Ahsoka & Baylan: Two Sides of the Same Coin
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- Опубліковано 25 лис 2024
- Baylan Skoll and Ahsoka Tano have fought several times already in the Ahsoka series, you could call them enemies. But if you take a closer look at their background and what motivates them, you'll find two individuals with a common past and similar motivations.
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Can we all appreciate how they haven’t said “you and I are not so different” and instead allow you to interpret dialogue and context clues
Well said
@@GenerationTechI sure hope you didn’t say that in the video cause I haven’t had the chance to watch it all yet lol
I came to the comments to say this, but knew in my heart it had already been said.
There’s still time.
It’s basic story telling, good movies do the same.
I only just realised the symmetry between a Mandalorian (Din Djarin) having a Jedi apprentice (Grogu) and a Jedi (Ahsoka) having a Mandalorian (Sabine) apprentice.
That's a great observation
"it's like poetry, it rhymes."
Baylan is wrong about Ezra, he wasn't trained to be a Jedi. Ezra was trained to use the Force however it feels natural just try to avoid the dark side. Ezra was trained by an ex-Jedi turned pirate who was casually sleeping with his best friend.
A truly modern character lmao
don't forget he also learn from Maul and the Sith Holocron
I love how Baylan and Shin are new types of “villains” (if we can call them that). They are not simply another Sith who hates Jedi, but hold complicated views mixed with nostalgia towards the Jedi, and have a sense of longing for community. This makes them so much more interesting and likable.
Innocent people who got killed by them, "Yeah, motherfu*ker, you can call them that!"
@@bz5791Ok maybe slicing New Republic personnel was pretty villain like, but Baylan’s motivations are greater than Thrawn. That’s why I love the symbolism of the Orange Saber’s. They aren’t Sith, but they aren’t Jedi. They are somewhere in between. Baylan seeks something more out of life, perhaps a new order, we don’t know yet. But he also doesn’t force Shin to follow or even understand his motivations. He knows her path is probably different from his and he’s willing to let her go if she wishes to leave. To find herself and her own destiny apart from his.
opinion shared
have you noticed tha baylans saber is orange not red..... i dont think hes really sith at all but maybe a grey jedi
Baylan reminds me of a quote from Kreia: "To believe in an ideal, is to be willing to betray it."
Wished that we see a Clone Wars live action flashback of Baylan Skoll being a Jedi before he went renegade.
yea for sure it would be interesting to see him as a younger man
@TopG371well he's dead irl
Yeahhhhh boiiii
@@GenerationTech For sure. I'd love a backstory through some kind of "Tales of the Jedi" 3 parter like we got from Ahsoka and Dooku. How he was found. Who he was as a Jedi and what he experienced when the Jedi fell. It would be so enriching to go back and watch this series again afterward. Gives me chills to think about. :)
Could always be adapted for a "Tales of the Jedi" like how we got Dooku and a bit of Qui-Gon. Truly wish so, maybe with the right casting dropping a gem like that isn't out of the works, only wish Ray was still here to continue this banger of a character he and Filoni managed to cook up. May he rest in peace and power 🕊
Baylan truly is like Anakin. They were from that same generation that knew war and were not afraid to use their power to "fix" the Galaxy. I really think that if Order 66 didn't happen and the Siths lost there would have been a Jedi Order civil war between a young faction led by Anakin that want to lead the Republic and set the Galaxy right ( kill slavers in Hutt space for example) and the traditionnalists from the Council.
Never thought about that before, but I really could see that happening. At the very least I think a major schism would have happened.
I was thinking exactly the same thing some weeks ago. Imagine Dooku, Anakin and Qui Gon clashing between themselves - 'cause they sure were dissatisfied, and in the begining they might have been aligned,.but Ani sure is gonna force everyone to stand stronger for their beliefs - and against Mace, Yoda and Obi.
Yeah I also wish Ahsoka & Baylan could chat as friends about Jedi philosophy. They probably have a lot in common.
I really hope we get to see more of Baylan's backstory in season 2 of tales of the Jedi. He's such an intriguing and popular character thanks to the phenomenal performance of the late Ray Stevenson. R.I.P Legend, you will be missed. I hope they find a way to continue Baylan's story without Ray Stevenson, but I know it will be difficult to do without him.
It would be nice to see him in Tales of the Jedi with just an appearance similar to sneaking in Caleb/Kanan
Although they fought, The Son really loved the Daughter and mourned her death. Maybe Ahsoka is the avatar for the Daughter and Baylan will become the avatar for the Son.
Definitely agree with your points. The Jedi order was completely flawed with the no attachment and ignore emotions ideology. It nice to see Ahsoka accept emotions others are feeling and understand the importance of it
Everyone…and I mean everyone…is a survivor. They all deal with their survivor’s guilt in different ways. It’s great!
Baylan and Ahsoka are specifically paralleled as mentors abandoning/encouraging their padawans at different points and seeking the greater good.
The padawans obviously want to impress their masters.
The best hero isn’t a paragon, the best villain isn’t cartoonishly evil… And the best adversaries are distorted mirror versions of one another. This series so far has been nailing how to tell a good story.
I would love a Timothy Zahn or similar author to do book on the life on Baylon & his history/time as a Jedi. The potential is huge & could still leave many things unknown for intrigue & speculation. I’m just incredibly heartbroken still over the loss of Ray & hate he hasn’t been around to see the love & response to his portrayal in Ahsoka. I met him while being an extra for Kill The Irishman & never take that month for granted. I still have a picture with him on our last day of filming, with Christopher Walken in the background just lurking around 😂
This is true Star Wars theory...... It's insightful and void of egotistical whiny nonsense, we need more channels like this. Great job tech.
Most introspective and thoughtful star wars channel. Keep it up Alan.
Yup, by far. Some are nerdier, and some are too "out there" but this dude hits the middle and then some like a fine wine 🫡
He spells it “Allen” im pretty sure btw, but yea he’s been making such great videos for a while he’s easily my favorite Star Wars UA-camr no contest
I kinda respect Baylan. And I hope he can be brought back to the light.
Shin def.
Im not sure about baylan tho
I truly don’t think he’s fell to the dark side. He lacks many tenants common in dark side Force users. I think he’s merely disillusioned and tired of the constant light side vs dark side struggle. Idk if you’ve played the KOTOR games, but he honestly reminds me of a nontoxic version of Kreia
Baylan gives me serious Zaheer vibes and I see a lot of similarities between the two. As well as between his ideals and Ahsokas. The White Lotus and Red Lotus battle of ideals. And given the history and overlap with some of the shows creators I would bet that is what they're going for.
Never thought about that, thats crazzy
Alan you seem to always bring the human element of the characters in SW and relate it to real world we live in, thank you.
That's because Alan is a human supremacist. ;)
@@haljordan777 A Humanity first policy is the best policy.
_"To believe in an ideal, is to be willing to betray it. It it something no Sith or Jedi has ever truly learned."_
To be completely honest some years ago I never really liked your videos, but recently you have become much more insightful and I find you are now one of the best SW creators on YT. Those SW hate channels are dumb. I found this video the PERFECT video to watch right before the season finale because it sums up the entire season up to this point and refreshes everything for us going into the finale. I just subbed!
If Baylan survives tonight's episode, I hope whoever they recast him with can live up to this performance so far.
May have him disfigured during his search or fight to where he has to wear some heavy makeup or similar facial prosthetics, even though no one can truly replace him as Ray Stevenson has truly made the best new live action Star Wars actor since Disney’s acquisition
It has already been announced that both Baylan and Shin are not killed in episode/chapter 8.
I love adult live action Ashoka as she definitely was those "f*ck around and find out" kind of Jedi's especially when she shows up taking out a bunch of night troopers. But Baylan you just got love him as he's not quite a villain but more of a greyman kind of figure and he such a deep multilayered character and has a lot of complexities.
I have more interest for baylan skoll than anything else right now... I kind of want to see where his arc goes and where he comes from... but I guess disney won't elaborate more on this character since Ray Stevenson passed away and since disney hate to recast...
Like I said when she first did it, that was a massive Jedi move on Sabine's part, the curiousity, the pull toward solving the mystery, handing over the map and not attempting to destroy it. In that moment her master was dead and it would have been either left with nothing or this 'thread' that presented itself.
Alan as Jakecook stated, you always bring out the human elements in Star Wars. As a father of two daughters one with daughters of her own and the other in college, l tend to relate to Ashoka and Baylan in parental rolls. We make mistakes along the way but if we assure our love through word and affection our padawans become strong in the Force of life.
If I get to see Ahsoka and Baylan Skoll get to sit down, have some drinks and snacks while also having conversation, it will be such an amazing sight to behold!
Ahsoka is the cool auntie of Star Wars now ❤
So Ahsoka has Huyang with all the Jedi history and techniques in his memory, as well as training holos from Anakin, but leaves Luke with only some old books for training new Jedi?
Yea that felt kinda weird too
Luke found those himself. Huyang isn't your average droid either he's live for so long he's developed his own personality. He belongs to no one and makes his own decisions. Perhaps he felt better with Ahsoka than he would Luke who he has zero relations with. I'm sure he'd rather be with Baylon Skoll than Luke because he KNEW Baylon.
That’s a really good point. I suspect he has his own Order 66 trauma. Maybe training younglings would be too painful for him.
Auntie 'Soka is a nickname I'll always refer to her as now. Thank you for doin'g God's work, Allen.
Yeah dude u make the wars feels real. A very important component for star wars is ur show.
Sometimes ill watch old technical histories of vehicles
Skoll and Hati are the envoy of ragnarok, ragnarok is not only destruction but also renewal. Baylan Skoll walked the light and the dark which gives him insights on the motivation of both. He seem to see the vicious cycle that plagued the galaxy and strive to change it. Bailan is 'they dance' in the Spanish, which could mean he's playing the melody in which everybody dance to.
Allen, as a retired Marine and former senior instructor at Quantico Officer training I find you extremely well read. You have a Command and Staff or War College level education. I wanted to ask what is you military background or what was your inspiration and guide to your studies.
When Ahsoka and Baylin meet again neither seemed upset and neither really seemed to want to hurt the other. It was an interesting moment.
I agree that they're very much similar. ... Over the past couple days have even been thinking that Baylan's storyline will end differently than most are thinking it will. ... Thinking that the voices & feelings he has had is just a simple dark side presence. Same as on Dagobah or whatever. ... Thinking he just wants to die. It's all based on shellshock. ... Think Ahsoka will reveal that to him & ultimately convince him to try to get off world with them. That or he'll seem convinced & bail on em at the end & stay there alone.
Like Shin said back to him after talking about those old Jedi stories - Maybe they're just stories?
Also, accepting people's faults & realizing why they have em is the lesson Anakin was teaching her.
....
Shall find on out soon enough either way 🎉
🤠
I’m glad you finally I wish the two of them just sat down and talk. I thought they might their last encounter, but there was so much riding on it., But if they just talked to each other, they may have found their endgame was the same!
I like how filoni seemes to be highlighting some of the things you are talking about in a lot of the new jedi. Kanaan was much the same way, except maybe more flexible. He never trained ezra to bot hold attachments, and activly encouraged and helped build the family relationship of the ghost crew. Hopefully this means filoni is planning on forming a new order with looser restrictions and less regulations than the jedi had.
After watching the finale, the tittle of this video hits differently
The Chosen One's Prophecy really did manifest (relatively) well. Wipe out the Sith, and brought balance by reforming, or technically just ending, the wayward Jedi Order. In the end, you'd hope to get a new set of "Jedi" who follow balance in a more effective, true manner. Then, for the Sith, all their knowledge is wiped out to a degree where, on the rare chance new sith do arrive, they're not much more than Dark Acolytes, easily stopped.
Still, that's one thing both Legends and Canon failed on. Made the Chosen One's situation mean less when the Sith still so blatantly endure in a similar way they did for generations before.
Technically the Sith die in canon. Though other darkside users pop up and are very Sith-like.
@@Ennylack Anakin pushed the reset button on both force organizations. Baylan wants to take it back to the beginning but Anakin already did that.
@Ennylack
Well, in Legends they have the likes of Darth Krayt and whatnot. Plus, they've got Sidious, in both Legends and Canon.
Though, I heard the Sith end after about 150~ years after either RotJ or after Krayt's Sith Order so, I guess it does happen. But, thats assuming cause Legends doesn't go further.
THE NEW EPISODE WAS SICK AND I CRIED
A 3 hour arthouse conversation movie of Jedi philosophy in a cantina called My Dinner with Ahsoka.
ki adi mundi: your thoughts dwell on your mother?
anakin: my thoughts dwell on your mother!
6:52 Anakin didn't save Ashoka she just woke up in WbW when she became unconscious under water because she has a connection to it probably via "Daughter" and because she has been there before.But yeah his advice definitely in a way helped her to motivate her to live
Balen's the classic murderer with a heart of gold, who just wants to complete his quest for unlimited power.
I just noticed that the standing stones with their concave tops look like silhouetted sitting Loth wolves. 🤩
I thought they were Ahsoka shaped 😂
The cauldron of powers beckons to return his master. Ahsoka, she chose to live. Baylan chose to die. A tale of two masters.
Imagine an episode of Baylan in CW era moving towards Order 66.
Part of why I love when SW is good, is you have fuel to make thoughtful videos brudda. Good work.
Now I want a Baylan Skoll Order 66 flashback..
Shin and Baylan aren't so much villains as they are antagonists. An antagonist is someone or something that impedes the protagonist from achieving their goal. I honestly would like for him and Ahsoka to so sit with a cup of coffee and chat about the old days.
Their costuming also says a lot about each character: Baylan in black; already knows who he is and what he's after, and what he has to do to get there. Shin is in gray: she's unsure of where she stands and conflicted within herself. This is prevalent when Ahsoka reaches out to her. And Ahsoka goes from gray - the same conflict within her - to white; the same as Baylan, only the opposite.
Ahsoka is more on the Ashla side while Baylan isn't so much Bogen as he is Bendu with Bogen leaning tendencies.
15:00 I WAS THINKING THE SAME, tysm for vocalizing it
You make very thoughtful videos. Thanks for the effort.
Cal kestis is still out there too. I think he was younger too.
What if baylan is what obiwan would have become if he went to the dark side?
Ahsoka is not a Jedi master. She is at most a Jedi Sage. Something beyond a Jedi in a lot of ways, someone that has learned from the mistakes of a Jedi and Like Luke takes the best and ignores the faults of the Jedi but making them something more.
Im curious about something... if he is about Anikan's age, or close enough, wouldn't he have known who she was? The bombing and trail would've been pretty public throughout both the Republic and the Order.
It is still possible that tey will sit down and talk, when Thrawn abandon them, they will not just fight to the last with our heroic trio, they will probably make some sort of truce in order to survive on this strange planet, in this new galaxy for long enough.
I still think it's kind of amusing with Baylan on the NR ship with what seems to be a "Really, we're doing this?" kind of feel as things start there
Hey could you make a clone wars or galactic civil war time line
I wonder what Baylon would've done without Sabine? Seems like he brought her just so he could have the pretense to go out in the wild to find whatever it is he's looking for. He's a clever guy.
Watching this right before 9pm and the finale
Your videos are so interesting just have to say that.
STANDING HERE, I REALISE
YOU ARE JUST LIKE ME
TRYING TO MAKE HISTORY
I was thinking on this last night since the new episode is dropping today, if they do want to keep Baylan alive maybe he could come back with a Darth Malgus-type face mask. Would be easier to find a new actor that looks similar and you could digital vocode the voice a bit so it's not too jarring. RIP Ray Stevenson
Great video, Xiono. Thank you!
Sabine had no option, Baylan won, Ahsoka was dead, Baylan could easily pull the map before she could shoot it, then she's dead and Thrawn comes back anyway and Ezra stays Exiled. Sabine was in a no win situation, surrender was her only option.
Allen nice video also you are about to get to 800k subs i have been watched since 2019 good 😊 job love ❤ all you’re videos can’t wait to see more also like that you started to daily uploads!!!!!!!!!
Definitely a little Aang\Zuko going on with them.
From Rock to Opera? Why choose when you can have Opera Rock?
I think shin was planned to die initially but upon Ray's death they re-write and re-shot the last 2 eps.
What a great channel man
I'm nervous for the future of this show. With Ray passing away, the possibility of Abeloth the most powerful being in SW, so much can go wrong.
I feel like unless baylan gets eaten by abeloth or something crazy, they're going to have to recast him. I know Ray Stevenson has been amazing but the character might need to live on given his importance in the plot.
@@GenerationTech Well, we need more Baylan, that's for sure.
Maybe what we will have is more Shin.
They don't need to recast. If Baylan survives episode 8 Filoni only need to kill him properly. He can put a doble, kill him without showing his face and make Shin the new true beliver in the new beginning. And is possible.
Now Shin is alone. I don't think Thrawn will trust her and possibly he will abandon her on the planet. Filoni only needs to show her the force ghost of baylan or abeloth and make a scene when she remembers the teachings of Baylan and the treason of Thrawn. And is treason because she supported Thrawn.
I dint find ashoka training sabine to be out of character for ashoka she has a very strong relationship with mandalore and its culture. I believe she is more qualified than anyone to teach a mandalorian in the ways of the force.
I need to watch to draw my own conclusions, but the commentary I'm seeing is suggesting that this is a story with no villains, only misunderstanding.
Baylan and Ahsoka are two sides of the same coin. One BLAMES the Order for not being open to modification and change, one ACCEPTS their decision to abandon the Order to it's fate as the Order accepts the fates of its members to fall in combat.
I very much enjoy Baylan Skoll as an adversary because he's not just evil for evil's sake... he hates the Order for letting him down, but if Yoda had contacted him from Degobah, he'd have goke there straight away and been calmed by Yoda's teaching. I always feel that, like Thrawn, Baylan is one step ahead, using Morgan Elsbeth to get to Peridia in order to do what ever HE'S got going on. Everybody on the Dark Side is about using people.
Ahsoka has probably embraced the parts of the Jedi philosophy which are vibrant and alive, having cut the dead and stale parts from it.
I'm expecting an Ahsoka/Baylan tagteam v. Elsbeth and Thrawn. It's a tragedy that Stevenson passed away... I LOVE Baylan Skoll.
I also love watching Alan because he is very knowledgeable in the whole of the Star Wars universe canon and non; he's very observant and able to take apart an actor's subtle portrayal of a character and see what the writer is intending. A good skill set to have.
What if Sabine ren was the OG leader of the knights of ren
Baylan's order 66 trauma is likely worse because he wasn't privy to the truth of why the clones turned... it was just a cold betrayal as far as he's concerned.
The plan to stop the journey to save Thrawn was Ahsoka was leaning into the dark side, trying to bend the force to her will to stop their journey with violence. If she had leaned into the light side she would have snuck onto their ship, saved Ezra, and trapped the enemies in the other galaxy via sabotage. She will come to see this choice was Sabine's greatest accomplishment in her Force journey.
They are all going to end up trapped in that Galaxy or dead
ahsoka and baylon would have been like erik lansher and charles xavier. 2 sides of the same coin with mutual respect for eachother
when compare these two together they are not Sith nor Jedi , they are just neutral (Gray) force users.
I hope they are together at the end as well
I keep about thinking how Baylon rides a darkish wolf and Hati rides a whitish wolf. Maybe a hint of things to come. Maybe she will change masters as many have said.
People without purpose will ultimately create a purpose for themselves, else will be perpetually lost.
The Jedi Order cherry picked and directed persons of great potential. Once The Order fell, the survivors each suffered in their own way until they found a new direction for their lives. These people lost everything they knew, and had to adapt to this new life..or die.
I would have gone with "Tegrutanity". 🙂
The pondering and conflicted force user needs to be explored me
5:36 This clip is big meme potential
As much as it is odd that Ahsoka would keep Huyang since he is programmed with the Jedi order which Ahsoka walked away from. Maybe she keeps him as a pilot, and repair expert.
Bet we see the daughter owl tonight. Yes? No?
so few Jedi left indeed
PLEASE don’t mess up this last episode FiloniFilm
I know this casting would be problematic, but upon considering a recast of Baylon it hit me that Mel Gibson would be an awesome choice. He is actually an excellent actor, I think his vibe would fit well.
The more I think of Baylan, the more I think that he maybe the Starkiller from legends being canonized. So another point of commonality between Ahsoka and Baylan is that Anakin was their mentor. I could be wrong but its a possibility.
Day 203 PLEASE DO MORE TACTICS VIDEOS AND STRUCTURES LIKE THE CIS NAVY STRUCTURE AND RANKS
@@an-animal-lover lots...
Ashoka is no jedi
Great video
5:13 Correction "return from the dead" to "return from the brink of death"
IT'S A TOTAL GUT PUNCH WHEN THE WORLD AND STAR WARS AHSOKA LOST THE ACTOR THAT PLAYED BAYLAN SKOLL, DIED IN SEPTEMBER 2023 - LOST SO MUCH HE CAN DO IN THAT CHARACTOR
sean bean as baylan skol in season 2
Is it just me or does it seem that parts of mara jades story line was given to shin hati could she potentially be disneys version of her ?
We need an Actors on Actors for fictional characters