7 Games Avoidant People Play
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- Опубліковано 23 лип 2021
- With manipulative people, avoidance is not just an attempt to pull away from people who are difficult. Dr. Les Carter describes how many avoiders are game players looking for ways to control and to maintain a self-serving narrative. He describes seven of their most common games. As you become aware of their manipulative ploys, you are positioned to stay out of their snares.
Dr. Les Carter is a semi-retired psychotherapist who spent 41 years in private practice in the Dallas, Tx. metroplex. He now resides in Waco, Tx. He has conducted over 65,000 counseling sessions, written extensively, and has presented many workshops and seminars.
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Whether the avoidant partner is doing these things out of their own fears and insecurity or whether they are deliberately playing you is immaterial. The out come for the person living with them is much the same and just as damaging regardless of whether it's done intentionally or unintentionally.
Very true. ✅
I've decided to break up with my avoidant partner. I'm tired of walking on eggshells and dealing with the hot and cold mood swings...the broken promises and excessive flirting with others, including ex romantic partners. It's simply not worth it.
Absolutely.The effect is same on
people whether it's deliberate or not.🙏🏼
One way that makes a difference imo is that someone doing it subconsciously, that is that don't have the intention of hurting you, means that they are more likely to work on those issues if they are pointed out. Of course the main requirement is healthy communication. While someone consciously hurting you is basically clearly stating that 'hey I don't care how you feel'.
That’s the other thing…. Avoidants always think about their exs since they only start missing someone when they are truly gone
Avoidant people can be very hurtful, especially to empaths. They want to be chased so that they can feel superior.
Pepper Bird Good point about avoidant narcissists. People with avoidant personality, on the other hand, feel inadequate and inferior.
They want to be in control, that is their goal.
Yes definitely don’t chase their b asses…
Or they want to be left alone and the empath doesn’t want to accept the many hints to just leave the relationship
@@Kwamedogg50 hints?? That is an avoidant style. Very covert and cant address any type of conflict or awkward situation
The game is the behavior pattern: Avoidant ignores my contacts and only contacts me when she wants something from me.
Yes! Yes! Yes!
That sounds like a User.
sounds like Pampered Cooking Pot cousin...
Stop. Just stop with her. You are worth so much more!!
Exactly move on
Love this mans accent. Sounds so gentlemanly.
Southern accents usually do. ☺️
He’s so stinkin cute!! He and Gussie Gus! Love them! 💗
I swear I do.. I could listen all day 💖
It sounds like doctor Phil 😂😂
It's so soothing
Surface level only - always. I was in a relationship with someone like that. Always thought I could "change" them, with enough love and trust... I know better now.
This is how my immediate narcissistic family works. There is no real relationship. It's just all transactions.
Is your family all in business together 🤔
Why so condescending, chief?
Some avoid ants are really good at; using humor to steer the way away from connection. I always see that one a mile away.
I know the type! Dr. C
Avoid ants 🤣 THANK YOU for that.
9 months into this and I'm happy I walked out ! 😁
My DA treats casual friends and strangers better than me...there is a tree missing out of his forest. He knows what he does but he has no clue why...
This describes my relationship with an avoidant so beautifully. He put so much work into dodging commitment with me, he'd even hide (emotionally) behind his elderly mother and nephew rather than deepen our connection, when we did deepen our connection I'd be so happy then he'd run and hide and it was devastating. I began to feel seriously third rate and unwanted and eventually our relationship turned toxic. Ironically after spiltting up he's become more willing to discuss what happened between us as he's not worried about connection or commitment because we aren't going out any more! It was a very hard experience to go through and I'd run a mile from an avoidant now! 😂
I feel relieved reading your message. I'm sorry you had to go through that. I had to go through that, to a point when I ended the relationship I felt a weird relief for not having to feel neglected or unimportant by someone so much like I did. (I eventually started to miss him, and I still do. Wishing he would text me, but I know he won't. But I'm moving on!)
@@lvr-tg9ek
I know the feeling.
They are out there.
Most don't even know they need help ( therapy).
Sorry for ur pain.
@lvr-tg9ek how you expect him to text back when you unilateral ended the relationship? Make that make sense ? You should be reaching out to him since it was youre idea to end it . I get it he's an avoidance, but you still gotta make things work if you really wanted that bad just as they should too.
My BFF of over 60 years won't stop by and still calls his mom ! She is 94 .
@bigcatproductions2789 that's wild !! Crazy that people tend to be like that even as an adult
Some people wear a mask. Once I see it, I just accept it and decide what I want to do next.
Smart idea
I've started doing the same now I finally recognise it..
They wear a mask and it's not even Halloween !
@@marywolfe6598 😂
Avoidant people also fall into the category of 'no bad news.' A few people that I formerly associated with behaved like this. Clear boundaries were set anytime one spoke about anything with emotional weight. That left the conversation stuck in commenting about superficialities. Nice but ultimately unsatisfying, stultifying, boring, and regimented.
Yes, I agree,, they're quite boring, superficial people. I'd rather spend my time reading a book than having a fake, one sided conversation with this type.
M Dee I agree with your "quite boring." Perhaps these folks think they're engaging, I experience them negatively and am left feeling emptier and disconnected. It's been good to distance myself from these people that leave me with micro-emotional cuts.
Yes, they are quite rigid. I believe it’s due to emotional neglect due to an emotionally neglectful upbringing. They have very little skills to understand, process and feel emotions so have poor boundary setting ability and tend to control/shut anyone down when they sense a certain level or kind of emotion is beginning to crop up, either in the person talking to them or as an effect inside of them. They get flooded very easily and dysregulated by emotions. It’s very soul draining to be around these types of people. The name of the game is “keep me comfortable at all times”.
@@naturefleur2062, wow, I sure appreciate your insight and thoughtful remarks. It's been my experience that people with this personality style share at least one trait similar to those with Narcissism. When these folks feel aggrieved, though they cannot tolerate being emotionally present for another, they expect an authentic audience for their own emotional dump. I don't know why they think they're entitled to this.
They can’t handle reality.
I think the overlap between narcissist and their victims is in this area. One avoiding emotional connections from fear and trauma and one deliberately withholding emotional connections to cause pain and maintain superiority.
I believe this is a narcissistic trait because one has to have little empathy to play people like this. The ghoster I dated cared nothing for how I felt, still doesn't but he sure knows how to turn on the charm to his advantage. They are manipulators and liars, stay away from these individuals they will only make your life miserable. All we can do is love them from a distance.
DAs and narcs are both results of emotional neglect and trauma . Make no mistake about it.
They withhold emotional connections as a form of control. They must stay autonomic and independent and in control. It’s very soul destroying 😢
There seems to be a lot of people like this. The avoidance hits home with a friend. Makes plans and then cancels. 17 times! Yes, I am a slow learn. Lol. I dont participate anymore.
Ever show up when they had hoped you'd cancel? Someone Invited me last minute. to their Thanksgiving & their oldest son spent it in his room NOT happy these pitiful surprize guests actually came. Gosh I regret going
Passive aggressive users.
With any statement that ends with just kidding.. They are not kidding.
People love using what is me. I shake my head. Find your own identity. Labeled as crazy. It's like walking through a mine field in a virtual reality game.
Oh the pride they show with their oneupmanship.
Think I'll hang out with the grasshoppers that I have befriended. They understand.
Thanks Doc!🌹🌹🌹
I’m guilty of using this behavior sometimes, but I think part of it is me being afraid to be me when In the presence of certain people
🐛🦗💕🐛🦗💕🐛🦗💕
I am hanging out in a field of wild rabbits. We have gotten to know each other, so they don't run away anymore, as they peacefully graze on the grass, while I stand 10 feet away. So much better than hanging with avoidant humans!
So so good Doc. Sometimes it’s hard to read because they are not mean or hurtful but just as you say “ Avoidant”.
But when you look deeper. The lights are off in the house so to speak.
@Perry Doerr Yes. I find them shallow thinkers. Surface skating!
That may appear to be true, until you cross them. Then they will retaliate with a vengeance. Shame them by unmasking them and they will make you pay dearly. Some...maybe not all.
Definitely. Now when I see the lights are on and nobody’s home, I run.
I think avoidant behaviour is part of emotional unavailability and causes unbearable stress in a relationship. Anyone who recognises this happening needs to get out, these people never change except for the worse.
Exactly
I identify with a lot of these, I never really thought I was avoidant.I really want to change these behaviours. I want to be intimate with atleast one person. Am I really doomed for good!!!😢😢😢
I recognize I'm a fearful avoidant, but I never want to let my avoidant side get the best of me. Yes I do fear conflict, but I also understand conflict happens, and if we don't clash, we don't change.
@@glitteryapple6819normally I would tell people they can change but with avoidant people it’s almost like they’re built that way…. But I’ll tell you something, you actually acknowledge that you’re an avoidant so now you can work on yourself and become more of a secure person. Most avoidant people just avoid all types of counselling and don’t ever feel accountability. But you do so just keep working on yourself. You’ll be ok
@@glitteryapple6819yes you can change. First thing is being fed up with yourself, the will to change next and practice. Little steps day by day.
It should be noted that Avoidant tendencies aren’t always synonymous with over aggressiveness and game-playing. Not all Avoidant people will do this. Avoidance in itself is a defense strategy that keeps them from being vulnerable or feeling/being controlled-to keep others from playing games with them, as it were. It just happens to also pair well with invasive, manipulative and controlling behaviors if the Avoidant person in question is also an ill willed sort of person. But, the two are very different.
Very well stated.
Yes, well said.
Yes, I see what you mean.
True, I also found myself being described, as I reacted to the braggadocio of my partner-I was not going to “enter in” to his conversation…..
Thanks for writing this @Nessa Millikan. I was listening to the video and found it upsetting that all avoidants were being lumped into one category-- as though the intimacy avoidance of a narcissist was being held on par with that of someone with PTSD, for instance.
My ex was a DA and played some of these games. However he wasn’t superficial and the connection we had was deep. But he was a very damaged individual.
Thank you! It feels so disrespectful to someone who wants to connect when these casual lies are laid out, along with the ghosting and the masks, the false impressions...
It’s been my experience that often times these types operate from the fearful avoidance stance. This is really difficult as they usually create a trauma bb d and use intermittent push pull dynamics and turn everything over onto you.
Yes it’s always the other persons job to carry the relationship
I’m so tired of it 😩 I’m Emotionally drained most of the time
@@seanm7539 the sooner you go no contact, block, delete all apps and move on with your own life and forgiven them from afar, the sooner your healing will begin.
@@lil--mo2025es, I’ve done that and it helped tremendously, minus the block. I just let them contact me when they want but I don’t give in…. I know she isn’t capable of a healthy relationship. Not even with just me. But anyone…
Connection vs. transaction: brilliant distinction!
***** 5 stars! OMG, this has been my life. The councelor my narc husband & I were seeing addressed this very topic. Surprise, surprise, those sessions still didn't help him to be open, emotionally giving or honest in our relationship. I wish I knew it was never going to happen. I didn't think anyone could be this avoidant. And surprise surprise again. I have a good friend who is another avoidant individual. 😟 Now it's up to me to recognize these people, be aware (so I can take loving care of myself), and keep these type of people on the periphery and not invest my heart into these kind of relationships. Thank you for this video, Dr C. You have been so instrumental in helping me towards freedom.
Yeah
I recognize this.
Thanks
Dr Carter
as a recovering 'avoidant' chooser in intimate relationships, I now realize it's because I grew up in emotional chaos with a bi polar mom. A childhood of unpredictable out of control emotions, so better to avoid & find a partner to avoid with me. Eventually I learned to want more intimacy & had to let go of my previous preferred emotional type.
same!!
Responding to a heart to heart, my ex would say 'keep it light' then suddenly put on a huge smile. Meaning, subject changed.
Listening to this, I wondered if I am avoidant. I’m a loner. I like people, but do not want to become involved with anyone to the point of being tied up to a lot of obligations that would cause me to have to leave home. I love the freedom of solitude. Maybe this is a part of who I’ve always been, and maybe it was exacerbated by the fact I was married to a very controlling narcissist for thirty years. I had very little freedom then and all my interests were rebuffed and squelched to the point that after that thirty years I hardly knew who I was anymore. I have thoroughly enjoyed getting reacquainted with that self the last twenty years and have found myself withdrawing from bossy or intrusive types who would swallow my whole world. There are some people who would dominate hours of your life every day and often those are the very same ones who try to force you into becoming a clone of themselves.
That’s so true. Or if they don’t try to make you a clone of themselves, they try to make you into the kind of romantic partner they want. 😬
THIS!!!!!
It's really sad what these individuals do to their partners. It's crazy to realise that there are people with this behaviour pattern in the world to begin with. How can one identify this type of behaviour early on in a dating relationship so to walk away before one gets too attached to them?
Great question. My ex got me and ultimately changed during the relationship.
Very hard to identify because they tend to love bomb you in the beginning. They’ll show glimpses of their true self in the beginning, but you’ll be too infatuated with the love bombing. Soon enough the ghosting and avoiding will occur but you’ll already be hooked, constantly trying to open them up and get back to the honey moon stage, but it’ll never happen. The longer you stay, the longer you’ll lose yourself and eventually get dumped and discarded, worst heartbreak you’ll ever experience.
They develop this pattern because carer’s are unavailable or abusive. It’s a healthy defence mechanism. If and when all parents are reliably present, calm, supportive, unabusive, then this healthy response won’t be necessary. In other words, never
@@joeflores174yea, it happened to me. Hardest thing I had to deal with but it made me so much stronger. And through it I learn a lot about relationships
If they are very flattering to you in the beginning but it may go against their social habits, give you particular disclaimers, ask for days alone. And may reveal things to you that may show vulnerability to you, but they may not give you the same grace when it is you letting them know vulnerable things about yourself to them. It's better to still keep your emotional boundaries up with them in the getting to know you stage or keep mental notes in your mind at least in the first 6 months. And maybe longer. This is the 2nd time I've been with someone one like this. It's harder this time around because we had been together for 3 years. It's harder to get my heart broken mind to negotiate down his value with all the hurtful things mentioned in this video he did to me.
My experience with an avoidant personality man was truly frustrating, he never would commit to even a first date or meeting.
I was misled & he played games always to disappoint me.
There were times he ghosted me.
At times I thought it was me
Eventually he broke my heart & I had to move on to save myself.
Yep. Totally understand!
Congratulations ❤
Have been going thru same for almost four months. I finally understand he’s not really interested.
I believe I am the avoidant type and as another person said in a video I experience EVERYTHING in life (positive or negative) with a cycle of 1) DREAD 2) PANIC 3) SHAME. It's exhausting
Check Avoidant Personality Disorder
It’s so painful. Almost 3 years and I finally left after 10 months of counseling with my boyfriend. prior to that I had not been involved in a relationship for eight years. Just trying to work on myself, My hobbies, and self-employment. I went in secure and I do lean anxious preoccupied when I begin to see pattern of instability in relationships. I’m proud of myself for the first time Because I had the fearful courage to walk away. It’s been horrible. it is horrible as I write this. My stomach tight as a drum and feeling fighter flight. But staying would’ve been far worse. This is the one good thing I have done for myself as if I would do if I were guardian of a child.
I've thought of myself as Avoidant with some Borderline features for some time . This coping technique has been I'm sure brought about by a NPD father and a Covert Narc mother who was without doubt the single most negative influence in my life . By this definition I don't think I'm avoidant - I'm AVOIDANT . There's no game playing - I avoid you , don't want any more shitty people in my life , not taking a chance on anyone else's bad behaviour now or down the road . I have learned to 'act' normal in social situations I can't get out of attending and maybe others might think I'm more approachable that I am as I can converse about many topics . But lead you on , suck you in so I can take advantage ? No that's what I'M avoiding .
Considering what you’ve been through, (two narcs!) I can understand where you’re coming from. I’m a fearful-avoidant, myself. It takes a lot to establish trust, especially when you know that gaining the advantage runs deep in the veins of the unconscious human mind.
One way I’m getting by is embracing everyone as a singularity and celebrating the freedom for them to come and go without forgoing the intimacy of the moment. To live in the moment and make a series of small impacts. Offering others’ our most vulnerable selves should never be an obligation except to yourself, at your leisure. Loyalty is conditional on trust and should never be pledged without it. Non-attachment can be a virtue, and communication (not implication) and community are the keys in that.
And I think in terms of the Hippocratic oath in that, if and when we cannot do good, at least do no harm. It doesn’t always happen, but to do our best with the sincerest intent is all we can do. It is always enough.
Pavla, what you described is not diagnosably Avoidant; it is not unhealthy. I speak with the utmost of understanding and empathy. Pathologically Avoidant Personalities are users and very superficial... they're not avoiding the BS, so to speak: they are empty vessels.
You are not alone. 🤗
@@ennui6083 Thank you for your input - I think you are more right than not in your assessment of my symptoms . There has never been adequate mental health services in our rural area and it's always been more expedient and cost effective by doctors to blame people and even children for their own problems and sell them some anti depressants or Ritalin than recognize family dynamics as that's where the money is . I actually think there is a solid wall of ignorance here in the arena of narcissistic family dynamics also . A couple of years ago a therapist told me she thought I had an attachment disorder before referring me off to a group therapy that I didn't waste my time attending as I have been to a few of those . I know of Pete Walker and have read his online writings some years ago . I'm no longer looking for a qualified therapist as I can't afford them and by all accounts they don't exist here . It has been as you expect with similar narc parents , a very emotionally painful life - hence some borderline traits . Thank you for your kind words and concern . I'll look into the podcasts you referred to .
Ive got BPD and I've picked an aviodant. I chose a fart in the wind because I don't know how to get close to someone without switching from Jekle to Hyde. So my avoidant stays at a nice safe distance....over there. Don't get any closer and we will get on just fine
So very right !
This really sounds familiar when dealing with certain types I have encountered.
I think sometimes I can be seen by others as avoidant, but really it's due to realizing there are things about that other person that are unhealthy for me to be around. So I gently back away. This may feel cold to the other person, but we're not compatible with everyone and it takes time for a potential friendship to develop enough to find out if you're truly compatible or not. Life is too short to have friends who aren't supportive, or we have enough in common with.
You need to distinct the two terms - ( 1 ) people who support you & ( 2 ) people who support the cause you associate with ( notice this is not personal - its function is to illustrate a point, you can imagine me as a subject, or anyone else ).
( 1 ) can be your friends, family, spouses, partners etc.
( 2 ) can be any institution, activity , project etc.
This is where things can go wrong if either of the parties involved does not properly communicate their needs and stances, or gets too attached to one side - that initial bond you developed which serves as a connection to ( 1 ) the person or ( 2 ) cause, or perhaps both in some cases.
example - one may ( 2 ) volunteer or join altruistic cause to support it, but it does not necessarily mean that individual wants to associate with ( 1 ) people involved. There usually needs to be another activity or cause to bond over, as a mean of avoiding overly strict boundaries which forces either party involved into a " role " to fulfill, and allows them to express their needs and desires out of the box, out if this role they are assigned.
Sadly, as we go further down the line, sometimes we lose the desire to connect, or we cannot find an activity or cause to bond over with, or it simply does not work out ( natural selection ). That's why open communication on both ends is important, one party should not weather the storm on their own as it creates dissonance and furthers the conflict instead of solving it.
And lastly, sometimes there are conflicts that need to be addressed immediately rather than swept under the rug and postponed. If left unaddressed, this behavior can become pathological not only for the party exhibiting it but for the party who chooses not to address it - adopts the avoidant behavior as a mean of dealing with an avoidant party.😀
Or, could it be that you see there are "things that are unhealthy" in EVERY PERSON, so you back away and move on, hoping to find the perfect person somewhere?
I see myself in a lot of these. I feel like the world is happening to me and not with me so i keep people and social expectations far away from the ”real” person i am on the inside. Its hard to break out of a pattern of avoiding deeper connections and keeping to myself when its been going on since i can remember, but i can see the pain it couses others when im not as present as they want me to be. Its not that i dont like people, im just tired of the games we play. I love your videos, thank you 😊
I need a treatment to stop dating avoidant people. They all behave like that
I'm an avoidant. No one, who is only avoidant, is gaming you. I tend to be very expressive when I first meet a person. That is closer to the real me. When people get intrigued by that me and want to get closer or kinder, avoidant reaction is triggered. I quit my first job when my boss offered to me a ride every morning and felt like I couldn't refuse because of the context. It'd be hella funny to say I'm gaming my boss by losing my job. Also, I don't understand why avoidants are interested in marriage.
They’re not trying to “play games”…as a therapist I think you’d have more understanding for attachment issues. Some of them are self-aware & want to do the work to change.
This summarized "the love of my life" so accurately I cried, and then I got really angry inside. Probably some healing happens now as I calm back down. It's my mom too. Damn. I got the "you're so clingy" treatment as toddler. Thanks for the clarification, Bro!
Cameras and photography changed human reality. Frozen moments of time.
These avoidant people are too shallow waters for me to swim. But am I one of them when I decide to avoid them?
Yes, that’s exactly it. Avoidance itself is a defense strategy, not necessarily an offense strategy. It’s not to get control over someone else-it’s to keep control over your own self when someone else imposes control over you.
Betscu: simply, No. There's a difference.
I never throw sarcasm at my better half when she tells me about her day,
but I am guilty of not providing any interest in it.
12:25 some of the best advice I've heard yet regarding healing from the heart-shattering pain of having fully loved a dismissive avoidant person. Thank you.
I worked for 11 years with people who kept saying that "next time" I came to the office, we would get together/ they would invite me to their home/ have a meal together, and it just never happened.
I discovered that to be a cultural saying or expression in southern USA culture when I did a year's contract working there. Everyone met me and promised to have me for dinner, lunch etc. Never happened. Finally someone told me it's a fake polite saying like Bless your heart. My couple of friends were shocked that 8n Canada 🇨🇦we say we will have to have u over, we mean it.
Yep.
@@joywebster2678 Hmmmm......no.... it's not just a saying. Sounds like a toxic pool of people you were involved with.
@@aloysiusdevanderabercrombi470 it was the entire city 9f Louisville KY. I encountered it through the hospital workplace, at the church I was a soloist at, in various social settings. It was cultural. One of my friends husband's during that time was coincidentally consulting in Detroit for GM and spent quite a bit of time at the Windsor Canada plant. He came home saying, wow do you know how many Canadian workers had me over for a meal or a drink? That never happens here we just say it. I nodded at him and said, I noticed.
@@joywebster2678 This was in France. In a Christian organization.
I think worth adding is that the game playing is often unconscious as the avoidant commonly beLieves that all people are playing the same games ( strategy or hidden agendas etc) - and it is after all a protective strategy- a way to not get too close and then get hurt / abandoned A classic Avoidant conflict statement may be “ what do you REALY mean” - or “I know what game your playing here” and when there is harmony and things are going smoothly they may say “ what was that look about just then “ or accuse you of being agreeable as some sort of strategy to get something from them or to hide something from them - the sarcasm is hard - a great weapon to prevent getting closer - and sharing something close to the heart - the immediate response is “ welcome to MY world” - no chance of receiving empathy when they’ve got a way bigger better worse thing than you have
Boy do I know ALL of these! And if we grew up in as they probably did, in narcissistic families, how do we know love??? I chose kindness and empathy and was used. He chose to take advantage and refused all recognition of what I gave. He said in court that in 40 years I did nothing. I won. He still did pay. They are above it all. Unreachable. Why our nails are full of these game players at great expense to society and victims.
Dr. C do you know James Hillman Soul's Code? In the mid 90s he predicted forms of sociopathy would be our biggest social problem. You have helped me understand his use of "daemon" or inner spirit he was seeing a growing lack of the ability to introspect and be authentic I imagine.
Thanks for all you give. Bless you.
Another game is: " Don't take it personal.. i just don't like to tell this part.. or i didn't respond..don't take it personal"
I mean shutting doors of communication with no reasonable cause.. and telling not to consider it directed toward you.
After one too many times of "not taking it personally," I'm only human. and eventually I explode in an overreactive outburst. There's a name for this and it's called "reactive abuse." Then ABBRA CADABRA, I AM MAGICALLY THE BAD GUY.
I grew up in a family such as this. I was the only one with objectivity. Weird. No one wanted to talk, have ambition or creativity. They told me “I” had emotional problems. I really do despise my family of origin, but love the family I created with my husband and children. Normal, healthy, fun.
My husband has a family like yours it’s terrible no interest in anything and I mean ANYTHING🤬
I would dare to wager that the family of origin had a lot of dysfunction going on as well. It's ok to set boundaries and recognize the unhealthy. 🤗
@@chiefjetsonofflare5329 it’s really sad, but also frustrating. 😘🙏🏼
@@aloysiusdevanderabercrombi470 of course, and I have had therapy over the years. I took my mother to a session in 1987. She sunk into the couch, literally, when asked a question by the therapist. Unbelievable. It was then I realized I was on my own in recovery. Again. Still. As usual. 🙄 (Mother lived to be 101 with me as her caregiver.😳lol)
@christinalw19 hi u are the black sheep I am too all are muddled up but they don't want to face that or do the work it's a tough journey ....
Argh! My ex is this way, and it's so frustrating! Constantly cancelled plans, and I was always the "problem" for calling him out on it. Barely said a word about his family or life. Only wanted to come by when it was convenient for him. He can't even do basic stuff on a friend level. Avoidants aren't bad people, but God, they're their own worst enemies!
Same here lol I’m not dealing with it anymore so i left her alone for good
Yes me to I’m dealing with it
I finally left after a year of this behavior. Canceling plans last minute, could only see her on her terms and schedule, less and less affectionate, while watching her be super loving to everyone else but me. When I called her out on it I was called too needy and emotional. Even studying attachment theory while in the relationship didn’t prepare me for the heartbreak
@@joeflores174 The being too needy part really left me feeling sore. Especially when I'd just text a heart emoji, and a "How are you?" But I've recovered, and I think I'm ready to go date again.
@@Angeliserrarehow did you two end? Did he ever come back? Im asking because I was ghosted in the end without any reason
"trying to bring normalcy to someone who can't do that"... That's it. 100%.
Thank you. The clarity and understanding, and validation contained in your videos helps relieve so much.
Wow, you have perfectly described my entire family. Even our children followed in the steps of the extended family through gossip. No one will talk to me about anything even when I have tried they will not open up. I surmise from this that they want to believe bad things about me so they have no desire to find out the truth.
@Blue Butteryfly I am so sorry your son treated you this disrespectfully. It doesn't matter what you said or what you did a son should never speak to his mother in this way.
@Blue Butteryfly we know of a friend whose adult daughter told her grandchildren that they were dead. They ran into the parents and the children somewhere and told the children who they were, but the grandchildren acted like they didn't know them at all. This is how my grandchildren act toward me, they don't know me and have no interest in me. However, one day when they are adults they may become curious and try to find her. These things are all in God's hands. I don't really miss the grandchildren because they seem like strangers to me. It is more that I miss the "idea" of having grandchildren than I do the actual people. It is impossible to continue to agonize over what cannot be and still remain joyful, so I let go and the Lord has removed them from my heart except to pray He gets hold of them someday before they leave this life. I also believe that our relationships in heaven are going to be so amazing we will forget about how we felt on this earth. May the Lord bless you with great joy and peace as you move on to continue your own life.
Luke 14:26-27 " 26“If anyone comes to Me and does not hate his father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters- yes, even his own life- he cannot be My disciple. 27And whoever does not carry his cross and follow Me cannot be My disciple.…"
@Blue Butteryfly one more scripture to encourage you! "Matthew 10:37 "Anyone who loves his father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me;"
@Blue Butteryfly You are right, "backwards" on nearly everything. Things are growing more irrational by the day because we are living in the last days as described in 2 Timothy 3 and 2 Timothy 4.
That was really good, Dr. Carter! I've had my 4 years with one, always ambivalent (except for when he was trying to win me over at the very beginning), 4 years of which 1 year and a half was absolute hell. I will never be caught dead with an avoidant again!
Hey I will call you tomorrow… crickets … lol 😂 so true
I usually love the truth. But not when it hurts so much to hear it. I'm no longer with my narcissist husband but it's difficult to realize the pain I've endured for so long.
You're not with him any more, right? That's the first step.
Exit, stage left or right - your choice, your call.
Now, close that book, dump it in an imaginary dumpster, a nearby landfill, or into the bottom of the deepest ocean 1/2 way around the World,
->> and start writing your NEW life story. 👏👍👏
⚘🙏❤🙏⚘
Love and prayers to you and yours from your eternal sister in Christ somewhere near Seattle and around the World.
run fast and do not go back.
Yes, I think I am being played. One cannot imagine the pain.
I'm astonished at the lies told to me, in detail, by an avoidant in my life. I KNOW that he's lying, in his efforts to maintain avoidance.
This was very interesting, but the best part is the dog on the couch. :)
This is sad but familiar. Can't believe pple live like this. So sad
I sometimes did avoiding behavior in the past. I was overextended and didn't have any energy left but didn't want to hurt their feelings. Now I'm more honest with people and don't make vague promises.
My husband does this but he's very enmeshed with his mother and family. We're doing therapeutic separation so I hope he chooses to work on His issues for once. His family made ME the problem.
Ok, that's all the people I kicked to the curb. Does that make me avoidant, or did I finally set boundaries? Hey I'm happy!
Found this video after a woman, who I was involved with for 9 months, proposed a 90 day break up. It was her Dad’s idea 🚩 and she ran with it. She’s since blocked me, avoided contacting me, etc after 9 months of life together, getting to know my kids, and she says, “I want to come back to this” but literally everyone in her life has avoided me, blocked me… makes no sense. It’s all games.
Knew someone who, every time i tried to express romantic tendencies, staunchly proclaimed, "I'm not into 'the game'." And refused to acknowledge that it could be important to anyone else.
In the end it was like, "ok, so you want a relationship but none of the work, or the joy".
Didn't realize this for what it was until much later. It's really sad, in a way. So much of life is being pushed away by these folks.
I've also had friends who were my best friends for years who would say "i want to be an artist" or what not and when I'd network and connect then to someone useful, they'd never follow up. When I'd ask why, they'd disappear completely. Who ruins a years long friendship just because they couldn't say "thanks, but honestly i was just saying that, sorry". It baffles me how much avoidant people are willing to throw away (and then tell themselves it's for the better for both parties) to avoid... Taking responsibility for literally anything. Like yo, I'm not your mom, give me a chance to exceed your already low expectations lol
Whew, I thought for sure this was going to be about my isolating myself. I know what I am doing is not healthy, but I just don't want to go through another relationship where the best I get out of it is being a door mat.
Book: Codependency for Dummies by Darlene Lancer
I didn’t know what I was doing to participate in allowing people to use me as a doormat.
Took my kindness for weakness and their path of least resistance to get their own needs met…..by me.
More and more I see people doing this, not just to me, but to others. One situation that always plays into this even in my 50's-60's "Let's go get a drink." I don't drink, but when I do agree to meet a 'friend' or someone that I know from work, they get aggravated with me when I just order water or a soda, the last time was iced tea. Never hear from them again. That visit and conversation is over and done with. This also has happened with my spouse. Neither of us drink alcohol. His family has no interest in even conversing (other than a text) at any given moment. I would really like to see if other's have this type targeted 'avoidant' situation. Life is short. Other than my true friends, I find it so shallow that alcohol seems to be the glue that is the standard for a friendly or civil conversation. There has also been many comments like "Oh, are you a recovering alcoholic?" NO...I just don't drink. Empty nest and retirement has been the spotlight of this. It's awkward and honestly brutal to just be yourself without judgment over a beverage. Hang on to your TRUE friends. I've no interest in trying to make new friends with stipulations about alcohol. Thank you Dr. C.
Of course this happens in relationships. We get involved with these mixed up people that turn everything around. Mind games galore.
I hope all who watch this video and see a bit of flying monkey in themselves take these words to heart. They can be hard to hear, but they also hold hope.
From a very young age, I was groomed to be a flying monkey. I'm 63 years old now, and it took me many of those 63 years to recognize the narcissistic dynamics of my family. Seeing this video simultaneously gives me a reason to celebrate (because I finally can see the truth) and a reminder to disengege from the prowling narcissists of the world as soon as I see them for who they are. I feel grateful for the freedom of self I've found in the process, but I wonder why I was lucky enough to make this discovery whereas others in my family have not.
If you're persistent enough and continue to chase they will eventually tire and give in. Happily married for 14 years now!
I appreciate you Dr. Carter!
I just love this video! Thanks so much!
Thank you for discussing this Dr Carter! I’ve been gamed by him for far too long, I just never had confirmation in the way you so excellently described! Thank you for the validation!!!
Excellent advice! Thank you!
"You're not going to game me."
Thank you. I really need to put these words in my head and my heart.
Thanks Doc, always great insight 🙌🙏
Excellent. Thank you, Dr. Carter.
Thank you Doctor Carter This is another very helpful message. Much Peace to you!
Thank you Dr Carter for these videos they are a blessing ! I didn’t know what I was dealing with for far…..too long !!!! 🙏
Well said, thanks
Insightful and most helpful. Thank you.
Very helpful informations! Thank you!
Dr. Carter, you just hit the nail on the head. Her name in mom.
We have been semi/mostly estranged since she and my step-dad stole my SUV from the parking lot of a Nursing Home.
I just had the first of 7 toes amputated, rehabbing, age 54. I yelled from my bed, down the long corrider:
MOTHER, DON'T! DO! THIS!!
She had grabbed my keys.
She disturbed the entire facility of almost 100 beds.
She is a bull in a China closet, thinks she knows best in all subjects. She was concerned about my car being broken into.
I told her that I had/still have a $100/$300 Deductible for everything. Steal my car? Break all the windows? Slash my tires?
Only $300. Explained it to her.
She stole my truck, and took it an hour away to their property. The heater core was out. It was running on water. Could have caused the engine to lock up and seriously hurt or killed someone or several people.
Left a msg on their phone, and the next morning called 911 to report it. 6-7 years ago.
Called her the other day to say hi, I love her and dad, would it be ok to call once a week, hoping to start some semblance of re-starting our older relationship...
She said, quote, "I can't stop you".
Everything has to be about her. She can talk. It's all about her. Twice?, talked for 45 minutes each way to see my brother in a nursing home. I just zipped it, let her talk, and she did so. Talk, for 45 minutes each way, about her.
I try to be a listening ear, kind, loving, caring, speaking hope and encouragement into peoples' lives and hearts, but some people just suck the life out of me/we and us.
Honestly? I don't know how you do it, Dr. Carter.
Would or could you consider doing a series about how to balance the teeter-totter of emotional life, given various toxic people, how to balance the mental?
Yes, exercise, walking, swimming, yoga, reading self-help books and most importantly, spending time in Scripture, etc?
Love your channel. Brief, concise but so full of wisdom.
So glad I and we all found your channel!!
Stay the course, ok?
Many hugs of gratitude, kind Sir!
I am very thankfull for this video, it’s the best content i found about this topic, thank you DR. ❤️
Story of my life, thank you Dr. Carter!!
Oh you are so on the button Dr Carter. I could tick every box on this list with a person I thought I was close to who was just playing me like a violin.... Eventually me strings stopped resonating and thankfully I was able to walk away, but definitely not unscathed...
I know it could sounds rude, but if you have discovered or understand that you are an avoidant or have an avoidant attachment style and you are a good person who simple shutdowns sometimes, you can always choose to close the relationships (with partners, friends) and give them the opportunity to be free and with someone who can give them what they diserve, if you are not an egoistic person, you know that that's the best you can do. Other people searching for attention aren't anxious, they have the right to be with a person that give them the basic of a healthy relationship, and if you are aware of your behaviors, don't give the cold shoulder to your partner only cause you are like this, it's cruel, it's not right that the other person feels unlovable, confused, needy, and so on. If you are aware of yourself, and you hope that the other person should wait you in your good times only again and again, you are acting in a egoistic way. Give them the opportunity to be free. Thank you
I think they rationalize to themselves that you are responsible for yourself and if you aren’t getting what you want out of the relationship, it’s on you to walk away.
Great video Dr. Cater, something like this just happened to me, I met someone back in January who VOLUNTEERED to help me with something really important that I needed. They then strung me along for several months allowing me to think that they were going to follow through, but they never did follow through, they simply disappeared from my contacts list, meaning I was blocked. I've decided that I'm now going to give people a cut off time to follow through, if they don't in that period of time then I'm moving on, they played that first game "I'm really impressed by you... not really."
I just wanted to thank you. Your videos are always filled with immense knowledge and understanding, and I find your voice and energy so soothing to watch.
You're welcome! Dr. C
Maybe related, not sure....when me and my man started dating I called him one day. He answered. He told me he was helping a friend with carpet. He answered to tell me he can't talk and to tell me, and "apologize" in the kind of voice used by a exhausted parent to a child, he said he doesn't want me to have an expectation of a conversation. Honestly, it was mean. A text was fine: busy, call ya later. He made it a "thing" and actually hurt my feelings.
Why did you accept his cruelty? And now he's your man? This says more about you then it does him! Get out now, (unless you don't mind your children being abused, in which case get your tubes tied) and get yourself into therapy. Please, the world doesn't need more of the same. It almost sounds as though you enjoy the attention having him to complain about... like "poor you".
I don't feel sorry for you, and if you have children with him you are worse than he is.
And he, didn’t want to let you down, by not answering.
Sure, the text may have been easier, but…
Sorry that happened to you. I’m only 23 but my dad started dating and has little time for new emotional investments, so he sees his girlfriend a couple times a week and they call each other at a specific time they are both free.
Maybe you need you set boundaries, give each other space and adjust to each other’s needs.
@@linw7320 don't be a bitch just to assert superiority by self appointing some authority to cast judgement or mind read her entire context. She was describing an incident of gaslighting. Just validate her, "Yep, he was passive aggressively gaslighting as if you were demanding. Don't have any doubt, because this is a red flag for psychological abuse". But you just engaged in a bunch of shaming emotional abuse, projected that she had kids with him because you needed to "justify" abusing her. Acting like a narc
@@chilloften Maybe
Thank you so much!
Thanks for sharing and your wise words and methods. I have met too many avoidant people in my life and their very difficult to deal with 😩
You are so welcome. Dr. C
Thank you again Dr.Carter I'm showing my children your videos.
Pleased! I hope they can figure it out! Dr. C
Dr Les has helped me help myself so much. I am eternally grateful. 💗
Sshhhh, don't give up our secrets. It'll be harder to maintain the necessary level of avoidance 😂
Busted! 😹
EXCELLENT VIDEO!
Thank you! 🙏🏻
Transactions and functions you summed that up well.
This is so spot-on! The problem I have is this is with a family member. A close family member. I'm sure dealing with them is different then in relationships outside of the family. I haven't figured it out yet and often fall into the 'attachment' side of it. Thanks for your insight.
Thank you, Dr. Carter. I think I've always thought of this type as "insincere" and normally don't engage with them much. However, I've learned that some will hide or obfuscate this, initially. Or maybe it's more accurate to say that the person might not be "off camera" for the first however long. Hard to imagine such a hollow existence, but I've most definitely seen it. Thanks for the insightful perspective, as always!
Good survivor instincts as they are a waste of time!
@@joseenoel8093 I'm wondering if I should upgrade the "insincere" to "damaged and damaging"!
@@notgivingthisout6977 In this case they are equivalent.
Their biggest problem is that they cannot keep the facade up for too long, and if you can stall such folks long enough, their true colors are going to show.
@@Robidu1973 It took about four years for it to show, but I agree with what you're saying in the broader sense. (He was always "on stage" or in "performative" mode - though I had no means to distinguish the act from reality - and he knew that, and used it to his advantage.) Had he been honest from the start and not pretended (and told me how invested he was, and all the other tactics he used), I'd not have put the time and energy in. He knew that, too. It's clear now he was not just avoidant, but a full fledged covert. But, maybe I'm making a nuanced distinction that others can speak to more knowingly since I don't often have contact with those who are openly this way.
Dr. Carter, thank you for taking the time to share your knowledge, skills and abilities with the world.
It helps me to be more focused and develope my super power of being in command of myself and my emotions. And knowing I can do that is what mitigates the anxiety I experience in the toxic, hostile workplace.
I have never found breathing, visualization, induced happy thinking etc to be effective for me because it doesn’t identify the real obstacle and how do I negotiate it.
I like how you break it down step by step.
Thank you
this is great content
Everything you are saying I have experienced with different people. I know now that I deserve to be appreciated for who I am. This is such a good video for those of us going through this. I am so much happier this person is gone even though we never met. I used to try to understand why they were like this. If a snake bites you, you don't need to know why, just get away, and get help.
Thanks for helping me figure out where I'm going wrong 😔