How to Properly Break In New Gears
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- Опубліковано 17 тра 2024
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Last updated: May 11, 2023 - Авто та транспорт
A good lengthy through discussion about a topic that way too many gloss over in a vague explanation. Good video. Fantastic demeanor 😊
Thank you for the valuable information. Love your channel.
Great Information !!!!! Thanks !!!
Thanks really enjoyed that vide.
Wanted to say thanks as I set up front and rear 4.88's in my 2020 JL in September and I can't say enough how much your videos helped me. I don't have a lift but was able to jack it up high enough to sit under it and do the work. I got great patterns with some trial and error thanks to your guidance. I now have a couple thousand miles on it and they are running perfectly and changed the break-in oil at about 700 miles. Gears looked great upon inspection when I changed out the oil.
Really the only thing I did differently than you typically do (but you did mention it in at least one video that I remember) is I put a film of oil on the shims and put them into the diff and then smacked the carrier in, I just found it easier then driving the shims in with the carrier, I just made sure the thickest shim was touching the carrier on either side. The Revolution gears set up perfectly once it got them dialed in. It was a lot of work but I really enjoyed it, but I'm sure the fact that the vehicle is only 3 years old with about 10K miles on it made the wrenching a lot easier ;)
I do have some information regarding the break-in heating of the diffs. Because of my work I have a very expensive thermal imaging camera in the work truck at all times so I used that to image the diffs after break-in runs. Front ran hotter by about 15º pretty consistently and all runs were done in 4 wheel drive. I think it may have something to do with less oil for cooling in the front and of course that's what you are ultimately measuring when shooting the diff covers. Running it in 2 wheel drive predictably didn't heat up the front end really at all which is to be expected. 15 minute 60 mph runs resulted in 150-165º on the first run then it leveled off in the low 120's after about 3 runs. It seems the heat goes down quite quickly and based on what I observed with subsequent runs and I think a LOT of break-in happens during the first run or 2. Didn't notice any real drop in the numbers after about 100 miles.
Anyways, thanks again for these videos, I really enjoyed doing the gears and you helped a TON! Saved me some money and by doing it yourself you also see how tempting it would be for a shop to stop when they get even CLOSE to a decent pattern. I wouldn't trust most shops to take the time, bracket it, dial it in, and do it right. In hind site I could have easily run the very first pattern I got (was a little deep) but ended up doing it 5-6 more times, and the worst part of the whole thing as laying on my back and smacking the flange onto the pinion gear until there was enough teeth for the set up nut to catch (would it kill them to make the pinion gear threads 1/4" longer?? 🤣
Thanks for the feedback! Great info.
Thank you sir.
one question just to clarify?? during the breakin cycle, do I do the first two 15 mile and cool downs then after those two cycles than would I connect my trailer and do another 2 15 mile cycles? and all this would be before the 500 mile oil change? or would it be best to wait to the end of the 500 mile oil change to do the trailer cycles? I will be using Revolution Gears FYI.
What kinda video camera you use for your videos? It sure is clear. What editing software do you use?
I use my cell phone for everything. Google 7Pro, Film Maker Pro -Movie Maker for editing (also done on my phone). I do use an external mic too. I think the editing software was $12 and the mic was around $10.
Are there any speed/ cool down recommendations for the 100-500 mile range? Can’t seem to find anyone talking about this? Interstate running 75mph okay? Any info would be greatly appreciated
After the first two 15 minute break in drives, then you can resume normal driving for 500 miles. The main thing to understand is changing the fluid at that 500 miles. 👍
@@TheBFHGarage thanks for the quick response! Just changed the gears in my JL this weekend. Already a huge difference with 37s. You got yourself another follower! 😁
Is it normal to get your shims right on the pinion preload on a dana 60 and have 20 inch pounds at 250 ft lbs before the seal and 30 inch pounds after the seal? Do I need to add a tiny amount of shims? Do seals cause that much drag? And can an oil slinger that is slightly bent be reused on an axle that was fine before and already like that? My outer one is like slightly concave.
The seal will most definitely add some drag. The pinion pre-load spec is without the pinion seal installed. Usually seals are good for 5ish in/lbs or so. As far as the slinger, it's a judgement call on how damaged it is
Thank you. You are correct, it was about 5 inch lbs after the seal. The issue I had was my Dana 44 front and dana 60 rear on my 78 F250 both needed speedi sleeves on the yokes. I didn't peel the back off yet because I didn't think it would interfere but I guess that dust seal that sticks out on the pinion seal was pushing against it adding about 10 inch lbs extra drag. I took it back off and cut it and it fixed the issue.
You can look at pictures of my projects if you want on my account description, I'm working on a 72 mustang, 78 F250, and 69 F250, thanks again for the help, I only just turned 20 and am working by myself. I have learned so much from youtube channels like yours.
Oh, and I'm also seeing that issue you were talking about with crappy gear sets I think, someone put a different set in my Dana 44 front, my machine shop said they were aftermarket when I brought it when I asked what I can reuse and need to replace, I have a decent pattern on one side and a meh pattern on the other. I'm not sure if it's just worn or what, it was set up all wrong before.
It had no oil in the front 44 and carrier had to be replaced because the bearings spun. Whoever did it before shimmed the carrier bearings extremely tight to try and keep them from spinning, and had zero backlash with the completely wrong shim setup on the preload, but an okay pattern on one side and a meh pattern on the other.
I bought new everything except the ring and pinion because they had no visible damage and the front diff doesn't get used often (and I don't have a lot of money). I ended up with 10 thousands backlash and 20 inch lbs on the pinion after I got my pattern. Not sure if it's off because of wear or just a bad gear set, or I'm bad, but I had no issues getting the dana 60 rear right, although that wasn't blown. It seems like my drive side is too far towards the outside edge and deep but mostly centered, yet the coast is nice and towards the middle. It looks really strange on the one side.
It's a reverse rotation diff so I may not be calling the sides correctly but I think I am. I realize my coast is a touch shallow and my drive is a bit on the deeper side, but it seemed like no matter how I set it up I couldn't get a decent pattern. I'd keep 10 thousands backlash and try like 10 different combos on the pinion depth in around 2-3 thousands increments. If I fix it then I either don't have good back lash or the coast is going off the edge. It seemed like sometimes I would have a great coast and the drive would be non-existent on the deep side.
The original pattern was better than mine I think but it had no backlash and would be ruined when I would fix the backlash.
And the dana 60 rear had no noise before, but I was super disappointed taking it apart to find the carrier was cracked in half. The drums were absolute toast and the self adjusters were in the bottom of the drums, I'm guessing it got caught and locked up a wheel. It was the worst grooves I have ever seen on a drum, it looked like a mountain range lol. @@TheBFHGarage
@@buttonysquare8501 Holy cow it sounds like you have your hands full!
@@TheBFHGarageI’ve got all of the mechanicals done now except rebuilding the power steering pump. I can probably get the wheels on tomorrow and finally have some brakes, then I can drop in the 300 when I get a chance. Then I can get that broke in and get some body work done. I think it’s gonna be pretty sweet. I rebuilt the steering box, axles, motor, carb, transfer case, transmission, alternator, and calipers all with the help of UA-cam and forums. Your differential videos have been the clearest out of every channel I have watched for axles and I thank you for that. I feel like I should eventually start making videos since I spend so much time doing this stuff and half of it most people don’t do themselves and the do’s and don’ts aren’t readily available on the internet. Luckily my machinist is an old timer who is very knowledgeable and is happy to share information when I need it if I can’t find my answer.
Would sitting in stop and go traffic go towards cooling down the diff oil?
No lol
@TheBFHGarage I just upgraded my stock 4.10 to 4.88 gear ratio in my 80 series landcruiser. The ride is bumpy from 0-15mph (like a vibration) and when I let off the gas to slow down I can hear what I can only describe as a metal on metal noise.
Will it eventually get better or could something else be seriously wrong?
@@MistakenMedia that will not get better. It should be smooth from the get go. Something isn't right.
@@TheBFHGarage uh oh. Good thing I had a professional shop do it with a warranty. I'll go back and have them check it out.
Based on what you say here, I guess I'm screwed. I just installed my first gear set...improperly. I was using the harbor freight vice grip dial indicator, and I just couldn't get a good read on the backlash. I couldn't understand why my pattern ran all the way across the tooth. I drove it as long as it took to hear some noise on the coast side, and immediately knew it was wrong. I brought it back, opened it up, and all the teeth are polished...no more coating. I got the magnetic base and saw that it was actually about 15 thousandths where the other base was showing me 9. I went back in and adjusted backlash properly. The pattern now looks like a football, albeit one with a slightly flat bottom, maybe a touch deep. I'm hearing a little noise between 40 and 50 mph. The noise isn't horrible, and those less paranoid than myself probably wouldn't notice. What would you do?
I'd have to see what was done. Run it and worst case scenario is you get to do it again!
Interesting video which leaves me with one question. How do new car gears survive without their owners following these run in recommendation?
The gears are lapped by the manufacturer. They make the gears and they set up the axles. Aftermarket gears are made in a different factory we whereas Dana makes theirs in the USA.
@@TheBFHGarage ..not 2 split atoms...but u said in the video..."all" gear sets r lap'd & u showed the laping pattern on the new set...!...im not say'n that what u said is wrong...!...we did a lot of gear sets back in the 70ies & 80ies...& i never remember a set have'n break in info...!..?...we primeraly used Richmond,Zoom, or factory gear sets...(did not have the slection back then)..never had a come back...?..?..the owners manual on new cars (back then)dont even recomend changing the gear lube till like 60,000 to 80,000 miles (NOT that i agree with that)...have serviced mine every 30,000 thousand,give or take a few miles & used nothing but dealer/factory gear lube....were the gear sets made differantly back than,or made out of better steal...?...just woundering...first time i ever heard of break in on a gear set...thats why I watch'd the video...thanks....
@@brianalbrecht4423 I appreciate the comment on this video and that you stopped by to watch. I'm not a gear manufacturer so I can't answer your questions with authority. However, I can say that I have spoken to a couple of different gear manufacturers and have obtained this info directly from them. Like I said in the video, new vehicles have their gears processed by the manufacturer so when the sell them to a car maker, they are already prepped for immediate use (whatever that may be). go to any aftermarket gear manufacturer and you'll see instructions for a break in procedure. I can't say what the differences were between the 80's and now that would require it. I just don't know. But if a gear manufacturer will only warranty gears that were properly broken in, well then that's what needs to happen. I have seen several examples that showed gears that were and were not broken in.
@@TheBFHGarage ok..thank u for the reply....sounds to me like...its either differant metal combinations,or the companys r just try'n to cover there buts on returns from people that dont set ring & pinions up right & try & blame the gear companys...thank u...
How about the front differential, 4 wd engaged part time, full time or not at all during the break in period?
What should happen and what actually happens are two different things IMHO. Theoretically speaking, there should be a load applied when breaking in the gears. So when talking about the front axle, it would make sense to disconnect the rear axle, drive it in 4wd using the front axle which would apply said load. In reality though, nobody ever does that and the front gets broken in passively. I wouldn't break in the front using 4wd (both shafts installed) on a dry surface,
@@TheBFHGarage thanks for that feedback and honest advise. I have recently completed a gear swap thanks to your videos. Anyhow, I'm currently 700 miles deep into the new gear swap and everything looks, feels and sound good. By the way, I also used the revolution gear set per your recommendation.
I’m getting a little ring noise when breaking with revolution 5:13 on the rear. The first set did the same thing but louder. The gears were replaced but still getting a little. Will this hurt anything?
@@GoneAgain-Outdoors did you set them up or somebody else? Do you have a picture of the final pattern? What was your pinion pre-load set at? Any sound like that is not normal in regular gear sets.
@@TheBFHGarage I had a shop do it. He said that everything was in spec and it is the second set that was doing it. It’s a low whistle type of noise not grinding or anything.
Totally agree with the quality of Revolution gears. Great customer service as well. Yukon can shove it. They are over hyped, over advertised, over priced and under deliver