Camping and CPAP Part 1. Cheap and Easy Battery Power for Several Nights of Camping.
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- Опубліковано 23 сер 2024
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Camping is fun, unless you need CPAP in the great outdoors. Here is a cheap and easy solution so that you can still get a good nights sleep using CPAP when you are camping. Most people will get 3-4 nights out of this.
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Thank you!!!
Great video! Started my cpap therapy in January. I went on my first camping trip of the year last week and went home after one night. I never realized how miserable I was sleeping w/o a cpap. This video was very useful!
Hey Lefty, just got back from hunting Northern Michigan and stayed in a tent for 5 days and 4 nights. I turned my humidifier off but kept my water chamber full. The temperatures ranged from high 20's to low 40's and I did my best to keep my marine battery warm ( threw some clothes on it while hunting) and placed it on a thick rug doubled in half so it wouldn't be sitting on cold ground. I took my battery charger with me and checked in town where I could plug it in to find out how much energy I had used after 2 nights and I had a 96 % still left. Mind you I bought this marine battery at Walmart a few years ago, so I think it was around a $130. When we got home after 4 nights of use , I tested the battery to find out how much energy was left in the battery and it said 50%. I was very surprised and excited and my brother said, "next year I got the whole week off"! I CANNOT SLEEP without my Resmed air sense 10, I just snore and snort and wake up with a very sore throat. I'm 6' 230lbs and once and awhile at home I'll add 2 drops of eucalypsis oil to my humidifier if I have to open my nasal passages.
In my RV, I wired a 12v cig lighter outlet near the bed which is powered by the 12v RV batteries. Before that, I used and inverter and Auto Jump starter which only lasted one night until I learned about the 12v power supplies. I left the jump start at the ranger station every morning, but it actually took 2 days to recharge so I only got about 4 hours out of it. Things are so much better now with the 12v adapters and solar generators. I've switched from face mask to nasal pillows (Aloha brand) and like it much better.
My "current" set up is a ResMed Airsense 10, ResMed 12vdc to 24vdc Converter, two 18 ah SLA batteries in parallel ( 36ah), humidifier and heated tubing shut off. I just got three (3) 8-hour nights of CPAP, ending voltage was 12.53vdc. Might have gone one more night but not good to run SLA batteries down too low. Total cost converter and batteries, less CPAP, approx. $200. Total (2) battery weight 26lbs.
We just spent a few days at Steep Ravine on the coast about 20 miles North of the Golden Gate Bridge. There are 10 cabins built in 1938 on the bluffs by the ocean with wood stoves and no water, plumbing, or electricity. My friend's CPAP machine and backup battery went dead on our last campout in the redwoods so I built one for this trip using 2 new garden tractor lead acid batteries from Walmart costing $24 each. I do not think generators are allowed there and it would be terribly rude to spoil the ocean surf and breeze sounds.
The downside on commercial battery jumper packs (like my Stanley Fat Max) is a long 20+ hour charge time needed using 120 VAC power. The unit I put together in a plywood box has 8 feet of 8 gauge jumper cables, a battery disconnect, 2 USB charging ports, voltmeter, LED light, a pair of 12 volt outlets and a small compartment to store a 350 Watt pure sine wave inverter and 2 USB phone cables. There is a 30 amp breaker inside for protection on the 12 volt outlets. The actual battery compartment is ventilated top and bottom to allow hydrogen gas to escape.
This unit ran his CPAP all night on the 120 volt inverter using the water and medium heat setting. We charged 3 cell phones, charged his audio system, ran my laptop using the 120 volt adapter. We purposely abused it for test purposes. Gramma even plugged in her Conair hair curling iron and used it in the morning. Charge went from 12.6 volts to 12.1 volts over 11 hours of use. The inverter cuts out at 11.0 volts so there was power to spare.
To recharge the next evening , I connected the jumper cables to our car's battery for 20 minutes, let it sit, then started the engine and let it idle for another another 10 minutes just to be sure it got a good charge. The alternator charged it to 14.4 volts but the battery pack settled to 12.6 volts when we brought it back in the cabin.
This unit weighs about 35 lbs and is the size of a Honda EU 1000 generator, has a heavy duty garage door handle to lift it, rubber feet on the bottom to free the air vents underneath. The jumper cables are wound around the top for storage and are de energized until needed. It will start the V-6 Camry easily. It can't be laid on its side without leaking acid, though. I had some parts, the inverter, and 1/2'' cabinet plywood pieces so the batteries and jumper cables and USB power panel cost about $75.00. The advantage of this home built unit is that it can be completely recharged off the car battery within 30 minutes or less. He was happy to have the heat on the CPAP as it got cold at night. ....needs more testing but I'd call it a success.
Got dreamstation converter for car plug in - then car plug to pos/neg clamp converter - then direct clamped it to deep cycle marine battery (about $100 bucks at most auto stores). Battery With two converter things, about $150 bucks total. I use no heat - my air pressure varies from about 8 to 15 lbs. I used my volt meter to measure battery after two nights camping last weekend - almost no change in voltage (pre and post). I added a battery box for about 15 bucks. With heater off, I think I can get a week out of it very easily without re-charge (maybe more).
Be careful, vehicle batteries are not made to sleep with and can actually put out poison toxins in the air. Sounds like a good setup hopefully your battery and box are outside the tent.
@@gamergeek8933 Thanks for the advice - I have always been in an open lean-to - but will be more careful now with that info.
Awesome advice. Solved my problem! Was using the heater and humidifier. Drained my battery power quickly. Not any more .Thank you!
James Mandas i have found a more competitive power bank for CPAP which can extend 4-6nights,which is 297 wh CPAP power bank ，it can compatible with different CPAPs.
I have a more complicated solar setup, but the idea is the same. When I camp I run my Resmed Aircurve on DC. Unfortunately, I've found I cannot do without the humidification. My nose, throat, and mouth dry out to a very unpleasant, uncomfortable degree. That's something for people to consider, because, as you rightly point out, you'll use more battery power running the humidifier.
I use the ResMed 10, and hooked it up to a 24 dc marine battery (a slightly larger one), and tested it for 10 days straight, 7 hrs a night, and I think it would have gone 2 weeks easily. It's a heavy battery, but good to have in case the electricity goes out for a week or two. Or for extended traveling.
How did you connect the Resmed to the battery? Do you have original Resmed DC conventer? Or there is any other (cheaper) solution? Thank you..
@@jantauber1724 Yes, I have the original Resmed DC converter.
@@christ-in3284 Affordable, maybe $75-$95. I also bought a case. www.walmart.com/ip/Minn-Kota-1820175-Trolling-Motor-Power-Center-for-Group-24-and-27-Size-Batteries/20511018?wmlspartner=wlpa&selectedSellerId=0
@@christ-in3284 We bought 60 Ah battery, it is enought for about 5-6 nights, with no tube heating, no water, and with airplane switched on..
Thanks for the tips in the video! 5-years later, but you saved my bacon on an upcoming camping trip. Pro tip about a cpap running longer on 12v DC opposed to AC on a PPS was critical.
This video is a quite old but I wanted to share another cheaper alternative to the expensive resmed DC converter for the cigar lighter socket use. There is a brand called TAIFU which do them for all diffrent brands of CPAP. I have the same model in the video and bought one of the TAIFU branded ones which are way smaller and more compact. They cost £28 currently on Amazon so like nearly half the cost of the manufactures versions. And being smaller and lighter helps with the carrying of gear. If it it all including my power bank battery in the resmed carry case. You can get about 3 nights on a 7ah sealed lead acid battery. Or probably double that on a 12v lithium pack. Used it for a few weeks camping and works really well. No complaints. 🙌👌
thanks .. I will look into that brand
I have a generator on wheels... '05 Prius 🥰 I just plug it into my pure sine wave inverter and my Resmed 10 works like home... I can't sleep without humidity nor heated air...
Works like a dream....
Hey thanks for the video! I was looking to get a travel PAP but saw this video and part 2. Got the battery and DC cord, and waterless humidifier device from Amazon. I Since I have the Dreamstation, the CPAP unit is slightly larger than a travel unit. Two nights at about 6 hrs/night and 7in H2O and the battery shows fully charged! Battery and CPAP w/out humidifier unit fit nicely in the Dreamstation travel case! Saved a truckload of money! Thanks for the recommendation! 🙌🏾
I run the exact machine you have to a rockpals 250wh solar generator. Without any accessories on with the cpap, I get 1 full night running on AC. With DC I get 3 nights. It will fully recharge with solar at 5 hrs and 3 to 4 off a generator.
I bought a "CAT" branded battery that comes with car charging clamps, air compressor and all of the various outlets. I think its a 600w device. It was around $60. I used the Airsense w/heat, humidity and got nine hours of usage. That's certainly a hassle if I have to find a place to recharge it every day. I then switched to using a Nose Strip and a strap-on cushion to help keep me from turning on to my back, and that helped. Larger units like the Jackery 1500 should supply maybe four days but they're around $1400. They can however be used at home to power a fridge or freezer if there's a power outage. I'll have to try my machine at home without the heat/humidity to see if I can handle that. - An editorial note: I'll suggest doing some editing and get rid of that RV salesman. It's distracting, and not very funny. I'd get rid of most of the humor and keep it straight forward. Thanks.
Used to use a 300W inverter that would consume .6 to .7 Ah before any device was attached. I just rigged up a DC-DC cable for my machine and will test out the consumption.
New to trying camping with CPAP, the tips you folks shared with DC vs AC is critically helpful thank you.
Also... where is that amazing vintage RV footage from ? it looks absolutely hilarious!
Very informative thanks. I wasn't sure how all this DC plug-in stuff worked but now on your advice have ordered one. Like you said not very cheap, about $120 Canadian with free shipping. I got the aimtom version of your storage battery for Christmas. A fine addition to the truck tent!
Hi Chris. Where you get your bits and pieces from in Canada. I'm trying to figure out a setup for my wife so we can spend a few days canoeing in Algonquin Park.
Great videos, thanks.
I used the TalentCell PB240A1 ($70) 24V rechargeable battery with the DC power cable from a 24V power converter ($70) and it worked fine over night (as long as humidity and tube temp turned off) for camping off the grid.
Bought 4x 6V rechargeable batteries and cut the cable off an old laptop power supply, going to wire them together with a 3A fuse in the middle and see how it works. Little heavier than the solution I mentioned above, but considerably cheaper and probably lasts much longer if needed for multinight camping. Will update once I get a chance to test it out.
@@christ-in3284 24V since it's DC, that will go into your CPAP when using the battery. Use the 12V with the charger that came with it.
So you're saying I can spend 8 months on the Pacific Crest Trail like I've always dreamed of? Balls! Goodbye civilization!
As long as you can plug in every three days! Lots of luck!
You could do that without electricity...
Add a lightweight solar kit and you’re good to go
Have an extra battery pack so one can charge all day solar while using the other...
I built a CV/CC PSU/battery using a buck/boost converter and a hoverboard battery (10s1p +bms) - £30 total. No powersupply adapter needed for inbetween. Does two nights, but can do more if you get a bigger battery (eg an ebike battery). I'm looking into making a mini CPAP for camping, with the blower/PWM kits from aliexpress.
Content eventually starts around 5 or 6 minutes, sort of.
I go tent camping but near my car. I have a Resmed Airsense 10 and as I am always away from mains power I use solar panels. I have a 110 amp hour deep cycle battery, a 120 watt folding two panel solar unit, DC to DC line from the battery to the Airsense. I got an auto electrician to modify the Dc to DC lead so one end has the Anderson connector on it which plugs into the battery, rather than using alligator clips. The line has heatshrink to weatherproof the modifications. The battery should give me 3-4 nights sleep if the sun was obscured by clouds/rain etc. So far the camping weather has been good. I went mid winter camping and the overnight temps were about -1C. The battery is very heavy. System works fine. This setup isn't suitable for going hiking.
I do not have the water chamber on the Airsense when I go camping, have the side fitting which seals the unit.
On the battery I've used two Anderson plugs, one for the input from the solar panels, one for connecting the line from the Airsense to the battery. The solar panel has a regulator to stop the panel overcharging the battery. If I'm around during the day I'll reposition the solar panels to track the sun.
I shall have a look at this portable device in the video and see if it is an option for use away from the vehicle.
I once used a generator when I started going camping with the CPAP but the friends at the camp area couldn't stand the noise. It was a Honda gennie, relatively quiet, but there was a low noise for the seven hours to charge the battery.
l214laus k
So I recently purchased a similar one of these, it was the AIMTOM 155w. I have the Resmed Airsense 10 Auto. Also purchased the DC Adapter. Silly me went camping without having tested it. Evern with humidifier turned off, I only got 3.5 hrs out of the AIMTOM before it was dead flat. Thankfully people nearby had an inverter and extension cored so we tapped into their power. Would love to know what settings you use to get 3-4 nights
hey,
i tuned in to learn about camping with CPAP and thought i was going to see a cowboy kent video instead. lol
that little rig looks like it'll work fine for me.
and that rv salesman? firggin' hilarious. "accoutrement?!"
110 amp hour trolling motor battery is what I use. Resmed adapter worth every penny.
My mouth gets crazy dry if I don't have the humidifier turned up (I use a full face mask). I guess being in the outdoors would make up for that.
This guy gave up his self respect & dignity for our coupon code so you better give this Vid a thumbs up!!! Lol.....
Rockpals 300w solar generator battery has a 24v outlet and Talentcell in HK make a $10 cable to connect the battery to the Resmed Airsense 10. No need to use inverter or buck and boost converter from 12v up to 24v as the Rockpals battery ("solar generator ") has a 24v outlet...the first one to do this as far as I know
now if I only understood technical talk like this....
I will look up the battery... how heavy is it though?
Still laughing at the old rv footage you edited in...too funny! Thanks for the laugh and as always the good info. Much appreciated.
Your review is the only one which demos camping with a c-pap more than 1 or 2 nights. Too bad Amazon says it's unavailable.
And I didn't see it listed anywhere in your store just a bunch of t-shirts
Will you be the lift out the name of that doohickey or I missed it.
On the Air sense 10 also put it in airplane mode. That will save you power as well.
Thank you, didn't know that was a thing.
Croaker Yep the air sense 10 sends a wireless signal. So your doctor can look at the data. If you are running on a battery it saves power to turn that off. I was told that by The cpap shop and also by the doctor. I have done it and with the Jackery Honda 290 I have gotten 3 nights with it. And was still at 29% when we packed up.
@@Wbl17 Hey thanks for the info. I use a 20Ah LiFePO4 battery with a 300W inverter. I have to check again but with tube temp and humidity off I used between 8 and 10 Ah. Luckily I really don't notice much difference without the humidity on. Wow that's some great run time! Are you using the DC-DC adaptor? I was thinking about buying one but they're approx. $70 and I want to see a comparison first. My inverter consumes .6 Ah which is a lot.
@@CroakerOutdoors I did buy the 12V adapter. It sucks that it is so much. But, I figured it was worth it for how much we camp. Before using the 110V plug i would get just 2 nights. So to me the 12v was worth it. Good luck
@@Wbl17 Thanks again. I do a lot of camping as well and might pick one up.
What is the little power supply called???
I just got one of these but it’s a different brand. I’m going to try it tomorrow night while camping. Hopefully my cpap doesn’t freeze. Lol. I hope the battery pack doesn’t come freeze either
Dude, that is fantastic.
But what is that cigarette adapter plugged into the powerbank at 08:10 minutes.
I need one of those, I have the Resmed Airsense 10 to cigarette socket adaptor, but I can’t power THAT adapter into the powerbank - which is the cable/adaptor I’m asking about.
Hope that’s clear enough, but those crocodile/battery clips are wrong and not what I need.
Thanks for any help anywhere...!
if i turn heat humidity off should i get the side plate cover that replaces water tank? would save some space too? thanks
I don't know what machine you use, but sure! Saving space when you're camping/backpacking is always a plus.
@@Freecpapadvice sorry, resmed airsense. luv ur videos!
Oh. That humidifier doesn't take up all that much space. I'd probably just leave it in there dry, but whatever works best for you. If you do need humidity but don't want to use the actual humidifier (for energy conservation) try a heat moisture exchange (HME). The work well enough.
Could you comment on how to power Transcend Micro?
Is there another alternative like this one? Can’t buy it no more.
Plenty. Check my channel for battery reviews.
Looking for a portable battery generator that i can leave plugged in so its at the ready in the event of a power failure.I already have the dc adapter, just need a good portable battery. Thanks
Check out the Jackery brand.
@@SpaneenOomlong thanks, ive looked at them,but I wasn’t aware they can constantly be plugged in and are fully charged in the event of a power failure. Most portable units you cannot leave them constantly plugged in.
Do you know otherwise?
System one is 12 volts DC. I've wired it directly to my house battery.
Use the same ResMed Airsense 10.... trying to figure out how to use a battery with that dang 24V cpap....
Any information on airsense 11 power supply stuff thats my next one currently for camping dream station 2 which i hate its loud keeping me awake, camping i use a 250 watt inverter and a 12 volt lithium battery
I’ve never thought I could go camping now that I’m on a bipap
Nice video. Do you have a video about how to use solar panel with CPAP? I have the same cpap machine that you show. I checked the manual and recommend the BPS SP40 is 40 watts. Is so expensive is $300. Can you make a video about that? Thanks
Enjoyed your video, thank you!
Q: How long did it take you to repack the 5 seconds set up tent? 🤣
I've got it down to a science now! Not going to lie....the first few took about 3.5 hours to fold back up. 🤣
But can it power the A/C that I need here in Texas to cool off the tent so I can sleep?
Hmmm.....I don't know what the power needs are for that, but I'm sure it would power a fan.
No. The wattage of these AC inverters are typically around 300w peak. You can power light electronics such as a small TV or lamp or even some laptop chargers. I don't know the spec of the inverter built into this but I doubt it will exceed 300w. But should be more than 150w. You have to check the operating wattage of the appliance usually a sticker near the inlet cord explains the wattage usage. All that will happen is the battery box will shut off if overloaded. Might pop a fuse. Which renders the inverter part useless as it will be a cheap SMD type fuse most likely. It will power a small fan though.
Has anyone found the generator that he is specifically using????
I don’t think this one is made anymore. I did a review of an Oupes unit recently (year ago?) and use it heavily. It’s been a good generator and has much greater capacity.
So all we need for an Air Sense 10 cpap is the battery pack and the DC to dc adaptor, right?
I've been looking for a 12v power cable for my Resmed Elite II and it seems impossible to find. (12v, 2.5a) Is there something out there that can work with these older machines? I use this one as my travel machine. Thanks in advance.
Dude, you RE SO FUNNY, LUV IT
How much does this weigh? I'm using a Lofta. I got one at 4 lbs for multi days and a 2 pounder for single nights. I can use a solar panel to recharge.
Nice-R or KFD specifically for ResMed AirSense 10. $32 - $34 on Amazon
Thanks. This will be a game changer for me. Luckily, I don’t use the reservoir.
A good compromise for me is to use the humidifier but the heat turned off. Gives some humidity but no electrical load. I leave it turned out at home also. I can't stand next the warm air.
I didn’t catch the price of that machine?
Hey I know it’s two years after you give this video but I’m thinking about doing the same thing but with a solar power bank which is 30,000 Milla amp hours and using a USB to DC power adapter I wonder if that will work have you ever heard of that working
Where did you get those old RV commercials? Great!
"Winnebago man"
There is a documentary about the guy. Definitely recommend. So funny. Also there's clips on UA-cam. 👍
Pretty cool!!!!! No longer available
Sorry to go off topic but jow is your suv towing that trailer? Does it lack power?
RVing.. camping.. are they the same thing? Some people think so.
LOL.. love the humor..
What is the name of your power station, the one you got from Alibaba?
Stop splicing in stupid Winnebago guy every thirty seconds!
Okay....I'll do it every 15 seconds. Great suggestion!!!!!
I loved the winnebago guy lmao
Amazing dude!
My dude... love the channel, you have been amazingly helpful. It seems as thought the price has significantly gone up for these little guys, now $280. Check this out on Amazon for $176... would this work?
Pinty Portable Uninterrupted Power Supply 500W, UPS Battery Backup, Rechargeable Generator Power Source with AC Inverter, USB, DC 12V Outputs for Outdoors and Indoors (500W, Red)
Looks like it would. I'm a big fan of the Baldr 330. I have a video testing it out.
Hello What DC adapter you used
I am looking for solutions thanks
What song is that at the 3:00 mark?
I don't know if my sinuses could handle using the CPAP without the humidifier.
It's horrible. Must have humidifier turn on, especially in winter. I used 2 old car batteries to run my CPAP. It's awesome and last more than 8hrs
Anyone know if the Dreamstation was set to humidification "on" for both hose and system if it would draw the same power if the humidifier and heated hose was disconnected?
How many nights can we get if we were to use the AC Plug?
Depends on pressure and if you're using humidification. You can get 1 night for sure. 2 might be pushing it.
I’ve used a deep cycle marine battery 🔋 without a DC outlet that attached by way of clamps. Plug in an inverter. Plugged cpap to inverter.
So how did that work? Please let us know
@@ortegaeldo5633
Worked great
If i dont use humidity I wake up in pain
What’s the battery answer for backpacking? I have the resmed 11 now and my old pilot 12 battery is not compatible like it was with the dream station. Anyone have a solution?
Have you ever tried Nose Strips and some sort of strap-on cushion to keep you from sleeping on your back? I had to do that when I only got nine hours out of my portable battery.
@@SpaneenOomlong yes, thanks, but it does not work for me.
What’s the model of the mask you were using in the tent?
I believe it was the AirFit F20.
TheLankyLefty27 thanks
@@Freecpapadvice I have the same mask for my Phillips Respironics Trilogy 100 machine . There is also the Air Touch F20 Full Face Mask by RESMED
I use a conventional marine batter with an inverter. Dream station and humidifier off. Thanks for the video.
I use something similar when we go to the mountains. I get about 18 hours out of mine.
Dude where did you get that RV footage?!?!?! Freakin hilarious bro!!! 🤣😆😂
Winnebago Man. Highly recommend it!
They don’t make the model anymore :/
I'm finishing up testing another one out now, so good timing!
@@Freecpapadvice Soon? I'm ready to go dry camping for 2 weeks. I'm not sure how to charge them for that long, though. Thoughts?
My machine has a different type of plug in to the machine. Mine has three or four prongs for the plug. I don't think this will work. Still looking...
Hmm, it taking 7-8 hours to charge is strange, since a laptop (e.g. Dell, Lenovo) with a 90 Wh battery will take little over an hour to charge.
This charge time estimate was from the manufacturer. It seems to be about right.
@@matthewsullivan8483 False. My 6 year old laptop charges at the full 90 watts.
Listen I'm going to give a clue here. Don't slam the fuckin door!
There is a generic DC kit for the ResMed 10 on Amazon for $32
Do you have a link for this?
3 years later I figure there is something else. I need to go 3 - 4 days and don't have a solution.
Look at the BALDR 500W. I did a video review of the BALDR 330w and it lasted (without humidity or leak) 40+ hrs with 8cmH20. Check my video since I can’t remember exactly from memory.
@@Freecpapadvice I will, thank you very much.
Has anyone found a similar product in Australia? I can't... :-/
They are on Banggood and Aliexpress
Fuck it! I just gonna buy the jackery 500!
Godspeed little doodle!
Where is the original video of that guys cursing…I wanna see the whole thing
Look at "Winnebago Man". It's fantastic!
The Dreamstation go battery pack is a useless piece of crap. Four times I have charged it 100% and I never get more than 6 hours of use out of it. I am returning mine and getting rid of my dreamstation go because it has no DC port. It is a useless option for camping. So disappointed in it!
Stop making coffee with Red Bull..
Sleeping in an RV is not camping.
150 "watts of power" == 150 Wh, or 540 kilojoules, or 129 kilocalories
Just tell us. My god.
The cut aways. Ugghh
Those movie inserts are mega annoying. I know you are trying to be trendy but it's poor.
The comments on Amazon say this may last 2 nights. The third night maybe 3 hours.. Need something better than this.
I agree, I need 5 nights..... You found anything?
@@ariesmusicangel negative. Haven't really looked. Bad knees, no camping.
Look at the Anker PowerHouse. On DC should give 4 days. I'm researching that now. Have not purchased it.
This thing is crap. 6 hrs to charge it from your car, then it gives you only 2-3 hrs with the cpap.
Sounds like you might have the humidifier on or using it with AC and not DC. Are either of those true? Both with sap the power.
Total crap. 151 watt hours will run a cpap MAYBE 5 hours, not multiple nights.
I clicked on to this video to get information, not a bunch of cloned in BS. BYE
Well dang. Thanks OUTRAGEOUS isn't it Karen?
We just use our generator.
Wasteful... and stinky. Even with charging-discharging losses, it's more efficient to use a generator to charge batteries and use those, but by then it's just easier to use PV panels.
all night long? that's pretty inconsiderate if you're around other campers. huge faux pa amongst rv'ers
Man those stupid clips he added was lame.