They have 0 base pierce armor, even as Elite, so Arbs kill them really quickly. These fights don't show how it'd actually play out in a real game (i.e. ranged units would be micro'd to kite the Urumi's as long as possible, melee units could still be sent against the Urumi's to act as a meat shield). Dravidians also have an exploitable weakness to siege. Bottom-tier cavalry, no Redemption, no Bombard Cannons, and no Siege Engineers. Their lack of mobility also means Hussar raiding will be extremely annoying for a Dravidian player to deal with if they cannot wall their flanks.
I've seen the weapon they used tested in Deadliest Warrior, and it was very cool, but underperformed in the tests. It seems like it would be potentially terrifying against multiple unarmored opponents, but any decent armor will render the weapon impractical. Ironically enough, the Dravidians thrive when their enemies invest in armor.
That weapon was used in my region. It's kinda used as defensive weapon when a person is surrounded by multiple enemies and have to no ally around . It was not build to pierce armor but to attack enemies from multiple directions. Rather than cutting through bone the blade slices off flesh while swinging . It sometimes backfires wielder if not skilled . Other hand dravidian don't have native horses . I guess to balance they combine urumi with steel tech. I don't think they are overpowered . They lack Mobility and lose to archery , when actual update is released we might see reality by playing it out.
@@Neon-Lines I mean urumi lose archery . Since they don't have high health , armor or mobility. If I choose to play with skirm and urumi opponents can play with knight/ hussar and archery . It can be countered there are several options.
lol, good observation, let's see why Urumi beat Cataphracts... Cataphracts have: 1. high melee armour 2. low pierce armour 3. bonus damage against infantry 4. resistance against bonus damage Urumi swordsmen: 1. ignore melee armour 2. have a large charge attack 3. have a decent attack rate Just by looking at it, you can say that the Wootz steel is what changes everything, ignoring armour is what makes Urumi win against Cataphracts and Teutonic Knights, nothing is overpowered about them.
A lot of these units /are/ counters, if they're in control of a player who can react.. E.g. conquistadors will make short work here if they hit and run. Slingers or hand cannoneers will work great if you can use halberdiers or something as a meat-shield to slow the attack.
@@asterozoan Still, compare the Urumi to a generic infantry unit. The Urumi is still a net gain vs. archers despite being "weak" to them, because it's barely more expensive, moves faster and has an AOE attack. Archers are in "soft counter" territory here when they need to be a hard counter.
@@Longknife No, Archers do better against Urumi's than they would against other infantry because the Urumi's have 0 base pierce armor, even as Elite. That 1 extra damage they'll take compared to Champions or various infantry UU's hurts quite a bit. Besides, we're all looking at the Urumi's in a vacuum. Dravidians might have extremely strong infantry, as well as good Skirmishers and Elephant Archers, but their cavalry is bottom-tier, they don't have Redemption, and they don't get Siege Engineers. All this combines to make the Dravidians weak against siege. They can't go for Mangonel/Onager trades if the enemy siege outranges them. You might say "Light Cavalry with Wootz Steel", but most siege units already have 0 melee armor, so Wootz Steel is moot in those cases. Meanwhile, the Light Cav's lack Bloodlines, Husbandry, and Plate Barding Armor, so they really suck. Also, Wootz Steel doesn't work against siege units anyway. Their lack of a reliable high-mobility unit (Urumi's aren't as fast as cavalry) also means they are gonna be weak to Hussar raids if they cannot wall off their flanks sufficiently. I imagine Dravidians are gonna struggle a bit on Arabia due to the wide open areas for enemy cavalry to flank them, and the lack of water on Arabia negating their naval bonuses. EDIT: They now have Bombard Cannons, but without Siege Engineers. That +1 range is really impactful for Bombards, so the Dravidians still have a hard time with strong siege civilizations.
@@darkdill 1 extra pierce armor is nothing if you consider the Urumi's are both moving faster and therefore killing the archers faster, not to mention their AOE attack results in more damage when they reach the target. I welcome you to compare how this unit does in these vids vs. the various archers vs. how comparable units such Woad Raiders do. Woads have fantastic speed too, still kill the archers slower than these and with more losses.
Charged attack is really weird choice, fluff wise, for this unit. It's a floppy, whip like ribbon of steel you use to flail around like crazy and fend of multiple attackers. Definitely not something that makes one decisive strike, like charge of mounted coustilliers.
I think it would make sense in the way of being charp at the first attack(s). I assume those things get relativly blunt very soon but can cut into bones at first. However, how they ignore (heavy) armor, is the thing I do not get. If it actually gets through the steel, wouldn't it be likely stuck?
Have you seen the man in Milan swing around a giant whip to crack it? you could hear the sound from three blocks away. Swinging the whip wildly before nearing the opponent builds up momentum to add to the charge+area damage -> ua-cam.com/video/kpNwm7CdHwo/v-deo.html Later the attacks are rather standard except in the way this takes advantage of its flexible hard steel to cut through chinks in the armor -> ua-cam.com/video/kpNwm7CdHwo/v-deo.html
Something seems weird about these charge attacks in these tests. I wonder if they're charge attacking more often than they should be. 15 free bonus damage on the first hit is a lot, but after that they should be hitting for 14 damage (due to ignoring armor) Meanwhile samurai have +15 health (negating first hit) and do 24 damage post mitigation, with +33% attack speed. I'm wondering if there's a case of release coustillier where there's accidental doubling up of charge hits or something similar. It feels like only with absurdly tanky units like the war elephant does the dps seem to decline closer to as expected. Otherwise the math doesn't feel like it checks out, esp. in the case of samurai or jaguar warrior.
Having the charge attack in the first hit means that you already Decimate a number of your opponent's army. For an example: four coustilliers instantly kill one of four knights with their charge attack. Thus, there will be 4 coustilliers against 3 knights. They already outnumbered the knights to overcome their lower attack and HP. That's the advantage, even we don't consider their cheaper costs yet. Urumi Swordmen themselves are unable to kill both Samurai and Jaguar Warriors with their charge attack. They win because they have ignoring armor ability to easily decimate low HP enemy units standing after the "first wave". Samurai might be a worthy opponent for Urumi, not the Jaguar Warriors since they, despite having similar Rate of Fire, have the slowest frame delay among infantry. Also, both Samurai and Jaguar Warrior need 3 hits to kill Urumi Swordman, but Samurai attacks 33% faster and has more HP. Urumi should be better because of their cheaper cost.
@@Bzhydack This sounds right, and other people are mentioning the same. It seems pretty strong. Charge mechanics are strong in smaller scale hit-and-run/scraps and number advantaged scenarios where you can overwhelm, murder, run, and recharge between skirmishes. Splash is strong in pitched battles but is easily mitigated by armor. Meanwhile splash charge attacks that ignore armor does... well, this.
An infantry that defeats TKs, Berserks, Obuchs and even Leitis, Jaguars and Samurai! What kind of insanity is this? Also, judging by how many units spawn here, they are really cheap! I guess only mass scorpions as a counter, and hope this civ doesn't get onager upgrade.
To be fair, they need an expensive imperial age UT in order to ignore armor, and they are very weak to ranged attacks even by infantry standards (they beat archers in these tests because ranged units without micro suck against anything, even infantry). They beastly in melee combat, no doubts about that, but saying that there are no counters it's exaggerated imo.
They also take only 22 skirm javelins due to having 65 HP, 0 PA. Champs take 35, Jags/Zerks take 38, Samurais/Woads take 40, Obuch take 95, TKs take 100. That's hilariously weak against pierce damage compared to the infantry unique unit standard.
I don't get the charged attack on an infantry unit that doesn't even run. In AoE3 Urumis have an area attack, I think that would've fit much better. Edit: @ StepS pointed out that the charge attack actually has an area effect. It's really hard to tell even on .25 playback speed (because everything dies so fast, lol) but I think they're actually right. The charge mechanic still seems out of place, in my opinion, but I'm glad they gave them splash damage!
Splash is the key. When they're facing massed units, there's a lot of targets getting damage at the same time. Even with archers in scattered formation, they should be easy to deal with.
How is this legal? XD okay most archer encounters would turn out differently with kiting or some protection, but they can still beat most of the cavalry and even units like jaguar warriors or samurai, thats not okay.
well they are a castle unique unit that's probably dead to fodder in most cases before they reach archers, also they have a unique tech to ignore armor which is probably what makes them look so good. It'd be nice to finally have a usable infantry unit and honestly they probably aren't OP given dravidians may as well not have a stable
@@valonreijk7393 not exactly built to chase archer under castle or heavy protection, they melt super fast against range units and a lot of those range units can run away from them, they are prob kinda op in lower rank ladder, also you have to look at the entire civ as a whole
While cool these showcases aren't reflected in game Wootz Steel is an Imperial age tech and most likely is expensive. It will help close out a game if you're winning, but if you're loosing I doubt spamming Urumi will help
I think what people are missing is that they have the unique tech that ignores armor in imp. So it looks super broken when really this kind of power is only available in post imp. Also explains how they beat the TK
That what I was thinking. For matches that don't start in post-imp, there is a huge investment to consider (Building a castle + Going to imp + Blacksmith upgrades + Castle tech + research time+ Cost and time for massing the unit). There also many other factors outside of the unit to consider.
Ignoring armor is definitely not what's winning most of these matchups, as most units will only have 3-4 melee armor after full upgrades. It's the absurd 29 damage on their first attack. You'd see the same result in 80% of these tests without that tech, the ones that get hit hardest by the tech are Boyars and TKs. Same reason as to why one of the three units that kill them are coustilliers, they have the same gimmick, but higher hp.
Konnik really messed up the benefit of charge attack with their second life. I really thought Coustiller would also win, with a charge attack of their own. Wait, they did win, I confused them with the Leitis.
-5 HP, -1 PA, +20 food cost, no extra speed compared to champions, need big numbers to make effective use of the charge attack, requires castles to be trained, need an expensive imperial age UT to ignore armor. Against melee units or unmicroed ranged units they look amazing, but you need a lot of build up and to hope that the enemy cannot micro their archers to get to that point. Also keep in mind that the Dravidian tech tree is garbage, so a late game power unit for this civ doesn't sound bad.
They die in 22 skirm javelins compared to 35 for generic champs. The balancing factor is they die at the mention of pierce damage. You don't realize just how bad 0 base PA is.
@@devangnivatkar2649 They beat imp skirms here. And they beat almost every range matchup here. They should have negative pierce armor then and less hp.
ahh of course they are the natural counters to eagle warriors, as world history has shown us when the Indians fought against the mesoamerica Civilizations. - Abraham Lincoln circa 2022 colorized
Samurai- I am the Master of Unique units duels.. Urumi- Hold my Urumi (the whip blade) Jaguar Warrior- I am the master of Infantry duels Urumi- Hold my Urumi.. Teutonic Knight- No one beats me in Melee I have too much armour. Urumi- Hold my Wootz Steel.. (same goes for Boyars..lol) Aoe2DE Community- Is this unit the Scourge of G.o.d? Someone please beat them!! Ballista Elephant-- The world will finally now know my value!! Also- Persian Elephants Cataphracts Konniks Coustillier Paladins Onagers
And how about you not allowing the opponent to hit Imp with a huge eco & multiple castles so as to stop Urumi from getting OP in the first place. Urumi are kind of OP only in Post-Imp scenarios. Wootz Steel (750F, 600G) alone is an expensive tech on its own not to mention various other supporting techs. Weak Cavalry in castle age alone will give them a big weakness in mid-game. Early pressure specially in Castle Age is the key.
@@AotO_DJ U r forgetting that to train urumi u need castles which are much more difficult that arch range or even siege workshops (for onagers).. U r watching these videos which start with 200 US but to train these 200 from even 3 castles working simultaneously will take 10 minutes.. while u can easily hv many more ranges/sw..
I don't think it's entirely OP because none of those tests are realistic really, however it does feel strong all combined. On the other hand, Coustillier still won vs them and we don't see that unit so frequent or regard it as OP, so let's see. And range usually still beats melee if some micro is involved.
That's often the case with those tests. Coustilliers are super op on the paper, but in real games they are not extremely strong. I think that'll be the same with that unit
People in comments saying the unit it OP and needs to be nerfed. These battles are not representative of real life situations. So whether the unit is OP or not, can only be decided after the DLC has released and enough people play with/against the unit
Let’s see, a fast, cheap unit that has a charge attack AND high attack AND can ignore armor. Yeah, I think we can say this is ridiculous. Honestly, this is that first new thing I’ve been pissed about.
@@josepetersen7112 Urumi are not really fast... Coustilliers have charge attack and are faster Leitis can ignore armour AND have +4 attack due to Relics Urumi have low HP and low pierce armour...
@@josepetersen7112 Except it has low pierce armour so it is quite weak vs ranged units. It has 10 base attack for its elite version, which is not high at all. It has lower HP than champion and the 'irgnore armour' is a unique tech which is only available in Imperial age. It will take a really long time and a lot of resources to fully upgrade. Most games don't last that long. That is why I said, it is unfair to say that this unit is OP based on this video. Wait till the DLC comes out and see how strong it is in an in-game situation before calling it ridiculous and demanding a nerf before the DLC has even been released
High HP, low armor units do well against Urumi Warriors. But the best counter is kiting them with Arbs, Plumes, Mangudai,Kipchaks, Camel Archers, CA etc. If you wish to stand and deliver, the Urumi will get you.
Urumi Swordmen vs Cataphracts and Teutonic Knights just showed me, how ridicilously OP these units are. I wish the devs would do the same tests before relase like Mike does afterwards...
It's strong but it doesn't have the pierce armor of obuch or serjeants. In line with some of the other newer unique units. Obviously older unique units can't compete.
Urumi swords do look quite dangerous but having these units beat samurai and teutonic knights doesn't seem very realistic IMO. I could buy them beating Jaguar warriors as the urumi are longer range but the idea of shirtless infantry surviving longbowmen or samurai just doesn't make sense to me. The idea of chola warships being larger than European galleons on the other hand does make sense. Could have left it at that or otherwise made the Urumi a cheap spammable unit which would have been more realistic.
Something important to note is that archers usually use hit and run tactics to focus fire and gain an advantage that way. As the archers aren't retreating this isn't an accurate depiction of what will happen in a game.
My biggest takeaway from this is that jaguar warriors need to be given a slight boost. This is exactly the kind of unit they are supposed to counter, but there were still TWELVE Urumi still alive at the end. and this is after a somewhat spendy research in Garland Wars. And they're not a highly armored unit so Wootz Steel can't be entirely to blame.
@@baristika There's this thing called 'archer micro' that happens in real PvP scenarios. This video does not cover that. You really think something like an Arbalester/Longbow/Rattan, let alone a Kipchak/Mangudai/Camel Archer is going to stand still on the spot while infantry comes close?
What makes you think they should lose to Jaguar warriors and Samurais though? Urumi is perfect imo, did you even see their pierce armour? Not to mention they need Imperial age technology... It's just like Cataphracts with Logistica (trample damage)... Nothing's OP about them
@@varunmanjunath9123 You're 100% right. How could I think an "Anti-infantry" unit should win against a "Light infantry" unit. My skepticism is now gone and without having played with them myself since they're not yet released I'll go ahead and preemptively call them perfect as well!
@@JJBeauregard1 lol, you're just accustomed to Samurai and Jaguar beating all infantry... Now you just need to factor in this unique unit... You have to understand the concept of how hard a counter a unit is to other units... Elephant archers are "anti-archer" and Genoese crossbows are "weak to archers, strong vs mounted units"... but the Genoese crossbows win very cost-effectively. Same case here, Jaguar warriors and Samurais used to win against most infantry because of their insane bonus damage, but you have to understand they have low HP and armour themselves. So when attacked by a devastatingly high attack at first, of course their bonus damage doesn't matter... Urumi lose to Skirmishers... That's how much pierce armour they have lol... You have to factor in new units, can't keep expecting same old results. Same thing happened with Teutonic Knights against Leitis, Coustilliers and Obuch, right? :)
historically the indian steel is the best in the world, even european armour couldn't help.. jaguar warrior only had obisidian sword the macuahuitl. this civ is supposed to be a powerhouse!
So much salt in the commentaries. I even saw some people say "they beat every UU OMG!!!!"... Wich is wrong, watch the video again. Also, UU are not supposed to be the best unit of a civ(or at least not always), they're more of a wild card. Using arbalesters (wich doesn't cost any gold and can be mass produced more easily) is a good counter against those guys. Units with a lot of HP are a good counter too. Elephants do very well against them. And units like beefy paladins do fine as well, it would be more cost effective to train halberdiers than urumis against a Frank paladin. Also... siege. They don't have enough hp to survive long enough against onagers. So, even if they seem fantastic on paper, they are the definition of a glass canon.
They won against almost all unique unit, whether cavalry, archers, cav archers, gunpowder ,all infantry (including samurai and jaguar warrior), even slingers and janissaries, which no infantry unit should ever win against. This is ridiculous, they need to be nerfed.
Almost every melee units wrecks archers, the issue is getting to them. Archers won't just stand still in a regular game. Urumi only have 4 pierce when fully upgraded, that's -5hp and -1 pierce with an extra 20 food cost when compared to Supplies Champions. They melt to Arbalest. That said, they have way too much damage on that charge, exact same thing happened with Coustilliers. Just "forcing" people to buy the DLC.
@@ComeRestusFX yeah that's what I was trying to say, the moment they reach archers they decimate them. It is too OP. Either reduce the charge, the attack speed or unit speed or increase their cost. Poor teutonic knight already is situational and now getting wrecked by new units like leitis and urumi. Leitis itself is pretty OP.
They are barechested, I mean, they should be decimated or softened reasonably from afar with the first or second volleys of ranged infantry but they reach them almost intact
@@abyssreborn4213 cannot agree, looking at the video, i can imagine that most foot archers can barly win or even lose to the new UU even they kite As the HP of the UU is not low, and their attack is broken high
Maybe it's asking a lot to have some micro in these tests, but I think it would be more reasonable to at least give the unique units stagger formation.
I have seen these units both in live gameplay and in isolate tests like this video. While it might seem like they are OP and appear to take out archers with ease, in a real game they will lose to ranged units the vast majority of the time. Maybe they need some kind of nerf but it's not as bad as this video makes it seem.
Looking at the comments section here, I can kinda imagine how players reacted when Huskarls, Cataphracts or War elephants were introduced... " OMG AN INFANTRY THAT MELTS ALL ARCHERS!?! A CAVALRY UNIT THAT BEATS HALBERDIERS??? THIS IS SO BROKEN, OP UNIT, HUSKARL RUSH GG, CATAPHRACT RUSH GG, WAR ELEPHANT GG" Think about this, have you EVER seen an infantry unit melt to Skirmishers? Just watch 8:44... This proves to you that ranged units are THE hard counter to Urumi swordsmen. Just like heavy melee units are the counter to Huskarls... Not to mention the Wootz steel tech for Urumi swordsmen is just like Logistica tech for Cataphracts or Mahouts tech for War elephants... If you let these civilizations mass up their unique units AND research their imperial tech AND attack you... You completely deserve to be crushed! xD This comments section proves that most of us are Low Elo Legends... SoTL would have a fun day going through these comments! :D 11
Why did you put those "three civilizations" as your example to defend or compare a unit currently introduced? Those civilizations were introduced in Age of Empires: Age of Kings which was the original version 22 years ago. Huskarls, Cataphracts, and War Elephants weren't that OP at that time. Huskarls had slow speed, lower pierce armor, and much less attack bonus than the current Huskarls. Cataphracts weren't since they didn't have bonus armor against anti-cavalry units so that they died to Mamelukes, Camel Riders, and even Pikemen so easily. War Elephants themselves were terrible since they were very slow, and the regular version had no trample damage. Of course, no anarchy nor perfusion, no logistica, no mahouts introduced. Every single unit in the game will be balanced while the time is going.
@@theobald_indoaoe Ayyo, I knew someone was going to nitpick this! xD Anyway... My examples are still valid, I just wanted to make the point clear, doesn't matter if changes are introduced through DLCs or regular patches... Just look at Mamelukes now, they won't be taking bonus damage from skirmishers from the next balance patch... But in the future, we will refer to Mamelukes as they will be, not what it was when it was introduced... Hope the misunderstanding has been cleared. Bottomline is that Urumi swordsmen are weak to ranged units, if anyone fights against Urumi swordsmen in melee with weaker melee units, they deserve to lose! Why attack a mob of Huskarls with crossbows and then complain about them being OP... Urumi lose to skirmishers... SKIRMISHERS! Let that sink in! xD
@@varunmanjunath9123 So weird. I like the DLC, but not at some points. So easily overcoming own fallacy with "I kNEw sOm3onE wAs ...". If you knew, you simply didn't say. Shotelai, Karambit Warriors, Axemen and Condottieri are just forgotten. The skirmishers referred to are Imperial Skirmishers which even deal 3 damage to Cataphacts and Leiciai. The civ have fairly good ranged units, faster attack skirmishers with additional wood bonus, and easily to tech into halbs to deal with cavalry to compesate their cavalry-line. Just always being proud of every single stuff related with Indians DLC. So many things changed as Mamelukes you even mentioned but these. Because you love them. Being very good against many units is fine. Being too good or too bad against many units isn't fine. It's not always like the bad units will be buffed nor the good units will be nerfed, but they might be nerfed at some points and buffed at some points, not only the units but also the civilization. Urumi Warriors' charge attack or base attack should be reduced to avoid dealing too high DPS against melee units with that gold cost, to compensate this, they should move faster, giving them a chance at least to try to retreat or to chase archers. No matter what, unarmed even half-naked units should move pretty fast.
@@theobald_indoaoe There's no point judging me lol, talk about the topic only please. Giving Cataphracts as an example is also a bad comparison because they're also low pierce armour... Of course there will be balance changes later... I'm okay with faster speed and lower attack. I'm just saying that people are worrying for nothing, my examples against Huskarl (use melee units), Cataphract (use heavy cavalry) and War elephants (use monk) were just to let people know about Urumi (use archers). Don't simply say they're too OP lol. As simple as that. Lastly, regarding your accusation of me being biased because "I love them", not really. Did I mention how powerful Huskarls, Cataphracts were because "I loved them"? Come on, stop being so judgemental. I'm an elephant archer player, but I still like these Indian UUs since they represent my history and culture. I wanted Urumi to have area attack like in Age of Empires 3, but it's alright. Urumi would be OP then, not now.
@@theobald_indoaoeno point in debating, dravidians mostly won’t even surpass castle age.. why bother about imperial age techs and upgrades. They nerfed the entire civ to the core and made UU OP. It’s a balance act indeed
This unit is so broken. The ways to fix it: 1) remove final attack upgrade and armor upgrade 2) increase charge attack and remove ignoring armor 3) decrease attack rate
Dies in 22 Skirm hits compared to 35 for generic Champions. 65 HP, 0 pierce armour. It's already balanced by the virtue of melting against pierce damage.
@@devangnivatkar2649 Doubt it. We’ll see with more play time, but it is both fast and cheap. This sucker will run down and murder skirms for less loss than champs due to its speed and charge attack. Moreover, the same likely holds true for archers. It isn’t like champs have meaningful PA anyways.
@@josepetersen7112 What is its speed? I'm hearing it's 0.90 like Champs and Obuch. Pretty slow for an infantry UU. That example wasn't to say use Skirms against them, but to highlight just how weak they are against pierce damage. Even suboptimal or unupgraded archers would do a decent job if needed. It isn't cheap either by infantry UU standards. 65 Food 20 Gold, 5 Gold less than Berserks/Woads. Cheap is Obuch @ 55/20. 65, that's still +20 food compared to Champions against whom they're competing with in the Dravidian comp.
Summary: they only lose to cataphracts, konniks, coustilliers, and the two elephant unique units. Very surprised konniks and coustilliers did what Samurai and Jaguars could not! Also surprised that chakram throwers (anti-infantry), and ranged unique units that do piercing damage didn't win, given their 0 pierce armor
@@sayedmubashshirulhoquemubi7909 ha, realized this right after I sent! Yeah, I mentioned the chakram because it's supposed to be an anti-infantry unit, but you're absolutely right
Almost every unit: this infantry unit is too powerful! We cannot beat them!
Cataphract: it’s still an infantry
Lmao
Still how many cataphracts dead 😮
Aztec jaguar warriors thought the same and where are they now?......
Tbh it seems a bit op for them to have charges attack, splash damage, and 100% armor negation.
They have 0 base pierce armor, even as Elite, so Arbs kill them really quickly. These fights don't show how it'd actually play out in a real game (i.e. ranged units would be micro'd to kite the Urumi's as long as possible, melee units could still be sent against the Urumi's to act as a meat shield).
Dravidians also have an exploitable weakness to siege. Bottom-tier cavalry, no Redemption, no Bombard Cannons, and no Siege Engineers.
Their lack of mobility also means Hussar raiding will be extremely annoying for a Dravidian player to deal with if they cannot wall their flanks.
They are fast as hell and better archer chasers than persian knights
a bit op and dravidians lose all the time even in water 11
You're right. It is a bit OP.
It's not going to be nerfed either because it's one of the only things Dravidians have as a powerhouse unit.
Yeah 3 abilities and also speed, like wtf, should have only one.
It looks like their mustaches are helping them to win almost everything they meet.
I've seen the weapon they used tested in Deadliest Warrior, and it was very cool, but underperformed in the tests. It seems like it would be potentially terrifying against multiple unarmored opponents, but any decent armor will render the weapon impractical. Ironically enough, the Dravidians thrive when their enemies invest in armor.
thank the silly devs
That weapon was used in my region. It's kinda used as defensive weapon when a person is surrounded by multiple enemies and have to no ally around . It was not build to pierce armor but to attack enemies from multiple directions. Rather than cutting through bone the blade slices off flesh while swinging . It sometimes backfires wielder if not skilled . Other hand dravidian don't have native horses . I guess to balance they combine urumi with steel tech. I don't think they are overpowered . They lack Mobility and lose to archery , when actual update is released we might see reality by playing it out.
Question. Where they using the same type of steel? Unironically it should be very different from a normal steel alloy so maybe that is the reason.
@@parthibans4969 they don't really lose to Archers though because of fully upgraded and 25% faster shooting Skirms
@@Neon-Lines I mean urumi lose archery . Since they don't have high health , armor or mobility. If I choose to play with skirm and urumi opponents can play with knight/ hussar and archery . It can be countered there are several options.
lol They even countered jaguar warriors and samurais.
and teutonic knights 💀
They almost beat catas as infantry and that say a lot. It is the most broken thing now.
Cataphract beat Imperial camels and helbs
lol, good observation, let's see why Urumi beat Cataphracts...
Cataphracts have:
1. high melee armour
2. low pierce armour
3. bonus damage against infantry
4. resistance against bonus damage
Urumi swordsmen:
1. ignore melee armour
2. have a large charge attack
3. have a decent attack rate
Just by looking at it, you can say that the Wootz steel is what changes everything, ignoring armour is what makes Urumi win against Cataphracts and Teutonic Knights, nothing is overpowered about them.
@@Nishantkj Exactly lol
@@varunmanjunath9123 are you ... ok? expalining WHY they are Op doesn't mean they're not. WTF.
obviously Wootz Steel is what needs a major nerf, not Urumi...
Something's wrong when units that are suppose to be counters to them get whooped.
A lot of these units /are/ counters, if they're in control of a player who can react.. E.g. conquistadors will make short work here if they hit and run. Slingers or hand cannoneers will work great if you can use halberdiers or something as a meat-shield to slow the attack.
@@asterozoan Still, compare the Urumi to a generic infantry unit. The Urumi is still a net gain vs. archers despite being "weak" to them, because it's barely more expensive, moves faster and has an AOE attack.
Archers are in "soft counter" territory here when they need to be a hard counter.
@@Longknife No, Archers do better against Urumi's than they would against other infantry because the Urumi's have 0 base pierce armor, even as Elite. That 1 extra damage they'll take compared to Champions or various infantry UU's hurts quite a bit.
Besides, we're all looking at the Urumi's in a vacuum. Dravidians might have extremely strong infantry, as well as good Skirmishers and Elephant Archers, but their cavalry is bottom-tier, they don't have Redemption, and they don't get Siege Engineers. All this combines to make the Dravidians weak against siege. They can't go for Mangonel/Onager trades if the enemy siege outranges them. You might say "Light Cavalry with Wootz Steel", but most siege units already have 0 melee armor, so Wootz Steel is moot in those cases. Meanwhile, the Light Cav's lack Bloodlines, Husbandry, and Plate Barding Armor, so they really suck. Also, Wootz Steel doesn't work against siege units anyway.
Their lack of a reliable high-mobility unit (Urumi's aren't as fast as cavalry) also means they are gonna be weak to Hussar raids if they cannot wall off their flanks sufficiently. I imagine Dravidians are gonna struggle a bit on Arabia due to the wide open areas for enemy cavalry to flank them, and the lack of water on Arabia negating their naval bonuses.
EDIT: They now have Bombard Cannons, but without Siege Engineers. That +1 range is really impactful for Bombards, so the Dravidians still have a hard time with strong siege civilizations.
@@darkdill 1 extra pierce armor is nothing if you consider the Urumi's are both moving faster and therefore killing the archers faster, not to mention their AOE attack results in more damage when they reach the target. I welcome you to compare how this unit does in these vids vs. the various archers vs. how comparable units such Woad Raiders do. Woads have fantastic speed too, still kill the archers slower than these and with more losses.
Urumi should be nerfed
Charged attack is really weird choice, fluff wise, for this unit.
It's a floppy, whip like ribbon of steel you use to flail around like crazy and fend of multiple attackers. Definitely not something that makes one decisive strike, like charge of mounted coustilliers.
I think it would make sense in the way of being charp at the first attack(s).
I assume those things get relativly blunt very soon but can cut into bones at first.
However, how they ignore (heavy) armor, is the thing I do not get.
If it actually gets through the steel, wouldn't it be likely stuck?
Yeah, since it's pretty much a whip, I think, instead of a charged attack, they should be able to deal trample damage from default.
If you are interested , there are still kalaripayattu practioners who do demonstrations with this sword. You can find them on youtube.
Have you seen actual martial artists use this weapon? It can be a very precise hit, down to aiming for specific joints in the opponent's body.
Have you seen the man in Milan swing around a giant whip to crack it? you could hear the sound from three blocks away. Swinging the whip wildly before nearing the opponent builds up momentum to add to the charge+area damage -> ua-cam.com/video/kpNwm7CdHwo/v-deo.html
Later the attacks are rather standard except in the way this takes advantage of its flexible hard steel to cut through chinks in the armor -> ua-cam.com/video/kpNwm7CdHwo/v-deo.html
Something seems weird about these charge attacks in these tests. I wonder if they're charge attacking more often than they should be. 15 free bonus damage on the first hit is a lot, but after that they should be hitting for 14 damage (due to ignoring armor) Meanwhile samurai have +15 health (negating first hit) and do 24 damage post mitigation, with +33% attack speed. I'm wondering if there's a case of release coustillier where there's accidental doubling up of charge hits or something similar. It feels like only with absurdly tanky units like the war elephant does the dps seem to decline closer to as expected. Otherwise the math doesn't feel like it checks out, esp. in the case of samurai or jaguar warrior.
I think charged attack also deals trample. This is why is much stronger than it looks.
Having the charge attack in the first hit means that you already Decimate a number of your opponent's army. For an example: four coustilliers instantly kill one of four knights with their charge attack. Thus, there will be 4 coustilliers against 3 knights. They already outnumbered the knights to overcome their lower attack and HP. That's the advantage, even we don't consider their cheaper costs yet.
Urumi Swordmen themselves are unable to kill both Samurai and Jaguar Warriors with their charge attack. They win because they have ignoring armor ability to easily decimate low HP enemy units standing after the "first wave".
Samurai might be a worthy opponent for Urumi, not the Jaguar Warriors since they, despite having similar Rate of Fire, have the slowest frame delay among infantry. Also, both Samurai and Jaguar Warrior need 3 hits to kill Urumi Swordman, but Samurai attacks 33% faster and has more HP. Urumi should be better because of their cheaper cost.
Think in same Numbers sams should win. Here are same resources.
Pretty sure their charge attack deals splash damage
@@Bzhydack This sounds right, and other people are mentioning the same. It seems pretty strong. Charge mechanics are strong in smaller scale hit-and-run/scraps and number advantaged scenarios where you can overwhelm, murder, run, and recharge between skirmishes. Splash is strong in pitched battles but is easily mitigated by armor. Meanwhile splash charge attacks that ignore armor does... well, this.
It's not the unit itself or the charged attack that's op. It's the tech Wootz steel that's completely busted.
An infantry that defeats TKs, Berserks, Obuchs and even Leitis, Jaguars and Samurai! What kind of insanity is this?
Also, judging by how many units spawn here, they are really cheap!
I guess only mass scorpions as a counter, and hope this civ doesn't get onager upgrade.
I think they have S.O.
Still this civ isnt so good vs micro considering how depending they are on elephants
To be fair, they need an expensive imperial age UT in order to ignore armor, and they are very weak to ranged attacks even by infantry standards (they beat archers in these tests because ranged units without micro suck against anything, even infantry). They beastly in melee combat, no doubts about that, but saying that there are no counters it's exaggerated imo.
They also take only 22 skirm javelins due to having 65 HP, 0 PA. Champs take 35, Jags/Zerks take 38, Samurais/Woads take 40, Obuch take 95, TKs take 100. That's hilariously weak against pierce damage compared to the infantry unique unit standard.
Cataphracts barely defeated them as well. Too OP.
I don't get the charged attack on an infantry unit that doesn't even run. In AoE3 Urumis have an area attack, I think that would've fit much better.
Edit: @
StepS pointed out that the charge attack actually has an area effect. It's really hard to tell even on .25 playback speed (because everything dies so fast, lol) but I think they're actually right. The charge mechanic still seems out of place, in my opinion, but I'm glad they gave them splash damage!
I'd like to see trample damabe that also hurts allies. That would be fun
@@Ymgarl nah that might make more sense than what they have right now but it would make em weak
Look closer, they get both the charge _and_ area attack.
@@StepS_ Actually you might be right but i can't tell for sure. However, if there is splash damage it appears to be only on the charge attack.
Correct, splash damage is only for the initial charged attack.
Splash is the key. When they're facing massed units, there's a lot of targets getting damage at the same time. Even with archers in scattered formation, they should be easy to deal with.
How is this legal? XD okay most archer encounters would turn out differently with kiting or some protection, but they can still beat most of the cavalry and even units like jaguar warriors or samurai, thats not okay.
with their charge attack every range unit is 2 hit kill so even they cought for second they will wreck all archers etc.
@@valonreijk7393 yeah, atleast they dont have any pierce armor :)
well they are a castle unique unit that's probably dead to fodder in most cases before they reach archers, also they have a unique tech to ignore armor which is probably what makes them look so good. It'd be nice to finally have a usable infantry unit and honestly they probably aren't OP given dravidians may as well not have a stable
@@valonreijk7393 not exactly built to chase archer under castle or heavy protection, they melt super fast against range units and a lot of those range units can run away from them, they are prob kinda op in lower rank ladder, also you have to look at the entire civ as a whole
They trade equally vs Leitis with 0 relic so its fine. Dravs practically have no stable.
OP the only lost to cataphract, elephants and konninks
almost to slinger if only they ran, almost to kipchak if only they ran, almost to leitis, and they lost to coustillier
Berserker: Nothing
Urumi Swordsman: Hey, i am real berserker.
While cool these showcases aren't reflected in game Wootz Steel is an Imperial age tech and most likely is expensive. It will help close out a game if you're winning, but if you're loosing I doubt spamming Urumi will help
It is not expensive and it works in imp like garland wars or only better up to +13 damage
@@thekroks5068 Ah I haven't seen the cost yet and you're right on that
I think what people are missing is that they have the unique tech that ignores armor in imp. So it looks super broken when really this kind of power is only available in post imp. Also explains how they beat the TK
That what I was thinking. For matches that don't start in post-imp, there is a huge investment to consider (Building a castle + Going to imp + Blacksmith upgrades + Castle tech + research time+ Cost and time for massing the unit). There also many other factors outside of the unit to consider.
Ignoring armor is definitely not what's winning most of these matchups, as most units will only have 3-4 melee armor after full upgrades. It's the absurd 29 damage on their first attack. You'd see the same result in 80% of these tests without that tech, the ones that get hit hardest by the tech are Boyars and TKs.
Same reason as to why one of the three units that kill them are coustilliers, they have the same gimmick, but higher hp.
Konnik really messed up the benefit of charge attack with their second life. I really thought Coustiller would also win, with a charge attack of their own. Wait, they did win, I confused them with the Leitis.
Pretty good case study for the argument that AOE is pay to win. The whole civs that come close to winning convincingly are dlcs civs.
All units - Where the hell this naked beast come from ?
These fine moustached gentlemen hail from the Chola Empire.
Man what is the problem of being naked. Don't you know the half naked Fakir destroyed the empire on which the sun never set?
@@rajas9803 lol man i liked your ability of sarcasm..
Crazy unit
Next patch: "...charge attack value is reduced..."
YEAH
hell no, Dravidians are already bottom tier. Maybe reduce charged attack if you give bloodlines and hussars 11
What's the balancing factor here supposed to be? Do they take a tremendous amount of time to produce?
-5 HP, -1 PA, +20 food cost, no extra speed compared to champions, need big numbers to make effective use of the charge attack, requires castles to be trained, need an expensive imperial age UT to ignore armor. Against melee units or unmicroed ranged units they look amazing, but you need a lot of build up and to hope that the enemy cannot micro their archers to get to that point. Also keep in mind that the Dravidian tech tree is garbage, so a late game power unit for this civ doesn't sound bad.
They die in 22 skirm javelins compared to 35 for generic champs. The balancing factor is they die at the mention of pierce damage. You don't realize just how bad 0 base PA is.
@@ParamecioLord ... they beat all UU, and your argument is "they requires castle to build so they are perfectly balanced"
@@devangnivatkar2649 They beat imp skirms here. And they beat almost every range matchup here. They should have negative pierce armor then and less hp.
@@baristika Not all units are trained in castles as far as I know.
ahh of course they are the natural counters to eagle warriors, as world history has shown us when the Indians fought against the mesoamerica Civilizations. - Abraham Lincoln circa 2022 colorized
Somehow Half naked Warrior can survive Arrows Gunpowder based Weaponry and even win some of them lol
They have shields
Yup. It is analogous to the barbarian guy taking 70 arrows despite having no knowledge of metallurgy
i think we need Spiffing Brit to look into this “perfectly balanced with no exploits what so ever” situation.
Coustillier: Shifu taught you well, but he didn’t teach you everything
haha.. gold bro 👌🏾
As a civilization Dravidian looks weak without cavalry.this unit performed well in open ground.but in actual game the archers did well against them.
Naked guys most scariest army in the world.
Samurai- I am the Master of Unique units duels..
Urumi- Hold my Urumi (the whip blade)
Jaguar Warrior- I am the master of Infantry duels
Urumi- Hold my Urumi..
Teutonic Knight- No one beats me in Melee I have too much armour.
Urumi- Hold my Wootz Steel.. (same goes for Boyars..lol)
Aoe2DE Community- Is this unit the Scourge of G.o.d? Someone please beat them!!
Ballista Elephant-- The world will finally now know my value!!
Also-
Persian Elephants
Cataphracts
Konniks
Coustillier
Paladins
Onagers
And how about you not allowing the opponent to hit Imp with a huge eco & multiple castles so as to stop Urumi from getting OP in the first place.
Urumi are kind of OP only in Post-Imp scenarios. Wootz Steel (750F, 600G) alone is an expensive tech on its own not to mention various other supporting techs. Weak Cavalry in castle age alone will give them a big weakness in mid-game.
Early pressure specially in Castle Age is the key.
its also a broken unit in aoe3 now its has its debut in aoe2
I think same Numbers a lot of these units should kill urumi
They beat Paladins with total resources and I don’t think they would die with micromanagement against onagers.
@@AotO_DJ U r forgetting that to train urumi u need castles which are much more difficult that arch range or even siege workshops (for onagers)..
U r watching these videos which start with 200 US but to train these 200 from even 3 castles working simultaneously will take 10 minutes.. while u can easily hv many more ranges/sw..
I don't think it's entirely OP because none of those tests are realistic really, however it does feel strong all combined.
On the other hand, Coustillier still won vs them and we don't see that unit so frequent or regard it as OP, so let's see.
And range usually still beats melee if some micro is involved.
That's often the case with those tests. Coustilliers are super op on the paper, but in real games they are not extremely strong. I think that'll be the same with that unit
Exactly. Also these tests are with no micro, urumis lose hard to basically any ranged unit with micro involved.
@@victoirej.2611 yes, look at the Dravidian win rate
People in comments saying the unit it OP and needs to be nerfed. These battles are not representative of real life situations. So whether the unit is OP or not, can only be decided after the DLC has released and enough people play with/against the unit
Let’s see, a fast, cheap unit that has a charge attack AND high attack AND can ignore armor. Yeah, I think we can say this is ridiculous. Honestly, this is that first new thing I’ve been pissed about.
@@josepetersen7112 Urumi are not really fast...
Coustilliers have charge attack and are faster
Leitis can ignore armour AND have +4 attack due to Relics
Urumi have low HP and low pierce armour...
@@josepetersen7112 Except it has low pierce armour so it is quite weak vs ranged units. It has 10 base attack for its elite version, which is not high at all. It has lower HP than champion and the 'irgnore armour' is a unique tech which is only available in Imperial age. It will take a really long time and a lot of resources to fully upgrade. Most games don't last that long. That is why I said, it is unfair to say that this unit is OP based on this video. Wait till the DLC comes out and see how strong it is in an in-game situation before calling it ridiculous and demanding a nerf before the DLC has even been released
Who would win:
- An elite army of heavy armored warriors.
- One naked boy with a flaccid sword.
They won more than i thought they would. I guess this shows the importance of ranged units having a frontline shield. Or micro, of chokepoints.
High HP, low armor units do well against Urumi Warriors.
But the best counter is kiting them with Arbs, Plumes, Mangudai,Kipchaks, Camel Archers, CA etc. If you wish to stand and deliver, the Urumi will get you.
Karambit warriors didn't do that well, though.
@@michaelmccarty1327 Karambits have too low HP to be effective. I was referring to Paladins, Cataphracts and Elephants
@@ladkikadeewana7786 Low HP individually, but so many together means there's a lot to cut through.
@@ladkikadeewana7786 LOL Paladins still loose to them.
you forgot siege, just awesome counters to this shirtless low HP unit
Urumi Swordmen vs Cataphracts and Teutonic Knights just showed me, how ridicilously OP these units are. I wish the devs would do the same tests before relase like Mike does afterwards...
It's crazy how hard it is to counter them with equal resources
Even samurais lost. Unbelievable
the fact that they beated almost every single other unique unit, with a clear, clear reaming HP says a lot
i call it OP
I haven't seen them being played once
You just need some archers behind. That's all you need to counter it.
Can you maybe repeat that but without the wootz steel?
It's strong but it doesn't have the pierce armor of obuch or serjeants. In line with some of the other newer unique units. Obviously older unique units can't compete.
Urumi swords do look quite dangerous but having these units beat samurai and teutonic knights doesn't seem very realistic IMO. I could buy them beating Jaguar warriors as the urumi are longer range but the idea of shirtless infantry surviving longbowmen or samurai just doesn't make sense to me. The idea of chola warships being larger than European galleons on the other hand does make sense. Could have left it at that or otherwise made the Urumi a cheap spammable unit which would have been more realistic.
GJ devs.. you finally did it
Something important to note is that archers usually use hit and run tactics to focus fire and gain an advantage that way. As the archers aren't retreating this isn't an accurate depiction of what will happen in a game.
True with respect to archers. But they still beat cataphracts, samurais and Jaguar warriors. That’s insane
Karambits in alternate universe.. 😅
Smoked Lietis, Obuchs, Knights, Boyars.
And those Kamayuks ain’t safe anymore.. lol
theres no way jaguar warriors and samurai lost these bro... and the fact that cataphracts struggled really says a lot...
My biggest takeaway from this is that jaguar warriors need to be given a slight boost. This is exactly the kind of unit they are supposed to counter, but there were still TWELVE Urumi still alive at the end. and this is after a somewhat spendy research in Garland Wars. And they're not a highly armored unit so Wootz Steel can't be entirely to blame.
you lost the game already when you face
This many urumi with full imp upgrades as a meso
Who would win?
The Samurai who trained his entire life to combat unique units?
Or
Some guy with a whip.
@Butter Scotch I’m aware ^^
when someone says they (Wootz steel) aren't broken because they melt to archers: 0:02
😂😂😂
oh devs, what have you done?
They either need to need theur unquie tech or the stats. Way too OP.
Yeah eother reduce the attack speed or increase their cost. Ignoring armor+ charge attack is way too OP for a unit
Dies in 22 Skirm javelin due to 65 HP, 0 PA compared to 35 javelins for generic champs. Which means anything that does pierce damage, melts them.
@@devangnivatkar2649 did you watch this video?
@@baristika There's this thing called 'archer micro' that happens in real PvP scenarios. This video does not cover that. You really think something like an Arbalester/Longbow/Rattan, let alone a Kipchak/Mangudai/Camel Archer is going to stand still on the spot while infantry comes close?
changing the cost won't do jack because all of their infantry ignores armour
Definitely use spread formation to counter these guys i guess.
Totally OP . Good job game designers
even killled samurai, teutonic knight. just OP, absürd.
What you didnt say is wootz steel researched?
Wtf... They should definitely lose vs Jaguar Warriors and arguably Samurais too. Something's not right with this unit.
So broken
What makes you think they should lose to Jaguar warriors and Samurais though?
Urumi is perfect imo, did you even see their pierce armour? Not to mention they need Imperial age technology... It's just like Cataphracts with Logistica (trample damage)... Nothing's OP about them
@@varunmanjunath9123 You're 100% right. How could I think an "Anti-infantry" unit should win against a "Light infantry" unit.
My skepticism is now gone and without having played with them myself since they're not yet released I'll go ahead and preemptively call them perfect as well!
@@JJBeauregard1 lol, you're just accustomed to Samurai and Jaguar beating all infantry... Now you just need to factor in this unique unit...
You have to understand the concept of how hard a counter a unit is to other units...
Elephant archers are "anti-archer" and Genoese crossbows are "weak to archers, strong vs mounted units"... but the Genoese crossbows win very cost-effectively.
Same case here, Jaguar warriors and Samurais used to win against most infantry because of their insane bonus damage, but you have to understand they have low HP and armour themselves. So when attacked by a devastatingly high attack at first, of course their bonus damage doesn't matter...
Urumi lose to Skirmishers... That's how much pierce armour they have lol... You have to factor in new units, can't keep expecting same old results.
Same thing happened with Teutonic Knights against Leitis, Coustilliers and Obuch, right? :)
historically the indian steel is the best in the world, even european armour couldn't help.. jaguar warrior only had obisidian sword the macuahuitl. this civ is supposed to be a powerhouse!
a small group of poorly armored men vs a group of teutonic knights who got the best armor
So much salt in the commentaries.
I even saw some people say "they beat every UU OMG!!!!"... Wich is wrong, watch the video again.
Also, UU are not supposed to be the best unit of a civ(or at least not always), they're more of a wild card.
Using arbalesters (wich doesn't cost any gold and can be mass produced more easily) is a good counter against those guys.
Units with a lot of HP are a good counter too. Elephants do very well against them. And units like beefy paladins do fine as well, it would be more cost effective to train halberdiers than urumis against a Frank paladin.
Also... siege. They don't have enough hp to survive long enough against onagers.
So, even if they seem fantastic on paper, they are the definition of a glass canon.
how are those swordsmen when they have whips?
This unit is too OP it kills actually every unique unit. Can you do same video but against generic units
Insane damage Bro, i dont believe
All the horse archers getting boned cause they aren't using superior mobility at all.
They melt everything
Precisely
8:13 the battle of the shirtless bois.
Op but only because of it's price
The are very OP to soften and weaken strong units with their charge attack.
They won against almost all unique unit, whether cavalry, archers, cav archers, gunpowder ,all infantry (including samurai and jaguar warrior), even slingers and janissaries, which no infantry unit should ever win against. This is ridiculous, they need to be nerfed.
Don't forget that the ranged units are not hit-and-run, especially for cav archers.
the Wootz Steel tech needs to be removed or changed
@@Neon-Lines it's not just the tech, it's thier speed and charge attack too that makes them op
@@Neon-Lines 2
The attack speed of this unit must be reduced to make it a bit more balanced. It can even wreck archers so what's the counter then?
Thank God Urumis can wreck archers. The Archer Meta can finally go to hell
Microed archers
@@theobald_indoaoe too much of a hassle
Almost every melee units wrecks archers, the issue is getting to them. Archers won't just stand still in a regular game. Urumi only have 4 pierce when fully upgraded, that's -5hp and -1 pierce with an extra 20 food cost when compared to Supplies Champions. They melt to Arbalest.
That said, they have way too much damage on that charge, exact same thing happened with Coustilliers. Just "forcing" people to buy the DLC.
@@ComeRestusFX yeah that's what I was trying to say, the moment they reach archers they decimate them. It is too OP. Either reduce the charge, the attack speed or unit speed or increase their cost. Poor teutonic knight already is situational and now getting wrecked by new units like leitis and urumi. Leitis itself is pretty OP.
They are barechested, I mean, they should be decimated or softened reasonably from afar with the first or second volleys of ranged infantry but they reach them almost intact
That's because there's no micro in these tests.
@@abyssreborn4213 cannot agree, looking at the video, i can imagine that most foot archers can barly win or even lose to the new UU even they kite
As the HP of the UU is not low, and their attack is broken high
@@sixstrongguys you're terrible at the game then, so shut up.
the coustillier was a surprise win for me. I guess the og charged unit is still better at overhwelming the opponent.
IMO all archer units should have bonus dmg against Urumis. Considering they're literally bare chested and not shielded.
what about plumed archers then 11, they never seem to die
Maybe it's asking a lot to have some micro in these tests, but I think it would be more reasonable to at least give the unique units stagger formation.
Is it just me or does the charged attack have a blast radius (check the Chu Ko Nu and Plumed Archers)?
1
Well, that kind of test are strange. For example archers should try to kite them.
I have seen these units both in live gameplay and in isolate tests like this video. While it might seem like they are OP and appear to take out archers with ease, in a real game they will lose to ranged units the vast majority of the time. Maybe they need some kind of nerf but it's not as bad as this video makes it seem.
It's not as bad as the vid makes it seem- however they certainly shouldn't win quite so handily against units meant to counter them IMO.
@@caocao4731 then why do Goths win against archers, wth
Even took out the Mangudai and ChuKoNus... geez
Omg these guys are OP as a group.
Urumi swordsman is the best in battle "unical unit vs unical unit", but, how good is this unit in standard battle?
9:33 Finally, a worthy opponent
why not give them lasers too ?
I can understand the charge attack and splash damage
But armor negation? Look what they did to my Tetonic bois
Would they win against Marines with a handful of Medics?
Looking at the comments section here, I can kinda imagine how players reacted when Huskarls, Cataphracts or War elephants were introduced... " OMG AN INFANTRY THAT MELTS ALL ARCHERS!?! A CAVALRY UNIT THAT BEATS HALBERDIERS??? THIS IS SO BROKEN, OP UNIT, HUSKARL RUSH GG, CATAPHRACT RUSH GG, WAR ELEPHANT GG"
Think about this, have you EVER seen an infantry unit melt to Skirmishers? Just watch 8:44... This proves to you that ranged units are THE hard counter to Urumi swordsmen. Just like heavy melee units are the counter to Huskarls...
Not to mention the Wootz steel tech for Urumi swordsmen is just like Logistica tech for Cataphracts or Mahouts tech for War elephants... If you let these civilizations mass up their unique units AND research their imperial tech AND attack you... You completely deserve to be crushed! xD
This comments section proves that most of us are Low Elo Legends... SoTL would have a fun day going through these comments! :D
11
Why did you put those "three civilizations" as your example to defend or compare a unit currently introduced?
Those civilizations were introduced in Age of Empires: Age of Kings which was the original version 22 years ago.
Huskarls, Cataphracts, and War Elephants weren't that OP at that time. Huskarls had slow speed, lower pierce armor, and much less attack bonus than the current Huskarls. Cataphracts weren't since they didn't have bonus armor against anti-cavalry units so that they died to Mamelukes, Camel Riders, and even Pikemen so easily. War Elephants themselves were terrible since they were very slow, and the regular version had no trample damage. Of course, no anarchy nor perfusion, no logistica, no mahouts introduced.
Every single unit in the game will be balanced while the time is going.
@@theobald_indoaoe Ayyo, I knew someone was going to nitpick this! xD
Anyway... My examples are still valid, I just wanted to make the point clear, doesn't matter if changes are introduced through DLCs or regular patches... Just look at Mamelukes now, they won't be taking bonus damage from skirmishers from the next balance patch... But in the future, we will refer to Mamelukes as they will be, not what it was when it was introduced...
Hope the misunderstanding has been cleared. Bottomline is that Urumi swordsmen are weak to ranged units, if anyone fights against Urumi swordsmen in melee with weaker melee units, they deserve to lose! Why attack a mob of Huskarls with crossbows and then complain about them being OP...
Urumi lose to skirmishers... SKIRMISHERS! Let that sink in! xD
@@varunmanjunath9123 So weird. I like the DLC, but not at some points. So easily overcoming own fallacy with "I kNEw sOm3onE wAs ...". If you knew, you simply didn't say. Shotelai, Karambit Warriors, Axemen and Condottieri are just forgotten. The skirmishers referred to are Imperial Skirmishers which even deal 3 damage to Cataphacts and Leiciai. The civ have fairly good ranged units, faster attack skirmishers with additional wood bonus, and easily to tech into halbs to deal with cavalry to compesate their cavalry-line. Just always being proud of every single stuff related with Indians DLC. So many things changed as Mamelukes you even mentioned but these. Because you love them.
Being very good against many units is fine. Being too good or too bad against many units isn't fine. It's not always like the bad units will be buffed nor the good units will be nerfed, but they might be nerfed at some points and buffed at some points, not only the units but also the civilization.
Urumi Warriors' charge attack or base attack should be reduced to avoid dealing too high DPS against melee units with that gold cost, to compensate this, they should move faster, giving them a chance at least to try to retreat or to chase archers. No matter what, unarmed even half-naked units should move pretty fast.
@@theobald_indoaoe There's no point judging me lol, talk about the topic only please.
Giving Cataphracts as an example is also a bad comparison because they're also low pierce armour... Of course there will be balance changes later... I'm okay with faster speed and lower attack.
I'm just saying that people are worrying for nothing, my examples against Huskarl (use melee units), Cataphract (use heavy cavalry) and War elephants (use monk) were just to let people know about Urumi (use archers). Don't simply say they're too OP lol.
As simple as that.
Lastly, regarding your accusation of me being biased because "I love them", not really. Did I mention how powerful Huskarls, Cataphracts were because "I loved them"? Come on, stop being so judgemental.
I'm an elephant archer player, but I still like these Indian UUs since they represent my history and culture. I wanted Urumi to have area attack like in Age of Empires 3, but it's alright. Urumi would be OP then, not now.
@@theobald_indoaoeno point in debating, dravidians mostly won’t even surpass castle age.. why bother about imperial age techs and upgrades. They nerfed the entire civ to the core and made UU OP. It’s a balance act indeed
Absolutely OP
This unit is so broken. The ways to fix it: 1) remove final attack upgrade and armor upgrade 2) increase charge attack and remove ignoring armor 3) decrease attack rate
Dies in 22 Skirm hits compared to 35 for generic Champions. 65 HP, 0 pierce armour. It's already balanced by the virtue of melting against pierce damage.
@@devangnivatkar2649 Doubt it. We’ll see with more play time, but it is both fast and cheap. This sucker will run down and murder skirms for less loss than champs due to its speed and charge attack. Moreover, the same likely holds true for archers. It isn’t like champs have meaningful PA anyways.
@@josepetersen7112 What is its speed? I'm hearing it's 0.90 like Champs and Obuch. Pretty slow for an infantry UU.
That example wasn't to say use Skirms against them, but to highlight just how weak they are against pierce damage. Even suboptimal or unupgraded archers would do a decent job if needed.
It isn't cheap either by infantry UU standards. 65 Food 20 Gold, 5 Gold less than Berserks/Woads. Cheap is Obuch @ 55/20. 65, that's still +20 food compared to Champions against whom they're competing with in the Dravidian comp.
WHAT IS THAT DMG???
What we see here is impossible in Ranked 1vs1
only after wootnaz Steel, This becomes possible thus a mid post-imp scenario
They're ridiculously overpowered. Just let them loose on a large map and they attack and wipe out things without even commanding it.
The power of mustache...
Its quite OP - even Berserks and Teutonic knights died to this unit! Other than elephants and cataphracts this unit seems OP!
Berserkers are no surprise. They suck.
Even teutons and samurai?
Summary: they only lose to cataphracts, konniks, coustilliers, and the two elephant unique units.
Very surprised konniks and coustilliers did what Samurai and Jaguars could not! Also surprised that chakram throwers (anti-infantry), and ranged unique units that do piercing damage didn't win, given their 0 pierce armor
Chakram throwers and other ranged melee units do melee damage though.
@@sayedmubashshirulhoquemubi7909 ha, realized this right after I sent! Yeah, I mentioned the chakram because it's supposed to be an anti-infantry unit, but you're absolutely right
Maybe just me but engaging with trash then your main units did pretty well for me.
holly shit this is the most op unite i have ever seen :D
THEY BEAT SAMURAI???!!
SHOT AND PISSED ON.
THE DEVS NEED TO BE SHOT AND PISSED ON
Wth they beat the samurai
They didn't lose a single fight against opponents with two feet :)
The most OP unit in 22 years.
So they melt everything except koniks and war elephants? The might be a bit OP.
just a "bit" XD
The also lost to Cataphract, dont forget that
My urumi is your undoing!