Elektron Rytm VS Machinedrum - modular synth, or groovebox?
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- Опубліковано 19 жов 2018
- Since before the Elektron Analog Rytm MK1 was announced, I was thinking to get a Machinedrum UW+, I had borrowed one for a while and it spurred me to get an Octatrack, which has been very useful and inspiring, but I always missed what the Machinedrum UW had to offer. As I watched the used prices of the Analog Rytm MK1 plummet with the release of the new MKII, it re-kindled my desire for an inspiring drum machine - but as I thought more deeply about it I kept circling back to the conclusion the Machinedrum UW was what I really wanted, despite all the fun I had with the new AR mk2 at a local music store (rock and roll vintage, aka synth city).
The Elektron Machinedrum, particularly the MkII UW version, is an extraordinarily flexible instrument, representing something like a modular synthesizer that has been architected primarily as a drum machine. In comparison the Elektron Analog Rytm Mk2, although an extremely playable and much more performance-friendly groovebox, doesn't have quite the same level of overall depth and flexibility, both internally, and when interacting with other gear. Even after I had already bought an MDUW+ I kept discovering more reasons to be happy with my decision, although I'd certainly like to merge what I consider the best features of both designs.
I hope this comparative review of functionality provides an informative look on why the Machinedrum, even in 2018, is far more than it appears, and can still compete quite well with its modern counterpart, the Analog Rytm Mk2
2:52 more voices, arbitrary choke groups
3:19 huge variety of machines that can be placed on any track
4:01 MIDI sequencing
4:50 song mode BPM
5:15 recorder trigs
5:47 12-bit sampling with character
6:49 rich and extensive voice architecture
7:17 classic/extended switch
8:49 input machines
9:13 audio inputs can also be trigger inputs
10:06 instant pattern switch via external MIDI notes
10:35 control-all
11:26 flexible LFO routing
12:00 master EQ
12:24 flexible audio bussing
12:48 conclusion
oldschool machinedrum resource compiled by tarekith ( / tarekith , which mentions abusing input+MIDI machine combination - tarekith.com/assets/machinedru...
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like and share this video if you think Elektron should design a real-deal MDUW mk3!
unfortunately i think it's a dream and it will stay like that because mono and drum where made at a time when the company made their dream machines came true and at this time let's say it was an half professional company we can see that after the octa all their choices where made to make more products that will fit together without open thinking of them... Per example the minimum for the rytm could have been two more open tracks for the sequenceur.......
Analog4 vs Riddim? Vid on that?
@@rustyhex9899 Yeah, Elektron as we knew it is gone. Sort of like Yellow Mitzus from 1998.....
I have both. Trust me the MD is the best drum machine ever made
I second that Mr. Dubla.
I’ve been drooling over this machine for quite some time and never even considered the Rytm. I am very excited to have my Machinedrum UW+ sit next to and compliment my OT MKII. Thank you Max for your very informative vids.
Man you do some proper and worthy of time experimental uploads. You inspire. Really appreciative of your thorough examination and nuances of these gears. Thank you.
thank you! always something new to learn or try with the Elektrons and making these videos has taught me a lot!
@@maxmarco as working class person ( barista with used MD, OT, DT took four years to afford) your uploads have made it worth it. May providence also reward you with your wishes, my friend.
really appreciate that! 👍👍👍 quite a studio you have there - MD and OT have made a lot of my other gear feel rather superfluous and as I keep getting deeper into them and streamlining my approach I've been a net seller of hardware for a handful of years now :D
Thank you for your MD videos ! You basic beatmaking session sold me on this machine, and I am having so much fun trying out so many things on it !
my pleasure, thank you! I need to make some more MD vids soon :) :) it's a really amazing design although it certainly has a few rough edges :D
Great video Marco!!! Thanks for your work on YT. You run a great channel!!!
Thanks a lot for this brilliant comparison. I'm buying MD after watching this. Going to watch also your MD tutorials.
Dude your really good at this. This is great
WOOOW you just really made me regret buying the MPC Live (which I love) but I've been looking for a drum synth and you just made my decision very easy for me. Very dope vid man. Peace, from Chicago!
hey thanks a lot! I really like the concept of MPC Live - I was eyeballing it pretty hard for a while - made me think that if Native Instruments ever makes a stand-alone and portable Maschine I'd probably be all over it. All the Elektron boxes are pretty awesome at being drum machines, just different flavors and features! I think the Machinedrum UW is an awesome sampler, but I do have to admit it has a tiny amount of memory (a fact I conveniently left out of the video) and is pretty basic and crude as a sampler, but in a weirdly beautiful and surprisingly flexible way. Would love to see a true Machinedrum UW Mk3 - a man can dream after all!
Thanks for the video...really,love it..keep up great work!greetings from Brussels
Hello, I find your video very relevant :) !! and thank you very much for enlightening me and giving your time.
For so many years, I think about taking an MD, but money question. I prefer to take Sonic Potion Lxr. (Machine drum of the poor).
Your video made me aware of the number of possibilities that I started to miss and to question in the sonic potion LXR + extension cv trigger.
The past years allow, to get a full option MD for 700 € even may be less, I think it will blend very well with Octa, and modular. So it's very good. Thank you, once again, I took a lot of fun watching your video, it's really clear and full passion ;)
thank you! I was always very interested in the LXR - I was building Shruthi-1s when it came out, but I was never convinced by any demos that I would be happy with the sound so never ended up building one. The trigger output extension did seem pretty cool, but fortunately MD can also directly output triggers, just not as many
Octatrack and Machinedrum is a crazy modular system all to itself, Try not to get too lost in the possibilities! Currently I only combine 1 Elektron box at a time with my modular gear, 2 of them seems a bit overwhelming for me at the moment! but I also have a lot of modules for them to interact with :) :) :)
really appreciate you sharing your thoughts! thanks again!
I have both MD and the RYTM MkI, they are totally different machines - as you articulate extremely well. Amazing insight! They both have appealing unique features, but yes I tend to favour my MD
really appreciate your comments! thank you! I have seen more than a few comments like yours floating around from folks that have owned both boxes - the Rytm is a really good design (and I do think it sounds great), totally slays so many other drum machines and grooveboxes, but for me the MD has more 'special sauce', so to speak. My purchasing decision was made rather challenging though, because the Rytm has a bunch of features I'd love to graft onto my MD!!
@@maxmarco I bought my MD back in the early 2000s, it was definitely the missing link to my vintage Roland gear - 909, 808, 707, 606 etc. I've rocked shows with just the MD and 909. The RYTM is also great, and understand its appeal to those who don't have a 909, 808 etc and want some "analog" machine in their set-up.
@@maxmarco The user interface is better on the Rytm MK2 which is why I bought one over a used MD which I had used before years ago as my first Elektron experience. Overbridge support, tactile finger drumming, nicer interface versus cryptic MD user interface. I have a Virus TI2 synth that in many ways is like a more powerful Machine Drum with a similar cryptic interface but way more voices and features.
@@Honeysmack love the better sequencer on Rytm vs Roland gear.
dude.. some great info in this video.. gotta love the electron stuff... crzy learning curve but when u get it down they are awesome.. especially for beats on the fly / live
Excellent comparison! Thanks!
Super interesting in depth analysis !
Thank you for that.
I believe the Performance feature of the Rytm is really the best feature. Especially with the performance knob of the mk2 that allows me to keep the parameter into a certain value, and releasing by pressing the pad.
thanks much for watching and sharing your thoughts! to me the pads and related performance features are definitely the main advantage of the Rytm design (besides the more advanced sequencer feature due to being a newer device) and would definitely be something I'd want on a Machinedrum mk3 :)
to a certain extent, 'scenes' and even 'performance macros' can be replicated using powerful and carefully pre-configured MIDI controllers, although it's something I generally wouldn't spend the time to implement
I think if we compare 'drum machine' to 'drum machine' the Rytm probably wins as the more straight-ahead and immediate device, with performance features and more modern sequencer - but on the flip-side and looking at the bigger picture the MDUW goes far beyond being a mere drum machine in some very exciting and mind-expanding ways!
fortunately there isn't a wrong choice! :) cheers!
Excellent video. Thorough and informative.
thank you! I'd been debating their relative merits for some years now before buying an MDUW earlier this year, so although perhaps this video is very biased I think it's fairly objective overall, and many of my points are purely factual. For example although we can certainly debate the relative importance of various features things like the fact of whether or not there is a BPM setting in song mode is not up for debate
Great comparison and highlit MD features.
I don't have AR, but I bought month ago 8.5 yr old MD MK2 UW+. This gear is everything what I needed. It can do anything :).
Besides the synth possibilities it also can be realtime sound processor (filters, fm, effects) using two inputs. Im connecting mics to this and making so rich, weird sounds (also try with piezo mics). Of course I can sample it and work more with it.
Also I connected octapad via midi to this, after that you can trigger whole patterns with midi cc, mashing between patterns, which is next level of abstraction playing on MD.
For me MD is the most creative instrument I know.
HAHA. That post headline from elektronauts that you posted up is a thread I started back in 2016 "Am I the only one? Machinedrum Love" when I first got the MD after purchasing the Rytm first. I purchased the Rytm thinking it's the newer version so it much be better, as both the Rytm and MD were the same price new at the time. Then a few months later when Elektron announced they were discontinuing production of the MD and dropping the prices by 40%, I had to get one before they all disappeared. Thank god I grabbed one. I also grabbed a MNM. And no I will not sell it to you. ;) I was only a MD noob back then. But after reading the manual and listening to it's purity I knew right away the MD was a better box. I started the thread as I just could not believe that I had wasted $2.2k AU on a Rytm a few months before, just to find out it was inferior to its predecessor.
I got into modular shortly after and the MD sat idol for a few years, only acting as a drum machine. But the last few months I dove right back in, and after using the modular, I can totally agree, and it's what I was thinking, the MD is like a little modular drum machine. I am still learning it's capabilities.
Looks like I am not the only one!
Sold my MD a few years back when I was broke. So much regret. I recently bought a Tanzbar 2 and that did help a lot with some of my drum machine cravings but I still really want to get a Machinedrum. I think they would complement each other very well actually. Absolutely love the sound of the MD. Unbeatable. The snappiest, grittiest piece of kit I’ve used.
Old comment but I’ll reply anyway. Sold my MD and Tempest after getting my Tanzbar (the OG one). I still think the original Tanzbar is the greatest analog drum machine of all time. Recently bought another MD since I was missing it and I’ll say they pair gorgeously. MD is so rewarding after some time apart and with some fresh perspective. Plus the unofficial firmware with MCL is super cool. Only two drum machines I’ll ever need
Thank you for making this video
thanks for watching! ultimately it was a tough decision for me to go for the MDUW over the Rytm, but the Machinedrum has a special charm and is much more than the sum of its parts
I think I'm convinced, thank you
Thank you for your opinion. Greetings from Wrocław
I appreciate how info-dense your videos are - you obviously know your stuff.
I’m just starting to get into HW groove boxes, trying to decide which Elektron machine to start off with. Machinedrum just shot up toward the top of my current prospects.
Would be very interested in hearing your thoughts on the Synthstrom Deluge.
thank you! Deluge seems more oriented towards a 'typical' approach/mindset, and my tastes are more experimental - I'm also not a fan of button matrix interfaces, moved away from them a long time ago. Lot of people seem to like it though. Machinedrum is a very cool instrument that despite being somewhat dated is still ahead of the curve in certain ways, but it's hard for me to 'recommend' it - generally speaking I'm not one to categorically endorse any particular product
far out man, I just learnt more about my MD!! thanks
thanks a lot! I'm always learning more too!
Goatboy has just bought a MD and is pleased with your video.
I would love to see a Machinedrum MK3!
Got a machinedrum SPS mk 2. Love it, it’s got its own character and sound
Thanks for the video! Last week I wondered about changing my MD UW+ for an AR (just for a change, didn't know to much about the AR)...now I'm sure that I will keep the MD!
Thanks for watching! Glad you got some value out of it, I often see some of these things discussed on forums (particularly Elektronauts) but pretty much nowhere else. Really it's a bit of an apples and oranges comparison, but for me the MD is much more interesting and goes deeper. Just last night I was messing around with MDUW using just my voice, a microphone, input machines, and RAM machines - and I was almost instantly transported to a place the AR mk2 will never be able to go. Even the Octatrack will not give me some of the flavors I was getting, although it's certainly far more versatile and powerful as a sampler
I do have to admit the Machinedrum does have a number of limitations as it's a rather old design, and lacks fancy new sequencer features, pads, and performance features of AR - I just find that all the different pieces of the MDUW combine to make an instrument that's much greater than the sum of its parts. The AR is this way as well, it just does not go as deep or is as flexible, as its design is more streamlined and focused on performance features. Would love to see a legit mk3 MDUW that properly closes the gap without compromise, but I'm not about to hold my breath!
Sure, I got some value of it! It's not a question of one only truth but just to make me think, mixing knowledge (you bring), tastes, experiences, etc. I also know and think that MD has limitations (managing samples, for example) but as you mention, just playing with audio input, ram machines, midi sequencing or simple sine waves (as you do in the other videos) just make it deep, great and unique!
to be fair I should make a video about rytm features, but instead I am thinking video(s) on how to do trigless locks, slow attack envelopes, emulate microtiming, and possibly even 'trigger conditions' with MDUW would be more fun :)
It's true, that would be fair but...as I have the MDUW, I'd really love to watch the other videos, hehe...those features/tricks that are not that well known
they are a bit more like hacks and kludges than features (except perhaps trigless locks, which are mentioned in the CTR-8P section of the manual), and have their limitations but are still quite interesting - trigger conditions in particular will be a bit tricky to implement but I have some ideas, and it will be good to document them on video. the tarekith resource linked in the description of this vid also has a TON of ideas and tricks that had never even crossed my mind - I'll definitely be looking there at some point for more inspiration
I looked all over for a comparison like this. I couldn't have asked for a more insightful, in-depth explanation of how these boxes compare and what their respective strengths are. I'm into deep sound design, so the Machinedrum is definitely going to be the way to go for me. I'm glad that I discovered this video before I made my decision. It's impossible to get my hands on either one of these boxes around where I live without purchasing them. Cheers.
awesome! glad my video could provide some insight! The Rytm can definitely sing, and it offers a lot of possibilities for sound design as well, but it's much more straight-ahead in architecture and it's very performance-oriented as probably the biggest sources of modulation are the scenes/performances. MD is very idiosyncratic in sound but very versatile, and if you like to dig deep and try weird stuff and don't mind the fairly simplistic sequencer it has in comparison to the modern Elektrons it's a very rewarding instrument - it also has quite a number of strange and sometimes unique performance possibilities that are very non-obvious and aren't available right out of the box - many of them are quite likely still waiting to be discovered!
This is a great video. Your more instructional videos are the best of their kind, I think. I'm also an Elektron devotee. I have a MD Mkii (and also a AR Mkii -and I love both) but not a UW, sadly. I find myself going back to it a lot these days. Really cuts through with live techno sets and the openness of design, as you point out, is amazing. I wonder if the real point is the one you make at the beginning about the sales patter. The MD was a really open vision and one that lasts and lasts. The AR was developed carefully to shift units and 'grow' the company in a highly competitive market. What is amazing about it, apart from the performance tools, is the sound. Huge Kicks and bass, but also the effect of driving samples through the analog filter, and the very flexible envelopes, sample looping etc. makes it a bit like a filthy 'analogue' MPC - but, with the compressor's sound etc an emphasis on a 'club-ready' sound. In those aspects, however, Elektron are fitting current trends rather than a (re-)visioning of the drum machine itself. I guess the market has transformed. After all, when the MD first came out, everybody said Elektron must be suicidal for going into hardware drum machines. They sure saw the future :-)
hey thanks a lot!! trying to make the kind of videos I would have liked to see when I was getting into Elektron. Your analysis of MD visionaries helping to create a market while AR design is more about following the market feels pretty accurate to me. If Elektron drops a new flagship (not a sure thing it would seem at this point) it'll be very interesting to see what direction they decide to take.
@@maxmarco Hi, I just posted a video of a score I made for a filmed dance performance. I dedicated the music to you as a thanks for all the great Elektron tutorial/session videos: ua-cam.com/video/I8ldVx0zDQ4/v-deo.html
Thank you very much for this useful information. For the last two months I'm thinking back and forth about buying a used Machindrum. Since the UW MKII models go for almost one and a half the price of a new Rytm, I thought maybe just get a Rytm and save some money... Thanks to your video the Rytm left my mind completely. I will concentrate on getting a MD UW MKII. It's a lot of money for a used device but I think it will be worth the investment.
Nice choice! :D Have you found a MK2 yet? I'm about to pick up a MK1 MD, non-UW, for a really good price. I'd love a UW MK2, but they're really expensive. On reverb the prices are crazy!
@@J1M0TEE Hi! No, not yet. There were a couple of UW MKII on ebay, but each time I hesitated to pull the trigger. (I try to get my GAS unter control) The prices are really high and after all this is just a hobby. It's nothing need to survive rightnow. Maybe someday I will makethe purchase ...
The non-UW models sadly are lacking the RAM machine and some othe features that make the UW model so interesting for performing. But if that doesn't bother you, definitely go for the MD MKI! 👍 The prices are really good at the moment.
The MD is more sound sculpturing experimental rhythm synthesizer to me than a classic drum machine. I have the version without sampling capabilities but even without this feature You can lost inside the machine. It is possible to make so many sounds on the MD, far beyond kick and a snare and a hat.
Don't forget about the sequencer! It is great to pair it with a classic sampler like a Roland s550 or akaiS20 to balance the cold ice from MD with warm samples from a vintage machine.
I often pair it with a monophonic synth like Vermona mono lancet it is a killer combo for techno.
With the MD you can start a gig from scratch easily.
I bought this when it came out and I have to say we were on our own back then. No utube. Had to learn by trial and error. I’m glad a stuck with buying elektron gear. It’s been really rewarding. But 17 years ago I wanted to chuck it out the window. I’ve owned all they made except the Sid.
Elektron srsly have to go back and look on their old devices and use them as the template to adjust and build upon for new devices. Though it's cool to have more simplistic machines (AR, A4, DT, DN, M:S, M:C), but now they have to go back imo. People seems to be very hungry for it. Elektron are their own boss of course, so they can do whatever they want.
On another note that isn't so Elektron specific, companies need to focus a little more on caracter in their products. The machinedrum later version for instance do 12 bit sampling and the reverbs sounds very viby and not too modern. And the visuals of the case design is just viby in itself.
The only other viby instruments that I can think of that you can currently buy from new are MegaFM, Microgranny and Ob6.
People are srsly hungry for viby stuff and enough features without becoming too menu divy. So not too much and not too little. Not too clean and modern. But not too dirty and muddy either. A balance between things. Of course clean stuff have its place, but so does caracterful stuff. But too much of either can become tirering after awhile.
I sold my Machinedrum UW years back because of financial trouble and I picked up an analog rytm last year because I missed my MD. I was (and still am) dissapointed about the lack of features, but I have grow to love my analog rytm. I'm definitely buying a MD again if I get the oppertunity! I hope that there one day will be a MD mk3
You’re cool man. I have both and agreed with you on anything but they’re different machine so for the customers: you either buy both or you’ll miss something, if you want it all. Rythm is fun Machinedrum is special
much appreciated!
Modular drums on Eurorack are the most fun and hands on. No presets and challenging to create beats but sound is amazing! I have an Elektron Analog 4 and Octatrack and they are great portable machines but I'd rather use modular drums and a good sequencer.
I only wish the MD had independent sequencer step lengths, some way to solo a track and the sample rate reduction effect placed BEFORE the filter. Otherwise, it's an absolutely amazing machine.
It also needs per track timing changes to make doubletime hat patterns etc
You can now solo with the latest non-elektron update
There is a 3-rd party machine called MegaCommand which upgrades MD to new possibilities incl micro-timing etc...
I like your content. Quality Stuff. Subscribed. Now i want the MD haha.
hahaha! thanks a lot! MDUW is a pretty special piece of gear - even if a mk3 eventually is designed and released I think the original will still have a lot to offer in terms of distinctive sonic character and the types of workflows it encourages. When I use MDUW I kind of like the fact it has certain limitations due to being an older piece of gear as it can help focus and streamline the production process
I own both. While I definitely enjoy the tone of the RYTM, you did a great job showing the increased flexibility possible with the MD. There are two things I wish I could magically pull from the RYTM over to the MD... The ability to Reload Tracks and Patterns, as well as the TRIG MUTES. These are two very highly useful live-performance and improvisation features, and were actually two of the main reasons I picked up the RYTM.
thank you, have enjoyed many of your videos! The Rytm definitely has the performance edge on the MD - I was not aware of the ability to re-load tracks or patterns, that's very useful!
I think this video is perhaps less about Rytm vs MD per se and more of a plea to Elektron to re-examine what makes a box like the Machinedrum have 'special sauce'. Essentially, I'd love to see an uncompromisingly deep 'modular system/sampler instrument in a box' with plenty of audio i/o and CV i/o done properly Elektron-style - which is where they seemed to be going, but then tons of people were like 'wtf is this Octatrack thing, it's weird, too complex, and I think it sounds crap anyway' . . . then the analog series and digi series came out, which are all fantastic and sound great, but their appearance established a clear new direction for Elektron design away from the older and more modular designs. Probably my best bet is for a legit Octatrack re-design, but even there chances seem rather slim and I'm not holding my breath!
@@maxmarco While I'd love to see why you describe too, I think it ultimately would be too complex (and potentially obscure) for the majority of people. I love the Octatrack probably more than most, but it's greatest strength (flexibility) is also it's biggest hindrance. Because it's capable of doing so many things, it must be carefully configured, and moving between these configurations is often very disorienting (this coming from having the OT since 2012). If anything, the Digitakt is their redesign of the OT. It takes what probably 80% of people end up using an Octatrack for and strips away all the details that get in the way, and then refined the physical interface to match.
The digitakt certainly appears to have been very successful! Hopefully Elektron will surprise me, but it seems the writing is on the wall for my favorite Elektron designs - I've even got a Monomachine on the way now, so maybe I can eventually whine about that one needing an update too! hah!
... man, that track / improvisation at the end ...... oh my
thanks so much!! that jam is definitely very gnarly and I had a blast recording it, I ended up publishing the very first take!
I just bought a MD waiting for it to get shipped now! I was on the fence between the two but it was the wider array of synth options to make me grab the MD. That said I reeeeeeaally wish the machinedrum had the sequencing power the RYTM does. Maybe they'll make an mk3 one day!
we can hope! people seem to be valuing the points I made here... maybe Elektron will eventually take note! For me the LFOs on the MD make up a lot for its sequencing limitations - part of why it makes me feel like using a modular synth, which prior to all these fancy software sequencers now, you would generally be using pretty simple stuff in terms of sequencing, but combining it in a way that's quite novel and exciting, with a lot of possibilities for modulation and interaction between signals
Rytm now has 8 MIDI sequence channels. Granted it's only note/velocity and monophonic, but that's huge. Also, Overbridge. I mean, come on. This thing has its own sound card, and now that OB 2.0 is out to the public, you can record all 12 channels with class-compliant USB audio, and it has its own DAW plugin with real-time control, MIDI CC automation, and sample management. I've had zero latency issues with OB 2.0, and I can record studio-quality multi-track recording without ANY 1/4 inch cables coming out of the device. I just have MIDI DIN for sync (although that can be routed via USB with DAW sync too) and USB for all 12 tracks, plus an FX/master channel. Done. I jam straight into my computer now with my A4, DT, Heat and Rytm. I have no interest in OT, MD, or MM because they don't offer this and once you use it, you don't want to go back.
From a tone perspective, the Rytm has INSANE amounts of headroom, overdrive, distortion, and low end. Eats the Machinedrum for breakfast in pure bass drum balls. Only machine I'm not fond of is the snare, I usually use a sample for the snare channel, because the sweet spot of snare on the analog engine is lacking.
I just bought a rytm mk1 I had the option of an MD (not uw) and the overbridge sold me. Even if I regret a bit the opportunity of having an MD.
I like the idea of using samples on each track and just complimenting them with the analog engine, making each track real complex.
Oh, and POLYRHYTHMS
Got both, love both. ofc the MD is way more capable synth-wise, the extra sequencing features of the rythm weigh a lot in comparison.
so: both.
lonely island machine: MD ;-)
lately the killer feature of MD that I've been messing with a lot is its ability to extensively process external signals, and to feedback outputs to inputs to give extra processing stages for internally generated sounds, seems odd the Rytm (and Digis) is so limited in this respect - in comparison the A4 is much more capable at external signal processing
I have only just recently heard of the MD... this video was super informative and you’re hilarious. Being new to hardware synths but very ambitious for my future DAW-less live and rehearsal setup, I was struggling between the various options currently out there. The TR-8S seems fun and approachable in terms of playback but doesn’t offer much in terms of actual synthesis. It also feels like more of a DJ performance tool than for composition. The RYTM feels like overkill in terms of playback features and and yet is more limited in terms of how many machines you can choose from and doesn’t sample in stereo. It’s also expensive as hell. The DrumBrute is even more limited, and the 808/909/TR-08/TR-09 and Behringer clones don’t offer much in terms of sound shaping either. Basically, after watching your video and stumbling upon a MD in the wild (on Instagram), I think I should save up for this.
One quick question: how do you think it would perform as a sound module? I have an external sequencer (Squarp Pyramid) I’m planning on using as the brain for my setup (Squarp, a mono, a poly, and now hopefully I’ll scoop up a MachineDrum).
thank you! Machinedrum is very versatile but it also has a distinctive sonic identity; some people love it, others not so much. It can certainly be used as a sound module, which can get around the sequencer limitations, but I prefer to use the internal sequencer and tend to approach it primarily as a standalone piece as I'm curious what's possible given its older design. The MDUW also samples down to mono; the only Elektron that can record and play back stereo samples is the Octatrack. Every Elektron box has a lot to offer as long as you're willing to spend the time and dig in
@@maxmarco Thanks a lot for the reply to my long-winded comment. Hop over to my channel if you ever wanna learn some Radiohead songs.
@@maxmarco I'm trying to decide between the one you have (UW+) and the UW and the non-UW versions. Can you help me understand this: how useful is the 2.5MB sample memory? Seems like the sound sculpting the MD's got onboard is more than capable of infinite possibilities and that 2.5MB gives you the possibility of sampling about.... a few 16-bit or 24-bit sounds, like less than ten one shot (let's say snare or a high hat) samples, right? Is the mindset more like "samples can get crazy after that so I don't need more memory?" Similar to your musical journey, I am coming from Ableton and playing acoustic instruments, so I have zero concept of working with limits on sample memory.
2.5MB is pretty small, easy to use it up on some one-shots and a handful of loops. UW+ is nice regardless though because you get +Drive snapshots, which are more or less equivalent to project files on later Elektron devices. Everyone uses gear differently (and the way I want to use gear changes over time) but personally I've only ever pre-loaded a handful of samples to the MDUW - what's much more interesting to me is the MDUW mk2 ability to 'live' re-sample and play back from the 'live' re-sampling buffers, in essentially the same way that it is possible on the Octatrack - I often use the sampling feature to re-sample the Machinedrum itself, or to live sample an external device. Also be aware that the MDUW audio input/output is 24-bit, so processing a live signal with the Machinedrum input machines happens at full quality, whereas samples are played back at 12-bit.
Hej, this video is really helpful for my decision which one to buy. What do you think, how dangerous is it to buy a used machindrum? I ve got no idea about how long such devices "survive"
I have both and I love the RYTM for what it is but the Machinedrum still reigns supreme it is easily the best modern day drum machine.
we need to start a petition for MDUW Mk3! hahaha
I imagine a MD mk3 will come out some day. I also imagine it won't have the same heart/soul as the original. Same for the Monomachine.
Hey Marco! Thanks formyour great and interesting uploads....I actually have new and OT MK2 and I would love to get the MD to there is one question like to ask you....can I go also with sp1 32step (with patten chains) or better to invest more money on the 64step version without UW, or really only the UW Version, I got one on hand, but it is very prized ;-) thanks in advance for your advice...cheers, Chris
Either way it's all good, the non-UW MD is very capable, much of what I demonstrate on MD does not use the UW features. The sampling does sound and respond very differently than the Octatrack (which is relatively transparent) so although there is functional overlap between OT and MDUW sampling (both offer real-time 'live' sampling) there are significant sonic differences. The sampling engine of the MDUW is very effective and powerful while still being rather primitive/crude, so some people don't care for it much - plenty of people out there are happy to pair OT with a non-UW MD. Personally I'm a big fan of the sound of the UW sampling, specifically because it is different than the OT, but it's not something I would use in every situation
Thx for your help and that you give a better understanding! Think will go with th UW ;-)
This is bloody great....! now i want one....or better MKIII...
haha! thank you!! looks like we have to wait for an MDUW mk3 at least until Elektron makes a grip of cash off their new 'digidrum' or whatever it's going to be :D (but tbh I don't foresee MD mk3 ever happening, hoping to be proven wrong)
I’ll likely be returning to this one in the future as it was rife with solid info and laughs, lmfao. #muchlove
I started on the Rytm mk1 closing in on two years ago. Picked up the A4 mk2 this spring and have now traded up for the control inputs on the Rytm mk2 (which unfortunately don’t work as they should yet (rofl), but I reported the bug and the devs have been notified).
I suppose the reasons I elected to go with the AR over the MD in the first place was:
1. The updated sequencer (independent track lengths/ trig conditions/ micro-timing/ sound locks/ direct change, etc.) would lead to a greater sense of liberty when programming more off-kilter/ odd-meter beats.
2. As I have a computer loaded with different forms of digital synthesis, I figured the analogue circuitry would give me something I didn’t already have. (this was my first hardware synth)
3. I was (/ still am, but less so) a heavy daw user, so the convenience afforded by OB seemed like an added bonus.
In retrospect, I’m still torn. I very frequently find myself lusting after the MDUW+ for all the reasons you mentioned, as well as others (no idea why you didn’t take this opportunity to rub our faces in the glory that are RAM recorder/ player machines ;).)
That said, I don’t see myself ever parting with the AR. The potential for expression in a performance context is just too immense (aftertouch/ scenes/ perf macros/ direct-change/ pattern pushing accents & trig mutes/ now control inputs), etc.
thanks much! really appreciate you sharing your thoughts! I kind of glossed over the real-time sampling aspect since it's such a huge subject, and I feel even the non-sampling Machinedrum punches well above its weight
re: limited sequencer, I'm actually enjoying this since it encourages me to exploit the machine in a different way, and if I really desire some complex sequencing I can do it via Octatrack or DAW - but I really haven't felt any need - there are still lots of solo MDUW experiments I want to try first! :)
I kinda left OB out of the discussion since that's such a seemingly sore point for a lot of people and isn't a feature I would use so I don't have any thoughts on it, other than I'd prefer Elektron put R&D into a MDUW mk3 instead xD
all those performance features are quite delicious, main reason it was hard for me to make a choice! with external controller(s) and/or careful setup there are a lot of performance control available with MDUW, but the abilities of the Rytm just slap you in the face the instant you touch it!
max marco no worries rofl; I just got done watching your probabilistic MD video and yeah - the stochastic approach looks like loads of fun. I’ve seen other videos doing similar things, but being able to see and follow how things are laid out in terms of menu-diving is really nice/ I’m not sure I knew about the shape mix on the lfo page. 😨
lmfao, I assure you; we are both on the same page as far as what we’d like to see R&D efforts allocated toward. - I’m just afraid that they’re getting too much commercial success from their smaller more immediate/ limited boxes, and thus won’t be as eager to sink the requisite time into developing something as deep as the silver boxes/ OT. 😔 Hopefully I’m wrong.
Seriously, these videos are CLASS. I’ll try and throw some analog series vids up at some point, soon. (Hopefully the devs will rectify the control inputs issue asap. #rip)
the LFO shape mix is amazing! it is such a basic feature but massively increases the possibilities - the 2ndary shapes are inversions of the primary ones and are very important and useful for additional envelope duties
the digi line is cool, just not really my thing - I actually did end up getting a Monomachine recently, hah! The analog series didn't quite fit what I was looking for - I've kind of ended up eyeballing the A4 harder than the Rytm, but I can't pick one because what I really want is to smash them together - similar with the digi instruments actually - I dream of a combo digitone/takt with even just one real-time recording buffer and record trig track...!
thanks much! hoping to get another Machinedrum vid out into the wild soon :)
:)
Just found your channel last week looking into the machinedrum and I really enjoy your music/jams! I got into Elektron not to long ago with the purchase of a Digitakt. And was excited to see my reasoning for selecting it was correct with Autechre releasing their machinedrum files as I’m an IDM, autechre fanboy.
I’d really like to get this if possible but I do have a question. I use a moog sub phatty and the Digitakt uses high resolution encoders which offers more steps for CC control which my sub phatty also uses high res control’s to avoid stepping. With the machinedrum, would there be noticible stepping in the audio of a synth being controlled by the machinedrum with it’s encoder knobs?
I hope they make a future MK3 since this really seems like featurewise to be a way more capable flagship. But thanks for your content and any advice.
hihi! thanks a lot!! afaik Machinedrum only supports 7-bit 0-127 CC values, both internally and when sending or receiving external MIDI. For myself exploiting/abusing/minimizing/avoiding parameter 'zippering' is just kind of part of the game, similar to being willing to accept the relatively limited sequencer on the MD in comparison to the more modern Elektrons. But speaking more broadly very few hardware MIDI devices/sequencers seamlessly support high-resolution MIDI, if at all, and Elektron in general doesn't really tend to support it (Octatrack has no capability for sending high resolution messages either).
@@maxmarco Max Hey, Thank You !! For the killer, in depth reply! I'm all for old, as well as new school approaches. So it's no downer to hear of new exploits! Part of my reason for interest in this, as well as learning about 16 assignable LFO's? The Octa does allow you to create your own LFO shape, which is pretty good, but I like that 12bit sampler, the 100+ synth engines, are they pretty limited, given they are for a specific precusive sound? Either way, good to know. So far as the resolution on the encoder knobs for the Digitakt I haven't noticed any stepping, from time to time it jumps, but I think that is b/c of how the knobs are programmed to respond to your initial force which drives the response speed and sometimes if you move fast enough it just jumps values. Thanks again, and great content! And thinking of your final description of it being a "modular system architected as a drum machine", pretty much hit's the nail on the head.
the MD 'machines' are generally pretty versatile although can be a mixed bag depending on your approach and goals. It's actually a big challenge of learning the MD to get properly familiar with all of the sound engines. I'm always learning new aspects to the ones I've tended to use more, and every now and then I can get great results out of ones I haven't clicked with previously - all of the options for processing the sounds from the synth engines can make figuring them out rather tricky - not too many of the synth engines sound that great 'right away' to me, and there is quite a lot of tweaking to do for processing the sounds to get them closer to where I want them. Not quite 100+ sound engines though, even adding in the machines that don't make any sound! hah! just a good bit more than Rytm has :D
the digi and mk2 lineups all have what I've seen referred to as 'sin/cos' pots or smth like that - my crude understanding is that it's basically a pot that can be used to mimic an encoder. Mk1 Octatrack and Machinedrum/Monomachine have old-school encoders so have a bit different feel
really appreciate it! thanks for checking out my videos! 👍
Made me think. Thanks!
awesome! thanks for watching! Either one is a great choice, I am just more inspired by the MD - been experimenting with it a bunch lately and plan to make some videos on some of the techniques I've been discovering. It's tough because I keep discovering new little twists and ways of doing things - like I was about to make a video on how to do probabilistic triggers with MDUW using the sampling features but then I figured out a completely different way that doesn't use the sampling features at all, and would even work on mk1 units!
Do you think its important to get an UW Version when combined with an OT? And when operating standalone? thx
@@maxmarco Ok, but do you think the sampling possibility is essential to your workflow? I love sampling and resampling on OT but i cant figure out if its that useful on MD, since there are not a lot of good videos out there. Looking at this machine from the "outside" makes me feel like its more of a really nice drumsynth than a sampler... i love my lxr as well, and never used the option of loading samples. But if i invest in a MD to make a step (production-wise and music experimantal wise) i want to make sure the money is spend well...
ANTWORTEN
Probably i can answer myself... Get the fucking the whole thing. It will be good to you, and it will love you to the end! So spend more money... ok thanks, me ! :)
the primary unique selling proposition of the sampling on MDUW is the 'character' and also that the sampling features squeeze even more synth-sound variety via the use of single-cycle waves - so even if you don't like the sampling for playing back low-fidelity one-shots or short loops you may still think it makes for awesome synth sounds and sound design possibilities (trigger relate feature for layering a sample-based sound with a drum synth sound for example)
Sampling and re-sampling on the MD is very similar to Octatrack but will lead you down a very different path sonically due to the lo-fi nature of the sampling. This aspect is very fascinating to me, others may not care for it - I think my two companion 'ambient' pieces for Machinedrum illustrate how the sampling can take very simple inputs and transform them quite extensively - although the 'remix' piece is certainly not representative of even a fraction of the re-sampling possibilities
being able to record directly into a sampler is an important requirement for me, although it's a bit tedious to save the real-time samples recorded into MDUW, I don't bother to save them most of the time, and I typically use octatrack the same way, usually I'm just letting real-time record buffers disappear on power-down
non-UW Machinedrum is still an awesome instrument though, but one will need to be more creative to squeeze quality synth leads and basses out of it, and working with loops inside MDUW is also very fulfilling and I would miss that a lot - the voice architecture of MD combined with primitive Octatrack real-time sampling abilities is pretty special
I am actually very excited about possibilities with MDUW + Octatrack, where they are able to sequence and process and re-sample each other, but that is a lot of time to invest exploring many new possibilities, and for now when I use MDUW I focus on it standalone to see what is possible
not sure if that helps! I really feel UW brings things to a new level, but I could also see someone not caring for the sampling characteristics at all and being perfectly happy with non-UW MD, especially when paired with Octatrack
Cool vid.
Do a op1 field review, please.
I have both. The MD KILLS THE RYTM. Love all elektrons tho
where are you? marco we are missing your content and views on the elektroneworld
I’m on my 3rd/4th MD, but I’ve had two RYTMs. The Machinedrum is my holy grail instrument. Just a beautiful and very exploratory instrument that always has a million different methods from any given state- the RYTM I’ve rarely loved the way I’ve loved the MD
fantastic insight and very eloquent! thank you for sharing! Sitting down with my MD is a lot like sitting down at my modular system, and feels very adventurous - I didn't feel that way with Rytm, although it was certainly a sick groovebox
I’ve never really poked around with the LFO potential of the MD. As I was playing around with one of my FM kits i thought of your description of the MD as a modular system in a box and decided to see how surface level intricate this this thing can get.
Absolutely beautiful- thank you for enlightening me to a new world for this machine.
Making my favorite piece of gear more favoriter
that's really awesome, and exactly what I'm talking about! I freaking love the LFOs on MD, they are really simple but incredibly powerful - having two shapes to mix between is a rather huge feature, and I assume adds very little to CPU load - I really wish other Elektrons had multi-shape LFOs. One thing that would really make a design like MD even more modular is if you could send a single LFO to more than one destination - even without adding any more LFOs that would explode the possibilities of the mod matrix in an incredible way (now I'm going to go and dream of a modern MDUW mk3...)
the FM machines tend to have a lot of parameters that modulate nicely... I need to dig into them more
max marco I’m right there with you on the mk3 dreaming. It’s one of the things that would make me not mind current gear depreciating in value.
maybe I'm imagining things, but I haven't been seeing too many MDUWs for sale out there, Reverb right now has a bunch of regular Machinedrum listings, and the only UW is listed at $1900? wtf? LOL
4:06 RYTM has MIDI sequencing now. The Machinedrum is probably way more advanced now though, because it has 16 potential tracks of sequencing.
Thanks for this very informative vid! I have a couple of questions: 1) is there any way to visually distinguish a UW vs a non UW model? 2) Can you possibly suggest some reasons to own one of these wonderful machines in addition to an OT. I have the OT but I’m wondering if I should get one of these to compliment the OT. Thanks for your help!
thanks for watching! UW vs regular MD is very easy to distinguish visually - regular MD Is black border all the way around the screen, MDUW screen border the bottom half is white. There is also a mk1 UW that can only play back samples that you load in and does not have the real-time sampling RAM machines like mk2 MDUW
The MDUW is an idiosyncratic instrument in sound and function, and despite a very powerful and open design it can be a bit limited in certain ways so I think you have to be willing to embrace it for what it is. That being said I think it's a perfect companion to the Octatrack, as it easily covers standard drum machine duties (what I see as a primary weakness of the Octatrack) with plenty of functions and features to spare, and the ability to interact with the Octatrack in a variety of ways via MIDI and audio - using the OT to sequence and modulate the MD also makes up for many of the limitations of the older MD sequencer. The sonic character of the MDUW sampling is also very distinct from the OT and the simplicity of the implementation encourages different results
👍🏽 Great info! Thanks so much for publishing these videos and taking the time to respond to comments and questions. I really appreciate it.
One last thing, I happened to notice in a few of your videos you have a book arbitrarily present. Are these meant as subliminal suggestions?
my pleasure! hah! I'd call them 'overt communications' rather than 'subliminal messages' - they are personally meaningful books that are always carefully selected for both visual composition and their symbolic messaging as it relates to the emotional and narrative content of the music - it's part of the fun for me to set up a scene for a musical piece to exist within, to give it a larger context, and not merely to document a performance. However, I prefer to leave it as an exercise for the curious viewer to decode these messages and how they relate to the music, and also once I publish something I'm far less interested in what I think about it than the raw impressions it generates in others based on the artistic choices I have made.
on a practical level I also have found thoughtfully chosen props to be very helpful for getting into a performance mindset that contributes to quality recordings, providing a clear demarcation between composition/production and recording/performance. There is almost always some level of improvisation to my performances and the setting seems to influence my decisions, so I find it's very important that I choose set pieces and framing that is congruent with what I want the production to communicate. I always spend much more time setting up the shots than I do actually recording takes :D
max marco , yeah I guess that is more accurate - calling the choice of books, and placement, overt communications. I can tell you that as an avid reader I really enjoy good suggestions, “communications.” I consider myself a visual artist with photography as my medium so I appreciate your thoughtful setups.
quite some time ago I was primarily focused on visual art, but with only a smattering of video production, so recently as I develop my 'video vocabulary' it is very interesting to see what ways I can use the format to hopefully increase the impact of my work and provide a richer presentation - thanks very much for asking about this aspect, gives me a chance to blab on for a bit! haha! :) :) :)
Great video. Does the MD + OT together maintain the same functionality as the UW? It seems like OT has more features for cutting up samples than machinedrum UW resampling but I've never used one of these boxes yet.
thank you! the OT has infinitely more features for sampling, and is quite a bit more modern design overall, but the 'character' of the MDUW 12-bit sampling is very distinctive (I really like how the pitch-shifting sounds), and the voice architecture/FX/overall layout encourages quite different results. I feel the MDUW design has just enough of all the really cool features of the OT sampling, and mixing that into an already amazing drum machine makes for a very special instrument; an MDUW + OT has some similarities to pairing a couple Octatracks, but with the extra special sauce of MDUW 12-bit :D
regular Machinedrum is still awesome though, there are some users that don't care for the UW sampling and are happy with a regular MD + OT
@@maxmarco UW is only a hundred bucks more on reverb 🤔 I'm really shooting for that untilted-era autechre sound, I think you swayed me into spending a little extra haha
it's definitely worth it! the autechre sysex that got out there recently does utilize the sampling features of MDUW afaik
@@maxmarco is the machinedrum sps 1 dsp uw mk2 the right one, you made me really want to have it, but one thing, is the sound of the machinedrum better /worse than the rytm, I need a machine for solid drums
the uw+ mk2 is the fanciest version - +drive is generally not essential but it is very convenient extra feature (uw mk2 does not have +drive)
either machine does great drums - I think both of them sound very good but they are quite different in character despite a fair bit of overlap. To me MDUW is much more old-school/dirty and has a retro-futuristic kind of feel whereas the Rytm is more of a modern sound, clean but with some warmth
Have both, debating selling Analog Rytm MK2, just from a standpoint of it sitting and not being used as much. Maybe money better spent on an MPC or something. (I also have OT Mk-1, A4 Mk2, MnM).
Wow, didn't really knew that DM is that powerfull!
But prices are off the charts atm, and it's hard to find it as well
Hopefully they will make mk3 but can you suggest something similar for digital percusions mostly, that uses similar engines?
yeah when I bought my MD before I made this video the prices were more reasonable and I got a good deal, not sure what I'd be willing to pay now if I needed/wanted another one. It has a unique sound, I would probably go software and just use reaktor or max/msp if I wanted to try to emulate it
LOL This video is great man! Had me rolling! :D
haha! awesome! thanks dude! This vid is really about how I'm a concerned and distraught old-school Elektron fanboy... 😂
@@maxmarco Love my MD man. Watching your videos looks like you have got super deep with it! had no idea about midi loopbacking what?!
I still have tons to learn about MD! Definitely want to make more info and technique vids as I learn new tricks and quirks
Supper useful ...I am debating btn adding AR or selling MD.
Btn you and Loopoppa one can gain so much more about gears, synthesis, and professional level education. Are a professional musician, engineer, educator ? just curious how you processed understand gear architecture and synthesis.
thank you! to provide some perspective I wrote my first note on a blank sheet of staff paper about 20 years ago and bought my first audio interface more than 15 years ago. I do have some formal education in music, audio engineering, and computer science but mostly I'd say my (somewhat limited) knowledge comes from lots of reading/thinking/meditating combined with lots of practical application and experimentation. To be honest I probably learned the most simply from getting into modular gear and music electronics DIY
I always say to just buy/keep whatever pieces of gear you think look/sound the coolest and are most likely to actually use 👍
@@maxmarco I just noticed that I had already express my compliments on this same session :)
your experience, discipline, disposition etc...make you the ideal tutor, educator etc...true one can go with intuition but has it's limits:) so, yeah, many thank you and good health to you.
Could you tell me please diffrence between MD sps-1 mk1 and UW mk2???
Made me def not want any other Elektron gear. Gonna wait to find one of these
fuk, this video makes me want to sell my Analog Rytm and only own a Machine Drum. And i melted inside when you spoke of the sampling system
Hi Marco, here am I. I already bought the MkII 'cause of your video.
Now, I owned it for one year, and thanks to you and other people I learned what wasn't inside the box. You know what I mean. for instance the very passage from classic/extended and viceversa.
I was wondering if it made any sense buying an Octatrack, given the fact that I don't have the UW version on the mKII.
Having said that, I want to produce only by sampling, arranging, playing with OT and MD.
Do you think it's a good idea? Because I can't decide whether to buy the A4 or the OT.
My setup is recording oriented, not live performance.
I wanted to hear your advice, given the fact that every time I have to buy electronic equipment, I always end up watching your vids.
Thanks for you reply,
Michael from Italy :)
hi Michael! A4 and OT are very different boxes - sounds like you want sampling, which makes the choice obvious, but if you want analog synth voices the OT obviously isn't going to take you very far. Speaking in absolute terms I would say there are much more possibilities with OT+MD than A4+MD but any two Elektron boxes make a great pair and in the long run it's less about total capabilities and more about whether the instruments you choose go well with your personality and tastes. Good luck! no wrong choices really 👍👍👍
Would love to hear it together with a syncussion
the thing im missing the most on the MD is a full ADSR envelope and a filter envelope, i know u can do it with LFOs but pita
Hello Max thanks for your work !! I had a Rytm in my setup i liked it but it had to go 2 times in sweden in 18months !! I liked everything of it but for me the tanzbar that i had was a little bit more organic but we cannot compare the sequenceur elektron rules !! i had to sell my setup because i moved location and i'll start it again tomorrow with machinedrum mk2 for now i took a volca kick for kicks and another for bass (sub) for a start (minitaur will come perhaps instead of the volca) then in a few months i'll had a tanzmauss (another analo kick analo clap snare and gritty hh 12bit) and an octa that will be in charge of the tanz and more to come (P08).One question the sampling processor for uw in 12 bit it's really cool but i thought elektron putted something in the octa to change the rate for playing samples like instead of 24bit processor you can choose to play them processed in 12bit... Thanks Marco keep going your work and i'll wait for you to make me into the monomachine ,)
hihi! thank you! not sure you can even load 12-bit samples to OT and have them play back (OT wants to see 16-bit or 24-bit files), but on the Octatrack there is a 'rate' control that you can use to degrade the sound without changing pitch if you have timestretch on - if you have timestretch off the rate control will just lower the pitch and slow down the playback (like a tape machine). The OT also has a lo-fi effect that has bit-rate reduction built into it - lots of different ways to degrade samples on OT but none of it sounds quite like what MDUW does with samples
@@maxmarco Cheers mate thanks for the light
This overview is great! 312, pilsen reprazent
hah, awesome! I haven't made it down that way in a bit. Thanks for the appreciation! Definitely planning to make more opinion/info vids like this one, it is a good format, just takes a lot of production resources
If you ever head to Austin - you have to check out Switched On, a really well set-up synth store.
Those guys back there are so silent about how genius they are, it's just scary. biggest church in Austin.
I definitely would check it out given the chance - I know I've ordered from them at least once - back when I was acquiring more eurorack I made sure to spread the love around, heh :)
This is great! MD all the way..
Can the machinedrum also handle modular levels?
The sequencer is more feature rich on the Rytm. Trig conditions, microtiming, length per track, chromatic mode and copying patterns on the fly are all great features not on the MD. The sound engine element is what I feel is lacking on the Rytm. The lower 4 engines have a lot of capabilites, but the tom engines are very lackluster. Also the cymbal being shared with the cowbell is a letdown since that is that is one of the more interesting engines. It's really too bad Elektron didn't go for a MD 2 with all the classic engines upgraded, maybe one more set of engines and all the modern sequencing features.
what I want even more than fancier sequencer for Machinedrum would be scenes, I love scenes on Octatrack - I'm always abusing classic/extended switching as a very simple 'scene' functionality on MD
Without midi, what use is it in a modern recording setup... not much
You are obviously horribly biased, but in the end I agree with you. I wouldn't swap my MD for an AR. Its just a more interesting and versatile machine.
biased? me? never!!! :D
You have to be bias if you have to pick one among....
so...I play live with Reaktor. I needed a new soundcard...the Rytm 1 became my soundcard with overbridge.(I also got an Analog Keys for the same reason if i want to take keys out to a show)..the idea being if something goes wrong with my computer i can just press play on rytm and jam out while I get the computer sorted again.
Rytm is really fun. The sound of the samples are really meaty with the analog processing. the compressor is really nice. pinging the filter with impulse is great. The chromatic mode is super useful to me while handing samples for sequencing. I Don't use the analog engine as much (its not really within my style of music) but I like to know that i have it just in case I Wanted to experiment but i do enjoy using it for making bass sounds and basslines.
things that suck:
-the velocity scaling on the pads is horrible...the only pads that are close to as bad with how they handle velocity would be the ones on my novation remote sl
-I couldn't find a way to control the level of the input. I believe there is none... this blows.
-it really needs more LFOs. (I might get an octatrack for this reason.)
-lack of midi...even one midi channel
thank you for your comments! Rytm does sound very good overall, no complaints there, and proper chromatic mode for samples is definitely one clear advantage Rytm has I tend to overlook a bit. MDUW is definitely not user-friendly in that aspect - MDUW design assumes relatively non-tonal usage
that's pretty crazy if there's no way to adjust input level - OT, MD, MNM all have lots of controls to adjust various types of inputs, whether that's an input to a machine or the external audio input
I haven't had a chance to use a mk1 unit but I've never heard/read good things about their pads. The mk2 unit I demo'ed seemed to have really nice pads though
Limited modulation options and lack of MIDI sequencing are probably the top two things that kept me away from the Rytm - it's a very powerful groovebox for performance but the design seems to encourage stand-alone use or to just have it sync'ed up in a very basic way to other gear. In comparison MDUW can be the brain unit of a complex setup, and can interact with the other gear in a variety of ways - the real-time sampling and 'record trig' features play into this quite substantially, giving it the capabilities of a primitive Octatrack
thanks again for sharing your thoughts, really appreciate it!
@@maxmarco i haven't messed with this input side of it too much but i believe the input is routed directly into the master effects aswell (compressor etc) which isn't ideal if you want some flexibility.
the compressor is GREAT though. incredibly small sweet spot with the settings but almost SSL bus compression like sound. there is also a gain stage after it that has a really nice saturation.
Overbridge makes it a really good soundcard in my setup..very happy with the 1.x versions. Analog keys is great on that end too.
I'm a big fan of my Analog Heat and when I demo'ed the Rytm I heard a bit of that sonic aesthetic to it, was definitely a very attractive aspect to the sound. What do you think of the sound of the reverb on the Rytm? That's kind of the main thing I like better on MD sonically - the reverb is old school and crunchy lo-fi while the Rytm had a very modern sounding reverb to me, kind of 'shiny' - vaguely similar to how OT dark reverb can sound sometimes but much cleaner/brighter and it wouldn't overload as easily
@@maxmarco I have no experience with the OT's verb algoritms...however i'm a bit of a reverb nerd. I find standard Elektron verb algorithms underwhelming specifically with how the parameters are tuned.
the AR's verb is very similar to my AK's verb in "size".. the AK's is grainier and deader and less forgiving. the AR's is sweeter and more forgiving with a it more life (think puffy cloud instead of sandstorm).
really curious to try the OT for this reason (i plan on getting one soon)
from your description it sounds like perhaps the AK has a reverb more similar to the OT than the AR. The OT plate and dark reverbs can do a decent job, but to me the parameters are calibrated primarily for variety/power/flexibility and not really at all for ease of use - in the long run I have come to prefer this aspect though. However, the spring reverb is a special case and I can't say I've developed much of a love or use for it yet :D
I really like the oldschool reverb on the Machinedrum and Monomachine, which bear a similarity to the plate reverb on the OT, but I tend to like the MD/MNM version better, and the plate reverb on the OT doesn't have a pre-delay (although you could presumably hack one, been meaning to try that)
WTF backing music what a trip mate
7:20 haha the main reason i bought the Rytm.
Ow yeah and it also has velocity sensitive pads.
and analogue sound
Ahhh very nice dude. Long LIVE the SPS-1 UW! I have to save the MD gets away with all this because it's Digital, like the Octa. The Rytm stands alone because it's true Elektron Analog. The latest firmware adds Synth tones which sound not bad at all. Plus, one thing I found out on my own is with conditional triggs u can go from drum/synth to sample on triggs in a track. My mind was blown when I did it.
thanks man! I love all the Elektron boxes really. The Rytm sounds great, and I certainly value analog gear (got plenty of it in my modular cases), it's just a theme has emerged with all the releases post-Octatrack where the modularity and overall featureset of the designs seem to be a bit unnecessarily sacrificed at the altar of 'immediacy' or 'easier to learn'. It makes a lot of sense for the 'digi' series, but much less so with flagship products like the Rytm - seems odd to leave out things like a bit of MIDI sequencing or BPM in song mode for example. At this point I've seen little from elektron to indicate they plan a truly legitimate update/upgrade to the Octatrack, and it would seem MD has been thoroughly supplanted by Rytm. But Elektron is usually pretty tight-lipped so what do I know? haha
I'm thinking I need to make another opinion/info video on Elektron products that digs deeper into these thoughts - an in-depth discussion and comparison of Machinedrum UW and Octatrack, the two boxes I consider the most 'modular' of the Elektrons (if Monomachine had a sampler it would probably win) might be a good way to touch on some of these things
@@maxmarco ya I hear u. It seems Elektron has appealed to the bandwagon lol. When the Rytm first dropped I wasn't feeling it even when the Digitone did to. I feel the Octa was a big update to the MD...a step into more Sample. I mean a new update wouldn't had helped the MD. They had to start fresh and 8 track was a new old skool step forward which the Octa still can't be touched to this day on many levels. Just image back in 1998 when the MD dropped... pretty amazing!
Ohh and it's clear Semi-Modular Synths are the future. I sure hope Elektron feels the same.
I thought Rytm was pretty cool but it just couldn't quench my thirst for an MDUW. I think updated MDUW mk3 with new sequencer features of Octa/Rytm and also the performance features (pads, scenes, fader, etc.) and lotta sample storage/RAM would be pretty amazing. Octatrack is definitely directly derived from MD, they even mention that in the intro of OT manual. Overall Octatrack is my top pick for Elektron device, but MD has certain special charm and absurdly deep features - a proper update would probably make it my top choice, and even as-is it has certain advantages over the more modern devices. Maybe if I whine loud enough Elektron will eventually hear me, LOL!
a true semi-modular done properly Elektron could be extremely compelling - my dream Elektron is something like an Analog/Octa/MD with a bunch of audio and CV i/o
Thank you for the video! Always great to watch wise opinion. For me, personal, I didnt like the MD - it has cold character, wierd filters, and spooky shuffle time. Its not fun to play with it because the sound of the machine always pushing you to do minimal stuff. And price is just to high -I dont see reasons to pay 800 euro or more for this, its better to buy okta.
I just wonder is it silly to expect a monomachine 3 or MD 3? I just don’t see it happening :(
certainly doesn't seem likely but if the market speaks loudly enough I'd have a hard time believing they wouldn't listen - personally I'm not so much looking for a mk3 MD/MNM/OT - I'm much more interested in a brand-new forward-thinking digital flagship design in the spirit of the original boxes that doesn't sacrifice any of the depth
max marco now THAT sounds like a machine! just getting starting in the elektron world myself, hoping they take an approach like you’re saying in the future releases.
@@maxmarco this 100%. Part of me thinks that if they did make a new Md it would be more expensive than ar. It would it be sweet if it was formatted to Digi size
Great job here Max. Elektron would do well to check out this video. I wonder if they could make a Machinedrum sps-1uw+ with some analog features? I wonder if the box would be big enough? But, last, and most importantly, I'm really glad I've held onto my MD... I bought it about 8 1/2 years ago; I love making music with it, and it continues to humble me.... More like a guitar than a "beat-box" that way, if you follow? Thanks!
thanks a lot man!! Would be pretty funny if Elektron ever does contact me! :D Machinedrum is definitely a real-deal instrument, and that focus on making instruments that handily transcend the medium of sequenced-synth/sampler seems to be diminishing. I want a sweet groovebox, but I also want something that encourages me to go in fundamentally new and often unexpected directions in order to attempt squeezing out the most interesting and tantalizing possibilities. I want an electronic musical instrument designed in such a way that the users can easily surprise the creators with what is even possible.
@@maxmarco they are definitely aware... don't expect an email though. On the topic. I've had a couple of MD's the very first and the MK2 + i've enjoyed them but moved on. I have two elektron boxes left, MnM and OT mk1. The OT sit's in a box somewhere but i use the MnM all the time - to me the classic Elektron device.
With the direction Elektron has been heading in I doubt they'd be interested in my perspective anyhow, and at this point I'm simply not paying any more attention to their new offerings than I would from any other company. I bought my first Elektron as a companion for my modular synth gear and the MNM, MD, and OT are basically modular-lite whereas all the newer designs show an increasing trend towards significantly less modularity/flexibility and are not nearly interesting to me. If I just want the usual synths, samplers, and drum machines there are plenty of companies that make those, and for the far out stuff there are oodles of esoteric designs in eurorack.
It's unfortunate they show no signs they want to continue occupying that space in the middle of those somewhat competing interests. However, given the continued expansion of the electronic music hardware market it seems to me we're on the cusp of more than a few manufacturers trying their luck in the quasi-modular groovebox arena. For example, although in a somewhat different space I was surprised to see the Zoia come out and be apparently rather well-received - it's quite literally a digital modular synth in pedal format!
I had three faulty ARs on the trot. And there was a software bug that never got fixed. My MD was awesome CTRLALL!
that's a bummer! was definitely a concern of mine I might get a faulty AR but I don't think it really played much into my ultimate purchasing decision, Machinedrum UW was just too irresistible :D
no competition!
To compare the two on the surface, the Machinedrum's user interface seems restrictive. Obviously it's super dope to have all that HxC flexibility when it comes to modding and arranging a performance, but the devil is really in the details on this one. I feel like the Rytm's pads and Qperf functions provides more opportunity for spontaneous inspiration, especially when I'm playing with multiple pieces of gear. I can jam live with my drums in one hand and a synth in the other all without a clock running.
On another note, the Machinedrum's physical appearance is fucking sweet. Especially compared to the MK1 products that succeeded it.
A4 and AR have tempted me many times, would love to graft those new features onto the silver boxes!! big fan of Machinedrum and Monomachine aesthetics here 👍👍
@@maxmarco especially mono machine interface design with that beautiful silverfish plate...a well designed and attractive mono machine....Love MD's design.
and then, there is X0.5. MachineDrum just woke up.
Thanks for in-depth comparison. Would be even better if you showed some audio examples instead just talking about it... anyhow: I have em both: loving them both for different reasons. I don't think Rythm was there to compete with Machinedrum. It's like comparing Toyota Tundra with ... Tesla car? Just different cars (machines) aimed for different needs. I personally did not expect sound design/synth capabilities of Machinedrum on Rytm, I just wanted that analogue sound. And I am so happy AnalogueRytm doesn't have it all because I would have no need for Machinedrum.. Machinedrum is awesome, and sounds awesome, but has that crunchy 10-bit sound, a very different then analogue and arguably not always needed/desirable. If AnalogueRytm was doing exactly the same as Machinedrum (plus analogue), it would be called Machinedrum MK3.... and the old Machinedrums would not be as valuable. Bass/kicks on Analogue rytm, the fateness and silkiness is not found in Machinedrum. the same goes for AnalogueRytm: it doesn't have that lo-fi, gritty, metallic, cyberpunky glass-breaking sound of the Machinedrum. ... they are different beasts. Now I'm looking into Cycles.. looks cool too.
i need to go to chicago synth city since i live like half an hour away or so
I don't think I took much of that in cos I was looking at your pythons the whole time 😆
I own both, and I think people who prefer the Rytm may be chasing organic, analog source material. If someone could reverse-engineer the Machinedrum and make a VST of it, the Machinedrum would effectively be destroyed. Whereas the Analog Rytm can hold its charm eternally, without imitation.
The only thing to destroy the value of the Rytm was the Rytm (mk2). It's a shame to see my Rytm selling for nothing now, because everyone is after the Mk2. (Companies should just make their hardware right the first time and not make these Mk2 versions. Take a look at the Tempest... still going strong.)
Worse yet, i got the Rytm MK2 cheap, because people prefer to have the black version now. I like the gray so i am happy :-)
Do you think there would ever be an updated version of the MD?
If they do a legitimate no-compromises update I'd be very surprised. I would be slightly less surprised to see a 'spiritual successor' that attempts to cash in on the basic idea/name and isn't really the same thing as a Machinedrum at all, but that also seems extraordinarily unlikely. I'm not even sure how keen they are on producing a new legitimate flagship of any kind; A4 and AR are relatively old designs now and were not quite on the same level as the previous boxes in terms of acting as studio centerpieces and most likely we'll be seeing another model:something coming up next
Got a new one in it s box and the Turbo Midi not selling it!!!
Why choose? I've got both! :D
hahah! in a perfect world, with infinite time, definitely! My last purchase was actually a Monomachine so I'm sure that will keep me occupied for at least a little while :D
one friend sold his Rytm to buy a Machinedrum again. (They've added MIDI out and BPM via firmware update) I just don't need another digital machine
Yeah, main reason I don't have a Rytm is I already have a bunch of other stuff - my modular gear can easily make for a crazy analog drum machine. If AR and A4 designs were combined into a single box that might be enough to sway me though...
afaik the BPM is stored per-pattern and still is not available in the song mode? Personally I prefer a global BPM setting instead of per-pattern, but maybe you can leave the BPM of a pattern 'empty'? The MIDI out is a nice addition but seems to have gotten quite a bit overhyped since it's fairly limited - no CCs or program change messages
What about digitakt vs machinedrum?
it's a nice design but off the top of my head Digitakt has no record trigs, no kits, no song mode, LFOs are not freely routable (putting aside MIDI loopback), no input machines and afaik can't send audio input through its reverb/delay. In some ways it's more spiritually/conceptually similar to MD than Rytm is though, and appears to be a rather good MIDI sequencer, other than a lack of song mode.
@@maxmarco record trigs? You mean you can save them in MD or automate them?
Machinedrum...Underdog?! No way!!!
hahahah! just softening the blow for Rytm owners that haven't experienced the exquisite joy of Machinedrum :D
Great love letter to this wonderful instrument! I fear the MD has spoiled other drum machines for me for good. Nothing even comes close to what it can do and its probably the last piece of gear I would ever let go. Don't know if I would need a MKIII, an update fixing some bugs would be fine for sure. (although I read there isn't any more memory left to do major updates - opening up the source code would be dope tho!)
thank you! tbh I'm not so much interested in a mk3 MD/OT/MNM but rather a new flagship design that has the same modular spirit of those old boxes and doesn't sacrifice any complexity or depth. Fixing some of the MD bugs would definitely be very nice though but I doubt it will happen :(
I'm taking mine with me to the grave
that's how I feel - an updated mk3 machinedrum even if it turned out amazing would probably lack some of that delicious special sauce! still holding out hope for a mk3 though :) :) :)
This video makes me happy that I exchanged my Rytm MKII for the MPC Live. It was a glitch mess and those finger pads are not meant to finger drummers. It felt like I was hitting a Boss pedal footswitch
hah! mpc live is quite a bit different device! :D getting pads right is tricky - akai seems to be pretty good at it. The Rytm mk2 I demo'ed in store had nice pads but I've seen enough complaints from people to know that's not the case on every unit, and even the mk1 rytm had issues with the pads