When in Bible School in Dallas, I knew a boy from the Middle East in the school and he had made friends with others from his country, all Muslim. When we visited, we shared our beliefs, the differences. He found it ucky that we believed that one was cleansed with blood. I learned a lot and I hope he did too, cause I enjoyed. He was a very nice young man.
This was a phenomenal conversation - Rainn is a very insightful, thoughtful person who clearly sees the deep need in people for a connection with the 'divine'. I am a Christian, so we would disagree in many ways, yet I found myself saying, "Yes!" at many of his insights. We were made for God (the One true God) and our hearts are restless apart from Him, as Augustine said.
That's the thing - if we can fully comprehend God - it's not really God. We can know him and his character, but no way we can wrap our minds around just how infinite his power is.
I will follow this channel. This represents the type of discourse I believe we should have. Ultimately all religions in their best form represent love and compassion.
100% on what Rainn shared on being willing to engage suffering. The Where did you see God Podcast just completed a year-long, 52 episode series called "Sitting in Suffering", and being willing to confront hard questions and tense spaces proved to be beautifully fruitful.
I’ve been preaching in a college town for a couple of years now and this conversation was on point in so many ways…not the least of which were love and respect. Just felt like what we need right now…at least where I’m working.
So, you agree with Rainn when he says, "Part of our reason for existing is to develop the spiritual qualities of God exemplified by God's Son, Jesus Christ, by God's messenger Muhammed, by the friend of God Moses, by the awakened one the Buddha, by the glory of God Baha'u'llah the founder of the Baha'i faith"? If you do you do not have the discernment of the Holy Spirit.
@@joeking433 soooo…if you’re twisting my words - by attaching an “if” to something that’s not even close to what I actually said - does that mean you’re filled with the spirit of the father of lies?
Great discussion. Here are a couple more questions to seriously ponder: 1) should people follow the religion of their parents and their cultural surroundings? 2) how do you know if the particular denomination or sect of your religion is indeed the right one? 3) have you thoroughly studied all the holy books of all the other major religions before you chose your preferred one? If you are happy with your choices, then God bless you. But don’t consider yourself better than others.
Congratulations to you both. I really liked the pleasant and spiritual atmosphere of this superb interview. The only weirdest thing in my opinion was towards the end where Russell said: “What would it take for me to become bahá'i, it would be becoming convinced that Jesus is the Lamp or a lamp rather than a light, I believe he is the Light”. This is exactly the kind of state of mind that the learned Jewish priests were in at the time of Christ's first coming: too attached to the lamp of Moses, and could not discern that the Light that was in the lamp of Moses was the same as that in the lamp of Christ, but in greater profusion and more adapted to the new requirements of the time. And this attitude or attachment of believers to their own and sometimes subjective interpretations of the meaning of the Scriptures, is repeated over and over in the history of the great monotheistic religions each time God sends a new Revelation in the guise of a new Lamp with a new Name! If we had had this kind of attachment to Moses, would we have been among those who could discern the true and essential Light under the new Lamp and the new Name of Jesus? In the book 'Thief in the Night' by Williams Sears, the following passage is very appropriate: "The disciples found this question too difficult to answer. They, too, had been taught that Elias must appear before the coming of the Messiah. If Christ was the Messiah, then where was Elias? They went to Christ and put the question to Him directly. Jesus told them that Elias had come. Elias had already appeared among the people, He said, but no one had recognized him, nor understood this truth. Elias, Christ said, had come in a manner in which the people did not expect, and for this reason they did not know him. Patiently Christ explained this symbolical truth to the disciples: “If ye will receive it, this (John the Baptist) is Elias, which was for to come.” (Matthew 11:14) This was an astonishing explanation. John the Baptist was Elias? Christ prefaced His explanation with the words: “If ye will receive it.” He meant apparently: If you can understand and accept this symbolical interpretation of the facts. Then Christ immediately added the words: “He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.” (Matthew 11:15) This time there could be no doubt. He was warning His disciples that it would take spiritual ears to hear and believe in this truth. It was to be understood inwardly, not outwardly. This return, which Christ said had happened, had taken place in the spirit and not in the flesh. This is confirmed by John the Baptist himself. He was asked: “Art thou Elias?” He answered: “I am not.” He was asked: “Art thou that prophet?” He answered: “No.” (John 1:21) Certainly Christ was not a liar. He knew that John was not Elias in the flesh. This is why it took spiritual ‘eyes’ to see and accept John as Elias. Once understood symbolically, the truth was simple: Elias had returned in the spirit in John the Baptist. If men were unable to understand the significance of this inward truth and accept it, Christ explained, they would continue to believe Him, Jesus, to be false. The return of Elias had come. John was the return of Elias-not in the flesh, but in the spirit. I found that this very event had been prophesied for John the Baptist in the Gospel of Luke: “... he (John) shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother’s womb ... And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias ...” (Luke 1:15, 17) This was one of the most important clues I had yet found in the teachings of Christ. It was still another confirmation of why the Messiah, when He came again, would have a new name. bahai-library.com/pdf/s/sears_thief_night.pdf
Great job on asking important questions. Perhaps the spoiler for those who haven't watched this blog is that Rainn Wilson never once told you "...where I'm wrong on Spirituality". Do we see things from a different perspective? Perhaps, but neither viewpoint lacks validity. I think the message is not one of Evangelical Christians becoming Baha'is or Baha'is becoming Evangelicals, but instead a message of our working side by side to make this planet a better place for all human beings and more in line with the Spirit of Christ's Teachings. Let's put aside our "Otherness" and see the Divine too often buried deep in side of all of us. If we can do that, then this planet indeed has a chance to realize the potential to become the Kingdom of God on Earth.
Don the Con is the opposite of a Christian, you will see him on the golf course on Sunday morning. Beatitudes: Blessed are: Poor in Spirit vs. proud Meek vs. forceful & aggressive Hungry & Thrist for Righteousness vs. seeking your own pleasures Merciful vs. vengeful Pure in Heart vs. evil heart Peace Makers vs. looking for a fight
All of my main pastors I know or follow and losten to online, state ," The Office as their favorite show!" Oh and " Christmas Vacation as their favorite movie.."..?? Lol
I'd say that endless conscious suffering is most definitely not justice. Christ Jesus said to always forgive but Christians teach that he is going to do the very opposite of what he taught. Rainn Wilson mentions the early Church fathers. I'd highly suggest doing some research on them, the Nicene Creed in particular. There's a lot to unpack but well worth your time.
Young people will find religion once they begin to experience what it is to get older, burying one's elder's, one's parents, one's contemporaries, and so on.
Interesting interview! As a non-fundamentalist, non-evangelical Christian I do tend to agree with the view of Jesus/Joshua/Yeshua as more of a teacher and a Buddha-like figure. I admire the Bahai faith but where I disagree with them is they pretty much accept all the prophets, whereas I don't really believe in any prophets. (Of course they get into big trouble in the Muslim world for daring to recognize prophets after Muhammad.) Maybe the term prophet grew out of a corruption of some term for ancient astrologers who tracked and predicted movements of the stars, but I certainly don't believe God picks certain people to have special authority over anyone. That said, I think there are many great teachers and philosophers who helped to advance humanity with major religious figures like Jesus, Buddha, Zoroaster, Lao Tzu and others among them. However, I've read some of the Quran and I can't get past even the first few pages without having a lot of issues with it. I know enough about Muhammad's life to know I don't think he was a particularly nice guy and the God he describes is one of strict rules and punishment, who is to be blindly obeyed out of fear. So, while I give credit to the spirit of openness and inclusion in the Bahai faith I would argue that it's somewhat naive to believe that all religions are equal.
He is right on the first or earliest Christians.. They shared with others. GAVE to each other. I often laugh or smile at the extreme right post of fear of socialism leading to being communist. Then oh my Karl Marx sermons..I dont want to be communist and know we do have some social programs .. Like Social Security.. But if they use any scripture that is very conservative or out of text. ## The Truth is the early christians did share and help one another. Socialism..
Real followers of Jesus aren't angry at you. We just love you like we are all loved by Jesus and pray you read more into the true God . Just pray. You are so nice and interesting
The 'spiritual' are the most materially and socially privileged. WHY isn't this ever acknowledged? 29:35 Suffering of course, what Christians enjoy the most...
"We take with us the qualities of the divine (as we leave this existence). Part of our reason for existing is to develop the spiritual qualities of God exemplified by God's Son, Jesus Christ, by God's messenger Muhammed, by the friend of God Moses, by the awakened one the Buddha, by the glory of God Baha'u'llah the founder of the Baha'i faith." God's messenger Muhammed"??? That is a statement that shows that Rainn Wilson doesn't have the Holy Spirit and is severely confused. Muhammed is a false prophet and is no more God's messenger than is Satan. He made a big deal of including leaders of other religions as holy when actually they will burn. This makes him a false teacher as well.
Jesus already did his deed for us, he ain't going to save us from ourselves, salvation is for everyone, good or ill, that's what's so awesome about what he did.
That title is such a "Christian persecution" clickbait. You invited Rainn on your show, he graciously accepted, you pushed a bit on his worldview, he was honest, and yet it's Rainn who's telling YOU that you're wrong? Classic.
This is wrong on so many levels! If you are believing any of this, you are being deceived, there’s not many ways to the father there’s only one way!Don’t drink the Kool-Aid or you will parish with them 2 Timothy 2: 15
When in Bible School in Dallas, I knew a boy from the Middle East in the school and he had made friends with others from his country, all Muslim. When we visited, we shared our beliefs, the differences. He found it ucky that we believed that one was cleansed with blood. I learned a lot and I hope he did too, cause I enjoyed. He was a very nice young man.
This was a phenomenal conversation - Rainn is a very insightful, thoughtful person who clearly sees the deep need in people for a connection with the 'divine'. I am a Christian, so we would disagree in many ways, yet I found myself saying, "Yes!" at many of his insights. We were made for God (the One true God) and our hearts are restless apart from Him, as Augustine said.
That's the thing - if we can fully comprehend God - it's not really God. We can know him and his character, but no way we can wrap our minds around just how infinite his power is.
I will follow this channel. This represents the type of discourse I believe we should have. Ultimately all religions in their best form represent love and compassion.
100% on what Rainn shared on being willing to engage suffering. The Where did you see God Podcast just completed a year-long, 52 episode series called "Sitting in Suffering", and being willing to confront hard questions and tense spaces proved to be beautifully fruitful.
I’ve been preaching in a college town for a couple of years now and this conversation was on point in so many ways…not the least of which were love and respect. Just felt like what we need right now…at least where I’m working.
So, you agree with Rainn when he says, "Part of our reason for existing is to develop the spiritual qualities of God exemplified by God's Son, Jesus Christ, by God's messenger Muhammed, by the friend of God Moses, by the awakened one the Buddha, by the glory of God Baha'u'llah the founder of the Baha'i faith"? If you do you do not have the discernment of the Holy Spirit.
@@joeking433 soooo…if you’re twisting my words - by attaching an “if” to something that’s not even close to what I actually said - does that mean you’re filled with the spirit of the father of lies?
Great discussion. Here are a couple more questions to seriously ponder:
1) should people follow the religion of their parents and their cultural surroundings?
2) how do you know if the particular denomination or sect of your religion is indeed the right one?
3) have you thoroughly studied all the holy books of all the other major religions before you chose your preferred one?
If you are happy with your choices, then God bless you.
But don’t consider yourself better than others.
Rainn talks powerfully about the early Christian church and it made me so proud!
This 'early church' being another utopian myth.
Whats wrong with you? How can you disagree with Dwight? @@williamoarlock8634
Congratulations to you both. I really liked the pleasant and spiritual atmosphere of this superb interview. The only weirdest thing in my opinion was towards the end where Russell said:
“What would it take for me to become bahá'i, it would be becoming convinced that Jesus is the Lamp or a lamp rather than a light, I believe he is the Light”.
This is exactly the kind of state of mind that the learned Jewish priests were in at the time of Christ's first coming: too attached to the lamp of Moses, and could not discern that the Light that was in the lamp of Moses was the same as that in the lamp of Christ, but in greater profusion and more adapted to the new requirements of the time. And this attitude or attachment of believers to their own and sometimes subjective interpretations of the meaning of the Scriptures, is repeated over and over in the history of the great monotheistic religions each time God sends a new Revelation in the guise of a new Lamp with a new Name! If we had had this kind of attachment to Moses, would we have been among those who could discern the true and essential Light under the new Lamp and the new Name of Jesus? In the book 'Thief in the Night' by Williams Sears, the following passage is very appropriate:
"The disciples found this question too difficult to answer. They, too, had been taught that Elias must appear before the coming of the Messiah. If Christ was the Messiah, then where was Elias? They went to Christ and put the question to Him directly. Jesus told them that Elias had come. Elias had already appeared among the people, He said, but no one had recognized him, nor understood this truth. Elias, Christ said, had come in a manner in which the people did not expect, and for this reason they did not know him. Patiently Christ explained this symbolical truth to the disciples: “If ye will receive it, this (John the Baptist) is Elias, which was for to come.” (Matthew 11:14)
This was an astonishing explanation. John the Baptist was Elias? Christ prefaced His explanation with the words: “If ye will receive it.” He meant apparently: If you can understand and accept this symbolical interpretation of the facts. Then Christ immediately added the words: “He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.” (Matthew 11:15)
This time there could be no doubt. He was warning His disciples that it would take spiritual ears to hear and believe in this truth. It was to be understood inwardly, not outwardly. This return, which Christ said had happened, had taken place in the spirit and not in the flesh. This is confirmed by John the Baptist himself. He was asked: “Art thou Elias?” He answered: “I am not.” He was asked: “Art thou that prophet?” He answered: “No.” (John 1:21)
Certainly Christ was not a liar. He knew that John was not Elias in the flesh. This is why it took spiritual ‘eyes’ to see and accept John as Elias. Once understood symbolically, the truth was simple: Elias had returned in the spirit in John the Baptist. If men were unable to understand the significance of this inward truth and accept it, Christ explained, they would continue to believe Him, Jesus, to be false. The return of Elias had come. John was the return of Elias-not in the flesh, but in the spirit. I found that this very event had been prophesied for John the Baptist in the Gospel of Luke: “... he (John) shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother’s womb ... And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias ...” (Luke 1:15, 17)
This was one of the most important clues I had yet found in the teachings of Christ. It was still another confirmation of why the Messiah, when He came again, would have a new name.
bahai-library.com/pdf/s/sears_thief_night.pdf
This was such an excellent and enlightening conversation! Thank you 😊🙏🏽
Such a great conversation. Thank you for sticking your neck out (both of you) and doing this interview.
Great job on asking important questions. Perhaps the spoiler for those who haven't watched this blog is that Rainn Wilson never once told you "...where I'm wrong on Spirituality". Do we see things from a different perspective? Perhaps, but neither viewpoint lacks validity. I think the message is not one of Evangelical Christians becoming Baha'is or Baha'is becoming Evangelicals, but instead a message of our working side by side to make this planet a better place for all human beings and more in line with the Spirit of Christ's Teachings. Let's put aside our "Otherness" and see the Divine too often buried deep in side of all of us. If we can do that, then this planet indeed has a chance to realize the potential to become the Kingdom of God on Earth.
Wonderful conversation. Thank you for having Rainn on.
Such a great conversation!!
Don the Con is the opposite of a Christian, you will see him on the golf course on Sunday morning.
Beatitudes:
Blessed are:
Poor in Spirit vs. proud
Meek vs. forceful & aggressive
Hungry & Thrist for Righteousness vs. seeking your own pleasures
Merciful vs. vengeful
Pure in Heart vs. evil heart
Peace Makers vs. looking for a fight
Right on Rainn Wilson! ❤❤❤Serve love. Create community.
Great conversation!
Very thought provoking
Is there a transcript everywhere?
All of my main pastors I know or follow and losten to online, state ," The Office as their favorite show!" Oh and " Christmas Vacation as their favorite movie.."..?? Lol
Way to go Russell! I admire your willingness to engage with Rainn. Loved this!
They both favour fiction over reality.
I'd say that endless conscious suffering is most definitely not justice. Christ Jesus said to always forgive but Christians teach that he is going to do the very opposite of what he taught. Rainn Wilson mentions the early Church fathers. I'd highly suggest doing some research on them, the Nicene Creed in particular. There's a lot to unpack but well worth your time.
Young people will find religion once they begin to experience what it is to get older, burying one's elder's, one's parents, one's contemporaries, and so on.
Interesting interview! As a non-fundamentalist, non-evangelical Christian I do tend to agree with the view of Jesus/Joshua/Yeshua as more of a teacher and a Buddha-like figure. I admire the Bahai faith but where I disagree with them is they pretty much accept all the prophets, whereas I don't really believe in any prophets. (Of course they get into big trouble in the Muslim world for daring to recognize prophets after Muhammad.) Maybe the term prophet grew out of a corruption of some term for ancient astrologers who tracked and predicted movements of the stars, but I certainly don't believe God picks certain people to have special authority over anyone. That said, I think there are many great teachers and philosophers who helped to advance humanity with major religious figures like Jesus, Buddha, Zoroaster, Lao Tzu and others among them. However, I've read some of the Quran and I can't get past even the first few pages without having a lot of issues with it. I know enough about Muhammad's life to know I don't think he was a particularly nice guy and the God he describes is one of strict rules and punishment, who is to be blindly obeyed out of fear. So, while I give credit to the spirit of openness and inclusion in the Bahai faith I would argue that it's somewhat naive to believe that all religions are equal.
He is right on the first or earliest Christians.. They shared with others. GAVE to each other. I often laugh or smile at the extreme right post of fear of socialism leading to being communist. Then oh my Karl Marx sermons..I dont want to be communist and know we do have some social programs .. Like Social Security..
But if they use any scripture that is very conservative or out of text. ## The Truth is the early christians did share and help one another. Socialism..
Real followers of Jesus aren't angry at you. We just love you like we are all loved by Jesus and pray you read more into the true God
. Just pray. You are so nice and interesting
Wait... "NO ONE" is talking about the system being wrong/rigged wrong???
The thing is, Jesus won't turn away a yearning soul, I am in a difficult patch, and I know that. Don't overthink it.
I know you all know this, but somehow I still have the need to say it, no person or group has a monopoly on God.
The 'spiritual' are the most materially and socially privileged. WHY isn't this ever acknowledged? 29:35 Suffering of course, what Christians enjoy the most...
That is a real discipline! To listen and ask questions only!? Wow. I wish non Christians would do the same
"We take with us the qualities of the divine (as we leave this existence). Part of our reason for existing is to develop the spiritual qualities of God exemplified by God's Son, Jesus Christ, by God's messenger Muhammed, by the friend of God Moses, by the awakened one the Buddha, by the glory of God Baha'u'llah the founder of the Baha'i faith."
God's messenger Muhammed"??? That is a statement that shows that Rainn Wilson doesn't have the Holy Spirit and is severely confused. Muhammed is a false prophet and is no more God's messenger than is Satan. He made a big deal of including leaders of other religions as holy when actually they will burn. This makes him a false teacher as well.
Specific yes, but objective? No, no one can claim objectivity when it comes to faith.
Please be careful. Hubris is right at hand for all of us.
Jesus already did his deed for us, he ain't going to save us from ourselves, salvation is for everyone, good or ill, that's what's so awesome about what he did.
Im confused with you stating," I think Jesus is either dead or alive." Im sure u didnt mean it that way. Why? I KNOW JESUS is Alive and believe it.!
I saw the title. I thought it was a joke.
Your edits make this unwatchable. 😢
That title is such a "Christian persecution" clickbait. You invited Rainn on your show, he graciously accepted, you pushed a bit on his worldview, he was honest, and yet it's Rainn who's telling YOU that you're wrong? Classic.
?
This is wrong on so many levels! If you are believing any of this, you are being deceived, there’s not many ways to the father there’s only one way!Don’t drink the Kool-Aid or you will parish with them 2 Timothy 2: 15
This Rainn fellow is on the wrong path, that's for sure!