Spider-Man Homecoming - Sibling Rivalry
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- Опубліковано 27 вер 2024
- Did Marvel finally get Spider-Man right? Doug and Rob talk about the web slinging hero in his latest reboot, Spider-Man Homecoming.
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Keaton finally lived long enough to see himself become the villain.
You wanna get bird nuts? Come on! Lets get bird nuts!
Did you catch the subtle Batman references?
Batman > Birdman > guy in a bird costume. Keaton likes his comic characters with wings.
+Robin Thrush I think saying "Vulture" would've worked just as well. Or is that his name in the movie?
Bunny in the Box "Old is evil" cliche.
Oh, didn't know Doug went into cosplaying. Gotta say, his Walter White is on point.
not funny, he was diagnosed with cancer after watching Norm of the North
Coincidence? I think NOT.
KID really?
PriceyYeti40 lmao
10 years of Nostalgia Critic he is having his Heisenberg midlife crisis
Peter's development was really blatant, actually - from the very beginning of the movie, he wants to join the Avengers and be a big hero, but by the end he turns down Tony Stark's offer to join and accepts that he just wants to help the little guy and protect his neighborhood instead of fighting big Avengers battles. His arc is growing up and learning to narrow down your dreams to something realistic. And it makes sense he'd come to that, with him constantly being over his head every time he tries to prove something. He thinks he needs something bigger in his life (Avengers, global heroism, etc.) when everything he actually needs is already there (a best friend, an aunt, a community close to him that needs him)
It's not about thinking more realistically about what you want. The moral is actually about finding your place in the world. Spidey eventually realized that there was a gaping hole that the Avengers won't cover when it comes to being superheroes that he could easily fill. I think the way Feige described it was the best: "The difference between Spidey and the other heroes is that the other heroes are looking up, while Spidey is looking down. So while the other heroes are tackling a really large problem. Spidey notices that the little guy needs help dealing with the same problem, as well."
Feige's quote doesn't denounce that. He said "Spidey notices that the little guy needs help dealing with the same problem, as well." Responsibility. There was nothing there in the quote to say whether or not he wants the power or not but that he has the responsibility to look out for people.
I don't think its so much narrowing down his dreams into something realistic as realizing the unspoken mantra (at least in this movie) of Spiderman which is "With great power comes great responsibility". He is literally given this extraordinary power when Tony gives him the new Spiderman suit and he has NO idea how to control or respect the power he is given (mostly because he is still a kid playing with a very expensive toy and also because Tony gives him this insane suit and then Happy is completely WORTHLESS as a babysitter and utterly fails at looking after him and literally doesn't care until the very end). At all. He wants to be the hero and emulate the Avengers, and I think he sees Tony as this father-figure who he wants to earn respect from, but he is still just a kid. A clumsy, irresponsible kid who is so desperate to prove himself worthy that he can't realize that sometimes being the hero means ASKING FOR HELP. Like when he literally ripped the ferry in half and almost killed people. Or when he was fighting the Vulture and crashing a plane. Or when the Vulture threatened him with a gun. Yes, Tony took the suit after the Ferry incident and said "If the suit is all that matters, you shouldn't have it" (which is a great part of Peter's growth as a character) but then they never followed through with making sure he stayed out of trouble. In the end, when Tony offered to make him an Avenger, I do think he wanted to be the friendly neighborhood Spiderman, but I also don't think he wasn't ready to shoulder the responsibility of being something bigger yet.
@@awesomeinspector5270 I felt like Daredevil and the other mcu heroes on Netflix kind of captured that better....
Sibling rivalry in a nutshell
doug: It was OK
rob: *sigh*
😂
you're right doug sees the good in movies more than his brother.
"Best part is [the villain]."
Wow, that's gotta be the first time anyone has said that about an MCU film.
MagusMirificus he is the best Spiderman movie villain and I'll tell you why:
He doesn't see himself as a villain, he sees nothing wrong with stealing these things and justifies it by saying he's doing it for his family. And what solidified him is towards the end when he's giving his monologue about "oh the rich and the powerful they don't care about us, they live in their glass ivory towers." But you look at his house and he pretty much lives in a mansion with a lot of glass windows. He's so blinded that he doesn't realize he's become what he preaches to hate.
First time they had Keaton.
Also, quite a few ladies have said Loki was the best part of Avengers.
Don't be a bitch --we _just_ got an awesome villain from *_Guardians 2_* a few months ago.
Paradox Acres Oh, I'm definitely not on the "All Marvel villains suck" train. I loved Ultron, I enjoyed Loki, and I liked both Guardians villains. It's just not every day you hear someone say "Hands down, best part of this MCU movie was the villain."
Paradox Acres but he wasn't the best part
I thought Flash was popular in this one because he was rich (going by his dad's car) and people liked the gadgets he had access to like the DJ booth.
That's you making up a backstory that the movie doesn't bother to tell though. Characters need motivation and at least a purpose. If this incarnation of Flash Thompson wasn't in the movie, would there be anything missing?
@@nidebau Yes, Flash would be missing. It doesn't matter why he's popular, it matters that he is.
To be fair, the other girl is Liz Allen, who Peter Parker did used to crush on in high school, he didn't really meet Mary Jane until final year and didn't meet Gwen until college. Sorry I know that's a lame comeback, but it is a canon thing.
Exactly what I was thinking I haven't even seen the movie yet and I knew they had Liz in this movie
Wait, what? Is that a retcon? He met Gwen first.
Thank you, man. As someone who knows nothing about the stories in the comics, I never knew that Liz was an actual character in the Spider-Man universe. I thought she was just a filler character for the movie until either MJ or Gwen showed up. You taught me something. :)
I enjoyed how Tony Stark was kept in the sidelines in the movie. He didn't take over or wasn't in it for too little. His inclusion was just right. I want to see more of Tony Stark in the Spiderman movies; his father-son relationship with Peter is too precious.
I'd say Tony's more of the Drunk Uncle who's barely useful but means well.
I don't think it's a good idea to give Peter another uncle. That doesn't end well.
Meh, if Tony can survive a handicap match against Captain America & Bucky..then I think he can survive a mugging.
OK, fine, you can have a like for that one.
Paradox Acres I feel sorry for the poor fool that tries to rob Tony Stark.
The Vulture is legitimately intimidating here.
Let me add to the (likely) chorus of comments, but Spider-Man started as a teenager and had his most iconic origin moments as a teenager. It's kind of a defining characteristic. In an era where teens weren't anything more than sidekicks, Spider-Man was his own hero, without anyone telling him what to do. That's basically what this movie built to. So, yeah, you're going to get mostly teen Spider-Man, and maybe they'll probably cap off with his college years. But him being young is the point. We've seen adult Spider-Man. But the years that really shaped him are usually barely touched on.
Digital Jedi Master That isn't the issue, the issue is that this film was lacking what made Spider-Man who he is. Being a teenager is a poor excuse as I am the same age that he was in the film and even I felt that the reason behind him in this film was shallow. Being that age he would have been more destrought over the loss of Ben as it would have happened recently, not drooling over Stark's approval.
Wait how would you know it happened recently. There was no mentioned for when it happened. For all we know it could have happened years before civil war. Also, don't generalize how people deal with sadness. Assumptions are not legit criticism. All i can see from the comment is you did not like the movie because you didn't want to, not because of legit objective criticism.
Ben not being a major factor is not an issue. Spiderman have entertained the idea of multiple realities/dimensions, so this is simply one where Ben is not a major factor.
Wait, wait, wait...the first half of the movie, you guys have no idea what is driving Peter? Um, he helped the Avengers and then had to go back to school. He spends the movie texting Happy because after getting a taste of being a real superhero, Tony sends him back to his ordinary life where he's bored out of his mind. The first half is shallow because Peter feels like he has been put on hold and nothing special is going on in his life. What I appreciated about this movie is that Peter is a real person. With most superhero movies, you generally get no sense of who the person is when they're not saving the world. The movie feels like a string of big action moments smattered with a few random conversations. Every scene is telling you something important rather than showing you the person's life. The movie rounded out Peter's life and gave the movie a chance to breathe. You knew who his friends were, you saw who he was at school, and you saw the bond between him and Aunt May. Sorry to write a book, but come on, guys. Also, did you really need them to mention Uncle Ben? We all know the story. When May freaked out about calling all of the hospitals, the movie trusts you to know why. They don't insult your intelligence by spelling it out.
Agreed
Christ Snell, agreed
In the comics and the Rami Spider-Man Peter started his Spider-Man career to make money. He needed the death of Uncle Ben to set him on the heroic path.
It appears the Peter Parker of the MCU universe is doing the right thing because he is a good person. He has the same basic motivation as Captain America, the kid from Kick Ass, or the Mystery Men.
Christy Snell Yaaas! Preach. 🙌🏼👏🏼
Yea and in this version It's not needed because there is already a driving force for him to do good. He got enticed by iorn man in civil war got a taste and decided that he needed it to be fulfilling in his life. Uncle Ben doesn't need to be a motivating factor in Peters life.
That is kinda part of the problem though. Peter is about responsibility. He isn't about impressing Iron-man and getting the adrenaline rush back. That goes against his nature. Being Spidey is his curse.
No offense, but that is some of the same hubris at the wrestling match that got Uncle Ben killed.
"He has no redeeming qualities - how is he popular?"
Man, I asked myself that so many times when I was in high school. That part didn't strike me as unrealistic to be honest.
Lol, true dat
Oh so the joke is that you’re popular. Ha ha very funny joke indeed!
R S uhhh
@Otneimica Made that all about Trump did ya?
They DO mention the spider bite. Peter tells Ned that, Ned is asking if the spider can bite him and questioning whether it would be worth the pain, and Peter says, "The spider's dead Ned." And regarding Uncle Ben, you remember when the first Shocker pulls the gun on Aaron Davis? If you look very closely, I'm 90% sure that you can see the eyes of the suit widen a little. To me, the thought process of Peter is clear: "Not again. Not like what happened to Uncle Ben." Especially considering the next thing that happened was he dropped down and yelled "Hey if you're going to shoot at someone shoot at me!"
Christian Deepe This comment
Christian Deepe So, I'm really confused. I don't know Spider-Man. My introduction to him was in Civil War. Could you explain the spider bite thing cause normal spiders don't give people powers. Where'd it come from? I thought his powers were in the suit until that line in the film about the dead spider. Also, I'm sorry but who's Ben? Why was he shot? Thanks
Thunderbolt8296 you...you can't be serious?
Thunderbolt8296 The spider was a radioactive spider and it gave him heightened senses, super strength, spider sense(danger detector), and the ability to stick to stuff. He doesn't per se need the suit but it helps him that's why he could fight Vulture without it. Uncle Ben was his father figure who was shot because Peter let a criminal get away with what he was doing.
Thunderbolt8296 really? Well he was bitten by a radioactive spider (he was invented in the 60s so this is typical comic stuff). It gives him a bunch of powers and he puts on a suit to hide his identity and uses his powers to make money on TV. Eventually Peter sees a robber being chased and instead of stopping him, he lets him pass as he's sees it not his problem. Eventually his uncle Ben is shot and Peter goes after his murderer and stops him. But it turns out the killer is the same robber that Peter ignored. Peter then decides to become a hero.
Doug Luthor
Vin Diesel's nerdy cousin.
If Lex Luthor Sr. appears in Justice League, Soug MUST play him in the reenactment-review.
Garrick Groover but Doug is likable
Doug is Heisenberg.
SpiderMan: Homecoming staring Michael Keaton as Birdman
Rurouni Kenshin is a perfect example of a manga/anime that doesn't get into the origin story of the hero until the final two arcs. The first season just introduces a former assassin w/ a cross-shaped scar on his face and a reverse-blade katana. The 2nd season then delves into his childhood training. But it's not until the last manga arc where it's finally revealed why he went from a fearsome killer to someone who doesn't kill, as well as how he got his scar.
jp3813 Thumbs up for mentioning Kenshin ^_^x
jp3813 Another awesome one is Cowboy Bebop that doesn't introduce the main characters' backstory in detail until the very end.
I would like to add Berserk as well, the first arc (Black Swordsman Arc) is sort of an introduction of the world but you don't get to the origin of the protagonist until the second arc (Golden Age).
Hey it's Charles Xavier!!! No wait.. it's Doug
MyName is Jeff so Doug Xavier?
MyName is Jeff 😂😂😂
MyName is Jeff if he starts to ramble about Taco Bell run.
I was gonna say Heisenberg, but that works too.
You guys forgot the part where he is crushed and takes the responsibility upon himself to get out
bearbaughgames And that was probably a recreation of one of the most iconic scenes in his comics. I loved the recreation. It actually got me near to tears.
best scene of the movie.
bearbaughgames They talk about that in their Spiderverse review. It’s a nice scene, and well acted, but it suffers due to the lack of stakes. In the cómics, he needed to get out to save Gwen. He would have given up if not for his devotion to the people he loves. Here, other then saving himself there’s no real incentive to get up. “Oh no, Tony’s shit will get stolen.” In the long run, it’s not good but it’s not nearly as good a motivator as “the love of my life will die in front of my eyes if I do not get my shit together.”
@@JavierPerez-cx4jw ............No.......in the comics it is because aunt May is dying and she needed the serum from Peter's blood being radioactive during a blood transfusion she got earlier.
Please don't be like those guys who says "like the comics" but hasn't actually read them. What you are probably thinking of is Spectacular Spider-Man
Elias Khan Fuuuuuuck. Ok that’s my bad. I confused the two. The point still stands. He did it to save someone he loved, not for self preservation or to save Mr. Starks stuff.
From the creators of "Don't show us Bruce's parents death again, Nolan!" and its sequel "Really, why are you showing us the death of Bruce's parents, Snyder!" comes the end of the epic trilogy in the form of "Why u not show us uncle Ben death again!" Really, true masters of their craft.
Кирилл Поповкин To their credit, Batman has had a LOT more media attention than Spiderman. From the 60s Batman to Burton to Schumaker to all the animated series/movies to Nolan and Snyder... each one of those (except the 60s one) has a flash back to the Wayne murders (hell even Gotham did it). We have seen it so many times that we dont need to see it again. Spiderman is still a relatively 'new' character in mainstream media so they are arguing that we still need that grounding. But I, for one, am GLAD Marvel scrapped an origin story tbh...
Yeah, it sort of is true, but... Really, who watches Batman from 60s or even Burton's version nowadays? Relative popularity and number of movies is not a good arguments in this case. To put it simply, Doug says "well, if a person does not know, he will be confused" - okey, but who is that person? Spider-man is one of most popular superheroes, if someone knows something about superheroes, it's that Superman came from Krypton, Bruce Wayne lost his parents and Peter Parker is sort of responsible for the death of his uncle Ben.
And telling this story third time in less then 20 years, in which this movies were rebooted three times... How is it different from Batman?
Anna C Still new? He's Marvel's flagship character, he's had hundreds of comics, several animated series (they even used an orchestral version of the original theme in Homecoming), has appeared in 7 movies in the last 15 years, & has multiple video games, with one still being hailed as one of the PS2's best games & a new one coming out next year on the PS4.
Anna C,
" Spiderman is still a relatively 'new' character in mainstream media so they are arguing that we still need that grounding."
Spider-man has been around in tv and/or movies in some form every decade since the 1960s. The only way a person wouldn't know his background is if that person made a point not to learn it.
I'll double that. I mean - I am a russian who lived in the center of nowhere his whole childhood and teenage years, and i still know Spider-man backstory.
Peter isn't Spider-man just to impress the Avengers or his girlfriend in this film, you can realize that not just from the ending of the film that pretty much spells it out for you, but also troughout the movie, like the pool scene when he pretty much ditches his crush to get to the bad guy while disobeying Tony Stark, or the party scene where he doesn't relly want to show up in the party. I do agree that this film suffers from being part of the massive industry, because you actually learn what drives Peter in this Universe in civil war from dialogue, but not nearly as much as other Marvel films of movies in general these days, I would count this as a step in the right direction.
But why did he reject Stark's offer? The entire film he was only doing things so that it would impress Tony, not because he felt that he was responsible for the lives of many. I litteraly had no idea why he said no to Tony when I was in the theater. And you can't just say that what drives him is in Civil War. If anything they should have explored what he had mentioned in Civil War rather than just saying "Well he told STARK his motivations in a film that wasn't even his." And being the same age as he is in the film I felt appalled about how he never for once stopped to think about his vain thirst for glory and actually take a look at why the Vulture needs to be stopped or how Aunt May is holding up emotionally. The excuse of being a teenager is garbage as even I know that wanting glory shouldn't be the reason behind helping people. To be honest this film completely missed the point behind Spiderman (though the writing and the performances were done well) that being how Spiderman is an independent hero who's interests don't lie in being a big time hero, but are there because of how he learned that having these powers means that he has s moral obligation to help those in need. Whether it be big scale of small scale. Not the need to impress.
He thought it was a test of character. He went through all the stuff without the suit and realized that he can still do good without going full Avenger yet.
But why is he doing it? Why is he a hero?
The one cringe worthy moment was the "Peter knows Spider-Man!" Moment, but that was more of a funny cringe.
Andrew Kim It's perfect for that sort of "high school cringe." Because high schoolers are extremely cringey, I sure as hell was, I had no sense of humor and said some of the stupidest shit.
Andrew Kim I cringed at the vlogging part at the beginning tbh
it's suppose to be cringe
@@erickmartinez5631 just like spider-man 3
“F-Thor” was funny cringe
To me, the movie was not about the events, but more of a character study of Peter Parker. This is my favorite Marvel movie for this reason. It marks a huge shift in how superhero movies are made, and I'm thankful it's as successful as it is.
Doug Walker on every movie ever: "Ehh....it's okay!"
Hyro Except GOTG2 and Thor Ragnarok
*My theory:*
The Uncle Ben incident was shown in the Deadpool 2 Teaser called "No Good Deed."
End of story.. Look up the video if you want..
RonJon 😂
If you told us that the emo girl was MJ at the beginning it would ruin ALL the romantic tension with the main girl because we would know MJ exists and MJ will win. Also, do you really want to see a third origin story. When Superman v batman came out I seem to remember people complaining that the dedicated time to showing Bruce's parents get shot.
Michelle Jones, not Mary Jane.
Sajirou Plays he didn't even say Mary Jane he only called her MJ, which is correct
ragmondead Yea there was also a TON of people bitching because they were afraid this Spider-man was going to re-do the origin story. I get what Rob is saying. They could have thrown in a line or 2 about Uncle Ben like when May and Peter are out eating a "Your Uncle would have been so proud of you" line. But on the other hand it's hard to throw that at the audience without saying what exactly happened and why Peter may feel responsible so from that perspective it would be better to hide behind "We just don't want to talk about right now." Sure it's shallow but I don't think they wanted to roll everything out in this movie. I think in the 2nd movie we are going to dig deeper.
For me, Spider-Man is a character that can have a different motivation other than guilt over the death of a family member, and still stay essentially Spider-Man. Uncle Ben could have died a million ways, and they could have had a lot of time pass where they get back to their lives and not have to constantly bring him up. I dig the idea of a kid who sees heroes on the TV saving the city, then he gets powers and wants to imitate those he worships. It is consistent with Civil War and what Peter saw in NYC, which serves as good motivation as any.
For me, Spider-Man is a character that can have a different motivation other than guilt over the death of a family member, and still stay essentially Spider-Man. Uncle Ben could have died a million ways, and they could have had a lot of time pass where they get back to their lives and not have to constantly bring him up. I dig the idea of a kid who sees heroes on the TV saving the city, then he gets powers and wants to imitate those he worships. It is consistent with Civil War and what Peter saw in NYC, which serves as good motivation as any. You guys are a little too stuck on Canon. This character has been worked on by many writers, and has a lot more wiggle room in his motivation for hero-ing than, say, Superman.
If they did go to details of the origin again, critics would complain that they are just repeating the same thing too many times...
exactly
You don't have to go into them you just have to ground the universe with details that tie the movie back to the origin that we already know. One or two lines about Ben would have made Holland's Spiderman seem to be more than just some do gooder, he could have been a deep three dimensional character that has limitless potential growth in future movies.
There are "one or two lines" that refer to his origin if you pay attention, when Peter gives Tony an altered version of the "with great power comes great responsibility" speech in civil war, when Peter says to Ned in this movie that he can't tell aunt may because of all she's ben through which is an obvious reference to Uncle Ben's death especially since we never see him around, he was aunt mays husband and its the only tragic event that occurs early in spiderman's career (been spider man for less than year). Also Ned says in following scene "so you were bitten by a spider". Also whats this from the MCU wiki? : marvelcinematicuniverse.wikia.com/wiki/Ben_Parker
That is nonsensical. Simply stating she has been through a lot is not enough to ground your movie with a general audience, especially when you are changing so much from the source material. And your second line is in civil war which isn't this movie. Obviously I know what they are referencing I have seen all of the major cinematic spider-man movies and all of the avengers movies; however, if you ask every person who came out of that movie having never heard of spiderman why spiderman wants to be a superhero what answer would you get? Probably something to the effect of the greater good. Compare that to the true story behind spiderman and the reason he is such a deep hero and it is a huge missed opportunity to establish a deep character. These are things that should be integral to his character as a hero not easter eggs you infer from past comic knowledge.
Recast the vulture with Doug
Nicholas Borg yes
Nicholas Borg Doug should be mysterio
Doug should've been Lex Luther, instead of Jesse Eisenberg.
And Rob should play the Kangaroo.
PFFFT, I looked that up and OMG that's an actual character?! XD
To answer you Flash Thompson question, I'm pretty sure it's because his family is rich. I thought the fact that his dad gave him a nice car to use to drive his date to the prom was proof of that. They never said it, but I thought that's what was being implied.
Mason Henderson it was really easy to figure out to me, and relatable to my high school experience: Flash is jealous of a kid that is smarter, better liked, more fit than him. Flash tries to bring Parker down a peg to make himself feel better, and all he has going for him is his family's money. And Peter mostly ignored him, I until a girl is wstching. They're able to weave their dynamic into the movie without having to smack us over the head with it. Too bad the Bros. here are so stuck in Canon they can't appreciate it.
Juan Pablo Rojas Agreed. While I understand their complaint about not giving us enough backstory for some of these characters, I think overall the subtlety of it all was rather refreshing instead of giving us all the cliched stories we've seen in a Spiderman movie before.
*Complains when batman films show the backstory you've seen a million times and everybody knows*
*Complains when a spider man film doesn't show the backstory you've seen twice already and everybody knows*
This spiderman needed explaining because his storyline is radically different than what we are used to. If they decided to make a batman movie and change the story, they damn well better explain it. If its what we already know, we dont need it explained again
EmptyAltruism it's not that different. Spider bites parker - uncle Ben dies - parker feels regret and becomes spiderman - ensuing superhero adventures. We just get to pick up at the adventures part
@@EmptyAltruism >"his storyline is radically different than..."
Okay but this is about his origin as Spider-Man. That's the same, and we never need to see it again.
@@gabrielhoran4525 "Spider bites parker - uncle Ben dies - parker feels regret and becomes spiderman"
That's not in the movie though. Also the problem is not the missing backstory per se but a motivation for Peter.
Millions vs Twice
"before we get to the negative" ---- is negative the whole time. -_-
The movie was stupid and shallow so yeah
couldn't disagree ,more
They really weren't though. They were overall positive about the film and recomended you see it if you hadn't already. Nothing is above criticism, and whether you agree with it or not you can't completely ignore criticism simply because you like the object of critique.
he was talking about after they said that.
I feel the movie had A LOT of wasted potential
My mother's a casual viewer, she's hasn't seen Civil War or any Avengers movie really, but she's seen the odd Iron Man movie and the first Toby Maguire Spiderman movie - she liked this movie and didn't seem lost by anything mentioned from the greater MCU
thePirateQueenKt 👌🏽👌🏽👌🏽👌🏽
thePirateQueenKt who gives a shit
Evidently not you, coming out of the gate swinging a little hard for some reason :P They talked about whether or not casual viewers would enjoy this movie, my answer is yes.
"I'm not really sure if spiderman had a character arc yet" That shows me you didn't pay attention AT ALL when watching this film.
His arc was all about him finding the best way he could be useful within the Hero Community.
tcrpgfan Really? I thought his character aec was being arrogant and thinking he was "all this" but in reality he is just a kid and he is immature and inexperienced, and as soon as he realizes this he understands that he doesn't need, and probably shouldn't have, all the gimmicks and tech of the suit. Besides, he fought Vulture rather competently without Stark's suit.
That's all part of it. It's one of those things where if you think about it, it makes sense. Like with him aiming for a spot on the A team. It's what he thinks he wants, he just doesn't know how to get it. When he finally does get a chance to join he's like 'nah, I'd like to look out for the little guy.'
Sorry, but having a recycled arc from iron man 3 is not a real character arc
@mounir maged Sorry, but wether you liked it or not, it doesn't change the fact that it WAS a real character arc. Period. And though it might seem like it's the same arc as Tony in IM3, it really isn't. Also, their motivations are completely different.
Glad they didn't do the "spider bite" or "Uncle Ben" thing. We've seen it before twice. Don't need it a third time.
G Mon they did mention he got bit by a spider
Diurno MX I meant showing it in the movie. Glad they didn't spend another 30 minutes showing us what we already know happened.
G Mon The didn't need 30 minutes to show something like that, maybe just a quick flashback.
But they have to ESTABLISH what actually happened.
In this version I'm not even sure if Uncle Ben is dead or just *divorced* from Aunt May. As Doug & Rob pointed out: this Peter doesn't even _act_ like he just lost someone he loved. Like, where's the _grief_ ..?
They at least mentioned the Spider. I don't really care to see the Uncle Ben scene, I just want to see them acknowledge it.
They don't do the origin story and shoot Peter's uncle all over again, and suddenly he doesn't have a character arc because of that one significant change? Are you and Doug sure you were actually watching the movie, or are you reviewing this movie based on what the audience members around you told you about the fucking movie? The dude had problems with bullies, balancing being a superhero with being a high school student and dealing with what he finds out about the girl he takes to the dance. That's a story arc.
Aaron Siewert But they say we don't need to see again that scene. Just acknowledge Uncle Ben and the influence he had on Peter! Rob said just one line would suffice, and I agree (I wasn't as bothered by it as he was though).
I feel like Rob puts too much weight on that one thing. After seeing how annoying the uncle Ben plot was in the other ones, my friends and I were relieved not to see it here. Also, after how dark phase 2 of the MCU got, we were glad to see just a lighthearted, fun film.
Maybe there was no mention of Uncle Ben because everyone complained when they showed Bruce Wayne's parents getting shot YET AGAIN, by the time we got to Batman's second reboot in "Batman V Superman".
Robert Currie yeah and they took advice from suckass dc
Flash:
The POINT is that he is a derptard. He gets away with it because Peter won't stand up to him!
What movie did you two watch?!
14:39 Marvel has stated that, there won't be a Spider-Man origins story, everyone knows it, and it's a critic that everyone has made to the past movies.
Yea, I agree. However, I also realize that since they changed so much of Spideys surroundings, knowing the backstory would definitely help. This movie doesn't make it seem like Ben ever existed except for that line about May going through a lot.
There are a lot of parts where if you look, besides the lines, where you see the effect that Uncle Ben had over Peter, a few of then in the first part of the movie.
Maxtime Really? Other than the Guilt complex speech in the Civil War I didn't notice much. However, it didn't really bother me much while watching. I only really noticed after I saw the review. I still love the movie tho.
Have you watched carefully some of decision that he makes? There clearly is an influence of Uncle Ben, it isn't screaming and in your face, but it's subtle, and a lot of times is more of show not talk.
As well, this problem was addressed with Batman V Superman. No one wanted the Batman origin story because we've seen the origin story numerous times.
first half of this movie was fun. But the second half is fucking 10/10!
You two talked about for awhile but here's the answer... Flash is rich dudes
yeah, a kid shows up to school in THAT car (Peter recognizes it as Flash's) and you think he's not going to be popular?
He is Peter's nemesis because he is obviously jealous. He never even came off as "super popular" in this and didn't need to be. He came off as insecure, desperate and would use any means to make people like him. On top of that he has been left with room for growth instead of "derrrr, Imma dum jok."
Czah5 sure, but they were asking why was he popular
Yeah, sorry about the rant. I had just seen the movie last night. You are right about how him being rich.
Czah5 and you are right about him being jealous! You are cool a lot of people that I find on my channel or other comment section would have just been ruder
Most of Doug's reviews: It's Good.
Jay W. He has to leave the bad stuff to the Nostalgia Critic
Jay W. it's good usually means it's great.
JuanK Gonzalez True
Well he liked Suicide Squad so yeah... I don't know what to say
Well, after he said Ghostbuster(2016) is "ok", I really can't take most of his negative review seriously.
......but, I do think the new Beauty and the Beast sucks as well
Rob is definitely the better and more consistent critic. Doug is just all over the place with his reviews.
um... im not trying to be an internet dick here or anything, but when you said that there was no character development for spider-man, that was complete and total bullshit. the character's journey throughout the film is about him learing to accept himself even if others dont accept him. he goes from being this naive kid who wants more in his life, to someone who accepts what he has and learns to be more responsible. at least thats what I got out of it. either way, glad you enjoyed the movie....
I agree. There was tons of development. *Spoiler* Especially when Tony told Peter that if he's nothing without the suit, then he shouldn't have it, then he remembered in that one scene when the building collapsed on him that he was something. He didn't need to suit, he doesn't need anyone else, he's strong by himself and he's stronger than he thinks. That's development. Before he thought he was a loser, a boy that wanted to be like Iron Man and a part of the Avengers. *Also Spoilers* He declined to be a part of the avengers (for now) at the end and decided to be a friendly neighborhood Spiderman. How is that not development lmao?!
CurlyCamillee Right? The whole movie was him yearning to be IN the team and when he finally gets a chance (even though he thought it was a test) he rejects it because he wants to grow more. He realized he was not all that ready and the time would come to join bigger missions and causes, until then he was going to be a neighborhood Spiderman. If that's not development then what is?
i just want to point out that he does mention the spider so its safe to assume that the origin story happened the way we all know
sure, but it still could've Been more dramatic
VK Produções was the scene where he is trapped under the collapsed building not dramatic enough?
THE SCENE WHERE SPIDERMAN IS TRAPPED AND FREAKS OUT LIKE THE KID HE IS AND THEN CALMS DOWN AND LIFTS THE WRECKAGE IS 10000000% SPIDERMAN I GOT GOOSEBUMPS DURING THIS SCENE .... THE ONLY THING I DIDNT DIG WAS MJ REVEAL .. WE DONT WANNA HEAR OF UNCLE BEN ..WE ALL F KNOW WHAT HAPPENED
IM GLAD TO SEE THAT YOUR CAPS LOCK BUTTON IS BROKEN TOO. I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE!!!
I was SO PISSED that they didn't address that scene. I found that to be such a huge character moment for this Spider-Man and they acted like they were going to get to it and Vulture's interesting character moment at the end/after-credits scene, and they NEVER DID. Much like they said the movie did, they just kept beating around the bush and never got to the grittiest stuff the movie had to offer.
deusredeemer Damn, hell yes! I almost cried at that scene. It was amazing! They did confirm though that Michelle is not actually MJ. She will be a love interest in the future but she's not Mary Jane.
i didnt find that scene that moving, i was not emotionally invested in the movie at all so i found myself not caring. They also kind of ruined the scene by repeating Iron Man voice over it.
Dude I almost cried.
This movie was honestly one of my favorite comic book movies EVER made! I fucking adored every second of this movie
DomnoSaur Same, I saw no flaw with it. But Flash is still a dick
d good Flash is a very realistic high school bully, and by that I mean thus: He is an asshole just because he thinks it makes him cool. That is literally the high school bully. And not only that, but these all seem like pretty young high schoolers, so it makes even more sense.
31:39 Wrong. My family, who hasn't seen any comic book films, was able to follow this 100%
Ben so did my dad and brother, and they have barely seen anything from the MCU.
Same here. I went with my little sister who'd seen the avenger movies but not civil war or anything else (that was relevant to this at least) she followed along perfectly
They aren't as old as Rob and Doug
Same with my mom. She understood everything perfectly.
Li-Li Mandragon i am pretty sure My dad is older than Doug and Rob
her name was Liz Allen she is a character from the comics not the vultures daughter in the comics but still she's there
Wish I could have sat there and debated with Rob on this one because I really disagree with the majority of his points.
*SPOILER*
I don't understand how you can have an hour long review of this movie and NOT talk about the rubble scene?? It was easily the best scene in the movie and, at least for me, cemented Tom Holland as the best actor, in regards to genuine raw acting ability, to play spider-man. It was SUCH a character defining moment in both the comics and the movie and they executed it beautifully.
I think you're wrong about this movie. To me, it embodied everything spider-man is about. The charm, the comedy, the heart, the youth and the idea that, when you're in the position that Peter is, the needs of others are more important than the needs of your own. This is the spider-man movie I feel like I've been waiting for and I can't wait to see what else the decide to do with this character in this universe.
My thoughts exactly!!!
CasualCommenter 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽 I couldn’t agree more!
my favorite scene out of all the spider-man movies
It was certainly a very strong scene, showcasing Peter for the first time having to emotionally face the trauma of impending death (all the other times were very quick and he got rescued, or he was fighting people he could handle easily) and completely panicking like any normal teenager would, then pushing through it to find the super hero he wants to be.
CasualCommenter it was great until that tony stark bullshit .
he's a 15 year old high school kid. everyone has seen the origin story, everyone knows it. It's like superman.
Even if everyone saw the other Spider-Man movies and this one is supposed to be a whole new thing. But even that, if the studio decided to drift away from the origin thing, they at least give the audience the reason why Peter is doing the superhero thing.
The Audience knows though. Theres not a person on this fucking planet that doesn't know about Spidermans backstory.
Stephen Morris I presume you haven't met Bruce Wayne?
Zangelin The audience who know are familiar with Spider-Man and his origins would know that. But if someone who isn't and would not seen any of the prior recarnations would most likely be lost on why he's an important character in the Marvel universe.
1: Her name is Liz. 2: He's 15 years old, his voice is fine for someone who should be in high school. 3: Flash was updated for the times. He is rich which is why he feels he can pick on people like Peter. 4: I didn't think they needed to include Uncle Ben in this since it's been 8 months since Peter's gotten his powers. I'm sure it's long enough to grieve. As far as why Peter is doing what he's doing, initially it was probably due to something that happened to Uncle Ben, now it's because he got a taste of being a real superhero in Civil War and after some time he isn't doing anything more than what he was doing prior to Civil War.
I don't know if it's long enough to grieve, but his motivation is impressing Stark to join the Avengers. I don't know how Rob and Doug couldn't figure that out. That's why he's filming himself. Stark is kind of a father figure to him now and his hero. It's really not Primer.
Yea but.... by your logic they've essentially written Uncle Ben out. That's horrible! Uncle Bens death should be a focal point for Peter, otherwise how do you justify "With Great Power Comes Great Responsibility." You don't need to show him die but you should at least talk about him, show remorse, something!
I cannot agree with the whole "it's been a long enough time to grieve" argument. The death of a loved one, especially one who looked after you throughout a good portion of your life, doesn't really go away. Especially in Peter's case, where he feels personally responsible for not preventing Uncle Ben's death. I'm thankful that they didn't do the whole "Ben gets shot" scene again at risk of feeling played out, but the fact that it wasn't mentioned at all did bug me a little.
Flash was updated for the time? Bitch please, Flash is the kid white boys bully at school not the bully himself. Tom Holland looks more of a bully than him.
That's a pretty good summary.
14:30 (Doug)
NO MORE ORIGIN STORIES!!!! of well known comic book characters. Every fucking comic book movie is a damn origin story. Every fucking batman movie is a origin story! WE GET IT FUCKING MOVE ON!!! progress the overall story! stop telling us about UNCLE GOD DAMN BEN DYING!! or BATMAN LOSING HIS PARENTS!
28:00 ish, Um, actually Liz is not supposed to be Mary Jane, she was Spider-Man's original love interest in the first few comics
Rob completely ruins this vid
He isn't talking about Liz at that part. He's referring to the "MJ" character they introduce later on.
His first love interest in the comics was betty brant not liz allen she was just a crush that never really went anywhere she wasnt really a legitimate love interest to peter
epiening kinda like she was in the movie. And the point stands that she was a character of her own
+TheCaptainCitizen ohhhh, my mistake. That's still dumb of them to assume that she's Mary Jane just because she has the same initials. She's a new and different character and I assumed the MJ was just a kind of nod because she had a different name and character.
Seriously guys? It seemed so obvious that Peter Parker's character arc and motivation is based on a huge desire for approval from others and the need to overcome that and do things for himself.
Also the anti-grav thing was a hilarious take on the cliche
One thing the movies didn't do so well is pointing out when Peter actually got started on his motivation. His first appearance in the MCU was in Iron Man 2! Yeah, Peter Parker has actually been around much longer than the movies themselves ever say directly. He was the kid in the Iron Man mask that Tony saves from the drone. When this is recognized, then yes, his motivations for helping people out makes total sense. While he's not doing it out of a sense of guilt or responsibility like most Spiderman incarnations, he's doing it out of hero worship because his own life was saved by a superhero. In this Spiderman's mind, that's just what people who have powers are supposed to do!
@@snakeman830 Thats A Horrible Motivation.
Hopefully, They'll Mention Uncle Ben In Far From Home And Confirm That Uncle Ben Was The Reason Peter Started This Superhero Shit.
I Would Be Really Happy With That.
@@snakeman830 You know that the movie didn't tell us that that kid was Peter and you can't just expect everyone knew that was him since there are NO indications that it was him.
holy shit quit harping on the origin story. yall complain about movies doing the origins too much. ya honestly dont NEED to know that anyway. Perhaps it was left out for a reason. just freakin let it go
Bruh... but Uncle Ben is crucial to spider-man's motivation. We need backstory in the sequel.
literally EVERYONE bitched and complained when amazing spiderman went back to an origin story. NOBODY would've been happy if they did it AGAIN. especially these guys.
not showing uncle ben died is like not showing human dislike / even hate mutants in an x-men film, which is pretty much the reason X-men exist, i believe This works for other things people thought would be boring as well, like batman's parents death or e.t.c. it's not that people are bored, it's just that they're not doing it right
everyone knows his back story..holy crap dude, this is more proof that peoole will complain no matter what
and no. uncle bem dieing is not the same as humans hating mutians...both of those. elements are not needed to make a good film either.
oh i can tell you why Flash is the popular kid. You see in high schools nowadays the kid with the biggest mouth becomes the cool kid even though half the things he says is pretty much bullshit assholish bullying towards other people but he pushes himself to that popularity by becoming part of every single group and leaving you wondering how?Plus in Flash's case he is the rich kid he goes to school with his daddy's lambo and pretends thaat he is hot shit
Tybor Vasas popular kids were just like that 15 years ago when I was in school and I'm sure they were like that 30 years before as well
I had never seen a superhero film before this movie and even _I_ knew Spider-Man's backstory. I think a rehash wasn't necessary and they knew it. They might do an origin in the next one but I doubt it. I agree with Doug, people were probably bored with the origin and wanted to move on.
Have it in the opening credits
I disagree it is absolutely not shallow. It is a journey of self-discovery, learning what you truly are capable of.
Daniel Dunlap Its a journey into vanity not self discovery. Self discovery was SpiderMan 2.
I'll tell you exactly what the origin story of Homecoming is with Uncle Ben.
Due to Peter's neglect, Uncle Ben was killed by a criminal.
There you have it.
They never said Uncle Ben was killed though? Are you making this up?
Uncle Ben could walk right through the front door and the filmmakers could say he was missing cause he was on vacation and everything in the movie would still make sense. All those bitter scenes could be Peter sulking about his parents or whatever.
but but where is my martha moment?!
But that is not good enough. Spider-Man needs an origin story. The character of Spider-Man is of guilt. If we don't get some closure with the tragedy then the character falls apart.
We know who spider-man is, we know how he got his powers, we don't really need to watch it again or even mention it.
Her name was Liz. She didn’t have her name changed from the comic.
Yes she did, do you even know anything about the comics? Liz Allen was changed to Liz Toomes so she could be the Vulture's daughter.
ShockWingman Okay, yes, her LAST name was changed. Her name, however, is still Liz. That wasn't changed. Perhaps I could have been more explicitly clear, but I wasn't referring to her last name.
ShockWingman "Do you even know anything about the comics?"
This is uncalled for. Even if what I said was completely false, rather than just ambiguous, that still doesn't mean that I know nothing at all about the comics. There's no need to belittle others; we're all geeks, here.
Liz Allan started as a blonde attractive girl which was popular in 1960s and still remained that way I don't know about comics but I sure know about Spider Man Liz Allan is not black even considering Ultimate Spider Man her father is not the vulture vulture has a daughter who works for shield. I mean if you do know about comic you should consider why this character was created this time and has to remain constant for a reason the thing you failed to know is last name is important changing it to Toomes is important once you turn her black and change her last name than it's a different character further more Liz is not known to be a smart student in Midtown high she is popular I remember
what you said you said we all are geeks true but when your statement totally offends another geek or spreading wrong information that is when you start a problem.
Nathan V that's a name change...
Doug your....head it's so bald....................can....can I touch it?
Jay Villanueva lol.
Jay Villanueva no
yes
Doug seems optimistic yet sensible, but Rob gives off that annoyingly cynical negative vibe, idk why. In addition, he cut off Doug many times which is always annoying. Also he seemed whiny af, like wtf is this at 15:45 ? I've also never been a fan of people that mock anyone who disagrees with them either, like at 16:46. He seems so heated in general.
This was the most negative positive review I've ever seen.
You should watch all their other reviews... pretty much the same thing
As much as I enjoy watching these reviews, it's kind of annoying how Rob is always interrupting Doug.
Jack Brazier Thank god I'm not the only one that noticed. He seems like a dick.
Yes. I've commented about this in the past too. He needs to chill out when Doug talks.
maybe Doug needs to stop cutting him off
Jack Brazier I think it gows both ways they interrupt each other
But Doug never has anything interesting to say lol... jk jk.
I think Peter's motivation was on point. He wanted to be an Avenger to help people. What's wrong with that? Does a hero always have to have a sad back story to be motivated?
He wanted to be an Avenger because Avengers were famous. At first he just helped people to help people but now he’s just Tony Stark’s fanboy.
@@pn2294 Uh-Huh.
Ok... Sure.
Have you even read Spider-Man? His fucking uncle died, that's how he became Spider-Man. If you don't want a sad backstory, don't read or watch Spider-Man.
@@HappyLarry. yeah, jog on, stupid.
@@bloodspittingspartan5002 you replied to a comment from 2 years ago, and went out of your way to look like a dumbass
I like young Spider-Man. lot more closer to the comics for me cause the last two actors didn't look like high schoolers at all. This is by far the best Spider-Man film since Spider-Man 2
Yeah I liked young Spiderman too. I feel I can relate to him more because he's only a year older.
In ten years time, Tom Holland will be the next gen’s OG Spidey. Some kids today are watching and enjoying Homecoming like it’s their holy grail, and for someone out there, it may very well be their first ever MCU film experience that they’ll cherish in their memories forever. The thought of this alone makes my heart swell up with adoration for the film, because that feeling is the exact same feeling I myself had when I saw the original movies in theaters for the first time.
I have a lot of respect for Homecoming because of this; not just because it’s an enjoyable Marvel film, but because it’s a great movie for kids to relate to and grow up with.
Olivia Martin i agee
Maybe. It seems only 1 person died, and technically, even that was an accident. In order for us to be put in the true Peter Parker's shoes, there needed to be that turning point of Uncle Ben's death to really ground him. He may have once been an ordinary kid, but getting the spider powers was too much for his adolescent mind, and the hard lesson of his uncle getting killed, HIS RESPONSIBILITY, was a huge character arc missed, I feel. Tobey may have whined and cried, maybe even let the character go mushy. But he learned his lesson. Feeling as if you are responsible, and actually HAVING responsibility are 2 very different things, both negligible. If all you want in a Spider-Man is a humorous boy in a modern setting with great powers, then Tom is your guy. Despite our disagreements, I respect your perspective.
Olivia Martin Unfortunately after the sequel Sony is most likely going to get the licensing rights back to Spider-Man and probably screw everything up again.
Unless you actually read the comics then see this movie. God help you if you read the comics.
I was thinking chicken parmesan so I was thinking cheese.
Rob: He (Stark) is uncle ben, only alive!
Me: *bites lip* um..
Not quite
"It's good." -Doug
I wouldn't even mind if that didn't seem to be how Doug reacted to *everything* in these videos.
That said, as someone who thinks all the previous Spider-Man movies had massive flaws, I think this is easily the best film for the character. The thing I love most about it is that Peter's arc does something I don't think ANY superhero movie has ever done, which is have the hero genuinely adopt part of the villain's philosophy and have that be the defining turning point of his growth. I'm literally incapable of understanding the argument that Peter didn't have an arc.
You're... you're actually complaining that there *wasn't* an origin story? That's insane. That's part of what made this movie great and set it apart from the other very recent iterations. Origin stories are some of people's biggest complaints with superhero movies! We know Batman's parents died. We know Uncle Ben died. We know about all that. There's no reason to tread that ground again.
If they want to, here's plenty of time to get into that in later movies, but anybody with a shred of comic knowledge (book, movie, otherwise) knows about Uncle Ben, knows about power and resposibility, knows about the spider bite.
That's a bad complaint.
I don't think they wanted another origin story. They just wanted the drama and depth that Spiderman always had. And they're right. Peter had little to no conflict in the first half. I think a small dose of emotional sentiment would've helped this movie a lot. He's Marvel's greatest hero after all.
Just because Peter became Spider-Man through a tragedy, doesn't mean he can't have fun being Spider-Man. Why don't you go watch a Batman movie instead?
Bricks_Ahoy
No, I agree. Spiderman should still be a fun hero, and this movie did that great. It honestly got Peter's character spot on!
Zach Cavanagh congratulations you missed the point they were trying to make with that entirely...
I agree, it seems a little hypocritical for them to moan about not seeing one of the most overused scenes in comic book movie history, when no critic ever shuts up about how annoying it is to see Martha and Thomas Wayne die over and over again. When a famous scene gets used again and again, like that death scene, I call it Martha Syndrome. You can guess why.
(Batman appears) "WHY DID YOU SAY THAT NAME?!"
I swear you guys are the only reviewers I know that needed to have ANOTHER version of the Spider-Man origin story?! You want them to go and stuff it into the 2nd or 3rd film?
And it is really funny since they complained when BvS did Batman's origin story again.
And they got that line.... All the way back in Civil War.
Langley M Neely lol bro uncle ben is what drives Spider-Man especially at the age they put him at and to not even Mention or show uncle ben death is a big flaw
They are though: ua-cam.com/video/PMrFoJUKXVY/v-deo.html
I don't want ANOTHER Spider-Man origin story. And they're trashing it so hard on the fact that they don't mention Ben... I think that's way too harsh.
They do mention it, in Civil War he hints and it and even more in Homecoming, something worse could have happened to uncle ben in this version than just a mere death.
just for everyone's reference, Michelle is not Mary Jane. Kevin Feige stated in an interview that Michelle is not Mary Jane. here's the direct quote:
"Well, we never even looked at it as a big reveal necessarily but more of just a fun homage to his past adventures and his past love. She's not Mary Jane Watson. She never was Mary Jane Watson. She was always this new high school character, Michelle, who we know there's an "M" in Michelle and an "M" in Mary. [laughs] So we're so clever and we thought, "Wouldn't it be neat if her initials were MJ?" And then I think it leaked that she would be playing MJ and then it became a whole headache for Zendaya to have to navigate. It was never a big, "Oh my God, it's a big reveal!" There are big reveals in the movie. That's not one of them."
Lycan Liam do you think there’s a chance that they ( peter and Michele ) will end up being the couple in spirit? Even if she’s not Mary-Jane?
THANK YOU!! I was starting to think i was crazy be cause i thought it was a nod to the audience and nothing more but some people really seem to think she is supposed to b Mary Jane...even though they are nothing alike and dont even have the same name
Thats like saying in a batman movie a character saying my name is dick... And robin hasnt appeared yet... ??? Why not?
When viewers see Bruce Wayne's parents die in batman v super man it's "been done too much" but when they skip uncle Ben being killed in the third Spider-Man reboot, "how dare they, what's Spider-Man's motivation?!?!?!"
Everyone already knows that Spiderman is motivated by the death of his Uncle Martha "Ben" Parker!
You were angry that Keaton didn't go "full" evil with the kill? I was so happy that he didn't intend to kill the guy; it didn't fit his character to do so. It's brilliant that they were able to keep him from being fully evil while still making him into a bad guy that's bad enough that he needs to be brought down but doesn't necessarily need to be killed.
You gave Amazing Spiderman an 8 but gave Damn a fucking 7? What the fuck melon?
Dougthony Robtano
I give Homecoming a 6, it was ok
Nepu-Tech USA i dont think you get the meme
What meme?
I know they thought it was good but I disagree with a LOT of their opinions on this movie. This is the best Spider-Man film.
The Vulture was one of the most threatening villains in the MCU and he doesn't even have powers! Lol
Channel NerdGasm Honestly, he is in my top 3 MCU villains, the others being Loki and Sec. Pierce.
Channel NerdGasm If you listen to rob it sounded like only his green eyes were threatening
Axelander I think more than just that. His costume, the way Keaton presented himself, the way he spoke. It all worked lol
Channel NerdGasm Yeah me too, I loved him as a villain. Loved the tension when and after it is revealed who he is to parker (as the father of his crush)
I just wanted to complain about rob.
I thought he was good but I found the "I thought that was the gravity gun" line was stupid
The problem is that you're looking at this like a one off. Marvel had control of the character again and so long as it makes Sony money they can keep doing movies. Rushing his entire character arc and the audience's interpretation of him to match the comics as fast as possible would be a ridiculous plan. Everything in this movie is set up to allow the characters to grow. It gives peter the room to grow older, mature and gain more experience. The action scenes aren't as good because he's learning how to fight. His motives aren't in the forefront because he is either developing them still or they aren't as important as introducing the character and making him likable. Hell, the first half of the movie is funny and seems "shallow" because we're being introduced to Peter in a manner that ensures he's endearing. Now that we have a jumping off point where we understand who peter Parker is, who his friends are, what his morals are, and so on, they can build him up, give him more experience and emotional connection to the audience. This entire movie is simply the base of Peter Parker's character and I predict in the next movies and the future crossovers, that we'll see his motives and backstory deepen immensely.
This is probably the most nitpicky review ever.
Nah, I nitpicked their review. They didn't even cut halfway beneath the surface.
Just wait until CinemaSins gets their hands on this movie...
Sully Uddin lol the epitome of superficial criticism
Uhm... I think they even said they would.
Doug's brother or whoever is always overly nitpicky. Why does he keep insisting Civil War was a Spidey movie? It wasn't about him at all, lol. Everyone got pissy when they showed Bruce Wayne's origin again in BvS but for some reason its a necessity to show Spidey's.
I love how you guys are basically annoyed we DIDNT get an origin story. do you REALLY need to see a third Uncle Ben murdered? fine go watch the Deadpool short and pretend it's Uncle Ben dying.
Especially since it's very hypocritical of rob to say he wanted an orgin story, when in the civil war review he said he did'nt.
It would have been so against the tone of the movie to have Uncle Ben die/dead. They could've had him alive and killed him off in the next film, which would have been amazing, imagine getting to know Uncle Ben before he gets killed and used forever as a sort of over-used motivation device. I still think this movie did well in not having an origin story, he's just a 16 year old kid who wants to help people and thats fine. You cant go into the movie thinking "if they dont do this and that then they're ruining the character and the movie".
It's particularly cringeworthy when they go "Do they even say the words Uncle Ben?!" when, while the film didn't in fact do that, it was heavily implied that Uncle Ben died because of the whole "My aunt is going through a very rough time and I don't want to have my secret out there, she wouldn't be able to handle that kind of pressure right now." thing.
I totally agree. I mean, WHO doesn't know about Uncle Ben? Who doesn't know Spider-Man's backstory? If they did put that in, then they would have complained about that. And the film didn't need it. Seeing the same story for a third time would have just been plain boring In my opinion this is the best Spidey film so far.
I agree. Everyone knows the origin story of Spider-Man. Doing it for a third time would be totally pointless and would just be going through the motions. It's been done a thousand times in the other movies, TV shows, and comics. I don't know what else they could really add to it.
For Uncle Ben, all you really needed was a picture of Peter, May, and some guy all having a good time, and a mention by Peter to Tony that he won't have people's blood on his hands because he didn't act again.
Flash is popular because he is rich. It isn't particularly complicated.
Spider-Man has so many love interests so...
JSD
Liz, Gwen, MJ, Silk, Black Cat, Mockingbird, Captain Marvel (Carol) and Jessica Drew (Spider-woman) to name a few....
Did you forget Carlie?
Of course you did, everybody does.
For good reason.
She was terrible.
Criticizes this movie for making jokes that subvert the dramatic moments, then later gushes all over Thor: Ragnarok. *facepalm*
Not every movie has to have the exact same standards in order for it to be great. It’s like saying, “They didn’t like Spiderman 3 for being too silly, but they praised the hell out of Superbad. Hypocrisy!!!”
Vivir Doug actually likes Spider Man 3
vacion610 The thing with Thor Ragnarok is that you know who Thor is. This movie is the first official Spider-Man movie in this universe, and we don’t know this guy yet.
I think the reason he had problem with Spider-Man and not Thor Ragnarok is because for 5 Spider-Man movies it's been serious and Homecoming was more fun. Thor however is part of the MCU which is fun so when Thor is fun it's understandable.
+vacion610 Thor Ragnarok still managed to be a big epic film though and it did have its purely dramatic moments (not a fuckton though obviously)
The filmmakers keep insisting Michelle is not Mary Jane, but a new character entirely
Look guys. I been watching Spider-Man movies and shows since I was 4yrs old. Seen all the movies growing up and Homecoming recently. I get the origin story and to be honest I didn't need an origin movie. I know who Spider-Man is now and this Spider-Man series was really refreshing for me, knowing that Marvel isn't going through the motions again when it comes to Spider-Man's story. I love Spider-Man homecoming and love Tom Holland and how he's a awesome Peter Parker and a awesome Spider-Man. Which is great for me considering Tobey was a great Peter Parker, but a ok Spider-Man. Andrew was a great Spider-Man and an ok Peter Parker. This movie really helped me fall in love with my favorite superhero all over again.
Elijah Lucero They didn't want an origin, what they wanted was for Peter to honour or at least recall the legacy of Uncle Ben. For example the rubble scene would have been the perfect opportunity to remember Uncle Ben and how he would never fail anyone else in his life again. Remember Aunt May and how she wouldn't be able to handle the loss of Peter, especially after the loss of Ben. How that thought would have given him strength like it did in the comics. Not fucking Stark and how disappointed he would be.
They are speaking for the people who don't know the lore of Spider man
@@shankioad7150 wasnt stark his mentor here tho?
Thank you for this. Me and my boyfriend went to see this movie last night, I really enjoyed it but he was very dissapointed. He's a big comic nerd and felt kinda robbed from the most important parts of Spiderman like you guys, I didn't quite understand it at first, because I was looking at it from a film makers perspective, but you guys combined both film making and making it true to the comic in your review and now I understand where he's coming from and some points that I missed!
Best Spider-Man movie since Spider-Man 2
it may be better than 2 for me and that's saying something :)
Ryan R. nah fam, spiderman 2 was the goat of all marvel movies
Woody and Daffy Duck better than it
Woody and Daffy Duck Spiderman 2 was overrated anyways
Spiderman 1 and *unpopular opinion* even 3 were better movies
2 had too much melo drama
Ryan R. What a shit opinion,this is not opposite day
How was McGwire a better highschool Peter Parker? He was almost 30 when the first Spider-Man came out.
Anthrax he was 24 when filming the first movie - Tom Holland was only 20 when filming homecoming
Yeah, but even then, Macguire looks like a college student at best, whereas Holland could easily pass as a high school freshman, despite going to an American high school for a month in his entire life!
Hell, that statement makes even less sense since he was only in high school for like the first 30 minutes of his first movie. When I heard that, I thought, "Have you guys even SEEN the older films?!"
Garfield was even older.
Does it matter? He looked the part.
I agree with Rob on MJ. That was where the changes really went bad for me. Actress is of different race? Who cares? You could even dye her hair red. But if you completely change their personality and even their name, *then* you have a problem.
The only way I can see this working is if it's a misdirect so we can be surprised when Peter meets MJ in the "Face it, Tiger" scene. So that we're just as surprised to meet Mary Jane as Peter is.
I'm just glad Vulture survived the "MCU Villain (almost) Always Dies" formula.
The Smoking Skull zemo is still alive
Benjamin Marichalar There are a few villains who survived (like Abomination, Loki, Kingpin, Zemo, and Vulture), but there are *soooo* many more villains who were killed off.
Villains like Ultron, Ronan the Accuser, Ironmonger, Whiplash/Crimson Dynamo, Aldrich Killian, Crossbones, The Other, Kaecilius, Baron von Strucker, Malekith the Accursed, Arnim Zola, Ego the Living Planet, Purple Man, Yellowjacket, The Destroyer, *every single Chitauri in existence*, Cottonmouth, and Alexander Pierce.
That's an unnecessary and uncalled-for amount of villain deaths.
It's because they are movies, not comics. In comics you can span the hero movies out for decades of storylines and hundreds of issues, while in movies, a supehero can only get a trilogy at most. So they have to give room for multiple great villains instead of rehashing them for multiple movies.
Unless they can play part in multiple crossover movies like Loki.
That last part is what I'm talking about. The movies should not kill off most of their villains (unless completely necessary), because it robs the villain of the chance to fight other heroes or team up with other villains. If Hela dies in *Thor: Ragnarok*, I'm going to be pretty upset. Not only would it be another villainous character down the drain, it would make her completely useless in the rest of the movie universe.
You know what the movie should do? Have Hela take the place of the character Death (since she is basically the Asgardian version of Death), don't kill off Thanos in the Infinity War movies, and have Hala be the one who Thanos falls in love with. He would still technically be "courting Death" like in the comics and Hela (one of the coolest-looking villains I've seen so far) would survive for more movies.
Plus, it would give the MCU a break and not make Infinity War have to introduce another new character (Death) just to kill her off at the end.
k.
Fans complain about how annoying Uncle Ben orgin stories then you guys complain about not having a origin story? Seriously?
Spiderman doesn't exist without an Uncle Ben origin as batman doesn't exist without his parents death. This is what motivates Spiderman to be a hero, instead of just some teen with powers. He would be a completely irresponsible jackass without Uncle Ben.
This is his PRIME motivation. Would you be okay if they just cut Batman's parent's death out of batman...or superman's planet exploding out? You just have to mention it somewhere. Not 30 minutes long, but a "Hey Uncle Ben died and it really effected our lives" is enough.
Fenixilius Strife But that's exactly what they did...."Aunt May has been going through a lot" was not a throw away line. The origin already happened, they just felt the need not to show it. Uncle Ben is the reason, Peter started fighting crime in the first place, this film is about a different conflict entirely: self acceptance and proving what he's capable of. Showing Uncle Ben's death was not necessary for this arc.
Why not? Why would it take the death of this specific figure to trigger "hero mode"? I always figured that getting a taste of real power and having a chance to make a difference, and then being forced to give that up was motivation enough. It would be for me. Could you even imagine being something like the President and having the opportunity to make a real difference, but only for a week and then being shoved back into mundanity?
Well, they're allowed to disagree with what fans say.
smeefan It's not as used as Bruce Wayne's parents death
Everyday I think I understand Doug's opinion less and less
It's better that way.
Need to comment again.
I really feel you guys missed the point of the movie.
You're complaining about the characters Origin being missing, "when you can do the things li do and do nothing, then people get hurt. And then it's your fault"
That sums the character up RIGHT THERE without dragging out a shorty origin again.
Also no love for the scene where he's trapped under the rubble?!?
Common guys. You're nitpicking and having a ducking whinge over nothing
I get the feeling that Tony is the new "Uncle Ben". The paternal mentor that teaches Peter about responsibility and power. He's now got a protégé and is engaged to Pepper, assumably getting everything he wants. We know that Infinity War is going to change the landscape of the Avengers and transition us into the new phase of the MCU. It's common practice to make the characters that you're about to lose 'as happy as can be'. The "everything that May's been through" line could easily refer to whatever left Peter as an orphan, losing a sibling and in-law.
+Myracle Harmon
Tony can't replace Been, fortunately, I think this will be corrected in the sequel.
I thought that 'we' (the general target audience for these kinds of films) had all agreed that origin stories were the worst, most-tired and played-out parts of super-hero movies especially with long-running legacy characters for which EVERYBODY KNOWS Their Origin stories through pop-culture osmosis even if they've never cracked-open one of the original comic-books... Seeing this film criticized for just dispensing with that convention feels weird.
Molly MacAlister You didn't listen to a word they said
Half-Life Scientist that's kinda what they said. They wanted us to be shown uncle Ben dying for the third time
the girl you were referring to as Mary Jane was Liz, who was in the comics before Mary Jane, she started off in the first sandman comic and they got the character right
Liz was the daughter of the Vulture, the person they refer as MJ is Michelle
I've never thought about it, but now that you said it, yeah I want a Spiderman fight in an amusement park dammit.
Earlier you guys were complaining about having to watch Spideys origin again, now you're complaining about not getting to see it....
My Lord how long has Doug been stuck in "Popular Movie? It's OK"-land?
Pickle Master Awhile
Pickle Master He really loved Guardians Vol 2
Pickle Master I love Doug to death but pretty much his take on 99% of movies are just "It's fine."
This was really was just okay.
I KNOW RIGHT ITS A FRICKING MARVEL MOVIE!!!!
ALL OF THEM WERE FANTASTIC!!
I'm kidding most of them were REALLY good, but this one wasn't in my opinion, cool but not excellent; like Dr. Strange
I kind of felt the "Oh, that's not the anti gravity gun" moment was a turning point for Toomes. Until then he'd been able to tell himself he wasn't a bad guy - He didn't do bad things (just the people he sold to did). Then his accidental incineration of someone was a tipping point, where having killed one person by mistake he, instead of feeling remorse, felt empowered and ready/ prepared to kill again if it suited him.
So, more character development than taking the edge off a serious moment with levity.