I see your point about it being a gangster film. In the 1920s-set American television production, "Boardwak Empire" there is a sequence involving the civil war and there is a character who I think is based on De Valera. In looks, anyway.
After recieving your comment, I looked up the relevant section. Parititon is mentioned in the context of the treaty negotations (from circa 08:00). In that section of the video, I refer the Sinn Féin delegates being pressured to accept a 26 county free state while the 6 counties of Ulster would remain part of Great Britian. It is brief not particularly detailed. Which I am not very happy with in hindsight. I'm not quite sure I can explain why I do not go into detail either. I made this video six years ago. I think I was really aiming to keep my videos shorter at the time and that likely contributed to it. It is a topic that I think would be best covered in a full video. Which is something I might very well do.
I watched the movie the other day and I'm happy I found this great review. Liam Neeson is convincing and charismatic but I hated how Michael Collins basically gets whitewashed. The ruthlessness of the assassinations he orders is never adressed and when Kitty asks about it, he's just like "I wish I didn't have to kill people but I have to". So it's apparently okay to kill people for your cause provided you don't enjoy it. Regarding De Valera, I definitly think he was responsible for the civil war. Having negociated with Llyod George he knew that the Free Statr was the best outcome possible. The only reason why he rejected the Treaty is because it was not his own deal, but had he gone to London instead of Collins he would probably not have got better. Moreover, after he got power in 1932, De Valera showed that Collins was absolutely right with the whole "freedom to achieve freedom" thing. So was he an egocentric and a hypocrit ? Yes. But he wasn't the evil schemer portrayed by Alan Rickman either. I think he geniunely didn't plan to scapegoat Collins by sending him to London, and he definitly didn't want his death.
9:14 you dont mention how the british made him do it and how at first he refused to attack his former comerades in arms but churcill told him sort them out or we will do it for you. its not collins fault so much as the anti treaty ira
It is true that the British threatened to attack the Four Courts off the back of the assassinaiton of Henry Wilson. Although whether or not the Anti-Treaty IRA were responsible for Wilson's death is a matter of debate. There are suggestions Collins himself may have been responsible for ordering the killing.
The Irish did not come back from the delegations with an Irish Republic they came back the a subservient Irish Free State which was still part of the United Kingdom, the entire troubles regarding the 2 counties dates back to this agreement still today. Also It took several years before the Republic came about and it was this entire issue of subservience to the crown that started the civil war.
I see your point about it being a gangster film. In the 1920s-set American television production, "Boardwak Empire" there is a sequence involving the civil war and there is a character who I think is based on De Valera. In looks, anyway.
Very good sir!
6:19 roger hit the nail right on the head. the anti treaty ira killed the one person willing to work with them who sympathized with them
Pretty spectacular to talk about the treaty for like 5 minutes without even mentioning partition...
After recieving your comment, I looked up the relevant section. Parititon is mentioned in the context of the treaty negotations (from circa 08:00).
In that section of the video, I refer the Sinn Féin delegates being pressured to accept a 26 county free state while the 6 counties of Ulster would remain part of Great Britian.
It is brief not particularly detailed. Which I am not very happy with in hindsight. I'm not quite sure I can explain why I do not go into detail either. I made this video six years ago. I think I was really aiming to keep my videos shorter at the time and that likely contributed to it.
It is a topic that I think would be best covered in a full video. Which is something I might very well do.
There were several ambushes on different roads trying to anticipate the route he might take
I watched the movie the other day and I'm happy I found this great review.
Liam Neeson is convincing and charismatic but I hated how Michael Collins basically gets whitewashed. The ruthlessness of the assassinations he orders is never adressed and when Kitty asks about it, he's just like "I wish I didn't have to kill people but I have to". So it's apparently okay to kill people for your cause provided you don't enjoy it.
Regarding De Valera, I definitly think he was responsible for the civil war. Having negociated with Llyod George he knew that the Free Statr was the best outcome possible. The only reason why he rejected the Treaty is because it was not his own deal, but had he gone to London instead of Collins he would probably not have got better. Moreover, after he got power in 1932, De Valera showed that Collins was absolutely right with the whole "freedom to achieve freedom" thing. So was he an egocentric and a hypocrit ? Yes. But he wasn't the evil schemer portrayed by Alan Rickman either. I think he geniunely didn't plan to scapegoat Collins by sending him to London, and he definitly didn't want his death.
9:14 you dont mention how the british made him do it and how at first he refused to attack his former comerades in arms but churcill told him sort them out or we will do it for you. its not collins fault so much as the anti treaty ira
It is true that the British threatened to attack the Four Courts off the back of the assassinaiton of Henry Wilson. Although whether or not the Anti-Treaty IRA were responsible for Wilson's death is a matter of debate. There are suggestions Collins himself may have been responsible for ordering the killing.
The Irish did not come back from the delegations with an Irish Republic they came back the a subservient Irish Free State which was still part of the United Kingdom, the entire troubles regarding the 2 counties dates back to this agreement still today. Also It took several years before the Republic came about and it was this entire issue of subservience to the crown that started the civil war.
I never said they did?
@@TheUnemployedHistorian your a compleat idiot. Do some recerch.
Thanks John!