Diesel Heaters - Orientation Deep Dive - Heater Mounting Explained
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- Опубліковано 25 січ 2024
- If you would like your own Inspection Camera or diesel heater, there are affiliate links below. If you use those links to make your purchase, I get a small kickback. Use code VVSALE5 for 5% off. Thank you !
Inspection cameras:
Canada - s.vevor.com/bfQQQF
USA - s.vevor.com/bfQQP1
EU - s.vevor.com/bfQQQV
UK - different / better unit s.vevor.com/bfQQQ0
AU - s.vevor.com/bfQQRc
MX - s.vevor.com/bfQQ6S
DE - s.vevor.com/bfQQ53
FR - s.vevor.com/bfQQ58
IT - s.vevor.com/bfQQ6o
ES - s.vevor.com/bfQQ6w
PL - s.vevor.com/bfQQ6G
NL - s.vevor.com/bfQQ6S
Diesel Heaters:
Canada -
s.vevor.com/bfQHG0 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQEYR 5kw
USA -
s.vevor.com/bfQEYL 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQEZf 5kw
EU -
s.vevor.com/bfQPn5 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQOT6 5kw
AU - s.vevor.com/bfQHHM 5kw
DE -
s.vevor.com/bfQPm2 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQOUz 5kw
FR -
s.vevor.com/bfQPnj 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQOUQ 5kw
IT -
s.vevor.com/bfQPnq 5kw
s.vevor.com/bfQOUZ 8kw
ES -
s.vevor.com/bfQPnB 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQOVe 5kw
PL - s.vevor.com/bfQRfL 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQRfP 5kw
NL -
s.vevor.com/bfQPnX 2kw
s.vevor.com/bfQOVD 5kw
UK - NA
MX - NA
If you would like to support me and my projects, I have created a Patreon account. Regardless of the amount, every bit helps, will be put to use and is awesome motivation. Thank you so much !!
My Patreon - / joel_a
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Actual Description: Explaining why it matters how you mount your heater, and why it's not a simple "yes" or "no" when you ask. - Авто та транспорт
This should be required viewing for all owners. Took mine apart to clean and didn't even realize there was a second mesh in there. No wonder it's been running like crap lol
Haha... Yeah, if that mesh gets a little stuff on it, it doesn't matter too much, but if it gets any volume of crud, it has a pretty drastic effect. (especially for start up)
It is hard to fight when facts are open for view :D I agree with you fully. I wish I had videos of this in the 90's when i played with Eberspächers and Webastos and Ardics :)
Haha... My motto is "when you want to find out how something works, sometimes you need to F $hit up" 🤣 If nothing else, that will tell you how it doesn't work.
I had an idea, thought I might check if someone knew the answer and here I am. I love UA-cam but I love creators more. thank you for making this video. I'm installing my diesel heater in my attic and don't want to burn down my house so thanks for the free PSA. much love from the UK
Thanks for the comment ... sorry for the delay, I have been busy trying to buy a house...
Play safe.... Make sure to take your time routing the exhaust in a safe way. Both for exhaust smell, carbon monoxide and heat... the exhaust on these can get very very hot, so you want to have your install done so that it will be okay in the worst case scenario.
Cheers from Canada !
@@loweredexpectations4927 Thank you for your reply. yes i want to lower the heat from the exhaust with some sort of heat exchanger before i send it anywhere near the structure of the roof and im still trying to come up with something for that. was thinking a small radiator or something along those lines, also something i can drain the condensation from too.
I run these 24 hours a day 7 days a week if you need somebody to run the chamber for a long time I volunteer, I sure hope you make one that works, Great video.
Right on ! I suspect that in a best case scenario, this will be something that will run for 100 hours or so.
This mod is an attempt to distribute the crud over a larger area, keep it from effecting the main burn area, make it easier to clean when it gets dirty and keep it burning hot... but I am quite certain you will be able to calculate time between servicing based on amount of waste oil consumed.
I have a few ideas to fall back on after this one, but I hope this one works well.
@@loweredexpectations4927 if anyone can build a good one it you or David
Joel I’ve been watching your diesel heater videos since the first one came out! Everything that you do to those heaters is awesome! I love to tinker with things myself. That’s going to be awesome if you can get that drop in part completed!!! Keep up the great work!!!
Thanks James ! I have a few ideas similar to this one. I'm hopeful that this will extend the run time between cleanings, and make it MUCH easier to clean.
Bravo Bravo !! Best explanation of the burn chamber/tube I've seen so far (many years of youtube watching). Keep it simple,real and fun(#not easy). This shit is addictive, I own 2 heaters myself(off-gid cottage)and never had to replace anything except that cheap green fuel line .
Keep the right foot down!
Thanks for the comment !! I agree... it is addictive.
Again.... wicked vid..... you got a a nak bro.... Info with humor, keep it up
Thanks ! Much appreciated 🤟
I like that you are watching David's channel. You two share the same curiosity, for understanding how things work, and what would happen if...
I really enjoy David's content. You can tell he is very genuine and like you say, curious. He is much more into electronics stuff than I am... I kinda shy away from that stuff.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I don't know! all that light bulb stuff, took some working out, and a basic understanding electronics. I found a new hobby playing with microcontrollers, like the Arduino and ESP32. I find coding both frustrating and rewarding, in equal measure. Frustrating mainly due to my lack of knowledge, but rewarding when I manage to get things working.
Yeeessssss! Thank you! Not only are you will to sacrifice yourself in the name of science, your also a great teacher! I’m taking my heater apart today! Thank you!
Wonderful. The best way to understand something is to pull it apart and have a look ! My curiosity always gets the best of me.
Same I always pull things apart to see how they work .also to see how to fix.love to repair things rather than throw things away in this disposable world.had many fights with washing machine bearings as no one replaces them these days.even repair shops say you cannot do them.but I know you can .they just cannot be bothered with the work.i just love tinkering
@@anthonyralph3101 🤟 a love for tinkering will teach you a lot of things !
@@anthonyralph3101 I replaced the bearings in my inlaws washing machine about 4 times.
Internet been out almost all day, so just dropping by to get my like in. See you in the next one.
Thanks Wallace !
The endoscope really helps for inspecting the fitment of the pieces! Thanks for sharing! I'm excited to see how that "arrow flame choke" works. I didn't know what to call it so I went out on a limb. Edit: It helps me understand the fitment that is. Cool to see the burn tube while it's in the heat exchanger housing thing.
I'm glad you enjoyed ! I will be making another video about the arrow flame choke system, haha.... I recorded an 8 minute clip explaining it, but this video was already getting a bit long.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I can already see you toasting the endoscope camera
@@werner.x Haha... I don't think I will be putting it in the heater while it is running !
Just want to say thank you when I go to take mine apart at least I will have some kind of idea of what I am doing lol
👍 It's really easy... you just need to get in there ! Worst case, parts are cheap ! haha.
Like @LowAmbitions I too am installing an "8kw" in my attic or actually void area, where the ducted aircon is and letting the fan sucking the hot air and blow it around the house. This is in Brisbane Australia, and I think it's possible to keep some rooms warm like 22 degrees, mind you the outdoor temp in winter goes to only -1 or -2 and day temp between 18 and 25. The area will be around 114 m2. I'm planning on using a bigger diameter aluminium pipe 2.5 meter long encapsulated in a bigger shorter open ended pipe, enclosed near the heater, but with a flex pipe attached, joining into the aircon ducting. I've done some preliminary testing without using the exhaust heat, and I got 22 deg with outside around 8 deg. What I don't know is I need to have the diesel tank outside on the ground, which mean the pump needs to pump close to 3 meter vertical and 2.5 meter horizontal. Any comment is very welcome......
Your concise and sound more like Howard Cosell as time goes by.
I just looked him up.... I don't recognize the name... Haha... OK, I'll take that as a complement... He seems charismatic.
Good luck with the new design. Hopefully, all goes well . A big hurdle will probably be the cost. But if it does work. That would be nice.
If it works it will a service extender, basically. New video on it just went live today. It shouldn't cost much at all.
Videos are great! Love the "fight me in the comments section". You should cut the whole back end off of an exchanger so you can see the combustion.
I responded to this, but apparently I said something I shouldn't have, as my comment got deleted, haha.
I would love to cut one apart ... I need to have a working one for tests.... so we will see when I can afford that.
Great job. Interesting things coming down the pike!
It would be nice if it actually worked well, but either way, we are going to learn something together.
Well done man I can't wait to see the next one
Thanks for the comment !
Awesome explanation. I pulled mine apart few weeks ago and missed half of what you have shown here. Great video keep her going.
Thanks ! I have had these apart more than once... to be fair, haha.
Very explanatory video, we have nothing to debate about what is clear.
Regarding the incandescent plug of the 2kw model, it is really very sensitive, I experienced the same thing.
Thanks for the comment.
Interesting you say that about the plug. I think it must be the way some of them are mad... now the metal is attached to the ceramic. The plug or my original heater, I grabbed it in my lathe and machined the metal part off without damaging it... I still have it and it works great.... except that it has no threads now, haha.
Where mine broke, you can see it is only supported on one side.
Glow plug down! Glow plug down! MEDIC!!! Calls HeavyDSparks to bring new glow plug via his black hawk, lol.
LOL.... When you get lucky 200 times in a row and all of a soulden think you are too good to break one... SNAP !
Good information about the diesel heaters.
Looking forward to more testing 🙂
More testing to come !
Directions in my heater basically showed that the corner with the glow plug needs to be up. But your notice of vent hole location is a good catch. Also for the high end wabstos there install directions also show the corner with glow plug needs to be upward. Facing up could possibly cause an issue tho. If it were to flame out or not completely buring fuel it could leak fuel through the main air inlet at the back of the burn tube and leak into the housing.
Yeah, with the heater sitting upright (exhaust and inlet down) the fuel path is down at a slight angle. Ideally, you want a direct downward path between where the fuel comes in, and the main burn area.
As long as there is some down slope from the fuel inlet to the burn area, there shouldn't be a problem. However, if you were to install the heater so that the fuel has to go uphill to get into the burn area, this is a problem.... this would mean that it needs to fill the glow plug area before running into the burn area. Not good.
I agree, glow plug at the top, no matter which way you choose to orient it, that way, if your pump fails and allows fuel to drain into the heater unimpeded, any unburnt fuel pools at the dead end of the outer casing, then fills the gap (and the centre burn tube) until it reaches the level of the exhaust port, at which point it can escape down the exhaust. The other way up, unburnt fuel can escape through the air hole and into the motor area, which may not be ideal. Remember some people have these mounted inside dwellings and vehicles, All 'should' have the exhaust routed outside, so having fuel drain via the exhaust rather than into the shell of the heater is the preferred option.
@@thegrimreaper7777 I do agree with this, but if your pump fails and you have more than a litre of fuel, your heater is going to overfill and it will still dump out.... man, that would be a nightmare ! haha.
🤣 Fight me in the comments. Naw I'm good, you're correct 🙂
Great run down and I really enjoyed the inspection camera footage!
Haha... come on... fight me, haha. JK
@@loweredexpectations4927 😆
yesss !! i cant wait to follow this new thing
Good to hear. I hope to have a video out explaining it in a little more detail, before I actually test it.
fantastic information 👍great video, thanks.
Thanks for the comment. Much appreciated.
Good review on the camera.
I did an actual video on it a few days ago, but it made a cameo in this video, haha.
Good luck on the waste oil adventure this winter, Joel.
Thanks ! I'm probably going to need a LOT of luck.
Maybe. I have noticed that all of the DIY waste-oil heaters I've seen on YT have been of the "open burn pot" variety. Although commercial waste-oil heaters are more similar to your diesel heater.
@@patchvonbraun Yes, I have noticed this. You want lots of room for crud to build up, and an open burner is a good way to do that. I think because they are waste oil burners (free fuel) most people don't put a lot of consideration into efficiency.
My concern is partly efficiency, but also keeping it compact and user friendly.... That being said, the cleaning process of my latest design would still be beyond many people.
If you use Vegetable Oil, Robert Murray Smith found the best wick is Carbon Felt cheaply bought as flame protective mats for Jewelers and the wick doesn't burn away.
I have seen some of his videos... cool stuff. I have hundreds of litres of waste motor oil as I am a small engine mechanic, so that will be my main focus.
My heater plug failed due too the wires oxidising i made a tempry one using a ford focus glow plug modified to fit and it worked nicely.
Mine failed because I was filming and told people to be careful 🤣. I should have known better.
I haven't had mine corrode, but I had broken the wire off several times and had to solder them back on.
There’s a diesel Focus? It must be European.
@@5roundsrapid263 probably from the era of the volvo parthership
@@5roundsrapid263 They get so many cool cars we don't.
Absolutely top fooking notch chap 👍😎👍
If you ever get the time take a look at Mikuni MY series heaters or the early Erberspacher heaters, different layouts that may be usefull for other applications?
Great vid as usual 👌
DUDE ! Mikuni makes heaters !! WHAT ! Woha...
I both appreciate this new found knowledge and hate it... because now I'm going to end up down a Mikuni rabbit hole. 🤣
@loweredexpectations4927 sorry dude, I know you already have a "few" rabbit holes to go down 🤣🤣
I know you will make good use of any info gleaned 👍
Hi joel maybe you can try burning wast tdh oil . It needs to be changed on tractors between 250 hours and 500 hours depending on the tractor and severity of use . Unlike used motor oil it generally doesn't have the high carbon buil up that we see in used engine oil . Just a thought. Cheers 🍻
Thanks for the comment. I have done all my testing in the past with stuff that I get from my summer job, lawn mower repair, but I could likely find a source of that. I think I actually have some new TDH in my shop somewhere.
Been trying to find out energy consumption on the 12 volt end. Am off grid at a ranch in the mountains and am calculating what kind of solar/wind setup I will need.
On the used motor oil, probably keeping the glow plug on to elevate the temperature to vaporize the oil since it is not under pressure being atomized. Maybe a lower setting for the glow plug after the start up so it doesn't burn out too fast. I would call this a passive system since the fuel is not under pressure. That's why it's so hard to use the oil.
Once the these heaters are up and running, they pull between 30 and 50 watts, depending on heat setting. The fan pulls the majority of that power. When they are firing up and shutting down, the wattage goes up around 120 watts for about 2 minutes on start up and one minute or less, on shut down.
The main two main issues with motor oil are 1. As you say, not enough heat to flash of properly, and the plug on would take care of that. However 2 is that heavy oils will always leave some crud behind. The glow plug area would become plugged up very quickly if the plug was kept on.
The main cause of failure when burning motor oil is the build up inside of the main burn area leading to restriction of airflow.... Then things spiral out of control really quickly.
@thefirstmissinglink:
As you are on a ranch, you don't really need a mobile heater solution. An oven should do.
If you'd weld yourself a dedicated waste oil oven with a real chimney, you can get away with a small fan of 5 watt or less, depending on oven size and oil feed. Best would be a normal oil flow regulator instead of drip feed, but the ones suited for thick waste oil may be out of production. There once were sites explaining the modifications to a normal light oil oil regulator, but i didn't check, if they are still there.
If nothing else works, drip feed always do, but the (highly recommended) safety feature N/C solenoid valve will be another battery drain.
I think, you'll get plenty of building ideas if you look for "blue flame waste oil heater".
Basically you have to build a normal oil fired oven, but with removable bottom plate (daily cleaning) and an electric fan.
I haven't tried that, but you might get blue flame even without a fan - if the chimney works good and the oven is designed right.
@@werner.x I should have given a better explanation, I am modifying my motorhome for off-grid use. I want to use the diesel heater but I needed to know the power consumption on the 12 volt side of things.
@@loweredexpectations4927 yeah that'll make sense with it being so dirty. I guess the only way to clean it up would be to do the same thing they do with biodiesel. I'll be eager to see what you come up with.
@@werner.x This is true. If I were somewhere outside of the city, I would certainly be building something a little more substantial than what I currently have.
I like the challenge of keeping it in a self contained package and being able to buy off the shelf parts, but there are other ways to keep warm.
A good designed burner could run without any power in a emergency situation and then use a a few watts for combustion air and a few watts for circulation for everyday use. I highly suspect that a high efficiency wood stove with a few mods would burn very clean and not require any forced combustion air.
thank for the info👌👌
Thanks for the comment !
The problem using waste oil or even brand new oil is the stuff that is in it. Somehow they put metals in the stuff like magnesium zinc etc and that stuff simply don't like to vaporize, even with extreme heat there is always a certain amount of residue left after a decent burn which is why it makes it difficult to re-light after a run down. I don't think that cog looking thing is helping the burn with oil, sure it will with diesel but it is gagging for blocking up with oil. If the fuel were allowed to get to the tube and burn in there it should be much better, but again it will need very frequent cleaning and have to be run red hot to minimise any build up. It would be nice if the head unit could be pulled off instead of bolting on sort of a bayonet fitting so it could be removed with ease and quickly and a quick scrape of tube should sort it for the next burn. I am eagerly looking forward to your design and David's and I am sure you will get decent results as you tinker around but it is all amazing to me. :)
For sure. I have a video last year where I burnt brand new oil to put an end to the argument that my oil was "too dirty" ... I did 30 videos on this topic last year with 4 months of testing.
Heavy oil and additives are a problem, and always will be, so the only solution is to deal with the build up. I will be releasing a video soon talking about my actual plan for this mod, and what I expect... I do expect that it will have to be cleaned frequently.
Brilliant explanation joel love it.can u tell me what stops gaskets sticking please.
If you put a little grease on the gasket before assembly, or assembly lube, this will usually do the trick. Cheers !
I think if you burn waste oil in one you have to get rid of those mesh's. A round cylinder with holes drilled in would probably work. Did you try that?
Oh I posted this before i watched the entire video and we you are doing some thing similar. I think you're on the right track
Yeah. I did almost 4 months of non stop waste oil testing. The mesh disappears quickly.
I'm not certain what part you are referring to as "a round cylinder with holes drilled" I tried lots of things, but nothing that matches that description.
The flow of air, fuel and burnt gasses is pretty fussy in these units, and I have learned, first hand, that a lot of stuff that you think would work really well, cakes the heater completely inoperable, haha
Ok, haha, Just read the end of your comment. So you were thinking holes instead of slots. I started to do it with holes and realized it would take a LOT of holes.
Yeh I like your design. Most of the burn chambers I've seen for waste oil burners are round cylinders with a series of holes drilled in them. So that's what I was thinking might work. Your design is the same principle. The only thing is they have all been in the vertical position so I'm not sure horizontal would work. Definitely worth trying though.
Btw just ordered a Vevor 2kw for my Dodge quad cab. Your code worked 👍. My first one so it will be a learning experience. Do you have a Facebook group?
@@jimschaffroth5652 My heater will be running vertical. Part of the reason I didn't try this before, is my previous burn chamber would not allow for running vertically, so I didn't go down that road. In hindsight, I could have welded up the hole and drilled a new one.
Welcome to the diesel heater owners club, haha. I don't have a Facebook related to heaters.... I don't even have enough time for UA-cam, most of the time.
The 8Kw heater probably only is "8Kw ready".
I have seen larger oil pumps offered. The one we always get is the standard 22ml model.
But then - i can ramp this 22ml pump from 1,2Hz to 5 Hz with my heaters and controllers in stock setting.
If you let it buzz with 10 Hz and this doesn't overheat the magnet, fan speed ramped up accordingly, this 8Kw maybe get real even with the small pump.
The one that I ordered claims that it consumes .7L/h , so I will have to see if it has a larger fuel pump or just runs at higher hz... likely a larger pump.
It should arrive next week. When it does, I'm going to pull it all apart before I fire it up... try to document the whole thing.
Can't wait to see if your mod works for waste oil !
Fingers crossed, it goes better than most of my other waste oil experiments, haha.
The idea is that it will be a removable piece that you can remove and clean out, pretty easily...If it works at all, it is hard to say how long it will take before it requires cleaning 🤷♂️
If you can work out how to clean it relatively easily you will be the top rated oil burner :) The race is on between you and David :)@@loweredexpectations4927
for alternative fuels... please before you get all fancy try
1. ) stainless steel screen/mesh of various opening sizes around the part of tube with slots. Length of this roll of screen mesh enough to protrude well into the burn chamber. idea being to add additional hot surfaces to atomize the oil via contact with additional hot screen mesh in both primary and secondary combustion areas. Might need diesel start to get added material good and hot.
2.) Little more complex (expermenting wise) would be experementing withing different type mesh/ and wicking gauze density (aka- differenttypes SS wool) in place of what is spot welded in there.
I have some stainless mesh sent to me by a viewer, and used it in a few previous tests, last year, but of course, not in this configuration.
The idea of this additional chamber is basically 3 things. 1. To have a spot after the main chamber that is very hot before adding any alternative fuels, so they flash off immediately 2. space for junk to build up without harming performance and a part that can be easily removed and cleaned out when it does get dirty.
Mesh and wicks may add some benefit, but what I have found is that anything like that will collect all of the crud from waste oils, (ash / coke) and become useless pretty quickly... but that doesn't mean that I won't try it, haha.
@@loweredexpectations4927 crud build up is what lead me to think a not as fine steel wool wick behind the spot welded mesh may be needed. Good point about easier access.
what lead me to think about stainless mesh screen as described in#1 was the aluminum piece you put in that helped combustion... but melted
@@coachgeo Oh yes... That aluminum bid did help a lot. I think the reason being is that it trapped just enough heat without choking it off too much. That was a surprising result.
@@loweredexpectations4927 EXACTLY. sorta.. and why thought of #1.. providing many hot spots ..... and this is why many non-injected oil heaters use various forms (like screens) in their designs to increase the number of hot spots. would add links to actual stove products but as you know.... not allowed. linked video is all can add... it offers some uneducated observations that hits #1
ua-cam.com/video/99OQuzRw3O4/v-deo.html
Cheers 🍻
👍
Great video and explanation. I have one question regarding the orientation of the heat. Since the fuel flows unrestricted into the burn chamber, when the heater is powered down, would fuel in the metal or plastic line seep or wick into the burn chamber if this line entered from directly above or at an elevation great than where it enters the burn chamber? I hope my question makes sense. Thanks again,
I think I understand, and the answer is no... Just like when you place a straw into a glass of water and place your thumb over the end, if you lift the straw out of the water, the water will stay in the straw until your thumb is removed... in this case, the fuel pump is your thumb.
The only way you will get a substantial amount of fuel flowing, after the pump stops, is if the pump fails, or of the fuel line breaks or is disconnected at the pump.
Hope this makes sense.
Hey bud. Boroscope is an automotive tool (what you have). It's a camera designed to go inside the engine.
Endoscope is a MEDICAL device that's designed to go inside the body.
Thanks, haha. Vevor lists it as a Endoscope Camera, Borescope Inspection Camera.
No, the term endoscope is not limited to human bodies. Whatever body you want to examine, an endoscope is just right.
Colonoscope would be limited to some internal organs though.
@@werner.x that's because companies like Vevor have been incorrectly labeling them for many years. If you look up the definition of the word, it's a medical instrument.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I know, it's silly. Ever since cheap Chinese borescopes infiltrated the market decades ago now, they have been mislabeled as endoscopes. It's probably just a translation error that keeps popping up over and over again.
@@IrisPPG I did look up the definition just to be sure not to talk bs .
It's a technical term, not medical only.
Who did give you the idea, we have to use the term borescope, even when we inspect mostly bodies instead of bores?
Be interesting to build one out of copper
Build the part I'm making out of copper ? I put some copper in my chamber last year and it turned into a melted blob ! .... that's pretty intense.
Awesome video! I have a diesel heater from Vevor too wrecked one trying to burn motor oil, bought a second one to just burn diesel and the other one I use for tests. It is essential for me to find an alternative source to warm my house. Electric, propane, or petroleum are just not affordable anymore. Red diesel is doable but on max it wont heat the caravan to a good temperature when it gets cold outside like 0 Celsius and below, from the Netherlands by the way. I checked al those videos on WMO and my verdict is it cannot be done with the actual setup of these heaters. I hope you can get some more insights in if we can adapt them that it will burn WMO maybe with some cleaning? Appreciate you and your videos hoping for more!!
There is something wrong with your heater setup. My caravan has 8m inside lengt with 1,95m roof height, 2,4 width inside, Insulation only 30mm (it's from 1982) - and the 5Kw heater keeps it quite cozy at lowest setting this winter in Lower Saxony - not far from you and almost sea level, the recently minus 8 °C required half power. Full power only required, when heating a completely frozen caravan. But with that low fuel consumption at lowest setting (1,2Hz) there's no need to let it cool down, if you're just away for the day. As the evening get's cooler and i'm just sitting, watching YT, i raise to 2 Hz and maybe 3Hz, when it's colder than minus 2°
So - where does your heat go?
My guess ist an open skylight.
Open skylights draw ice cold air inside and your bottom area get's cold - no matter how much the heater is putting out.
Thanks for your comment. I agree with Werner, if you are recirculating air, a 5kw heater should be able to keep a decent size caravan pretty warm. I used one to heat my 24x26 foot garage last year, and while it has better insulation, it also has 9 foot ceilings and a lot of air space... it was fine at -20C
I suspect this mod, if it works at all, will extend time between cleaning, but will of course need cleaning.
I used to work for a junkyard that had a waste oil heater and that thing was huge and clogged up weekly… and it had three filters before the oil even got to the heater part. I don’t have much confidence in either of you being able to make waste oil work in one of these. Stick with diesel, it’s going to be cheaper in the long term, waste oil is close to being illegal to burn, I’m pretty confident that it already is in the UK… which is ironic considering they burn it to get rid of what’s left after they recycle it.
Thanks for your comment.
I have talked to a lot of waste oil burner techs and heavy oil burner / boiler techs... They all say the same thing as you, and I that has changed my approach.
I will release a video talking about the goal / idea with this heater. I did about 4 months of testing last year, and what you say is true.... these heaters are not suited to anything but clean fuel. My goal is not to make a maintenance free heater (at this point) but to extend the cleaning intervals.
Typically, waste oil burners are rated at litres per hour or gallons per hour, while these little heaters consume a about a gallon a day, about 4 litres in 24 hours of run time.
I appreciate your info and you not calling me a moron ! Haha... some people get pretty worked up about this stuff
@@loweredexpectations4927won't call you a moron, just talking about the experience having one run in a junkyard in Maine that used one all winter long and how much of a PITA that it was to keep running. Good luck.
@@david78212 👍 Yes, I know I'm in for a battle. Like I said. I burnt waste oil for 4 months last year. I went through about 300lL of it in my little heater and sometimes had it apart 4-5 times a day, cleaning and modifying it. The heater ran for about 13 hours a day, most of the time with me babysitting it. I'm very familiar with how much of a PITA it can be.
This is what I built my channel off of... I think people like watching me suffer 🤣
Is the 2kw heater quieter than the 5kw ?
Can't wait to see the building videos you are planning :D
The 2kw is slightly quieter, but not a lot.
Love it. # fight me in the comments. I would think the fuel is drawn in by a Venturi effect once the heater is started ??
Haha... I can't tell if you are serious, or if this is your attempt to start a fight 🤣
The venturi may actually be part of what starts the burn in the main burn area 🤔 ... The reason I would argue against this is that the air actually comes into the main burn area, directed out to the circumference.
I didn't mention it in the video, but if you look at the inspection camera view, in the end of the burn tube you can kinda see a few fingers in the slotted are that are larger (wider) ... The incoming combustion air is actually partly shielded so that it doesn't blow directly back into the glow plug hole.
Excellent run down on the inner workings of these heaters. BTW, is that '8kw' heater you mention the Hcalory HC-AC22, billed as a 6.8-8KW unit? I've been eying that one myself, but they're still out of stock on the Hcalory site (supposedly back in stock in February). Trying to order them off Banggood or Aliexpress is ridiculously expensive for me here in the US.
Thanks !
The heater that I ordered is Maxspeedgrods off Amazon Canada.... They list the fuel consumption in the ad as .7l/h so that's 7kw.. I haven't tested it yet, so we shall see.
I'm going to do a detailed tear down on it before I even use it.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Ahh, I see. I'll keep an eye out for that. The Hcalory HC-AC22 I mentioned has a physically larger heat exchanger but the rest of the unit appears to be the same as the regular 5kw units.
@@kobolila Yeah, I have heard about that one too... This one is larger as well. Has a 90mm hose and is a little larger all around.
I would think that the waste oil would have to be diluted with diesel to help stop the contamination of the burn chamber. Waste oil is full of stuff that likes to stick to everything. Your video was very educational as I have just picked up a 5 kw Vevor diesel heater to experiment with home heating.
Absolutely it needs to be diluted. I use 10% kerosene to my waste dirty oil, put it through a kitchen sieve to filter, I don't suffer with blockages in fuel pipe even inside the burn chamber which delighted me no end :) But it needs to be cleaned out every day really. It will burn again next day without cleaning but doesn't like it after a few hours. But that's my thing it's not a diesel heater, just what I found out over a few years the problems using oil.
Thanks for the comment.
I have a 30 part video series where I tried burning waste motor oil with all sorts of different fuels, diesel, alcohol, gasoline, varsol, DPF cleaner etc.
In the end, WMO is heavy oil and will always leave ash behind. When you refine heavy oil and get diesel or kerosene, you remove the crud that would have been left behind, that is why they burn so clean
Waste veg oil has glycerine, and that is what causes the problems with it.
The only real solution is to make a heater that is easy to maintain, has more space for build up (before causing problems) or create something that is mechanically self cleaning.
I would suggest to keep diesel, kerosene or light fuels in your heater... I twill work really great if you do that, haha.
Thanks for your comment / input.
I see you have some waste oil burner videos. I will give them a watch if I ever find the time.
The issue with these little heaters is that they have very little volume, and any change to the geometry of the chamber can cause things to go way out of whack. A waste oil furnace / burner has a lot of advantages over the burn chambers on these things.
I have tried diluting up to 70% diesel 20% waste oil and 10% gasoline, and my heater would run for less than 24H before issues.
I wonder if the exhaust isn't big enough for waste oil, because it has more mass and more energy than kerosene so it produces more gas? There are pros and cons with all types of burners, at least the diesel heaters are guaranteed safe, one would need a decent setup for use in a camper or lorry :)@@loweredexpectations4927
I'm running 75/25 Diesel/waste oil, with no issues.
But I do filter my waste oil.
Large screen for big stuff.
Then into a 120 micron paint strainer.
Then through cheese cloth
One more option about the direction of the mounting. Would it not maybe be better to have a slight angle pointing downwards about 30 degrees with the burn chamber pointing downward at an angle so the oil has to drip down the chamber and it wont clog up? I saw horizontal vertical on the side etc. but not at slight angles?
Are you talking about in a stock burn chamber, or a modified design ? In the OEM chamber, there is a baffle before the burn tube. The fuel / oil will pool behind this baffle if angled, and if it builds up it will drip off the centre of the baffle ... I can't say for sure. This could help.
I have searched forever for the larger KW heater? Who sells it? That’s the link I need 😊
Maxpeedingrods. You need to look at the fuel consumption rate (.7l/h) and the outlet pipe will be 90mm. They sell some that are "8kw" that are really 5kw ... just like everyone else.
Question - have you determined what is the longest exhaust pipe that can be used that would allow the heater to keep working efficiently (same diameter as the original)?
I planned on doing those tests this week, but got sidetracked... I may be testing that this weeked as I do have 16 feet of pipe.
I can tell you that even an extra meter (3 feet) causes a noticeable difference if CO.. but I'm I just did a quick test, so can't say for sure.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I have a 3 meter pipe. Runs fine. No idea on CO, still dont have a meter
@@Veikra Good to know... I have 4 meters to try on mine, haha.
I'm guessing that you won't see running issues till the CO get up over 200... maybe even more. I think a LOT of what determines the outcome is your pre existing situation. Meaning, if you have a heater that is already running borderline high elevation, with a little inlet restriction and then you restrict the exhaust, that could be trouble.
If you are running close to sea level or have your heater manually adjusted lean with no restrictions, then restricting the exhaust may not be an issue.
I have about 3 metres and two silencers on mine (fitted under a VW van) no issues with running, even on low overnight just keeps the van warm at 19C in outside temps of around freezing.
@@thegrimreaper7777 Good to know for sure !
I can see how this is easily overlooked, but if the heater were going to have issues, due to a long exhaust, it would be on the high setting. The limitations of the exhaust restrictions comes down to how many kw you are trying to force out the exhaust. The more exhaust your try to force out, the more problems you will have.
Another detail that I may have overlooked, is that I have been / will be using a 5kw heater. A 2kw will be able to use a lot more before it becomes a problem.
I only have about 5 metres of exhaust, so we will see.
Your "bolt on" waste oil upgrade part is a great idea! Sounds like a nice little side business in the making if it works! I'm very interested in this as I'm sure many others are as well!
I think I heard you mention there is no heat output difference between a 5 kW and 2 kW heater? Does the 5 kW use more fuel? If it does then it must produce more heat, so I'm confused (I'm sure I have some understandings wrong)!
I will be releasing a video talking about this in a little more detail... the goal for this set up is to be a maintenance extender. It may be a total fail, but my hope is, it will work engou to collect data on how much crud builds up based on oil volume consumed.
I have some ideas on a self cleaning unit, but that will take considerable work, and I need to know how much crud before attempting to make something to clear it.
@loweredexpectations4927 Maybe it is not truly realistic to run 100 percent waste oil, but fifty percent might be more viable and that would still be a huge win.
@@AtimatikArmy In the end, this seems to be a percentage game.... Meaning a litre of oil leaves behind (i'm making up the thumbers) 10 grams of ash. It takes about 2 hours to burn a litre.... SO, if you dilute it 50/50, you burn 2 litres of fuel before consuming 1 litre of oil, essentially doubling your run time.... however, you have still only burned 1 litre of oil... Make sense ?
I have talked with boiler techs as well as waste oil burner techs and they do have some interesting thoughts about keeping the temp high at the oil flashpoint location, but not too high further down the line. The ash that does not burn will melt if hot enough, and when it does, it is more likely to build up, rather than flow out the exhaust I'm not sure if this is based on research or assumption, but I have heard it from a few different people.
@loweredexpectations4927 So it doesn't burn off the carbon like a hotter spark plug will burn off the carbon so it doesn't foul?
@@AtimatikArmy Yes and no. Carbon will burn off pretty easily with a little heat and enough oxygen. What is left behind from heavy oils is not carbon, but other non burnable minerals. When you refine oil and turn it into diesel or kerosene, you remove these substances.
Ultra low sulphur diesel is an example of this. Even regular diesel or airplane fuel still has quite a bit of sulphur, and this either builds up, or ends up being pumped into the air... So, in some cases they process the fuel further to remove more sulphur.
So basically where the fuel line comes in needs to be on the higher side ?
Where do you get your burn chambers from? Do you know the purpose of the internal mesh? I have a burn chamber cut apart kind of like yours and found replacment mesh for it on aliexpress but yours seem to work without it. is it for holding heat or kind of wicking?
I have purchase one chamber from WIsh .. I believe, and the others from aliexpress.
The mesh is basically the same as a wick. It spread the fuel out over a larger area instead of just pooling in one spot. This larger surface area exposes it to more air and helps it burn cleaner.
Diesel flashes off very quickly at higher temperatures, so you may only notice issues during start up, before the chamber reaches temperature. If you have cut your chamber apart, you want to make sure that it is sealed up well. I use stainless steel rings and a hose clamp...
If you do not do this, the diesel can drip out of the chamber before burning and burn in the exchanger or while going out the exhaust. This makes a lot more carbon monoxide and is less efficient.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I saw the hose clamp back when you were working on it but what did you use for the stainless rings is it like a band or a belt around it? I have a tig welder so worst case I can just weld it if I have to.
@@benjamin2339 I used a piece of stainless that I had laying round. It was a piece of a jet ski pump. You could use the piece of a hose clamp without any slots in it if you have a long one. Welding it takes care of it for sure.
Slow the flow of oil to give it time to burn maybe.
Yes, that is a possibility .... I was thinking instead of it entering and burning where it enters, having it run over a large surface. This would allow it to be exposed to more air and because there will be deposits, perhaps spread then out instead of piling up in one spot.
All the heater manuals I have indicate the 2 heater orientations acceptable.
Good to know.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Nothin like reading the Docs 😂
@@stevecarlisle3323 That's a last resort, no ? I have looked at the Webasto manuals a few times, briefly, out of curiosity, but other than that I have only had Vevor heaters / manuals. The only thing they say about installing is some very basic safety studd "don't vent the exhaust inside" and preferable install it inside, but nothing about orientation.
Will a dickinson stove carb work rather than drip feed?
I'm guessing that it would... I'm not sure that you could set the flow low enough... I don't' know much about them.
The Burn Chamber is like a jet engine?
More like a candle ... a jet engine has more moving parts and a pressurized fuel system.
Do the diesel ones running just diesel make shops or trailers dirty from "soot"?
If they are running properly, they do not make any soot at all.... I have a video testng the exhaust fumes called "The Truth About Diesel Heaters - Carbon Monoxide, Formaldehyde & TVOC !" showing how clean they are.
ua-cam.com/video/aPMM_xjoboI/v-deo.html
Is the fuel line bendable enough if I wanted to relocate the connection to the flexible fuel line from the pump?
Not really.... If you want to do that I would suggest removing the original line and brazing in some automotive brake line or copper line, after pre bending it to your desired shape.
I relocated a line last year by using brake line and then a short U shaped soft line between my new line and the original. The title of the video is EASY Waste Oil Preheater - Chinese Diesel Heater. PT-10 I will attempt to post a link separately.
ua-cam.com/video/0fFbsiP-iA8/v-deo.html
@@loweredexpectations4927 thanks!
@@davidparron9546 You're welcome !
Have you seen David McLuckie's latest using oil he seems to be going in the direction of what I've been thinking about
I think so... I'll have to see if he has published one I missed, haha.
Okay... yes, I had been talking to him about this a few weeks before... I got all my stuff together to build something but didn't realize that the heater would run well standing on end. (pointing up). Then it got really cold and I didn't want to be messing with waste oil in the extreme cold, haha.
My original idea was to make a secondary chamber, like his, but sitting on it's side (not unright) and have it compact enough to fit in the heater.... so it functions like a normal heater ... kinda.
Now that I know they will run pointing up, and have tested it that way for a few hours, I have changed my plans a little.
What do you think about pointing it down and then drilling a hole through the center from the back of the burn chamber and drip the oil in from there onto a baffle
🤦♂️I posed the video at 20min to right that comment lol
I really need to stop ⏸ing videos and commenting before seeing the full thing I had no idea you were going to mention David etc lol
@@colinhamer6506 From my experience, they don't' like to run well facing down, but I think my testing was done without a wick, so that may be the reason for my results... I should retest.
There is very little room to drip the oil in from the back side You would have to cut a notch into the burn chamber finned area as the fan runs within a few millimetres of the chamber. I like the idea of that, as it would be passing through the hottest part of the heater... but it also introduces challenges in how to route your air flow, allow the oil to pool and still aerate it.
My brain constantly goes nuts with ideas.
witch video is the one that's backfiring
I've had a few people ask me that, and I really wish I could remember. I have a series of 30+ videos and I just can't remember.
It is with the hole through the bottom of the shelf, so that narrows the timeline a little 🤷♂️ At first it was in a case, then on its side, then as seen in that clip.
Has anyone ever tried running bio diesel in these heaters?
I have heard of a few people doing it, but have not seen any videos. I just bought some cooking oil and I am considering giving it a try. If it will run ok in a diesel engine, it should be okay in these heaters.
@@loweredexpectations4927 I haven't seen any videos on it either. I love watching your videos. I hope you try it.
Definitively, does an 8 KW heater really exist? Thanks Greetings
That could be a whole video in itself. There is no simple answer, but, no, not really.
The 2 kw is about 1.8, the 5 kw is about 4.3 and the 8kw in most cases is also 4.3 but sometimes the pump hz is increased to push it up over 5.
There is now a new heater on the market that is physically larger, I have just ordered, they call it 8kw, and it appears that it will be about 7kw, based on the fuel consumption claims.
@@loweredexpectations4927 Thanks Waiting for the next video about the "new" 8KW..Greetings
If you're a high auric person, the words you say and your intentions matter. You snapped the glow plug right after you said be careful. You kind of jinxed it there. 😅
Now you have a new toy to poke around with. I was wondering whether it was small enough to see into an ear canal? My right ear is totally blocked. Maybe I should ask this question to my doctor. 😅
An engineer measured the 8kW to be outputting only 4kW. Can't wait your test.
Wouldn't a rocket stove of some sort is the most efficient way to burn waste oil? It wouldn't need any electricity. If you use or modify a diesel heater to burn waste oil, you still have to open it up and clean the carbon sooth built up daily?!
If the flame initiation hole is very critical, I'm afraid I won't be able to mount it upside down, fan blowing downwards position because I plan to dip the heat exchanger in water in my water heating project. That's for later.
I have a few questions for you regarding my air heater project with exhaust heat recovery. The exhaust outlet ID is 3/4" or ~19mm and OD is ~24.5mm and the ID of the exhaust pipe is 1" or ~24.5-25mm. If I install a 3/4" straight bulkhead fitting somewhere down the exhaust pipe to transition from inside of a heavy duty plastic bucket of water to outside, do you think it will "significantly" restrict the exhaust flow or should I use a 1" ID fitting? Then it will make it a bit more complicated, I mean I will have to use a 32mm-25mm silicone reducers as the OD of 1" bulkhead fitting will be 32mm. Any suggestion is very much appreciated.
My last question is if I dip the stainless exhaust permanently in water, will it get rust, if so, after what period according to your experience? Thank you very much in advance for your answers. Have a nice weekend.
Haha... yeah.. I looked at the plug afterwards and there was some sort of anomaly right where it broke... The plut itself is ceramic, and the metal threaded part has a crimp or 🤷♂️ something right in that spot.
I wish you hadn't asked me about the ear canal, lol... of course I had to check... it's not pretty in there. To answer your question, this is not the idea tool for that job. I can see just enough to make me want to see more.
Yes, I suspect most 8kw heaters only put out about 4.3kw based on fuel consumption. The heater that I got is actually a bigger unit, from what I understand.
A rocket stove could work, but I believe the battle is this... Air flow is dependent on losing heat out the chimney. They are powered by convection current, so the amount of air coming in, is related to the amount of heat rising out of the chimney. If you dissipate the heat efficiently (don't lose it out the chimney) then your combustion air flow decreases and you are left with a dirty burn. This is why forced air is used on almost everything.
However, if you aren't paying for the fuel, and you are willing to throw a lot of it away, then it could work with the right design.
Fan blowing downwards shouldn't be affected by the placement of the initiation hole. I have not had success with running this way as the heater will flutter and flame out HOWEVER this may be because I wasn't using a chamber wick, as it had been removed.
I have done a tiny bit of testing with my pipe, and I can say that 3 feet of extra pipe (about 5 feet in total) causes the CO levels to increase a little.... This leads be to believe that it will become a problem pretty quickly. 1" should be safe.
The stainless exhaust won't runst, from what I can tell... If you keep it from getting to hot, it appears that it will last a long time... if you get it red hot repeatedly (like I have with mine) it will crack if bent or flexed... Ask how I know, haha.
@examplerkey: If you let the exhaust bubble through water, you get soot problems and even flame outs after a while at low settings.
@@werner.x For sure... that probably wouldn't even start up at all ! I think he meant with the exhaust passing through and venting to atmosphere .... but yes, bubbling under water would not go well
Yes this is what I meant. There is no amount of huge pressure in either 85L of water or exhaust, so a good clamp seal should work. I plan to make the exhaust total length to 1-1.5m and the exhaust going outside. @@loweredexpectations4927
I plan to run the exhaust from the heater through the bucket of water in thermodynamically efficient curved L shape, semicircular shape or one complete loop and not more than that. The exhaust then comes out of the bucket from the lower side into the surrounding air like water would come out from an IBC tank tab, not bubbling through water. The intake fan probably doesn't have enough pressure to do that. @@werner.x
Canadian guy avoiding Air Conditioners😏
Haha... not much need for AC at this time of the year !
20:38 ... Shouldn't that be written " 向上 " since it's a Chinese heater ? Do these come with egg rolls or are they extra ?? 🤔
🤣 I wish they came with egg rolls ! Damn you, now I want eggrolls and I'm eating frozen pizza.
@@loweredexpectations4927 ... I just ordered my first heater tonight. I'm trying to convert my '58 Willys Wagon into an overlander and hopefully make the trek from Indiana to Alaska in 2025. Thanks for all the information that you share.
@@huf67 Woha ! That's a heck of a trip !!
You want a fight in the comments?!?
I assume aboot the video...but I don't have a fight on that, you are much more educated than I on that.
So how aboot this.... Wisconsin maple syrup is better than anything from Quebec. 🤪
Now that does it ! You have a mortal ennemi now ! Your lamp post syrup is no match to the fine Quebecois true white north syrup!
Haha.. Thanks for the fight ! You're talking pure nonsense. "Wisconsin" more like "You Wishconsin" 🤣 I heard they buy Quebec maple syrup and cut it 50/50 with Ant Jamamias.
Lol.... Wishconsin thinking that creosote is maple syrup !
@loweredexpectations4927 first off, STOP giving away the Wisconsin syrup secret!! How DARE you!😅
@loweredexpectations4927 secondly, it is not the creosote maple syrup you're thinking aboot, it's the creosote smoked venison that everyone is aboot around here, ya der hey!
That said, we have yet to make a stove specifically dedicated to utilizing waste smoke from our heat source...that just seems WAY too Canadian for us down here, dontch ya know!
My comment is not showin and IDK why. This is a test
UA-cam has this habit of blocking or deleting a lot of comments recently. If you say anything that has a word that could be ... well... if I try to explain it they will probably delete this comment... but yes, they are going WAY too far.
They used to offer settings so that, if you wanted to, you could block or filter certain speech, and I always had it turned off.... now it appears that they have decided to just block things themselves.
i would pay 500euro for a heater that burn waste oil as easy as diesel.
I think my mod is a long way from that.... "waste oil as easy as diesel" may be possible, but what I'm aiming at first is an extended cleaning interval mod.
I do have a few ideas for making something that is .... self cleaning, we will call it, but that is a ways off.
A hundred dollar one can do it easily. 40 percent very well filtered waste or veggie oil..50 percent new diesel /heating oil/kerosene/jet A, and 10 percent petrol. Run at least 1/2 to full throttle. Switch to straight diesel if you can't run at least 1/2 power and during any startup / shut down
@@gbear1005 fake news
@@gbear1005 Please make a video showing this happening. There are lots of videos of people doing this and failing, so we would all like to know how your setup is different from all of those that have failed.
I am curious to know where the glycerine goes that seems to cause everyone else problems. In biodiesel, this is "cracked" out using alcohol and lye and then the glycerine is removed before burning. I thought perhaps the gasoline might have an effect, but separating the glycerine, but unless it was drained out, that would be even worse.
Running at full throttle causes the primary burn chamber temperatures to drop substantially lower than at half. The only part of the heater that is hotter at full throttle, is the exchanger.
like i say it will not burn easy only 40% and a lot of work. i can burn around 60-80l pure before it clogg up and shut off. i would just like one that burn 100% wvo with no problems@@gbear1005
the venturi effect?
Not totally sure what you are referring to, but the venturi effect requires some pretty specific geometry. You are the second person to say this so maybe I'm missing something, haha
The air form the combustion fan blows outward towards the circumference of the chamber, onto the mesh, so is not idea for the venturi effect.