready to build my building and this was very helpful
Looks awesome. I love saving large amounts of money for something so simple to do. You could have even put another 1 1/2 inch foam board in front of that one and made it even better.
Can't agree with you more. Thanks for referencing the greatest, only, source of real truth 😊. Well done.
Keep on keeping on. Take care.
Woops. My phone jumped videos. This went with the latest video.
Nice job. Too late now but for anybody else, use a boric acid powder or solution on the steel behind the foam to kill bugs especially carpenter ants which love to make homes in the foam. I would also use the high expansion great stuff behind the vertical 6x6 to slow down mice using the the girts for runs.
My brother did spray foam on his house. He got an estimate and realized it was cheaper to by the gear and do it himself. He’s a builder contractor and has his own company. Since he has done his and his three kids houses at cost. I have a 130 year old house we plan to do this summer. I was planning ridged foam board but it’s faster and easier to do foam.
The best foam insulation video around. Thanks for covering EVERY detail!
Our pleasure! Thank you
Solid fact based decisions as always. So nice to see your kids involved. You dont learn these skills in school.
So true!
I'm impressed with your forethought and skill.
ya'll did a very good job keep up the good work and keep warm. look out for a polar votex coming down and to the south. be bless and love and safe. thanks for the young ladies help you out that is great,
Thank you! Will do! Take care Billy!
I did basically the same thing you did on my 40' x 60' x 16' pole building worlshop, except I used 4 inch thick panels. I bought the flat roof foam panels (foil on both sides) from an Amish roofer who buys factory seconds. The defects were nearly impossible to find. I didn't find it that hard to cut them to fit snug between the poles. Used a circular saw with an old dull blade set to maximum depth, then finished with a foam cutting hand saw (very wide blade).
I also slid 1.5 inch thick pieces behind the poles and between the girts, extending about 6 inches beyond each side of the poles. Before I found the 4 inch panels I started with 40 sheets of 1.5 inch on my back wall, installing 3 layers and overlapping the seams. Then I found the thicker panels and did my remaining 3 walls with 91 sheets of 4 inch thick panels (they came in wrapped stacks of 10 or 11 sheets). Much cheaper than spray, but MUCH more labor, dust, and time to install.
My ceiling has R-38 fiberglass, purchased in the winter (off season) when it went on sale for 1/2 price.
I am looking at using this method for a dwelling building would it keep the heat in?
@@laceymathers445 It works well for my workshop. With the heat off, it stays at about 50 degrees, even on a cold winter day (20 degrees and windy). One LP infrared heater brings it up to 60 in less than an hour. I have 2 insulated overhead doors, each 12 ft x 12 ft, 1 walkthrough door.
As long as you have a complete thermal break in the ceiling, walls and down to below the floor, it shouldn’t be overly expensive to heat.
I've had to remodel and/or make changes to an existing build that had spray foam. Let me tell you it was a pain in the butt. It sticks to everything. Wires studs sheathing you did the right thing
Thank you! This was very helpful for me since I have never done this before and am getting ready to do my shed before winter here in the upper part of Lower Michigan. Very informative and GREAT tips and tricks!
Thank you
Another great episode! Excellent tutorial on the foam insulation. Autumn looks like she has grown a foot over the winter ❄️we didn't recognize her at first ❤
Thank you. Yea they are all growing too fast!
I, too hate getting heat loss through my crack. I also have problems with putting my foam in that tight crack. I wish I had widened that crack to 1/4" before putting my foam in there. Thanks for the advice on filling that crack!
😂 no problem! Now we’re both professional crack fillers! 😆
Bosch (and others) make a specific jig saw blade for cutting foam that leaves zero mess and works perfectly. 3 pack is like $10…
cuts very nice. though the thicker the foam the harder it gets to keep it square. slight pressure side to side against the jigsaw will cause the blade to deflect and you get a wavy edge. takes a bit of practice getting used to it but its worth it.
Fun fact, those oscillating tools (I call them buzz saws) were originally developed for the medical industry for cutting into rigid cast material. They needed something that wouldn't hurt their patients' limbs when removing the casts, and these don't. They sound mean, but you can gently touch your finger to the tip while it's running and you won't be hurt.
Great to see you Chad. That’s going to be a great year round shop. 🎉
Hi Bruce! Nice hearing from you! How have you been been? House life treating you out west? I believe you said you lived in California?
That was some nice artwork on the panel you were standing in front, Chad. Good video. It has given me some ideas. Thanks.
😆 I’d love to take credit for that but my kids are the artists in our family.. 😝
Thanks Chad. This will help us do the same thing learning from you. Looking forward to how you do the ceiling.
I apologize for being late always love watching what you and everyone all your wonderful kids and your wife as well and all your animals and dogs as well love you all
Also, covering the screws in the foam is a good idea because metal is a conductor, so they are your weakest points regarding the transfer of heat. In fact, on jobs I've done similar to yours, I have removed most or all of the screws and relied on the adhesive nature of the canned spray foam to support the sheets. If you use more than 1 layer of foam, you can lessen the effect of the canned spray foam with staggered joints.
Great Video! I’ll chime in with others, that I serious doubt the 1/4” gap and fill buys you anything, particularly since you taped over the gaps at the end anyway. Had you cut the boards with a (for example) track saw, any gap would have been very small, resulting in a very small space where convective cooling would be nothing. The tape then seals up the cracks so no drafts escape through the crack. Alternatively, if you really wanted to have a double block for insurance, get one of the window and door foam sealants, and just put a bead of it down the middle of the top edge of a bottom foam board before placing the next higher up foam board atop it. Make sure to get only window and door foam sealant as it has limited expansion (regular foam would push your two boards apart). Doing your 1/4” foam gap on the ends abutting the vertical posts is likely a best way to seal that edge as it will also a fix the foam board to the vertical post. Anyhow, great vid and thanks for the insight vs blown foam!
Hey Chad. Been following along since yous started the project. I also have a 30x40. All it's got is bubble wrap between the tin & perlins. I think this is the ticket the way you did it. No studs for bats. Easy to apply wall coverings. 1 section at a time in between the posts. My only problem is the ceiling. No eves or overhangs= no ventilation for a ceiling application. May also try this method in between top of trusses underneath roof. Or I may do blanket insulation up there. Plus, my wood stove pipe runs out the side wall 1foot above the bottom of trusses. Nice job! Look forward to seeing the finished shop! Thanks for the great info as well!
You’d definitely want some sort of ventilation up there. We are about to put out a video on our other channel possibly tomorrow on how we are doing the ceiling. If you don’t know our other channel is Great American Northern Garage. Have a great weekend!
Great job , nice to visit again , thanks for sharing , God bless !
Thanks again Michael
A lot of good information. Awesome video. Keep them all coming. Take care and God Bless y'all always
Thank you Lisa
Looking a lot different from when you first bought the property!! Great job, your girls are awesome to help and learn along the way. All the best up there...
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yes, mice chew through anything, almost. I kept fixing, with spray foam, a hole they were coming in. I finally stuck some course steel wool, then spray foam. They never came in again.
Good looking job - I too checked spray foam for cargo trailer I'm finishing, and yes, it was prohibitive$$! I used Pink Foam too.
Cheers from Lapeer, Michistan.
Nice ideas! Quick note: They are "girts" are on the walls, "purlins" are on the roof.
Thank you
@9252 LIFE I have misused the word "purlin" so many times in my 25 years as a carpenter!
WOW. Beautiful job. You and the girls have been pretty busy. Looks GREAT. Nicely done. Way better looking than the regular messy insulation or the spray stuff. Very nice lines and flat surface. Everything runs in unison together. Love you guys.❤️🥰 Give my girls a high five 🤗
Thank you Joanna ! How have you been?
Nice video. I have used both spray foam and rigid foam board. My spray foam was a DIY kit I thought it would do a large area of my workshop 350 to 400 sqft.
it only covered about 10% of my estimated area. The cans were empty 😮.
I was so disappointed and so frustrated. We now laugh about it. I have learned a 4x8 sheet covers 32 sqft every time. Also it really is 2 or 3” thick.
Glad to see your kids on the job too. I have 5 (4 girls and 1 boy). They always worked with me and learned how to run tools.
You are a good dad! You are a gifted teacher also.
That’s quite the family! Glad you got your boy! 😆
Those foam panels are amazing. Please wear PPE when cutting and or sanding (they make great craft supply). Good call about the VOCs and pollution.
i used your ide for this however i first used the 1-1/2 white foam with the alum on one side. i cut them to fit between the perlings and slid them behind the post even and into the corners,
when i insulated my heated pole shed cabinet shop i put inch and a half of the cheap white styrofoam between the purlins . i used long screws and ran studs vertically and screwed them to the purlins on two foot centers .next i cut two inch pink and put between the studs . i put 5/8 osb on to hang my cabinets and jigs and racking from . the shop is heated with wiresbo and the electric boiler averages 75 dollars a month in the MN winters once i enrolled in the off peak program . you have to be careful not to screw too far and into the exterior metal but that went good once i had the right length screws . the ribs of the metal allowed moisture to transfer outside . I've added windows and ran electrical post insulateing and never found any condensation . it was labor intensive but that what evenings are for . i still have 3 and a half inches between my pink and my osb . comes in handy when i want to run wiring for new tooling or make changes .
Thanks for sharing. We are in winter wondeland too. Nice to have good help😂I’m a empty nester now. But love to do DIY jobs to stay warm for winter ✌️
Greetings from the Keweenaw Peninsula!!!
Nice job insulating your pole barn.
Last summer built a 32X48 garage and yes next summer insulation time and heat.
Greetings Wayne!
@@9252LIFE Glad to meet you
Good for you...Nothing wrong at all with using rigid foam board.
The best to cut it with believe it or not is an electric bread knife, LOL. Nice work on the Shop. I plan on doing pretty much the same thing on mine when i get to it. People always forget maintainability when building things.
Thank you
Good morning how are you today hope you have a great day I like what you're doing to the walls very good keep up the good work happy sunshiney 🌹😍❤️
Good evening! We all had a great day! Not much sunshine but just a beautiful day of some nice fresh crisp winter air. Hope you’re doing well!
You did a great job that works for you. That's all that matters and it will be far better than what you had. Keep doing you brother. 🐾🙏🏻✌🏻
Thank you Scott!
Thanks. I have a small cabin I just made and was thinking about spray foam. Going your way.
So back in 2017 we decided that we wanted to insulate our wood sided pole barn. We looked into the spray foam idea also. We found a company that delt in recovered/Recycled foam board insulation similar to this manufacturer. Was every sheet 100% like new?? No. But at 1/3 of the cost of new we couldn't pass it up. As cutting it, We used a cheap Craftsmen table saw, And it worked great.
I have used metal screen on the bottom of the walls to keep mice out with great success.
Years ago I learned it is entirely possible to get a structure too tight to where the air goes bad especially with a wood stove . People have died from this / see air to air heat exchangers.
They can be built with coraplast core. I have also gotten into building 4” air lines in under the floor to the stove and make the stove airtight.
We installed a rat guard and it seems to work good
@@9252LIFE Screen breaths .
Glad you have a good system.
Chad, such a good thought out process! Your hard effort and research will be rewarded. Enjoy the season 2023! I'm near Hell Michigan.
Thanks! It sounds much warmer near your side of Michigan! 😆
Hell, MI, ha-ha-ha. My Dad used to say he went through Hell (MI) to get to Climax (MI). I responded he should have taken Hwy 69, would have been quicker!
Crude joke but if any youngsters are offended, I would say how do they know what the joke is about?
It's like the time the song Mony-mony by Billy idol played at a Piston's game. The Dad behind me got in my face about the chorus and I said, I was saying "Hey, get paid get a truck". He looked pretty stupid when I asked what did his pre-teen think I was saying and how does he know what the dirty words are? Boom!
it's great your teaching your kids how to do it themselfs
Great to see your daughters in there working with you. Learning to handle tools and solve problems at a young age will serve them well for the rest of their lives!
Thanks & wow the girls are getting so tall ! I'll be looking for the next video i got all the bell checked !
Yea they are! Hope you’re doing well! Take care!
House wrap before the tin install on the outside would have very beneficial. Great videos btw
We did not build the building but if we did we definitely would’ve used a wrap of some sort.
Thank you for posting!! I am considering building a dome using 2x6's for struts. I"ve come up with a very good concept for the hubs using 3" ABS pipe and bolts. I thought spray foam would be the way to go, but in the back of my mind I still had foam panels because they can be removed, and your video has pretty much cinched the idea. I recently discovered the sheathing tape and combined with the "Great Stuff" spray I think your construction method is what I need for my dome project. Thank You again.
You don't need to put great stuff sealant in between gaps of less than an inch. You just need to tape them over. 99% of their wall is covered by the boards and if you just tape them and seal the air from flowing into the condition to space, those gaps are going to give negligible. You won't even be able to measure the difference between using the great stuff spray foam and not using it. Trust me on this. Basically what I did with my garage was I insulated the walls and the ceiling with traditional fiberglass insulation and then i put building wrap on the inside not on the outside of the building but on the inside and because there is no airflow between the outside and the inside. It's just as good as it's super good. Only cost me 1500 bucks to have somebody else do it. So I'm telling you it's you don't need to use great stuff in between the panels. That's way too much of a detail. You don't need to go through that. That's two labor intensive. Just cut the panels. One quarter inch shy and then put them up and then you just use the tape to seal all the seams and you stop any airflow. It's not going to make a difference if you use great stuff it's just going to increase your labor in your cost
Nice Video and good direction for sure - here is the/a spray foam reference - and I am on board with the installation that you show! It will work well! I have sprayed a few hundred barns in the last 20 years in northern Ohio and always wish for folks to enjoy their buildings. Seems like every barn is built a little different and used in many ways. $4000 is the number I would have been around for your walls at that R value. As has been the case over time my chemical cost runs real close to what you paid for sheets and accessories! I would have also installed baffles at the soffit and sealed them in with foam as I sprayed the walls! Always, always, always be mindful of having quality air in your space, gaining combustion air from outside and understanding how you are managing humidity!
I have a metal building too, I agree spray is too expensive and has drawbacks, my plan is foam board and I do the labour...
Nice presentation I was going to use foam board and I needed an explanation of how to actually fasten it and use it thank you your presentation was great
Thank you.
you did it right if you build the inside of your building first insulate it then put your siding on if you had put bubble foil next to the metal sheets that is good as it gets
you seem like a cool dude and have a nice family. Very informative video
Thanks
Hey buddy, the perlins are in the roof. The horizontals in the walls are the girts. Great job and thorough that you're doing...😉
Thank you.
Looks like you have some artists in the family. 🙂
Lol you seem that? 😆
Great video! Good information and this will help me with a future garage project. Thank you!