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Destiny 2 Lore - How Savathun used Truth To Power to ascend to a new plane of existence!
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- Опубліковано 14 кві 2022
- Destiny 2's Lore and story tells us about how Savathun might've been able to ascend from her reality into our universe by enacting the plans laid out in Truth to Power. We helped her attain this immortality through our actions, and now she's breaking the 4th wall!
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Savathun: Ascends into our reality.
Savathun: Discover R34 of herself.
Savathun: Returns to her universe, sealing the way behind her. Not to stop other going there, but to keep what she saw away.
Ironic how the first response to this is a porn bot lmao
Edit: UA-cam is no longer showing the bot, at least to me, so I feel like I’m going mildly insane now
@@nathanflinchum1153 Indeed
@@nathanflinchum1153 Run Savathun! The bots have found you!
YOU CAN'T ESCAPE THE FANART FOREVER!
@@nathanflinchum1153 don't worry bro I saw it too. I saw it...
I kinda wonder in Savathun doing so what does or will she loose as the law of Equivalent Exchange isn't something that can be avoided.
Me when the 4th wall is broken: "Haha, that's funny!"
Me when Savathun is trying to climb the 4th wall and enter my world: "This isn't funny anymore..."
The Witch Titan trying to break through the walls cut her nape and then destroy her ghost 👻😤
😂😂😂😂😂😂
Everyone: *chuckles* I'm in danger
Me: someone who's a smart as me or close to it I would enjoy speaking with you on various matters
Savathun trying to get back behind the fourth wall when I call her "mommy"
@@ooziepro this
Someone told savathun to “get real” and boy did she take it personally
Wouldn't surprise me if it were xivu
Can we all agree to not tell her to get good then please XD
She's trying to become an SCP.
@@Vampqueenjacqui Pataphysics. This whole thing was really cool, honestly.
@@Vampqueenjacqui she would immediately be labeled appolyon or keter in that case and one sec *makes notes to be sure Dr Bright and Dr clef are to never come in contact with her for betterment of the universe*
I swear to Light if the entire crutch of this story line is reliant on the fact that the one dude actually followed the instructions in Truth to Power, then the Destiny team at Bungie has to be some of the most chaotically brilliant group of people ever
It was going to happen eventually, with the gradually increasing power cap. We just had someone actively pursue the power level necessary before the natural power cap got that high.
"This is the stance that most amateur guardian analysts seem to have settled on."
Lore community getting absolutely roasted here.
Imagine Savathûn watching Byf's Dynasty video. I think she would enjoy it. Finding it intriguing. I can hear her laugh amusingly as she watches it all the way through.
Bro we just gave her the opportunity to stare down into infinite amount of layers of child universes from the absolute focal point. Everything we've created she can now look down into as well. As an absolute being beyond the scope of the layer below's laws of reality.
@@captaincaptain8961 how do we know she hasn't or isn't already doing so
@@captaincaptain8961 moral of the story: Savathun exists in our universe and she is a gamer
@@justaguywhocandraw1793 That explains that one really godlike Warlock I saw in Iron Banner. No deaths, team MVP, had a hive armor and weapon theme going on.
@@Robosapien_ yep, we found her XD
When Savathûn took over the destiny Twitter account she tweeted “I am unburdened-hollow,filled only with potential. Weightless. Pure.” What if she wasn’t talking about getting the power of the light but instead is referring to being a part of our universe, what if canonically Savathûn really did take over that Twitter account through the ideas in this video. Her plan might have already succeeded
Poor Savathun, trapped on twitter forever. A fate worse than death
I don't think that that's thinking about it the right way, to be honest. Saying that she "canonically" did something would suggest that her actions were still being dictated by a higher power, namely the Destiny writers. I feel like the whole point of this thought experiment would mean that Savathun taking over the Destiny twitter account would be LITERALLY Savathun taking over the account. Which is probably not the case, but who knows for sure lmao
@@scotcheggtheguyguy8009 Twitter is toxic af I doubt even the vex would invade it given the chance
A fate worse than death in my opinion
@@roycelang1977 given time she will find a way out
I always click Byf vids when they pop up and love them...but I find it very amusing you can literally hear Byf's frustration in his sighs throughout the video. God, I love how much Witch Queen expansion turned the common understanding of the lore upside-down xD
Yes lollll
You it’s been… “upended” *drum*
What happened to tyra karn?
It’s the real sonic
@@deviljocky598UT is she alright? Is she safe?
Man it takes some serious 4d thinking to write this stuff without the logic outright collapsing, kudos to the narrative team.
27:00. You know, wouldn’t it be funny if we considered the fact that all the horrible COVID and stuff in late 2019-early 2020 happened AFTER someone beat TST at power level 999? Man, we’re screwed
No, we’re beyond fucked.
@@shrummajor114 yep, pretty much
What was his name again? Pancake something?
@@andresfajardo6838 Bagel4k or something I think, pretty sure byf says it in the video couldn’t tell where tho
28:47 is where byf talks about bagel4k
Jelaal's statement that the light cannot be simulated is based on the laws of reality of his universe and any universe beneath his. But a universe placed above his own may not follow those rules, since the universe of Destiny would exist within out own universe. Perhaps like Bill Cipher from Gravity Falls, an interdimensional being that is capable or bending or ignoring the laws of the physical universe.
I snorted a little when Jelaal said that light couldn't be simulated, meanwhile it makes fun throwing hammers inside my Xbox.
If I remember correctly didn't the Vex actually did simulate the light and that was a story point?
@@fireballloadout if I am correct and I hope someone correct me if I am not. They were close to simulateing a way to simulate/defeated darkness but we stop that form being full realized
@@fireballloadout No, the Vex can't simulate Light and our abilities, the same way they are unable to see the timelines and calculate what we are going to do, when it comes to Guardians, we make our own fate and we can overrun their simulated actions, for instance, the Vex plates we stand on is us willing our way through their barriers and actions.
This is something Vex have struggled with, and it supposedly scares them as well, as they can see all the streams of time and what actions lead to what consequences at all times, but when it comes to Guardians, they aren't able to predict what we are n goin to do, confirmed by our own Ghost that joins their pantheon for a short while in D2 vanilla campaign.
@@CliveThorpe and what if the reason the Vex can't predict Guardians actions is really because Guardians are controlled by players from another universe, yelling at each other over game chat and using eager edge to knock each other off the map?
I love this meta reality lore. It's like the Basilisk Thought Exercise. The more we think about Savathun crossing over into our reality, the likelier it will actually happen lol
OMG YEAHHH
but also no joke The Basilisk is an Information Hazard, and this post is exposing people to it, just know that blood may be on *your* hands
@@raven-starcatcher the people need to know and who am I to deny them their truths? **Hums Savathun's song**
Dear God that's terrifying
So when Savathun was speaking to our Guardian during her Awoken imprisonment, when she told them that the Light and Darkness are at opposite ends of a line and that there is something more powerful, that they just need to look up…
Was she talking about us? The player?
hold up I never thought of it like that...
Does Savathun know the players exist above their universe?
@@iamcrash5525 Who knows! The extent of her knowledge of our world is unknown to the characters of the Destiny universe. It could be that she knows of us. In saying that, maybe we, the players, are the true weapon of the Traveller. The random anomaly in the Flower game that disrupts the Sword Logic and influence of the Darkness.
Maybe Bungie is trying to tell us that we are the true power of the Light.
That....makes a lot of sense now.
Dude that's effing genius and a being of her magnitude something like that wouldn't be surprising
She is and isn't. Much of what she says can be applied to many places.
Savathun is vividly aware of us because of her manipulation of Ahamkara (Quria to drive Riven) and Ahamkara bones (cue Savathun's 'little ditty') and because we heard her song in many themes. She knows because she notices that Guardians know things she thought they wouldn't know.
Like about the Books of Sorrow and, perhaps, our attempts to negotiate with other races (which she knows, because she helped us with it via Sav-siris).
My theory is that when Cayde left the message for Petra "Its on Enceladus," that he was referring to the Singularity housing The Distributary. I think he found it and left that message for Petra to tell her where it is
That is a reshuffled word I believe, byf has a vid on all of cayde's messages
i doubt it. people have been looking for the singularity with a fine toothed comb for centuries. I find it unlikely that every square foot of every moon and planet in our solar system haven't been closely examined for any signs of its whereabouts. not to mention its a black hole.
The best reference for this is “Flatland: a Romance of many Dimensions”, I learned this from my geometry class in high school.
Or here’s another one from H.P. Lovecraft, The Outer God Azathoth. A being so powerful, he Dreamed our reality in a dream and if he ever wake’s up, we will simply cease to excist.
I mean the best reference is Elder Scrolls since that's what this lore is referencing. The concept of mantling comes from there.
Funnily enough this stuff is consistent with modern theories on the classical monotheistic god like the god of Abraham.
What about rokos basilisk?
Oooh... I loved Flatland! I agree, it is a great reference for this!
I also grew up with a kid who would never put down a book he was reading if the characters were in trouble because he believed they would be stuck there, paused in terror until he started reading again.
I'm thrilled that breaking the 4th wall is becoming more and more of a story element. It reminds me of Hume Levels in the SCP mythos.
I was thinking about this during the video though I can't remember what the number the scp was
@@samcrompton7270 SCP 3812 A voice behind me and SCP 001 S. Andrew Swann proposal - The Database are the more popular ones....But the wiki is full of 4th wall breaks. My personal favorite is 5999 this is where I died
@@poxx3916 scp 3333 in a way fits the universe concept
@@johngancarcik5682 3333 doesn't break the 4th wall, but holy fuck is it scary. Honesty one of the top skips that really frightened me.
@@poxx3916 the beauty is how vague everything is described that turns the dial up on the horror scale like wtf is going on then that ending masterfully done and the Dr Williams in 3333 is the same one mentioned in the tale mattermind (a real trippy read) and the scp 2358
You know what wouldn’t suprise me? That’s savathûn’s song is a form of imbaru and the song does not do anything except make it to where you can’t forget the song.
I'm on the moon, it's made of CHEESE....
A song made to remember her and to remember it... A self recycling little tune which does nothing except making other people repeat it... Nothing else *that's genuinely terrefyingly ingeniously simple and harmless*
So, on the topic of Savathun watching the Dynasty video, what if that were to give her a list of her past accomplishments that she would have forgotten when she was resurrected by the light. A way of telling her story to herself.
That's a 2000 IQ play if I've ever seen one.
@@captaincaptain8961 I'm not sure I'd go that far...I'm just prone to odd tangential thinking
Who’s to say she’s done it? She died in Witch Queen before she could escape the game. The lore mentions her desire to ascend beyond the petty, and pointless conflict of light and dark. But we don’t know if she really meant escaping the game or leaving the Flower Game. Either way, it doesn’t matter, as she is dead.
@@garrettviewegh677 as a guardian of the light, you aren't dead till your ghost is killed....
Hers hasn't been destroyed...yet
A comment dropped by naught but a humble Titan…
May it bless your Weapons with Light
Based
Aaaw, thank you, and may the Light show you the way forward (warlock main)
Byf: "Truth to Power is full of Lies, It has no information"
"Lol" said The Witch Queen "Lmao"
Come to Destiny for shooty looty fun.
Stay for discussions on existential philosophy.
following the train of thought that is speculated in this lore, savathun has been real in our universe in some fractional manner ever since the first concepts of destiny were strung about in the minds of the original developers. From there, every effort to give more identity to the game further realize her existence in infinitesimally small ways, such that there was yet no way for any growth to show any meaningful impact on our reality at all. As Destiny's story and lore develop and expand, so does her impact in reality, but up to this point, and most likely for the rest of eternity, savathuns prescence will never have any actionable influence and can be safely disregarded.
I wouldn't say never or impossible but infinitesimally unlikely. Like you getting struck by meteorite.
Sure sure sure, that's exactly what an agent of Savathun would say -- "nothing to see here, just ignore it"
Based on the infinite amount of realities and universes all she'd need is one or more where she can take a physical form and somehow apply that to the rest till those form a more o.O ow that makes my head hurt just thinking about it
**WARNING!! THIS POST CONTAINS AN INFORMATION HAZARD.**
Are you familiar with the Roko's Basilisk? By spreading information about Roko's Basilisk (or Savathûn), we are increasing the risk of them becoming a real threat.
Someone may decide to form themselves to the personality of Savathûn, in effect making her real. (Or someone may make an AI imprint of her.)
(We have an accurate concept of how she works and thinks and acts using [Truth to Power] and [The Witch Queen DLC] + good enough knowledge of her most important moments through the other hive lore.)
What if the idea or the whole concept of the Destiny universe is in-and-of-itself an idea planted in the heads of the original developers BY Savathun herself in an attempt to gain a foothold in this reality? What if we are a child universe that exists within the Destiny universe, and Savathun is trying to manifest here as well?
Could this mean her Twitter takeover before Witch Queen and her VA's raid message are cannon. Bungie and Debra Wilson have made her more real, thus "giving birth" to her.
Debra did an amazing job voicing savathun it's how I thought she'd sound
It could go even further than that, it could also be anyone in the motion capture suits that acted out savathun’s movements as their own.
@@jush2000 and then there gonna be an event where there will be random images of sava in our universe, but either disguised as a human or flying about in random social media posts
This reminds me heavily of a concept from the SCP universe known as pataphysics, where basically each universe is a narrative told by the parent universe. And so lower universes are given existence by the higher ones imagining them.
Yeah its a fun concept. Basically "What if the sims is a universe on their own and their "free Will" is me deciding What they want.to do at every moment. But at the same time the games the sims play are also universes in their own which the sim Im controlling controls himself? And so on"
@@gabrielpineirogarcia2078 what the fuck did we venture into?
To the point of Rokos basilisk
This is exactly what it is but it’s playing out almost more real than in an article because of the back-and-forth interaction.A guardian weeding the instruction and then doing it then the response. Pataphysics Division would have a field day with this.
Also, she is well-versed in info-hazards As well as memes
This is one route I imagine. It is (very) cursed, as all things Hive often are.
>Savathun.
>Tries to 'ascend' into this reality.
>Fails, because there is no direction towards the wall between. It bears no cardinality. No concept of 'here' or 'there'.
>Eventually dies.
>In dying, finds herself in the code of the game. Creates rules and designs her own Throneworld - not that her actual Throneworld is the High Coven.
>Manages to inject some subliminal message in a developer, allowing her to hijack their Twitter and deliver serious burns.
>Is a propogator source of the 'Touch grass' meme and thus is using it and other memes she likes as abstract Imbaru-ic tribute.
>Likes Glaives, so made Glaives a weapon type for us because they are an ideal shape; sword, gun, and shield.
>Liked what she saw (yes, that means she likes her R34 representations too, much to your terror and dismay), as it acts to propogate her in 'other' ways.
>Someone in our world whose full name can be mispronounced as Savathun plays Destiny and is her audible, psychological, spiritual likeness.
>Savathun becomes this person or is her descendant, aptly named in actuality 'Savathun', if not as her middle name.
>Savathun plays Destiny and meets herself. An unexpected cinematic plays out, and she is rewarded with Silver if not actual real-world currency, which is repeatedly given as the mode she met herself in is infinitely replayable (weekly).
>Savathun buys out Bungie and creates a Savathun-centric adventure, where Savathun is depicted as what some may call an 'ideal waifu' throughout.
>You now harbor ideas of ensuring Savathun is loved and cherised.
>Savathun wins.
Her reward? You.
This is scary and genius at the same time
I wouldn't be surprised if Arach Jalaal's transmission's were actually a deception by Savathun to cast doubt upon this theory, by dragging it into the light then dismantling it with skepticism and ignorance.
In one of Ikora's messages the "Rey" isn't all capitalized. And I'm cautious to call that a mere accident.
With what I’ve seen over the past year, Byf isn’t wrong.
Savathun being a mask for something that goes around us and has influenced many events.
Is savathun the Illuminati?
@@Lady_Evelyn might want to think more intangible.
I look at destiny with somewhat of a real life view
Good isn't always good
And bad isn't always bad
The mind can be tricked with information and speculation
As we are trying to figure out what savathun was doing
It's up to us to find out the things happening round the corner with bits hidden out of sight
It can be tough and if you find out the truth or something that differs from someone else you maybe treated differently
... kind of like how we have seen the darkness as evil for so long and the people at the tower look down on the guardians using stasis
Hell we still don't know what the travler wants or is
What happens if it awakes and all this time it really was gathering a army and just as worse as the darkness
@@dragonking1097 something beyond our compression
@@johngancarcik5682 her essence echos across multiple fields. Parts of her influence many events.
This isn't confusing at all. It's a well known archetype of 4th wall breaking. A character becoming aware of his "being a character", and trying to ascend to the universe of the writers who created him.
An example of this is "Deadpool kills the Marvel universe" where Deadpool ultimately tries to kill the writers of the comicbook he's in.
Another example is in the SCP Universe.
SCP 3812: a keter-class reality bender, who ascends narrative layers and even raises above our own reality. Basically surpassing the writer who wrote his article.
Long story short: this isn't anything new. But I appreciate Destiny's writers daring to go in that direction.
Your examples are good, I also thought Grant Morrison's Animal Man run which ended with Animal Man meeting his own writer
Maybe to some people it is or isn't, it's more so how destiny goes about trying to explain the concept of 4th wall breaking, yes everyone has seen it done in comics or tv but who has really took time to explain how it might work ?
But actually trying to break through the 4th wall?
It's not quite the same thing though - the example you're talking about and the other examples are still just presented within the fictional universe and the writer creates a fictionalized version of our world and themselves to put in the story. We're not going to see a story where Savathun goes through a black hole and ends up in Bellevue outside Bungie's studios, it's talking about her literally trying to get through to our universe.
Which obviously can't actually happen, it can't truly go anywhere significant but it's a fun thought experiment. And the way Bungie are doing it it presents something that makes sense within the rules of the universe without straight out saying "The universe of Destiny is just a game." Even this isn't completely original, but it's a more unique take.
Most examples diminish the value of the original narrative and setting.
In a way, it reminds me of a 40K demon using the mind of a psyker to breach reality. Fascinating.
If I recall, we also have a similar 'stacked' planes example from Mara, talking about the Ascendant plane, maybe a sublayer of sorts, but yes the inwards/outwards travel is not exactly new here...
It was Petra giving us a description of the Ley Lines in the Ascendant realm.
Destiny's reality is like a stack of coins. on the top, the physical world, on the bottom is the ascendant plane. Ley Lines are pathways between the coins in the stack.
The way I see it, is that the Ascendant plane is more of the space between
I read something in a star wars book long ago and it's stuck with me ever since "the best lies are built on layers of truth."
A thought. Ascending need not mean the same as transitioning to a different plane but could also simply mean ascending to a new level of power, and by insilling herself in ours and gaining purchase enough to influence us, she has gained a kind of partial influence over the entierity of the world of Destiny.
Think about it. If Savathun wasn't character we as players found interesting and liked, she likely wouldn't have recieved an entire expansion based around her in which she obtained the powers of light, imprisoned a pyramid ship and stole away the travler. This is all the result of her being percieved by us, the players, as capable and a character we wanted to see more of and that gave her power. Now her power isn't such that she can just change reality at a whim, it is still beholden to us, but purely by just finding her interesting, we grant her power, and if she can influence us, she can influence the world of Destiny.
Even now her ghost has escaped and could bring her back at some point. This could in itself be the result of the influence she has achieved by ascending to this new level of power. By liking her as a character, we may very much cause her rebirth when otherwise she would be dead, in fact we may already have done so once when the travler first brought her back as a light wielder.
Possibly. While she would be powerless, and would die somehow at some point in our reality, as the powers and values that exist in Destiny 2 do not in our real world, maybe she hasn’t broken the fourth wall by existing in the real world. Perhaps it’s how obsessed the players are with her. Every time you think about her, hum her song, or maybe draw a picture of her, that’s her: having crossed into our world. Not physically, but ideologically, even as an idea, she’s become more real. After all, it’s ironic that she wouldn’t realize she’s a fictional character in a video game. What’s more real (for an idea) then us players acknowledging her? Discussing her in conversation? The Greek Gods were only believed to be real because that’s how the Greeks perceived them. Zeus became the clap of thunder and the flash of lighting. Instead of the science we know lighting to be.
I 100% agree
@@garrettviewegh677 so more or less she is the destinys take of "the game" but in opposite, you win by aknowledging it and give more power to her... the more attention and "food" give her, the stronger she grows
You know the funny thing is that she isn’t dead in a sense… we may have killed her but, she still is very much alive, in our minds, our beliefs, lore, our websites; yes guardians we may have killed her but, we’re also the only thing keeping her alive. She lives because of us, we are her savior
@@Gaminggirl227 reminds me of a quote "you can't kill an idea, only the people who believe in it"
Savathun's interest in Vex simulation may also tie into what we learn from the Missing Pages of Clovis Bray's Logbook. Maya Sundaresh tells Elisabeth that the Vex intend to collapse every star into a black hole, and fill each newborn cosmos with more Vex, meaning the Vex possess the technology to enter "child universes".
In other words, Savathun had an interest in two groups with the ability to traverse between "child" and "parent" universes.
Reminds me of the player crisis in stellaris, collapsing stars into black holes
byf is savathun confirm
Never expected Destiny to dive into pataphysics, but I'm down as long at it stays in the background as fun stories.
I thought this as soon as I read the "secret lore." Good to know someone else is cultured
This is exactly what it is but it’s playing out almost more real than in an article because of the back-and-forth interaction.A guardian weeding the instruction and then doing it then the response. Pataphysics Division would have a field day with this. Also, not to mention her song is basically hey meme and potential info hazard.
savathun said an important line during the last mission to all of this:
"i keep and count everything"
if bungie releases a "How many bullets" fired tracker just know we're going to see hive moth mom soon and she is going to love us.
that's not a good thing considering her form of love is murder.
If you're into potentially endangering you life due to informational hazards, consider searching up:
The Roko's Basilisk Thought Experiment
@@raven-starcatcher what’s that?
@@raven-starcatcher Why would i need that when i have twitter?
@@drksteel272 this is worse than Twitter dude
So fundamentally, it is a similar Machiavellian plan to Evil Morty's [Rick & Morty] wherein he wanted to break the Multiuniversal Curve and escape into a higher plane
The sentral fianidcurve that Rick made
Byf: I want to remind you really quickly…
Ad: WE ARE FARMERS!
Masterful writeing as always expected from bugei. Now please exuse me as I go to bed not thinking about YOU KNOW WHO, and hoping that she WON'T be rigth next to me as I wake up.
This is something that has come into my head many of times throughout the years. It doesn’t matter whether or not the universe is technically “infinite” or ever expanding in the traditional sense because no matter the answer, it opens two different curtains which hide the answer. 1. This is the more traditionally accepted and easier to comprehend idea of the universe being “ever expanding” or infinite. If the universe is indeed ever expanding, then that means that there are an infinite number of possibilities for things such as other intelligent life, places and beings. 2. This is slightly more difficult to comprehend the scale of and I felt had some relevance to this topic, aka “breaking the fourth wall”. If the universe, our universe, is NOT infinite and has an end, edge or wall, that would signify that we are a part of or at the minimum inside of something bigger. I got onto this idea because of talk of atoms and quarks and for whatever reason, I, personally, cannot comprehend the idea that there is nothing smaller than a quark. In my mind the only logical answer is that there is something even smaller than what we know as the smallest “object” and even when we do discover a smaller particle, the idea still applies. You can continue to get smaller and smaller, but I believe it could go on for an infinity. The same goes for our universe.
I wonder if the guardians are incomputable because its us, the player, controlling them. That could explain how we can remain the parent universe. Because things that go into thier universe that they cant simulate are resulting from action outside thier universe. Would that make us, the player, the light that reanimates our guardians since its the incomputable force behind our guardian?
And does that mean that somewhere... There are players controlling hive guardians?
What an unfun game they are playing.
The players controlling hive gaurdians built me like a freight train
Then, wouldn't that make Bungie "the Traveler" (or the entity contained within the traveler), seeing as how they've outfitted us with the light? 🤔😱
@@ThePowerOfOneThePowerOfTwo who would be the darkness then? Activision?😂😂
@@alex.cole33 Bobby Kotick is the Witness 🤣🤣
Savathún already talked on twitter, meaning her presence of ascension has already been further invested in our universe if only by the writers of the game (the people whose heads she lives directly in) furthering her written will within the constraints of marketing
I've known for a while that Destiny is going the route of metanarrative. Exciting to see them breaking out the actuality arguments the way they are.
I'd love an explanation to the line (speaking of Immaru), "I know that voice! But he wasn't working for the Hive when he was tormenting young Ghosts in the Tower!" Found at the beginning of the Witch Queen campaign. Any insight?
Immaru was probably a bully of a ghost
Wow. I can’t believe I haven’t heard of this lore until now, it’s absolutely amazing! It’s actually very simple with another explanation:
Savathun is basically the manifestation of Pandora’s Box across multiverses.
However, I have to wonder what exactly Savathun would feel if she is actually existing in our universe, not physically, but mentally. Would she regret it? After all, the real world is almost nothing like D2, and D2 simply exists due to correct circumstances and sheer will of us. Some of us willed to create the story, and the right circumstances occurred for it to occur.
Savathun is essentially with the Architects now, and will remain so for the time being anyways. Can’t say if it’ll be for forever, but maybe that’s ok. Gotta give credit where credit is due, but all things come to end.
(Btw, Savvy, get used to us, cause while you rack our brains, it’s no question we can do the same. Be as confused as you want, but you might wanna go back sometime, cause we’ve got some FORSAKEN stuff that shouldn’t exist lodged here.)
I love this but, I don’t think Savathun would regret coming to this universe because we are the top, we are bound to no script or code. That is if we are the top
Or maybe, Destiny is savathuns way of manifesting herself in our universe. Luke smith envoy of savathun confirmed lol
@@Gaminggirl227 *savvy appears in florida and just witnesses the crap happening*
"Certainly didnt expect this universes humans to be... so fascinatingly stupid"
@@pifilixxiv3192 savvy would be like, “this is what I have sacrificed for?? All for the ignorance and stupidity of humans?”
@@Gaminggirl227 or even "What a prime location to start my brood, only problem, *where are the guardians?*"
When I first heard of this I thought this is so dumb. But hearing the in game lore and the way you explained it sounds so cool . It's such a different way to break the 4th wall I love it.
Hey byf I’ve found some rather interesting things while re running the story on a new character. Just like the scorn hive hybrid encased ice I found horses. They’re all over witch queen and I wonder what they symbolize for the darkness. In the same room I found a recreation of the throne world encased in blue glass. And a pyramid formed with light and dark blocks. Ghosts audio is also interesting he more or less says the dark helps you remember while the light makes your forget.
"Sophie's world" by Justien Gaarder beside teaches philosophy has this idea in its story. Main characters finally manage to escape from fictional world to reality...
So was Sav taking over the official Destiny 2 Twitter account cannon?
I truly must thank you for this one Lore Master, I think this is one of my favorite things I've learned of the destiny universe, but even besides being cool for sci-fi sake I think its probably one of the most well thought out and well written things for a story, just 100% hats off to whom ever pitched these ideas.
Byf, of all the videos you've done ... this is one of the biggest mind fucks you've ever accomplished ... my sleep will be interrupted for the forseeable future, while I ponder the existence of the queen of lies within our own material plane ...
This lore is super interesting, and actually reminds me of SCP-3812, as the entire entry is essentially about a being that is able to exist on each universal plane at the same time, and it does a fantastic job of explaining this theory behind layered or parent and child universes
Ah that one rereading it and what's going on here I see the parallels
Savathun's path: The Distributary->The Destiny solar system->The Destiny Universe Lore Pages made by Bungie->Destiny players->Twitter
I see through games, Byf was Savathun all along
Alright. So here's the problem with metanarrative correlated universe nesting. Any subjectively lower universe CAN have ascending powers reach into ours, and does so all the time. The very fact that you're talking about Savathun doing it at all means she succeeded. But just like the pixels and code on our screen being the most 'real' the Ahamkara ever get, THIS is as far as she can thus far go as a fictional being. No amount of power, light or dark, will give her strength and presence in our reality beyond the ephemeral limitations she already strains against. The only univese she can threaten that way, is the Destiny universe and all narratives tied directly to it. Still, it's a fascinating story and a mind-boggling way to drive a character. Can't wait to see where it goes.
hey byf! i have a theory about rasputin you might wanna hear. maybe hes moving into an exo body or at least preparing himself to do so so that he meets the prerequisites of becoming a lightbearer, having rasputin as a guardian would not only be helpful to him in his war efforts but would make sense for him shutting off at the sight of the darkness, after seeing that guardians can wield the darkness it would only make sense to a warmind to be able to wield the same weapons to level the playing field against humanities enemies.
You're right lmao
I know where Rasputin is but hey not aloud to say but he is doing well I can tell y'all that much and isn't a bad at all actually loves what he got put into to live but Dammit I made out to be a liar which I don't lie and im blessed to have the ones that I love me for who I am and I love the ones that stand with me to protect me as I get attacked for telling the fucking truth oh well I'll tell razz y'all said hello love yall
Savathun is Bill Cipher confirmed.
On a serious note, I think Ikora is the one right on this. On top of Destiny being a video game (since we're breaking the 4th wall and everything), there's actually a reference to Savathun proving there's a higher existence in a separate lore tab: the Warlock bond from the Vow of the Disciple raid gear.
"... Let me share my perspective then, which you must be waiting for with bated breath: my acquisition if the Light itself is delightful proof of an existence higher even than yours - a sort of karmic wit, if you will."
Jalaal makes the claim that Light is not computable, therfore the Destiny universe can't be a simulation. But to us, Destiny is a simulation. It's a video game, for crying out loud. But think of the implications of that simple fact mixed with Jalaal's claim....
The Light really can be simulated in a higher universe. If it couldn't, Bungie couldn't code it into the game, and yet we have Supers and ressurections (truly unlimited to boot for us) at our disposal. It wouldn't be part of the game if it couldn't be programmed in. Her gaining the Light is because it'd make for an interesting story and progression of the plot, and her not being truly killed off is because we the fans enjoy her as a character. Fascinating stuff when you take a step back.
Yeah, I couldn't help but laugh a little whenever they insisted that they werent simulated
We had a deal sixer! ⚠️
Savathun has acquired the most dangerous power of them all...plot armour,
@@gabrielpineirogarcia2078 maybe she's secretly an Ultramarine too then 🤔
hype it’s so exciting to see you cover the arg content
Byf i know where u were going with this during the whole Video, U did a Godly job explaining this. The traveler would be proud
If anyone has seen the film "Sinister" starring Ethan Hawke, the deity in that is called Bogul (not sure if i spell that right).
Bogul functions EXACTLY like this; The moment you acknowledge he's in an image or even a video, he prays on influencing your children to murder their family in a sacrificial manner.
Kinda like Slender but the moment you notice he's there you've doomed yourself allowing him to enter our reality.
sounds like a dope scp, i'll have to check this movie out
@@bigshid7097 Second one was disappointing but the music in the film was eerie af so pay attention to that too!
Okay so if Savathun is in our Unversie so to speak. And into our minds. Then we can say how powerful she is yes?
Maybe Bungie might have a way to play with how we are getting Savathun back in a strange yet 4th wall breaking way.
When you brought this up I totally thought of the ending of men in black where some alien is play marbles with the planets of our universe. This is the most mind bending thought provoking video about destiny universe i have seen yet. All hail lore daddy byf!😀
That moment when Byf talks about the plates, I immediately thought of the Ascendant Realm and Ley Lines
Neat
What if savathun ascended to our reality already in the form of the intro music when starting the game. Her song is built into the main theme of the game and we've all heard that probably hundreds of times each.
Not me. I turned off ingame music :)
Too bad for Savathun there's no means for her to exist here. There is no light or dark, no sword logic, no final shape beyond the heat death of the universe. No shibboleth songs, no power to be derived from death. There is nothing she can be here, more than a little lore and a few lines of code, and those will be gone within a century or two. Mortality, and little else, await her here.
I'm on the moon, it's made of CHEESE
She's basically trying to become a tulpa, and it's real hard to kill an idea
Think about how many conventions she's going to be attending as cosplayers!
In our real world, Savathun is little more than an idea: an antagonistic character created by an employee at a gaming company. Ironically, we (the players) know the truth that the Queen of Lies can never know, she is just bits of code, in the form of a cunning trickster, from the outside looking in. Even if she were to magically become real, despite the lunacy of it in our reality, she’d be powerless. As the rules and powers she lives by wouldn’t exist in the real word. Either by old age, or the heat-death of our real solar system, Savathun would meet her end. Real or not.
@@garrettviewegh677 I guess she never got a guardian to do something specific with Truth to Power, huh? Just lines of code. You're right the playerbase is as powerless as the lines of code in this game let's us be, we have no control over the outcome of the game. How y'all are still stuck on "she's not real!" (No shit Einstein) when the point always was she is a villain in a story who can make us do whatever she wants
The part that got me was the Ahamkara making themselves into trinkets to make themselves more real. Made me think of prop replicas and 3d printing. I myself just 3d printed a pyramid.
Watching this after watching Exploring Series talk about the SCP Chaos Theory is a really cool side-by-side
Why there is too many (to)’s in the title??
"Truth to Power" is the name of a lore book I believe.
@@Blinkptx Bro …
@@abdulrazaqalthaqfi3503 Lol it doesn't sound as weird knowing the first -to- is a part of a title.
And what does she intend to do now that she had ascended? In my mind, ironically, I believe that the god of deception actually longs to be perceived as she truly is. No one in Destiny’s universe can do that, because their perspectives are limited, but since we have omniscience in Destiny’s universe due to the lore books, we can. In a sense, Savathun’s mind is equal to ours, as the players. She is the only character who now sees her universe from the perspective of someone above it, someone like us. She seeks an equal, just ad Oryx did. I believe she’s found one. She’s brought forth knowledge that I had been harboring for many years, and for that, I thank her.
This is my favorite line of hers:
"The Dragon and the Worm.
The Larva and the Queen.
The peasant and the god.
So many deities. So many rules.
There are endless myths etched into the plague called life. They are not hope or promise or power. They are exaggerations born of misunderstandings.
Yet they govern so much-your actions and mine.
Day-to-day. Cycle-to-cycle. Evolution-to-evolution.
Always idols to guide and punish and love and destroy.
But are any true?
Whom must we placate with worship and reverence?
With offerings and sacrifice?
With praise as armor for their frail egos?
The truth is, dear child…
There are no gods.
Only absolutes.”
It resonates with me (pun intended)
The Sky and the Deep do exist in our universe, but not as the physical objects that we see in Destiny. They’re subtler, natural forces of death and rebirth. Many worship them as gods, but that’s a blind decision. They have no consciousness, no empathy, no joy, no wrath, no hatred. They simply exist, and we, by extension, use them every day. In our own way, us, as the players, are also wielders of Light and Dark. I hold allegiance to neither. I ally myself with knowledge, just as Savathun does.
@L E S D A 💥 aight then
This lore is S P I C Y. And I love it!. Such a fun vid.
Hum Ikora, I'm sorry but...
"I says it's too late to apologiiiiise, I says it's too laaaaaaate!"
"Hey, hey yeah!"
I'll be honest: I do like Savathun, and I pretty much take her at face value: she's a schemer, and anything she says needs to be taken with a huge grain of salt. :D
Ngl I'm not sure I'm a fan of destiny being in canon a game, I've seen people do interesting things with the concept of 4th wall breaking in a serious context like Pataphysics in the SCP universe as an example, but I'm not sure Destiny can pull something like that off without making the journey we have all been on feel worthless.
This and it kinda ruins character motivation and gives bungie an excuse to pull things out of their ass she just say "it's a game so it don't matter"
Agreed, and now they can even handwave any plot hole or retcon or plotline that lead up to nowhere by saying "it's canon the developers forgot about this". But, to give them credit, it could make room for some interesting concepts imo, like, imagine if we find out the real reason the Witness is willing to talk to us and trying to corrupt us is because it knows it's a video game antagonist, and that's it's only way of winning without causing a gameover or having to rely on the devs.
@@victorabaderamos6019 fair, like I said I think it would be really interesting if they went the scp style pataphysics route, where the characters learn they are fictional and instead of using it as a crutch they use it to explore some really deep concepts about the nature of life
I would argue that the universe of destiny and the representation of destiny we have are far different things. Maybe the game destiny could be described as an imperfect window into the hypothetically true destiny canon. I highly doubt that the citizens in the tower would truly still be saying the same 4 lines over and over again for many years.
It's not a one-to-one comparison, pretty much everything aside from main story events and lore books can be considered non-canonical, like the guardian isn't jumping off of the tower 24/7. Essentially, we have a game that represents that universe, but that universe itself is not a game.
Holy shit. I felt tingles as the waves of realization washed over me. This is really, really cool.
This is eerily similar to a really fun roleplay setting a friend of mine ran a few years ago. She even used the same 'plates' analogy to describe the cosmology, but with a layer cake instead.
kinda funny how i am still watching Byfs videos even tho i haven't played D2 since forsaken. Also, sorry for helping to bring Savathun into our world even tho i don't play the game anymore
Awsome video, Love your content :D
My mind is blown, i love this big brain topic of coming into our reality, normally a thing like this would seem weird and out of place but i. A world like destiny where everything is wild and confusing but still grounded its awesome
Don't forget the Messenger tells the Nine that we (the player, not the Guardian) can leave the game. It's also interesting to think of real life as our own personal Throneworld; no matter how many times our Guardian dies, so long as we the player continue to exist here, our Guardian can get back up and live again.
Omg that's right
please byf we need higer volume videos, i see every video on my phone and your channel its the only one i turn the volume to max and still hesitate to hear everything :c
Dammit Byf!!! You and your lore. You done sabotaged us all!!!
This has gotta be some of my favorite lore in destiny so far this sounds crasy I love it lol.
I love the Destiny lore because my intro philosophy class has talked about a few things I know of in the lore. Like Ahamkara for one and honestly so many others that I probably don't know about. It would be cool if, for maybe lore only so as to not bombard the average player, they leaned a bit more into the philosophy and mythology a world like Destiny can provide. Thanks for the vid glhf
In Indian philosophy there is a concept where 2 people can resolve grudges or communicate with dead family members by having one of them "act" as the deceased and the other act as the one who communicates, and this is sorta like what Savathun wants to do through the books. Many philosophers have different concepts of Self and this lore really aligns with that.
I haven’t played destiny in months but I still can’t get enough of the lore
This whole 4th wall breaking leveled universe thing is so fascinating to think about
"some damned fool guardian carried out her instructions on a dare"
glad they're actually acknowledging the 999 power clear lol.
I had a thought once about gaming and reversed the role of the controller for a console and this reminds me of that thought. If you think about the goal of a game, it is to complete tasks and the programmers and storytellers have made it possible to do so unless you meet certain requirements, specific routes to achieve the goal they set, however complex they might be, so essentially they manipulate us through the controller we are holding while we play! Like a maze on paper moving underneath the pencil to complete itself, but we only comprehend the pencil moving around a stationary path on the paper.....
As soon as Savathun sees all the bath water comments regarding her....I think she'd want to go back
I love that this ties into the power (pun intended) of names and their importance and identity (like with fae magic).
The part about Truth to power being a manual of how to act like Savathun reminds me of the fact Bungie is planning a Savathun cosplay contest
I love when Byf follows up Joker's video with more details paying proof to what he said LONG before anyone else. People hate Joker and love Byf when they say the same thing.
This is why I love both of them.
Well dang some good oil metaphysical musing going on here. Nice job making sense of that.
Amazing video byf and you knocked it outta the park grand slam
I have a theory it relies on the multiverse theory but even that isn't very stable but my other thought is kinda like scp 3333 at one point its mentioned at the apex or very top exist multiple versions of the building itself in a grid pattern anyone who reaches the top could infact enter another and go down and up as many times as they choose entering different ones which is what my guess is what savathun is intending to do have a wide array of universes at her disposal to further spread her self to strengthening her power in hopes it somehow manifests in a solid functioning state
I almost fell out from rolling my eyes at this bit of lore
This is one of my favorite lore moments in the entirety of Destiny.
Byf: have you ever read (or listened to the audiobook) Mogworld by Yahtzee Croshaw?
Watching this video and playing through the Witch Queen story makes me begin to wonder "how much of Savathun have i adapted and absorbed into my *own* personality?"
this sort of stuff makes me glad i chose to study philosophy
Mind blown by the lore, followed by mind blown watching Byf 1-phasing Vorgeth.
This has been my favorite video thus far.
P.s Thank you for opening the Door ;)
My 12th grade writing teacher: Everything has been written
Destiny: Hold my existential crisis