Paul london shoots on joey mercury getting his face busted open during their 4 way ladder match

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  • Опубліковано 27 сер 2024
  • Paul london shoots on joey mercury getting his face busted open during their 4 way ladder match at armageddon ppv.
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    #paullondon #joeymercury #renedupree

КОМЕНТАРІ • 168

  • @alexanderson4497
    @alexanderson4497 2 роки тому +224

    I hated La Resistance as a kid, now as an adult I realize you guys were just good at what you did. Thank you for being part of my childhood!

    • @durden2480
      @durden2480 2 роки тому +9

      They did their job!

    • @1KingCoop
      @1KingCoop 2 роки тому +2

      They were definitely one of the coolest Heel stables that I've seen in WWE during that time. They knew how to work the crowd and get the crowds and hate them. Him, Rob conway, and Sylvan Grenier knew how to do their jobs well.

    • @timnavarrette6932
      @timnavarrette6932 2 роки тому +1

      Rene cool AF my brother and his friend meet them i Kansas City. My brother see the character outside the ring

    • @mickporter1488
      @mickporter1488 2 роки тому +1

      I hated Regal now you realise he was a quality heel.

    • @ChrisMS0815
      @ChrisMS0815 Рік тому

      Same, I used to think Renee Dupree was lame as hell for that dance he would do lol

  • @connorgouge5890
    @connorgouge5890 2 роки тому +125

    Renes face through that is like he's never heard a wrestling story ever , so much concentration 😂

    • @Toadsage77
      @Toadsage77 2 роки тому +23

      I totally agree. I find myself way more interested in the story, based on his expression.

    • @Urbanizemecapn
      @Urbanizemecapn 9 місяців тому +1

      Lmao

  • @TheZom1965
    @TheZom1965 2 роки тому +67

    Really enjoyed Paul’s interview. He seems like a really good guy and a straight shooter.

  • @UFCWWE69
    @UFCWWE69 2 роки тому +123

    Considering Matt was the guy literally holding Joey’s face in place for that spot, it’s so fucked up that he didn’t visit him afterwards with all the boys.

    • @Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa669
      @Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa669 2 роки тому +10

      Matt hit Joey with a dui hit and 🏃‍♂️

    • @HBKman1
      @HBKman1 2 роки тому +1

      @@Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa669 😂😂😂

    • @andrew8168
      @andrew8168 Рік тому +14

      Is Matt Hardy the guy Paul doesn't like?

    • @kittenmask
      @kittenmask Рік тому

      @@andrew8168 ua-cam.com/video/IjWbw3G9coI/v-deo.html

    • @Ted_Sheckler
      @Ted_Sheckler Рік тому +6

      Matt wasn't "literally holding Joey's face". Nitro wasn't busted open, because he protected himself. Mercury didn't even put his hand up to protect himself. You make it sound like it's Matt's fault.

  • @Wolfenstein731music
    @Wolfenstein731music 2 роки тому +55

    Lol, you were a champion, Rene, you got money, get a damn lamp.

    • @dieselgonzalington6691
      @dieselgonzalington6691 2 роки тому +10

      I thought the same thing cuz this was the first interview i started watching of his lol but his other interviews are more well lit!

    • @durden2480
      @durden2480 2 роки тому

      🤣

  • @TheMistahWooseNetwork
    @TheMistahWooseNetwork 2 роки тому +64

    Joey Mercury getting his face busted open was gruesome!

  • @jamiedoran9442
    @jamiedoran9442 Рік тому +7

    Love Paul London but Brian Kendrick and Paul London is the most underrated tag team of all time

    • @creases7
      @creases7 8 місяців тому +1

      Either them or The Beverly Brothers

  • @riffsandwich9541
    @riffsandwich9541 2 роки тому +12

    I really appreciate that Paul is a crazy athlete high flyer type that still appreciates psychology.

  • @ThaoLand
    @ThaoLand 2 роки тому +28

    I remember doing the French tickler dance all the time in front of my cousin because he hated La Resistance 🤣

  • @EliteEasyE
    @EliteEasyE 2 роки тому +21

    Love the psychology these boys added to the ladder match

  • @1KingCoop
    @1KingCoop 2 роки тому +13

    When Joey Mercury got his face busted on that ladder I felt so bad for him. I remember watching that pay-per-view too I was like 13 or 14 I think and I knew that wasn't part of the script or anything. He's was such a good wrestler too but, I feel like that is all he's going to be remembered for and I hate that because he had some great matches and other promotions as well as in WWE.

  • @Eric-ew8jt
    @Eric-ew8jt 2 роки тому +36

    I literally just watched this video! You know I never understood how some people think wrestling fake . I mean yes it’s predetermined but when you get body slammed, you’re getting thrown to the ground by another monster of a man. I had an old roommate always talking about the fake wrestling I liked to watch , I double legged him and slapped him in the Kurt Angle Ankle lock lol asking him as he screamed “Is this fake “ thanks Renee enjoy your Sunday

    • @brandonconner1416
      @brandonconner1416 2 роки тому +15

      You can definitely get hurt wrestling. I don't understand when people say wrestling is fake, but then they freak out about a movie. They don't criticize Vin Diesel for fake driving a car

    • @tylermcnally8232
      @tylermcnally8232 2 роки тому

      @@brandonconner1416 people... are... dumb. That's why. They barely have a grasp on the english language and do not know how to be objective in their opinions or definitions.

    • @daytonabeachUSA
      @daytonabeachUSA 2 роки тому +2

      @@brandonconner1416 probably because vin diesel isn’t in his underpants…

    • @brandonconner1416
      @brandonconner1416 2 роки тому +3

      @@daytonabeachUSA doesn't really go with the point I was making. Funny though

    • @brandonconner1416
      @brandonconner1416 2 роки тому

      @@ocsjc13 what did I spin? What the fuck are you confused about

  • @edallen1921
    @edallen1921 2 роки тому +16

    Christian York!! Forgot about that dude completely, i saw him and mercury at Maryland Championship Wrestling a BUNCH of times in the late 90s, i remember when i saw mercury show up with morrison and melina, i got so excited. I wish i could’ve appreciated this era of stars more than i did at the time.

    • @justint8635
      @justint8635 2 роки тому +1

      I went to a few MCW shows in 2002-2003 and saw York & Matthews there after ECW. So good. Christian York was definitely underrated. I think it was a missed opportunity that someone like a TNA never gave him a shot till way later in his career.

    • @morgancarini1130
      @morgancarini1130 2 роки тому +1

      same here, i got to see Joey Matthews back in 2003 at a MCW show, I remember seeing Mickie James as Alexis Laree and Danny Doring on the same card. We also had Lita show up as a guest appearance while she was out with a neck injury. I know Lita had some training done there earlier in her career

    • @justint8635
      @justint8635 2 роки тому

      @@morgancarini1130 ha we probably went to some of the same shows. I still have a couple old programs that were signed. I know Laree/James was one of em because I remember talking to her. Good times!

  • @JesusSaves80
    @JesusSaves80 2 роки тому +7

    Paul should do voice over or some kind of voice acting telling stories he really puts you into it.

  • @redwood9992
    @redwood9992 9 місяців тому +3

    paul london seems like a legit good dude that you can just hang out with and shoot the shit about wrestling & i think thats part of the reason why i rooted for him after he went back to being a solo act after kidman turned heel on him. He was a good performer and sadly thats why he got so much heat with some of the guys backstage because he knew his shit & he never put on a fake persona while he was there. imo another guy wwe didnt deserve

  • @JustJefferson
    @JustJefferson Рік тому +3

    Good story, Long story, but every so often I look at the screen and can’t help but notice Rene locked in. 🤣 Not interrupting or talking over others, just tuned in. Cracks me up. Good stuff.

  • @FlyinLionQuinn
    @FlyinLionQuinn 2 роки тому +6

    I wish we got to see Matt Hardy vs Paul London settle their differences in the ring

  • @robertwarf3316
    @robertwarf3316 Рік тому +3

    "in the backyard of... other backyarders" I love how Paul never says a certain someone's name but you always know who he's talking about.

  • @joshx022
    @joshx022 2 роки тому +5

    I remember watching that show with my buddy and I was like "that hit mercury" and my buddy laughed at me....then mercury showed his face. He gave me cred in that room as an analyst lmao..

  • @acamp8255
    @acamp8255 2 роки тому +5

    I still have that on DVD Armageddon 06’ 🔥

  • @juggalohiphopemporiummore7134
    @juggalohiphopemporiummore7134 2 роки тому +5

    Great podcast congratulations on getting over one million views so quickly

  • @basedlordk5416
    @basedlordk5416 2 роки тому +9

    It’s crazy how I just found this podcast, my favorite by far I’ve heard has definitely been Paul. Renee was by far one of the best heels in the WWE I hated him and FiFi as a kid lmao. Like how dare a man have a poodle!!!!!! 😂😂😂 Paul was amazing too him and Brian were my favorite tag as a kid and when Paul went solo for a bit it was sick lol. I had his Wrestling action figure and he’d always be my WWE champion (Spinner belt) 😂

  • @robkearsy2995
    @robkearsy2995 2 роки тому +3

    Oh man I remember this match cause London & Kendrick were a great high flying tag team.

  • @EliteEasyE
    @EliteEasyE 2 роки тому +12

    I really wanted a substantial Hooliganz and Regal and Taylor match. The match on Smackdown was way too short.

  • @0newingedcrow
    @0newingedcrow 4 місяці тому

    Going off when Paul said Regal's facial expressions are second to none; one of my all time favorites was the Duchess of Queensberry rules match from Backlash 2001. Regal is on the floor outside the ring, hunched over the apron and takes a baseball slide from Jericho. The kick spins Regal and sends him face first into the crotch of the Duchess who is sitting in her throne at ringside.
    The crowd pops, JR and Heyman are selling like crazy on commentary, and Regal jumps off of her and practically out of his skin as he stands there shivering with this great look of horror and shame on his face!
    Nobody could have done it any better! Absolutely no one!!!

  • @tidesofsulfurcb
    @tidesofsulfurcb 2 роки тому +1

    Paul London is talking about Chris Marvel at 8.04; the guy broke his femur, his leg broke so badly, his foot was facing the other way.

  • @Captinfun101
    @Captinfun101 6 місяців тому

    I had the pleasure of meeting Paul at a wrestle for rotary ( Australian fundraising club) in a backwards no name town in country Victoria Australia. He had a match with Rob Conway as main event . Even though it was basically a bingo hall event they did a great show and stayed around at the end to meet and greet as well as signing autographs. Both top guys .

  • @fredtheonly1
    @fredtheonly1 Рік тому +1

    I enjoy this channel so much! Keep em comin!!

  • @christian31Eagles
    @christian31Eagles 6 місяців тому +1

    armageddon 06 was the first ppv i ever watched as a kid. i loved that ladder match. regal and taylor being in it was out of place.

  • @HilltopperTA
    @HilltopperTA Рік тому +7

    Damn I'm really impressed by Paul London after this interview. Seems to really know the business.

  • @louisschallhorn4528
    @louisschallhorn4528 2 роки тому +4

    I agree so much with Paul! Just make it make sense

  • @JokerThaToker
    @JokerThaToker 2 роки тому +9

    This is probably the fourth clips I’ve seen from Rene’s podcast with Paul London. Holy fuck Paul loves to hear himself talk.

    • @ishmael802
      @ishmael802 2 роки тому +20

      So do you if you listening to 4 clips lol

    • @TheBigBopper443
      @TheBigBopper443 2 роки тому +14

      He was invited to do a shoot interview to talk lmfao

    • @JokerThaToker
      @JokerThaToker 2 роки тому +2

      Just rambles on aimlessly.

    • @saulramirez6117
      @saulramirez6117 2 роки тому

      Yea no shit pal he was in the freaking match... dumb

    • @mikeawesome9212
      @mikeawesome9212 6 місяців тому

      Atleast it's interesting, his stories always have my attention. I like when the guest can talk without being interrupted. Stop watching if you have such an issue.

  • @patrickboian8545
    @patrickboian8545 2 роки тому +2

    That match was crazy and it was on a great show.

  • @screamingbaboon664
    @screamingbaboon664 2 роки тому +1

    Bloody hell James, do you have to SCREAM like that on that ad at the beginning? 🧐🧐 You'll give yourself a hernia mate

  • @wvu9787
    @wvu9787 2 роки тому +3

    Lol Rene looking like Dexter Loomis with that stare. 😆 3:14

  • @forgottenmma3694
    @forgottenmma3694 2 роки тому +19

    Matt Hardy was jealous Paul London got the baddest chick in the WWE back in 2007. I would have put Ashley > Torrie Wilson back in the day.

    • @dxfifa
      @dxfifa 2 роки тому +1

      Lmao she was fake as fuck. Mickie James and Maria >>>

    • @codyjohnson8959
      @codyjohnson8959 2 роки тому +7

      Matt Hardy dated her before Paul did.

    • @maxito561
      @maxito561 2 роки тому +5

      Lmao I was wondering who he was talking about. Sounds like there was nuclear heat all around during the Ruthless Aggression Era.

  • @DjCp3o420
    @DjCp3o420 2 роки тому +6

    Rene's Thoughts on the Hardy boys?

  • @killuminati3034
    @killuminati3034 2 роки тому +1

    French tickling sob is a funny line from big money hustlers

  • @derekhawkcherokeefire
    @derekhawkcherokeefire 2 роки тому +3

    Osiyo/Cherokee for hello 🤘 I remember that moment in front of my TV when Joey got that injury. One of a kind Holy Freaking Shit moment. All I could think is how bad that had to hurt. 🤘🤘🔥

  • @blackadam6445
    @blackadam6445 6 місяців тому

    La resistance at wrestlemania 20! Remember that match Renee I just watched it last night. The one with Booker and RVD when they had a run

  • @killuminati3034
    @killuminati3034 2 роки тому +10

    Paul was under appreciated

    • @justsomeoldyoutuber6093
      @justsomeoldyoutuber6093 2 роки тому

      Nah he is not, when you complain for so long until your hair is grey, you deserve to be ridiculed for being a talentless acrobat with no personality. Stop giving credit to people who don’t deserve it when there have been others before him, even smaller, that had better personalities aka Rey Mysterio

  • @carolynbuckley8733
    @carolynbuckley8733 2 роки тому +8

    This dude is a legend in his own mind. If you were never anything special because WWE did not know how to use you I have one question.... what did you do after you left that stands out. Take your time I'll wait

    • @aleeking2602
      @aleeking2602 2 роки тому +4

      He did this part and can agree he never did anything mainstream hes just a good dude that didnt need to bury ppl .

    • @angelr.7754
      @angelr.7754 Рік тому +1

      ​@@aleeking2602 and that is when obscurity comes in. Hey I would love if everyone was a cool, humble, down to earth person, but reality is the rude, loud, shit talking people are the ones that draw in a crowd and doing shitty things to good people is what gets you to the top. it's a cold world out there and you better grab your coat.

  • @ayyachris
    @ayyachris 2 роки тому +7

    The initial guy? Is he talking about Matt? Or someone else?

    • @AlanJ1993
      @AlanJ1993 2 роки тому +4

      Yeah Matt, They both dated Ashley Massaro if i recall and Matt was weird about it.

    • @ECW5320
      @ECW5320 2 роки тому +6

      @@AlanJ1993 From what I've read Ashley cheated on Matt with Paul, then Matt tried to bury Paul to WWE management.

    • @forgottenmma3694
      @forgottenmma3694 2 роки тому +3

      Paul has beef with both Joey Mercury and Matt Hardy. But I think he is referring to Matt here.

    • @forgottenmma3694
      @forgottenmma3694 2 роки тому

      @@ECW5320 I thought the story here was Paul London pulled Ashley first and Matt Hardy was jelouse and then stooged to the Office about Ashley’s opportunity with Survivor on CBS

    • @ECW5320
      @ECW5320 2 роки тому +5

      @@forgottenmma3694 Matt dated Ashley after his breakup with Lita in 05, then she dated London in 06.
      Rumor is that she cheated on Matt once she managed London; there's an old message board about a report regarding her and Matt arguing about her alleged infidelity.
      What's London's beef with Mercury?

  • @sebastiendorion4742
    @sebastiendorion4742 2 роки тому +6

    Really love Paul’s insight 🤌 good job to you 3

  • @sons714native4
    @sons714native4 Рік тому

    Renee captivated by Paul’s storytelling

  • @rileykazama3145
    @rileykazama3145 2 роки тому +2

    I remember seeing the spot on UA-cam it looked like something from mortal kombat

    • @cafederene
      @cafederene  2 роки тому +1

      Fatality

    • @rileykazama3145
      @rileykazama3145 2 роки тому

      @@cafederene in mk3 Jeff hardy wins flawless victory fatally

    • @rileykazama3145
      @rileykazama3145 2 роки тому +1

      @@cafederene in mk3 Jeff hardy wins flawless victory fatally

  • @brodyjames4126
    @brodyjames4126 7 місяців тому

    Paul is fun to listen to talk.

  • @taylorgriffing641
    @taylorgriffing641 2 роки тому +3

    Damn man it's like pulling teeth .

  • @Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa669
    @Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa669 2 роки тому +1

    Why they never had more investment in cruiserweight or do a ladder match or 6.

  • @insanesundew5105
    @insanesundew5105 2 роки тому +7

    Who did Paul London not like?

    • @cafederene
      @cafederene  2 роки тому +26

      V1

    • @insanesundew5105
      @insanesundew5105 2 роки тому +13

      @@cafedereneAhh okay the “Woken” one

    • @jesseforce9933
      @jesseforce9933 2 роки тому +12

      I was look through the comments to see if anybody needed to know it was Matt Hardy.
      I think he said it was because Matt's dorky and was jealous of him dating Ashley Massaro. RIP

    • @ishmael802
      @ishmael802 2 роки тому +1

      Why did he hate Matt?

    • @theragoooverlord5021
      @theragoooverlord5021 2 роки тому +2

      I remember that video pl put out where he was making fun of Matt's coke nostril plus his motivational talks. That would have been like 12 years ago now.

  • @codesm96
    @codesm96 2 роки тому +3

    So sad to hear about this...typical I never knew just how selfish VEEEEEEEEE WAAAANAAAAAH was not visiting Joey in the hospital lol

  • @dirwin9599
    @dirwin9599 10 місяців тому +1

    There was a very short period where I did blame Matt I don’t anymore, if you watch the match closely Matt didn’t hold anyone’s face anywhere. He was holding their heads but when Jeff was right about to land or right when he landed Matt moved his arms back away and at that point nitro and mercury were supposed to cover up and only one did. Joey knew what to do and didn’t do it. It was a freak accident. Thankfully Joey made it through it but at the end of the day it’s not Matt or Jeff’s fault.

  • @diptardwithabigheart2916
    @diptardwithabigheart2916 2 роки тому +1

    Any memories of Volocity

  • @bbcc2286
    @bbcc2286 2 роки тому +1

    Should get Mercury on

  • @themadviking5746
    @themadviking5746 Рік тому

    We were watching that PPV back in the day and rite after he took that hit to the face , I belted out now watch him get fired and not long after he did .

  • @leonsimsek9769
    @leonsimsek9769 Рік тому +1

    Who didnt Show up in the Hospital To Look After Mercury ?

  • @DjCp3o420
    @DjCp3o420 2 роки тому +3

    Rugged injury 🤕

  • @italianplastic23
    @italianplastic23 8 днів тому

    but wouldn't it be the fault of the cameraman if someone is caught peeking for their cue?.....its not really a big deal anyway

  • @brokentablespodcast
    @brokentablespodcast 2 роки тому +2

    This is still listed as the worst injury I have seen at a show. Did you happen to have any bad blood with The Wizard Known as Chris Jericho Joey?

  • @WAFFLEZZ_92
    @WAFFLEZZ_92 2 роки тому +8

    He hated matt hardy because london was dating ashley massaro and matt hardy was jealous

    • @ShabbsArt
      @ShabbsArt 2 роки тому

      is Matt hardy the one he had beef with? and that was why? lol

    • @mysonandme8424
      @mysonandme8424 2 роки тому

      he didn't hate matt just cuz matt was jealous. one can be jealous of someone and still get along with 'em. he has said matt was doing assholish things because he was jealous. that's just how paul perceived it, tho. maybe matt was being assholy, maybe he wasn't. if matt was engaging in assholishness, maybe it was because he was jealous, maybe it wasn't. what i'm trying to say is...gang gang, baby.

  • @sleazyfellow
    @sleazyfellow 2 роки тому +2

    I didn't know he was hurt? Dude what? His face ballooned up and was bleeding profusely following the spot.

  • @dirtyyfendi
    @dirtyyfendi 2 роки тому +4

    Why does paul not like matt hardy?

    • @forgottenmma3694
      @forgottenmma3694 2 роки тому +3

      I heard Paul London dated the hottest Diva in 2007 and Matt was jealous and tried to ruin their relationship

    • @forgottenmma3694
      @forgottenmma3694 2 роки тому

      @Michael Roelle London did date Ashley Massero. Look up her playboy and tell me thats gae. Lol

    • @forgottenmma3694
      @forgottenmma3694 2 роки тому

      @Michael Roelle Lol you clearly don’t know about UA-cam Shadow banning comments for little “insensitive phrases”. Anyways your welcome introduced you to Ashley massero. She hot.

    • @Hellythep
      @Hellythep 2 роки тому +1

      @@forgottenmma3694 rip

  • @raymondmorrison8968
    @raymondmorrison8968 2 роки тому +2

    We get it matt stole your girl lol

  • @ssilva872
    @ssilva872 2 роки тому +2

    I can't believe Matt didn't visit Joey in the hospital!
    I mean Paul said only he didn't show up so that means Jeff did so why didn't they go together?

  • @samiam7342
    @samiam7342 2 роки тому +1

    when they show the spot where joey got injured - Renee laughs out loud.......................not cool.

  • @mcgokoro6343
    @mcgokoro6343 2 роки тому +1

    I remember when that happen led I was in 3rd grade that was gruesome

  • @Lishen-rh8mp
    @Lishen-rh8mp 6 місяців тому

    Was it Jeff that Paul did not like lol

  • @clearlyblurry508
    @clearlyblurry508 2 роки тому

    V1 wasn't at the hospital... was Brother Nero there?

  • @juggalohiphopemporiummore7134
    @juggalohiphopemporiummore7134 2 роки тому +1

    Cyber warfare 💯

  • @Thathorrorguy12FU
    @Thathorrorguy12FU Рік тому

    He's gotta be talking about John Morrison

    • @NycUncutRaw
      @NycUncutRaw Рік тому

      John Morrison a backyard wrestler? Think harder

  • @You-Tube-FBI
    @You-Tube-FBI Рік тому +1

    Get to the point. Guy trying to sound like he is bret hart.

  • @seanmcintyre5936
    @seanmcintyre5936 5 місяців тому

    Have y’all ever seen the podcast clip of Matt Hardy explaining what happened here? Sounds like a total douche and blamed the whole thing on Joey himself

  • @Brando-Lee3725
    @Brando-Lee3725 Рік тому

    Whatever happened to York ? I like him and Matthews as a team . But where did York go ? Did he just quit the biz ? I liked him a lot . I thought after ECW closed they were gonna be a big team somewhere else . Next thing I know MnM was a team ! So where is my boy Christian York ????

  • @GenesisXTRM
    @GenesisXTRM 2 роки тому +1

    Who does he have beef with?

  • @misterkrogan8837
    @misterkrogan8837 2 роки тому +1

    Who is it Paul didn't like?

  • @supernik6569
    @supernik6569 Рік тому

    who does london hate?

  • @ashleybrown8837
    @ashleybrown8837 Рік тому

    wait paul london is not english ??

    • @mattj222
      @mattj222 5 місяців тому

      🤣🤣🤣🤣

  • @Myling_And_The_Machine
    @Myling_And_The_Machine 6 місяців тому

    Dude, could you talk any slower?

  • @Robocoppat
    @Robocoppat 2 роки тому

    HE'S TALKING ABOUT MATT AND JEFF HARDY!

  • @williamschaeffer409
    @williamschaeffer409 2 роки тому

    whos paul talking about he didnt like in the match? 🤔

    • @jamesb1988
      @jamesb1988 2 роки тому +1

      Fatt Hardy, master of the Twist of Weight. He will not diet!

    • @bigdaddy0614
      @bigdaddy0614 2 роки тому +1

      @@jamesb1988 How has your wrestling career been?.. Oh yeah, armchair jobber

    • @jamesb1988
      @jamesb1988 2 роки тому +1

      @@bigdaddy0614 Oh great, you're one of those "you haven't done it so you can't criticize" people... tell me, was the Italian cruise ship captain that sailed too close to the shore and ran a ground a bad captain? According to you he's not, because you and I have never been cruise ship captains.
      See how goddamn retarded that logic is now?