I WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree. That’s why I was upset when I saw the cameo that felt so cheap. I didn’t want him to have anything to do with this very lackluster story with a presentation that felt so amateur
Yeah, I'm pretty hesitant with where this will go. The only positive I see is that the "Convergence" that created Mae and Osha, could be the knowledge that created Anakin. That being said, I haven't read any of the comics so I don't know if there's already a good story/explanation for it.
That little scene also portrayed plagus as more of a Voldemort in hiding, rather than a high-society person operating in secret. Not that the writers know anything about Star Wars.
Yeah, no. Plagueis already had an entire novel explaining where he came from in wanting this power. How he conceived of it, how he spent decades researching aspects of the Force to try and achieve it, and more importantly the CONSEQUENCES of doing so. This is just Headland trying to justify playing with a plot point that makes her personal creations special in a similar way to Anakin, even if his birth was a result of the Force itself rather than just people messing around with artificially tampering with life. It's completely unnecessary to Plagueis since he already had an entire storyline in Legends that didn't once mention anything like this influencing his decisions or ideas. The guy was a genius in every way imaginable with his entire endgame being to put the Force in the hands of everyday people, to basically remove the thin line that placed the Jedi "above" the people they protected and remove the power and trust that came with it. His one, single flaw was allowing himself to trust his apprentice as a Sith Lord. The witch coven's story was entirely detrimental to the show if I'm to be honest with my opinion. We never needed to know what happened, and to be honest it created more plot holes than it solved. The girls could've been normal twins from literally any part of the galaxy with the same backstory and it still would've worked, they didn't need to be "super special" in much the same way Obi-wan and 99.9% of the Jedi Order wasn't. Honestly was way more invested in the slight glimpses we saw of the Senate trying to exert more control over the Jedi Order, especially since there were definite flaws in the organization - Jedi as individuals are great, but the institution itself had some deep, deep problems which directly led to the Clone Wars even being possible and the divisions we saw in Tales of the Jedi. Putting the focus on that plot line alongside what we know of Plagueis's influence via Damask Holdings would've made for a hell of a political thriller potentially on par with Andor if it was told right.
Man this was well said and I can tell you're a big fan and have read Plagueis book. I've listened to the audiobook several times and agree. The book exposes the flaws of the Jedi of an institution and how political they've become. He says something along the lines of "they've confused matters of the Republic with matters of The Force". So he undermined them politically. That narrative did a far better job of portraying the Jedi's shortcomings than this show. Plagueis was indeed a genius, but even then he didn't even create life, it was implied it was the Force retaliating. But these witches did it without issue.
Why do you care? There's some people who actually enjoy the show. You just don't want whatever a 2nd season story could be to be considered "canon" and it literally makes no effing difference what is considered canon or legends. It has zero actual impact on your life other than you just simply don't like it.
I don't want a second season because it was trash. The audience rating of 14% on RT indicates that I am holding a view that the majority of viewers have. If you're one the 14%, that's great, glad you enjoyed it. Also, when did I mention legends or canon or whatever? My issue is the horrific writing and numerous plot holes, like the magic elevator door that the Jedi couldn't open 16 years before (then Venestra just uses the force on it), Mae broke the controls for it and it has no power after 16 years, but still Mae manages to fix it and power it up despite that.
What bots? No-one ever says waves of good reviews are botted, why is it so hard to believe that it is overwhelmingly negatively received by actual people?
Honestly, knowing Disney, I think they're just teasing us towards a dedicated Darth Plagueis series, which will likely be more focused on the origin of Sidious, which in turn will be overshadowed by Lucasfilm's attempts to "fix" the various gaping plotholes Rise of Crudwalker blew into the Canon, and will ultimately suffer from those attempts and be a fraction of the quality of the Book. At least that's my prediction.
agreed Plagueis needs his own series directed by someone with a love of the legends lore to really pay respect to this established and important character. I am also completely okay with never seeing some of these characters from legends as I feel part of their allure is their mystery and the more you reveal the less interesting they potentially become.
To be fair, Leslye does seem to have a very good knowledge of legends lore. It’s just that the execution of the show itself is not so great in the writing and direction
@@tonykirk8295 She may have the knowledge but not the love for the source material. If she did she wouldn't have made a show about 2 girls no one cares about. A sith apprentice finding an Acolyte should've been an incredible premise but it was not done well at all.
unfortunately i don't think a whole series about plagueis would ever be possible so even tho i agree that it deserves it i'm still happy that we got plagueis in a series after so many years. i do hope the series will give him justice (if we get a season 2 lol)
It would be interesting if we had some sort of plot twist where Plaguise reveals to Mae and Osha that he was the one responsible for creating the twins the entire time and probably had mother Annasaya believe otherwise.
Lesley is on a mission to rewrite Star Wars because she deems it as toxic. Idk how someone with that mindset is even allowed to get this job. It’s a disgrace to the legacy of Star Wars, especially George and the fans.
No I like this idea. I hope she gets to do it. That would be so interesting. I'm actually rly enjoying her story telling. I hope she gets to make alot more starwars shows, and that even with all the criticism it got, it still got much more watch time than Andor which is getting a season 2. 🤞
@@DarthPrime52 Velma's was greenlit before season 1 was done (and the hate watching didn't help), Halo because Halo had the initial numbers in season 1 to make a season 2 make sense - as well as some hope that season 2 they'd be able to course correct and fix some things (especially due to season 1's ending fight). Only to lose way too much in ratings, not even be hate watched (lessons learned from Velma), and just the sheer amount of negativity at that point that no one was likely watching season 3. This started in a hole because of the current state of Star Wars under Kennedy's leadership, and it got worse - it's not surprising that the hardcore lore nerds (understandably) bailed on this show unless they were determined to finish it for whatever reason, but I even saw some of the ones calling them 'cry babies' cause of some of the nonsense the show has already pulled like 4 episodes in (cause my dads been putting it on at times to watch during dinner) by episode 5 or 6 I think tap out saying 'no, the shows writing is awful and it's just bad - lore be damned'. If they are really tightening their belts - since this had DOUBLE Kenobi's budget and actually did worse I think (haven't seen final numbers), 'Book of Boba Fett' has a better chance at getting a season 2, and is far more deserving of one.
@@Mbaeac The second season hasn't been confirmed yet. Usually with shows like this the next season will be announced near the end of the current season, which hasn't happened for The Acolyte. It's very likely that they're getting a lot of pushback, since the ratings, watch time and revenue (compared to budget) are so low.
If she wanted to do a story about how Plagueis is pursuing that power…she should just use his amazing book as the main source and make the show ENTIRELY about Plagueis instead of OSHA and Mae. There are SOOOOO many missteps and missed opportunities with The Acolyte already, but making Darth Plagueis into Darth Plagiarize is one of the worst things she could do! And she’s already done enough damage
@@LAmaxX97 Problem is it entirely undermines the idea of his character. They guy wasn't just smart, he was a genius. He knew exactly where and how the Jedi had weakened, and his solution wasn't to directly target them as prior Sith had done. His plan was to "democratize" the Force. To make it into something that could be controlled and utilized through technology and scientific understanding, and by extension to put it in the hands of the people. Take away what made the Jedi special and make them just people like everyone else. The Sith, meanwhile, would control both this technology and the economy of the Republic, and by extension the Senate and government. This was all stuff he'd come up on with his own in Legends, and he spent decades working at it, approaching the Force from a scientific point of view that the Jedi outright refused to allow their members or the Republic to do. This is bad writing, and it just weakens an otherwise very unique and smart Sith Lord's character. Takes away what made him different from all those who came before and after him.
The book did a fine job of telling that story already. His goals, his activities, his perspective on the Sith and the force are all well developed. His character would disdain the creation of Headland more than we the fans already do.
This is a bad idea. I think that they should have a Darth Plagueis movie far removed from this series, showing why he was considered both powerful and wise. It also worries me that the show isn't going to have Plagueis be responsible for the vergence on Brendok. That would be the logical direction for this show. It would also correct the mistake of having the witches create Osha and Mae. If Plagueis is responsible for creating life on Brendok, then he is also accidentally responsible for creating Osha and Mae. This would give him motivation to understand them more.
The Acolyte would be a WAYYY better show if it focused solely on Pleagus’s rise to power rather than the frankly lacklustre story’s of Osha and Mae. Give us a story where we see the end of the high republic, the beginning of the rift between republic and Jedi and the secretive rise of the Sith, with the show acting as an origin to Palpitine, Anakin and just the world of Star Wars we know today
The other problem I see is this is all but implying that Plagueis learnt how to create life through the Force from watching the witches instead of discovering it himself. The feat that practically defined him getting cheapened by making it seem like if Osha and Mae hadn’t been created, neither would Anakin.
She is WAY off base on the criticism. People are saying that Anakin should be the only person ever created by the force in all of galactic history, otherwise the chosen one prophesy is meaningless. Assuming master green face tells yoda about the girls, Yoda’s first thought should be the prophesy, considering it would sort of fit with them. I’m sure it will not be. Honestly it would be like finding out that Jesus was not the first person born from God. It would negate the whole new testament.
It doesn't matter if they make a Plaguis show at this point, the Acolyte IS part of Disney Canon, regardless of if the fans like it or not, and Plaguis is implied to have gotten some ideas from the events of the Acolyte, ideas on how to mess with midiclorians to create life. Maybe this even gave him the idea for how to have a go with immortality. Whatever the case, even if they now give us a show that happens soon after the Acolyte and is almost a scene by scene recreation of the Plaguis novel, it would still be tinged by the fact that all of the events happening are happening because Plaguis was inspired by Osha and Mae. This even means that Plaguis and Palpatine messing with the force and the force retaliating by creating Anakin happens because of Osha and Mae, because Plaguis and Palpatine are only messing with the force in the first place because Plaguis got some ideas from the Witches in the Acolyte. It doesnt matter at this point. Whether we get an Acolyte season 2 or a Plaguis spin off show, its still tainted at this point.
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the fact she put him in there just PROVES she has no actual idea what she's doing with the story and IP and just doing whatever she can to put her "stamp" on Star Wars actual trash show worse than fan fiction IMO
this is literally the exact reason people have been hating his inclusion since the very beginning. All while Ecks defended it. kinda disappointing that you have to have it spelled out (as a lore speculation channel) when the consequences of the show are obvious
lets just go all the way. Have Plagueis be a nice guy who just wanted to live long enough to finish his studies into the dark side of the force. THEN THE DAI BENDU DROP IN THROUGH THE CEILING RIDING DINOSAURS WITH LASER GUNS. Then he runs Damask Holdings with a black turtleneck. Sojourn Gatherings were just a gatherings of people who wanted to play Star Wars version of D&D.
Why can no one just stick to the original material already present?! The plagueis book is one of the best ever written Star Wars books... JUST TAKE THE GODDAMN IDEAS AND STOP MESSING WITH OUR FAVORITE FRANCHISE
It’s just key jangling the same as a Yoda cameo, Headland has no interest in the characters other than how their presence can enhance her own original characters story, but we’ve just had a eight episode series trying to flesh out her creations and it feel like the majority of people will be forgetting this show in 3, 2, 1.
Yup- if they are going to tell Plagueis’ story (and I’m not convinced they should, they’ll just stuff it up immensely) then it definitely shouldn’t be second fiddle to the twins
Sorry, a bunch of random, lesbian witches - with zero explanation - can somehow conjure life from the Force, and the Sith, who've sought such power since the time of Bane (1000 years, give or take)... can't???
Ah yes, the ego trip big enough to insert an epic, almost mythological figure from the prequels that they know people like, and make it so that entire story centers on your excrement of a show. Awesome.
Disney+ would probably have to shove it in our faces that he's Palpatine's master if they want the nostalgia high they bought Star Wars for in the first place. I hope Holden gets to tell as interesting of a story as she promises, but the odds are slim
Its nonsense, Plagues didnt have some lousy twins to study creating life from force. He had prisoner,his master Venamis, he experimented on and studied. Until let him finaly die. Trying to say he had to study force from lousy character twins is just to ruin original stories
I can see 2 ways they can use Plagueis. Either they try saving the Acolyte by making him part of a bigger role in Acolyte and write Ohsa as an apprentice before Sidious, which would be possible since Palpatine is first born 40-50 years later. Alternatively they end the Acolyte with this season or kill Qimir and Ohsa in season 2 and then create a Plagueis focused show that could possible include Sidious, in the show there would likely be a focus on his quest for immortality and how the Acolyte somehow affected him and his goals.
I understand the wish for Plagueis having his own story but to reach to a broader audience it is a pretty big risk to center the storyline around a psychopathic alien villain. It is more logical to have ”good guys” being the main focus with his story being told parallell. They could very well do this without destroying canon. Main story - charismatic guardians of peace and justice uncovering mysterious hints of a dark presence B-story - Plagueis operations in the dark, learning about dark side rituals, training an acolyte, setting the stage for Palpatine’s rise to power. Too bad they already failed with the charismatic Jedi aspect
I wouldn’t mind, but I think they would need to deal with Qimir first, like is he the apprentice, is Plagueis at this the apprentice and Qimir is doing was Maul or Ventress did and trying to train his own apprentice. I think focusing the story more on Darth Plagueis needs to conclude the Qimir chapter of the story and then move onto its focus on him. Which is why I don’t love the cameo tbh as cool as it looked. Plagueis arriving should get the same “oh fuck” moment that we got when Qimir appeared on Khofar
I personally think that Plagueis' story should remain vague, with the only mention of him being from the tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise, by Palpatine in Episode 3 Revenge of the Sith.
Plagueis getting handed the secret not only is not interesting, it lessen his character and the whole premise - Any generic Sith person would want to take advantage of that knowledge. The point is that he in particular was hyper focused and skilled enough to achieve something so anti-natural. The story should be about him been meticulously behind everything and everyone's actions, just to lose all at the end. Hence the "Tragedy".
Wish young writers understand that pre-established characters & storylines ARE an asset, not a problem to be dealt with, needlessly worrying that their sole presence will overshadow your own creations. It's ok to not be overtly beholden to lore and traditions, but is also ok to use it as a baseline to propel new ideas, rather than attempting to swiftly overwrite all. That's laziness.
The book did a fine job of telling that story already. His goals, his activities, his perspective on the Sith and the force are all well developed. His character would disdain the creation of Headland more than we the fans already do. And, main characters named OSHA and (Fanny) Mae? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Health code and safely violations and poor banking are your main characters?
Remember Anakin was born by the force because the prophecy says he'll bring balance? Remember the mortise god arc? Oh yeah let's just throw that out the window. And did you just say a different timeline so what you're saying is this is not canon to our timeline?
There are very important ponts being overlooked: 1) This is happening quite early in Plagueis' life, comparing to when he starts teaching Sidious. 2) It's miraculous for a boy to be conceived by a woman without a man, but it isn't for a girl, as women do not carry the Y chromosome. What happened to the mothers is closer to cloning & to IVF than to the miraculous birth of Anakin. C) It was already alluded to in the comics that Anakin was created by Plagueis & Sidious, almost making Palpatine Anakin's father.
The book literally describes how he learns this power they had a chance to make an amazing series they blew it and now more people hate starwars what I would give to get half decent writers to at least look at the lore instead of whatever woke crap they want to shove into it.
If it does happen, I hope Leslye is only an idea person. I like some of the general concepts of the Acolyte but her overall story writing and execution was not good. I feel like she was right with this statement though, it would be much more interesting to see him pursuing this power.
Wait… There’s going to be a season two of this garbage? Why on earth would they ever make a season two of a universally hated show? All we want is Andor.
This presents some very interesting theories. However, there's one problem. Disney Lucasfilm has confirmed that The Acolyte is a limited series. There will NOT be a season 2.
I absolutly disagree. No one on this planet can make a good, let alone a great Darth Plagueis movie or tv-show centered around him. Lesley is all alone in talking about these characters, this era of Star Wars, and no one else is, because no one of a creative mind have that interest.
Just cuz it's big in the first doesn't mean it's not just a mechanism of story in the second. You gotta build it up then deliver. Did they build it up.like we wanted or like we thought they would... no but that doesn't meant they won't the second season. Hey quimire (or however you spell it) was as savage as he was convincing. Sol and a torn up jedi BELIEVING he was right but was just philosophically wrong was brilliant. They set up the jedi corruption and blindness. They set up this dice roll of immortality and the force dyad (cool but don't know how I feel about it yet). Was it awesome, amazing, and great.... no. Did it tell a convoluted story that could have been better told.... yes. Was it the pile of shit that some people said it was... no (comr on it wasn't new trilogy bad, i.e. Just mucking up the whole Skywalker and 6 movie legacy). It was a decent story with some sub par nonchronological mishaps that pulled it together in the end. Let alone the lightsaber fights. Let them cook for a second
I've been saying the same thing with ALL these Acoylte reviews, and I'll say it again, the cannon is intact, it's the timeline they are tweaking, which is fine.
In canon the Sith were extinct, now they're bending that a lot by making the Jedi do some ridiculous cover-up so somehow Yoda and Mundi don't know? Plagueis was the one experimenting with creating life, but now it's the witches that do it, easily at that. Sure they are not technically violating canon, they're just undermining its importance.
NO! Plagueis, Malgus, Revan my top 3 Plagueis' story Is great, no need to sully it with this lack of respect for his story and what he achieved. Diminishing his legacy to improve their own
Plagueis was able to create life with the force, and that's how Anakin was born to Shmi with no father. The force is literally his father, or I guess technically Plagueis. Now, him "stopping" death or whatever was never shown or demonstrated, but the creating life with the force was his thing originally.
He HAD an interesting story. We are in a new universe. I remember when people did this with the MCU movies. "Here are 10 things they got wrong about Thor". No, they didn't. The MCU is its own self contained universe that picks and chooses what elements of the comics and other media they would like to include and changes character details as necessary. People need to start accepting that the new canon is its own self contained story that holds a few movies as a common starting point. The EU still exists and is a self contained story and the new universe exists and is its own self contained story that may or may not pick and choose whichever elements of the old EU that they feel add to the story.
The emount of angry nerds in the comments section of these videos is crazy. Its just a tv show! If you dont like the show you can just consider it non canon (even though it is) and move on with your life. Dont waste it whining about it online.
Game of Thrones is essentially about Jon Snow. Do you feel like the other characters are eclipsed? No tons of other characters in the show are amazing.
Respectfully, first of all Plagueis shouldn't be alive yet, secondly changing it from Plagueis's power/research combining to result in creating life and preventing death with the force, should be left as that. Do not make it "Oh he learned it from these new witches that we made up for the series" but anyway I'm not super worried because...well there's no way this gets a season 2. Whether you liked it or hated it, it got less viewers than Ahsoka which was formerly the least watched Star Wars media recently created.
Man people, including this whole channel are hating on the acolyte so much all because people get so worked up and obsessed with whats considered "canon" vs "legends". I've been a SW fan since before the prequels came out, and so many of you hated the prequels with a burning passion when they came out compared to how you view them now. Your life is not going to end just because there's a SW show out there you personally dont like. It's a TV series, it may not be the greatest show, but its fiction and entertainment and what is considered "canon" vs "legends" has zero materialistic harm nor impact on any of you. Get a life lol.
*thumbnail*
Palpatine: "Prepare for trouble!"
Plagueis: "And make it double!"
A Sith version of MC Hammer “Dew it.”
Palpatine: "To protect the Sith from devastation!"
Plagueis: "To unite our Dark force users within our nation!"
@@IzMyVideozlol
Team rocket reference?
@@Trebor74 yeah
I WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree. That’s why I was upset when I saw the cameo that felt so cheap. I didn’t want him to have anything to do with this very lackluster story with a presentation that felt so amateur
It almost looked shoehorned in. The special effects looked poor compared to the Muun design we saw in Revenge of the Sith.
Yeah, I'm pretty hesitant with where this will go. The only positive I see is that the "Convergence" that created Mae and Osha, could be the knowledge that created Anakin.
That being said, I haven't read any of the comics so I don't know if there's already a good story/explanation for it.
The Plagueis novel deserves to have a movie made about it.
I thinks it works pretty well as It is. I don't imagine it in an audiovisual medium
There is a fan made movie of it made by Everest productions check it out it’s pretty good
I just love how he sticks his head around the rock like he’s in a cartoon.
Puts his hand on it and everything
Pure art
The fact that Headland is talking so confidently about a season 2 just means that KK is doing everything in her power to greenlight it
She need to be stop
Kathleen Kennedy is the truth Sith Lord. Now she has her apprentice.
That little scene also portrayed plagus as more of a Voldemort in hiding, rather than a high-society person operating in secret. Not that the writers know anything about Star Wars.
They were supposed to be the main focus of a sith show and all we got was one creeping out a cave in the last episode
Yeah, no.
Plagueis already had an entire novel explaining where he came from in wanting this power. How he conceived of it, how he spent decades researching aspects of the Force to try and achieve it, and more importantly the CONSEQUENCES of doing so. This is just Headland trying to justify playing with a plot point that makes her personal creations special in a similar way to Anakin, even if his birth was a result of the Force itself rather than just people messing around with artificially tampering with life. It's completely unnecessary to Plagueis since he already had an entire storyline in Legends that didn't once mention anything like this influencing his decisions or ideas. The guy was a genius in every way imaginable with his entire endgame being to put the Force in the hands of everyday people, to basically remove the thin line that placed the Jedi "above" the people they protected and remove the power and trust that came with it. His one, single flaw was allowing himself to trust his apprentice as a Sith Lord.
The witch coven's story was entirely detrimental to the show if I'm to be honest with my opinion. We never needed to know what happened, and to be honest it created more plot holes than it solved. The girls could've been normal twins from literally any part of the galaxy with the same backstory and it still would've worked, they didn't need to be "super special" in much the same way Obi-wan and 99.9% of the Jedi Order wasn't. Honestly was way more invested in the slight glimpses we saw of the Senate trying to exert more control over the Jedi Order, especially since there were definite flaws in the organization - Jedi as individuals are great, but the institution itself had some deep, deep problems which directly led to the Clone Wars even being possible and the divisions we saw in Tales of the Jedi. Putting the focus on that plot line alongside what we know of Plagueis's influence via Damask Holdings would've made for a hell of a political thriller potentially on par with Andor if it was told right.
Man this was well said and I can tell you're a big fan and have read Plagueis book. I've listened to the audiobook several times and agree.
The book exposes the flaws of the Jedi of an institution and how political they've become. He says something along the lines of "they've confused matters of the Republic with matters of The Force".
So he undermined them politically. That narrative did a far better job of portraying the Jedi's shortcomings than this show.
Plagueis was indeed a genius, but even then he didn't even create life, it was implied it was the Force retaliating. But these witches did it without issue.
Correct. It's an inferior writer wanting to change an established story for selfish reasons.
But its not canon there only 6 movies and thats it. everything else is hot garbage we do not care about kiddo.
I haven't read that book, in ep. 3 it is implied Plagueis could create life and did likely create Anakin
Hoping very much that the show does NOT get a season 2.
Why do you care? There's some people who actually enjoy the show.
You just don't want whatever a 2nd season story could be to be considered "canon" and it literally makes no effing difference what is considered canon or legends. It has zero actual impact on your life other than you just simply don't like it.
I don't want a second season because it was trash. The audience rating of 14% on RT indicates that I am holding a view that the majority of viewers have. If you're one the 14%, that's great, glad you enjoyed it.
Also, when did I mention legends or canon or whatever? My issue is the horrific writing and numerous plot holes, like the magic elevator door that the Jedi couldn't open 16 years before (then Venestra just uses the force on it), Mae broke the controls for it and it has no power after 16 years, but still Mae manages to fix it and power it up despite that.
@aeschylus6250 If we get 15 seasons of Mando like S1 and S2, I wouldn't mind. But if they're like S3 or Acolyte...
What bots? No-one ever says waves of good reviews are botted, why is it so hard to believe that it is overwhelmingly negatively received by actual people?
@aeschylus6250 jeez, someone seems snappy
Honestly, knowing Disney, I think they're just teasing us towards a dedicated Darth Plagueis series, which will likely be more focused on the origin of Sidious, which in turn will be overshadowed by Lucasfilm's attempts to "fix" the various gaping plotholes Rise of Crudwalker blew into the Canon, and will ultimately suffer from those attempts and be a fraction of the quality of the Book. At least that's my prediction.
agreed Plagueis needs his own series directed by someone with a love of the legends lore to really pay respect to this established and important character. I am also completely okay with never seeing some of these characters from legends as I feel part of their allure is their mystery and the more you reveal the less interesting they potentially become.
To be fair, Leslye does seem to have a very good knowledge of legends lore. It’s just that the execution of the show itself is not so great in the writing and direction
@@tonykirk8295 She may have the knowledge but not the love for the source material. If she did she wouldn't have made a show about 2 girls no one cares about. A sith apprentice finding an Acolyte should've been an incredible premise but it was not done well at all.
I hope Lucasfilm knows what they’re doing.
I want to see more about the Sith that came before Sidious in canon, both the ones from The Old Republic and The Rule of Two
unfortunately i don't think a whole series about plagueis would ever be possible so even tho i agree that it deserves it i'm still happy that we got plagueis in a series after so many years. i do hope the series will give him justice (if we get a season 2 lol)
This is the best take down here. No Acolyte slander but knowing you want Plagueis done right. Thanks bro :)
It would be interesting if we had some sort of plot twist where Plaguise reveals to Mae and Osha that he was the one responsible for creating the twins the entire time and probably had mother Annasaya believe otherwise.
Lesley is on a mission to rewrite Star Wars because she deems it as toxic. Idk how someone with that mindset is even allowed to get this job. It’s a disgrace to the legacy of Star Wars, especially George and the fans.
No I like this idea. I hope she gets to do it. That would be so interesting. I'm actually rly enjoying her story telling. I hope she gets to make alot more starwars shows, and that even with all the criticism it got, it still got much more watch time than Andor which is getting a season 2. 🤞
Wow how optimistic to think there will be another season
there will be a second one sadly
@@MbaeacNo wonder Disney is loosing billions everyday
Well Halo and Velma both got a second season so…
@@DarthPrime52 Velma's was greenlit before season 1 was done (and the hate watching didn't help), Halo because Halo had the initial numbers in season 1 to make a season 2 make sense - as well as some hope that season 2 they'd be able to course correct and fix some things (especially due to season 1's ending fight). Only to lose way too much in ratings, not even be hate watched (lessons learned from Velma), and just the sheer amount of negativity at that point that no one was likely watching season 3. This started in a hole because of the current state of Star Wars under Kennedy's leadership, and it got worse - it's not surprising that the hardcore lore nerds (understandably) bailed on this show unless they were determined to finish it for whatever reason, but I even saw some of the ones calling them 'cry babies' cause of some of the nonsense the show has already pulled like 4 episodes in (cause my dads been putting it on at times to watch during dinner) by episode 5 or 6 I think tap out saying 'no, the shows writing is awful and it's just bad - lore be damned'.
If they are really tightening their belts - since this had DOUBLE Kenobi's budget and actually did worse I think (haven't seen final numbers), 'Book of Boba Fett' has a better chance at getting a season 2, and is far more deserving of one.
@@Mbaeac The second season hasn't been confirmed yet. Usually with shows like this the next season will be announced near the end of the current season, which hasn't happened for The Acolyte. It's very likely that they're getting a lot of pushback, since the ratings, watch time and revenue (compared to budget) are so low.
If she wanted to do a story about how Plagueis is pursuing that power…she should just use his amazing book as the main source and make the show ENTIRELY about Plagueis instead of OSHA and Mae. There are SOOOOO many missteps and missed opportunities with The Acolyte already, but making Darth Plagueis into Darth Plagiarize is one of the worst things she could do! And she’s already done enough damage
I feel like plagueis stealing that idea is a pretty Sith thing to do
@@LAmaxX97 Problem is it entirely undermines the idea of his character. They guy wasn't just smart, he was a genius. He knew exactly where and how the Jedi had weakened, and his solution wasn't to directly target them as prior Sith had done. His plan was to "democratize" the Force. To make it into something that could be controlled and utilized through technology and scientific understanding, and by extension to put it in the hands of the people. Take away what made the Jedi special and make them just people like everyone else. The Sith, meanwhile, would control both this technology and the economy of the Republic, and by extension the Senate and government. This was all stuff he'd come up on with his own in Legends, and he spent decades working at it, approaching the Force from a scientific point of view that the Jedi outright refused to allow their members or the Republic to do.
This is bad writing, and it just weakens an otherwise very unique and smart Sith Lord's character. Takes away what made him different from all those who came before and after him.
The book did a fine job of telling that story already. His goals, his activities, his perspective on the Sith and the force are all well developed. His character would disdain the creation of Headland more than we the fans already do.
Darth plagueis looks like a malnourished guy who hasn't seen daylight in months wearing a snorkel mask
This is a bad idea. I think that they should have a Darth Plagueis movie far removed from this series, showing why he was considered both powerful and wise.
It also worries me that the show isn't going to have Plagueis be responsible for the vergence on Brendok. That would be the logical direction for this show. It would also correct the mistake of having the witches create Osha and Mae. If Plagueis is responsible for creating life on Brendok, then he is also accidentally responsible for creating Osha and Mae. This would give him motivation to understand them more.
I'll be a bantha's uncle if they're gonna have another season
The Acolyte would be a WAYYY better show if it focused solely on Pleagus’s rise to power rather than the frankly lacklustre story’s of Osha and Mae.
Give us a story where we see the end of the high republic, the beginning of the rift between republic and Jedi and the secretive rise of the Sith, with the show acting as an origin to Palpitine, Anakin and just the world of Star Wars we know today
The other problem I see is this is all but implying that Plagueis learnt how to create life through the Force from watching the witches instead of discovering it himself. The feat that practically defined him getting cheapened by making it seem like if Osha and Mae hadn’t been created, neither would Anakin.
She is WAY off base on the criticism. People are saying that Anakin should be the only person ever created by the force in all of galactic history, otherwise the chosen one prophesy is meaningless. Assuming master green face tells yoda about the girls, Yoda’s first thought should be the prophesy, considering it would sort of fit with them. I’m sure it will not be. Honestly it would be like finding out that Jesus was not the first person born from God. It would negate the whole new testament.
It doesn't matter if they make a Plaguis show at this point, the Acolyte IS part of Disney Canon, regardless of if the fans like it or not, and Plaguis is implied to have gotten some ideas from the events of the Acolyte, ideas on how to mess with midiclorians to create life. Maybe this even gave him the idea for how to have a go with immortality. Whatever the case, even if they now give us a show that happens soon after the Acolyte and is almost a scene by scene recreation of the Plaguis novel, it would still be tinged by the fact that all of the events happening are happening because Plaguis was inspired by Osha and Mae. This even means that Plaguis and Palpatine messing with the force and the force retaliating by creating Anakin happens because of Osha and Mae, because Plaguis and Palpatine are only messing with the force in the first place because Plaguis got some ideas from the Witches in the Acolyte. It doesnt matter at this point. Whether we get an Acolyte season 2 or a Plaguis spin off show, its still tainted at this point.
Are you saying you’ve “got a bad feeling about this”?
This show was so damn confusing
Second of all, if you're going to tell any story about an already known character, you need to know about them.
600th like!
Oh god... Please don't let her have another season. She is just awful.
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The Acolyte has utterly destroyed the Lucasfilm Canon timeline.
the fact she put him in there just PROVES she has no actual idea what she's doing with the story and IP and just doing whatever she can to put her "stamp" on Star Wars actual trash show worse than fan fiction IMO
this is literally the exact reason people have been hating his inclusion since the very beginning. All while Ecks defended it. kinda disappointing that you have to have it spelled out (as a lore speculation channel) when the consequences of the show are obvious
lets just go all the way. Have Plagueis be a nice guy who just wanted to live long enough to finish his studies into the dark side of the force.
THEN THE DAI BENDU DROP IN THROUGH THE CEILING RIDING DINOSAURS WITH LASER GUNS.
Then he runs Damask Holdings with a black turtleneck. Sojourn Gatherings were just a gatherings of people who wanted to play Star Wars version of D&D.
Why can no one just stick to the original material already present?! The plagueis book is one of the best ever written Star Wars books... JUST TAKE THE GODDAMN IDEAS AND STOP MESSING WITH OUR FAVORITE FRANCHISE
It’s just key jangling the same as a Yoda cameo, Headland has no interest in the characters other than how their presence can enhance her own original characters story, but we’ve just had a eight episode series trying to flesh out her creations and it feel like the majority of people will be forgetting this show in 3, 2, 1.
She has not earned Plagueis yet.
Yup- if they are going to tell Plagueis’ story (and I’m not convinced they should, they’ll just stuff it up immensely) then it definitely shouldn’t be second fiddle to the twins
If there is any hope left for Disneys Star Wars this show won't get a second season.
Sorry, a bunch of random, lesbian witches - with zero explanation - can somehow conjure life from the Force, and the Sith, who've sought such power since the time of Bane (1000 years, give or take)... can't???
She will retcon the Plagueis novel for her super duper new characters....
Ah yes, the ego trip big enough to insert an epic, almost mythological figure from the prequels that they know people like, and make it so that entire story centers on your excrement of a show. Awesome.
Disney+ would probably have to shove it in our faces that he's Palpatine's master if they want the nostalgia high they bought Star Wars for in the first place. I hope Holden gets to tell as interesting of a story as she promises, but the odds are slim
I would like to see season 2 AND the original Darth Plagueis novel made. I think that they can do both without harming the other.
Its nonsense, Plagues didnt have some lousy twins to study creating life from force. He had prisoner,his master Venamis, he experimented on and studied. Until let him finaly die. Trying to say he had to study force from lousy character twins is just to ruin original stories
We need to go 1000 years back or 1000 years forward.
Somehow Darth Plagueis returned.
Nothing she does with Star Wars is a good idea
I can see 2 ways they can use Plagueis. Either they try saving the Acolyte by making him part of a bigger role in Acolyte and write Ohsa as an apprentice before Sidious, which would be possible since Palpatine is first born 40-50 years later. Alternatively they end the Acolyte with this season or kill Qimir and Ohsa in season 2 and then create a Plagueis focused show that could possible include Sidious, in the show there would likely be a focus on his quest for immortality and how the Acolyte somehow affected him and his goals.
I understand the wish for Plagueis having his own story but to reach to a broader audience it is a pretty big risk to center the storyline around a psychopathic alien villain. It is more logical to have ”good guys” being the main focus with his story being told parallell.
They could very well do this without destroying canon.
Main story - charismatic guardians of peace and justice uncovering mysterious hints of a dark presence
B-story - Plagueis operations in the dark, learning about dark side rituals, training an acolyte, setting the stage for Palpatine’s rise to power.
Too bad they already failed with the charismatic Jedi aspect
There are plenty of shows that focus on the bad guy this is not new. It can work
I wouldn’t mind, but I think they would need to deal with Qimir first, like is he the apprentice, is Plagueis at this the apprentice and Qimir is doing was Maul or Ventress did and trying to train his own apprentice. I think focusing the story more on Darth Plagueis needs to conclude the Qimir chapter of the story and then move onto its focus on him. Which is why I don’t love the cameo tbh as cool as it looked. Plagueis arriving should get the same “oh fuck” moment that we got when Qimir appeared on Khofar
*evil head turn*
*slight smile*
I do not trust them with Plagueis!
He will end up being just another guy that stole something from a woman. Darth Patriarchy: The Sexist.😐
I hope it does get a second season. First one had lots of potential and the best fight scenes since the prequels, hopefully it can improve
I personally think that Plagueis' story should remain vague, with the only mention of him being from the tragedy of Darth Plagueis the Wise, by Palpatine in Episode 3 Revenge of the Sith.
Plagueis getting handed the secret not only is not interesting, it lessen his character and the whole premise - Any generic Sith person would want to take advantage of that knowledge. The point is that he in particular was hyper focused and skilled enough to achieve something so anti-natural. The story should be about him been meticulously behind everything and everyone's actions, just to lose all at the end. Hence the "Tragedy".
Wish young writers understand that pre-established characters & storylines ARE an asset, not a problem to be dealt with, needlessly worrying that their sole presence will overshadow your own creations. It's ok to not be overtly beholden to lore and traditions, but is also ok to use it as a baseline to propel new ideas, rather than attempting to swiftly overwrite all. That's laziness.
Nevermind a _series_ it should be given a *FILM*
The book did a fine job of telling that story already. His goals, his activities, his perspective on the Sith and the force are all well developed. His character would disdain the creation of Headland more than we the fans already do.
And, main characters named OSHA and (Fanny) Mae? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Health code and safely violations and poor banking are your main characters?
Remember Anakin was born by the force because the prophecy says he'll bring balance? Remember the mortise god arc? Oh yeah let's just throw that out the window. And did you just say a different timeline so what you're saying is this is not canon to our timeline?
I just want this story continued in some form even if we don’t get a season 2.
No
There are very important ponts being overlooked:
1) This is happening quite early in Plagueis' life, comparing to when he starts teaching Sidious.
2) It's miraculous for a boy to be conceived by a woman without a man, but it isn't for a girl, as women do not carry the Y chromosome. What happened to the mothers is closer to cloning & to IVF than to the miraculous birth of Anakin.
C) It was already alluded to in the comics that Anakin was created by Plagueis & Sidious, almost making Palpatine Anakin's father.
Two words:-
Tony Gilroy
The book literally describes how he learns this power they had a chance to make an amazing series they blew it and now more people hate starwars what I would give to get half decent writers to at least look at the lore instead of whatever woke crap they want to shove into it.
That creature lurking in the cave is not Hego Damask.
If it does happen, I hope Leslye is only an idea person. I like some of the general concepts of the Acolyte but her overall story writing and execution was not good. I feel like she was right with this statement though, it would be much more interesting to see him pursuing this power.
It could work either way
A Plagueis show might be terrible on its own
Wait… There’s going to be a season two of this garbage? Why on earth would they ever make a season two of a universally hated show? All we want is Andor.
This presents some very interesting theories. However, there's one problem. Disney Lucasfilm has confirmed that The Acolyte is a limited series. There will NOT be a season 2.
Who knows maybe in the far future this TV series will be redcon. Then we can move on in life
I absolutly disagree. No one on this planet can make a good, let alone a great Darth Plagueis movie or tv-show centered around him. Lesley is all alone in talking about these characters, this era of Star Wars, and no one else is, because no one of a creative mind have that interest.
Just cuz it's big in the first doesn't mean it's not just a mechanism of story in the second. You gotta build it up then deliver.
Did they build it up.like we wanted or like we thought they would... no but that doesn't meant they won't the second season. Hey quimire (or however you spell it) was as savage as he was convincing. Sol and a torn up jedi BELIEVING he was right but was just philosophically wrong was brilliant.
They set up the jedi corruption and blindness. They set up this dice roll of immortality and the force dyad (cool but don't know how I feel about it yet).
Was it awesome, amazing, and great.... no. Did it tell a convoluted story that could have been better told.... yes. Was it the pile of shit that some people said it was... no (comr on it wasn't new trilogy bad, i.e. Just mucking up the whole Skywalker and 6 movie legacy).
It was a decent story with some sub par nonchronological mishaps that pulled it together in the end. Let alone the lightsaber fights.
Let them cook for a second
Give me a second season but keep her the hell away from it
How about time travel and bring Anakin from the future?
I've been saying the same thing with ALL these Acoylte reviews, and I'll say it again, the cannon is intact, it's the timeline they are tweaking, which is fine.
In canon the Sith were extinct, now they're bending that a lot by making the Jedi do some ridiculous cover-up so somehow Yoda and Mundi don't know? Plagueis was the one experimenting with creating life, but now it's the witches that do it, easily at that. Sure they are not technically violating canon, they're just undermining its importance.
NO!
Plagueis, Malgus, Revan my top 3
Plagueis' story Is great, no need to sully it with this lack of respect for his story and what he achieved.
Diminishing his legacy to improve their own
Heck nah...
It was fine being its own story why do they have to drag other stories and characters down with them 😭
I agree and disagree, the purseu of power is a much better story but it could easily be it's own thing
Also it kinda takes away from anakin
They will completely butcher and murder his character. Luckily we don’t have to worry about this shit getting a second season 😂
But like plagueis never was Able to do that Palpatine was just lying to ankin what is she on about
Plagueis was able to create life with the force, and that's how Anakin was born to Shmi with no father. The force is literally his father, or I guess technically Plagueis. Now, him "stopping" death or whatever was never shown or demonstrated, but the creating life with the force was his thing originally.
@@xSharpW But he never created life. He tried to, but the Force retaliated by creating Anakin.
It was George's opinion that Palpatine was lying, but that's not the case in canon.
@@LordExorwait George is the creator so he decides the cannon
@@xSharpW no he didn't have u read plagueis novel or any disney cannon material because they all say he didn't
oh look its lesbian headlamp.
We are living in the worst Star Wars timeline
He HAD an interesting story. We are in a new universe. I remember when people did this with the MCU movies. "Here are 10 things they got wrong about Thor". No, they didn't. The MCU is its own self contained universe that picks and chooses what elements of the comics and other media they would like to include and changes character details as necessary. People need to start accepting that the new canon is its own self contained story that holds a few movies as a common starting point. The EU still exists and is a self contained story and the new universe exists and is its own self contained story that may or may not pick and choose whichever elements of the old EU that they feel add to the story.
Season 2?? Seriously?? This shitpile didn’t deserve an EPISODE 2… this show was fucking awful
Cool
The emount of angry nerds in the comments section of these videos is crazy. Its just a tv show! If you dont like the show you can just consider it non canon (even though it is) and move on with your life. Dont waste it whining about it online.
Why do these WOMEN have it?
Just answered your own question
Second season😂😂😂😂😂😂
Star Wars are doom
Game of Thrones is essentially about Jon Snow. Do you feel like the other characters are eclipsed? No tons of other characters in the show are amazing.
Plagueis did it first. Leslie is just mad because you ultimately need a male to contribute to creating life...
Leslye Headland is a great Director! I hope she gets her second season, she deserves it.
This little dream she is having of a season 2 will likely never happen. She can quit her acolyte hissy fit
What a bad idea to save all of the interesting plot points for a second season…
Respectfully, first of all Plagueis shouldn't be alive yet, secondly changing it from Plagueis's power/research combining to result in creating life and preventing death with the force, should be left as that. Do not make it "Oh he learned it from these new witches that we made up for the series" but anyway I'm not super worried because...well there's no way this gets a season 2. Whether you liked it or hated it, it got less viewers than Ahsoka which was formerly the least watched Star Wars media recently created.
If season 2 does that 😂
Due to it not good reviews
Man people, including this whole channel are hating on the acolyte so much all because people get so worked up and obsessed with whats considered "canon" vs "legends". I've been a SW fan since before the prequels came out, and so many of you hated the prequels with a burning passion when they came out compared to how you view them now. Your life is not going to end just because there's a SW show out there you personally dont like. It's a TV series, it may not be the greatest show, but its fiction and entertainment and what is considered "canon" vs "legends" has zero materialistic harm nor impact on any of you. Get a life lol.