Cabbage-pult Doesn't Work in PvZ2
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- Опубліковано 14 тра 2024
- Nobody asked (actually I believe a couple people asked), I answered. Here's who I consider to be the most useless plant in PvZ2.
Intro (0:00)
What is Cabbage-pult? (0:53)
Cabbage-pult vs. Peashooter (2:08)
The Effectiveness of Cabbage-pult (4:46)
Outro (10:48)
Music by:
Peter McConnell
Voup
/ discord - Ігри
I recorded this while sick so sorry if I sound like garbage
Also tysm for 15k!!!
(Also thanks voup for fixing my mic)
bro you sound wonderful, no worries there
That aint garbage that a whole pollution
You missed the chance to say you sounded like cabage smh
You sounded fine (=
Hope you feel better man
Cabbage-pult's biggest problem in pvz2 is that he was designed as a roof level peashooter when roof levels don't exist in pvz2.
It was also a counter to shield enemies too, but there aren’t many shield enemies apart from the obvious Excavator. Surprised it doesn’t even kill the Newspaper zombies without aggroing them anymore.
He can hit snorkels zombies in Big Wave Beach
If there was a map/world that was before the other catapult plants that played around with elevation like in pvz1 then it could have seen some uses, like a mountain of sorts where the zombies come down it
@@UP51L By the time you meet shields you have plenty of options to counter them which further invalidate the ultility of cabbage pult.
Roof levels dont exist however its purpose is to kill zombies when graves block zombies in Ancient Egypt.
I think Cabbage-pult's biggest problem is it's specifically designed for a level that *no longer exists*
I think you copied the *top comment* (edit : stop saying the same thing I already got the idea)
@@eee_eee Or had *the same thought*
@@eee_eee Or had *the same thought*
@@eee_eee Or had the same thought
Im on dark mode and can somebody tell me if they're using bold text
In the original PvZ, Cabbage-Pult solely served as a peashooter replacement in the roof, as the roof is designed to prevent you from using all of the powerful plants a player in the roof would have accumulated. Simply put, Cabbage-Pult is entirely and intrinsically tied to the roof. So when they remove elevation from the game, Cabbage-Pult loses all purpose.
Can't you use peashooter in roof in pvz1
@@landbell201you can, but the lower elevation will block the shot on the roof, making it so peashooter either becomes a melee plant or having to be planted on column 6 or further out
Shooting over graces
Graves
@padorupugsteriov9322 NO. On column 5, a Peashooter can hit zombies on columns 5-9
The half fire rate but double damage is secretly a downside. For example, if a zombie has 20 health left, both CP and peashooter can kill it in one hit, but the peashooter will recharge its next shot faster while the CP wasted half a shot on overkill. The fact that the CP can miss is also reduces its effective damage output. A peashooter can't miss as long as there are zombies in the lane, but if a zombie dies while a cabbage is mid-arc the shot is always wasted.
It wasn’t always that way with Peashooter, back in the day the headless body could still be hit a couple more times before fading away.
Also another advantage Peashooter has is you can plant him to narrowly kill a zombie if he only needs like one more hit but Cabbage can’t get his shot out in time, at least on low levels
that also means the CP can kill slightly sooner in certain situations, in theory. say a zombie has 80 health. two hits from CP is the time it takes to reload one shot, vs the peashooter needing the time to reload 3 shots. assuming travel time is the same it would mean you could kill slightly faster.
do not abreviate cabbage-pult 😬
@@isaacsimpson8098 oh yeah...
I forgot CP has another meaning... :(
CP 😳
Plant costs 100 sun, does what his name implies, has art and animation and even has a plant food effect. Truly one of the plants in the game.
easily one of the plants ive ever used
Honestly
If you look at it closely you realize that cabbage-pult is a cabbage
Many people don't see the true potential of cabbage-pult cause they fail to realize this
@@marxyogurt I didn't know that
I wonder if any other towers are based on plants
...please stop.
@@aperson8077 Well, there's ultomato which, if you look very closely, is a tomato
I honestly NEVER knew he even had a lower overall damage output than Peashooter. I always thought he was a slightly better peashooter. Now that I’ve seen the numbers tho, I guess it’s time to FIRE Cabbage-Pult.
Especially considering it DOES have the same damage as peashooter in pvz1 so you pick it against screen door zombies and ladder zombies (but other catapult plants can do it too)while peashooter can combo with torchwood
@@pumpkin6192 exactly
@@Cool_Kid95 well, maybe the reason it has a slightly lower damage is because it ignores lawn obstructions? therefore making it slightly more "evened" to peashooter?
_fires cabbage_
_gets a still shitty plant, pepper pult_
Mmm~ roast cabbage.
What if cabbage-pult targeted the furthest zombie, instead of the closest? That way it gets a simple, but unique mechanic and purpose: to soften up new zombies to be taken out easier with the rest of your frontline plants. Then buff the stats so it's better than peashooter, and voila, something that is actually interesting to use.
why would you trust EA with good game design? even their popular titles like FIFA & NFS survive on glamour and gimmicks. their game design is the same since their first successful iteration. They are like Ubisoft, pumping out copies of something that worked years ago.
I've actually proposed this idea for cabbage pult before. He's my favorite plant and he deserves better.
Not like they need it but I could see this change/buff also apply to the other catapult plants cornpult melonpult and wintermelon
@@CoralReaper707 my personal fav is G L O O M B O I
Actually they added to game plant with that mechanic
A small thing I'd like to add for the "lobbing over isn't always a good thing" is that even for graves it can be a downside. Since more often than not if there is a lot of graves using cabbage you'll usually never clear them all out meaning they can end up just blocking up half your lawn cause cabbage keeps lobbing over them to hit the one or two stray zombies instead of when it's needed to clear out the grave sitting where you wanted to put a wall-nut.
Cabbage isn’t intended to clear out graves..it’s intended to hit zombies over them whilst another plant handles the graves, once the graves are gone you replace cabbage with something better.
But with bloomerang you never have to worry about such a situation
Yeah. He only counters TOMB RAISER because of that trait, due to being able to kill it before it spawns too many graves, but that is only one zombie in one world, that doss not appear much, if at all, anywhere else. Even after killing a tomb raiser, it still won't clear out the graves, which can be an issue when that sarcophagus or garg is right up near your defense and you need an insta to deal with it.
In many ways, it’s similar to PVZ1 Cactus. Basically a Peashooter that counters one super niche thing, but before long, you have another plant to counter the same thing. It’s outclassed by literally everything and you would only ever realistically use it for one stage.
sucks cause both cactus and cabbage pult's designs aren't half bad. it would've been sick to use
Wait you can counter balloons without cactus?
@@af2547 Yes. Use Blover, Cattail, or any explosive plant.
I unironically used Cactus when playing Survival Day Hard sunflowerless due to sun cost stacking up using Blover. Yyea cuz Balloon.
@@realpvzdamemes Yeah, but that’s not part of the main game. If you’re just playing casually, you’ll never have a reason to use Cactus.
The only reason I ever used Cabbage-Pult was for his Plant Food effect during huge waves in the earliest levels.
That’s what I did too but it was so underwhelming, the flag zombie was in between a three pane camel 🐪 so the flag got hit by one plantfood cabbage directly and three splash damaged him and he didn’t die
It's good for big weak waves of zombies, if only that was as half as useful as taking down a dangerous zombie, like octopus or mage
A new idea to increase cabbages usability
Flaming hoop plant
I think this should be stressed more. The plant food was so good because it was the only one to damage the entire board early on.
Yup
I still think cabage pult is a good and worth to use plant, mainly because of the plant food, you see, most lobber plant's plant food effect is firing out alot of projectiles and randomly falls around the map. This might be good if the plant has splash damage but a significant amount of projectiles can be missed and watsed. While cabagepult effect only shoot out enough prohectiles depend on the amount of targets on the map(include and obstacle that can block plants and can be destroyed such as: graves, octopus... ) but this mechanic allow the cabagepult never waste a projectiles while still does some good damage to both tanky single target or crowd of enemies
I think every plant food only targets randomly if it runs out of targets. Melons and Banana come to mind
@@Barely_Edited eh, fair enough, still, cabbage pult pf is faster though
Corn… a cabbage pult that can stun
Melon: More damaging cabbage
Ice melon: Slowing Version Of Melon
@@SaphirePhionex corn: a cabbage pult that does less damage
melon: more expensive cabbage with longer attack animation
winter melon: melon but more expensive
@@binhevewont argue melon since they are useless
But corn is easily one of the best plants along with iceberg lettuce, puffshroom, sun shroom and potato/primal potato mine
Could even add sling pea to the group
If cabbage was the only catapult you could unlock in early game, it would be more understandable, but it really doesn't take that long for you to unlock corn, which can actually be useful.
So true corn is cabbage but actually useful in terms of dmg bcs of that stun chance
This is where i wish lobbers had their own version of torchwood, maybe not specifically fire-based to set them appart, but still.
Maybe like a Commangler Pult that both lures lobbed plant attacks towards a single lane but also gives them significantly more speed depending on how light or heavy the projectile is. Like, light kernels from Kernel Pult zoom almost instantly, Cabbages projectiles land crazy fast, and Melon pults stuff barely gets speed boosted.
Would be a vine
@@saltysalt844 A vine that makes lobbed projectiles have a flatter arc, makes projectiles move faster, and makes catapults deal more damage the closer the target is to them
Gravitree from PVZ Heroes, making the projectiles of catipults behind it fall faster and stronger, it even fits the theme of Torchwood being a tree AND it makes sense
when i was like 6 years old i did nothing but play PVZ1 on my dads phone and I had a dream that there was a secret plant that was a burning carnival hoop that lights lobbed projectiles on fire
I think Pulting plants would work nice with a damage bonus to zombies like seagull, where there's an obvious weak point that can be hit by them. Other zombies could be jetpack (on the jetpack itself), news paper (passing the paper), Weasel/chicken hoarder (killing them without releasing animals), and killing imps on gargantuars before they can throw them
i wonder why interactions like newspaper and lobbers weren't readded into pvz2; probably has something to do with the code itself, though.
@@660nj we have damage that goes through armor though (poison), I dont see why they couldn't add damage that goes through specific types of armor
you could also speed up the cabbage projectile’s speed too while were at it
@@660nj Newspaper Zombie, Balloon Zombie, and Football/All Star Zombie got ridiculously buffed due to Modern Day being the Last World.
I can see why they did it, it would have looked silly to have the Zombies in Modern Day be much weaker than the previous worlds but they should have just added tougher Zombies instead of making Paper as strong/balloon as a Bucket Helmet or Football Zombie being immune from Magnet Shroom. (hard plastic helmet?) They could have added Zombies like Catapult Zombie, Digger Zombie, Zomboni, or others.
My guess is Popcap was so proud of their super sped Newspaper Zombie that they refused to let it be bypassed. Even the spike plants won't bypass it, somehow damaging the newspaper through his feet. (Then again, you can say the same for headwear)
Cabbage-Pult in PvZ: Stronger damage output than normal Pea-Shooter at the same cost and cool down meaning it can kill Zombies and clear lines faster (assuming they aren't getting too close), also hits Door Shield Zombies as well as hitting Snorkel Zombies who are submerged, making you not have to possibly rely on Tangle Kelp and Fume Shrooms. The first plant you get on the roof meaning that it's the first line of real defense you have on the sloped surface, allowing you to not have to suffer from using Pea-Shooters or anything like that. Overall a really cool plant, and part of a really cool plant Trio of catapults, all of which have really interesting and powerful abilities (Kernel-Pult is able to butter Zombies and stop them in their tracks, and also become Cob Cannon. Melon-Pult over all is really useful and also has the Winter Melon upgrade which just makes it all the better.)
.
Cabbage-Pult in PvZ2: Same as PvZ1 for the most part, but no slanted levels means there's no real practical use for them outside of hitting zombies who may have something in front of them, but with Plant Food that's really not worth it as most other plants have some high damage output move when given Plant Food, such as the Pea-Shooter, or any other Pea-Shooter later in the game (ig the Plant Food for Cabbage-Pult hitting everything on screen for 200 damage is something but like, cmon...). The closer a Zombie is (namely like 2-3 tiles away) the longer it takes to kill it unless you have like 3 rows of them, making them entirely unreliable in these scenarios (It can be this way in PvZ1 as well, but I feel like that rarely happens unless you're really unlucky in your waves). Overall out classed by so many new plants that were introduced and doesn't get that much time to shine and is likely forgotten after some better plants are obtained.
Correction: Cabbate Pult lobs at half the rate of a Peashooter so they actually have roughly equal DPS 🤓
OK there is one good use for cabbage-pult. It is added as a starting plant in lost city endless. It’ll help you deal with shovel zombies until you unlock better options.
true i forgot about this
@@660nj Why not any other pult plant?
@@HavocTheReactiveit’s the only one in your loadout to start with
@@buttnuggetsauce7666 why are you using cabbage pult on anything past pirate seas
@@HavocTheReactive I’m not? I’m saying that cabbage pult is a default plant in the lost city endless levels
Something that could have worked for cabbage pult and maybe some other plants is that they focus on high health zombies. If you gave cabbage a little more damage as well as focusing strong zombies it could be an interesting plant to work with. People use spikeweed to deal with weaker zombies so the damage dealers can focus the tankier zombies so this could provide a neat opposite niche.
So basically just Dartichoke?
yes- bacicly lobbing dartichoke ( but dartichoke is seedium so shhhh- )
Then again, cabbage pult damage isn't the best to deal high health zombies
So, turn Cabbage-pult into Citron but a lobber with faster fire rate and lower damage.
@@joelhoon1707problem. Citron is flawed in many ways
If anything, Cabbage-Pult is basically just a Peashooter for Rooftops. I mean, in the first game, Cabbage-Pult was the first lobbed plant unlocked. His important role was to deal with the Roof’s slanted angles, which Peashooter can’t easily do unless it’s right at the top, just begging to be a sitting duck(weed).
also it has a bonus that it gets over screen door and newpaper zombies that have an object in front and peashooter just hits the object
@@zacharyroper6012 Correct, though I only called it the “Peashooter for Rooftops” because it attacks by lobbing projectiles across the sloped roof.
But indeed, their projectiles also ignores walls (like newspapers and screen doors) and anything submerged (most preferably water)
Also it doesnt have the problem that gets outclassed by every other lobbed plant, because in the first game the other or have low damage or are high cost
@@larrymantic2635ok but i don't understand how catapult plants cannot hit the ballon zombie.... this doesn't make sense!
I get your point, Cabbage is incredibly outclassed by so many other plants, which does make it basically useless when not in Egypt or Dark Ages. However, I believe the Most Useless Plant Award should go to Gold Leaf. So much potential, and such a waste.
Only usable in lost city
@@tianlecheng2656not anymore
Not anymore
I think the most useless plant is puffball. Cuz once you spawn him. He just explodes! like what is the point of him!?
@@Destroythegameman _Cherry Bomb, Grapeshot and Jalapeno:_
I think another issue with Cabbage-Pult is that there is quite literally never a reason to use it over Bloomerang. If there was a level that had like four graves in one lane, Cabbage-Pult might see some use there since zombies may get too close to Bloomerang before it can fight back, but in Ancient Egypt you'll generally only see one or two graves on one lane (sometimes three but that's rare, and even then one of them is usually far enough back the zombies in that lane start getting attacked quickly enough it doesn't make a difference).
cabbage pult is cheaper but you are probably still right
@@zacharyroper6012 Its cheaper but not by enough to make a difference except at the very start of the level
@@ClonedGamer001only one bonus forusing cabbage pult instead of boomerang and that is for some levels you don't need to even pay attention to the Graves most of the time
Pepper-Pult may be terrible, but at least he had a purpose, which can be done better by other plants.
Yeah only good in the tundra cause ya don’t want to use the better snap dragons in the back lines
Well, he and hot potato is the only f2p warming plant there, so there's really no choice.
Edit: I also just realise that snapdragon is a warm plants as well, so make that three. My bad
@@victory8928 But atleast it has a splash damage unlike garbage pult
Actually snapdragon is a free fire plant and it's unlocked before frostbite caves
@@alimate0890 That's only because of the recent patch, Pepper Pult was pretty good before they gave Snapdragon the warming ability, and even then, he's still good to use at the back.
I think the issue doesn't really stem from cabbage-pult so much as the amount new lobber/piercing plants the dev team added.
Back in PvZ1, Cabbage-pults were Peashooters of the roof. All other options had some downsides that made the choice to pick Cabbage meaningful (Kernel-pult deals less damage ; Melon-pult and Winter Melon cost too much for early game ; Fume-shroom is impractical to use in daytime). It even had extra uses that made it relevant in other worlds, like targeting hidden snorkels or shielded zombies.
Too bad the design team didn't think this through for PvZ2. They added a slew of strong enough piercing plants like Bloomerang and Laser Bean, and better lobbers like Akee and Dusk Lobber. At the same time, the returning plants were buffed: Kernel-pult got more uses (like insta-killing some flying zombies) and the 50 then 75 sun meta made Melon-pult and fume-shroom more viable as early plants.
A.K.E.E.:
It's pretty much a stronger bloomerang that became a pult plant, oh it bounces to 1 2 3 4 zombies but deals 10 less damage each bounce
Hol up Akee is my favorite
Why did became so honest when im a "A.K.E.E fanatism"
Maybe because mob vote problems ☠️
@@ariztheackee505 its cause A.K.E.E is very flashy, and was put in a world where it has a use. People hate bowling cause it was put in a world where it was useless, sun bean cause it came too late to be of any use, and garlic cause it was put in a world that counters its gimmic.
Meanwhile, AKEE is presented as a perfect counter to excavators, and the shots feel like they deal actual damage. Even if its just as strong as cabbage, it just feels better.
Actually cabbage does have a nice advantage over peashooter and repeater early game in that he can hit zombies over graves. But then he quickly becomes overshadowed by Bloomerang, which not only can hit more zombies than him for the same damage, but also destroy the graves in the process
The cabbagepult was designed to serve as a lobbing equivalent to the peashooter in roof levels. But roof levels dont exist in pvz2. So the only real benefit it has over a peashooter is its ability to clear gravestones, which can also be cleared instantly with the FREE grave buster plant.
What I’m frustrated by is how worse it looks compared to pvz1. Whereas Kernel pull looks nice in both
Yep, cabbage looks good in pvz1. I like kernel more in pvz2. The leaf-made pult oddly fits well, unlike with cabbage
i dont know, Cabbage looks nice in both games to me
@@icedoveranimals7368 that leaf-made pult looks so odd. It's bent over to look like a pult, but it also looks like someone injected a bent green plastic straw in his head.
I like the OG cabbage-pult, but i would prefer the new cabbage's color
Nah I like it more realistic look in Pvz2
I feel like the purpose of Cabbage-Pult is that it is just one of the basic starter plants. Unlike PvZ 1, PvZ 2's selection of plants feels more "Journey Progressive" or feels like the type of game that has a better and more effective weapon/person/object than the last as you slowly go through the game.
In PvZ 1, each plant has a special role to play in the game, they are all unique with different purposes. PvZ 2 however, is not the case, every time they introduce a new plant, it feels like the plant is a better and upgraded version of a previous plant, take Peashooter for example, there are so many other plants better than it, no less it's other counterparts.
Once they introduced the new "Level System" to PvZ 2, there were already some plants that were...questionably better than others. After another month or so, I realized by then, PvZ 2's plant selection wasn't about strategy anymore, at least not really. Remember what I said about PvZ 1's plant selection? Every plant the game has is unique, has it's own purpose, and has no other plant that can do it better, or at least similarly.
Yeah...just scrap that away from the PvZ 2 table, then you got PvZ 2.
This is basically the case. Once you've got Red Stinger, Repeater is a lot less favourable
"Every plant the game has is unique, has it's own purpose, and has no other plant that can do it better, or at least similarly. "
*Cough* Cactus *Cough*
@@nightowl6055 the exception
shadow plants are pretty op (especially shadow pea)
I used it on big wave beach and i clinically sane?
well researched video for a game i thought many forgot about. Really interesting!
I always have used Cabbage Pult over Pea Shooter because of UPGRADES. Which, although a large amount of people abstain from upgrading their plants, are still a valid part of the argument. While Vanilla PvZ2's upgrades can be extremely unbalanced, they can be essential in the newer player's first playthrough. When upgraded, Cabbage Pult can absolutely lap Pea Shooter in damage, and since it is unlocked at an extremely early point in the game, you often have a lump sum of Cabbage Pult seed packets. Rant/ rebuttal over.
If it was more effective at dealing with airborne zombies or simply dealt like 10% more damage,
It'd technically have a niche,
But, like magnet shroom, it'd still be outclassed.
If sloped worlds were still a thing it'd be just as good as it was in PvZ 1,
A cheap alternative to melon pult that deals more reliable damage than kernal-pult.
Edit: didn't remember what the corn one was called.
Kernal-pult*, but yeah
@@dayandere2669 I only remembered that it wasn't the cob cannon,
So thanks, now I know what it's called
And as a bonus I don't have to think about how to spell kernal.
worlds that should have been sloped: Lost city, big wave beach(extra hard)
The lost city being sloped should just makes sense that it takes place in a temple with stairs, of course so it should be included as a mechanic and block projectiles.
The reason for big wave beach cause of water needs lower land to move down.
@@ariztheackee505 they could've also made levels where just 2 lanes are sloped
To help with their philosophy of making levels more dynamic.
@@BramLastname ...
Pretty sure yes, slopes could be good gimmick for worlds
I’ve only played PvZ1 around once or twice in an airplane or something several years ago, and yet I watched this video like I was studying for a test.
Loved the clear explanation and general video style
I'm just gonna say. I was about to close the page. But then I saw you have a Furret pfp in the post-video cardscreen. You just got yourself a new sub.
I feel like it really does one thing well: it keeps the players in with nostalgia, and since its a later plant in pvz1, it gives the player a feeling that the game will be harder than the first, which may be a glaring issue for people who felt the first was too easy.
What does too easy mean
AN EASY GAME IS A NON-STRESSING GAME WHICH IS A GOOD GAME
@@Danpg79Robloxthat is an opinion
@@dogemon NO, TELL ME HOW YOU FIND A GAME TOO EASY
Ain't Kernel-pult, Melon-pult and Winter Melon do the same?
@@Danpg79Roblox if someone wants a challenge in a game, and they don't get one, they might consider the game too easy
Another thing to note, if an imp is on the same tile as a grave, cabbage pull hits the grave instead.
so a peashooter
Exactly what I wanted to wake up and see thanks for making me feel so much better!
another thing you have to consider for the DPS is that cabbage has high damage and slow ROF. That can often add up to a lot of overkill damage. If a zombie has 5 hp left and gets hit for 40 thats 35 wasted.
I think you should make a video about plants who lost their use in the sequel. Plants who don't have a point in the sequel because their original purpose wasn't translated well. Cabbage-Pult was made as a roof Peashooter, but since that's not in the sequel they really had to stretch its purpose. And like you said it gets both outclassed by the default plant and multiple plants in the first world.
I feel like its only purpose here is to be the defacto tutorial lobber.
Tall-nut fit there perfectly as example. Having tons of hp don't mean much when most of the enemies in the game can just straight up ignore you.
@@januszpolak254 I’ve been thinking of this for a while. Aside from Magnet and Garlic, Tall-Nut is the worst victim of power creep in pvz2.
Like you said, the surplus health means little when instakills, disabling (Wizard etc ) and displacement (Excavator etc) disregard that. Everything Tall-Nut counters Blover does instantly.
What Tall-Nut needs is another type of gimmick like resistance to instakills (besides burning) like Primal Wall-Nut but can survive less and resistance to displacement like how Blockoli is immune to Fisherman by default.
@@togarashi6437 garlic is kind of useful when paired with electricurraunt, but that’s assuming there’s no gargantuars or other instant kill zombies on your lawn. But about tall nut, he really is pointless. Why use him when you have other walls that are so much more efficient?
@@Woopor yeah, just get Infi-Nut. He’s literally a better Tall-Nut when given Plant Food.
Ever since release I've questioned why cabbage pult exists in PvZ2, its ONLY use in PvZ1 is to lob over the roof tiles. But in PvZ2 there is no roof level? When PvZ2 first released it felt so cursed to be planting any of the lobbing plants at all because of the lack of slanted tiles. Kernel pult and melon pult at least have uses in stalling and crowd control respectively, but cabbage pult is like you said a worse peashooter.
No, I don't count lobbing over graves as a 'use', I just see it as a bonus for a plant. Example, if you look at apple mortar do you think its use is to lob over graves?
completely agree with that last point
@@660nj Haha yeah nice opinion, Now make a video about Caulipower
@@660nj agree having a "helpful use,, come on its way worse than the first plant in the game peashooter like Creeps20 said you can stall with the graves and other grid items the zombie waves
Seeing both Flag Zombie and Creeps20 in your responses is the greatest crossover I never knew I needed
I genuinely prefer Cabbagepult to Peashooter literally just because of the animation. I love that lobbing spectacle!
cabbage pult could have a damage/speed scalling based on how far the project travelled it would be good at long distances and week at close distances, the reverse of peashooter straight shoot aproach, making both a great complement to each other it would be a great synergy.
Randomly found this channel one day n damn, the content is insane with so much in depth. Thank you for your thoroughness and amazing quality. Stopped playing the game a while back n still go on n off but still find these incredibly interesting and fun
I don't even know anything about or play PvZ but this kind of videos is really fun to watch
I’m so glad I stumbled on this channel
Finally, It's here! Now I'm curious about how you would fix Cabbage Pult...
you sounded like one of these bots, also nice alt liking.
@@Reddishty lmao yeah. Those boys that say "Finally, it's here:" and then paste a random link that leads to some shitty Buddhist video or other shit
@@Reddishty yikes bro
@@Reddishty i almost thought that too, the "it's finally here" followed by some random youtube link
that said, i doubt this person used 18 alts to like his comment
@@paul_particularlyunhappynut LOL
I still pretty much use cabbage pults for it's damage with other AOE damage dealing plants as a mix usage in every world because using one single meta in all the levels feels too boring.
Just use kernal
legit use anything else for aot clear
Cabbage Pult big projectiles do more damage per hit than Butter, Melon plant food, divide equally unlike Dusk Lobber, Akee or Pepper Pult. I love him cuz of that
@@overstimulatedboy01 no
I mean, cabbage pult is a pretty terrible pick if you're using it as your main source of damage (about equally as bad as peashooter)
Some information you might be interested in is that the pvz 2 wiki says that peashooter and cabbage-pull have the same dps due to the cabbage-pull having half the fire rate and double the damage.
I love these newer styles of videos you’re doing. Keep this up!
cabbage-pult during pvz: I defeat big zombie while my entire family dies and i carry every plant.
cabbage-pult during pvz2: pls protec me bucket zombie scary boy!!11!!
Yeah, I used this plant back when I was a fan of the PVZ franchise.
It's flawed, for sure. Though the only reason I still used it is because, well,
I didn't know it was considered 'not good' in-battle. So I went and used it.
In PVZ1, I would pair it up with Kernel-Pult and Melon-Pult/Wintermelon-Pult since I thought it was a good strategy to have it as a back-up plant, thinking it would do extra damage to some zombies. I went along with it and it worked! Sometimes.
There were some times where I struggled when using cabbage-pult in PVZ2.
Nonetheless, I still pushed through regardless of it being 'pointless'.
So what do I think of it? Meh, it's alright.
It's not the best lobbing-plant in-game but it isn't the worse either.
Though, I do agree with your points. This is just my perspective of using cabbage-pult at a young age.
Even in the original game cabbage-pult was only really useful due to the roof slope. Sure lobbers had uses like going over shields and hitting snorkels but kernel pult does the same while also stalling, and once you get melon pult you'd never use cabbage again, just kernel and melon.
Idk if pvz2 is the same but in pvz1 it shoots past newspaper and screen door zombies which is an added bonus for cabbage pult unlike peashooter
one of the most needed videos out there in the internet.... new subscriber
If cabbage gets a buff in the future (e.g. fire rate, plant food scales with levels), it would be more used and be better.
If I had to change cabbage pult, these are the changes I would do:
1. Increase its fire rate from 2.85-3s to 2.35-2.5s.
2. Big cabbages would always deal 5x the damage of the regular cabage, even with levels.
a. Big cabbages could probably shoot a second wave on level 3+ (more waves every 3 levels).
3. Splash damage to all the zombies on a 1x1 tile area (splash damage being half of the regular cabage.
a. Maybe at level 6+, every 10 cababges could shoot straight with more splash damage (base 20 to base 30).
i. At max level, ever 2nd cabbage will be shot straight, also it can Peirce up to 10 zombies.
4. Increase the accuracy, so it can hit faster enemies better.
5. More HP; it's a cabbage, a hard leafy plant that takes more effort to cut than lettuce. Base Hp increase is 300 to 750.
a. It could probably get synergy with cold plants, being harder to get eaten, because frozen cababges are almost impossible to cut.
i. The health increase with cold plants is +75%.
ii. This only works if there is a cold plant on the lawn.
"hi guyss welcome back to making the most overpowered plant part 34"
I always hated that the plant dios effect only affected the first zombie of each lane instead of all of the zombies , like the plant food effect should be like Melon pult , many waves of projectiles that hits everyone
yes, except 3. No need.
I'd say increasing damage is enough. It'd be like a quasi citronen, having high single target damage in exchange for firerate.
tbf just giving it more health would give it a niche early as a weaker pea nut
In all the years Ive played this game, its mods and penny's pursuit, I think Ive used it less than 20 times. It just didnt deal enough damage to deal with big crowds even when leveled up.
His boost is pivotal in the early campaign. Gets crept over by other plants quickly but this goes without saying.
Happy I clicked on this Video I haven't played PvZ2 in ages but it's got a special place for me. I remember everytime I redownloaded the game the moment Kernel-Pult or even Bloomerang was unlocked I'd stop using Cabbage-Pult 🔥😂
I like to use it for Egypt levels with a ton of Graves or the grave spawner zombies cause it'll target them over the Graves which a peashooter cant
I always use cabbage-pult and this hurts my pride but this guy is right it doesn't work in pvz2
The reason plants have a varied fire rate is so that there will be variation in the way the projectiles look when you have a bunch of plants and it won’t be the exact same pattern every time they shoot
I only played PvZ 1, never any of the sequel stuff.
So I was confused why people would dislike it. But knowing it was used in a setting without roof levels makes it clear.
Just a case of a plant designed for a certain level type not being removed when that level type was removed too.
Few things I can think of to make the cabage useful is to either give it an op leaf ability or buff it's damage and add more enemies with front facing shields that can be dispatched faster by hitting them directly with lobbing weapons. Lastly add splash damage, small radius and 50% or 25% splash damage for an early cheap splash damage plant
I want to put out that I will always pick cabbage over peashooter. In early world completions within the versions with keys (ex. Bbw with only plants up to iceburg lettuce going in) it is what got me through the early levels. The huge this with it is actually to do with plant food. Once you can replace it yeah, you do, but it's far better than peashooter imo simply because of its ability to go over graves and its plant food.
Great video! I always felt something was just... off about cabbage.
Also no one gonna talk about sun pod at 10:09.
i love finding breakdowns of random, specific aspects of games i know nothing about. do i know anything about plants vs zombies? other than i played it on my cousin's ipad once as a kid, no. was i captivated by this the entire time? absolutely
Looking at the bright side, Cabbage pult is like slow Peashooter but serves a bit purpose that prioritizes shooting zombies from the barriers like graves, but other lobber plants just outdo cabbage pult. Also in Ancient Egypt, they have Grave buster with 0 cost so we have more reason to pick other plants.
You should make a video on Kernel-pult also, since it has the same struggles as cabbage, with a little more usability
I think that it has salvation, it's just hidden. I am pretty interested on the ability to not only cross targets, but also damage them faster from far away, if i was a pz2 developer, i think ill make cabage-pult a plant that could ramp up damage the farther the target is, making it a plant that has some uses, more than the usual skipping tombstones bit, expanding on what it already has, instead of what it does not.
Also great video, and congrats on 15k
At least in PvZ 1, cabbagepult was good against the screen door zombies and others that carried a barrier. It wasn't better than kernelpult, which stunned often enough to be useful even if its base damage wasn't as good, but that was its use-case. Aside from being a version of peashooter that worked on the roof.
It’s very useful in the first stages of egypt because it can hit the zombie even if there’s a grave in front of it. A peashooter can’t do that. But I dropped the cabbage pult once I got the boomerang plant because it can hit both the grave and the zombie
I've always thought Peashooter was better than Cabbage-Pult, with his Plant Food being the main reason. Also he's definitely useful for lobbing over graves given Bloomerang costs 75 more sun (and if you think that's a bad reason, then just look at the people who think Iceberg is better than Stunion because he's free). But then again, Grave Buster... yeah I'll give you that one.
Also I still prefer him over Kernel-Pult, because while Cabbage has slightly less DPS than Peashooter, Kernel-Pult has DRAMATICALLY less DPS unless you get super lucky with butter. Sure using multiple Kernels in one lane makes them a lot better but most of the time I'd rather just use a different attacking plant in place. Also, Cabbage's plant food can reliably kill groups of weak zombies given it at least guarantees a hit on every single one, unlike Melon-Pult and AKEE (Kernel's does too, but Cabbage's does 5 times more damage). Furthermore he is quite useful for countering Barrel Rollers as Kernel's butter stun is actually somewhat of a disadvantage since it means he might get overtaken by other zombies, so he'll get hit less and may sneak through later on, which is dangerous if using close ranged plants (but then again there's still better options like Bloomerang).
Also also, Blooming Heart is more useless.
GNVS, I enjoy your video alot! Also, I use Cabbage-Pult because the game tutorial force me to upgrade the Peashooter when I was trying to win without levelling.
@Among Us Stunion freezes for the same duration as Iceberg, plus Torchlight Zombies very rarely appear, and Stunion can be used with fire plants. The plant food though, you're right on
@Among Us And Stunion still wins lmao. At level 1 he literally freezes for LONGER than Iceberg Lettuce as he does it for 12 seconds compared to 10. Granted, Iceberg's stun duration increases with upgrades plus a brief chill duration when on at least level 5, but then again Stunion can poison zombies at that level, which is pretty broken given it means he's practically an instant kill for any armoured zombie
@Among Us Shadow Shroom is 25 more sun and requires Moonflower to be powered, so if Stunion is level 5+ he basically replaces Shadow Shroom unless you're using the latter exclusively for plant food
@@GNVS300 also stunion can actually poison zombies if he's boosted by contain mint too.
Wish there was a Torchwood for lobbing plants. Something to do with frost, maybe! (and if you're gonna argue "there's already Winter Melon for a freezing lobber!", consider they still added Fire Peashooter when Torchwood is a plant they had to bring over.)
pepper pult:
@@buckethead_cdsonicstill same with the fire pea and torchwood situation
Another plant review idea: Go over the stats of all the sunproducers (sun flower, twin sun, primal sun, sunshroom and moonflower) and go over which are better in certain situations and which is "the best".
It'd be interesting cause, honestly I don't see much purpose in using other sun producers other than sunshroom and moonflower. I use sunshroom when I'm not using shadow plants, cause moonflower has a slower recharge though it does produce overall the most sun out of all of them. A lot of people prefer either sunshroom or primal sun, so it'd be interesting to see the objective stats
(Though I do have an "interesting" strat of my own when I'll use two sunproducers, either sunshroom + sunflower or sunshroom + moonflower. I believe this gives you a bit more overall sun in the early game cause of the make up of recharge. It also helps as an additionally "wall" for the zombies to eat through. Idk maybe I could be a complete dumbass cause I haven't seen anyone else use this strat)
sun producers are hard to compare because much of it matters on when you plant them
@@660nj They aren't hard to compare at all, the goal with sun producers is to produce sun.
Thus you compare that at certain points in the game, the ones which can reliably produce enough sun and high amounts tend to be better, but not so high that you have excessive sun you don't use.
even corn gets his place after you get it, the butter attack is so much better
I think that pea shooter is better overall but cabbage pult is very useful for graves in ancient Egypt because bloomrang has a weaker hit rate unless I’m incorrect about that and grave buster being slower recharge time which means the graves could be a problem. But yeah overall cabbage pult is pretty weak. I think it might help to give him some splash damage but ultimately he does get outclassed pretty quickly especially once you get melon pult.
Yeah, it's only useful for those graves
Yeah, but is it worth one slot to essentially have something that can shoot over graves, an issue that gets resolved later on in the round anyway
@@beforeflight5566 I mean, if you were gonna pick peashooter at all, cabbage pult is a decent replacement for it. They're basically the same plant except for a very minor dps difference and lobbing mechanics. It's not great but neither is peashooter
@@LauBauBer cabage puly has better plantfood
just wanna say you and creeps20 are my fav pvz youtubers rn, you make really cool and interesting videos that are fun to watch and get a certain perspective on the game
this channel is now gonna be a pvz wiki for me
Cabbage-pult is the only plant to have its firing rate increase through leveling up cabbage-pult fans
I like how the kettle corn is functionally a direct upgrade
Butter
Also another thing about cabbage vs peashooter is that shots from peashooter will still travel straight to the next zombie when the original one dies so they're not wasted when fired excessively unlike cabbage where the shots will simply hit the ground unless another zombie happens to be nearby.
Cabbage-pult still has one purpose, and it’s for the nostalgia. I was a little surprised you didn’t mention it in the vid, but to me cabbage pult is one of the first plants I think of when I think “plants v. Zombies.” It’s kind of iconic in its own little way.
But even then I think of peashooter first, so oof, I guess it’s even outclassed in that regard.
The thing i like about cabbage-pult is the power up it has when you give it the plant food. It targets all of the zombies in the field so it makes it easy to deal with big waves quickly
Cabbage pult will only be used if there's a world that has a landscape like the PVZ1 Rooftop. But then again, even if PVZ2 comes up with that world, we already have built high level enough experience and melon pults to just go straight melon or wintermelon pult.
I only used cabbage-pult and found him useful in ancient Egypt since he can shoot over gravestones while peashooter has to break every tombstone in front of him to get to a zombie if you don’t have a grave buster or there are more important graves to break cabbage-pult was actually useful but I don’t remember him being too useful after that
well,if you could get other plants before,you wouldn't use it at all
@@overstimulatedboy01 that’s why he was no longer useful after Ancient Egypt
@@overstimulatedboy01 That applies to peashooter as well. Your point?
@@pichujiggs153 you can still use peashooter after ancient egypt, yes there is better options but for the most part is playable and like the person in the video said you can combo peashooter with stuff like torchwood and pea vine which you can't with cabbage pult.
@@RaphielShiraha64 This argument can apply to literally any plant, cabbage included. Also you can combo cabbage with arma-mint so it does have some combo utility.
I’ve watched this video 5+ times now and I don’t even know why. I get the knowledge and I expect everything said to be said but I keep watching it when it pops into my recommended
Idk why the algorithm showed me this, but banger vid mr 660nj
*[Sees title and thumbnail]* But it is capable of prioritizing zombies over graves...
*[Watches video]* Oh...fair point...
Even in a meme build, it can't do anything. I can't believe i said this, but even Garlic has a gimmick and synergy with other plants
The only use I have for cabbage-pult is in the beginning, when cooldowns actually slow you down and your choice in plants is very limited or nonexistent. I take both peashooter and cabbage-pult for faster rollout as extra firepower. Even when I get better plants, cabbage-pult along with peashooter work as temporary fillers. It helps to rush the early levels and get to the point where it gets outclassed faster. Its point, as an early-game plant, is getting outclassed and being redundant. Everything it does can be done by other plants better. It's a crutch and it's good at it.
One things not mentioned in the Peashooter comparision: lower damage instances with the same DPS is also generally better.
You are less likely to overkill enemies by a lot, which can add up depending on the breakpoints on different enemies (which I don't know).
Other games counteract this with armour often being more effective against a lot of small attacks, but I don'tthink PvZ has that?
Damn I’ve been running him for ages and I had no idea the community hated this plant😂 I always run him for his plant food effect which I thought was pretty good
It really is
Then melon plant food shows up
Same, he was one of my favorite plants to use in pvz2 and I like to use him for his plant food ability, I really figured that other people liked him but I guess not.
I've never played PVZ, but just looking at it's numbers with some assumptions:
-There seems to be no damage threshold on zombies (flat damage mitigation)
-There seems to be no value in overkilling zombies
That means even with equal DPS, the peashooter should be more effective outright anyway, yeah? Considering the fact that it can never overkill worse than the cabbage does (which wastes damage). Say a made up scenario where you're fighting a row of five zombies with 45 health, the peashooter should be able to kill the row in less time than the cabbage-pult would, as you'd waste 35 cabbage damage on each zombie versus the peashooter only wasting about 15. Given the same DPS, you'd lose less damage to this on the peashooter.
Forgot to mention overkill, and, yes, that's completely right
Cabbage-pult might just be a starter support plant for Peashooter, but as time goes on, it's going to get replaced, yes.
A buff for Cabbage-pult could be have them give a chance to stun like Kernel-pult's Butter, and their plant food effect should always stun (Melon and Winter Melon should also have these) or have them have a faster fire rate.
Personally, Cabbage-pult can be a decent support for Pea-shooting plants if Bloomerang was introduced much more later (like before Bonk Choy) or buff them in some shape or form
If you were to give Cabbage pult a chance to stun, wouldn't that just completely destroy the purpose of Kernel pult? You just gave a Cabbage pult, which has more damage than the Kernel pult, the signature ability of the Kernel pult. Kernel pult's whole deal is sacrificing damage for the chance of a stun, giving that to the other pult plants makes Kernel significantly inferior, as now it is just a catapult plant with less damage for the same price.
Honestly I think they should give the CP a buff, since cabbages are full of water, why not make it take out fire tiles & extinguish fire zombies.
It would conflict with pepper pult
Oh and in frostbite caves it should chill zombies because wet + ice land= really cold.
I wish cabbagepult had splash damage at least when leveled up so it wouldn't break early game
Cabbage pult is best shown in pvz 1.
Cabbage pult was the peashooter of the roof level, and can take out screen door shield zombies and ladder zombies like a normal zombie.
Sure, melonpult is better, but cabbage pult was there to be your early defender, and it did a pretty good job.
I remember in PvZ 1 I completely moved from Peashooter to Cabbagepult even after the rooftop level because it had the same stats but with some advantages, like being able to bypass some zombies' shields or attacking the snorkels while they moved. I guess things didn't go so well for it in the second game.
I never thought of Cabbage Pult as a good plant. Even in PVZ1 it's only used because you need a lobbing plant for the roof.
I've always had a soft spot for cabbage-pult simply due to convenience. He's a perfect early game plant in ANY world due to his power to fling projectiles over any obstacles like gravestones, surfboards and octopi. In Grind Thousand mod by GoodPea2 he literally has a better DPS. 22 damage every 4 seconds vs 10 damage peashooter every 2 seconds. And only gets better from there on.
I can't think of a situation where it would be better to immediately trigger waves with the plant that especially has the slow viral rate then say it with me the 1.35 to 1.5 fire rate pea shooter if you think about it a 5th of the time you might be dealing like 1 10th of a gargantuar health with a pea shooter yeah it's a head scratcher why cabbage pult was even added considering pvz 2 is much more rushed than pvz 1 and there's no roof section or elevations so cabbage pult really has no purpose
cabbage pult: the 'i am waiting for my pea shooter to recharge and i need to plant something' plant
I just recently started PVZ 2 after like a decade of avoiding it lol
I've been quite surprised how much I enjoy it but when I got the cabbage pult so early on I was kinda confused why I got it, it served litterally no purpose and I still haven't used it once, PVZ 2 really needed a roof level...
All the more reason to love him, he's really conscious about the whole situation