The changing view of the Altmer on Humans - The Elder Scrolls Lore
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- Опубліковано 21 лис 2024
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I hope you enjoyed this kinda different video from a different perspective! I certainly did!
Could you possibly do a video on liches in the future
Did you know the Elder Scrolls is a complete ripoff of The Lord of the Rings
It was a total war not a genocide.
I'm so hyped for TES6 but i know you don't look at the comment section at all so yeah
@@papastankui6566 some things, maybe. But not in everything, and even in most things, as far as I'm concerned. It pulls from a far wider range of influences.
Without going into the more complicated lore stuff, it also bears mentioning that Talos is more or less Lorkhan reborn, and to the Altmer, Lorkhan is/was their Satan
more like the Nords worshiping Loki and the elves seeing Loki as the enemy...well Loki did try to usurp Odin's throne after all lolz
@@judgedrekk2981 From the Altmer perspective, he's less "trickster god" and more "god of evil" and a demiurgic figure.
@@BroadwayRonMexico I wasn't aware that their religion was Gnostic in nature. Do the High Elves have some esoteric religion revolving around escaping the physical plane?
@@Its2l84Lalu It's the whole basis of their religion: the ancestors of the Aldmer were gods until Lorkhan decieved them and trapped them in Mundus. They seek to reascend to Aetherius, and their two most prominent gods (Auriel and Magnus) did just that.
According to Michael Kirkbride (one of the most prominent lore writers and a former Bethesda employee who still sometimes is contracted by Bethesda and ZOS), the reason the Thalmor want to ban Talos worship is because as the god who succeeded Lorkhan (and is born of his oversoul), he is the "glue" that keeps Mundus and Nirn intact. He is the most important of the "towers"
@@BroadwayRonMexicoI kinda side with the Aldmer now, they are trying to get out of the 3D material prison they are trapped in
I really wish Bethesda has put a few characters explaining the Thalmor POV and making them less mustache twirling evil in Skyrim. Maybe even make them a third faction in the civil war where you worked to keep the empire and the Stormcloaks in perpetual war.
In that third path they could reveal their motivations, some internal disputes about how to go about their goals etc.
"I really wish Bethesda has put a few characters explaining the Thalmor POV and making them less mustache twirling evil in Skyrim."
I mean, there are literal Altmer within Skyrim that disagree and even oppose the Thalmor. The Thalmor are pretty much the Gestapo of Skyrim.
Khajiit has wares if you have coin
@@TitanSubZero15 He was talking about Thalmor disagreeing with own doctrines and racism you know inner turmoil in Skyrim we get High Elves outside of the dominion hating Thalmor we don't get an inner perspective think Cerberus from Mass Effect
The thalmor hate all humans and want to unmake the world to become elnefay again. I'd say that's pretty bad unless you're an altmer
@@princesstinklepanties2720 That was theory the unmaking of the worlds it was never proven hell there's evidence to suggest otherwise for example why take over Hammerfell the adamantine tower is closer to high rock
Excellent work Imperial Knowledge! Your chests of gold are on your way 😁
KINKY 😍👅😘
(I KNOW that you know that I know you're paying him for the "party" last night and NOT the PROPAGANDA!)
Praise Talos!
Woke as fuck!
Elenwen I'll have your blood
Suffering to all mankind.
*Sharpens Wuuthrad*
Lol facts
SHARPENS A ALREADY SHARPENED WUTHRAD
And I can hear ysgramor shouting from sovenguard "the only Good elf is a dead elf"
Bitch, your axe can't match my lighting!
I can already hear Pelinal coming back to join...
"YOU ARE INTERFERING WITH OFFICAL THALMOR BUSSINESS, MOVE ALONG!"
Dragonborn:🖕
*draw elf-slaying battleaxe*
@@danksalt5935 😅🤣
@@danksalt5935 Based & Thalmor-hatred pilled.
@@NCRVeteranRanger patrolling skyrim almost makes you wish for a dragon break
Menimarco, a high elf from the summerset isles, caused the planemeld. This is interesting when menimarco's actions are the dominion's casus belli.
That TOTALLY flipped my compass on Elves *NOT THE THALMOR* the Elves.
It’s good that you know they’re not all bad now 👍.
They never were all bad. They were just different from humans with a higher superiority culture complex. Which given their extremely longer lifespan, is kind of understandable
The Tsaesci Akaviri admired Reman, and for some reason so did the Altmer, to the point where even in the Third Era, the Altmer king of Sunhold is named Reman Karoodil (it's the Daggerfall quest where Morgiah, Barenziah's daughter, gets married to the king of Firsthold after she promises her firstborn to Mannimarco). I don't know what parts of Reman's history are fiction and which ones are fact, but it's close to certain SOMETHING about Reman the Cyrodiil was different from your average man, to the point where the Altmer think his name has power over Tamriel and they actually respected him. That probably helped a lot for the Altmer to join the Empire.
In contrast, Tiber Septim or Hjalti Early-Beard was an ass whose main virtue was being a sneaky, shrewd conman, one of his advisors was none other than Wulfharth, who had a grudge against the Mer in general bigger than the list of Ysgramor's 500 Companions, and the only part of the Septim Empire that was a cooler head was the battlemage Zurin Arctus, who was BFF with Hjalti/Tiber and stuck being the diplomat because he was the only one who didn't murderize the problems like a player character. I can actually sympathize with the Altmer for wanting to pretend Talos isn't a god simply because he's not a very upright guy overall in his mortal years, and as we know from the Tribunal, mortals who get godhood tend to turn into various flavors of jerkish.
In conclusion, I can't believe I have to give the Thalmor some sympathy over the Talos-undoing attempt because I hate them almost as much as I hate King Helseth. Or the controls for TES Adventures: Redguard.
Tiber Septim also massacred hundreds of thousands of Altmer using the Numidium during his attack on Alinor. It even created a dragon-break, and there are alternate timelines where the Battle of Alinor is still being fought. The Fall of Alinor is within living memory for a lot of High Elves by the time Skyrim rolls around.
Imagine an upjumped barbarian sociopath slaughtered hundreds of thousands of your people for no other reason than his own selfish ambition to rule the world.
Imagine he did it with a superweapon whose very existence is profane and unholy to your religion, and did so because his armies couldn't take yours in a straight fight.
Now imagine you were forced to acknowledge his divinity and allow shrines and temples to him to be built throughout your lands.
And then his empire, which was imposed upon your people through slaughter, crumbles and no longer has the power to force your compliance.
It's weak, on its last legs, and you are in a unique position to toss it on the ash-heap of history, get your revenge, and eradicate the cult this madman set up in his own name forever.
What would you do?
all i heard was heresy, praise thalos
The controls for Redguard are truly the most vile villain in all of The Elder Scrolls.
*Mannimarco causes the planemeld*
Altmer: “damn humans.”
Well, it was only due to the humans (and notably, wannabe human Emperor) that Mannimarco even got into the position to do so.
@@thalmoragent9344that’s like saying a place was only robbed because it had money.
I'm pretty sure they held Mannimarco as responsible as the wanna-be emperor. But the thing, Mannimarco was a evil man corrupted or motivated by a Deadra when the wanna-be-emperor was just a average guy that wanted to force his way on the trone. That's the thing, Mannimarco is hardly a average elf or even a average people in term of characters (i don't think there is many sane peoples who would want to serve the god of literal rape and undead).
That doesn't mean the pretender was evil, the elves know that he wasn't and that all that plan was orchestred by Mannimarco but it comforted their opinion that human play too often with forces they don't understand, let alone control and so that they should step in to prevent the whole world to be destroyed.
@@efaristi9737
Yeah, the wannabe Emperor trusted Mannimarco of all people since he wanted to force legitimacy of his claim to the Throne
Empire n'wah's vs ancient magic n'wah's. By ALMSIVI I do not care.
Milkmen United yes! 🙌🏼 I agree!
ALMSIVI?! That Heresy hasn't mattered since the reclamations s'wit
FAKE GODS!
Milkmen United
Why did that make me laugh sooooo hard?
KJ L Take a look at what little remains of House Hlaalu to see what the Dunmer think of Imperial Dunmer
to blame humans for the plane meld is crazy seeing as it was mannimarco a high elf who caused it
You truly gave me better insight into the matter with the points you discussed. While I agree that I could never support the Thalmor and their ideas of supremacy, or any ideas of supremacy at all, I can certainly understand why they are supported after everything that has happened. Sometimes, a good look at history is all you need to better reason somebody's point of view.
Well if someone started worshipping someone committed genocide against your race you’ll be quite pissed too
Like white jesus for black people
That's not genocide.
And yet so many elves worship the Daedra? This is bullshit.
and forced you to worship them too
@@afrohighborn262 Since when did Jesus ever genocide anyone?
In-short, the Altmer believe that they descended from divinity who were trapped in a moral plane by Lorkhan. Meanwhile, humans believe that rather than descending from the divine, they were created by divine forces (and so hail Lorkhan as gifting them existence by creating Nirn and the moral plane).
As such, the Thalmor worldview (which has become the dominant Altmer worldview since the Oblivion Crisis as that allowed the Thalmor to take control of the Aldemeri Dominion) is that the Altmer have been trapped on the moral plane and so they want to undo this. This means fighting against Lorkhan (who they consider basically satan) and his creations, creating a new Merethic Era and ascending back to immortal divinity.
They don't 'hate' the humans, they simply see humans as lesser than them. Perhaps a bit like the human/animal distinction in real-life.
They do hate humans since the Dawn Era they were like Shezarr, who is the devil in the Elven religion and this is why the Dark Elves are the only likable Elven race ever because they like the mortal realm of Mundus and also like and honor Lorkhan.
@@Super50ldier and then slave ppl
@@Super50ldier TES lore reeks of Warhammer/40k anyway distilled with Tolkienism, contemporary spiritualism & comparative religions.
Moral as in right and wrong? Why would they throw hissy fit over ethics? Or do you mean mortal as in having a definite lifespan?
@@whitewolf3051 I made a typo and wrote ‘moral’ instead of ‘mortal’
Great lore video. This covers the history/tensions/feelings between the two cultures very well. That being said, this is all at face value. This is how history appears to be. The truth behind it is somewhat conflicted and debated about. there is the concept that the thalmor resent the humans due to the original man-god, lorkhan, for tricking the elven ancestors and trapping altmer spirits into a corporeal realm to give the humans and other beings a physical plane. Most altmer are unaware of this concept and it is restricted to the high elite of the thalmor. This concept then expands upon the thalmor conquest, as it claims they are trying to capture theoretical "towers" which are physical locations that are keys to holding nirn and mundus together and chained into a physical dimension. Many assume this is what bethesda is slowly leading towards with their games because in the last several games several towers have been deactivated. Theoretically. These towers include; Red mountain, The throat of the world (possibly parthuurnax), The white gold tower, The adamantium tower, two towers in the summerset isles, etc. At the point of the elder scrolls v skyrim, almost all towers have been deactivated. The thalmor elite are supposedly manipulating their own population (for which they believe to be for "their own good" mind you) and trying to take over and shut off these key points around tamriel and the surrounding areas in order to literally unravel physical reality and rejoin with their incorporeal spirit bodies and bollocks to everyone else. the evidence that supports this theory is quite substantial actually and i find it pretty fascinating. I am very interested to see if this theory holds up in the next installment. I absolutely love the lore of these games and hope someone else finds my story interesting and decides to look into it some more. Thanks for reading, hope you all have a great night!
Forgot to mention that at the time men used the numidian on the altmer, the altmer looked at themselves as superior. Lots of lore mentions how the altmer had a huge blow to their ego "because how could they lose to mere humans" type of thing.
@@LalaLa-ze7kv not really. Lore wise the altmer are right, they're the closest living relatives to the old elnefay.
@@LalaLa-ze7kv is there a non-stupid reason to commit a genocidal war? Lol.
@@LalaLa-ze7kv Payback is always a good reason, especially its after a magical nuke.
I've been going through all this lore, seeing how immersive and expansive the elder scrolls really is, now I understand why the Elder Scrolls VI is taking so long. I hope they take as much time as they need to make the game as best as they can get it.
i just hope that im still alive when it comes out
@@winter_ghosth don’t worry that game will come out before star citizen 😂😂
TES6 is taking so long because rather waste their time on stupid mediocre cr*p like Fallout 76 or Starfield or milking Fallout 4 and TES5 for every penny.
Take my advice, stop hoping for TES6 and save yourself the disappointment. You'll be thankful in a few years. The way Bethesda's been going this past decade it can only end up a big pile of disappointing garbage at this point.
Personally feel its thalmor rather than altmer theres a few high elves with no love for thalmor as well as Hosmer and kahjit
Even in part of lore they tried to kill off dissidents
Well the beastfolk are seen as sub races and the bosmer are seen as race traitors for leaving summerset and making the green pact
I would add this line to the next game:"Well you High Elves could have proposed a better deal as soon the news of the Morrowind 5 finger discount arrived to the negotiations table."
I call the deal between Morrowind and Tiber Septim 5 finger discount because it is a really good deal for the Dark Elves
Thanks for showing me this video. I honestly hated the elves but now i dont hate them so much.
Personally although I despise the Thalmor I dont dislike the Altmer; even if they are a bit full of themselves and snooty. I dont think of the Thalmor as being the Altmer. I see them as a fundamentalist fascist sect among the Altmer who have gained power and control.
Another way to put it is, I dont hate Germans because of Hitler. These kinds of evil aberrations can and do arise in all nations and races.
I have a similar opinion of Tiber Septim as I do of Julius Caesar - both were brutal ruthless leaders; and both were posthumously deified. I dont approve of either of them. I can understand the revulsion of ordinary Altmer to the deification of Tiber Septim; but I dont approve, of the Thalmor's beliefs or goals or methods in Skyrim or anywhere.
One of the lore elements I would like to see going forward with the Elder Scrolls storylines would be the Altmer deposing the Thalmor and restoring true Altmer society and civilisation.
It would be a blast to play through a questline which brought that change about.
I was appalled by the recent bankrupting and looting of Greece by Wall St and the European banks and the humiliation of Greece by the EU.
Athis i feel this so much
Yeah, and the imperial scum decide to suck them dry, thus giving even more altmer a god complex and causing the aldmeri dominion armies to grow, it would have been much better for the empire and independant provinces to keep fighting and spreading anti-thalmor propaganda, that way the thalmor wont have total control of the continent
Also just realised this is from 2 years ago lmao
@@toddhowarddressedasatellyt702
Yea 2 years and still no sign of TES6!
I put it down to ESO
God go sit under and tree and write me a poem ya lib
>Talos isn't a god
>Talos wasn't in Sovngarde
Pick one Mer.
Talos is in the Void.
>Talos CHIMed
>Need the blood of a divine to enter Mankar Camorans Paradise
>Use Talos's blood, it works and creates a portal to paradise
Talos achieving CHIM doesn't disqualify him from apotheosis, it doesn't really factor in at all tbh. Unless he used it for a new Amaranth which he did not.
I disagree that he doesn't deserve worship, whatever his actions in life he is now looking out for mankind and the kalpa. Its also speculated that he is the prophet in the knights of the nine dlc, if so he played a big part in helping stop Umaril, and he may have even created The Last Dragonborn since he can do that as well. Also Talos is a combination of Tiber Septim, Zurin Arctus and Wulfharth, so he also helped stop the Numidium, and the Akaviri invasion of the late 2nd era.
Let's also not forget that the Snow Elves started it all, committing actual genocide against the Atmorans at Sarthaal. They started the anti-elf sentiment within the humans...the subsequent conflict with the Chimer (Prior to their becoming the Dunmer) didn't help matters either.
@Happy Gol-Lucky
Which the Atmorans answered with MASS-Genocide of their Entire Species, Oh and let's not even mention how the Snow Elves WERE somewhat if not fully justified in their attack of Sarthaal, Because those Atmorans were composed of Warriors acquiring a Magical Super-Weapon called The Eye of Magnus that LITERALLY can reshape reality itself OR more importantly destroy whatever you wish it too!
How about WE ask the Dwemer to KNOW exactly what happens when someone fucks with Magical Artifacts with Unlimited Power?
Yeah the Snow Elves MAYBE weren't in the right and instead of attacking the Atmorans they should have talked it out or figured out the Atmorans intentions with The Eye of Magnus, BUT the Atmorans trying to find The Eye of Magnus for whatever goal DEFINITELY weren't in the right either and they weren't no matter whatsoever at all in the right for committing to the extermination of *ALL* (Women, Children and Elders included) Falmer/Snow Elves in retaliation!
The Atmorans actions to cause the incident and their retaliation actually paint them as the Bad Guys that seek only Mass-Genocide against their enemy, While the actions of the Snow Elves paint them as simply defending themselves against a hostile enemy that seeks their annihilation by striking first.
*"If It's Hostile, You KILL It."-A Dead Man*
I'm pretty certain Humanity would be considered Hostile by anything other than Human and even by other Humans.
The point of my post is that the world of the Elder Scrolls was built on the back of mutual genocide
Happy Gol-Lucky
This is true BUT that doesn't mean others aren't justified while others are indeed wrong.
The Snow Elves actually most likely were indeed justified in their attack, However that does all depend on exactly what the Atmorans were planing to do with The Eye of Magnus. While the Atmorans just weren't justified at all for the scale of the war/conquest they brought back they took it too far.
All that is suggested in the lore is that the Atmorans were building in their city when they uncovered the Eye, not that they went looking for it or intended to use it. In fact the history suggests that the Atmorans discovered the Eye and then proceeded to attempt to bury it again to keep it's power away from everyone. The Snow Elves learned of the discovery of a powerful artifact and then attacked Saarthal to take that artifact for themselves. There's even the hint that the massacre occurred because the captured Atmorans refused to tell the Snow Elves where they had buried the Eye prior to the attack.
Read the Night of Tears in the game.
This is supported by the fact that after the 500 Companions took back Saarthal and the surrounding area they stopped fighting for a time, something that is mentioned in several lore books, and buried the remains of the city deep underground before going off to fight again against the Elves. If they had any intention of using the Eye why did they immediately bury it upon actually having complete control over it and the surrounding area? Kind of counter intuitive.
Afterwards the Atmorans and the Snow Elves did both try to slaughter the other out of existence for decades with the Atmorans winning out so no one was right in that war, but it's simply unclear if there was ever any desire by the Atmorans to do anything with the Eye at all.
@C Stains
I literally said "However that does all depend on exactly what the Atmorans were planing to do with The Eye of Magnus".
Also to answer the question "If they had any intention of using the Eye why did they immediately bury it upon actually having complete control over it and the surrounding area?"
1. They didn't because they WEREN'T the same group of Atmorans so they NEVER had the same intentions as the last one
OR
2. Ysgramor decided The Eye of Magnus was too powerful or dangerous or wasn't worth the effort to maintain/control or he thought perhaps the Snow Elves would get a hold of it and use it themselves, So he decided it must be buried PERSONALLY.
But Ysgramor actions nor the 500 prove that it wasn't the intent of the previous group to use The Eye of Magnus....Also you admit it's SUGGESTED not proven fact that's what happened.
Are we REALLY logically to believe it was all just coincidence that they found such a Powerful Magical Artifact?! Yeah I don't know about that.
However I also said the Snow Elves were most likely in the wrong too, Because it seems though not proven that they didn't even try to reason or speak with the Atmorans to find out their intentions if any.
But I'd say you're probably right in saying both sides were wrong....That is probably the truth there the whole truth is most likely somewhere in the middle of our thoughts about what happened.
Another awesome video is usual. More Bretons in the future please.
Dragon worshippers shouldn’t have the eye of Magnus
agreed friend, agreed
You deserve a lot more subs.
The Empire screwed their culture so much (dark elf queen in Summerset) that they had to hit an extreme end to break free.
Much like the civil war in Skyrim.
1:53 You had me checking my discord, lol
i have always loved the Altmer, but hated the thalmor.
and
All hail Queen Ayrenn!!!!!!
Weren't they put under imperial rule by threat of being numidiumed?
Sadly, yes
Great video, as someone who has never played anything except Altmer (Eso, Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim)... it's appreciated to see someone willing to do a lore piece that doesn't decimate them.
Oh boy lore time!
Tristan Jackson cool name! That’s my brother’s first name and the last is the town I live in!
As someone who plays Elf characters a lot in Skyrim. I already undermine the Thalmor when even I can.
I can really understand their point of view
Aldmeri dominion quest on regaining their godhood that was lost when lorkhan (known as shor by men) tricked the divines into giving mortality and creating nirn or mundus. The Talos worshipping ban is to weaken not talos but shor's (since it's theorised that dragonborn are aspects of shor) power, thus making the road to godhood easier for the elves. This explains why the mer hate lorkhan and why men adore "him".
I apologise for the confusing explanation, but i do believe fudgemuppet or camelworks made an indepth analysis of the true endgame for the thalmor.
@@HectorJimenez-ee9zi yeh, i know. Dont know why you commented that.
But its a good summary
@@seynkrosis9658 a-ok, bro, have a good day.
@@seynkrosis9658 oh, damn' i read can't instead of can, sorry
Well it helped me 😊
man I had no idea about thoes horrors caused by tiber septim, i always thinked that the were like nazist, that the thinked that they are supreme to all other races and that the other races would become slaves but, no, man if bethesda didn't made us always see the thalmor as monsters, but it could show us this side of the history more easily, man before i seet this video i was one of the people that hated them but now, i support them 100% ( whit the exception that they are killing innocents in skyrim but they just show us the bad people inside and not the good ones) but now i am a aldmeri dominion supporter, one thing, ween they say elven supremasy they mean the they are best rules to make a long peace in Tamriel but all the races will be ruled as equals or that the see the others as inferios and as slaves ( in which now I have my doubts about this idea )
The Veiled Heritance infiltration of the Thalmor in the 2nd Era was much more of a problem than Queen Ayrenn could ever imagine. I am still and forever will be a sympathizer to the Aldmeri Dominion but as a Psijiic I must keep my political views out of my practices
@Effishcent You have clearly never played ESO. Psijic's aren't mindless buffoons. They hold opinions and observe Tamriel frequently.
Basically, they're still salty about their 4 centuries of humiliation since the rise of the Third Empire... Kudos for anyone getting the reference.
oh boy. lore has to wait ... I'm in work again 😡
I am definitely doing this on purpose.
Just kidding, I am sorry :(
Why did Tiber Septim just decide to take that giant Mechagodzilla Power Ranger Mech thing and attack a neighbouring Empire?
To conquer it, of course
I think it is because most human sympathizing elves have Breton children, so when they die there's less elves.
Race traitors.
We need more info on the Morag Tong
Elenwen wants your location 😂
Elder Scrolls 6: Days of Future Past
Main Quest: You are the (chosen one) you have been flung back in time. Your objective is to find and convince Tiber Septim not to unleash the Numidium on the Summerset Isles and prevent the future destruction of Tamriel at the hands of the Altmer supremicist Third Aldmeri Dominion!
I kinda sympathize with the Altmer now seeing this video, humans do tend to be bloodthirsty and power hungry a lot
It's not so much the war and politics as it is hard core racism. Since the mer come from the old elnefay and man was created by lorkan to btfo the aldmer during the mythic era
@@princesstinklepanties2720
Well, the War and Politics all comes down to the Ehlnofey Wars in general, so yeah, Man V Mer is the name of the game (except Redguards and Dunmer, they're on opposite sides given their beliefs)
True. The Mer have had their wrongdoings and their BS problems and negative effects on Tamriel, but the Mer don't start wars as much as the Humans do
@@princesstinklepanties2720 I thought humans also descended from the Elnofeys, hence why they are capable to reproduce with the elves?
@@efaristi9737 they were, altmer came from the old elenofy ie they remembered the time before nirn and lorkans betrayal trapping them as mortals, humans and beast races were wandering elnofey who forgot about their divinity and "degenerated" to the altmer
All hail the Daggerfall Covenant!
The thing I hate about ESO is the faction don’t make sense besides the Aldmeri Dominon. The Bretons/Redguards have always hated the Orcs and their city or Orsinium but ally with them? The Orcs would probably have allied with the nords who have more or less welcomed them in their province. The Argonians lit have been enslaved by the Dark elves since sometime in the late mid-first era. Aldmeri Dominion >
Man can't be trusted so follow queen Ayrenn and be safe
surrender
now
The Thalmor are everything that the Stormcloaks want to be. They get their independence of an empire who didnt help them in a moment of crisis (Oblivion Crisis), they formed their own nation, they prospered and eventually started to conquer other lands from people who oppressed them in the past. They both are traitors to the empire, they are both racist, except that the thalmor succeded in their goal, Stormcloaks... we have to wait and see. The dominion is the future!!! Great video btw.
Neo Riv sometimes reading the comments help me see my in game decisions...thanks
I'll still never bow down to elves. Not that I support the stormcloaks but the empire itself. United provinces under a single banner is the future.
@@Roguephilsopher
How is that the future when it's already been the past?! It's LITERALLY just Regression back to what was! The NEW ideas are the Independence Movements of Skyrim and Argonia as well as PEACE in Hammerfell while Independent. As for the future welp LOOK at real history who ends up on top?
Hint it AIN'T Empires, Monarcies, Dictatorships, Communism or Socialism!
@@flamesofchaos13 if skyrim had its independence, they dont have the men or resources to stand against the dominion. Hammerfell put themselves against a stalemate against the dominion, but I highly doubt they would give up. I believe in independence and unity, without the elves. Tameriel needs the empire for protection against, not just the dominion, but against necromancers, the daedric cults, and dragons.
Man, you are wrong. The only thing AD conquered is South Hammerfell, which is strategically important territory. "They both are traitors to the empire". Traitors of this Empire, which conquered all of Tamriel and killed everyone, who opposed Septim? This is shitty Empire!
Dope video bro
Isn’t the whole goal of the aldmeri dominion to basically return the world to basically back before it even existed or something like that lol
Not exactly
Imperial Knowledge but something along those lines? I mean I’m pretty sure I read somewhere that they want to take down all of the towers pretty much for the world to end or something
Not quite, they seek to recreate a Merethic Era though, might be that you confused it with that.
@@thatguy_66 yes the higher echelons of the thalmor want to unmake nirn to become elnefay again.
A little bit wiser
I can see why the Thalmor hate humans... but there are flaws in their thought process.
1) they say Tiber Septim isn’t a divine, but the blood of a divine was needed to get the Amulet of Kings back, and his blood was successfully used. So don’t tell me Talos ain’t a 9 damn it!
2) yes, humans did so nasty things to you, but what you’re doing makes you no better than them. The 4 era Thalmor have lost sight of what their name meant, and are going to suffer because of it. And this will create an endless cycle of hate and domination until some brave and wise soul says “enough is enough” and forces both into peace (TES:VI plot. I’m calling it here and now!)
Except he was a Dragonborn, so it could be he had the blood of Auriel (Akatosh) in his veins which would've qualified
I think you miss understand. Racism in elder scrolls isnt like our racism, altmer are literally descendents of the elenfay and remember their divinity.
I can't believe that someone made you fanart out of that crown
What do you mean?
I'm talking about the artwork you featured in your end screen, but it does suit you.
While I've personally always been a huge fan of Elves in various media, I don't like the whole "arrogance" thing most of them have going for them. They might be right about Humans in many instances, but still...
Mer in elder scrolls usually are right to be arrogant since they're the descendents of the old elnefay
Elder scrolls hardly invested any growth in them, except for dark elves in morrowind. Who are as different as nords to imperials or argonians.
It's all a matter of perspective, their arrogance comes from their own personal experiences, and as you said, they're often right about humans. Their arrogance can be annoying, true, but their ego and hell, even their superiority complex is understandable if you put yourself in their shoes
@@LoftOfTheUniverse
True, sucks that only the Dunmer really have much Lore established on the side of Elves.
Wood Elves are the most chill of all the Mer. They don't seem to care about the rest of world and everyone else, they just exist in Valenwood and are at one with nature.
Congrats on 20k !!!
Thanks very much! :)
I really dont know what to think about ESO lore. I generally dislike it because of the Molag-Bal "we did oblivions plot again!" stuff and the whole unclear genocide done by my boy Talos. But I really like the second position to the first Talmor Dominions, I just wish they would be executed a bit differently, Especially with the whole Numidium thing, which was pretty much set in place to build up what happend with Nerevar the Tribunal and the storyline of Morrowind
Very good observations!!! Cheers
I don't support the lies and schemes of the 4th era Thalmor but i have never sympathized with the Empire, the elves were right all along, they were oppressed, conquered and forced to surrender to a tyrannical, warring, bloodthirsty empire. And i'm not doing apologism for the Altmer, they've done their fair share of brutal acts but the Empire was the one who used a weapon of mass destruction on them and then forced them to accept the guy who was conquering them as a god. I only wish for the Thalmor to be replaced by someone like Queen Ayrenn, the best elven ruler there has ever been.
''they were opressed'' when? When the Thalmor, with a piss-poor justification, annexed Valenwood and took it over? When they send out its soldiers against the Legion?
Ayrenn was just as much a racist as the present Thalmor. She blames Mankind for the chaos that Tamriel is in during the events of ESO, while it's because of Mannimarco - an Altmer. Ayrenn would rather put an Altmer infant on the ruby throne than a race of man. She believes in Elven supremacy just as much as the present day Thalmor.
Summerset was said to be the birth place of magic for the rest of nirn so the so called high elves claimed it for their own and started to see themselves more superior to everyone else
No the altmer are the closest mer race to the aldmer and want to unmake the world to become gods again
That wasn't always the case they didn't think that way as whole until the 3rd era
didn't they claimed the summerset isles because it was the closest lands to old Aldmeris they had to flee and then they discovered Tamriel later?
@@efaristi9737 since no one has any trace of it.
@@princesstinklepanties2720 only a few shady elite altmer want that. Most altmer aren’t that crazy. I think most altmer want peace but the thalmor used that desire and seized power
I understand better now. Thank you
I always loved the Highelves ! In morrowind, oblivion and skyrim. :)
as do I!!
You know, mannimarco caused the soul burst, using emperor varen aquilarios just to become a God. He was a high elf himself. Mandarin Cameron (I botched his first name, I know) caused the oblivion crisis, by killing uriel septim the seventh (I think he's the seventh) to get a 'paradise' in oblivion. Also a high elf. Now, the dominion want to the ruby throne, because they dont trust men. Uh....no. I absolutely do not trust any altmer when they are in charge. Superior race, my ass.
So basically, the altmer have as much blood on their hands as every other race on Nirn. I don't trust anyone who is in charge, both in real life and in the Elderscrolls. I just naturally mistrust authority.
@@etinarcadiaego7424 that's what I call healthy paranoia. I'm with you on that.
Mandarin Cameron, leader of the Mythic Wontons. :D
Part of the Cameron Dynasty, including esteemed filmmaker James Cameron. :D
@@unifieddynasty who delves deep into the ocean floor lol
Skyrim truly twisted my arm with loyalty. I support skyrim independence but my favorite race is high elves
I have to admit he has a point
I know I'm biased because I'm am human but it really pisses me off that the high els blame the humans for the plane meld, yeah they weren't blameless but mannimarco was a high elf and he was behind the whole thing
Sounds like someone needs to unearth the brass god again give the thalmor the nords those any and all who threaten peace a good kicking. or of course wiping the slate clean and having the world reforged might be the more sustainable option
Did you just described a kalpa without Alduin?
HIGH ELVES ARE NOT PEOPLE
Proceeds to sharpen Wuuthrad
We are the cultured people, FYI.
Elves are technically superior, live longer and more adept in magic. Not just that but they have way longer to train
Cant wait to join the thalmor in es6 idc
As a altmer archmage I support the thalmor because they support magic the humans mostly nords want to be uneducated country hicks the nords used to call there mages clever men I think the world of tamriel needs a mageocracy were the people are learned not idiots
Aldmeri Dominion... basically a coalition formed to defend Tamriel against the humans. Damn😂
Yes and no. The humans beat the elves in atmora and genocided the sinistral elves, the derini clan and the ayelids, at the same time the altmer want to unmake the world to become gods again
@@princesstinklepanties2720 interesting. I have some mixed feelings about this... I think the radical high elves within the dominion need to be rooted out and destroyed for the sake of peace in Tamriel.
A Imperial , an elves, or a stormcloak . It make no difference to Me I’ll send you to Sithis either way
It is no surprise that the Thalmor went after Talos. It would be like forcing the country of Israel to accept Adolph Hitler as a God.
Talos - 3E 417, Thalmor - 3E 433
Except, in the real life case, Hitler got into politics because of the threat of Jewish Communism taking over. In TES universe, it was elves (Jews) that attacked humans (non-Jews) first, via the Night of Tears.
That's a bad comparison. Talos's actions were those of warfare, not ethnic cleansing.
Snowelves who are attacking nords has something to do with tiber septim conquering the whole continet hundreds of years later.
Bazgoth Ar go back to Atmora, Snow Mohammed.
Personally I sympathize with the old High elves though I am a pro imperial
So mad at the humans for committing genocide they decided to deal with it by commiting genocide
Yep it's something a LOT of Civilizations do like for instance the Nazis of Germany!
I call it simply Absolute Idiotically Evil Hypocrisy.
National Socialism was a reaction to Jewish Communist take over. Nice try, asshole.
Such is the sick, sad cycle of sentient life.
@SamTheFallenSon 69 the thing about war is that the winner writes the history. If Germany and Japan would have won WWII no one would talk about the killed jews. Everyone would hate the Americans for dropping a nuclear bomb on civilians.
@@MrHogGamer Oh boy, looks like we've found one.
The Altmer have very few reasons not to hate Man.
True,
Look what Ysgramor did to the Snow Elves? Committed an Ethnic Cleansing of an entire Civilization culture, history... he even nearly ended their race, all because they supposedly "killed everyone in Saarthal", even though there's evidence that the Snow Elves didn't have any intention of wiping out all the Nords, nor did they how with the intention of Sacking Saarthal.
For all we know, it may have been the Atmorans who aggravated the Snow Elves to the point they decided to go into Saarthal at night for an investigation of the power radiating from it. If Michael Kirkbride's um... "Lore" is anything to go off of, well.... then it means the Atmorans were dangerous and took the Eye of Magnus away even though both races previously had it in shared possession.
Even if you don't take his word for cannon, given its clear they didn't intend on wiping the other settlements out in Skyrim, it was just a botched operation gone wrong in Saarthal and that lead to bloodshed for the Night of Tears.
Either way, Ysgramor should've ended the war to respect the fallen Snow Prince who fought valiantly to keep Solsthiem out of human hands. They gave him and only him an honorable burial, so obviously in respect for his valor, the Nords should've let their people be. But no, they butchered the Snow Elves at the end of the battle.
The Allesians turned on their Aylied Allies who helped them in the rebellion against other Aylieds and never did anything wrong to them for centuries, and drove them out of Cyrodiil and killed many in the process.
After what Tiber Septum did to the Altmer with the Numidium, as much as I don't condone the Thalmor's actions, I completely understand why the Altmer of Summerset would be pissed.
@@thalmoragent9344 what do the Falmer have to do with it? They're a world away from Summerset Isle.
@@lagartoverdebr6176
Well, I brought them up, then the Aylieds and lastly the Altmer to make a point that more often than not, its usually humans mass murdering huge swaths of innocent Mer, not much the other way around.
Oh, and same goes for the Sinestral Elves.
Really, if you think about it, don't think any Elves have ever put any races of Humans to Extinction. We have plenty of evidence of the opposite happening
@@thalmoragent9344 Redguards and Sinestral Elves have always fought against each other, they're not "innocent"
Tiber did too much trolling
Thank you 4 this video!
Dame those gold tall n'wah
I can understand the general Altmeri position of anger and mistrust towards humans, although I can’t support the racial superiority bent that the Thalmor have going on there. They could’ve consolidated power on the past genocide alone. While I almost always play a High Elf, that aspect leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
For the queen!
I watch your videos a lot in my free time. I would really like to see you cover more ESO stuff.
how are you talking from beyond the grave
CommanderM117 such is possible when you have achieved CHIM
indeed vivec did the same side note how is your dunmer assassin Dram
CommanderM117 not so lucky
most likely in a deadric realm as most dunmer do when they die i will let you get back to being a god got some thalmor to kill and rebuild morrowind
Althmer all talk till you leave them in a pool of their own blood
i just burn them alive safer and more painful along with legion scum
They’re at least smarter than Stormcloak scum
Mooie video. Ga vooral zo door, man.
All of that historic information is cool, but there’s always this bigger picture. There’s no way to get around this, guys. The Aldmeri Dominon’s mission is to erase the mortar realm i.e. wipe out all of Mundus.
That’s why they are so menacing. They don’t target men exclusively. Anyone who’s in their way is considered enemy, including the altmer specimen who don’t support their cause. Besides the men of Reach are actually their allies.
Altmer are not Evil or Bad or anything. Other races want to live their lives on Nirn. Altmer guys seek divination.
That’s what it’s all about, and not like about stupid wars over the pack of chips.
That’s just a theory and hasn’t been proven as of yet
it’s only the thalmor that believe that. the altmer in skyrim working the stables at windhelm would have no clue about all of that stuff, like most altmer
Altmer bad XP watch fudge muppets "why men suck" video
I feel the Dark Efls are next on the chopping block why? If you have people who can talk to their ancestors and worship daedra that has much has a tie to Mundus has Nords with telos.
alright I wont dislike, just because you're so nice
DO IT! DO IT!...........................................DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
M Lupa Noir why would you dislike?
Dorian Prince I said that because of the joke he did about it. Even so I'm kinda mad whenever he talks about the siperiority of mer. I mean, what about a human empire conquering Tamriel and preserving peace like 400 years between all races?
@@ledanoir1239 to be frank it wasn't really peaceful all the time
11/10 I love your videos
So basically Thalmor are the ccp
with their long lives; were any of them Aylieds too or not?
Ekim Aulthar No, all elves are descended from the Aldmer.The Altmer are the descendents of Aldmer who did not migrate to Tamriel from the Summerset Isles, whereas the Ayleids are the descendents of Aldmer who migrated to and settled in Cyrodiil. Moreover, the Ayleid survivors of the human slave revolt were taken in by the Bosmer of Valenwood, and it’s believed that after a few generations of interbreeding they were absorbed into that race. Hope this helped answer your question!
@@estebanuniversidad6976 I heard somewhere the upper echelon of the thalmor were alyeids
Damn elves.
Khajiit has wares if you have coin
Shades of grey always make better stories.
Not when it's boring like in skyrim. Nobody is likeable ulfric and the empire were lame and the thalmor were just arrogantly hostile. Oh wait almost everybody was.
So they are NSDAP equivalent in Tamriel
I hate the 3rth ad, but i cant help but feel sad for them :/ their people did got damaged pretty badly by tiber septim -_- knowing how slow reproduction is for them, the altmer couldve gone extinct :/
Amd its true that the races of men, the orcs and the dunmer are most occupied waging wars, argonians just stick in argonia warwise, bosmer cant even wage war in valenwood because the meat mandate bids them to consume all they kill, the khajiit altho the north and the south are often in conflict, they still avoid oneanother and dont bother the outside for as far as im aware
Ofc the aldmeri dominion changed everything
Poor argonians
But then the covenant and pact did similair horrible things so i shouldnt be too suppriced, but i think committing genocide is worse then attacking some corral or attacking a city or concpiring with an enemy of your enemy
I always found it funny that the deminion was started during the plains meld do their preceved distrust of humans in power even thou it was actually menimaro who started it and vide for power as an altmor
Dude I just saw this video in my recommended, and as someone who has a strong affinity for the High Elves, The Aldmeri Dominion AND the complexities of the Thalmor, this video you made really made me feel less closed off from the the peeps who are pro imperial and stuff.
I pay close attention to Elder Scrolls story details about certain aspects of the Lore and one thing that always stood out to me was how the High Elves in ESO under Queen Ayrenn seem to be FAR more bent on achieving peace in Tamriel over the radical and dictatorial Thalmor in Skyrim. It was kind of odd to see this shift when comparing Ayrenn’s goals to the things Elenwen and other Justiciars allude to because they come off as Radical Supremacists.
The idea that the reason High Elves first acted the way they did to men and others such as orcs and dark elves wasn’t because they believed they were superior but instead was due to them just wanting to be left alone to live peacefully. They tolerated them but saw how much they bathed in each other’s blood through endless wars to be beneath them and the event that almost tore the whole of Tamriel a sunder being caused by a man that was manipulated into thinking he could possess the Blood of the Dragons to legitimize his claim to the throne only served to fuel the High Elves’ idea that, “If you are left to toil with all this power so irresponsibly then you’ll bring about the end of days,” which is why the feel it was their duty to try and seize Emperorship.
The massacre they suffered and being forced under Tiber Septim’s Rule naturally left the Altmer who lived through the bloodbath to see their home get forced under a foreign rule to be extremely jaded and bitter, even more so with Talos’s ascension into Godhood.
When you factor in all of this, you really do get a good understanding on why the Thalmor did what they did as told in Skyrim. This of course isn’t to try and excuse or justify their actions but at least you know what they went through to get to the point they were at in Skyrim and it really makes me ALL the more disappointed that the Thalmor couldn’t have been joined as a Third Party Faction in the Civil War quest line because you could at least learn some of why they are the way they are. But you did that spectacularly with this video man! Great job!
Where can I see more of this? I want to learn more about the elves
Long live the Empire
The Empire of Tamriel will rise again
All hail Talos and long live the Empire!
Down with the weak empire Skyrim belongs to the Nords
After my I complete the main quest line again, I'll pay Elenwen a visit. With a black soul gem as her new home. No mercy for the wicked. Lawful Good does not mean lawful nice.
I mean... a black soul gem prison isn't even Lawful Good, that's just cruel 👀
@@thalmoragent9344 what part of lawful good doesn't mean lawful nice don't you understand?
@@SuperLumianaire
If it's a lawful thing at all, you wouldn't be damming her for an eternity in the Soul Cairn... that's now Lawful good at all, that's hardly a Lawful action at all, unless you plan on letting her go after the enchantment has been used so she can go to whatever Elven God she prays to the most
@nir fir
Nah mate, plenty of shitty necromancers or Vampires that would be best in the Soul Cairn, not a Thalmor woman doing her job.
Remember, the Empire told Ulfric he could still worship Talos and all that, so when the Thalmor found out they were trying to negotiate that from the White-Gold Concordat, that's when they decided to send the Justiciars to Skyrim, so as to uphold the Concordat.
@nir fir
Yeah, swift kill is fine. Lawful good, you responded to her justice with your own.
Can you make a video about the lifespan's of all races ?
Most pure blooded mer can live thousands of years, neloth is 4k years old. Atmorans used to also live this long but alduin ate their years and so they got normal human life spans
@@princesstinklepanties2720 Elves can live up to 300 or so normally, 400 if you are an altmer. The ones that live up to the thousands do so because of magic, and as we don't know much about how magic can affect aging, we don't know if humans could simply live as much with it.
Long live the empire and down with the thoim
Let the Empire of men rise!!!
Lets be honest here, the empire would just rise again as usual.
You CAN'T rise WHEN YOU'VE ALREADY BEEN IN POWER FOR CENTURIES! You fools need to tell the difference between Rising to Power AND Ascending to Power AND The HEIGHT of Power!
Flames Of Chaos Are you not aware that the empire just has only 3 provinces Cyrodil, Skyrim, and High Rock. That isn’t much power.
@Dirty Dan
I DIDN'T say their at their Height of Power or even Ascending to Power! My response is about how these guys are mixing all these terms into one single one! The Imperials are at a Middle-Ground kind of position in terms of Political and Geographical Powers....They're NOT doing Horrible BUT they also AIN'T doing Good either at least in the Events of Skyrim! So my point still STANDS....IF they AIN'T in a Decline or at the Bottom then there's NO reason to Rise in the first place BECAUSE they're NOT at the Bottom or Decline!
You DON'T have to rise when you're ALREADY there....They RULE a Quarter of the Entirety of Tamriel with an Imperial Victory in Skyrim AND are in Decent Terms with Hammerfell, Morrowind AND even the Territories of the Aldmeri Dominion to have GREAT Trade! That's NOT bad at all!
Also the Time of Jagar Tharn occupying the Throne AND the Events before the Warp of the West WERE the *Worst* point in the 3rd Empire of Tamriel's Power NOT in Skyrim DESPITE the reduction in Territories! (MULTIPLE Civil Wars, an Impostor Emperor FOR a DECADE, Racial and Nationalist-Terrorists IN the Territories of the Empire, OPEN Rebellion of the Empire's Second MOST important Province The Territories of High Rock split into Multiple Petty Rival Kingdoms seeking the Power to overthrow the Empire's Will, Orcish Bandit Hordes, Demonic Invasion....ETC)
Also for the MOST part Morrowind and Hammerfell during the Empire's Golden Years WERE Independent in all BUT name, So losing them ISN'T that big a blow whatsoever to the Empire's Political or Economical or Geographical Power Holdings. WHICH is why THEY(The Imperials/Empire) CHOSE to let them go DESPITE being ABLE to EASILY take them back!
P.S. I'M Dirty Dan you Sponge!
P.P.S. The CORRECT Term IS Ascending to Power IF the Empire IMPROVES EVEN MORE then they already have after Skyrim!
FOR THE GLORY OF THE EMPIRE!!!!
Great vid!