THANK YOU CS2! - Your GPU finally gives you frames
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- Опубліковано 14 тра 2024
- I did a framerate performance test of 4 different graphics cards in CSGO and Counter-Strike 2. What I found confirms that the Source 2 engine and CS2 are much better designed than Global Offensive, but how does that affect your fps in game? Will you have to upgrade graphics cards to even play CS2?
Cards Used:
GTX 980
GTX 1080 TI
RTX 2080 Super
RTX 4090
I posted the final results of my framerate performance test on Twitter:
/ 1686780643705851904 - Ігри
Do NOT let WarOwl touch another GPU again
He learned from Linus
just jam it with a screw driver!
Does this count as sexual harassment?
Why though
@@dsl69ues
A pro player will use high shadows, Shadows show player positions a lot more in the new lighting system.
they definitely do, the new shadows are kind of crazy. So many times playing it felt like the enemy was making shadow puppet shows on the wall next to me.
@@TheWarOwl "oh look, it's a rabbit!"
"oh shit the rabbit is planting a bomb!"
Fallen made a play with shadows VS The Mongolz on Inferno
@@IKEACherryChair "The bomb has been defused, Counter-Rabbits win"
floofys playing cs
"If you have 60, upgrading to 120 will change your life!"
I'm afraid that if I do that I'll never be able to go back to 60 Hz displays without going insane.
It sucks
It's worth it. Even cell phone displays are hitting 120Hz nowadays
That's why do don't go back. Just buy a 144 hz and never look back.
I cant even go back to a 60hz phone, its just so much smoother
I get used to it in about 3 hours on console.
Good to see you are trying new things. I personally would watch anything you make, but it's a good for you to not get burned out and find new viewers. Good work mr. Warowl!
thanks, I don't do tech videos but this is a topic I am interested in
@@TheWarOwl reminds me of a philip video which I enjoy
@@TheWarOwl well idk if everyone like it but id like to see more !
@@TheWarOwl setup update tour
I uh play on a 49 inch widescreen on 240hz maxed settings xD
7900x+4090
It's good. It's really good.
5:40 Source 2 probably has much better frame time consistency, it can make the same frame rate feel a lot slower when frame times are inconsistent
thanks for the insight 🙌
inputs also aren’t frame dependent anymore, which surely makes a difference
@@colin7242 Do we know that?
If it is, it is entirely irrelevant for perceived smoothness as your inputs would be from the same time interval.
Source 2 is also likely prioritizing efficiency over brute force on the frame rate. Noticed a better watt average even when the fps was capped on both.
@@Hyperus Old source was already really oldshit when it didn't do timestamped input in 2013, so it would be supremely weird if Source 2, particularly with being targeted for VR as well, didn't have that. Complete tablestakes and massively improves perceived jank. It's probably the main reason why console shooters still feel somewhat playable at 20-30 fps.
I swear RTX 5090 is gonna be the size of a PC case
Hahah, it's just a second tower you place next to your PC with a giant tube going out the back, into a 1ft cube power box before it goes back to your PC.
Nope, it gonna stay in the cloud and doing AI stuff.
10090 would be the same size as those old OLD computers. humongous
You just put a computer on the gpu in 50 series
@@vesta3544and same performance as rtx 6090
your "why did I say that?" and "i was concerned that it wasn't level" bits made me burst out laughing, something about the way you deliver your punchlines always gets me
Glad to see the 1080Ti still making waves after all these years, truly a card ahead of its time
Thats the card I have actually, EVGA GTX 1080 Ti ! Great graphic card.
Its crazy how it has the same performances as a rtx 3060 when its a 7 years old card
They probably finally disconnected mouse position tracking from the framerate. It used to be in cs go that the mouse position only got read, if a new frame was being rendered. They had to write a new input system for HLA bc moving your hands fast was a nightmare in vr when throwing stuff. So that might be why you notice low framerates less.
That and the frametimes are now much more consistent which also definitely helps a lot for smoothness
@@DUD3H0WD4R3Uyeah, that's most likely also a big part of it.
This is actually fascinating I love it thanks for sharing
Really miss this kind of testing, this is my favourite tech review video of the year!
didnt expect to see you here lol
@@bruh.j4mes I guess he plays CS
Ideally, we'd also want to know how much GPU memory was utilized, and preferably see some tests on AMD GPUs to to see if the new engine has any preference to one or the other, but still a great investigation
thanks, I'm not a tech YTber, just a guy who happens to have a bunch of GPUs and access to CS2
Go watch Steve, he'll probably add CS2 to the suite when its ready... instead he just gives us memes about R6:S reaching 1k FPS.
I actually doubt it uses a ton of GPU memory. Almost certainly more than csgo, but you'll probably still be able to get by just fine on a 4 gigabyte card.
@@donovan6320 as I said, "ideally", as it's just in case, and FYI, though I have a proper desktop now that I can afford it as a grownup, most of the time I played CSGO was on a laptop and then on an APU (integrated graphics), pretty sure I didn't even have 4 GB of video memory 😅
@@guiorgy as of now, it's almost certain you'll need a dedicated GPU or a very recent APU in order to play it. That being said, an APU can dynamically reserve memory.
I just love your humor paired with your professionalism. Youre the only UA-camr Ive been watching consistently since.. I started playing Counter strike, which is like 7 years ago. I cant wait for a new era to begin with CS2 :)
I am not a PC nerd myself but I was missing these kind of videos where WarOwl gets to cover PC and performance related stuff.
I am so glad you are getting new parts for your pc! I remember playing nuke with you and you mentioned you got lower frames on that map. Glad I watched you for all this time and got to have the chat during game. Hope you're enjoying CS2!
Loved the editing on this one. The clips of you installing the GPUs and saying what you did was hilarious.
Great video, more content like this please - would also be interesting to see 1440p and 4K results
I didn't know WarOwl had legs
Its not the cpu after the 1080ti. Its because csgo is a dx9 game. 2000 series and later do dx9 by emulation. Theyve removed optimizations for old direct x versions.
thank you for the explanation, this makes sense
I'm curious, what's your source for the emulation bit? As far as I'm aware, only Intel Arc uses DX 9 emulation/translation currently. It would make sense that Nvidia don't bother optimising for ancient APIs, but I haven't seen any official mention of a translation layer.
@@Creepus_Explodus I was just giving a laymen reason for why it would run slower. Its impossible to know exactly why older apis run slower on newer hardware without actually having engineer access.
My best guess is emulation. That would make the most sense.
@@Creepus_Explodus There is no emulation going on. DX9 support hasn't changed for Nvidia for a long time. There is nothing in the architecture or spec sheets that supports the idea that DX9 is being emulated.
There can be a host of reasons why DX9 isn't running as efficiently on newer hardware without coming to the conclusion of emulation.
I believe thats only the case for intel cards.
Bro glad to see new things, I'd watch anything you'd make tbh, but i also appreciate the new stuff.
Luv you ♥
Your vidoes are always a W WarOwl Keep up the good work !!!!
I actually have a 4090, but it's still shocking to see just how huge it is compared to basically any other graphics card ever made before it.
I love how happy he is about cs2
super interesting video, thanks for checking out older cards instead of brand new ones!
those little memes in between about the GPU and the table not being level, those made me chuckle. thank you
I have 165hz 1440p. Playing at 1440p has been a game changer, the precision you get is insane.
got a 1440p 360hz panel recently but still find myself just playing 4:3 stretched
@@rhandycsnoob
How big is your monitor? Because the size of the pixels matters a lot too
I suppose it's 27" at least? For me 24-25
Victus??
Great video, wasn't expecting that much of a drop with the higher settings compared to CS:GO. Also I just got my plushie yesterday, I love it!
Thanks! I just got my plushie yesterday as well, it took a while but I'm happy with what they made.
@@TheWarOwl so by estimation what would a 1660 TI get ?
Fantastic upload. Just the question I have been asking and just the answer I need. Amazing
You are the youtuber with the best music selection IMO. Always guaranteed bangers on this channel.
Would've loved to have seen 1440p benchmarks due to the 1440p 360hz panels on the market but I still very much appreciated this video, thank you WarOwl.
1440p 360hz is a very fancy monitor. Top of the line as I know
@@AntiFurry927 So is the 4090
@@AntiFurry927 so is the 13900k
@@doppled I have a 13900k with a 1050ti as the gpu lol
@@Ribstarpre-builts be like
5:21 I always noticed this when just playing CSGO normally except instead of dropping 40 frames, it was more like dropping 130 frames from 400FPS capped. But it never happened all the time. It is always completely random but when it happens I can notice a big change. For example sometimes it feels like when my FPS drops like that, the game is not running at my monitors refresh rate, and I only have 1080p 144hz. and I don’t have the graphics cranked all the way either, only some things on medium. I hope that I can actually see an improvement once I can finally play CS2.
Great effort , thanks for your hard work :)
That’s super good! Great video man!
Important thing to consider here, if you play at anything higher than 1080p, the performance gap between cards will become significantly greater. 80 class and above cards these days are really marketed towards 1440/4k, so there's potentially performance being left on the table for the newer cards.
I agree would've liked to see testing in 1440 especially on the 4090 and 2080
im still waiting to see what they gonna do with shadows theres no way everyone will just have to play with high shadows or suffer being in disadvantage
Shadows of player still shows in low shadows. I think Znorux cover that if you are interested
This is the fabled WarOwl Tech Tips.
Great video nice change of pace and super usefull
i had friends who would play CSGO without the graphics card. and some would use way older ones. they would play well at around 40-20 FPS. they are the ones i am truly worried about
My little brothers don’t have a graphics card and I’ve been looking forward to playing CS2 with them. They get around 30 FPS on the lowest settings so like you, I’m a little worried.
@@SonicMaster519 i am hoping valve give great focus on optimization to keep this large plyer base alive and also go against the Market's new standard of very demanding games we have today.
@@luanfonseca5179 I'm sure they'll try to make it as optimized as possible. Of course, as time goes on, tech is going to become more outdated and standards for specifications are going to increase, so I wouldn't be surprised if CS2 still destroys older or weaker PCs. I'd imagine Valve is doing the best they can though.
This is one of the least (personally) interesting video titles Ive seen from Warowl and i stlll didnt even hesitate to click instantly. AND enjoyed it very much :)
I caught that fps doug reference. Well done old man, keep pwning
Good stuff, but I can't help to note that without CPU testing you can't definitively say if or where a GPU bottleneck occurs. Cranking up the settings can also enable effects that put more strain on the CPU, thus reducing your fps if you're already limited by that.
GTX1080Ti is really something which is unforgettable for every gamer , what an revolutionary product it was at that time !
Fortunately, I still have my GTX1080Ti loaded in my PC... What a great GPU it is...
I’m still running 1080ti as well. It’s a cool card 🤞🏻
@@jadeahn4288 me aswell , no problem playing newer games aswell :)
Thank you I was waiting for this! (From 3kliks ok I am not going to lie on that) happy too see the CPU bottleneck is not an issues anymore, sometimes on Anubis I can feel the drop (especially around water) and knowing I have a 3060, it's frustrating
Loving this kind of content.
Would have been nice to see a dataset with a more mid tier cpu. I think many of us run into the issue of cpu bottlenecking in csgo where we opted to put more budget in gpu when putting together our rig.
If you're playing on anything Rocket Lake or newer, or 2nd gen Ryzen or newer, you're framerates will be relatively comparable to this test. Just remove 0-10% from the lower end cards and 20-30% from the higher end cards.
@@BloodDjimon614 And on top of that if you're running Ryzen, you'll also have the option to play silicon lottery and see how well your chip overclocks. That way you can claw back some more performance out of old hardware, provided you also have better than stock cooler. Sure that would apply to Intel's CPU's too, but they've paywalled that feature behind the K-series chips (I can't remember if there's some other letter suffixes that mean unlocked too).
What CPU did he use?
@@aachoocrony5754 1:34 he briefly says he used an i9 13900k. It’s easy to miss.
@@aerykfilmsphoto thx. Was in the beginning I guess.
It would be interesting to try this with the budged variants GPU's , lets say a 750Ti ( some ppl still use it ) 1050Ti , 1660 , 3060 , something like that .
Nice video, interesting comparison👌
Thank you for the video WarOwl, I can't believe it's been almost a decade since I bought my 970. I suppose it's time to upgrade soon anyways.
I would love a more CPU bound test. I did the whole "buy a 2x better GPU to get 10 more frames" thing, I wonder if a recent Intel i3 or i5 will still give the same frames with the 4090 as your i9 did.
actually it's much more likely to give better FPS than an i9 because the 16 or so cores that the flagship chips are seldom leveraged by game engines (save for a bunch of strategy games i guess). it's a parallelization problem, since the algorithms are non-deterministic (the result can differ even with the same input variables, like due to random bullet inaccuracy for example) and reliant on the previous result to compute the next one (so a new frame can't be drawn before a player input has been captured/processed) you can't really split the main game engine process across several workers.
so that's why the many extra cores have little to do, but turboing/overclocking a single core much higher than the base frequency gets you more performance benefits, and which is why in many modern games 4/6/8/12/16 core parts are very similar in performance if clocked similarly and based on the same architecture. (there are of course slim differences due to cache size and such)
and with a smaller core count you get less heat production, a smaller potential for hotspot creation (as such chips are lower TDP parts in general) and thus can often times push them to higher speeds than an i9 or R9 or similar HEDT/workstation parts.
Awesome video, would love to see 1% and 0.1% in the next one!
Min and Max FPS are unfortunately not very representative/useful.
Video was hilarious and had good information awesome upload
You are an awesome person warowl
I would like to see WarOwl build a PC by himself...
Even though you say CS2 is gpu bottlenecked I still think the cpu is more important and this test would be interesting to see with a more lower end cpu.
Thanks for the video,
Cant wait to review this cs2 on rtx 3080 on my channel
Since we already have the engine and we have the game on a playable version with a newly designed map. I agree that this was the perfect moment to make this video.
Results are good, happy with my pc that has a great cpu and a decent gpu. Although the shadows might become an issue.
TheWarOwl is the only person that actually cares that he doesn't have a closer
It would have been nice to see the frametimes (through a program like msi afterburner or something). CSGO may have been relatively easy to run, but even at 60 fps, the experience was still borderline unusable compared to other games at the same fps. I am curious if CS2 resolved this issue, because if it has, the lower fps may not be a problem.
EDIT: "feeling better" like you described is probably a result of improved frametimes. still would be nice to see the frametime graph to see what the improvement is quantitatively.
ive been playing it on an rx 5700 and an r9 3900x and the frametimes in cs2 for me specifically are the opposite of what hes describing in the video. no matter the settings, from 1280x720 lowest to 1080p highest i get way way worse timings compared to csgo and i cant find anybody talking about it or any potential solutions haha. oh well. hopefully when it properly releases therell be wider coverage of different hardware.
This was a great video, very interesting!
Congrats on staying fit by the way you look great!
If you use something like CapframeX, you could see the 1% lows too. When you say "it feels better at lower framerates" it means the 1% lows are closer to the average.
not exactly, source 1 just has HORRENDOUS frametimes at anything below 200 fps - playing csgo at 100fps feels like playing any other game at 40 due to the inconsistent frametimes
@@Linda- This shows up on the frametime graph
@@DarthZombie510 yes, but not really on 1% and .1% lows
@@Linda- stuttering appears like a comb on that graph. 0.1%s are not super useful unless you benchmark something like an hour at a time, but 1%s are really visible if a game goes all over the place
i really hope they further optimize the game, cs2 is going to be a huge issue to run for people on low(er)-end machines in its current state
He's used a ten year old $40 graphics card and still got 230fps with effects and bots on screen.
And that's an extremely low end graphics card.
@@thedizzlor the 980 isn't a low end card by any means if you think about the demographic of people that play cs
@@prinzkitty1209Steam cant even run on Windows 7 lol
Uh so just so you know, I'll watch anything u post lol. So just keep on man! Whatever u make, community should follow!
Thank you for making this video Warowl. I have a 3080 in my system so yeah I think I'm good.
benchmarking the 4090 with 1080p resolution is like combining it with a q6600 bottleneck af
You don't understand benchmarks, do you?
Literally nobody plays the game at 4k, all the players care about are high and stable frame rates
Hey buddy, did you just roll in from stupid town?
@@void78371440p is definitely going to be the new norm in the next 3 years or so for competitive titles and there are plenty of videos explaining why the increase in pixels per inch results in a clear advantage competitively for longer sightlines in other games. Once zowie drops a 1440p TN competitive panel it'll be the final nail in the coffin for 1080p imo
ua-cam.com/video/Zy3w-VZyoiM/v-deo.html
Hearing random bits from the Halo 2 OST made me smile, so nostalgic.
Good tech video! I'd love to see you try to play a game of CS where everyone is running at low frame-rate; often times people take the smoothness of these games for granted.
You have my thanks, sir! I really have been waiting for exactly THIS video! I am gaming on GTX 980 in CS:GO, and it is still solid (literally everything about my pc is in the modern range, just my GPU and monitor (60Hz) are kinda outdated). Anyway, I have now thanks to you a bit of orientation, and I'll look for a budget upgrade ;)
Currently I'd recommend a previous gen GPU like a 3070 or a 6700xt. Current gen is way overpriced for what they offer. The change to higher refresh rates is also huge and feels amazing.
@@Shreyas-S thanks for your advice! I also have been monitoring the GPU-Market and I totally agree. I was hoping to get RTX 4060 FE about 300€, but this has become quite illusional with Nvidia’s dumb ass marketing. RTX 3060ti/3070 should be it rn :)
@@HAYK1L26 yeah 3060ti should be great for CS and pretty good for most other games as well unless you're planning to run them at 4K. I switched from 60hz to 240 about a year ago and I really cannot go back to lower refresh rates without my eyes hurting. It's something that you have to experience for yourself.
Really appreciate you making this video. I have a computer running Windows 7 within Intel core Duo processor so I need to upgrade many parts of the system. In fact everything graphics round hard drive so maybe my graphics card will survive but let’s see
Great video, thanks for making. Makes me happy to know that my expensive paperweoghts will finally get some use.
A few notes about the relative performance of the cards:
Resolution up to 1080p is, generally speaking, trivial for almost all graphics cards these days. Scaling up to 1440 and beyond will certainly have an impact, but at 1080p the resolution js almost certainly not the limiting factor.
The thing I would take note about the 1080ti versus the 2080 super is that the 2080 super likely has only 8gb of vram, whereas the 1080ti has 11gb. That may not sound like a big difference, but as you scale the graphics QUALITY up (not the resolution) there tends to be a greater demand on vram. The affect of resolution is once again only really shown by scaling past 1080 (even though yes, many csgo players likely will mever go higher than 1080). But effects lights and whatnot require extra information, and that info must be stored somewhere. This is why when the graphics are increased, you see a smaller dropoff across the board for the 4090 with its 24gb of vram as opposed to the others.
The argument may be made that "even if its more its still nowhere close to full". To that i say, imagien a large storeroom. If you had 10 boxes, you could likely set them each and have their own soace. You could instantly open any box you wished. Now what if you had 20 boxes? You may have to stack some boxes, put one in front of the other, etc. Suddenly, its not as easy to access every single thing in the room. Computer memory often works the same way. In order to pltimize performamce, developers will attempt to arrange the necessary storage items intelligently. The less items there are, the more intelligently you can store them, this, greater performance.
Driver maturity is also most definitely a factor. The newer the card, not only is the driver itself younger, but also the more entrenched in new techniques it becomes. In new titles such as cyberpunk 2077, the 4090 absolutely demolishes the other cards. This is not just do to its specs, but also because the game was DESIGNED for wuch a workload, and is thus optimized for it. Running csgo at 700 fps is like doing a workout as hard and fast as you can: the differences between which exercises you do on a daily basis vs those you perform once or twice a week become starkly apparent. Source 2 is still by no means a recent release, and so there are likely still optimization issues that have yet to be figured out between bleeding edge drivers and old technology.
Again, by no means am i critiquing the vid. Just thought id share some extra thoughts that may deepen the analysis a bit.
Such a well created video.
Finally someone made a video for CS2 graphics card! Been looking for this! I noticed my 1080ti is not consistent pushing 240+fps anymore when playing CS2, I have been contemplating if I will upgrade it. I might go 4090 as well haha
Great video Mr Owl.
I never really truly understood the scale of the rtx 4090 but seeing it next to the other cards and comparing it with the width of warowl's torso, I understand what all the reviewers meant now
I'm pretty happy to see this. I'm on a 3070Ti that i picked up secondhand for about 400 about 8 months ago, and judging by the 2080 super numbers and the 4090 numbers, mine probably slots in between them, probably cost to the 2080 than the 4090, so i should be able to get about 250 at 1080p high which is what i play csgo at, but I'm looking to get a 120hz monitor here soon, so its probably still overkill.
I say probably because something about csgo that's weird is that you still want crazy high frames even if you're playing at 60hz, because the game makes tick updates and gameplay updates at the frame rate you're getting, regardless of what you're seeing. So you will have an easier time on a 60 hz monitor running 300 fps than you will on a 60 hz monitor running 75 fps. It's possible to make shots in between frames you can see. You're only seeing 60 pictures a second, but the game is still operating under the surface at the 300 you're pumping out.
0:40
I almost did the same thing! Those prior Gen motherboards made it such an insane pain to unlatch the GPU because big GPU’s covered the latch. The nicer ones make that really easy.
One thing I'm excited about is that thing you mentioned with how stable the FPS is. In GO it was normal to see 300fps and a second later 220 without even moving. CS2 seems to be a lot more stable which will ensure the game is smooth. What's the benefit of 100% refresh rate fps count peak if it can go down rapidly at random, right?
the table level bit was really funny
Thank you, warowl.
I think some, if not most of the stuttering and wild fps changes even when standing still in the original cs were actually probably more a result of how cpu limited the game is. Fps in gpu limited scenarios (which cs2 is looking at least a bit more like one) tends to be smoother and more consistent with drops when tons of visual stuff occurs while cpu limited scenarios just have wacky inconsistent frame times in my experience. Not really a huge issue with the video or anything as the effect is functionally the same, i just think the technical reason is cpu processing rather than game engine stuff (besides the game just being more gpu heavy).
New war owl video!
Good stuff!
I think it's worth testing with all low graphics except for high shadows since I expect a lot of people to use that combination in CS2
I love your videos ❤
I heard HALO THEME WarOwl! Such great choice of music haha
I like that you actually look at and fully argue both sides of "It sucks being forced to upgrade" and "It's amazing this new game works well at all with a decade old card"
Just wanna leave this comment to tell you how much I love your content
Bro, I love the Halo 3 music. So good. Gosh what a missed era.
I can't help the feeling im spying on warowl from his closet in the beginning shot.
Look at WarOwl man so inspirational
Love the subtle Halo 2 soundtrack in the background! "Peril" starts around 1:45 a real banger!
i love you warowl- that is all
I think someone who is more tech savy like linus should get in on this. And also, i feel like there could be some extra optimization done throughout the years.
For an early report, however, this is very well done
Cool video!
thanks!i am with 1060 on 11th gen cpu machine and i am happy that it will run fine at 1080p.
So happy i saved up for a year to buy a completely new setup. I've always had to do with low end pc's and now I finally have a 7900XTX. No more struggles for the upcoming few years (I hope)
Thanks for validating that I don't need to upgrade my 1080ti still
"It Pwns" ahh that takes me back.
Nice, I liked this vid!
5:40 This is likely because of what you explained right before, fluctuating framerates feel a more choppy than a constant framerate, especially when its under your monitor's refresh rate.
Huge relief