Why did Dragon Balls art style change so much?
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- Опубліковано 3 лип 2021
- On this channel I've delved into the evolution of DragonBalls art style numerous times however I've seldom discussed the WHY behind these changes. Did series author Akira Toriyama make a deliberate attempt to change the look of the series or was it a result of just simply refining his style over time? Well, join me today as we pour through numerous interviews to find the answer!
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The Real question is: "How did Vegeta get taller?" he was the legendary SUPER-MANLET and now he's just sort of short.
He trained and did leg day and stretching non stop… that’s gonna be for the vegeta growth spinoff 😂😂😂😂
5'2 to 5'5
PROGRESS >:D
Well saiyans do age slower, maybe they grow slower too lmao
If you compare the boots he wears in the Broly movie to the ones in the Saiyan through Cell Saga, they have slightly thicker grey soles but in universe he probably just grew a bit.
Vegeta been using the dragon balls for years to slowly make it look like he's been growing. He beat Frieza to the idea.
Fans: "It's too square"
Toriyama: "You underestimate my Geometric powers"
I love toriyama’s new style. F the haters
@@mrsavage4837 do you mean the movie art style of dragon ball super art style
sounds like Janemba to me
*inhales*
"THIS ISN'T EVEN MY FINAL -SHAPE- FORM!!!
@@mrsavage4837 just because people don’t share your opinion doesn’t mean they’re haters, fanboy.
F the fanboys. See, I can get petty too
I just wish Super's style was closer to DBZ.
Same, really wish Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru had filled that role
Being based on Toriyama's modern designs, plus new character designers, of course it won't.
Super Broly style is cool
Yeah the characters look like they all went vegan .
It looks more like Pokemon style characters.
I love the way SS1 was drawn in the early android season. That's my favourite art style.
Same I always liked the softer looking hair and aura.
Not to mention the "aura , no-sura" color scheme (stronger yellows with aura, and lighters yellows without aura)
To me it was the favourite thing about the ssj transformation
Nowadays they stick with color scheme
Hyperbolic Time Chamber is my favorite art. I like the SSJ while in a natural state.
Gohan walking around normal with Blonde Hair.
I like the buu saga art style the most
@@pinstripecool34 The animator who did the Vegita/android 19 fight nailed the look. The simple persistent glow was a really cool introduction to Vegita's foray into the form.
Also to factor in on the changing style, on the manga side, is the fact that Dragon Ball was a weekly manga. And Toriyama had one assistant, while he draw most of the manga. Do that for 10 years, you learn real quick to be more efficient, while trying to maintain quality. It's not easy, nor any surprise that Toriyama did not go back to long running weekly manga ever again.
This is the realest answer right here, and I don't blame Toriyama for this.
Yep and he also did character designs for video games like Dragon Quest and wrote other manga like Go GO Ackman all while writing and illustrating Dragon Ball!
He was also part of the animation team back in the 90s from the dragon ball anime... that dude is talented
Not sure if mandela effect but I heard him say once that the whole reason he invented the super saiyan was so he didn’t have to ink goku’s hair all the time, which was very time consuming.
@@Coquitox That is correct. I feel bad for these mangaka; the grind is brutal.
DBZ fans: recognize saga by lines in artwork.
Akira Toriyama: forgets everyone’s hair color and ages and Launch.
I always thought that the art style in DBZ buu arc changed to show how stronger goku had become. His muscles are way more defined, bigger and look way more cooler lol. But yeah, personally the artwork looks way better in the later part of the series.
Actually, Goku was at his bulkiest in the Frieza saga.
@@jasonone8726 and in the cell saga as well
It did. They had the characters look more menencing towards the end. A gradual shift from the soft pudgy characters in original kid goku
@@jasonone8726 Maybe in his base but in his super Saiyan 2 and especially 3 he was bulky af
@@danielvelaswuez7197 SS2 makes anyone too bulky, it's the flaw of that transformation.
Has anyone noticed that almost all the main villains in DB universe have no eyebrows and their ears are like hollow tubes except for piccolo, Dr. Gero and Moro of course. Was toriyama aware of this?
Probably very much so because he designed these characters. Probably saved them time drawing ears, also for these alien looking creatures it actually looks better than drawing them human or giant elf ears. Also we all know that SSJ was originally supposed to have black hair, but went with blonde which in black and white manga it saves a ton of time and ink.
I always wondered WTH was with freezas ears before his last form they look like they are made by the armor his troops wear.
Toriyama has said he uses ear holes as an easy way to draw aliens 😂
My buddy and I used to refer to them as 'Frieza Ears'.
Not only has the art been dumbed downed in Dragon Ball Super, but also the violence. In comparison DB DBZ were always more grittier. Miss those days.
The violence downgraded is not toei's fault. The age rating in japan has changed.
At least shintani's style looks better than modern yamamoro's one
@@2025fahaddenseje I vaguely recall reading something about that somewhere. That sucks.
@@trifeloco On the bright side, believe or not, DBS manga still has that kind of old school violence, something that we probably never will see on TV.
@@2025fahaddenseje True!
@@2025fahaddenseje
what?! Could you explain it to us better.
I really want to understand why they made Dragonball super so much dumber and more “childish” than DBZ.
The series should have matured but instead it dumbed down.
Was it to suit a younger and newer audience?
I just thought the art style changing was the characters getting more jacked... lol
Same lmao
As a kid I just always assumed it was because even though Saiyans don’t age much people still look a little different throughout the years
That's a really fun interpretation.
They do age
The art simply evolved as the series' mood became much more aggressive. The cleaner and sharper lines just seem more powerful.
Agreed. I’m happy that this seems to be the consensus amongst the fans in the comments.
@@gillysummerss I think they went way too far with it, the characters became almost unrecognizable by the end of it. You don't need overly angular characters to tell a serious story, you need better writing.
@@SavageFreddy33 I think it just looks cool
Even though the style of the Broly Movie in 2018 wasn't talked about too much in this vid I like it a lot because it reminds me of Toriyama's later work where he had more angular design and and less pentsrokes, the 2018 movie took this approach and the only difference is that lines are softer and not that angular per se until the latter part of the movie which had more of an emphasis on fighting. Thanks for making this video and I hope to see more cool content from you :)
Yeah, the shintani style is my favorite, it stays true to toriyamas manga artwork
Maybe the least favourite style of all.
It have literally nothing in common with Toriyama's works, and of course no any with the OG series.
It's just bad One Piece design poorly mimicking Dragon Ball and thinking that dirty lineart was THE reason of why OG designs are so good, that it was the whole point, instead of something else.
Everything done wrong basically.
@@SuperSaiyanDate The new designs don't come without mistake like for some characters it makes them look a bit too young but I think it's fine, it's no failure. These designs where made with animation in mind so being accurate to the manga it's portraying isn't the #1 priority. In addition it is an original animation so it doesn't matter that much, as long as it looks fine in motion.
@@wormHD every design made with animation in mind.
To be accurate to the OG is the #1 priority.
What is "original animation" suppose to mean? It's not a fanmade.
It not looks fine in motion too.
It's original in the sense that the specific storyline doesn't not have a manga counterpart to go off of. I believe you are too used to very angular designs and every character having defined muscles, I can appreciate that but that's not the only thing I like.
The last saga of the original DB to the Frieza saga, that was peak Toriyama art.
Edit: Guys, I'm obviously talking about the manga, not anime lol
Buu saga vegeta is my favorite design :(
@@benthompson4911 Yeah, design, not art too much, the anime looked great though.
I feel like after super saiyans were introduced, dragon ball changed for the worse.
Awesome Fish Prince agreed. Power scaling as opposed to cleverness was emphasized
@@NobaraGamezzz Toriyama didn't really want to go past the Frieza Saga
Ive always liked how this worked out. I feel like his style changed as a reflection of their growth kinda too. Like goku's teen/20s he still had that roundish shape but it was also soemwhat square and as he grew with age and skill he became more stronger and his physique changed alot.
Definitely agree!
I think my favorite art style in the manga might be from the 23rd Budokai fight with Piccolo jr. to the end of the early Saiyan arc (1:44), right before things got a bit too angular. When just the body anatomy was rounder, but I do admit the angularity works the best in the Cell arc to convey the seriousness and intensity of the character's strength that probably wouldn't work with a rounded style. The characters do look cooler more angular but the square muscles do make the characters look a bit too stiff at times in base form. The higher forms being angular though makes sense.
While the Buu saga art in the anime looked amazing, the manga, not so much.
@@jasonone8726 that might be because Toriyama was burned out by that point
@@hoodedmullet8194 This, though it’s not something exclusive to Dragon Ball as YHH and Naruto had similar issues near the end.
@@jasonone8726 the buu saga Manga ver looked the same like the first volume ver.
@@mrsavage4837 No it didn't, you can see the the obvious difference.
Personally im the biggest fan of the rounder art, not the super early version but like mid-DB to early Z
Especially Mr.Satan, his design use to be very muscular tall gut with a small head,, and now he's skinny with a big head
All styles still looked really cool
0:06
So that's where Jiren got his design from.🤔
lol 😂
I literally almost died because of laughing to this comment
Those were the reasons why the artstyle at large changed, but there were additional reasons why certain characters were changed so much through the story. For example, when Vegeta was first introduced he was extremely short and noticeably less muscular, even though he was already like 30 and had been in many battles. The reason for this was because he wasn't originally meant to join the main cast. He was just going to be the villian of the Saiyan saga, and then a reluctant (but still evil) ally during Namek. Once Frieza killed him, that was supposed to be it, he was not going to revive. However, because the character became so popular with the fanbase, Toriyama eventually decided to bring him back, and since he was going to become one of the "heroes", Toriyama realized he had to give him a more...appealing general design. This is why Vegeta suddenly grew over a head taller and became a lot more muscular in later sagas.
This is also the root of several people's assumption that "Toriyama hates Vegeta" because he doesn't give him the same amount of spotlight as Goku. No, the reason had nothing to do with hate, and more to do with the fact that since he created him with the intent of simply being a temporary villian, he wasn't keen on suddenly having to give this former villian the same attention and spotlight as Goku and Gohan (who were both always planned to be the at the center).
Toriayama later went to say that Vegeta became a very "useful" character to have around, for better or worse, and considering how unimportant the character was originally going to be, I'd say he's given Vegeta far more attention and love that most people realize.
Attention yes, love? Hell no
I never knew that about Toriyama's intention with the Vegeta character. Good thing vegeta stuck around because he was likely an influence for other shonen characters like Sasuke
Small correction, Vegeta was originally only meant to be in the Saiyan saga and killed off there, not Namek saga.
@@jasv49 Vegeta’s not deserving of THAT much love…
@@jasv49 I mean, he got bulma, a son, and had one of the best character arcs in dragon ball.
I think toriyama gave him some much needed love.
The way Toriyama change and evolved his art style to make Dragon Ball very different from Dr. Slump and again for the Z portion when series shift to a much more serious tone highlights his skills as an Artist.
That side by side comparison of movie 7 and 8 blew my mind
I think Toriyama's old style is the best. Especially the Cell saga one. I can't believe YT didn't show me this notification
Man I reallyike that art of Vegeta SSJ on the thumbnail.
Toriyama art style is da best
Toyotarou artstyle is pitiable
@@hunterkudo9832 uhhh toyotaros artsyle is amazing just not his writing.
@@jamesb3623 no I used to think it was good, but after seeing some fanwork, even his artstyle is meh
@@jamesb3623 for a guy drawing manga on the monthly, his stuff is awesome. Love his gestures and dynamic poses. I just wish there was more world building in super so that we can see toyotaro's way of drawing other alien cultures and environments. My only big irk with him is his line weight being the same all the time.
@@tonyg196 Yeah his lines totes could improve but hes got time to improve, But his writing is like a seesaw his idea always get me excited but the delivery mostly always disappoints.
I’d like to see an evolution of Toyotaro video where we overview how much he had improved over the decade.
Fans: We dont like the square lines
Toriyama: *I forgot the part where thats my problem*
Am I the only one who prefers the older, rounder art style that was consistent through the original Dragon Ball and beginning of DBZ?
Bro I love yur vids, like I literally feel the same way about newer art styles
🤢🤮
Had no idea Goku's neck grew longer over time, unless he was just hunched in one panel and was standing straight in the other.
I’d say my favorite look had to be Namek Saga to early Android Saga. I felt the lines and edges felt like they’re weren’t to edgy like they ended up in the Buu saga and I also prefer the original Super Saiyan color pallet. More white hot yellow with a magma looking aura than sunflower yellow and a more electric looking aura.
It felt like that nice middle ground between OG DB style and the more edgy look we got from Buu to GT.
The Super Saiyan hair was white looking, throughout of the whole DBZ anime.
Fans should never butt into the manga, let the artist tell the story their way and how they want to tell it, you're just the fan
I always really loved the artstyle from around the time 23rd budokai came around. That Goku vs Piccolo fight was the peak of Dragon Ball for me, both in the narrative and the style.
The art was still good after that but post saiyan arc it was never as good as it was before
@@justatoaster7476 *Post Frieza arc
Yes Goku vs Piccolo Jr was peak art style.
Artists tend to hate doing the same thing. Drawing the same way, keeing the same tone.
Evolving Art style and maturing the art are definately noticeable with Dragon balls continuation. Though going from soft to sharp is easy by any means, but does help show how much has changed over the years as both the narrative changes with the art! Thank you again for this awesome info and the reveal behind the magic!
Sorry meant isn't not 'is' easy
This video answered a question I didn't know I had.
I just love the classic style from the beginning of the manga. So good...
I can tell any of Toriyama's styles immediately as soon as I see it, no matter what. That's pretty iconic.
such an excellent and informative channel. super cool to see a broader look at DB's artstyle through the years
great work as always
Glad you enjoy it man!
Totally agree
@@forgottenrelics1197 Besides the way the characters are drawn; do you notice a difference in how everything else is drawn? For examples: infrastructure (buildings, bridges, roads, homes), nature (mountains, bodies of water, forestry, climate zones), and other miscellaneous things like animals, atmosphere, planets, ki blast? I notice in the movies the art work is drawn from various point of views, angles, positions and distances where the characters are placed at or of it's a shot of the environmental setting in comparison to the anime. Even the scaling(sizing) is drastically different. In the movies I get a sense of how huge something is compared to other things like how enormous the tree from the Tree Of Might is, Dr. Wheelo's lair, Lord Slug, or the monster from movie 13. Even the Spirit Bomb from movie 8 compared to the Namek one looks bigger and felt more impactful.
The 80s anime asthetic in DragonBall and early arcs on DragonBall Z are more interesting to look at. After the 80s age was over anime toned down the violence and blood and started compensating on cooler and cleaner designs for the characters.
I love seeing mangaka's art evolve through the years. Just going through my collection of manga and looking at the early chapters to the more recent one, it's inspiring to look at because they show so much progress with their art. Inoue's Slam Dunk is a great example. By the end of the series you see so much what we expect from his incredible artwork
I’ve always felt there were pros/cons for every art style from the different animators they’ve utilized over the years. My personal favorite is probably /Android and Cell saga, I enjoy the paler more whiteish SSJ hair. I also like the OG Broly movie as well as Cooler, the Buu saga wasn’t bad either.
Awesome job, breaking down the art style of dragon ball can't wait to see more video's from you.👍👍👍
More to come!
The Manga is beautiful, but I love the way the anime looks on the Buu Arc as well
same :)
@@forgottenrelics1197 💙
Cell and buu saga had the best art and designs. I don't know what they were thinking in super. The art style was so bad in that
These videos are always fun. I enjoy looking at the art, and learning about why it looks the way it does.
The SS2 drawing style during the Majin Vegeta arc is one of my favorites of all time.
Great video as always and thanks for shout out👌
No problem :)
it's a clear refinement of style. It's an extremely common thing with Japanese mangakas. Eye Shield, Yu yu Hakusho, Grappler Baki, Berserk, Dragon Ball, Slam Dunk, Ranma, City Hunter, Claymore etc. all started off looking different, but gradually the art improved/changed as the artist continue to refine their style. Not just mangakas, anybody who does art can relate to this.
Tbf I wouldn't really agree that baki improved the art style in any way, the early art is so much damn better than what it morphed into
Dragon Ball's art style changed so much simply because that's how Toriyama was evolving to be. It happens to most artists throughout their career.
Just from the thumbnail you can see vegetas neck went from being under his chin to behind his ears, everyone got huge necks and traps
If we trained like him at 450x gravity maybe we would too
He's in ascended ssj right there
This inadvertently gave more insight as to how the story telling of Dragonball changed as well. Both the pros and cons. Like I knew Toriyama didn't really plan it all out but he did enjoy thinking of the story at one point.
5:30
And after that some people STILL shows their ignorance claiming "Dragon Ball" to be "the father of the cliches and stereotypes", when it is literally breaking all of the cliches and stereotypes and it's story is even more relevant today considering how it achieved maybe the most interesting shonen story, which almost even no any modern shonen can achieve to this day.
Misconceptions like that are born from people going off what people say on the internet or people who know the series on a surface level, OR having no lt rewatch it for a long time and obscuring what they remember.
Also careful what you say when saying "most interesting Shonen" Cause you'll attract the One piece and Hxh mob crowd. Personally I agree with you though
I always loved saiyan/frieza saga vegeta desgin the most he's got that old school iconic look to him
0:11 is something that nobody seems to adress. It is the SSJ look. It was NOT only the Animators who did change their artstyle but also Toriyama. The moment where Goku mastered the full ssj his hair looked different. Look at 0:11 left is ssj unmastered (he used it against frieza and c19), right is the full mastered one (he looks like that after leaving the time chamber).
I know this because my parents didn‘t allow me to watch dbz, so I just bought the manga. This different ssj look was something that I noticed as a child.
For years, I thought the difference was just a stylistic change, I wasn't aware that it was because of mastered SSJ.
I’m so sorry they did such a life-threatening decision to you.
Nobody deserves to be taken away from such a great kingdom of story
@@bm1343 It had the advantages tho. I know perfectly what scenes are canon and what not since I read the manga multiple times.
The later artstyle looks really cool,but the old ones makes characters feel unique and animation more fluid
That was all very interesting , especially for me working in 2 anime projects ( in story )
one of my fav vids from you besides the coloring/shading one. the why is the most valuable for me
Thanks man, I'm glad you found it interesting :)
Great work as always bro!!!
I think Piccolo Jr. Saga through the Saiyan Saga was the best artstyle the series ever had.
The Buu Saga art style is amazing!
Very informative, thanks for this vid!
This is this video I’ve always wanted to see. When I first got into db this was the question i always had. So thanks 😎
Great video. I think this basically illustrates that Toribot is essentially a genius. A lazy troll genius. Little planning, desire to piss off the fans, and a constant quest for doing less work... and from that we got DB. However he's changed from the height of his powers 30 years ago, in his prime his talent was enormous.
On a personal opinion as some who dislikes the rounder style (including the Shintani roundness) what I like about the manga's evolving style is it makes the characters look like they are aging. It's natural for kids and even teens to have some "baby fat" and it's not until the early to mid 20s that most people kind of hit their "adult" form and even then there's a more subtle process that goes on. For me the manga kind of evokes that change and I appreciate it.
I've always thought DBZ looked it's best during the Buu Arc. Now I know who to thank.
But at the same time I love Toriyama's Dr. Slump-style. It's nostalgic for me.
It looked it's best, in the anime, manga Buu saga art, was the worst.
I like GT the best, it's like a natural evolution of that style
loved it every step of the way. noticing these things only kept the creative juices flowing. 👍
i like how the style changes over time. and a particular style calls back to that particular era and story line in your mind.
Thanks for the video! cheers!
I just thought since everyone was training so hard they needed people to look more swol
Rest in peace Akira Toriyama ❤
Answers a lot of questions I had so thank you for making this! Also confirms what I suspected in my adulthood as I learned about character design: Toriyama loves Goku so much as a character he'll do unpredictable and chaotic things but not to hurt his beloved character. Funny how a second character can do that to you isn't it when everyone assumes it's the first.
give me end of DB/early DBZ/Raditz saga through Frieza any damn day. peak animation. just my fav
Nice vid, great idea to look at why they style changed so much.
I definitely feel like the anime adapted to the angular style better than Toriyama did (after a point it stopped looking intentional, and just like he was burnt out imo). That’s going by the decent animators though - Uchiyama obviously didn’t handle the change as well as the likes of Shimanuki.
Yeah there was a decent amount of chapters in the Buu arc where the artwork was certainly simple but it was more so burnout playing a role. And even in GT Uchiyama's style was still lagging years behind haha. Although I personally don't mind Shimanuki's Buu arc style, perhaps not my favourite style of that era but it's good :)
@@forgottenrelics1197 oh yeah, I meant to say that Uchiyama didn’t adapt as well as Shimanuki did. Shimanuki produced some of the best looking scenes in the Boo arc, as far as I’m concerned.
It’s a shame that we didn’t see Yamamuro and Nakatsuru provide much key animation for the arc though, they had the cleanest styles of the era imo. As much as the movies of the era look excellent, part of me wishes Toei had let the animators focus on the anime a bit more.
Luv this channel, always wanted someone to do a breakdown about the designs and style.
It gave some "realism" to this anime.
Starting young and fresh to buffed up and nice looking, powerfull like hell
I was so memorised by the beautiful drawings that I absolutely couldn't concentrate on the narration.
Very nice video. I see the point from Toriyama's side, but I infinitely prefer the drawing style and overall stories pre-DBZ, precisely because it had that road-trip feel, the world was kind of a magical place and characters were so different and interesting.
My favorite style is classic, up to the Saiyan saga. Vegeta looked the best there.
Love these analysis vids🔥🔥🔥
thanks as always bro!
@@forgottenrelics1197 Np!! Rlly a God When it comes to Discussing Anime art styles 🔥
Absolutely loved the cell saga art style
Your content is very good. You need to upload at least 1 video per week and try to do more than just Dragon Ball. I am sure your channel will grow amazingly in 6 months.
When I used to read Dragon Ball as a kid the change in artwork felt like a natural transition, the growth of the characters were visible in a sense I allways thought it was genious. Toriyama made history.
It might not have fit aesthetically with the way the rest of the series panned out, but I absolutely love the art style that DBZ season 1 had. It was so unique, rounded, and it felt detailed but not to the point of comedy.
Maybe that was their way of showing how the characters got older and more mature.
Masaki Sato is the best of both worlds, he merges the old DB artstyle's idiosyncrasies with the angular DBZ style.
Amazing video brother
I think the best thing about the art style changing is that it shows how the characters progress. I loved that about it. So, it goes from rounded to more rigid and tough.
Can wait for that yamamuro part 2
Yeah man I plan to make it this week! Although over the weekend some more work came in so it may be uploaded a day later than usual or at worst I'll delay it to another week depending on how busy it all gets.
Hey my Instagram account is called M4RCUS and use should include it for the intro
I don't know how to tag so this is my only option
Whatever the art style was in DBS BROLY, that’s my favorite
I kinda agree with the old fans, it is too square, especially these days, was maybe best at the beginning of Z. If they did a mix of the two kinds of art, almost like Super: Broly was done. It would've been gorgeous
I personally love the old style it was beautiful
It’s probably because of maybe aging or something else like vegeta in sayian saga looked kind of small but in the cell saga or android saga he grew a little bit and same with krillon he looks pretty damn tall but don’t get me wrong he sure it’s just that he has a big ass head in the android saga
I vastly prefer the "square" style Toriyama adapted later on, even though I fell in love with the manga in the first 10 volumes, where it much more resembled Dr. Slump's style.
Wow this was a great informative video. Very "how was it made".
Fantastic video!
Lmao, that Stan edit did not go unappreciated. Funny ass shit.
love your vids man
cheers man!
Wow this is a pretty amazing video honestly. It explains so much about everything. The change between 7/8 movie isn’t something I think most people would notice unless you knew and were looking for it. Unlike the original DB and later DBZ where you can really tell. I do like the circular art though.
I enjoy art style change in anime and manga sometimes because we the fan get to see his skills as an artist evolve over time
I understand the purpose and his desire in shifting the art style but I'll always hold to that DBZ from the beginning up until when the Ginyu Force arrived was when the animation was at it's best. After that it declined. So much detail was lost for the sake of Toryiama wanting to convey and achieve a more serious tone and showing intensity in character emotions by simply changing the style. But I'll always like more detailed art instead. I feel like he could have still conveyed intensity and serious tone with detailed art, a skilled artist can do that. But whats done is and done and we are forever left with boxy less detailed art for the DB franchise now. DB Super Broly though was an artistic bonanza, the art was so detailed and amazing in that movie it almost felt like the old days.
I agree with you. Up until Ginyu was legendary
The art style was already different by ginyu force saga
@@user-rb2hg Not really, it was pretty consistent up until then but thats when we did start seeing the round eyes turn into those blocky ones. The detail was still there also but pretty much after that we started to see more shading and blocky body parts
@@Darth1Marik also goku seemed to be much taller compared to the vegeta saga
so as vegeta in the manga, he appears to be abit taller