To be fair, Alexander lived and died the way he choose, as a warrior in battle. Also by giving his innards to the small jar in Jarburg, a part of him lives on, able to become an even more formidable warrior.
I agree, he had a great life! As he said himself, all vessels are destined to break one day but he lived as a great warrior, having awesome adventures and seeing things he'd never have seen if he stayed in the safe village. Just like all humans-vessels containing souls? ;) -are destined to die one day. The point is to live a life you choose until that end.
I can imagine My Way by Frank Sinatra playing in the background. I've lived a life that's full I traveled each and every highway And more, much more I did it, I did it my way
I mean if you help Dung Eater, you can't really say you were just trying to be a good person and it backfired. He literally did exactly what he said he was going to do.
It's why I kinda love the dung eater as a character. I was expecting his story to be subversive as usual, with a "how did this poor guy get in this bad of a situation" type vibe, but no, he's not much of a tragic hero, he's literally the most evil fuck in the entire game lmao. He does exactly what he says he'll do, and he ain't sorry about it either.
@@Stunda_ Funniest part of all of this, with your help, that edgy emo teen wanting to ruin anyone lives can succeed ! Curses for everyone for no aother reasons than pure angst against the world and the gods !
For reference of how op Thops spell is: you can use it to reflect Elden star, black blade, almost all abilities from Renala. Thops is the true genius. o7
There are two graves near the place where you reunite the Jellyfish with her sister. The tombstone reads "Here lie Aurelia and Aureliette, who never saw the stars". sadness ahead
So your telling me the people who refuse to use the mimic because they feel the jelly is more unique are actually forcing a dead child to fight for them. Shits wild but oddly fitting for a souls game.
@@MettanAtem I love thinking about that from the other Sorcerer's perspectives. Thops gets a Glintstone key and comes back. Oh well, one more person isn't going to change much, even if he's a blunt stone with stupid, impossible ideas, right? He immediately sets to work, creates his barrier in what has to be a fairly short timeframe, then dies. Sad as it is to lose Thops, it's kind of funny to imagine how they had to feel like complete dipshits, for his theory to not only be correct, but for him to prove it so quickly.
I remember that it took my dad literally an hour to find Boc because he refused to look it up. It was hilarious just watching him run around trying to find the voice.
Happens too often. I just couldn't find enterance to Valiant Gargoyle fight in my NG+ for about an hour. Well although I wasn't circling 5 meters around a bush but around whole Nokron.
Honestly it took me like a million years, I just thought I was going crazy and ended up finding him by accident while trying to hit one of the rodent creatures that was running from me
I just gave up. It’s funny hearing someone saying their dad was playing this. Sounds like a bonding experience I could never imagine playing a game with my pops. I saw him play super Mario bros 2 one time.
@@Abeleko Same for me, not only he won't ever play any game more than 10 minutes period (I tried Dark Souls, Elden Ring, Dead Space, Bioshock...) He constantly ridicule me for playing games. Only time he played further than introduction of any game is when I showed Slay the Spire, essentially a card game.
Being a veteran to from software games, the first thing I think of when meeting NPCs is "I wonder what long convoluted course of events I have to trigger to actively bring about their demise.....cause I want that hat."
Alexander actually DOES get stronger, not just numerically, as the game progresses. By the time of the final fight, he can pull off a flaming Shoryuken and huge gravity crush attack taken straight from Radahn. He can do some real damage if you're not careful.
@@Simply_Oblivious I think so. The Warrior jars do seem to get qualities from the Warrior remains stuffed inside them. The more and better fallen warriors they have, the more and better strengths they can use. Kinda reminds me of how our character can use the memories of fallen warriors to learn new skills.
Also if you didn't do the Alexander quest, there is a sleeping dragon in Alexander's spot. If you did Alexander's quest tho, you can find the dragon somewhere else with half health, suggesting Alexander beat it half to death before fighting you
Unfortunately, Renallas Great Rune tells you it wouldn't have worked for him. It flat out says everyone she rebirths is frail and not long for the world. The only reason it works for you is because you have her Great Rune of the Unborn. It says it's the only way to have a "perfect rebirth".
the mage face ball thing is also explained exactly in detail online in the wiki! literally mages’ “punishment” of sorts it seems is they get turned into them for fucking with the forbidden shit/Primeval Current
@@Dairkun its more of the games trap than the players fault. I mean, why cant the option to accompany boc with the great rune and ensure that his rebirth is perfect, exist? Just have this death be a consequences of neglecting to accompany him and help him with proper procedure.
If only we could give our great rune to Boc.. or at least lend it to him so he undergoes perfect rebirth. We only need 2 great runes to repair the Elden Ring anyways. What's one less great rune?
10:30 “and then the sorcerers beat thops to death with a book. Because they realised that the one thing they hated more than an idiot was a smart ass.”
For people wondering what's going on with Sellen: her turning into a Burgerking Pinball is not your fault, Rennala didn't do that to her, and she might have even planned on doing that to herself as some sort of transitive phase like Azur or Lusat's crystalline appearance. If you help her against Jerren, and she shows up in Raya Lucaria, but you never tell her about meeting either one of the Primordial Sorcerers (I never met Lusat), she will stay in charge of Raya Lucaria forever. For the record she never actually hurts Rennala. She just kind of... pushes her into a corner, lmfao. Check behind the bookcases.
@Fortamican I feel like this must have at least been bounced around the idea table for a while, given the fact there's so many npcs that feel like it should be leading towards choosing them as a maiden, and also the fact you are given the option initially to refuse malena(?? Our finger maiden) despite her being required to progress.
Soo i do i little digging in a game and i think i get it what happend to Sellen (it is to those who dont know about it, soo everyone who do, dont be angry at me xD) so of all mages i find there are those with 1 stone faced mages up to 3 faced ones with magical potency scaling with number of stone faces mage have and of corse there are also those multi-faced balls that can hit hard with magic, the point is (at least i thing by connecting dots) the more someone know about Glintstone sorcery more that someone is magicaly capable in art and stone heads being a side-effect/prestige ? and then by restoring a primeval current in someone that person could acquire vast understanding of art/raw energy but as side effects go there is only soo much room for stone faces on your head inevitably, irreversibly and i suppose quite painful turning that someone into giant multi stone-faced magic anomaly as it was said that she was not the first and before her there were many who "failed"
While I don’t want anyone to accidentally hurt Boc, naturally discovering the “You’re Beautiful” solution just by sheer timing and circumstance (didn’t meet Boc until much later on) was easily one of my favorite moments in all of Elden Ring. Using the item a few times, partly hoping it would cause a reaction but mostly just doing it for the sentiment, only to then talk to Boc and see a new dialogue option was incredibly exciting, and the conversation that followed cemented the whole experience as my favorite quest line in a Souls game, period. That’s one demi-human monkey this world doesn’t deserve.
I had been guided to find him early, and as I love using the Prattling Pates my dear friend lead me to the "You're Beautiful" one, too, though after I'd spent much time dallying before getting into the Mountain region. I, however, noticed the lore that it was the voice of a mother and that it had a similar accent to Boc. I was so excited to go tell him how much I like him, and was thrilled to see the new dialogue too! It was after that my friend said they had really hoped I'd make the connections on my own, but they planned to tell me in NG+ if I hadn't. Boc is such a darling, and really, he isn't hard to look at. (Maybe a little silly that his mouth always gapes open like he's star struck after he finishes talking.)
I noticed even the item description says it's the voice of a demi human mother, so I planned to let him hear it. He is the only one who talks repeatly lovingly about his mother. His ending after the prattling pate is ominous
Love this and this is totally why I try not to look stuff up. The satisfaction of those little discoveries are so much more impactful than following a wiki. [I blew it with boc and just watched this so...]
Thops you OBJECTIVELY helped. He achieved his life's work. He literally changed the world because of you. He died having finally achieved his goals. You made that possible.
@@alexl.4362 well, the world may be a bit of an overstatement. but from thops' barrier spell we know he definitely changed the future of glintstone sorcery. his barrier spell was revolutionary enough to have earned an entire new conspectus of the academy.
Not just that, but apparently he died of exhaustion rather than be killed because making his theory work was that important to him. It's like a posthumous Nobel Peace Prize type of thing.
@@blueskiesabove2641 The academy was already beyond repair with Rennala in her current state; the last of the Carian Knights were killed by you and the major heads were either killed during the infighting or abandoned the school altogether. Changing the future of glintstone sorcery is a bit of a stretch, more like he gave it an small highlight as the pages burned. He ultimately just made a cool spell and died in his home but there's pretty much nothing left for the Academy to speak of for him to influence. If anything, he could've just rediscovered a lost spell, it's likely much of the knowledge created under Rennala is gone forever from the turmoil.
@@sws212 "Future generations will learn. They will know the foolishness of the sneering sorcerers who ridiculed this theory, little realizing that it was in fact a discovery worthy of a new conspectus of the academy." The academy is not finished yet. True, in present times its kind of fallling apart, but so is literally everything else in the world, thats why you need to become elden lord and fix the elden ring. The spell description talks about FUTURE GENERATIONS. These **future** generations will learn thops' barrrier was revolutionary enough to make a whole new conspectus based on it.
"Elden Ring is an empowering story about starting out as a meager low level tarnished with a miniscule healthbar - and going on to get a ghost clone that does the rest of the game for you" I cried both tears of laughter and sadness
@@TrophyHunterTyler tip for the mimic tear once you get it (if you haven't already): if you equip raw meat dumplings in your item slot, then the mimic tear can use them and heal half its hp basically at will, meaning that at +10, it just becomes an immortal boss distractor.
You’re hardly responsible for Sellen’s life…she starts off dying and chained to a wall in a dungeon. You help free her by transplanting her life crystal to a new body. After that she chooses to challenge Rennala…not your doing.
@@destrorso2505 right…and again…that’s hardly your doing. This video suggests the player is responsible for her outcome…but nothing you did made her life worse.
@@barryweatherley5046 The argument I guess should be that your involvement in bringing her to that point is why you're to blame. As in, she wouldn't have turned into a burger king head ball if you didn't help her out of that dungeon in the first place. Though yeah I'm just playing devil's advocat, I actually agree with you.
The humour in this video is so on point it’s great “he’s dead, oh shit” “I think thops was beaten to death with a book” Luke just has a talent for making things even funnier
to be fair, Boc mentions several times that his mother was one of the closest people to him, and the Prattling Pate item descrition mentions how it must be the voice of a loving mother
@@zamarickz Yeah but it worked for me 5 times before I tried it on Boc. And no faults there. But now that you mentioned it my character never said a word.
@@MrCrownedClown It is odd that the player can "rebirth," but the lore tells us that her rebirth process doesn't work lol. I guess since we aren't changing form it works for us?
The ending for Boc when you help him realize that he's perfect just the way he is actually got me super emotional when I encountered it. I love that little man so much.
This isn't just dying in a tragic way anymore. Literally anything I do they're dropping like flies, it's ridiculous. According to this game, I could sneeze and some dude in the underground would be crushed by a boulder because he went to the same highschool as me. This game makes you FEEL like being on a watchlist.
Youre coment, reminds me the whole concept of the character Nanika from Hunter x Hunter. Someone makes a big wish, the next person who cant acomplish the demands will die, and all the people who cared and expend time with him/her will fucking die depending on how big the wish was.
@@alangama8464 bahhahahahhahahahha shit , I haven't watched hunter x hunter but this made me die of laughter! Damn the way u worded it is fricken perfect ! Bahahhahahahhahah
I got to the volcano manor and thought "hey, these people seem kinda cool," then I ran into patches on the way out and realized I'd made a horrible mistake.
@@23Scadu yall ever run into patches on the WAY to volcano manor? He tells you about this cool maiden mechanism thing at the bottom of raya lucaria that - rumour has it, is embedded with a teleporting mechanism and can teleport you to Leyndell itself! Very excitingly he tells you this, clearly hoping you (as someone who wants to get into the Capital City) would seek this Maiden out and get it to swallow you. Seeing as how he makes it INTO the manor unscathed i'm starting to think he knew what the thing was actually going to do.
I just did it for the loot tbh lol "Oh, WHAT. I murdered a whole six people for nice clothes 🙄 and you farted this morning so we're both a bit morally grey, get over yourself"
Actually for Thops, he got what he wanted. If you listened to any of his dialogue, he himself said even though he is a bluntstone and would never fit in with the rest of the mages in the Academy, deep within his heart, he still belongs in the Academy where he can continue studying magic. Saying we shouldn't help Thops is the same way saying we should never have done Alexander's questline. He was a warrior at heart and wanted to fight and to a warrior dying on the battlefield was better than dying in bed. And so he got exactly what he wanted. A duel with a Tarnished (Elden Lord) and still lost but he was happy we gave him this chance. And I think he would be happier knowing we fought him instead in the future possibly losing to some poachers. Thops is the exact same, he longs to be in the Academy, if we kill him early he even says it's the home to his studies. Which showed truly how much he wanted to be in the Academy. I rather knowing that he will die in the place he felt like home than forever miserable and filled with regret on not being able to return home, just like that lingering spirit in East Lunaria where he was shut out of the Academy.
Sellen's folly is revealed in the Graven Mass talismans. She was driven from the academy for killing students to turn into star seeds. She built all those sorcerer heads with her experiments. When she had you reveal Lusat's and Azur's corpses, she was going to do it again, but this time with other powerful glintstone sorcerers. She may be a great teacher, but she's definitely the bad guy of the academy.
And yet... two other characters know her well, and considered these actions to be very inconsistent with what they knew of her. We know her to be fairly ruthless in her time - hell, she's planning a coup at one point - but it's almost like these actions were taken by someone else. Someone else, for example, who happens to be capable of profoundly vile actions, and who has a puppet to command that looks exactly like Sellen locked in his basement. Consider also that Seluvis also has some relationship with Gideon and wants to puppet Nepheli, and the thing that makes Nepheli vulnerable to Seluvis's potion is her profound depression at discovering the Albinauric Village destroyed by an Omenkiller, allegedly at the hands of Gideon. Except another one of the puppets in Seluvis's basement is also an omenkiller. Neither are conclusive, and each can go either way. Sellen may have been the murdering experimenter, and perhaps Gideon actually was the one to frame Seluvis, given if you give him the potion he may be the reason Seluvis is found dead as a puppet. But then that begs the question of what the deal with Pidia was.
@@UnreasonableOpinions I believe Seluvis is found dead as a puppet regardless of your actions. You just have to progress Ranni's questline far enough for it to happen. That said, Pidia claims to be watching over the other cache of puppets, but if you head over after Seluvis dies you'll find Pidia getting bludgeoned to death by the puppets while exclaiming that they belong to him, heavily implying that Seluvis was a puppet all along and Pidia was the one actually pulling the strings.
@@HanabiraKage That's interesting. I never even thought of that particular angle. That Pidia was controlling Seluvis. I kind of figured Pidia was just a servant of his since it really didn't make much sense that Seluvis would be looking for a star shard that Pidia has the map to.
13:58 Patches quest was updated. He returns back to his original cave and ambushes you again when you open his chest like when you first met. He quickly recognizes you and surrenders and gives you another gesture. If you return later he’s set up his store again. He did mention setting up a shop with the pals. So I’m assuming that means he will be around during Shadow of the Erdtree DLC.
I want this to be clear: Thops is one of the most badass characters in the whole game and if you think about it for a bit, you'll notice why. Aside from him inventing a way to just... reflect spells, something the Carians were unable to do as even Carian Retaliation just converts the spell to something else, this man is a humble sorcerer who just decided to help us out and when we find a single Glintstone Key, if we return before we find the second, he just tells us to keep it and do our stuff, he's fine with waiting until we finished our business. When we do finish our business, fighting through the Academy, and return to Thops, he takes the spare key, seemingly walks through the town that's filled with enemies and a flame spewing head, enters the Academy which likely has seen better days, shrugs his shoulders, walks through the graveyard filled with corpses, dogs and marionettes, the most fun of all enemies, and when he reaches his desk, calmly sits down to just die... without any trace of damage on him. I'm not even sure the man is dead, I think he just completed Sellen's research on his own, without the need for the transformed primeval sorcerers and just ascended to godhood.
Presumably the guards wouldn't attack him - he's a registered student of the academy, probably has his ID card and Unidays membership and everything - and they're still following their orders even though they're long insane. Thops is still a cool guy, though.
I was progressing along Boc's storyline and learned about the death after his rebirth, so I wanted to avoid that. However, I progressed too far before before I tried the Prattling Pate. As a result he disappears from his spot in Lyndell. You can then find him outside the Raya Lucaria library, still in demi-human form... LYING DEAD AND MOTIONLESS! Heartbreaking.
It's such a silly/broken quest, you can be teleported to inner Leyndell by accident and the game will progress his story and Melina will abandon you, without even giving you a chance to reach Gelmir first, then, if you talk to him there, HE ASKS you what do you think of him, and you can't just say "you are beautiful" or whatever, YOU MUST have the ITEM that TELLS it for you. And he dies, of course, because a dialog option it's not an option.
You might as well include every NPC. Everyone I came across either died or was worse off mentally by the time I hit the end. The old Souls adage stands: "The best way to help an NPC in a Souls game is to ignore them and never speak to them."
Yep. None of this surprises me. At least with Boc we can leave him alive by using that prattling pate near him and not giving him the tear. I'm personally dreading Blaidd's end.
The most terrible part about Boggart's death is that he experiences a fate more bad than death. Since he became defiled by the Dung Eater, he is no longer granted the ability to return to the Erdtree and is rejected, just like other "cursed" being such as the Misbegotten and Omens.
@@CallMeTeci Jason “Boohoo Where’s My Press Invitation? Sexual Harassment Of Men Isnt Real Sexual Harassment” Schreier? I feel fairly sure that he won’t cover Fromsoft unless it’s actual law breaking, there are numerous times that he’s already come too close to stepping into one Souls-like bottomless pit of regret after another for his countless bad takes on popular games and the companies responsible for them.
I think you can keep him alive but i'm not sure, in my first playthrough i finished all in Liurnia and remembered about Thops, i played a strenght build so i had no use for him. So i had a key for Academy and tried to give it to him and he refused. I'm not sure if i recall correctly but i tried to give him the key, he refused and stayed in that church for the rest of the game.
You can prevent Sellen's death by never telling her about Lusat. She just stays in the grand library and Fromsoft planned for that as well. You can still respec with Rennalla. She's tucked behind a bookcase in the library.
@@joaofaria7404 Yeah, she asks her favor after telling you about Lusat. After the Jarren fight, she gives you the same dialogue about being loyal to you when you become Lord and all that, but will also speak about still needing Lusat. It keeps the quest open and she teaches sorceries, but once you tell her about Lusat, she turns into the ball. If you want Lusat's armor though, you have to tell her. It's more of a NG+ thing I guess.
Theres another clue at the jellyfish ruins. If you search the cliffs near the ruins youll find two gravestones next to eachother you can examine. It says "Here lie Aurelia & Aureliette, they never got to see the stars."
Melina gives you a hint when you rest at the Altus Highway junction (where Boc is before moving to the capital) where she says he's sad and cries often. She thinks he wants to be told he's beautiful. The hint is there, but you have to talk to Melina when you rest at the site of grace
You call that a hint?!? Sure , next time fromsoft should obscure it even more. We should have to perform a strict sequence of prattling pates, gestures while reloading the area a million times until finally quest can progress. And even then, there'd be some people who say the hints were there the whole time.
Also it's pretty clear that the 'rebirth' Rennala offers has some serious drawbacks. Even if the lore didn't lay it out, the generally creepy vibe and the crippled 'sweetings' crawling around her arena gives you the idea without having to say much. And really, it just seems too good to be true in a world like this. There's no way a 'happy ending' like that would ever not have a serious catch.
Sellen's fate feels fitting and the least "tragic" the more you think about it. From her comments on the Carian royal family ruling the academy, you'd think she was just expelled because she didn't want to participate in "toothless pedantry" (sticking to rules that kept the magic harmless). But the Carian royal family was making these rules for the academy with good reason, because when you follow Sellen's questline, you discover that if you research primeval/glintstone magic too much, it will break your mind like it did to Lusat and Azur or make you do harm unto others in pursuit of power. In Sellen's case, you find out from Jerren that she was expelled because she killed countless sorcerers. He calls her the graven witch and when you look at items like the Graven-School talisman, you understand what horrifying things she must have done to those sorcerers: She added them to her "school", which is in fact the "graven schools", the stone face balls made up of literal sorcerers. She mentions Azur and Lusat and even Jerren being added to the "school" the more you proceed through her quest, clearly not intending to stop increasing her power through using others. In a way, it's fitting that her demise is at the height of what she perceives to be her victory over the academy, a place that, ironically, has already been completely ransacked and destroyed by its own pupils who lashed out against the clearly needed control of the royal family. When Sellen turns into the exact same thing she subjected all of her victims of scientific study to, it's a perfect, horrible ending to her pursuit of power. Her demise was at her own hands and she has to join the school, just like she forced countless others to do so,
@@FelisImpurrator next time you try to correct, make sure you're not the one getting recorrected. Now boy, look up something called a patch then actually correct yourself then dismiss yourself
I didn't know who the hell is Nephali until I finally fought Godfrey and by Heavens she helped us Greatly to defeat him. I'm glad I didn't know her name Shape or look until I decided to get rid of the Dumb Potion.
I handed the potion to Gideon instead. But when Seluvis gave me another potion to give Ranni, I tried to report Ranni about it, she didn't respond, I handed her the potion and she expelled me off her sight. I tried to speak twice more and at last she insta killed me. When I got back up she was gone and Seluvis was dead.
I didn't know how Ranni's questline would turn out, so I was eager to follow it, but I was worried about screwing it up so I thought I HAD to give Nepheli the potion, or I'd fuck up Ranni's questline not knowing it only affected Seluvis'. I regret that decision greatly. But I have much greater regrets in my life, so it doesn't matter too much.
For context, Sellen turned her fellow mages into those giant mask-covered spheres in order to improve her own power. It seems likely that she planned to do the same to Rennala, but it blew straight back into her face when either Rennala or (more likely) Ranni got wind of it.
From what ive seen its actually that when a graven mage goes too far deep into learning these sorceries and the knowledge of the stars, they turn into a ball of faces.
@@AfterLifeGuru oh where was that stated ? sounds cool. I thought she transformed because its implied she has stolen/used other bodies before in her research, as stated by jerren, and she might have tried to do the same to azur and lusat, who is already partly crystallized.
The dialogue is from the graven mass talisman which is: "A talisman depicting the first school of graven mages - a nightmare that would continue to haunt the academy. Greatly raises potency of sorceries. The primeval current is a forbidden tradition of glintstone sorcery. To those who cleave to its teachings, the act of collecting sorcerers to fashion them into the seeds of stars is but another path of scientific inquiry."
@@AfterLifeGuru if you recall, Sellen is known as the Graven Witch, which implies that she was the one who either discovered how to convert other mages into schools of Graven Mages, or simply figured out how to tap into their power.
See, if they really wanted to hit us in the guts, they would turn Tanith into a serpent-like boss and would allow Patches to be a summon. But this time he would not leave.
Instead he’d turn on you cuz he can’t bring himself to hurt Tanith? Or he helps you kill her and then they both die. Or something more tragic, it’s a soulsgame.
I think it’s both. According to Alexander’s own assessment of things, we are supposed to feel happy that we have fulfilled his wish and given him what he desires. But we are also supposed to see that as tragic since so much is wrong with the world and Alexander is so good. It is also tragic, because even if it is what he wanted, we aren’t supposed to just think that it’s not sad or that it’s a good thing.
If you read the item description of the prattling pate, you can infer it’s boc’s mother voice. So it making him feel better makes a lot of sense because boc is a mommies boy. “Twisted clay sculpt in the shape of a demi-human head. Emits a voice that says "You're beautiful." A wistful fetish that imparts voices and words on an eternal journey. Unconditional love. Unrestrained assurance. It must have been a mother speaking.” Item description as well
Note for PATCHES questline: You can go back to Murkwater Cave to get ambushed by Patches a second time. He will then tell you that it has been a long time since you two met and will open his shop again.
Where the hell is Patches? I completely missed this character on my first playthru. I was already over 100 hours into the game before I heard people and videos talking about him 😕
@@Crimsonlee2XX that canyon near agneel lake has a cave in it, two actually, but you'll get invaded near the first one on the left side of the canyon, and it's that one :)
So you're saying the dead children, who were turned into Jellyfish, are the only ones to have a happy ending. I'm starting to regret how much I like Sellen.
I guess the one lesson that From Soft games teach you is to leave people well enough alone. Helping them is possibly the worst thing you can do for them.
you forgot the very first quest i completed which ended with the blind daughter killed and the father, driven mad with grief and revenge, i had to put down like a rabid dog at the revenger shack
@@damiester1 i checked when hyetta spawns right after stormveil castle cause i thought she looked like her, but the girls body is still in it's original spot
@@kj_blaze I don't know if that's an oversight, but there is evidence of Hyetta being Irina. Hyetta only spawns after Irina dies, the bloodstains are still on the dress, they have the same voice actress etc... It's somewhat similar to Yura who gets taken over by Shabriri.
Sooooo while finding her stuck to the wall in the one cellar she never gave me the option of taking her soul... she just kept repeating some nonsense and eventually I killed her and when I did she said I’d pay for what I did.... like what?? I feel cheated
@@Kevcoffe101 Answer might be late, but you probably didnt encounter her in the cave behind the pumpkin head or in gelmir before. You can always find sellen trapped at the witches tomb, but to trigger her quest, you gotta start it in the first place. Thats done in the cave in limgrave, not the cellar you find her trapped in.
Sorry for this being so late but... Jerren is better. As a good friend of Radahn who vowed him death in honorable battle given his loss of mind he does all he can for his closest friend. Also sellen is involved with seluvis... and eff him for sweet nepheli
Just, for the record, becoming a graven school was always Sellen's goal. The Graven School and Graven Mass Talismans' flavour text mentions that for students of the primeval current (which Sellen made very clear she was), one path of study is to collect sorcerers to fashion them into the "seeds of stars." These seeds are graven schools. This isn't something you become if you fly too close to the sun, or some ish. Sellen had to actively pursue this form. And as graven schools are made up of several sorcerers, the fact that Sellen is the consciousness "in control" when you speak to it heavily implies she is the primary sorcerer in the school, which no doubt means she created the school. It is, however, also implied that graven schools are made up of unwilling participants. While Sellen wanted to become a graven school, all the sorcerers she bound to her probably didn't. She says to Jerren during the fight against him "Join the school, to reflect on your mistakes," and somehow, I doubt she was talking about Raya Lucaria.
You know this adds more context to her last words to us. If we fail to become a lord, we can always come pay her a visit; that "even her dullest students will always have a place here." If she was always intending to become a graven school, i dont think she would've made that offer for the school. Mayybe the "here" she meant was her graven school. I mean, heck, the manor's lord is a giant snake with a face in it that was to basically graft you and those people like you. Wouldn't be too far-fetched that she wanted you to "join" her, too...same with that jar guy. I'm starting to think the people in the lands just want us for our bodies.
You can do his quest and keep Boggart alive by aggroing him before the conversation that makes Dung Eater invade. He will still invade, but Boggart will be aggroed and alive. Then just kill the invader, and seek absolution.
I gave the Dung eater Seluvis's potion in my first playthrough,and killed him off in the sewers in the new game + because a-by doing this Boggart will still be alive and will be one of the few NPC's who have a happy end,b-Dung eater is one of the most powerful summons in the game
We Tarnished are really just the equivalent of a kid running around with a loaded gun, powerful yet incredibly dangerous because have absolutely no idea what we are doing.
Boggart was never invaded in the moat in my playthrough. The Dung Eater was my puppet (and an awesome puppet at that) at that point. He's still cooking that delicious crab meat on the side of that gorgeous moat down there.
You can't give him a potion until after he invades though? That being said, you can save Boggart if you aggro him before the invasion and then hit the church of vows.
@@omniscension8967 or ignore his questline. I got to lava manor the long way. Met and released Dung Eater and all that. The only trade off was no crab meat. He stays where you first meet him. At least for me.
Alexander and the little jar are a far more optimistic parallel to Siegmeyer and his daughter from OG dark souls, who went hollow and was put down by his daughter. Alexander at least died happy, and his jar friend went on to become a jar worthy of Alexander’s memory.
@@TrafalgarWaterDLaw-dl5cm that’s true! Alexander is low key kind of strong too. The place you fight him at is where a dragon normally sits, presumably because Alexander killed it before we got there. If that’s the case, he’s definitely pretty damn strong even if he didn’t feel that strong in the final fight.
@@CringeGamingOG Almost you can encounter that Dragon elswhere if you do his quest but at half hp. Suggesting he beat the damn dragon half to death before it ran away.
You can kill Tanith when she‘s eating Rykard. As a consequence, you‘ll be invaded on the spot by the Crucible Knight who‘s her servant. I don‘t remember what loot he drops, if any.
I find it somewhat amusing to think of Thops just walking into the academy, ignoring all monstrosities lingering there and casually sitting at the table as if nothing happened
The sad thing about Millicent is, Malenia would most likely have killed her in an instant. Considering how much she hates the scarlet rot and its servants, and what Gowry says if you helped Millicent.
Except Millicent explicitly states that she is there to return the Unalloyed gold needle to Melania, so that she can once again ward off the influence of the Scarlet Rot as she had been doing before she removed it in the fight with Radahn.
@@Digitize27 Look I love Malenia, but considering how quickly she attacks us, I kinda doubt she wouldn't do the same with Millicent. I get she only attacks us because of "Dark Souls boss", but still. When we find her she seems to basically give into the rot
I mean it’s not like Millicent was actually related to Malenia in anyway. The whole point of her quest is she’s a created flawed imitation that the scarlet cultists tried to make to imitate Malenia because she rejected being their goddess and embracing her Scarlet rot.
For those wondering, Blair’s was essentially a childhood friend/ Bodyguard of Ranni the Witch, a main character for one of the endings, and also the lady who gives you the spirit bell. Rannis goal (which you help her to achieve) is to defy the 2 fingers. However, Blaidd was (unknowingly), a sleeper agent for the 2 fingers. At the end of his quest, you are forced to kill him to protect Ranni. At least his armor is sick.
@@dumbmemes4180 My understanding is that Blaidd wasn't really a sleeper agent. He is Ranni's Shadow, essentially an eternally loyal servant given to her by the Greater Will because of her status as an Empyrean. She ultimately had to betray him because he was inextricably bound to the Order and everything Ranni wanted to destroy, similar to how she killed her "two fingers" incarnation with the finger killer blade. It's super convoluted, but Vaatividya did a great video about the game's lore that covers how it all works.
15:05 you can actually find patches again back at the murkwater cave, in a twist of Deja vu, you loot a chest, patches jumps down, says you're stealing his stuff, then you commence a boss fight with him. After you hit him once he starts to remember you and you get an emote
You're not looting his stuff. If you ignore the chest, it asks you to open the chest in the dialog. And after you fall into the trap, he says, finally I was able to open it.
I think Alexander didn't get "ruined". He was able to live the life he wanted with what hand he was dealed. He wasn't sad at the end apart from losing, but rejoiced how he lived.
Doing Sellen's quest gave me the impression that she knew exactly what she was doing and what she'd become. It's probably no less painful than it seems but I think she either knew the risks of pursuing her research or actively sought to become a horrifying ball of faces.
She is totally a bad guy trying to overthrow Rennala and have the school pursue a different path of magic research. That's why she's mounted to the wall in a dungeon guarded by a face monster. She even admits being exiled. I was not surprised to find her a monster, I thought she was just going to be killed by rennala.
tbh i never really understood what those ball of faces were. Is it something they do to themselves to become closer to the primeval current? Or the consequences of trying to grasp it? And why does Sellen need Lusats and Azurs bodies? Also, im pretty sure her becoming a ball has nothing to do with Renalla, as she stays normal until you give Lusats location, even after you kill Jerren.
Its almost a meme how fromsoft has every friendly NPC's story end at this point, I don't get upset/surprised anymore. It's like, meet an npc. He/she doesn't want to kill me. They have a minor tragic backstory and a goal. Help NPC complete goal. NPC dies in a sad way for no reason other than to make you feel bad. Bravo, writing team.
Dude seriously. It's like they're trying so hard to be this edgy ass game by killing everyone remotely good. It's getting lame and old to the point you can pretty much predict how every quest will end
@@-Four- I mean practically everyone dies, not just the good ones. The game just doesn't sugarcoat the world. It's a rotting, dying world, anyone who is still alive is going to die soon, good or bad, doesn't matter. They wouldn't be following the themes of their own story and setting if they didn't kill most of them off. Might not be your thing, but they aren't wrong for making the stories that way, as it'd break the point otherwise. It's a dark world, people die.
4:30 If you talk to Melina (at sites of Grace that Boc appears nearby) in Leyndell she literally tells you to tell him he's beautiful. So, it's not really "incredibly obscure".
I hadn’t seen my buddy in a while. Then I saw him in the capital and wanted to do anything to help. I wonder why he wouldn’t talk after he turned. Look…look how they massacred my boy.
@@kidfazer I think it's pretty poetic. You can only find them when you want to and help them if you want to. You'll completely miss the journey when you're only thinking of going straight to the finish line.
Hey, I didn't ruin Sellen's life. I just encouraged and enabled her every time she made a decision for herself that ruined her own life more. And Patches isn't dead. He's playing you again. He disappears when you reload the area, drops no runes, leaves no blood stain, no body, no items, no bell bearing for his shop. He's fine. And good on that crab, cursing the Dung Eater with Death.
When you kill him he drops he's ball and items. How do I know that? Well, he's Patches and I'm a veteran from other souls. Can't waste the chance of killing off that bastard at the start of the game.
The game tells us that Rennala was deposed from leading the academy after Radagon left her. She was locked into the library since she's a shell of her former self. Probably why the phase two is a fight with the version Ranni conjures, it's like her true self from before.
The problem with Hyetta is that she's actually hijacked the body of the murdered Irina from much, much earlier in the game. It's why Edgar invades you later on and you end up giving 'Hyetta' the grape that he drops.
Technically Hyetta might have been a body snatcher, much like how Shabriri steals Yura's body later in the game. Her model is the exact same as the character Irina's and she doesn't spawn until after Irina has died. I believe she may have been an extension of the frenzied flame like Shabriri, drawing you ever near the Three Fingers in order to become the lord of Frenzied Flame.
This makes quite a lot of sense, I never thought about it. Although, Lanya also has the same NPC model if I remember correctly. So that's two NPCs with the same model that just. Die. Irina does mention that she has had vision problems since birth, just like Hyetta, so your theory may be correct.
@@Ashmodath is not there, just a bloody messy cleaver, but not misbegottens around, which, causes the father to go mad seeking revenge, finding out a girl of close resemblance of her daughter and ending truly devoured by madness
There's this theory I read on reddit which I found fascinating which claimed that the body snatcher could be Shabriri himself who is some sort of trickster God like Loki who tries to trick you into serving the three fingers and ultimately burning down the Erdtree. It seemed quite plausible to me because when I looked at the Shabriri's Woe talisman, the face on it seemed to be that of a trickster, smiling. Also it's effect of aggravating enemies against you also seems like a cruel trick a Loki like god might play. Ngl I felt like punching that smiling face the talisman had when I read what it does
Hyetta is likely a possessed body, specifically Irina. She still has blood on her dress. Plus, her father has an eye of Shabriri, a clear connection to it all. How would he come into contact with madness if not being put forth by Hyetta?
I disagree with some: Thops, although he died, he's happy being with the academy, for him, its better to be in the academy than in that Church doing nothing Alexander because the fight we gave him makes him happy, he felt he's a warrior fighting the best warrior he know
Sellen's quest absolutely floored me, I was just getting used to everything I touched or helped dying or ending up miserable, and here she is, seemingly at the end of her quest happy and pledging to help me with the backing of the Academy of Raya Lucaria! I was so excited, I saw visions of gaining other allies, like Nepheli and Kenenth, only for...well... we saw here. I guess we just cannot have anything nice, eh?~
I think Blaidd also fits this list! After all, all he wants is for you to help Ranni, which you do. Unfortunately, what Ranni wants is to rebel against the Two Fingers, so they try to control Blaidd's mind, which they can do because they created him to be Ranni's shadow. In the end you have to put poor, insane Blaidd down like the big, sword-wielding dog-man he is. Heck, you could even say Iji also counts, since he suffers a similar fate to Blaidd shortly after you inform him of the doggo's death. When you reload the area he seems to have killed himself with black flames after fending off the Black Knife assassins, presumably to sever his connection to the Two Fingers. All because YOU helped Ranni :)
Alternatively, he fended off the gank, but the sheer amount of spam killed him because he forgot that black fire deals persistent damage based on total health
At least iji died on his own terms though, and do it willingly to fulfill Ranni's destiny. Blaidd certainly prefers to still aid ranni to the end but got denied that opportunity by the fingers.
ohhh right, i remembered now that Ranni is an Emperyan and destinied to inherit Marika so she got Blaid as her shadow. Now it make sense why Ranni asked you to kill him as the Baleful Shadow. Man the shadows, Malekith and Blaidd really got the short end of the stick. Though interestingly, Malekith is Marika half brother, is Blaid related to Rani? as far as i know, people like Blaid and Malekith don't really exist, so maybe they got the beastly form after becoming shadows? I guess Vele (or whatever his name is) figure out what would happen if Ranni make her intention clear so he locked Blaid away, for everyone safefy.
I think you should also mention how Hyetta was originally the gentle blind girl you can find near Castle Morne, whose death you caused by delivering the letter to her father Who THEN is resurrected by Shabriri or the three fingers idk and becomes Hyetta the cursed finger maiden
Eh, I wouldn't really blame you for Irina's death, beyond the fact that delivering the letter tells the game to kill her. She was alone and helpless with Misbegotten on her trail. The only thing you did to kill her (in terms of story, not in terms of the game code killing her in response to you doing something on the other side of the map) was not insisting on hoisting her onto Torrent and taking her somewhere relatively safer (uuuhhhhhh...... the merchant at the Church of Elleh seems nice, I guess?).
What an absolute masterpiece of a game. I’ve sunk nearly 200 hours into this game on two playthrough’s now and the vast majority of this video is news to me
Luke: "You are a big tarnished with no stupid hat." Me: Now hold on just a minute... Luke: "The really stupid hats don't start unlocking until much later." Me: Yep, checks out 😌😎😂
"Helping" Rya: "Hey innocently pure snek, you were created by horrific ritual that resulted in the death and torture of dozens." Rya: "Oh, wow, thanks for letting me know. Can you please kill me now? No? Fine, then I'll wound your very soul by telling you I love you and then disappearing. Ciao!" You'd almost think this was written by the same person that wrote Game of Thrones or something, because it's less of a spoiler to say someone has a tragic ending then a positive one. Oh... wait...
Late comment but I always assumed it wasn't because he couldn't handle it but because it was a mean name for those who struggled with sorcery. I mean he knew a few basic ones so he definitely could but because assumed he was incapable of doing much more and disregarded his pursuits for a new kind of sorcery
Sellen is even above Alexander for how much it hurt to see what happens at the end. I genuinely loved her character, maybe she wasn't exactly 'good', but the way she's so supportive and how she discusses wanting you to turn her into the pupil once you becomes Elden Lord put a huge smile on my face! Only for me to rest at the grace and look around confused until I realised what had happened to her where my heart lurched, dammit Myazaki.
Yeah voldemort/orochimaru was a cool teacher til the end. care for us feed us knowledge. Even let us take care of her own soul who care if she use others for living we dont know them we know sellen our teacher we are tarnish/human we barely care for those we dont know most of the time
I spoiled myself on her ending while looking up the location of her duel , so I withheld telling her about Lusat's body's location. Now she's still standing happily oblivious in the middle of the Raya Lucaria Library. I get that she's evil and all, but in a world where everything (even goats) is trying to murder you, at least she is one of the nicest people to you.
After giving Tanith the castanets, go back to Murkwater Cave and find Patches doing the same thing he did when you first find, only if you fight him for a bit he realizes its you again and stops fighting, reopening his shop.
I know im late af but the saddest part of selens quest is that she turned herself into the graven-mass by combining with azure and lusats bodies, as well as presumably a bunch of random raya lucarian mages, the graven-mass talisman (ball of heads) lore says primeval glintstone current is forbidden and for those that cling to its teachings creating a “seed of the stars” by “collecting” sorcerers is a scientific inquiry. Tldr selen was turned into a graven-mass (star seed) intentionally. Its supposedly the height of primal glintstone sorcery by combining several sorcerers into a single form.
Blaidd broke my heart. Its like fromsoft said people really liked sif , how do we twist the knife further. Let make him talk and make him super loyal and trusting I cried when I fought him
@@stephenroche7988 Ranni's set (Snow Witch set) should be available in Renna's tower regardless of Blaidd being dead or not once you have gotten far enough into her questline.
To be fair, the Experiments Sellen performed on other students as she was still at the Acedemy were more gruesome, leading sometimes to Death or being also turned into big Balls of Stone Heads
TV Tropes actually suggests that Thops went out like Mozart, that is to say (depending on who you ask) he worked himself to death in the process of completing his final project.
The Dung Eater literally says "I shall defile each corpse with care"
That's not a guy you want to let out.
Dont worry about it,
OH NO
I let him out then immediately obliterated him
Unless you're RTGame
As soon as he said that i started slicing
To be fair, Alexander lived and died the way he choose, as a warrior in battle. Also by giving his innards to the small jar in Jarburg, a part of him lives on, able to become an even more formidable warrior.
I agree, he had a great life! As he said himself, all vessels are destined to break one day but he lived as a great warrior, having awesome adventures and seeing things he'd never have seen if he stayed in the safe village. Just like all humans-vessels containing souls? ;) -are destined to die one day. The point is to live a life you choose until that end.
I can imagine My Way by Frank Sinatra playing in the background.
I've lived a life that's full
I traveled each and every highway
And more, much more
I did it, I did it my way
I accidentally killed him thinking he was stuck inside a big jar
@@SoraDestiny471 bruh 💀
Actually, after you give the jar in jarburg, you can find that jar kid dead somewhere in caelid (sorry I don't know where exactly)
I mean if you help Dung Eater, you can't really say you were just trying to be a good person and it backfired. He literally did exactly what he said he was going to do.
It's why I kinda love the dung eater as a character. I was expecting his story to be subversive as usual, with a "how did this poor guy get in this bad of a situation" type vibe, but no, he's not much of a tragic hero, he's literally the most evil fuck in the entire game lmao. He does exactly what he says he'll do, and he ain't sorry about it either.
@@Stunda_ Funniest part of all of this, with your help, that edgy emo teen wanting to ruin anyone lives can succeed ! Curses for everyone for no aother reasons than pure angst against the world and the gods !
I killed him in the sewers my man talked too much shit for me not to run his pockets
I can change him 😩
@@yeeee859 💀💀💀💀
For reference of how op Thops spell is: you can use it to reflect Elden star, black blade, almost all abilities from Renala. Thops is the true genius. o7
Someone pin this comment.
Unfortunately it doesn’t deflect book
>elden stars
The worst spell in the game. Not high praise for that one specifically
@@sparxskywriter2589It's not that bad if the Elden Beasts uses it
@sparxskywriter2589 not everyone cares about the ass pvp in this game.
That sorcerer just saying "fuck it" and starting to beat you with his spell book was one of the funniest things I've seen in a while
If magic won’t work, THEN I’LL BEAT TO DEATH WITH KNOWLEDGE!
@@judgment5090 "Words will never hurt me" The Sorcerer: *Swings a book of incantations at the Tarnished' face*
IM OUT OF FP BUT IM NOT OUT OF OPTIONS
@@start9799 "Abra cadabra, bitch!"
Being slapped by a book and smacked by Licia's chime (in Dark Souls 2) are the most humiliating things my greatsword wielder character ever suffered
There are two graves near the place where you reunite the Jellyfish with her sister. The tombstone reads "Here lie Aurelia and Aureliette, who never saw the stars". sadness ahead
aren't those there BEFORE they get reunited though?
@@marhawkman303 well, yes, because one must die before becoming spirit ash you see.
@@marhawkman303 thats their name, so they die and turned to jelly
So your telling me the people who refuse to use the mimic because they feel the jelly is more unique are actually forcing a dead child to fight for them. Shits wild but oddly fitting for a souls game.
@@nigazi8452 well... not really. "forcing" implies that the dead child is unwilling to fight.
One theory I’ve heard is that Thops died essentially from overwork, pouring everything he had into creating his spell.
He did. He obviously wasn't attacked because he's sitting in a chair. He likely worked himself to death to prove that his spell research was correct.
And in the end, he had the last laugh, succeeding in his life's work and proving his colleagues wrong.
@@MettanAtem I love thinking about that from the other Sorcerer's perspectives. Thops gets a Glintstone key and comes back. Oh well, one more person isn't going to change much, even if he's a blunt stone with stupid, impossible ideas, right?
He immediately sets to work, creates his barrier in what has to be a fairly short timeframe, then dies. Sad as it is to lose Thops, it's kind of funny to imagine how they had to feel like complete dipshits, for his theory to not only be correct, but for him to prove it so quickly.
Here's hoping there's a Heaven in this universe for him.
And maybe even a Hell for the naysayers.
@@michaelandreipalon359 we know people reincarnate. If you did Age of the Stars souls do rest, but nothing on what that's like that I've found
I remember that it took my dad literally an hour to find Boc because he refused to look it up. It was hilarious just watching him run around trying to find the voice.
I didn't realize I was your dad...
Happens too often. I just couldn't find enterance to Valiant Gargoyle fight in my NG+ for about an hour. Well although I wasn't circling 5 meters around a bush but around whole Nokron.
Honestly it took me like a million years, I just thought I was going crazy and ended up finding him by accident while trying to hit one of the rodent creatures that was running from me
I just gave up. It’s funny hearing someone saying their dad was playing this. Sounds like a bonding experience I could never imagine playing a game with my pops. I saw him play super Mario bros 2 one time.
@@Abeleko Same for me, not only he won't ever play any game more than 10 minutes period (I tried Dark Souls, Elden Ring, Dead Space, Bioshock...) He constantly ridicule me for playing games. Only time he played further than introduction of any game is when I showed Slay the Spire, essentially a card game.
Being a veteran to from software games, the first thing I think of when meeting NPCs is "I wonder what long convoluted course of events I have to trigger to actively bring about their demise.....cause I want that hat."
Big Hat Logan liked this comment.
Solaire nooooooo, he just wanted to be grossly incandescent.
@Viper Hareous find shabriri first
Preach
me looking at warmaster's armour..
Alexander actually DOES get stronger, not just numerically, as the game progresses. By the time of the final fight, he can pull off a flaming Shoryuken and huge gravity crush attack taken straight from Radahn. He can do some real damage if you're not careful.
Do you think he gets those abilities from the people he shoves into himself?
@@Simply_Oblivious I think so. The Warrior jars do seem to get qualities from the Warrior remains stuffed inside them. The more and better fallen warriors they have, the more and better strengths they can use.
Kinda reminds me of how our character can use the memories of fallen warriors to learn new skills.
@@enlongjones2394 To add, the Shard of Alexander mentions that Alexander has the remains a red-haired warrior inside him
@@enlongjones2394 That's why the one person had been refused by the jars to be buried inside them. They viewed him as too weak.
Also if you didn't do the Alexander quest, there is a sleeping dragon in Alexander's spot. If you did Alexander's quest tho, you can find the dragon somewhere else with half health, suggesting Alexander beat it half to death before fighting you
Unfortunately, Renallas Great Rune tells you it wouldn't have worked for him. It flat out says everyone she rebirths is frail and not long for the world. The only reason it works for you is because you have her Great Rune of the Unborn. It says it's the only way to have a "perfect rebirth".
yeah it also most likely the weakest of all the great runes considering its size. Rennalla is too broken at that point to care though.
Yup. I was so mad at myself after because I'd read the rune before that, but thought...well, if I can do it, why not Boc? So stupid I was.
the mage face ball thing is also explained exactly in detail online in the wiki! literally mages’ “punishment” of sorts it seems is they get turned into them for fucking with the
forbidden shit/Primeval Current
@@Dairkun its more of the games trap than the players fault. I mean, why cant the option to accompany boc with the great rune and ensure that his rebirth is perfect, exist? Just have this death be a consequences of neglecting to accompany him and help him with proper procedure.
If only we could give our great rune to Boc.. or at least lend it to him so he undergoes perfect rebirth. We only need 2 great runes to repair the Elden Ring anyways. What's one less great rune?
10:30 “and then the sorcerers beat thops to death with a book. Because they realised that the one thing they hated more than an idiot was a smart ass.”
For people wondering what's going on with Sellen: her turning into a Burgerking Pinball is not your fault, Rennala didn't do that to her, and she might have even planned on doing that to herself as some sort of transitive phase like Azur or Lusat's crystalline appearance.
If you help her against Jerren, and she shows up in Raya Lucaria, but you never tell her about meeting either one of the Primordial Sorcerers (I never met Lusat), she will stay in charge of Raya Lucaria forever.
For the record she never actually hurts Rennala. She just kind of... pushes her into a corner, lmfao. Check behind the bookcases.
I so wish they expanded on Sellen, she pretends to be stern but ends up being sweet and endearing at every possibility, she even has cut content
@Fortamican I feel like this must have at least been bounced around the idea table for a while, given the fact there's so many npcs that feel like it should be leading towards choosing them as a maiden, and also the fact you are given the option initially to refuse malena(?? Our finger maiden) despite her being required to progress.
Wait u can prevent her fate and make her head of the academy?
Honestly I’m just glad renalla is still there I thought she was killed and I could no longer rebirth
Soo i do i little digging in a game and i think i get it what happend to Sellen (it is to those who dont know about it, soo everyone who do, dont be angry at me xD) so of all mages i find there are those with 1 stone faced mages up to 3 faced ones with magical potency scaling with number of stone faces mage have and of corse there are also those multi-faced balls that can hit hard with magic, the point is (at least i thing by connecting dots) the more someone know about Glintstone sorcery more that someone is magicaly capable in art and stone heads being a side-effect/prestige ? and then by restoring a primeval current in someone that person could acquire vast understanding of art/raw energy but as side effects go there is only soo much room for stone faces on your head inevitably, irreversibly and i suppose quite painful turning that someone into giant multi stone-faced magic anomaly as it was said that she was not the first and before her there were many who "failed"
While I don’t want anyone to accidentally hurt Boc, naturally discovering the “You’re Beautiful” solution just by sheer timing and circumstance (didn’t meet Boc until much later on) was easily one of my favorite moments in all of Elden Ring. Using the item a few times, partly hoping it would cause a reaction but mostly just doing it for the sentiment, only to then talk to Boc and see a new dialogue option was incredibly exciting, and the conversation that followed cemented the whole experience as my favorite quest line in a Souls game, period. That’s one demi-human monkey this world doesn’t deserve.
I'm glad someone somewhere in the multiverse told Boc he was beautiful
I too am happy to know that at least one person discovered this naturally.
I had been guided to find him early, and as I love using the Prattling Pates my dear friend lead me to the "You're Beautiful" one, too, though after I'd spent much time dallying before getting into the Mountain region.
I, however, noticed the lore that it was the voice of a mother and that it had a similar accent to Boc. I was so excited to go tell him how much I like him, and was thrilled to see the new dialogue too! It was after that my friend said they had really hoped I'd make the connections on my own, but they planned to tell me in NG+ if I hadn't.
Boc is such a darling, and really, he isn't hard to look at. (Maybe a little silly that his mouth always gapes open like he's star struck after he finishes talking.)
I noticed even the item description says it's the voice of a demi human mother, so I planned to let him hear it. He is the only one who talks repeatly lovingly about his mother.
His ending after the prattling pate is ominous
Love this and this is totally why I try not to look stuff up. The satisfaction of those little discoveries are so much more impactful than following a wiki. [I blew it with boc and just watched this so...]
Thops you OBJECTIVELY helped. He achieved his life's work. He literally changed the world because of you. He died having finally achieved his goals. You made that possible.
How did Thops "Change the world"?
@@alexl.4362 well, the world may be a bit of an overstatement. but from thops' barrier spell we know he definitely changed the future of glintstone sorcery. his barrier spell was revolutionary enough to have earned an entire new conspectus of the academy.
Not just that, but apparently he died of exhaustion rather than be killed because making his theory work was that important to him. It's like a posthumous Nobel Peace Prize type of thing.
@@blueskiesabove2641 The academy was already beyond repair with Rennala in her current state; the last of the Carian Knights were killed by you and the major heads were either killed during the infighting or abandoned the school altogether. Changing the future of glintstone sorcery is a bit of a stretch, more like he gave it an small highlight as the pages burned. He ultimately just made a cool spell and died in his home but there's pretty much nothing left for the Academy to speak of for him to influence. If anything, he could've just rediscovered a lost spell, it's likely much of the knowledge created under Rennala is gone forever from the turmoil.
@@sws212 "Future generations will learn. They will know the foolishness of
the sneering sorcerers who ridiculed this theory, little realizing
that it was in fact a discovery worthy of a new conspectus of the
academy." The academy is not finished yet. True, in present times its kind of fallling apart, but so is literally everything else in the world, thats why you need to become elden lord and fix the elden ring. The spell description talks about FUTURE GENERATIONS. These **future** generations will learn thops' barrrier was revolutionary enough to make a whole new conspectus based on it.
"Elden Ring is an empowering story about starting out as a meager low level tarnished with a miniscule healthbar - and going on to get a ghost clone that does the rest of the game for you"
I cried both tears of laughter and sadness
What are those spirit ashes called?
What are those spirit ashes called?
@@TrophyHunterTylerMimic Tear Ashes, found in Nokron
@@mimyceh thanks.. I just got access to this area
@@TrophyHunterTyler tip for the mimic tear once you get it (if you haven't already): if you equip raw meat dumplings in your item slot, then the mimic tear can use them and heal half its hp basically at will, meaning that at +10, it just becomes an immortal boss distractor.
You’re hardly responsible for Sellen’s life…she starts off dying and chained to a wall in a dungeon. You help free her by transplanting her life crystal to a new body. After that she chooses to challenge Rennala…not your doing.
She actually became that because she challenged the primordial flow
@@destrorso2505 right…and again…that’s hardly your doing. This video suggests the player is responsible for her outcome…but nothing you did made her life worse.
@@barryweatherley5046 The argument I guess should be that your involvement in bringing her to that point is why you're to blame. As in, she wouldn't have turned into a burger king head ball if you didn't help her out of that dungeon in the first place. Though yeah I'm just playing devil's advocat, I actually agree with you.
@@barryweatherley5046 not arguing with that, i was responding to your statement about challenging Rennala
@@BigVorst Well. She was gonna die regardless since she was about to be assassinated. I feel like we gave her a chance at hope if anything.
The humour in this video is so on point it’s great “he’s dead, oh shit” “I think thops was beaten to death with a book” Luke just has a talent for making things even funnier
"Or perhaps f*** you it's Elden Ring"
Exactly what I was thinking lol
"This is what happens in Elden Ring when you try to give someone a grape."
Sums up From's storytelling in a humorous little nutshell, really.
Welcome to British humour - there's no situation so bleak that we can't wryly comment on it!
to be fair, Boc mentions several times that his mother was one of the closest people to him, and the Prattling Pate item descrition mentions how it must be the voice of a loving mother
Sadly there’s dozens of hours between all of that so 98% of people plum forgot.
@@deifiedtitan Yes I am one of them. I thought: "Great, cosmetic surgery does not sound so bad." Well. I was wrong.
Doesn't the game also tell you that Renalla's rebirths are always failures? Another clue not to rebirth Boc.
@@zamarickz Yeah but it worked for me 5 times before I tried it on Boc. And no faults there. But now that you mentioned it my character never said a word.
@@MrCrownedClown It is odd that the player can "rebirth," but the lore tells us that her rebirth process doesn't work lol. I guess since we aren't changing form it works for us?
The ending for Boc when you help him realize that he's perfect just the way he is actually got me super emotional when I encountered it. I love that little man so much.
I give Alexander credit for being strong enough to help me fight the fire giant.
I respect his warrior spirit.
He died an honorable death, in battle, like general Radahn
Fr, Alexander is the only reason I was able to beat the fire giant the first time lmao
Bro that's a hell of a Warrior
He's immune to fire in that fight, very helpful distraction.
This isn't just dying in a tragic way anymore. Literally anything I do they're dropping like flies, it's ridiculous. According to this game, I could sneeze and some dude in the underground would be crushed by a boulder because he went to the same highschool as me. This game makes you FEEL like being on a watchlist.
Youre coment, reminds me the whole concept of the character Nanika from Hunter x Hunter. Someone makes a big wish, the next person who cant acomplish the demands will die, and all the people who cared and expend time with him/her will fucking die depending on how big the wish was.
Be careful if you jump onto some npc’s they die.
your comment had me dying 😂😂😂🤣
@@alangama8464 bahhahahahhahahahha
shit , I haven't watched hunter x hunter but this made me die of laughter! Damn the way u worded it is fricken perfect ! Bahahhahahahhahah
@@htstuf I jumped on the pope turtle 😭😭 I just wanted to write a message on his back...
I got to the volcano manor and thought "hey, these people seem kinda cool," then I ran into patches on the way out and realized I'd made a horrible mistake.
Come on, when has trusty Patches ever steered you wrong before? And before you say it, he already apologized for those times!
@@23Scadu He always kicks ya in the right direction at least. Except for that first time in the Catacombs with the bridge, the trickster lol
You were okay with a cult of murder thieves but it was patches that made you realize something was off?
@@23Scadu yall ever run into patches on the WAY to volcano manor? He tells you about this cool maiden mechanism thing at the bottom of raya lucaria that - rumour has it, is embedded with a teleporting mechanism and can teleport you to Leyndell itself! Very excitingly he tells you this, clearly hoping you (as someone who wants to get into the Capital City) would seek this Maiden out and get it to swallow you. Seeing as how he makes it INTO the manor unscathed i'm starting to think he knew what the thing was actually going to do.
I just did it for the loot tbh lol
"Oh, WHAT. I murdered a whole six people for nice clothes 🙄 and you farted this morning so we're both a bit morally grey, get over yourself"
Actually for Thops, he got what he wanted. If you listened to any of his dialogue, he himself said even though he is a bluntstone and would never fit in with the rest of the mages in the Academy, deep within his heart, he still belongs in the Academy where he can continue studying magic. Saying we shouldn't help Thops is the same way saying we should never have done Alexander's questline. He was a warrior at heart and wanted to fight and to a warrior dying on the battlefield was better than dying in bed. And so he got exactly what he wanted. A duel with a Tarnished (Elden Lord) and still lost but he was happy we gave him this chance. And I think he would be happier knowing we fought him instead in the future possibly losing to some poachers. Thops is the exact same, he longs to be in the Academy, if we kill him early he even says it's the home to his studies. Which showed truly how much he wanted to be in the Academy. I rather knowing that he will die in the place he felt like home than forever miserable and filled with regret on not being able to return home, just like that lingering spirit in East Lunaria where he was shut out of the Academy.
Thops was a hidden sorcerer genius, the academy didn't like his new sorcery discovery, so they decided to help him discover mele the hard way
Not so much that they didn't like it, but didn't think it was even possible.
He dies from overworking. He isn't murdered.
@@Takapon218 yep! The spell he creates consumes FP as it's used... and it's likely that Thops didn't level up his mind stat enough.
@@chukuemekaoje1015 maybe that’s why he’s asking for runes in the church?
@@qwertye334 OOOOOOOH!!!! True!
If you're wondering where Tanith's quest leads, well, don't worry. I'm sure it'll be added, in a few... Patches.
You smack her and she dies which causes her pet Crucible Knight to invade you. It drops another Crucible Art.
@@gothicbutterfly013 there's also the whole thing of giving her the castanet's at rykard's dead body
@@akalaramorgan9242 yea I'm saying in addition to giving her the castinets
Ahhhhh, you sly one!
BOOOOO!
Sellen's folly is revealed in the Graven Mass talismans.
She was driven from the academy for killing students to turn into star seeds. She built all those sorcerer heads with her experiments. When she had you reveal Lusat's and Azur's corpses, she was going to do it again, but this time with other powerful glintstone sorcerers. She may be a great teacher, but she's definitely the bad guy of the academy.
And yet... two other characters know her well, and considered these actions to be very inconsistent with what they knew of her. We know her to be fairly ruthless in her time - hell, she's planning a coup at one point - but it's almost like these actions were taken by someone else. Someone else, for example, who happens to be capable of profoundly vile actions, and who has a puppet to command that looks exactly like Sellen locked in his basement.
Consider also that Seluvis also has some relationship with Gideon and wants to puppet Nepheli, and the thing that makes Nepheli vulnerable to Seluvis's potion is her profound depression at discovering the Albinauric Village destroyed by an Omenkiller, allegedly at the hands of Gideon. Except another one of the puppets in Seluvis's basement is also an omenkiller.
Neither are conclusive, and each can go either way. Sellen may have been the murdering experimenter, and perhaps Gideon actually was the one to frame Seluvis, given if you give him the potion he may be the reason Seluvis is found dead as a puppet. But then that begs the question of what the deal with Pidia was.
And the plot thickens.....truth be told evil or not I'm a simp for Sellen ☺️
@@UnreasonableOpinions I believe Seluvis is found dead as a puppet regardless of your actions. You just have to progress Ranni's questline far enough for it to happen. That said, Pidia claims to be watching over the other cache of puppets, but if you head over after Seluvis dies you'll find Pidia getting bludgeoned to death by the puppets while exclaiming that they belong to him, heavily implying that Seluvis was a puppet all along and Pidia was the one actually pulling the strings.
@@HanabiraKage That's interesting. I never even thought of that particular angle. That Pidia was controlling Seluvis. I kind of figured Pidia was just a servant of his since it really didn't make much sense that Seluvis would be looking for a star shard that Pidia has the map to.
Even if she was a mad nut job, I can't bring myself to forget her last words before turning into... that.
13:58 Patches quest was updated. He returns back to his original cave and ambushes you again when you open his chest like when you first met. He quickly recognizes you and surrenders and gives you another gesture. If you return later he’s set up his store again. He did mention setting up a shop with the pals. So I’m assuming that means he will be around during Shadow of the Erdtree DLC.
I want this to be clear: Thops is one of the most badass characters in the whole game and if you think about it for a bit, you'll notice why.
Aside from him inventing a way to just... reflect spells, something the Carians were unable to do as even Carian Retaliation just converts the spell to something else, this man is a humble sorcerer who just decided to help us out and when we find a single Glintstone Key, if we return before we find the second, he just tells us to keep it and do our stuff, he's fine with waiting until we finished our business.
When we do finish our business, fighting through the Academy, and return to Thops, he takes the spare key, seemingly walks through the town that's filled with enemies and a flame spewing head, enters the Academy which likely has seen better days, shrugs his shoulders, walks through the graveyard filled with corpses, dogs and marionettes, the most fun of all enemies, and when he reaches his desk, calmly sits down to just die... without any trace of damage on him.
I'm not even sure the man is dead, I think he just completed Sellen's research on his own, without the need for the transformed primeval sorcerers and just ascended to godhood.
Presumably the guards wouldn't attack him - he's a registered student of the academy, probably has his ID card and Unidays membership and everything - and they're still following their orders even though they're long insane. Thops is still a cool guy, though.
Thops tried to achieve chim and got zero-summed
This is my new head canon.
@@edgarallenjoe6494 I reckon Academy security came round and he'd misplaced his ID card, then was prompted executed
@@CallMeTeci u must be fun at parties
I was progressing along Boc's storyline and learned about the death after his rebirth, so I wanted to avoid that. However, I progressed too far before before I tried the Prattling Pate. As a result he disappears from his spot in Lyndell. You can then find him outside the Raya Lucaria library, still in demi-human form... LYING DEAD AND MOTIONLESS! Heartbreaking.
Omigoddd nooo
Ouch...
It's such a silly/broken quest, you can be teleported to inner Leyndell by accident and the game will progress his story and Melina will abandon you, without even giving you a chance to reach Gelmir first, then, if you talk to him there, HE ASKS you what do you think of him, and you can't just say "you are beautiful" or whatever, YOU MUST have the ITEM that TELLS it for you. And he dies, of course, because a dialog option it's not an option.
honestly almost impossible to get the good ending on Boc's questline, the condition is just too specific
@@skyblue6092 But I got it.
You might as well include every NPC. Everyone I came across either died or was worse off mentally by the time I hit the end.
The old Souls adage stands: "The best way to help an NPC in a Souls game is to ignore them and never speak to them."
Yep. None of this surprises me. At least with Boc we can leave him alive by using that prattling pate near him and not giving him the tear. I'm personally dreading Blaidd's end.
@@SolaScientia Well, at least you're prepared for the worst.
@@SolaScientia I cried
@@23Scadu Yep. That's my thinking. Even knowing what's ahead of me won't make it easier.
@@stephenroche7988 I fully expect to.
The most terrible part about Boggart's death is that he experiences a fate more bad than death. Since he became defiled by the Dung Eater, he is no longer granted the ability to return to the Erdtree and is rejected, just like other "cursed" being such as the Misbegotten and Omens.
“But you are not a small monkey in a stupid hat, you are a big tarnished without a stupid hat.” I absolutely love that quote.
that was amazing but what really got me was following with, “because all the really stupid hats don’t start unlocking until later”
10:00 It's implied that Thops died from overwork and exhaustion.
Sounds like a developer problem, too...
@@CallMeTeci You are totally right.
But recently things are changing quite a bit in Tokyo. The developers are transcending to a higher ground
@@CallMeTeci Jason “Boohoo Where’s My Press Invitation? Sexual Harassment Of Men Isnt Real Sexual Harassment” Schreier? I feel fairly sure that he won’t cover Fromsoft unless it’s actual law breaking, there are numerous times that he’s already come too close to stepping into one Souls-like bottomless pit of regret after another for his countless bad takes on popular games and the companies responsible for them.
I think you can keep him alive but i'm not sure, in my first playthrough i finished all in Liurnia and remembered about Thops, i played a strenght build so i had no use for him. So i had a key for Academy and tried to give it to him and he refused.
I'm not sure if i recall correctly but i tried to give him the key, he refused and stayed in that church for the rest of the game.
@@Reujuvenary Yeah, he'll only accept a spare key from you, not your own key.
@@mb2001 Well, i used one key to enter the academy then found another one randomly. The more i know, thanks xd
You can prevent Sellen's death by never telling her about Lusat. She just stays in the grand library and Fromsoft planned for that as well. You can still respec with Rennalla. She's tucked behind a bookcase in the library.
Its possible to be summonable to fight Jerren without telling her about Lusat?
@@joaofaria7404 Yeah, she asks her favor after telling you about Lusat. After the Jarren fight, she gives you the same dialogue about being loyal to you when you become Lord and all that, but will also speak about still needing Lusat. It keeps the quest open and she teaches sorceries, but once you tell her about Lusat, she turns into the ball. If you want Lusat's armor though, you have to tell her. It's more of a NG+ thing I guess.
@@NCRRanger7753 Another reason to go NG+ besides the boss weapons haha
Sellen did not die in the sense of natural death. She experienced a transformation into another form of existence...
I mean Sellen kinda deserves to die for what she did to those sorcerers so I think I’ll still tell her
Theres another clue at the jellyfish ruins. If you search the cliffs near the ruins youll find two gravestones next to eachother you can examine. It says "Here lie Aurelia & Aureliette, they never got to see the stars."
Melina gives you a hint when you rest at the Altus Highway junction (where Boc is before moving to the capital) where she says he's sad and cries often. She thinks he wants to be told he's beautiful. The hint is there, but you have to talk to Melina when you rest at the site of grace
the melina grace chats are so easy to miss on a first playthrough unfortunately
You call that a hint?!? Sure , next time fromsoft should obscure it even more. We should have to perform a strict sequence of prattling pates, gestures while reloading the area a million times until finally quest can progress. And even then, there'd be some people who say the hints were there the whole time.
Also it's pretty clear that the 'rebirth' Rennala offers has some serious drawbacks. Even if the lore didn't lay it out, the generally creepy vibe and the crippled 'sweetings' crawling around her arena gives you the idea without having to say much. And really, it just seems too good to be true in a world like this. There's no way a 'happy ending' like that would ever not have a serious catch.
@@adiadiadi333 it's not their fault that you impulsively pressed E through the dialogues
@@adiadiadi333no kidding. erudition gesture what?
Sellen's fate feels fitting and the least "tragic" the more you think about it. From her comments on the Carian royal family ruling the academy, you'd think she was just expelled because she didn't want to participate in "toothless pedantry" (sticking to rules that kept the magic harmless). But the Carian royal family was making these rules for the academy with good reason, because
when you follow Sellen's questline, you discover that if you research primeval/glintstone magic too much, it will break your mind like it did to Lusat and Azur or make you do harm unto others in pursuit of power.
In Sellen's case, you find out from Jerren that she was expelled because she killed countless sorcerers. He calls her the graven witch and when you look at items like the Graven-School talisman, you understand what horrifying things she must have done to those sorcerers: She added them to her "school", which is in fact the "graven schools", the stone face balls made up of literal sorcerers. She mentions Azur and Lusat and even Jerren being added to the "school" the more you proceed through her quest, clearly not intending to stop increasing her power through using others.
In a way, it's fitting that her demise is at the height of what she perceives to be her victory over the academy, a place that, ironically, has already been completely ransacked and destroyed by its own pupils who lashed out against the clearly needed control of the royal family. When Sellen turns into the exact same thing she subjected all of her victims of scientific study to, it's a perfect, horrible ending to her pursuit of power. Her demise was at her own hands and she has to join the school, just like she forced countless others to do so,
Well Rennala punished Sellen pretty fair I guess
Rennala still got power then if she was able to come back from that then.
Fuck that, I like Selden. She's nice to me.
I still loved Sellen.
Then again my favorite unlocked ending was lord of Frenzied flame.
I killed her way before any of that happened does it have a big effect on the story or not?
After Thops dies you can return to the church you first find him in and there will be invisible scarab with Thops's barrier ash of war hiding there.
aw shit found that a long time ago and never knew that meant he'd died
it's such a good ash too
That's actually to the west of Raya Lucaria even before he dies.
@@FelisImpurrator that was before 1.03 patch
@@FelisImpurrator next time you try to correct, make sure you're not the one getting recorrected. Now boy, look up something called a patch then actually correct yourself then dismiss yourself
@@OccultKing10 I got it before the patch so it's good to know where the new location is. Idk if I would ever find it again if not for this comment.
Turning Nephelia into a brainless puppet is the most dastardly thing you could ever do, she's such a sweet noble soul
I didn't know who the hell is Nephali until I finally fought Godfrey and by Heavens she helped us Greatly to defeat him.
I'm glad I didn't know her name Shape or look until I decided to get rid of the Dumb Potion.
@@themphantom9138give it to dung eater next time
I handed the potion to Gideon instead. But when Seluvis gave me another potion to give Ranni, I tried to report Ranni about it, she didn't respond, I handed her the potion and she expelled me off her sight. I tried to speak twice more and at last she insta killed me. When I got back up she was gone and Seluvis was dead.
I didn't know how Ranni's questline would turn out, so I was eager to follow it, but I was worried about screwing it up so I thought I HAD to give Nepheli the potion, or I'd fuck up Ranni's questline not knowing it only affected Seluvis'. I regret that decision greatly. But I have much greater regrets in my life, so it doesn't matter too much.
That's why seluvis' potion is reserved for the crazy caca consumer
For context, Sellen turned her fellow mages into those giant mask-covered spheres in order to improve her own power.
It seems likely that she planned to do the same to Rennala, but it blew straight back into her face when either Rennala or (more likely) Ranni got wind of it.
Don't fuck with ranni
From what ive seen its actually that when a graven mage goes too far deep into learning these sorceries and the knowledge of the stars, they turn into a ball of faces.
@@AfterLifeGuru oh where was that stated ? sounds cool. I thought she transformed because its implied she has stolen/used other bodies before in her research, as stated by jerren, and she might have tried to do the same to azur and lusat, who is already partly crystallized.
The dialogue is from the graven mass talisman which is:
"A talisman depicting the first school of graven mages - a nightmare that would continue to haunt the academy.
Greatly raises potency of sorceries.
The primeval current is a forbidden tradition of glintstone sorcery. To those who cleave to its teachings, the act of collecting sorcerers to fashion them into the seeds of stars is but another path of scientific inquiry."
@@AfterLifeGuru if you recall, Sellen is known as the Graven Witch, which implies that she was the one who either discovered how to convert other mages into schools of Graven Mages, or simply figured out how to tap into their power.
See, if they really wanted to hit us in the guts, they would turn Tanith into a serpent-like boss and would allow Patches to be a summon. But this time he would not leave.
Possible future dlc?
@@bigjuicy0range545 Considering in the recent 1.04 patch, it could happen.
Instead he’d turn on you cuz he can’t bring himself to hurt Tanith? Or he helps you kill her and then they both die. Or something more tragic, it’s a soulsgame.
You can find patches again in murwater cave.
@@Imp-poser or patches instead leads you to tanith and traps you there. the guy's a trickster and a mega simp, i wouldn't put it past him
Never really saw Alexander's death as tragic because it's what he wanted. He was a warrior to the very end.
I think it’s both. According to Alexander’s own assessment of things, we are supposed to feel happy that we have fulfilled his wish and given him what he desires. But we are also supposed to see that as tragic since so much is wrong with the world and Alexander is so good. It is also tragic, because even if it is what he wanted, we aren’t supposed to just think that it’s not sad or that it’s a good thing.
To Valhalla !
He is certainly at the table of Kahless in Sto Vo Kor.
If you read the item description of the prattling pate, you can infer it’s boc’s mother voice. So it making him feel better makes a lot of sense because boc is a mommies boy. “Twisted clay sculpt in the shape of a demi-human head.
Emits a voice that says "You're beautiful."
A wistful fetish that imparts voices and words on an eternal journey.
Unconditional love. Unrestrained assurance. It must have been a mother speaking.” Item description as well
Note for PATCHES questline: You can go back to Murkwater Cave to get ambushed by Patches a second time. He will then tell you that it has been a long time since you two met and will open his shop again.
Where the hell is Patches? I completely missed this character on my first playthru. I was already over 100 hours into the game before I heard people and videos talking about him 😕
@@Crimsonlee2XX murkwater cave. Go E lf Stormveil, once you get to Agheel lake follow it north and the entrance is on the left.
why wouldnt you kill a guy who tries to kill you?
@@Crimsonlee2XX that canyon near agneel lake has a cave in it, two actually, but you'll get invaded near the first one on the left side of the canyon, and it's that one :)
@@amidalaprin4846 I found him now :)
So you're saying the dead children, who were turned into Jellyfish, are the only ones to have a happy ending.
I'm starting to regret how much I like Sellen.
T-
That doesn't mean EVERY jellyfish is a dead child, right?
........right?
@@pinewolfpresents They are usually peaceful.
@@pinewolfpresents in some ways, we are all dead children.
I guess the one lesson that From Soft games teach you is to leave people well enough alone. Helping them is possibly the worst thing you can do for them.
@@navtektv Well, They *are* Japanese. That's pretty much the national ethos there.
you forgot the very first quest i completed which ended with the blind daughter killed and the father, driven mad with grief and revenge, i had to put down like a rabid dog at the revenger shack
Im pretty sure the blind daughter becomes hyetta as hyetta spawns after you do her quest
@@Jasterfarian Her body gets taken over I believe.
he wasnt even killing demihumans as revenge, just anybody :/
@@damiester1 i checked when hyetta spawns right after stormveil castle cause i thought she looked like her, but the girls body is still in it's original spot
@@kj_blaze I don't know if that's an oversight, but there is evidence of Hyetta being Irina. Hyetta only spawns after Irina dies, the bloodstains are still on the dress, they have the same voice actress etc... It's somewhat similar to Yura who gets taken over by Shabriri.
I legit loved sellen so you can imagine the sound of my heart breaking when finishing her quest
Sooooo while finding her stuck to the wall in the one cellar she never gave me the option of taking her soul... she just kept repeating some nonsense and eventually I killed her and when I did she said I’d pay for what I did.... like what?? I feel cheated
@@Kevcoffe101 Answer might be late, but you probably didnt encounter her in the cave behind the pumpkin head or in gelmir before. You can always find sellen trapped at the witches tomb, but to trigger her quest, you gotta start it in the first place. Thats done in the cave in limgrave, not the cellar you find her trapped in.
Sorry for this being so late but... Jerren is better. As a good friend of Radahn who vowed him death in honorable battle given his loss of mind he does all he can for his closest friend. Also sellen is involved with seluvis... and eff him for sweet nepheli
I remember doing Hyetta’s quest thinking “oh she seems nice” aaaand ended up burning the world 🤷🏻♂️
did you have miquella's needle? if so, you could/can reverse that ending.
@@trve_kvltslampolice_boi yeah, I knew it was possible but I was way too tired to do it, I just wanted to finish the game at that point lol
Just, for the record, becoming a graven school was always Sellen's goal. The Graven School and Graven Mass Talismans' flavour text mentions that for students of the primeval current (which Sellen made very clear she was), one path of study is to collect sorcerers to fashion them into the "seeds of stars." These seeds are graven schools. This isn't something you become if you fly too close to the sun, or some ish. Sellen had to actively pursue this form. And as graven schools are made up of several sorcerers, the fact that Sellen is the consciousness "in control" when you speak to it heavily implies she is the primary sorcerer in the school, which no doubt means she created the school. It is, however, also implied that graven schools are made up of unwilling participants. While Sellen wanted to become a graven school, all the sorcerers she bound to her probably didn't. She says to Jerren during the fight against him "Join the school, to reflect on your mistakes," and somehow, I doubt she was talking about Raya Lucaria.
Ya think she grafted her teacher lusat to her school aswell considering she doesnt tranform unless you mention him
@@unauthenthic Due to bodies of both primeval teachers bodies dissapearing, its very likely
You know this adds more context to her last words to us. If we fail to become a lord, we can always come pay her a visit; that "even her dullest students will always have a place here." If she was always intending to become a graven school, i dont think she would've made that offer for the school. Mayybe the "here" she meant was her graven school. I mean, heck, the manor's lord is a giant snake with a face in it that was to basically graft you and those people like you. Wouldn't be too far-fetched that she wanted you to "join" her, too...same with that jar guy. I'm starting to think the people in the lands just want us for our bodies.
This somehow makes me feel a little better about her fate, however, next time I’m defined gonna fight against her.
@@jebbthefool Bitches be like that, all the want are your runes, your stats, your items and sometimes you doing all their bidding.
I was trying to do every quest I could in my first playthrough, but I immediately killed Dung Eater in his cell just to keep Big Boggart safe.
Good choice.👍
What you lookin’ at?
You can do his quest and keep Boggart alive by aggroing him before the conversation that makes Dung Eater invade. He will still invade, but Boggart will be aggroed and alive. Then just kill the invader, and seek absolution.
@@LorenzoCa or just dont start Boggart/Rya's questline at all until you're done with Dung Eater
Lol I killed bogart for the necklace
Bok's story is one of the most wholesome and heartwarming if you use the Prattling Pate. He's so happy when he recognizes his mother's voice.
I gave the Dung eater Seluvis's potion in my first playthrough,and killed him off in the sewers in the new game + because a-by doing this Boggart will still be alive and will be one of the few NPC's who have a happy end,b-Dung eater is one of the most powerful summons in the game
Yeah but you don't get his armor and stuff if you do this.
@@Wiseman108 You can still gets his armor after you kill him
THE BERSERK BOOTY-BOMB BANQUETER
@@Wiseman108 so you're saying loot is more important than making sure a friendly dude doesn't die?
@@jotarokujo4727 I don't care for his poop armor anyway lol
Alexander breaks my heart, but truely chose his fate. So I can't help but love him for the Jar he was. A Jar with a heart of a warrior. To his last.
several hearts, from what I hear
We Tarnished are really just the equivalent of a kid running around with a loaded gun, powerful yet incredibly dangerous because have absolutely no idea what we are doing.
Takes "Your success is paved by others misfortune" to a whole new meaning
Boggart was never invaded in the moat in my playthrough. The Dung Eater was my puppet (and an awesome puppet at that) at that point. He's still cooking that delicious crab meat on the side of that gorgeous moat down there.
the good ending
killing dung eater in his cell is never wrong
You can't give him a potion until after he invades though? That being said, you can save Boggart if you aggro him before the invasion and then hit the church of vows.
@@omniscension8967 or ignore his questline. I got to lava manor the long way. Met and released Dung Eater and all that. The only trade off was no crab meat. He stays where you first meet him. At least for me.
@@omniscension8967 Just don’t progress his quest line until you trigger the invade. Then it’s safe to move Boggart there.
I bursted out laughing when I realized you could still study sorcery from Sellen as a ball of heads 💀
She was just trying to get ahead in life. In the end, I guess she couldn't face the truth.
@@davidhong1934 😂
@@davidhong1934 Damnnn
@@davidhong1934 damn that burns
She is a "school" after all, makes sense in a twisted way.
Alexander and the little jar are a far more optimistic parallel to Siegmeyer and his daughter from OG dark souls, who went hollow and was put down by his daughter. Alexander at least died happy, and his jar friend went on to become a jar worthy of Alexander’s memory.
Also since jars inherit powers of warrior parts put into them.. the lil jar you gave Alexanders parts grows exponentially from the get go.
@@TrafalgarWaterDLaw-dl5cm that’s true! Alexander is low key kind of strong too. The place you fight him at is where a dragon normally sits, presumably because Alexander killed it before we got there. If that’s the case, he’s definitely pretty damn strong even if he didn’t feel that strong in the final fight.
@@CringeGamingOG Almost you can encounter that Dragon elswhere if you do his quest but at half hp. Suggesting he beat the damn dragon half to death before it ran away.
You can kill Tanith when she‘s eating Rykard. As a consequence, you‘ll be invaded on the spot by the Crucible Knight who‘s her servant. I don‘t remember what loot he drops, if any.
Crucible Knight Breath incantation, if I remember right
After Fia killed D and threatened me out of nowhere I thought to myself "Yep emotional attachment it's still a mistake on this one"
I find it somewhat amusing to think of Thops just walking into the academy, ignoring all monstrosities lingering there and casually sitting at the table as if nothing happened
The sad thing about Millicent is, Malenia would most likely have killed her in an instant. Considering how much she hates the scarlet rot and its servants, and what Gowry says if you helped Millicent.
Except Millicent explicitly states that she is there to return the Unalloyed gold needle to Melania, so that she can once again ward off the influence of the Scarlet Rot as she had been doing before she removed it in the fight with Radahn.
@@Digitize27 Look I love Malenia, but considering how quickly she attacks us, I kinda doubt she wouldn't do the same with Millicent. I get she only attacks us because of "Dark Souls boss", but still. When we find her she seems to basically give into the rot
I mean it’s not like Millicent was actually related to Malenia in anyway. The whole point of her quest is she’s a created flawed imitation that the scarlet cultists tried to make to imitate Malenia because she rejected being their goddess and embracing her Scarlet rot.
@@arryn786 Gowry pretty much calls her perfect
@@arryn786
So basically, Millicent is Malenia's clone.
You don't go without Boggart's cooking, only his humor. He drops a ball bearing that lets you buy more prawn and crab
I can't believe you didn't include Blaidd in this list. He's my favorite character in the game and the end to his story is also tragic.
yeah he looked so badass. sadly he lost his mind or something after Rannis quest
For those wondering, Blair’s was essentially a childhood friend/ Bodyguard of Ranni the Witch, a main character for one of the endings, and also the lady who gives you the spirit bell. Rannis goal (which you help her to achieve) is to defy the 2 fingers. However, Blaidd was (unknowingly), a sleeper agent for the 2 fingers. At the end of his quest, you are forced to kill him to protect Ranni. At least his armor is sick.
Blaidd going mad isn't the Tarnished's fault
@@dumbmemes4180 My understanding is that Blaidd wasn't really a sleeper agent. He is Ranni's Shadow, essentially an eternally loyal servant given to her by the Greater Will because of her status as an Empyrean. She ultimately had to betray him because he was inextricably bound to the Order and everything Ranni wanted to destroy, similar to how she killed her "two fingers" incarnation with the finger killer blade. It's super convoluted, but Vaatividya did a great video about the game's lore that covers how it all works.
He goes insane anyways so its not our fault
15:05 you can actually find patches again back at the murkwater cave, in a twist of Deja vu, you loot a chest, patches jumps down, says you're stealing his stuff, then you commence a boss fight with him. After you hit him once he starts to remember you and you get an emote
LMAO, what's the emote?
@@midgetwaffles8635 the emote is just his signature pose but it's still pretty cool
You're not looting his stuff. If you ignore the chest, it asks you to open the chest in the dialog. And after you fall into the trap, he says, finally I was able to open it.
Alexander lived his life to the fullest and died in his own terms, as a warrior. Honestly, a bittersweet ending.
I think Alexander didn't get "ruined". He was able to live the life he wanted with what hand he was dealed. He wasn't sad at the end apart from losing, but rejoiced how he lived.
Doing Sellen's quest gave me the impression that she knew exactly what she was doing and what she'd become. It's probably no less painful than it seems but I think she either knew the risks of pursuing her research or actively sought to become a horrifying ball of faces.
She is totally a bad guy trying to overthrow Rennala and have the school pursue a different path of magic research. That's why she's mounted to the wall in a dungeon guarded by a face monster. She even admits being exiled. I was not surprised to find her a monster, I thought she was just going to be killed by rennala.
Maybe she was just lonely and wanted someone to have a face-fo-face(-to-face-to-face-to-face) conversation with!
@@KwadDamyj PLEASEE
tbh i never really understood what those ball of faces were. Is it something they do to themselves to become closer to the primeval current? Or the consequences of trying to grasp it? And why does Sellen need Lusats and Azurs bodies? Also, im pretty sure her becoming a ball has nothing to do with Renalla, as she stays normal until you give Lusats location, even after you kill Jerren.
Right. Once she got a round to it, maybe she was simply willing to face the necessary sacrifices to get ahead.
Its almost a meme how fromsoft has every friendly NPC's story end at this point, I don't get upset/surprised anymore.
It's like, meet an npc. He/she doesn't want to kill me. They have a minor tragic backstory and a goal. Help NPC complete goal. NPC dies in a sad way for no reason other than to make you feel bad. Bravo, writing team.
So Pidia isn’t different at all to you? Are you that dense? The writing is extremely good idk what you’re talking about.
Welcome to how their world works. Even our own character's story ends up sad as fck.
Dude seriously. It's like they're trying so hard to be this edgy ass game by killing everyone remotely good. It's getting lame and old to the point you can pretty much predict how every quest will end
@@-Four- I mean practically everyone dies, not just the good ones. The game just doesn't sugarcoat the world. It's a rotting, dying world, anyone who is still alive is going to die soon, good or bad, doesn't matter. They wouldn't be following the themes of their own story and setting if they didn't kill most of them off.
Might not be your thing, but they aren't wrong for making the stories that way, as it'd break the point otherwise. It's a dark world, people die.
Ranni doesn't die. She achieve her goal, and she becomes some weird shit of the stars.
4:30 If you talk to Melina (at sites of Grace that Boc appears nearby) in Leyndell she literally tells you to tell him he's beautiful.
So, it's not really "incredibly obscure".
Melina can and does leave you during Leyndell, it’s entirely possible to not have access to her.
@@deifiedtitan That's a fair point
Dude it’s obscure to even find Boc. There are so many easy ways to miss things in this game because it’s massive.
I hadn’t seen my buddy in a while. Then I saw him in the capital and wanted to do anything to help.
I wonder why he wouldn’t talk after he turned. Look…look how they massacred my boy.
@@kidfazer I think it's pretty poetic. You can only find them when you want to and help them if you want to. You'll completely miss the journey when you're only thinking of going straight to the finish line.
Patches returns to the Murkwater Cave after the Shaded Castle, his quest ends how it starts and is pretty nostalgic to when you first meet him.
That was added in a patch (no pun intended) after this list was made. Still, a decent ending for a Fromsoft NPC.
Hey, I didn't ruin Sellen's life. I just encouraged and enabled her every time she made a decision for herself that ruined her own life more.
And Patches isn't dead. He's playing you again. He disappears when you reload the area, drops no runes, leaves no blood stain, no body, no items, no bell bearing for his shop. He's fine.
And good on that crab, cursing the Dung Eater with Death.
When you kill him he drops he's ball and items.
How do I know that? Well, he's Patches and I'm a veteran from other souls. Can't waste the chance of killing off that bastard at the start of the game.
The game tells us that Rennala was deposed from leading the academy after Radagon left her. She was locked into the library since she's a shell of her former self. Probably why the phase two is a fight with the version Ranni conjures, it's like her true self from before.
In Hyetta's case, she actually enjoys making the entire journey despite the... unfortunate result.
The way she eats those grapes is sus
She is like way too into them.
@@baonkang5990 Hey man, don't knock it 'till you tried it.
The problem with Hyetta is that she's actually hijacked the body of the murdered Irina from much, much earlier in the game. It's why Edgar invades you later on and you end up giving 'Hyetta' the grape that he drops.
@@AzNZinc Why would Edgar invade us if someone else murdered her?
@@smithcubs Probabily he just went mad. You know like classic dark souls when an NPC loses his/her motives
15:56 Didn’t you tank like 10 hits from him? You kept him distracted for a good while, be proud.
The boc alternate ending where you use the prattling pate to tell him 'you're beautiful' almost made me cry. Thats just so wholesome, holy shit.
Boc is a pure cinnamon role who must be protected at all costs.
Technically Hyetta might have been a body snatcher, much like how Shabriri steals Yura's body later in the game. Her model is the exact same as the character Irina's and she doesn't spawn until after Irina has died. I believe she may have been an extension of the frenzied flame like Shabriri, drawing you ever near the Three Fingers in order to become the lord of Frenzied Flame.
This makes quite a lot of sense, I never thought about it.
Although, Lanya also has the same NPC model if I remember correctly.
So that's two NPCs with the same model that just.
Die.
Irina does mention that she has had vision problems since birth, just like Hyetta, so your theory may be correct.
I’m quite sure you can still find Irina’s corpse even after you meet Hyetta though
@@Ashmodath is not there, just a bloody messy cleaver, but not misbegottens around, which, causes the father to go mad seeking revenge, finding out a girl of close resemblance of her daughter and ending truly devoured by madness
@@gman8D1
I mean, Irina's father uses some Frenzied Flame incantations whenever he invades you.
That's not really some eye-opening thought was it?
There's this theory I read on reddit which I found fascinating which claimed that the body snatcher could be Shabriri himself who is some sort of trickster God like Loki who tries to trick you into serving the three fingers and ultimately burning down the Erdtree. It seemed quite plausible to me because when I looked at the Shabriri's Woe talisman, the face on it seemed to be that of a trickster, smiling. Also it's effect of aggravating enemies against you also seems like a cruel trick a Loki like god might play. Ngl I felt like punching that smiling face the talisman had when I read what it does
Hyetta is likely a possessed body, specifically Irina. She still has blood on her dress. Plus, her father has an eye of Shabriri, a clear connection to it all. How would he come into contact with madness if not being put forth by Hyetta?
I believe hyetta only appears after Irina is dead because she never appeared for me unless I did the castle mourne questline
Irina also mentioned hearing a howling before they attacked. Guess what spell you can get : Howl of shabriri
@@Gensolink So Shabiri most likely cause all Castle Mourne problem jsut to get to Irina.
@@MaxHinaNaru maybe not shabriri himself but rather something like how the great caravan in their despair summoned the frenzied flame
@@Gensolink I mean, near castle of mourne there is a village affected with madness...
You can prevent Blackguard's death by doing Dungeater's quest first before doing Rya's quest
Yeah I was like what why isn't he dead
I disagree with some:
Thops, although he died, he's happy being with the academy, for him, its better to be in the academy than in that Church doing nothing
Alexander because the fight we gave him makes him happy, he felt he's a warrior fighting the best warrior he know
Alexander killed me one because I wasn't ready and I did finish the game so man did at one point best the current elden lord
Thops was killed
I wish there's an Alexander spirit summon so that he can be a strong warrior he always wanted to
wake the fuck up, potman. we got an erdtree to burn
That would be great, he falls to his idol yet continues proving his mettle alongside them
And that's why they didn't call the game 'Helpin' Ring'...
Sellen's quest absolutely floored me, I was just getting used to everything I touched or helped dying or ending up miserable, and here she is, seemingly at the end of her quest happy and pledging to help me with the backing of the Academy of Raya Lucaria! I was so excited, I saw visions of gaining other allies, like Nepheli and Kenenth, only for...well... we saw here. I guess we just cannot have anything nice, eh?~
"I think Thops was beaten to death with a book"
I laughed out loud, which hasn't happened to me in quite a long time while watching a video
I think Blaidd also fits this list!
After all, all he wants is for you to help Ranni, which you do.
Unfortunately, what Ranni wants is to rebel against the Two Fingers, so they try to control Blaidd's mind, which they can do because they created him to be Ranni's shadow.
In the end you have to put poor, insane Blaidd down like the big, sword-wielding dog-man he is.
Heck, you could even say Iji also counts, since he suffers a similar fate to Blaidd shortly after you inform him of the doggo's death. When you reload the area he seems to have killed himself with black flames after fending off the Black Knife assassins, presumably to sever his connection to the Two Fingers. All because YOU helped Ranni :)
Alternatively, he fended off the gank, but the sheer amount of spam killed him because he forgot that black fire deals persistent damage based on total health
At least iji died on his own terms though, and do it willingly to fulfill Ranni's destiny. Blaidd certainly prefers to still aid ranni to the end but got denied that opportunity by the fingers.
ohhh right, i remembered now that Ranni is an Emperyan and destinied to inherit Marika so she got Blaid as her shadow. Now it make sense why Ranni asked you to kill him as the Baleful Shadow. Man the shadows, Malekith and Blaidd really got the short end of the stick. Though interestingly, Malekith is Marika half brother, is Blaid related to Rani? as far as i know, people like Blaid and Malekith don't really exist, so maybe they got the beastly form after becoming shadows? I guess Vele (or whatever his name is) figure out what would happen if Ranni make her intention clear so he locked Blaid away, for everyone safefy.
But.. can I take blaidds sword when he's dead?
Worth.
I think you should also mention how Hyetta was originally the gentle blind girl you can find near Castle Morne, whose death you caused by delivering the letter to her father
Who THEN is resurrected by Shabriri or the three fingers idk and becomes Hyetta the cursed finger maiden
Eh, I wouldn't really blame you for Irina's death, beyond the fact that delivering the letter tells the game to kill her. She was alone and helpless with Misbegotten on her trail. The only thing you did to kill her (in terms of story, not in terms of the game code killing her in response to you doing something on the other side of the map) was not insisting on hoisting her onto Torrent and taking her somewhere relatively safer (uuuhhhhhh...... the merchant at the Church of Elleh seems nice, I guess?).
Frick.
Fuck I knew I shouldn't have started that quest
i didnt start the quest because i knew irina would die, so yeah.
@@Nemo12417 i wish we could save people like that in the game, but sadly no such option was given.
What an absolute masterpiece of a game. I’ve sunk nearly 200 hours into this game on two playthrough’s now and the vast majority of this video is news to me
I think the irina quest is fully intended to be a sort of tutorial quest, both tutorial in how quests are done and on how they will all end
Luke: "You are a big tarnished with no stupid hat."
Me: Now hold on just a minute...
Luke: "The really stupid hats don't start unlocking until much later."
Me: Yep, checks out 😌😎😂
As Jim sterling once pointed out; from software games are very fashionable
prisonner hat
"Helping" Rya: "Hey innocently pure snek, you were created by horrific ritual that resulted in the death and torture of dozens."
Rya: "Oh, wow, thanks for letting me know. Can you please kill me now? No? Fine, then I'll wound your very soul by telling you I love you and then disappearing. Ciao!"
You'd almost think this was written by the same person that wrote Game of Thrones or something, because it's less of a spoiler to say someone has a tragic ending then a positive one.
Oh... wait...
12:04 Not really surprising if you know Patches. He always hated Clerics and you can summon for a fight against the church in Ds3’s ringed city.
I believe that Thops is described as a "bluntstone" his body cannot handle glintstone sorceries, and he knew this, but decided to practice anyways
Late comment but I always assumed it wasn't because he couldn't handle it but because it was a mean name for those who struggled with sorcery. I mean he knew a few basic ones so he definitely could but because assumed he was incapable of doing much more and disregarded his pursuits for a new kind of sorcery
Sellen is even above Alexander for how much it hurt to see what happens at the end. I genuinely loved her character, maybe she wasn't exactly 'good', but the way she's so supportive and how she discusses wanting you to turn her into the pupil once you becomes Elden Lord put a huge smile on my face! Only for me to rest at the grace and look around confused until I realised what had happened to her where my heart lurched, dammit Myazaki.
especially with a distorted voice calling you her apprentice one last time
Yeah voldemort/orochimaru was a cool teacher til the end. care for us feed us knowledge. Even let us take care of her own soul who care if she use others for living we dont know them we know sellen our teacher we are tarnish/human we barely care for those we dont know most of the time
Yeah I couldn't help but simp especially after the encouraging words at the end of her quest
I spoiled myself on her ending while looking up the location of her duel , so I withheld telling her about Lusat's body's location. Now she's still standing happily oblivious in the middle of the Raya Lucaria Library. I get that she's evil and all, but in a world where everything (even goats) is trying to murder you, at least she is one of the nicest people to you.
Yea at the same time I have to say Sellen's bad ending was all her own fault.
After giving Tanith the castanets, go back to Murkwater Cave and find Patches doing the same thing he did when you first find, only if you fight him for a bit he realizes its you again and stops fighting, reopening his shop.
I know im late af but the saddest part of selens quest is that she turned herself into the graven-mass by combining with azure and lusats bodies, as well as presumably a bunch of random raya lucarian mages, the graven-mass talisman (ball of heads) lore says primeval glintstone current is forbidden and for those that cling to its teachings creating a “seed of the stars” by “collecting” sorcerers is a scientific inquiry.
Tldr selen was turned into a graven-mass (star seed) intentionally. Its supposedly the height of primal glintstone sorcery by combining several sorcerers into a single form.
Blaidd broke my heart.
Its like fromsoft said people really liked sif , how do we twist the knife further. Let make him talk and make him super loyal and trusting I cried when I fought him
What happens when you beat him? I never killed him, I just left when he attacked
@@jevans1864 you get his set , rannis set is unlocked and there's a Frozen reference, also you cry over puppy bro
@@stephenroche7988 Ranni's set (Snow Witch set) should be available in Renna's tower regardless of Blaidd being dead or not once you have gotten far enough into her questline.
@@Joralion I probably grabbed it a bit late
i like maliketh better if we talking about puppy friends
Hyetta isn't dead btw. When you burn her, you're basically freeing her from her physical body and let her be your maiden in spirit form.
My headcannon is that she's the seal
Not really, since the frenzied flame is just going to burn everything away, theres no place for even spirits in that ending.
@@morinor1340 So, still maidenless?
@@drunkenphilosopher5159 still maidenless 😔
@@morinor1340 spoiler: Torrent and Melina still survived it 😀
To be fair, the Experiments Sellen performed on other students as she was still at the Acedemy were more gruesome, leading sometimes to Death or being also turned into big Balls of Stone Heads
TV Tropes actually suggests that Thops went out like Mozart, that is to say (depending on who you ask) he worked himself to death in the process of completing his final project.