@@BlackPill-pu4vi a manual valve body conversion is no big deal, its been done a million times. Sorry but You are mistaken, even a manual clutch when disengaged applies some torque to the input shaft. Due to friction. THERE IS NEVER A TOTAL DISCONNECT. You can try this by running a car in gear in the air with the clutch pedal down. The wheels will SLOWLY spin (unless the brakes are binding). Infact if you disconnected the input shaft it would stall, while the rest of the gearbox will run at the wheel speed, making it much harder to shift. In order to shift the speed of the input and output shafts has to match, utilizing a brake {not a lock) will make it much easier to shift.
@@BlackPill-pu4vi The output side shouldn't stall the engine. It's the same thing as when the car is stopped in gear (automatic or manual with the torque converter in the video). You can't stop the input side that is connected to the engine flywheel/flexplate though as that will stall the engine.
@@Cyrix2k I wasn't clear. It won't stop the engine. It will stop the car because the proposed brake on the TC output is attached to the input of the gearbox.
@@pepperfish_ I'd have been more elaborate but, often yt hides full form replies. Yes, there is a small amount of force from a disengaged clutch due to friction. But, the dog clutches can handle that. What is coming out of a TC is too much and grinding is the result.
@@Hrossey No, a normal dry plate clutch in series with a fluid coupling. This became an 'automatic' with the addition of a then-common overdrive unit behind the transmission (but it was actually set up for underdrive vs direct drive). There were two ranges, 'low' (with the gear selector in the equivalent of 2nd gear on a 3-on-the tree), and 'normal' (with the selector in high gear). You pressed the clutch to go into one of these ranges. After that, you relied on the overdrive unit to switch between underdrive and direct drive. They had the reputation of being pretty sluggish in normal range, but they did offer two pedal driving once you selected a gear.
I don’t know how big the team at garage 54 is but this is seriously impressive, this is the difference between a mechanic and a parts changer. It takes some serious knowledge and knowhow about the actual mechanics behind components in a car. Every good mechanic has had thought what they are doing for years, make something stupid work and being completely useless at the same time. Thank god for youtube advertisements that make this possible. Every episode I’m on the edge of my seat if it will work and how it will work
@@awdrifter3394 Discovery Turbo had some amazing shows. I forgot the names of many though. There was one where 3 teams were tasked to build some crazy stuff and race them. It was an epic show.
That's is so crazy. The things we learned in auto class and was told not to try.... These wonderful men are bringing mechanics to a whole different level. Thank you guys from the USA
Probably cause cars are complex machines on best of times and if you are working on customers cars, you dont want mechanics trying some experimental things on them, specially since manufacturers have instructions on how to repair it. Of course that system has its flaws and there are the few who ignore these. Hell how hard it is to find mechanic that does not mind doing EGR by pass mod to customers vehicle for legal reasons. Hell even to replace part with the same cheaper part from another make and model, simply cause for instance i tried to check the drivers window lift switch/motor fault on Clio mk2 with wrecker part of Megane. Sure drivers window went up and down on drivers side, until it didnt and putting back the old switch, now the passenger side that did work, wont work no longer, so i presume something else broke, even though it was identical part that bolted in place with out issues. When working on electronics trying things might cause even more issues, hence why mechanics tend to replace things with new parts until fault it found, in detriment of the customers wallet.
@@Hellsong89 learn, experiment, risk. Known as LER method. A high gamble way to learn about something, even if you don't have cash, it will give you high rewards in the end.
Just goes to show you how even tho vehicles can be complex... the human mind can't be governed .. just because you "shouldn't" ...doesn't me "you can't" That's why it's called trial and error
This is the same system as used by Jim Hall with his Chaparral 2 series of Canam racers of the 1960s. He used a torque converter with a 3-speed manual gearbox. As in the video, the cars could only be started when the transmission was in gear. This setup left the driver's left foot free to operate the high mounted rear wing; he pushed the pedal to flatten the wing when running down straights. The cars were innovative and successful, although they never won the championship, always beaten by the McLarens.
Add a clutch between the torque converter and transmission for easy gear changes, then weld some cooling fins on the converter. You will you will have what Chrysler had in the 40's and 50's - Fluid Drive. I own two Fluid Drive cars and they are both a pleasure to drive.
Torque converter (from automatic transmission) increases the torque output from the engine up to 2x(the more it “slips” the nearest you come to the 2x value), that’s why it was happy to toe the van.
I do wonder what the manual, without the transmission losses, would have done. Probably the speed it would want to be in while towing, wouldn't be an RPM the engine wants to be in, in first gear, so you would need to slip the manual clutch, wasting energy and not torque multiplying anything.
@@thevirqthink that in a manual transmission your engine power curve correlates with the gearbox output shaft rpm. in an auto/torque converter you can manipulate more the power since when the engine starts "slipping" you don't gain more speed but you gain more torque. that's why small forklift are able to move 3 ton (counterweight and load) easily with a very small engine.
The is a misconception on what torque converters do actually. They don’t increase torque. They allow the engine to spin at a fast revolution than the input shaft of the transmission so that you are getting more toward the peak output of the engines power while the transmission is going slower.
When I was in service in 1994 we had the DAF YGZ. This also had a manual gearbox with a torque converter. You could drive away in any gear,it took a little longer if you started in the highest gear. These YGZs were used to transport, launch and retrieve folding bridge sections and the associated push boats. These trucks could drive up almost any river bank with a fully loaded push boat or bridge section. This was due to the torque converter that generated so much torque.
@@otm646 What I remember is that you could drive away in any gear with no problems. These trucks also had coolers for different types of fluids, including one for the transmission. I don't recall having a single problem with this system.
@@otm646 Basically the same as in the Finnish Sisu SA-240 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sisu_SA-240 IIRC it has a temperature gauge for the ATF, same system is also used as a hydraulic retarder. It has a regular automatic gearbox cooling circuit. If it was a hot summers day and you drove with payload in deep sand with higher gears constantly slipping the TC then it would start heating up.
The 1978 MAN mil gl offroad truck used a standard 6-speed manual gearbox with a clutch AND a torque converter. So you can shift without grinding your gears, but you don't need the clutch pedal for anything else. It also had automatic torque converter lockup for every gear (even reverse). So when you drive fast on the highway, the torque converter is bypassed and does not eat energy. But when you slowly creep up a hill in an off-road situation, the torque converter is really useful with multiplying the torque. And it also allows you to drive slower than the idle rpm in first gear, without slipping the clutch. That is really good off road.
The combination of a manual clutch with an automatic is great for drag racing. You only need the clutch to get moving then shift fast without using the clutch.
@@ClosestNearUtopia Old drag racing trick before the transbrake method, was a way to get the rpms up high for taking off and not having to worry about missing a gear like in a manuel, basically best of both world on paper anyways.
@@ClosestNearUtopia You forgo the torque converter. they're heavy and cost some power. When you have low gears in the rear with a close ratio transmission and really rev the car up the torque multiplication only helps on the launch. A light flywheel and clutch can be faster. At least it was back in the day,
But we both know without the circulating fluid and a trans cooler, the TC would overheat quickly. In this case you probably would not know it until it blows up (cracks with rapid boiling fluid loss).
At the very end, it looked like there was some smoke coming off the torque converter, I'll bet that thing was way too hot to touch after towing the van. To get it to lock, they'd need to add some additional fluid paths to engage the internal lock plate.
Very similar to Ford , New Holland, international harvester ect. They all used at some point, a converter drive 3 and 4 speed manual transmission in the late 1970's early 1980's in backhoes, dozers, forklifts and some tractors. Tons of torque, low maintenance.
This is not a new idea, it has been used since the 1940's in several models of vehicles. My 1948 Dodge had a similar set up to this with fluid coupling and manual gearbox. Other posters have said the same thing.
This channel actually undertakes every extraneous daydream every kid has when learning about engines, and theorizing about their extreme limits. Love it!
Garage54 is soon becoming a 1M+ youtube channel. Will you guys dedicate a video to introduce the guys working on these fun videos tiredlessly for a long time? It would mean a lot for anyone following the channel and I am sure they are all deserve to be known. Great teamwork all the time!
I'm glad you guys are finally doing this. I suggested this 7/8 years ago and several times since. I think it was Oldsmobile that had a clutch torque converter setup back in the sixties but I don't remember the car name or anything. There's had the torque converter mounted solid to a flywheel for an automatic mounted to the crank and on the back side of the converter they mounted a flywheel for a standard transmission and the input shaft from the gearbox was splined into the center part of the torque converter. It was a regular operating manual transmission but if you just stepped on the brake without pushing the clutch in it would not kill the motor and it acted like an automatic in all the selectable gears. You used the clutch and gear shifter like normal but it was a lot smoother than a regular clutch pressure plate setup.
Vw had it on the type 1. It was a three speed with a torque convertor and a friction clutch. There was a brake/clutch pedal so you could shift it when it was stopped.
Yes sir, I came here to make this comment as well. GM definitely did this back in the day with some of the super early Hydramatic transmissions, and I believe Chrysler did it with their Fluid Drive autos. Very interesting setup! I have always been fascinated with automatics. Even learned how to rebuild them eventually! 😎
@@chuckwhitson654 I've successfully rebuilt dozens, couldn't give an exact figure. They were all GM ones though. Anyways, yes sir the fluid clutch is quite neat I think as well!
Mazda rx3 rotary engine cars came with a fluid coupling system . You started moving car by letting out the clutch then every year change after that you just moved gearstick no clutch pedal required up or down the gears and worked perfectly even under race conditions. It was brilliant!
Many older American fork lifts used a torque converter and a manual gear box years ago. They were still pretty common up until about 20 years ago. The idea was that it could be shifted from forward to reverse instantly without damage or the need to use the clutch. (Most still had a clutch as well. The torque converter was ahead of the clutch and flywheel). I had one with that set up until the mid 1990's or so but replaced it with a full hydrostat transmission. The torque converter worked better though, but it used more fuel likely due to slippage.
@@jamesthornton9399 Not instantly, they need to be slowed to crawling speed to avoid shock-loading the clutches in the reverser mechanism. Often there's a separate pedal for forward and reverse.
I own a 5-ton haul truck built for underground mines that uses a similar arrangement. It has a Funk Reversomatic torque converter/reverser that feeds into a Funk 33000 HMD four-speed gearbox. It doesn't have a clutch so gear changes are only made while stopped. Typically I run it in 2nd uphill and 3rd downhill.
So in the late 50s early 60s J.I. Case came out with Case O Matic drive transmission. It was a 8 speed dual range regular manual transmission but instead of a clutch housing they have a torque converter. Theres a "clutch pedal" thats a in or out clutch hydrauliclly actuated you press that pedal down it disengages a motorcycle style multiplate clutch pack between the torque converter and the input shaft of the transmission you press this pedal shift to desired gear then release the pedal and use the brakes for stopping/creeping like you do with a automatic transmission car. Theres a second leaver that engages a torque converter lockup clutch when this leaver is pulled you have direct drive as you would with a normal clutch this is used to gain engine breaking, not building excessive heat with the torque converter and for plowing/pulling implements at a steady speed. I have 2 case 830 tractors they have the exact same 8 speed dual range manual transmission but one has the case o matic torque converter mid section and the other has the regular mechanical clutch mid section. When i use the case o matic 830 in a tractor pull i put the tractor in 3rd gear the torque converter does a amazing job at putting smooth gentle amplified torque to the ground i won first place if my tires started spinning out i would let off the throttle allow them to bite back in then ease back on the throttle all while still in motion. No regular clutch tractor can do that if you let off the throttle to the extent i did the engine would never recover in rpm and it would bog down or stall out. Its a guaranteed way to never stall the engine or run out of power. If the tractor had a regular clutch it definitely wouldn't pull that far in 3rd gear before the engine powered out
The original automatic transmission input shaft probably has a hole through the center. This is for the lockup clutch. Without pressure to the clutch, its not going to lock.
On the Rover 3.5 automatic you had to manually set the gearbox to lock and it was only able to do it in first gear, it also would have a position on the gearstick for lock up in 2nd gear but not in 3rd. I think the slip was only 5% when cruising could be 10% not sure but I know it's not bad. I think though they use the gearbox for quicker acceleration and less use of fuel.
Yes it does. Volkswagen used that for their semi-automatic gearbox called the “Auto-Stick”. A semi-automatic transmission has an automatic clutch, whether actuated by touching the stick shifter (like the Volkswagen Auto-Stick), or by the very shifting between gears (like the system used on the Citroën DS).
Gotta be the most pointless thing ever. I'm disappointed that sticks are going away but it's only because most people can't figure out what the 2nd brake pedal does or how to use it🤦♂️ Not difficult but the typical durrpei can't handle it.
@@fastinradfordable Took all the fun out of engine R&I for sure. Oh and you gotta love "shifter points", I would just want a button on mine if I had to own one. I did build a few trikes with them for wheelchair bound clients and they worked well.
My aunt has a 68 VW Beetle with an auto-stick. Was a problem to get a clutch and the accompanying vacuum tank to actuate that clutch. Around town it is left in second gear and that torque converter does the job well.
The first vehicle I drove was a huge wheel loader that had a manual gearbox (no synchronization so a bit fiddly until you learned) and a torque converter. There were a normal clutch to as otherwise there were no way you would be able to change gears without grinding the gears flat. The torque converter was there so you could run on a low gear and break to a stop without having to use the clutch. So it was a way to make the wheel loader more suited to daily work. There were also a hydraulic part that made it possible to switch from forward to backwards without using the gear box. It also made the maschine go as fast backwards as it went forwards. At least I think it was hydraulic as you didn't have to use the clutch to switch to forwards, neutral or backwards. Again this was a huge wheel loader that had a scoop that could lift about six thousand pounds about 15 to 17 feet in the air. More than that and it would tip over the front wheels. So for typical use you would be going forth and back about as often, and more usually slowly than at road speed. The torque converter was also a way of allowing the driver to start on a high gear when you were to drive on a street as shifting the un synchronized gear box at speed was something you had to train a fair bit to learn. Well I learned, but I also got told by my father that none of his coworkers could do it. It was fun to show him as he didn't know I'd trained to do that. Thing is he was standing in the scoop as I drove up to a light hill. I had been using a higher gear and knew that it wouldn't be enough to get the machine up the road here so I just stepped on the clutch put the gearbox in neutral unclutched and revved the engine, clutch and slap in at the lower gear and get off the clutch. When I started he turned towards me with a smile and I knew he would tell me there were no way I'd make it that way but the ger went in without any scraping and he laughed. I was 12 at the time.
This is remarkable in the fact that it worked this well, you guys a really good at fabricating the parts to make projects like this work. well put together and thought out kudos to all of you from Texas.
In the early 2000's, we got something very similar here in Brazil: an Opel Corsa (branded as Chevrolet Corsa) with the so called "autoclutch" transmission. Basically a manual without a clutch, so you still could change gears yourself.
Yep, Chrysler introduced the Fluid-Drive transmission for the 1939 model year. Lived on until the early 1950’s, ended up getting replaced with a simi-automatic transmission which still had a clutch pedal, but the shifting was done mostly automatically.
Volkswagen had semi-automatics starting in the 60s with some trial runs called Saxomat. By the early 70s, semi-auto setups were being used. Manual gearbox with a torque converter.
I see the magnet but I don't understand what it's doing. Is it pulling something on the inside up so that it can be drilled properly? I've seen a couple of these comments and I'd like to understand so I can appreciate!
@@Chaos_God_of_Fatedrilling a hole inside a delicate and precise mechanism. The magnet keeps the shavings from falling inside the torque converter while drilling through, as the shavings would destroy the transmission by bypassing the filter and getting pumped through the fine passages and butyl solenoid seals.
The madman's brainstorm strikes: Imagine a 4X4 drive train with locked the front and rear differentials and a torque converter in each drive axle to drive the wheels, sounds funny.
Of course it works. As I suggested. Next try thicker oil and set the engine idle rpm as low as possible. (so that the motor does not stop when the converter puts a load on it) We did that on an Opel Ascona and a VW in the 90s. It was a very funny thing, it made much fun ;) People looked at us strangely ;-) But at one point you need a oil cooler if the load is too much for the converter
They guys are so cool. They take a crazy idea and simply ask, what if? The cool part is that they have the mechanical ability to try the idea I've thought of but never had the ability to engineer. Good stuff!
I'm always amazed at the Russian ingenuity - the ability to fabricate things so they fit together, and without such precise measurements, but it still works! Always makes me think we're behind the times in the West, with lots of people who don't have such amazing skills. I'd love to live in Russia.
This idea is brilliant, dodge did it in the late forties under the name "fluid drive". I'd say add in a clutch assembly in between the torque converter and transmission for gear changes as well as a cooling system for the converter. You will never have to worry about stalling again!
Brilliant experiment yet again from these legends! Side note , id love to know how hot the converter/fluid got! Super impressed it continued to pull that van all the way with no oil cooling!!
Glad to see you're not wearing a coat and hat! It's summer at last for you too. The sun is shining and everything is green! Have a nice day! Good project. Greeting from Hungary!
In the 80's Mazda had a 5 speed manual trans with parking gear. It has a t-converter and a clutch (twoo bell housings) behind a 13B rotary engine that was used in small commuter buses... I have two of them.
@@volvo09they could modify the input shaft to feed oil to the converter and the tranny case too route it through an oil cooler via a pump on the engine.
I know the original 1951-1955 Ford "Fordomatic" automatics had an air cooled torque converter! Pretty interesting looking bell housing with vents for cooling and cooling fins on the converter itself.
I've wondered for a long while why we haven't seen at least one niche Car over the years like this. Maybe there are some that exist and I just don't know about them. Nice work as always, I love all the crazy stuff you folks do!
@@thomasparks1943 I can definitely see that as a possibility. I remember the Pontiac vibe was a rebadged Toyota matrix (ironically, only the Pontiac version of that car was available in Japan and not Toyota's)
wow ....i would have never thought that would have worked .....nice job fellas ..... you guys always seem to amaze me with the things you do man ....keep it coming!!!
My 1942 dodge d22 has a fluiddrive which is a manual-automatic so yes what you built was built 80 years ago but i guess it was not the best design. I love the videos you rock!!!
The first car I learned to drive, when I was 13, was a 1950 DeSoto which had a fluid-drive transmission, that consisted of a torque converter and conventional manual disc clutch, coupled to a 3-speed box. My grandad also had a 1951 Dodge pickup that was fluid-drive. It has been about 60 years since I drove this car, but as I recall, you could start the car in first gear without disengaging the clutch, by holding the brake, as long as the engine didn't rev up and remained idling. It was more typical for a driver to disengage the clutch when starting up in gear, however. You could slow down to a stop and remain idling, in first gear, without using the clutch. Shifting up could be done with or without using the clutch. If you downshifted at a fairly precise speed and engine rpm, it was possible to do so without using the clutch pedal, however, to the less experienced driver, this often resulted in significant gear clash, as I recall.
Driving an old school US truck as a daily, I love how smooth it all works and how it pulls if needed. Those torque converters accumulate the engine power, increase the torque and send it to the gear box. But: if the converter is charged up it still sends the torque to the gear box even if you don´t step on the gas. The converter first needs to get rid of the accumulated energy. So if you accelerate hard on the green traffic lights, it will be hard to stop quickly because the converter still sends the accumulated energy to the gear box accelerating the car. Same thing with burnouts. When you start loosing control it is too late because the converter needs to bleed energy first and still pushes the car.
One of the best auto channels on UA-cam. Chrysler built cars in the 40s with a fluid coupling in front of a manual transmission...they called them Fluid Drive
I guess that the fluid in the torque converter was very HOT after towing the van, with no circulation through a cooling radiator, as would normally be the case with an automatic transmission. Nice experiment, and great execution! Well done!
I remember driving one military-grade truck with both clutch and torque converter. It was an interesting experience. Otherwise, it worked as a regular manual except when starting to move. There was no touching the clutch; just releasing the break.
Remember VW had a stick shift 3 spd semi automatic? Not sure if you ever drove one of those. Basically the same as what you have, except you could actually take it in and out of gear with its special system where when you touched the shifter, it would disconnect like a clutch. You could stop like any automatic, but if you were in 3rd, you would have to shift it back to 2nd or first to get going again. It worked well. Thanks for your experiment! Hi from Manitoba, Canada!
I loved this video and recommend for car enthusiasts to watch it. Keep up the good woek. Thank you for considering my request of installing torque converter to a manual gearbox
You guys have great content. Plymouth used a similar setup in the late 1940's in their cars and the design went on thru the early 1960's in fork lifts, using the same flathead 6 engine, standard 3 speed transmission, fluid drive sealed torque converter and a clutch and pressure plate. I think high temp rated silicone gel would work great for your project.
My dad had a '70 VW Type 1 "Beetle" that had a torque converter with a manual. There was no clutch pedal; When you grabbed the shift knob to shift, you made an electrical connection and a vacuum servo disengaged the clutch. You shifted, released the lever, and the clutch engaged, the torque converter was there to make the sudden clutch engagement smooth. Porsche installed something similar called "Sportomatic" in the 914 and some 912's (I don't think the 911 ever had this transmission) back in the day. I really don't see the point of all this. My dad hated manual transmissions! I hate automatic transmissions! I have a PDK in my current '14 Cayman S and I can accept it because it is nearly telepathic and "money shifts" are basically impossible, but I miss the manual I had in my previous Porsche 928S2! Great video!
Same F&S clutch/TC was used in the NSU - Ro80 - 3 speed transaxle. The NSU was front wheel drive with disc brakes mounted on the trans'. The NSU trans could certainly take Maz tricked 12A and 13B power output. Setup as: Engine > Balanced flex plate (NOT a flywheel) > T/C > Stator and Output shaft + bearing + OIL PORTING & SEALS > Clutch assembly and throwout > Gearbox/Diff. A clutch is needed. OIL circulation and a large oil cooler is absolutely necessary.
I'm impressed I've been in I've been a mechanic for over 60 years and I've engineered all kinds of weird things electrical electronics all kinds of stuff and this really is something that's pretty impressive I have to give him a big thumbs up on that good engineering
For the first time watching this, I am grinning in amazement. I honestly didn’t think this would work! Who would have thought? Yea, this is worth digging into!
Random fun fact- some of Ford's industrial tractors and loaders in the 80s-90s had this exact thing- a pretty standard 8-speed tractor transmission, but a torque converter instead of a clutch. You had a shuttle clutch lever on the steering wheel that engaged the torque converter to the rest of the transmission, in either forward or reverse. You also had a manual lockup switch for high-speed or high-load operation. Source- a friend's family owns one. Pretty fun to drive but has a learning curve. It also sucks in the cold, until the fluid is worked a bit and warms up, you barely crawl. The torque converter also means the trans will overheat fast if you're doing heavy work and don't have the lockup engaged.
My Uncle had a 52 Desota with this setup. It had a clutch behind a two speed column shift!! Reverse eas up and back. No first. Second was up and forward It was geared low for getting a trailer moving and braking. Overdrive was down and forward. To start the engine pit it in neutral. Press clutch and select gear. Let out clutch the car will move with more throttle. In high and second you have two speeds. It will shift from low to high by idling the engine. The clutch is only used between second and overdrive. You hear a clunk when it shifts when you take your foot off the gas. It will not shift until you do. They went to a regular transmission two years later It was weird but fun!! Also weird was you could stop and start without the clutch if not loaded. Some Buicks didn’t shift at all. They just got faster!! (Dinaflow)
That was cool! I used to shift my father's Malibu all the time without using the clutch, it was sort of a parlor trick. Of course, it saves wear on the clutch, but it can wear out the synchronizers if you don't carefully match the RPMs. This reminds me of the VW "automatic stickshift" or the Chrysler "HyDrive" (or something like that). Both had torque converters or fluid couplings and clutches, though the clutch on the VW kicked in automatically when you touched the shift lever.
The old VW AutoStick did this, but left the clutch in there. No clutch pedal is used, an automatic clutcher and solenoid on the stickshift was used. I loved it.
I had a dodge with fluid drive. they are not quite a "torque converter" since they have no "stator" inside, They did not multiply torque, just a fluid coupler. .. it was a great system, I wish my power stroke 6 speed manual had a system like that old dodge. it would be a great off road set up.
This already exists in the raceing community, Its called a Lenco Transmission and work with either a clutch or a torque converter " that requiers a pump and cooler". There are also Manuel Transmisions that only need to use the clutch from a dead stop and once moving you can shift with out engaging. Grab Venders "requires a cooler" makes a overdrive module to add onto automatic or manuael transmissions that work of either a speed sensor or a switch. Its great to see these guys building this but the build is ladened with a lot of issues. 1. the pump isn't actually pumping any fluid 2. no cooler 3. the brackets holding the pump in place are sketchy at best 4. the stand off's to gap the etra length are not going to hold up to transfer of much power, hence the bell housing making a flush mount to the engine. 5. and very important, the whole system needs to be ballencet
We had a 1953 Plymouth Cranbrook with a "manual-automatic. It was called "Fluid drive". You put it in any manual gear, let the clutch out and it just sat there, waiting for the gas pedal. First and second worked OK when taking off, but if it was in third, you needed that bumper sticker, "0 to 60 in 15 minutes". To say it was slow takeoff would be an understatement. The system leaked badly so it was converted to an ordinary standard. Excellent car though. General Motors had a "Torque Drive" for a brief moment and I think it was in their (American) Nova and VW had a manual-automatic in the Bug, also for a short time. Things heated up (overheated easily) in both, so it was a no-go. In our Plymouth, we liked the concept. If it hadn't leaked so badly, we easily would have kept it in. The seal kit and the rebuild was way too expensive to do. It worked great though.
add a brake, literally a car disc brake, behind the torque converter so it can be stopped to change between 1st, Neutral and Reverse.
yeah and just run the brake off the clutch pedal and you're golden. The first auto cars had a manual clutch to engage reverse.
@@BlackPill-pu4vi a manual valve body conversion is no big deal, its been done a million times.
Sorry but You are mistaken, even a manual clutch when disengaged applies some torque to the input shaft. Due to friction.
THERE IS NEVER A TOTAL DISCONNECT. You can try this by running a car in gear in the air with the clutch pedal down. The wheels will SLOWLY spin (unless the brakes are binding).
Infact if you disconnected the input shaft it would stall, while the rest of the gearbox will run at the wheel speed, making it much harder to shift. In order to shift the speed of the input and output shafts has to match, utilizing a brake {not a lock) will make it much easier to shift.
@@BlackPill-pu4vi The output side shouldn't stall the engine. It's the same thing as when the car is stopped in gear (automatic or manual with the torque converter in the video). You can't stop the input side that is connected to the engine flywheel/flexplate though as that will stall the engine.
@@Cyrix2k I wasn't clear. It won't stop the engine. It will stop the car because the proposed brake on the TC output is attached to the input of the gearbox.
@@pepperfish_ I'd have been more elaborate but, often yt hides full form replies. Yes, there is a small amount of force from a disengaged clutch due to friction. But, the dog clutches can handle that. What is coming out of a TC is too much and grinding is the result.
Chrysler did what's called "fluid-drive" in the 50s which is a manual transmission with a fluid coupling (similar to a torque converter) and a clutch.
A common wet clutch manual then? (Supercar territory) Chrysler were ahead of their time for sure!
We're converting a 48 Chrysler 6 cylinder to TH350 now.
@@Hrossey No, a normal dry plate clutch in series with a fluid coupling. This became an 'automatic' with the addition of a then-common overdrive unit behind the transmission (but it was actually set up for underdrive vs direct drive). There were two ranges, 'low' (with the gear selector in the equivalent of 2nd gear on a 3-on-the tree), and 'normal' (with the selector in high gear). You pressed the clutch to go into one of these ranges. After that, you relied on the overdrive unit to switch between underdrive and direct drive. They had the reputation of being pretty sluggish in normal range, but they did offer two pedal driving once you selected a gear.
Koenigsegg uses a torque converter in one of its 150hp cars
You mean 1500hp? @@bogganalseryd2324
I don’t know how big the team at garage 54 is but this is seriously impressive, this is the difference between a mechanic and a parts changer. It takes some serious knowledge and knowhow about the actual mechanics behind components in a car. Every good mechanic has had thought what they are doing for years, make something stupid work and being completely useless at the same time. Thank god for youtube advertisements that make this possible. Every episode I’m on the edge of my seat if it will work and how it will work
It reminds me of the old Discovery Channel' Monster Garage by Jesse James. They create weird vehicles that shouldn't work but kind of does.
@@awdrifter3394 Discovery Turbo had some amazing shows. I forgot the names of many though. There was one where 3 teams were tasked to build some crazy stuff and race them. It was an epic show.
They are proper mad lads and gentlemen I hear. I hope to visit them someday. Greetings from the UK
A real mechanic would know this wouldn’t last 5 miles because he knows how it actually functions and wouldn’t even attempt this stupidity 😂
@@shogunero3.6 Scrapheap Challenge i think is what your talking about, had some real talent on there great show
That's is so crazy. The things we learned in auto class and was told not to try.... These wonderful men are bringing mechanics to a whole different level. Thank you guys from the USA
Probably cause cars are complex machines on best of times and if you are working on customers cars, you dont want mechanics trying some experimental things on them, specially since manufacturers have instructions on how to repair it. Of course that system has its flaws and there are the few who ignore these. Hell how hard it is to find mechanic that does not mind doing EGR by pass mod to customers vehicle for legal reasons. Hell even to replace part with the same cheaper part from another make and model, simply cause for instance i tried to check the drivers window lift switch/motor fault on Clio mk2 with wrecker part of Megane. Sure drivers window went up and down on drivers side, until it didnt and putting back the old switch, now the passenger side that did work, wont work no longer, so i presume something else broke, even though it was identical part that bolted in place with out issues. When working on electronics trying things might cause even more issues, hence why mechanics tend to replace things with new parts until fault it found, in detriment of the customers wallet.
@@Hellsong89 learn, experiment, risk. Known as LER method. A high gamble way to learn about something, even if you don't have cash, it will give you high rewards in the end.
Just goes to show you how even tho vehicles can be complex... the human mind can't be governed .. just because you "shouldn't" ...doesn't me "you can't"
That's why it's called trial and error
This is the same system as used by Jim Hall with his Chaparral 2 series of Canam racers of the 1960s. He used a torque converter with a 3-speed manual gearbox. As in the video, the cars could only be started when the transmission was in gear. This setup left the driver's left foot free to operate the high mounted rear wing; he pushed the pedal to flatten the wing when running down straights. The cars were innovative and successful, although they never won the championship, always beaten by the McLarens.
Another little fact to love those cars even more. Thanks!
Add a clutch between the torque converter and transmission for easy gear changes, then weld some cooling fins on the converter. You will you will have what Chrysler had in the 40's and 50's - Fluid Drive. I own two Fluid Drive cars and they are both a pleasure to drive.
Torque converter (from automatic transmission) increases the torque output from the engine up to 2x(the more it “slips” the nearest you come to the 2x value), that’s why it was happy to toe the van.
I do wonder what the manual, without the transmission losses, would have done. Probably the speed it would want to be in while towing, wouldn't be an RPM the engine wants to be in, in first gear, so you would need to slip the manual clutch, wasting energy and not torque multiplying anything.
Why it doesn't improve car power then? Manual and automatic cars with the same engine have same power
@@thevirq car engines are measured at the crank, not the wheels
@@thevirqthink that in a manual transmission your engine power curve correlates with the gearbox output shaft rpm. in an auto/torque converter you can manipulate more the power since when the engine starts "slipping" you don't gain more speed but you gain more torque. that's why small forklift are able to move 3 ton (counterweight and load) easily with a very small engine.
The is a misconception on what torque converters do actually. They don’t increase torque. They allow the engine to spin at a fast revolution than the input shaft of the transmission so that you are getting more toward the peak output of the engines power while the transmission is going slower.
When I was in service in 1994 we had the DAF YGZ. This also had a manual gearbox with a torque converter. You could drive away in any gear,it took a little longer if you started in the highest gear.
These YGZs were used to transport, launch and retrieve folding bridge sections and the associated push boats. These trucks could drive up almost any river bank with a fully loaded push boat or bridge section. This was due to the torque converter that generated so much torque.
Cool
Can I put one in my Honda ?
Were there instructions to prevent overheating the torque converter? Or did it not matter, could you start in any gear without issue?
@@fastinradfordablewith some modifications to the engine/transmission joint setup, sure.
@@otm646 What I remember is that you could drive away in any gear with no problems. These trucks also had coolers for different types of fluids, including one for the transmission. I don't recall having a single problem with this system.
@@otm646 Basically the same as in the Finnish Sisu SA-240 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sisu_SA-240
IIRC it has a temperature gauge for the ATF, same system is also used as a hydraulic retarder. It has a regular automatic gearbox cooling circuit.
If it was a hot summers day and you drove with payload in deep sand with higher gears constantly slipping the TC then it would start heating up.
The 1978 MAN mil gl offroad truck used a standard 6-speed manual gearbox with a clutch AND a torque converter. So you can shift without grinding your gears, but you don't need the clutch pedal for anything else.
It also had automatic torque converter lockup for every gear (even reverse).
So when you drive fast on the highway, the torque converter is bypassed and does not eat energy.
But when you slowly creep up a hill in an off-road situation, the torque converter is really useful with multiplying the torque. And it also allows you to drive slower than the idle rpm in first gear, without slipping the clutch. That is really good off road.
Wandler my beloved
Nice
The combination of a manual clutch with an automatic is great for drag racing. You only need the clutch to get moving then shift fast without using the clutch.
Clutchflite old-school
Why if you have a torque converter you need a clutch? You could multiply some torque without it..?
@@ClosestNearUtopia Old drag racing trick before the transbrake method, was a way to get the rpms up high for taking off and not having to worry about missing a gear like in a manuel, basically best of both world on paper anyways.
@@ClosestNearUtopia You forgo the torque converter. they're heavy and cost some power. When you have low gears in the rear with a close ratio transmission and really rev the car up the torque multiplication only helps on the launch. A light flywheel and clutch can be faster. At least it was back in the day,
It was so you could rev the engine then shift it like a auto. It was before high stall converters. @ClosestNearUtopia
This is like watching a Soviet era contraband western movie with the home made voice over. Very interesting and watchable channel, many thanks 😊
Pulling the van clearly demonstrates the mechanical advantage of the torque multiplication afforded by the converter
But we both know without the circulating fluid and a trans cooler, the TC would overheat quickly. In this case you probably would not know it until it blows up (cracks with rapid boiling fluid loss).
At the very end, it looked like there was some smoke coming off the torque converter, I'll bet that thing was way too hot to touch after towing the van. To get it to lock, they'd need to add some additional fluid paths to engage the internal lock plate.
Super cool video! I love stuff like this
Converter Boil over explosion sounds like a good one for the Russian disaster crew
These in-depth videos are much better than just a bit of B-roll and then testing.
I love to see how the boys figure things out and overcome problems.
I love this channel, they do the craziest stuff that all of us would love to try but can't, due to lack of funds, time, or fabrication abilities
Now we need Manual style clutch with an automatic transmission!
They did that back in the old days of racing it was a clutchflite
robotized clutch ? like the bvmp gearbox ?
I've seen it done in a Toyota trophy truck. Foot clutch with a turbo 400 trans I believe. I'd still like to see it done.
ZF 8HP can do that already. Look up ZF 8HP Clutch Pedal.
@@Borgschulzecar friends are the best❤
Very similar to Ford , New Holland, international harvester ect. They all used at some point, a converter drive 3 and 4 speed manual transmission in the late 1970's early 1980's in backhoes, dozers, forklifts and some tractors. Tons of torque, low maintenance.
I remember Farmall M on a farm I worked had that.
Allis-Chalmers.
Powershift or something like that they called it?
Turbomatic
@@goosenotmaverick1156
@@goosenotmaverick1156 That was John Deere's version. Had it on an old 4020 from the 60's. Junk.
You are always coming up with my daily brainstorms! Many others I have never thought of! Great video! Thank you
This is not a new idea, it has been used since the 1940's in several models of vehicles. My 1948 Dodge had a similar set up to this with fluid coupling and manual gearbox. Other posters have said the same thing.
This channel actually undertakes every extraneous daydream every kid has when learning about engines, and theorizing about their extreme limits. Love it!
Garage54 is soon becoming a 1M+ youtube channel. Will you guys dedicate a video to introduce the guys working on these fun videos tiredlessly for a long time? It would mean a lot for anyone following the channel and I am sure they are all deserve to be known. Great teamwork all the time!
I'm glad you guys are finally doing this. I suggested this 7/8 years ago and several times since. I think it was Oldsmobile that had a clutch torque converter setup back in the sixties but I don't remember the car name or anything. There's had the torque converter mounted solid to a flywheel for an automatic mounted to the crank and on the back side of the converter they mounted a flywheel for a standard transmission and the input shaft from the gearbox was splined into the center part of the torque converter. It was a regular operating manual transmission but if you just stepped on the brake without pushing the clutch in it would not kill the motor and it acted like an automatic in all the selectable gears. You used the clutch and gear shifter like normal but it was a lot smoother than a regular clutch pressure plate setup.
Vw had it on the type 1. It was a three speed with a torque convertor and a friction clutch. There was a brake/clutch pedal so you could shift it when it was stopped.
I been suggesting someone do this for over 15 years. Glad to see them do it
Yes sir, I came here to make this comment as well. GM definitely did this back in the day with some of the super early Hydramatic transmissions, and I believe Chrysler did it with their Fluid Drive autos. Very interesting setup! I have always been fascinated with automatics. Even learned how to rebuild them eventually! 😎
You successful rebuilt how many?
It doesn't matter
This idea a fluid coupler type clutch is way cooler
@@chuckwhitson654 I've successfully rebuilt dozens, couldn't give an exact figure. They were all GM ones though. Anyways, yes sir the fluid clutch is quite neat I think as well!
We had a truck with manual 6 speed gear, clutch AND torque converter. It drove exelently.
Mazda rx3 rotary engine cars came with a fluid coupling system . You started moving car by letting out the clutch then every year change after that you just moved gearstick no clutch pedal required up or down the gears and worked perfectly even under race conditions. It was brilliant!
Mazda TQX Transmission
Many older American fork lifts used a torque converter and a manual gear box years ago. They were still pretty common up until about 20 years ago.
The idea was that it could be shifted from forward to reverse instantly without damage or the need to use the clutch. (Most still had a clutch as well. The torque converter was ahead of the clutch and flywheel). I had one with that set up until the mid 1990's or so but replaced it with a full hydrostat transmission. The torque converter worked better though, but it used more fuel likely due to slippage.
Some how I do not think from forward to reverse instantly. ?????
@@jamesthornton9399 Not instantly, they need to be slowed to crawling speed to avoid shock-loading the clutches in the reverser mechanism. Often there's a separate pedal for forward and reverse.
I own a 5-ton haul truck built for underground mines that uses a similar arrangement. It has a Funk Reversomatic torque converter/reverser that feeds into a Funk 33000 HMD four-speed gearbox. It doesn't have a clutch so gear changes are only made while stopped. Typically I run it in 2nd uphill and 3rd downhill.
So in the late 50s early 60s J.I. Case came out with Case O Matic drive transmission. It was a 8 speed dual range regular manual transmission but instead of a clutch housing they have a torque converter. Theres a "clutch pedal" thats a in or out clutch hydrauliclly actuated you press that pedal down it disengages a motorcycle style multiplate clutch pack between the torque converter and the input shaft of the transmission you press this pedal shift to desired gear then release the pedal and use the brakes for stopping/creeping like you do with a automatic transmission car. Theres a second leaver that engages a torque converter lockup clutch when this leaver is pulled you have direct drive as you would with a normal clutch this is used to gain engine breaking, not building excessive heat with the torque converter and for plowing/pulling implements at a steady speed. I have 2 case 830 tractors they have the exact same 8 speed dual range manual transmission but one has the case o matic torque converter mid section and the other has the regular mechanical clutch mid section. When i use the case o matic 830 in a tractor pull i put the tractor in 3rd gear the torque converter does a amazing job at putting smooth gentle amplified torque to the ground i won first place if my tires started spinning out i would let off the throttle allow them to bite back in then ease back on the throttle all while still in motion. No regular clutch tractor can do that if you let off the throttle to the extent i did the engine would never recover in rpm and it would bog down or stall out. Its a guaranteed way to never stall the engine or run out of power. If the tractor had a regular clutch it definitely wouldn't pull that far in 3rd gear before the engine powered out
The original automatic transmission input shaft probably has a hole through the center. This is for the lockup clutch. Without pressure to the clutch, its not going to lock.
Yep. Hydraulic pressure is what activates it, and there's no pressure.
On the Rover 3.5 automatic you had to manually set the gearbox to lock and it was only able to do it in first gear, it also would have a position on the gearstick for lock up in 2nd gear but not in 3rd. I think the slip was only 5% when cruising could be 10% not sure but I know it's not bad. I think though they use the gearbox for quicker acceleration and less use of fuel.
@@Moonlightshadow-lq4froh yea the rover 3.5 was very fuel efficient😂😂😂
@@fastinradfordable Imagine if it didn't have a gearbox then :)
Correct, you can see the lock-up supply hole at 3 min 29 sec.
The BEST bailing wire, chewing gum and duct tape engineers on EARTH . Great job guys . :)
Yes it does. Volkswagen used that for their semi-automatic gearbox called the “Auto-Stick”. A semi-automatic transmission has an automatic clutch, whether actuated by touching the stick shifter (like the Volkswagen Auto-Stick), or by the very shifting between gears (like the system used on the Citroën DS).
Gotta be the most pointless thing ever. I'm disappointed that sticks are going away but it's only because most people can't figure out what the 2nd brake pedal does or how to use it🤦♂️
Not difficult but the typical durrpei can't handle it.
God I hated those
@@fastinradfordableand now we have dsg. A dual clutch computer shifted manual transmission.
@@fastinradfordable Took all the fun out of engine R&I for sure. Oh and you gotta love "shifter points", I would just want a button on mine if I had to own one. I did build a few trikes with them for wheelchair bound clients and they worked well.
My aunt has a 68 VW Beetle with an auto-stick. Was a problem to get a clutch and the accompanying vacuum tank to actuate that clutch. Around town it is left in second gear and that torque converter does the job well.
I really like the way you work with these young men letting them try new things and making it possible for them to learn, Big Respect 👍
The first vehicle I drove was a huge wheel loader that had a manual gearbox (no synchronization so a bit fiddly until you learned) and a torque converter. There were a normal clutch to as otherwise there were no way you would be able to change gears without grinding the gears flat. The torque converter was there so you could run on a low gear and break to a stop without having to use the clutch. So it was a way to make the wheel loader more suited to daily work. There were also a hydraulic part that made it possible to switch from forward to backwards without using the gear box. It also made the maschine go as fast backwards as it went forwards. At least I think it was hydraulic as you didn't have to use the clutch to switch to forwards, neutral or backwards. Again this was a huge wheel loader that had a scoop that could lift about six thousand pounds about 15 to 17 feet in the air. More than that and it would tip over the front wheels. So for typical use you would be going forth and back about as often, and more usually slowly than at road speed. The torque converter was also a way of allowing the driver to start on a high gear when you were to drive on a street as shifting the un synchronized gear box at speed was something you had to train a fair bit to learn. Well I learned, but I also got told by my father that none of his coworkers could do it. It was fun to show him as he didn't know I'd trained to do that. Thing is he was standing in the scoop as I drove up to a light hill. I had been using a higher gear and knew that it wouldn't be enough to get the machine up the road here so I just stepped on the clutch put the gearbox in neutral unclutched and revved the engine, clutch and slap in at the lower gear and get off the clutch. When I started he turned towards me with a smile and I knew he would tell me there were no way I'd make it that way but the ger went in without any scraping and he laughed. I was 12 at the time.
This is remarkable in the fact that it worked this well, you guys a really good at fabricating the parts to make projects like this work. well put together and thought out kudos to all of you from Texas.
In the early 2000's, we got something very similar here in Brazil: an Opel Corsa (branded as Chevrolet Corsa) with the so called "autoclutch" transmission. Basically a manual without a clutch, so you still could change gears yourself.
"gear heads" are universal! This is a wonderful video! Much love ❤
That's a crafty ass mechanic right there. Respect 🤘🏻
This was literally in my mind for years, you finally made a video about this topic
My fathers 1941 Dodge had a system called Fluid Drive, A torque converter on a manual clutch/trans
Yep, Chrysler introduced the Fluid-Drive transmission for the 1939 model year. Lived on until the early 1950’s, ended up getting replaced with a simi-automatic transmission which still had a clutch pedal, but the shifting was done mostly automatically.
Was that a torque converter or a hydraulic pump though? I know you can get hydraulic drives but nothing about them just that they are very powerful.
@@seana806 Hi Sean! Funny seeing you here :)
@@porcupinepunch6893 think you are subscribed to me if I am not mistaken?
@@porcupinepunch6893 think you are subscribed to me?
Volkswagen had semi-automatics starting in the 60s with some trial runs called Saxomat. By the early 70s, semi-auto setups were being used. Manual gearbox with a torque converter.
My dad had a 68 convertible with an "autostick".
Probably the best channel that fills the void in curiosity!!
nice trick with the magnet 2:15
I see the magnet but I don't understand what it's doing. Is it pulling something on the inside up so that it can be drilled properly? I've seen a couple of these comments and I'd like to understand so I can appreciate!
@@Chaos_God_of_Fatedrilling a hole inside a delicate and precise mechanism. The magnet keeps the shavings from falling inside the torque converter while drilling through, as the shavings would destroy the transmission by bypassing the filter and getting pumped through the fine passages and butyl solenoid seals.
Add a pump with a solenoid into the input shaft to activate the clutch in the torque converter
A magnet from a busted old speaker nonetheless. Lol. Good stuff!
What is that black stuff covering the old Lada? Zimmirite anti magnet paste?
This Dude is so entertaining, this is one "Scroll" I don't consider a waste of time. Keep up the GOOD Brother MAN!!
I hope your channel doesnt get caught up in the UA-cam ban. It would be a shame to loose Garage 54. You guys are excellent entertainment
UA-cam censorship bah what a world its becoming... I hope not either.
The madman's brainstorm strikes: Imagine a 4X4 drive train with locked the front and rear differentials and a torque converter in each drive axle to drive the wheels, sounds funny.
Sounds like all the power and torque
this guy just goes and tests the ideas I ponder in my mind when im bored at work. love it
Of course it works. As I suggested.
Next try thicker oil and set the engine idle rpm as low as possible. (so that the motor does not stop when the converter puts a load on it)
We did that on an Opel Ascona and a VW in the 90s. It was a very funny thing, it made much fun ;) People looked at us strangely ;-)
But at one point you need a oil cooler if the load is too much for the converter
thinner oil and less oil
Thicker oil? Why? In the crankcase or in the torque converter?
@@tylerhoover1770 in the torque converter of course :)
They guys are so cool. They take a crazy idea and simply ask, what if? The cool part is that they have the mechanical ability to try the idea I've thought of but never had the ability to engineer. Good stuff!
I'm always amazed at the Russian ingenuity - the ability to fabricate things so they fit together, and without such precise measurements, but it still works! Always makes me think we're behind the times in the West, with lots of people who don't have such amazing skills. I'd love to live in Russia.
Necesity is the mother of invention. These guys often can't get the parts they need, so they make do somehow.
This idea is brilliant, dodge did it in the late forties under the name "fluid drive".
I'd say add in a clutch assembly in between the torque converter and transmission for gear changes as well as a cooling system for the converter.
You will never have to worry about stalling again!
2:18 Great use of the magnets from a magnetron!
or from a simple speaker
@@Sekir80 More closely resembles magnetron magnets; I've scrapped out so many microwaves!
@@TiborRoussou I haven't disassemble a magnetron, yet so I'm sure you know more than me. Now, I know what to expect!
The great thing about youtube, it makes people do things, they never would have done. Love garage 54.
Brilliant experiment yet again from these legends! Side note , id love to know how hot the converter/fluid got! Super impressed it continued to pull that van all the way with no oil cooling!!
2:22 drilling a hole with a ring magnet around is an excellent idea
Glad to see you're not wearing a coat and hat!
It's summer at last for you too.
The sun is shining and everything is green!
Have a nice day! Good project.
Greeting from Hungary!
Please get a limo, and connect multiple gear boxes and auto transmissions to it and then have multiple seats with a few people all changing gears.
In the 80's Mazda had a 5 speed manual trans with parking gear. It has a t-converter and a clutch (twoo bell housings) behind a 13B rotary engine that was used in small commuter buses... I have two of them.
That torque converter was probably super hot by the time he finished the high torque runs. Why transmissions have oil cooling radiators
You could see a bit of smoke from it when they parked.
I was hoping they would overheat it to failure!
@@volvo09they could modify the input shaft to feed oil to the converter and the tranny case too route it through an oil cooler via a pump on the engine.
I know the original 1951-1955 Ford "Fordomatic" automatics had an air cooled torque converter! Pretty interesting looking bell housing with vents for cooling and cooling fins on the converter itself.
I've wondered for a long while why we haven't seen at least one niche Car over the years like this. Maybe there are some that exist and I just don't know about them. Nice work as always, I love all the crazy stuff you folks do!
10:30 how in the world did a Chevy cavalier make it all the way to Russia?
Might be a Toyota Cavalier during a joint venture with gm.
@@thomasparks1943 I can definitely see that as a possibility. I remember the Pontiac vibe was a rebadged Toyota matrix (ironically, only the Pontiac version of that car was available in Japan and not Toyota's)
Gm manufactured cars in Russia probably up until sanctions
wow ....i would have never thought that would have worked .....nice job fellas ..... you guys always seem to amaze me with the things you do man ....keep it coming!!!
What is the absolute best anti-theft device for use in vehicles in the USA? A manual gearbox.
Younger people are increasing the manual transmission take-rate. Times are changing for the better!
My 1942 dodge d22 has a fluiddrive which is a manual-automatic so yes what you built was built 80 years ago but i guess it was not the best design. I love the videos you rock!!!
The first car I learned to drive, when I was 13, was a 1950 DeSoto which had a fluid-drive transmission, that consisted of a torque converter and conventional manual disc clutch, coupled to a 3-speed box. My grandad also had a 1951 Dodge pickup that was fluid-drive. It has been about 60 years since I drove this car, but as I recall, you could start the car in first gear without disengaging the clutch, by holding the brake, as long as the engine didn't rev up and remained idling. It was more typical for a driver to disengage the clutch when starting up in gear, however. You could slow down to a stop and remain idling, in first gear, without using the clutch. Shifting up could be done with or without using the clutch. If you downshifted at a fairly precise speed and engine rpm, it was possible to do so without using the clutch pedal, however, to the less experienced driver, this often resulted in significant gear clash, as I recall.
Driving an old school US truck as a daily, I love how smooth it all works and how it pulls if needed. Those torque converters accumulate the engine power, increase the torque and send it to the gear box. But: if the converter is charged up it still sends the torque to the gear box even if you don´t step on the gas. The converter first needs to get rid of the accumulated energy. So if you accelerate hard on the green traffic lights, it will be hard to stop quickly because the converter still sends the accumulated energy to the gear box accelerating the car. Same thing with burnouts. When you start loosing control it is too late because the converter needs to bleed energy first and still pushes the car.
One of the best auto channels on UA-cam. Chrysler built cars in the 40s with a fluid coupling in front of a manual transmission...they called them Fluid Drive
Привет и крепкие объятия из Коста-Рики.
Всегда приятно смотреть ваши видео, продолжайте в том же духе
Вашими молитвами, как говорится) спасибо, привет Коста-Рике)
Very cool!!! Nice Display of the fluid transfer coupling Multiplying torque!!!!👍😸
I guess that the fluid in the torque converter was very HOT after towing the van, with no circulation through a cooling radiator, as would normally be the case with an automatic transmission. Nice experiment, and great execution! Well done!
For every amazing job this guy do, there's a Lada making it possible! ❤Lada!
I remember driving one military-grade truck with both clutch and torque converter. It was an interesting experience. Otherwise, it worked as a regular manual except when starting to move. There was no touching the clutch; just releasing the break.
The stuff these guys do is truly amazing I can’t believe they can figure all this out
Remember VW had a stick shift 3 spd semi automatic? Not sure if you ever drove one of those. Basically the same as what you have, except you could actually take it in and out of gear with its special system where when you touched the shifter, it would disconnect like a clutch. You could stop like any automatic, but if you were in 3rd, you would have to shift it back to 2nd or first to get going again. It worked well. Thanks for your experiment! Hi from Manitoba, Canada!
I loved this video and recommend for car enthusiasts to watch it. Keep up the good woek. Thank you for considering my request of installing torque converter to a manual gearbox
That's pretty cool. You guys really come up with interesting things to do with a Lodda.
Great to see this!!! I literally asked for this video a few days ago and now it’s here. Love it
I always get excited when this guy’s come up with something new!👌😂👍Great stuff!
Молодец! You guys do great work! Much love from the USA!
You guys have great content. Plymouth used a similar setup in the late 1940's in their cars and the design went on thru the early 1960's in fork lifts, using the same flathead 6 engine, standard 3 speed transmission, fluid drive sealed torque converter and a clutch and pressure plate. I think high temp rated silicone gel would work great for your project.
My dad had a '70 VW Type 1 "Beetle" that had a torque converter with a manual. There was no clutch pedal; When you grabbed the shift knob to shift, you made an electrical connection and a vacuum servo disengaged the clutch. You shifted, released the lever, and the clutch engaged, the torque converter was there to make the sudden clutch engagement smooth. Porsche installed something similar called "Sportomatic" in the 914 and some 912's (I don't think the 911 ever had this transmission) back in the day.
I really don't see the point of all this. My dad hated manual transmissions! I hate automatic transmissions! I have a PDK in my current '14 Cayman S and I can accept it because it is nearly telepathic and "money shifts" are basically impossible, but I miss the manual I had in my previous Porsche 928S2!
Great video!
Same F&S clutch/TC was used in the NSU - Ro80 - 3 speed transaxle.
The NSU was front wheel drive with disc brakes mounted on the trans'.
The NSU trans could certainly take Maz tricked 12A and 13B power output.
Setup as: Engine > Balanced flex plate (NOT a flywheel) > T/C > Stator and Output shaft + bearing + OIL PORTING & SEALS > Clutch assembly and throwout > Gearbox/Diff.
A clutch is needed.
OIL circulation and a large oil cooler is absolutely necessary.
Say what you want about Garage54, but these guys have done some insane stuff over the years. Serious masters of their craft!
I'm impressed I've been in I've been a mechanic for over 60 years and I've engineered all kinds of weird things electrical electronics all kinds of stuff and this really is something that's pretty impressive I have to give him a big thumbs up on that good engineering
For the first time watching this, I am grinning in amazement.
I honestly didn’t think this would work!
Who would have thought?
Yea, this is worth digging into!
Random fun fact- some of Ford's industrial tractors and loaders in the 80s-90s had this exact thing- a pretty standard 8-speed tractor transmission, but a torque converter instead of a clutch. You had a shuttle clutch lever on the steering wheel that engaged the torque converter to the rest of the transmission, in either forward or reverse. You also had a manual lockup switch for high-speed or high-load operation.
Source- a friend's family owns one. Pretty fun to drive but has a learning curve. It also sucks in the cold, until the fluid is worked a bit and warms up, you barely crawl. The torque converter also means the trans will overheat fast if you're doing heavy work and don't have the lockup engaged.
I owned a 1951 Dodge with almost this same thing. It had BOTH a standard clutch and a torque converter, and was called a semi automatic transmission!
Bypassing the scatter shield (bell-housing) and locating your right foot next to the spinning torque converter assembly was a bold move.
You guys come up with the most clever ideas
I have been waiting for this kind of video for ages, thank you!
My Uncle had a 52 Desota with this setup. It had a clutch behind a two speed column shift!! Reverse eas up and back. No first.
Second was up and forward
It was geared low for getting a trailer moving and braking. Overdrive was down and forward. To start the engine pit it in neutral.
Press clutch and select gear. Let out clutch the car will move with more throttle.
In high and second you have two speeds. It will shift from low to high by idling the engine. The clutch is only used between second and overdrive. You hear a clunk when it shifts when you take your foot off the gas. It will not shift until you do. They went to a regular transmission two years later
It was weird but fun!!
Also weird was you could stop and start without the clutch if not loaded.
Some Buicks didn’t shift at all. They just got faster!!
(Dinaflow)
Glad to see you doing something creative and educational with your skills, rather than retrofitting tanks.
That was cool! I used to shift my father's Malibu all the time without using the clutch, it was sort of a parlor trick. Of course, it saves wear on the clutch, but it can wear out the synchronizers if you don't carefully match the RPMs. This reminds me of the VW "automatic stickshift" or the Chrysler "HyDrive" (or something like that). Both had torque converters or fluid couplings and clutches, though the clutch on the VW kicked in automatically when you touched the shift lever.
i've been requesting this for so long omg so glad they did this!!!
I really didn't expect that to work. Awesome video.
Your guy did an excellent job with adapting the torque converter to the Lada!
Kudos, young man!! 🙂👍🦾
Why am I learning so much from this guy?
The old VW AutoStick did this, but left the clutch in there. No clutch pedal is used, an automatic clutcher and solenoid on the stickshift was used. I loved it.
It reminds me of the vw beetle with the auto stick. Thats impressive , i love these videos !
I had a dodge with fluid drive. they are not quite a "torque converter" since they have no "stator" inside, They did not multiply torque, just a fluid coupler. .. it was a great system, I wish my power stroke 6 speed manual had a system like that old dodge. it would be a great off road set up.
My kid has a 2008 escape hybrid that has a clutch disk on a automatic transmission. That was a mind blower.
At 5:53 that is a nice low-resistance clutch pedal you have there. Nice. Thanks for your videos.
I don't know how they come up with this stuff. Its great!
This already exists in the raceing community, Its called a Lenco Transmission and work with either a clutch or a torque converter " that requiers a pump and cooler". There are also Manuel Transmisions that only need to use the clutch from a dead stop and once moving you can shift with out engaging. Grab Venders "requires a cooler" makes a overdrive module to add onto automatic or manuael transmissions that work of either a speed sensor or a switch.
Its great to see these guys building this but the build is ladened with a lot of issues.
1. the pump isn't actually pumping any fluid
2. no cooler
3. the brackets holding the pump in place are sketchy at best
4. the stand off's to gap the etra length are not going to hold up to transfer of much power, hence the bell housing making a flush mount to the engine.
5. and very important, the whole system needs to be ballencet
Bruno drive
This guy reading our minds and makes it real
We had a 1953 Plymouth Cranbrook with a "manual-automatic. It was called "Fluid drive". You put it in any manual gear, let the clutch out and it just sat there, waiting for the gas pedal. First and second worked OK when taking off, but if it was in third, you needed that bumper sticker, "0 to 60 in 15 minutes". To say it was slow takeoff would be an understatement. The system leaked badly so it was converted to an ordinary standard. Excellent car though. General Motors had a "Torque Drive" for a brief moment and I think it was in their (American) Nova and VW had a manual-automatic in the Bug, also for a short time. Things heated up (overheated easily) in both, so it was a no-go. In our Plymouth, we liked the concept. If it hadn't leaked so badly, we easily would have kept it in. The seal kit and the rebuild was way too expensive to do. It worked great though.