All apps are inevitably like that, everyone with modicum of common sense knows CCP's threat in comparison to any foreign threat, cope, seethe, & dilate🤪🤪🤪
Literally, _literally,_ 1984. The perception of an international adversary keeps the people's hostilities directed outwards, so they're less likely to focus inwards.
I mean, maybe a little bit? If it’s a Russian national, then turning over data to the FSB is meh. If it’s a US National, there are more legal options for charges against them.
@@dansmith7009 If you have operations within a given country, you must follow all their laws if you wish to continue operating there. Look at the actions that the EU is taking against companies like Microsoft and Apple in the wake of the Digital Markets Act. If they are collecting data that they aren't allowed to, then fine, ban them until they modify their policies,. BUT, if they are doing exactly as other social media companies do, honestly what is the concern? What difference does it make if China is harvesting this information directly, or if they're buying it from data brokers? We could nip this entire thing in the bud by banning companies from harvesting data that makes such direct targettied advertising illegal, but we don't. Our lawmakers are fine when it's American companies doing it, but when a foreign interest does the same playing within the ruels you set why jump to banning them?
Not privacy but on who has the ability to invade it and who can pull the strings on those doing so. The privacy is going to be invaded by most pieces of tech we have and any apps on them.
They wanted to ban all social media in the UK at one point because under age people got on it and got to see things they shouldn’t. Disabled people among others were very angry at this. Without the internet and social media disabled people have… very little social interaction unless governments do something for them.
It's not fascist bro not even remotely close You could argue it's authoritarian ( you'd still be wrong but you'd have a better chance of convincing someone) but it's not fascist Fascism is a very specific core of vague tenets that very very few modern countries follow so before you water down the word fascism even more read some Giovanni Gentile 😂
@@Lord-of-The-West-Weald If you are talking about the US, the GOP is fascist and trying to take over, ergo a fascist state should they succeed. If you are talking about China... After what has happened to Tibet and the uyghurs muslims (and these are just the ones I know about) then it is definitely fascist.
That's funny because the ceo of tiktok came out to say that the proposition that tikitok can find a buyer in the 6 months that this bill proposes to be "utterly inconceivable"
The Chinese government would probably not allow the tiktok algorythm to fall into foreign hands, so if they sell it to an american company it won't work the same.
I have videos there but I'm not a large creator and I haven't posted since last summer. This morning I went there and found half my videos muted because of copyright issues. I make my videos specifically to tie into he music I use, right down to the cuts. With the mutes, they're all ruined. Fucking hate the rich.
I hate to be doomer, but it sucks because it feels like they're just gonna get away with it too. I hope that it makes younger generations radicalize and vote more, but all I can see happening is "How dare they! I'm still not gonna vote though" It's so insanely difficult to convince people to actually fight for themselves and stop stuff like this from happening.
this isnt about china. it is very clearly israel lobby. gop have wanted and tried to ban tiktok since 2017 or so and failed spectacularly. dems never were close to joining on. to have them jump aboard all the sudden means it is because israel lobby pushes it.
Government overreaching is always a threat. Banning Tiktok is acceptable, but then America should also fix their own social media platforms in the process. Banning other countries social media because they are quote "an adversary" is cowardly imo
@@daraghokane4236TikTok can be American backed too if it wants to exist here. :) Saudi is a business partner not an ally. China crying about fair competition, who owns 57% of Shanghai Disney again???? :D
I read this as 'forced diversity in Grindr' and spent a solid minute trying to figure out how the US government could control the sociological makeup of the bottom community.
While the influence of the chinese gov't is harmful, I'm also worried the ban will further reduce the amount of competition online. I really don't want just two or three tech companies controlling social media
We don't need trains in the US. We'll have millions of miles of Hyper Loop in the coming weeks now that Elon perfected his boring character. I mean process.
Arguably, when he was headed to Jerusalem and had to pass through Samaria. Not quite the same, but the Samarians saw him as a foreigner (and an insult to their gods) and refused to receive him. This is, naturally, seen as a bad thing in Christianity, because I guess immigrants are okay when it's *their* immigrants.
I dislike the authoritarian banning of apps like this, but I'm not gonna pretend that TikTok is some great platform that we all benefit so much from keeping around. I don't have data on this, and I'd like to look into it further, but TikTok and bite-sized social media content has clearly directly curtailed the attention span, literacy, and media diets of so many people that it's not even funny. Gen Alpha barely reads, and many teachers report that their students' literacy skills are literally several grade-levels below where they should be. Bad media analysis is rampant, and so many people just openly spread falsehoods, twisted narratives, outright lies or rumors just because they saw it on TikTok and didn't have the media literacy to see through it. Bad parenting, broader issues in the educational system and tough economic conditions are absolutely the largest factors affecting this, but TikTok is _absolutely_ worsening this phenomenon. China, Russia, Iran and other countries are also conducting propaganda operations on western countries that are beyond f---ed in their scope and scale, and if banning TikTok is what can curb some of it, then I say it's better than letting them sow propaganda and disinformation freely. People are easier to control when they only care about bite-sized attention-grabbing content as it's effectively reducing their ability to understand or dissect the nuances found in longer-form content, which in turn limits their ability to express those more nuanced ideas themselves. When you only think in TikTok length, all you'll be able to express is sensational BS and incomplete, un-nuanced ideas. People can doomsay all they want, but I, for one, am looking at this with _cautious_ optimism.
@@kirakoraawesome I, however, do have data on this! They're studying social media impact fervently in academia these days, and what OP said is pretty much spot-on.
The question is whether it has curtailed short attention span or people were born with that kind of span already, that's why they are attracted to that kind of content in the first place, usually thats how it works, ADHD is a real thing, and nurture has hardly any effect over the nature in this case.
It's not about personal info, it's about influencing. There is no way China will not do it. It's incredible how effective Russian propaganda is online and China's resources and control of the internet is on a whole different level. When they'll start being serious about it it will change the world.... they don't seem to have a clear objective yet.
As a cybersecurity MA candidate, I actually think forcing its sale to a U.S. owner is a better option than banning it, but whatever the case, it's just a dealbreaker for 150 million + people to get their news from a platform that can be more easily weaponized for disinfo than Facebook, with even less accountability. This isn't a "muh freeze peach" issue, let's not whatabout this like people did with Facebook's congressional hearings. The issue is about the people's failure at media literacy, susceptibility to propaganda, foreign and domestic, and ultimately how financially cheap it is to cause very very expensive disruption in other countries. Ask any cybersecurity researcher working out there and in academia, and they tend to treat Tiktok with about as much weariness as the goddamn demon core.
Still remember the Singaporean TikTok guy getting done dirty with the King of the Hill bit. 'Are you Chinese or Japanese?' 'No sir, I am from Singapore.' I'd look at you crazy if you told me that happened, then I would realize yeah that could happen ༼;´༎ຶ ༎ຶ༽
Depends on how you look on the race thing and how you feel about racial definitions. I only have a dutch nationality but i fully admit that racially i am chinese. Culturally i am way more dutch then Chinese. It is however kinda impossible for me to say i am not racially chinese since both my parents kinda came from China and are ethnically chinese. I do think people with Asian backgrounds and nationalities might look differently at this as racially the backgrounds are way more similar appearance wise. Also in some asian countries the people that can trace their lineage to Chinese immigrants is rather significant as they form a rather big part of their population.
The fact that Trump would even say we Gen Z would all switch to Facebook if Tiktok dies 😂 Really shows how much of a Boomer he is. I dont know beyond 2 people my age who seriously uses facebook beyond familial obligation. Everyone else is on insta, snap, dord, what have you. But ig I do agree with Trump on one thing, Facebook sucks
Honestly in terms of election year shenanigans and absolute insanity, this is fairly mid to at least what I was expecting from the political establishment
@@hadronoftheseus8829 Astroturfed? paranoid much? 😂 Election year shenanigans, pretty straightforward you know *vaguely gestures at literally everything in politics*
@@hadronoftheseus8829culture war issues flare up,Politics finaly make good on a promise or two, virtue signaling , demonizing the other side, misusing the court system against political enemies , That sort of shenanigans that happens about every year or so
@@hadronoftheseus8829 He means that it is 2024, we have elections this year, millions of people use TikTok, and it's easy to use it to spread political disinformation. It seems kinda obvious.
I will gladly get my Online Data spied on by Corpos, if the alternative is a state that is authoritarian to the Core. A money-grabbing Corporation only cares that I keep consuming content. A State wants me to consume specific content.
Who decides who our geopolitical adversaries are? Also if you get shown Chinese, or anyone else's for that matter, propaganda, and you can't identify it, then that's on you bud. You can't regulate away stupid.
@@NatoStormContent doesn't have to be pro the adversary to be harmful. Just simply sowing divisions by leaning into political wedge issues and inciting divisive content and behavior could be equally, if not more destructive.
Except they are currently doing a Big Good with it (Israel footage, helping spread the BDS boycott, Ukraine footage) That doesn't preclude them doing it at a later date of course, but either they are jumping the gun or under the thumb of AIPAC/ADL
Tiktok in america is already controlled and has a separate system that's IN AMERICA. Tiktok's algorithm is also literally just "recommend videos to people that they'll like." The content on tiktok is also all made by its users. Please explain how the Chinese government is manipulating Tiktok content?
I'm really tired of mfrs talking about Palestine like WE didn't do it to iraq and Afghanistan forever... I understand that a lot of people cared when that was happening but corporate interests never swayed in the face of any of this. Palestine has NOTHING to do with this acquisition. It's specifically a tech venture to cut off influence and make the product worthless so that an American tech billionaire can buy it cheaper than it would've been otherwise. To pretend this has anything to do with Israel Palestine is the most pigeon holed shittake ive ever heard of and flies in the face of real DATA that this channel used to care about.
Seriously. I subbed to Vaush way back because I liked how he was far more analytical than other leftist creators and paid more attention to the details of the situation than most, but now it's like he's not putting in any of the effort he used to, and just says whatever reflexive shit first comes to mind. He's starting to remind me of Hasan, and I fucking hate that.
(I myself am not a lawyer) Would this bill violate Bytedance's or their shareholders' due process rights under the 5th amendment of the constitution by just imposing an ultimatum? Depending on how the bill is written, it might skirt too close to the territory of being a Bill of Attainder (declaring an entity guilty/illegal by legislative fiat) or an Ex Post Facto law (declaring an action to be illegal retroactively, and imposing consequences).
"Would this bill violate Bytedance's or their shareholders' due process rights under the 5th amendment of the constitution..." No. Full stop, no caveats. "Due process" is not a legal term of art and the constitution offers _exactly zero protections_ to non citizens, and a fortiori it offers none to foreign corporations.. Tiktok's only recourse is to whatever trade agreements apply. I've _no_ doubt we'll be hearing plenty of sophomoric whining from the selfsame people who think (or affect to think) that the first amendment precludes private corporations from having terms of service.
I'm not a lawyer either, but I think what you just said is conjecture. The US laws are different than the Chinese laws and if you do business in the states, you must follow such laws. A company isn't a citizen btw, so I doubt the ammendents have any bearing over a Chinese business. However, I'm not really fluent in American laws so this is also conjecture probably.
All of the stuff I know about legal mumbo jumbo comes from the Ace Attorney games which is irrelevent as it's a hodge podge of Japanese and US legal systems in video game format
No. Full stop, no caveats. "Due process" is not even a legal term of art and the constitution offers _exactly zero protections_ to noncitizens_ and a fortiori it offers none to foreign corporations. No real precedent is being set here, and Tiktok's only recourse is to whatever trade agreements apply.
As a foreign company, it's not protected by the 4th (not 5th!) Amendment. Protections are given under some U.S. code I don't have my lawyer friends around to ask about, though, but last I recall there are plenty. It wouldn't be good for America as a supporter of business otherwise.
“American government is infinitely worse” okay Vaush, what’s the American counterpart for TikTok which should be collecting personal information and manipulating domestic politics in foreign countries?
All of them. They are making profits by literally selling your data to whoever pays more, so other governments as well, but not directly. Usually those are some shell companies.
So many questions with this issue. Will it be illegal to utilize a VPN in order to use tiktok on a phone? Will the phone companies be banned from using chinese factories to produce the phones that run the app? Why don't they do something important like maybe pass a damned budget? Why is the news coming out of Congress always so stupid if we really live in a meritocracy?
no. Banning an app's distribution does not equate to applying punitive measures to those who insist on going out of their way to gain access to it here. Especially not the way the bill is written.
@@Blackgriffonphoenixg I think that was their point - they were rhetorically pointing out how inefficient and flawed this bill is. On paper, that sounds good, but the problem is that when bills fail to do what they're supposed to, the gov't tends to pass new ones trying to "fix" it. Which all have their own problems which require fixing...
@@BlackgriffonphoenixgRepublicans have talked about using period tracking apps to go after girls that might later get an abortion. Laws an easily get twisted.
Why not just ban all social media at this point? Maybe im missing something here, but all these issue stem from the existence of these platforms no matter what country its from. Its cutting a weed but not pulling the root. Something like it will take its place in due time. Just doing it for TikTok seems so half assed. Be bold and brash.
Vaush’s takes have only gotten worse since H3H3’s videos on him. No wonder he keeps losing subs. I legitimately have no idea what the strategy is here. Appealing to an even more radical audience? If so, guess it’s time for me to leave as well
Not sure if I'm misinterpreting the text if the law, or if presidential exceptions are common for these sorts of things, but I feel like with Trump expressing opposition to the law right after Biden said he would sign off on it, I would expect that this will be another issue Republicans could run on to pull Gen Z support from Biden
Why would they ban TikTok if the president has one? Aren’t there other things more important? Such as rising food, rent, home prices, ??? Not American so maybe I miss some important context.
Those aren't problems for the lawmakers to solve, because capitalism demands an underclass to exploit and profit from. Helping with those things in any substantial way threatens business as usual.
Unironically though I know this is an unpopular take with the zoomers but TikTok's effect on the youth has been a fucking disaster. I wish the other forms of short form content will go but this is a good step
I normally agree with Vaush, but this is an absolutely awful take. Seriously, you think the US is going to be okay with a foreign adversary meddling with them? Since when did Vaush become a China sympathizer?
Btw if Trump is against it, maybe the republicans in the Senate will vote against it. I suppose he didn't have time to tell the House how to behave, hence why it passed.
@@Jon-eo1lz now imagine China forcing Ford to divest ownership of their factory in Detroit to this native Chinese partner. The employees in Detroit now have a new CEO in Shanghai instead of NYC.
China could take banning on a whole another if they wanted to. Apple a trillion dollar company manufacturers in China, they could ban them easily. Amazon which is another trillion dollar company has 70% of sellers that get their products from China, they could easily destroy Amazon in a single day if they wanted. I can keep going but it will be too long, they could do serious economic damage to the US if they really wanted to.
@@emilchan5379 until the workers in Detroit decide to go on strike. The Chinese government has ways to deal with striking workers...."Hey, what happened to Bob from the local 247 Union?" "I don't know, he went into work today and disappeared never to be seen again."
This is like saying look slander is a crime why not hate speech, I don't see a problem with foreign owned tv shows, I would have no problem with the BBC Russia today, Ai Jazeera and Fox news all being on one cable box, hell even just for verity thats good whats happening In Europe turn on the BBC whats happening in the Middle east turn on Ai Jazeera America Fox news, are these stations perfect and honest no. But its not Like Fox stands out as the most honest
@@Jorge-np3tqRegulation of foreign ownership of media companies is the norm. Norway always ranks at the top of free freedom indices and they regulate ownership.
if you are a foreign business owner who the united states is not on good terms with your days of doing business in the united states are numbered if you don't play ball with washington and no matter where you fall on the political isle this kind of government overreach is too much.
I don't think there's really a thing of precedent here. China has been our top economic enemy for a while now. Neither of us are going to allow the other to maintain Ws like this. This is how geopolitics works unfortunately. It sucks but it's not "scary".
China is not an enemy. The government of China just does really freaky sh*t but America also does really freaky sh*t, so both countries need to stop doing freaky sh*t
Short-form, instant gratification content is here to stay. I use tiktok to get underground music recs, but it's no skin off my ass. There are plenty of other places to find it
@@Newton-ReutherDoesn’t really make sense because the reason behind the ban would be because TikTok is owned by a Chinese company while Facebook is owned by an American company.
If the government can force TikTok to sell the company to an American owner, would this set the precedent that the government can force CEOs and corporations to sell their businesses to their workers?
I'm gonna be honest I had no idea you took notes on what you were planning to stream. I thought you were just winging it 100% of the time. Now I think you're winging it like 80% of the time.
There were some in the house who were apparently on the fence about the bill, but then TikTok started telling its users to call their representatives and complain about it... And this pissed off a ton of politicians since all of them started receiving like over a thousand calls a day... So TikTok seemingly encouraged the fence-sitters to vote against TikTok with that move...
I don't quite recall, but didn't they have some sort of slogan back then? Something about a swamp? Don't know why this popped up in my head right now though..
Damn it's funny and sad how boomer Vaush and so many other huge personalities like even Penguinz0 Charlie can be about TikTok. Vaush could have such huge reach over there and the youth is much better informed and on his side than he thinks. Charlie thinks it's still a platform about dancing and only trending songs. Get with the times.
0:00 Teaser / Intro
0:14 TikTok Livestream Segment
13:50 New Offline TikTok Segment
Falsified information.
I wuv u
@@CXLVIIWhat are you, gay???
@@CXLVIIgay
@13:50 was a lie
"It should be illegal for any video to be less than 5 minutes"
Thermia: *violently sweating*
😰
verdadero
clearly this is a shadow plot from the video essayists to force everyone to sit down and watch hour long videos
It all makes sense now!
💯 truly an underrated comment.
True
I, for one, support this move by Big Essayists.
tiktok: And The Death of Tiktok / 5 hours essay
American Politicians: If any social media website is going to steal users' data it better be an American one!
Stop it
All apps are inevitably like that, everyone with modicum of common sense knows CCP's threat in comparison to any foreign threat,
cope, seethe, & dilate🤪🤪🤪
I wanted your comment uo make me feel something.
@@henocksherlock3340
Rebel cumrag in profile pic opinion immediately discarded .
@@henocksherlock3340Says the guy with the participation trophy flag as his pfp
Older gen z already survived the death of Vine, we can survive this death, too.
Yeah
Not comparable. Vine was irrelevant. And Vine wasn't banned
vine was ass tho tiktok is like a legitimate platform
Zillennials! We're called Zillennials.
@DavidWest2 bro you clearly werent part of the vine demographic. It was huge
*"He would name it Xik Xok"*
Good lord 😂 Elon would
"Xix xox"
If anyone bought tiktok and named it anything other than “cik cok” I’d be mad
no he'd call it TT or Tick Cock because he's a literal manchild.
And then it would be called, "Xik Xok, the app formerly known as Tik Tok,"
@@horseydino Sneed vibes
Literally, _literally,_ 1984. The perception of an international adversary keeps the people's hostilities directed outwards, so they're less likely to focus inwards.
I would go with "Its a shame you cant afford to buy it..." the free speech stuff is good.
They could have called it the anti-Fascist influence law but the GOP would never have supported it.
Ok now ban Temu. My roommate can't stop himself 🤣
Yes! Their products are cheap shit, ther ads are obnoxious, I've yet to learn a single redeeming quality about them.
Fr the sheer amount of cheap garbage bought on temu is terrifying
If the only thing that changes is who the owner is, the concern was never over privacy.
I mean, maybe a little bit? If it’s a Russian national, then turning over data to the FSB is meh. If it’s a US National, there are more legal options for charges against them.
@@dansmith7009 If you have operations within a given country, you must follow all their laws if you wish to continue operating there. Look at the actions that the EU is taking against companies like Microsoft and Apple in the wake of the Digital Markets Act.
If they are collecting data that they aren't allowed to, then fine, ban them until they modify their policies,. BUT, if they are doing exactly as other social media companies do, honestly what is the concern? What difference does it make if China is harvesting this information directly, or if they're buying it from data brokers? We could nip this entire thing in the bud by banning companies from harvesting data that makes such direct targettied advertising illegal, but we don't. Our lawmakers are fine when it's American companies doing it, but when a foreign interest does the same playing within the ruels you set why jump to banning them?
@@dansmith7009Facebook already leaking our shit 1000x
Not privacy but on who has the ability to invade it and who can pull the strings on those doing so. The privacy is going to be invaded by most pieces of tech we have and any apps on them.
Alright Zelda fan, let me break it down for you:
Taking something away from Ganon and giving it to a Hylian is a big difference.
They wanted to ban all social media in the UK at one point because under age people got on it and got to see things they shouldn’t. Disabled people among others were very angry at this. Without the internet and social media disabled people have… very little social interaction unless governments do something for them.
Kinda surprised companies like Google, & Apple didn't lobby to get this ban killed considering TikTok is popular on multiple platforms?
kinda seems like this might be a negotiated political W...wonder what comes next...
why would they care? people don't buy phones FOR tiktok.
They’re probably looking to buy it
Google might be hoping that UA-cam Shorts will get a big boost if TikTok gets banned.
They obviously want to take over that market share for themselves.
Fascism with trains > fascism with no trains
I agree in principle, but damn, fascism AND trains have a daaark historical connection...
It's not fascist bro not even remotely close
You could argue it's authoritarian ( you'd still be wrong but you'd have a better chance of convincing someone) but it's not fascist
Fascism is a very specific core of vague tenets that very very few modern countries follow so before you water down the word fascism even more read some Giovanni Gentile 😂
😪it's a joke man@@Lord-of-The-West-Weald
well yes but I just like how Vaush says things in a funny way sometimes@@FatalAlcatraz
@@Lord-of-The-West-Weald If you are talking about the US, the GOP is fascist and trying to take over, ergo a fascist state should they succeed. If you are talking about China... After what has happened to Tibet and the uyghurs muslims (and these are just the ones I know about) then it is definitely fascist.
The question is not if tiktok is banned but if China will sell Tiktok to another company to make money.
I think they will. Tiktok without access to the American market is dead. They should sell it to Elon Musk so he can fuck it up just like twitter 😂
That's funny because the ceo of tiktok came out to say that the proposition that tikitok can find a buyer in the 6 months that this bill proposes to be "utterly inconceivable"
I mean, it wouldn't be China, the CEO of TikTok is Singaporean.
@@FelisImpurrator The CEO is Singaporean sure, but that doesn’t change the fact that TikTok is owned by the Chinese government
The Chinese government would probably not allow the tiktok algorythm to fall into foreign hands, so if they sell it to an american company it won't work the same.
This country has collectively lost its f'in' mind.
I dont even use tik tok, but this smells like BS.
You're objectively incorrect. Foreign corporations have _exactly zero_ constitutional rights.
I have videos there but I'm not a large creator and I haven't posted since last summer. This morning I went there and found half my videos muted because of copyright issues. I make my videos specifically to tie into he music I use, right down to the cuts. With the mutes, they're all ruined. Fucking hate the rich.
I hate to be doomer, but it sucks because it feels like they're just gonna get away with it too. I hope that it makes younger generations radicalize and vote more, but all I can see happening is "How dare they! I'm still not gonna vote though"
It's so insanely difficult to convince people to actually fight for themselves and stop stuff like this from happening.
Real dark times are ahead
@@TheStarSquid I know it feels that way....I think it will be better when the gerentocracy finally kicks off.
McCarthy is celebrating in Hell.
I thought you meant Kevin for a second but I laughed anyway…
this isnt about china. it is very clearly israel lobby. gop have wanted and tried to ban tiktok since 2017 or so and failed spectacularly. dems never were close to joining on. to have them jump aboard all the sudden means it is because israel lobby pushes it.
I vote Fascism with trains. TRAINS RIGHTS!!!! 🚂🏳⚧✊
Yesss
Spirit Tracks was always best Zelda game after all
@@GBomb9704 dude i LOVED spirit tracks!
Hell yeah
@@GBomb9704 YES. That's it. Just yes.
Government overreaching is always a threat. Banning Tiktok is acceptable, but then America should also fix their own social media platforms in the process. Banning other countries social media because they are quote "an adversary" is cowardly imo
China bans Tiktok.
Yeah, a slippery slope but I want TikTok banned for ethical not secutity reasons.
@@SerendipityChild And American ally Saudi Arbia bans Queer stuff from the internet wha'ts your point? That's worse and american backed
@@daraghokane4236TikTok can be American backed too if it wants to exist here. :) Saudi is a business partner not an ally. China crying about fair competition, who owns 57% of Shanghai Disney again???? :D
There goes the youth vote lol. The one that made Biden become president.
"We are not Banning TikTok" No Nancy that's exactly what you're doing you can't spin this in any way, shape, or form.
US government is probably betting on an American company buying it so they can collect data and control the algorithm.
Tiktok is still there so yes she can say they are not banning TikTok
Tiktok can still exist if ByteDance chooses to divest it. So no, they are not banning Tiktok.
She's such a corrupt insider trading ghoul
@@ni9274 If Tik-Tok is inaccessible or unusable in America, then it is banned.
The U.S. forced the divestiture of Grindr a few years ago. So, this isn't exactly new.
I read this as 'forced diversity in Grindr' and spent a solid minute trying to figure out how the US government could control the sociological makeup of the bottom community.
@@trianglemoebiusDEI but for gay bottoms is crazy
While the influence of the chinese gov't is harmful, I'm also worried the ban will further reduce the amount of competition online. I really don't want just two or three tech companies controlling social media
6 companies have owned essentially all television/movies for years now. Good luck getting capitalists to outlaw the accumulation of capital.
@@vanessaashford9203This seems like tankie Americanophobic vibes here
Ban Tetris as Russian propaganda!!!
Tetris doesnt algorithmically control what narrative on any political topic is dominantly fed to millions of people.
@@meinnase
Yes it does. Nice try, Kremlin spy.
I... AM THE MAN WHO ARRANGES THE BLOCKS!
@@meinnaseJust like Facebook, Instagram and UA-cam?
@@meinnase no but every American platform also does
We don't need trains in the US. We'll have millions of miles of Hyper Loop in the coming weeks now that Elon perfected his boring character. I mean process.
Elon buying tik tok would be like Sisyphus and the Boulder.
Now I'm imagining Elon pushing two boulders up a hill at the same time.
Forget TikTok - when did Jesus ever get his VISA checked?
Arguably, when he was headed to Jerusalem and had to pass through Samaria. Not quite the same, but the Samarians saw him as a foreigner (and an insult to their gods) and refused to receive him. This is, naturally, seen as a bad thing in Christianity, because I guess immigrants are okay when it's *their* immigrants.
I dislike the authoritarian banning of apps like this, but I'm not gonna pretend that TikTok is some great platform that we all benefit so much from keeping around.
I don't have data on this, and I'd like to look into it further, but TikTok and bite-sized social media content has clearly directly curtailed the attention span, literacy, and media diets of so many people that it's not even funny. Gen Alpha barely reads, and many teachers report that their students' literacy skills are literally several grade-levels below where they should be. Bad media analysis is rampant, and so many people just openly spread falsehoods, twisted narratives, outright lies or rumors just because they saw it on TikTok and didn't have the media literacy to see through it. Bad parenting, broader issues in the educational system and tough economic conditions are absolutely the largest factors affecting this, but TikTok is _absolutely_ worsening this phenomenon.
China, Russia, Iran and other countries are also conducting propaganda operations on western countries that are beyond f---ed in their scope and scale, and if banning TikTok is what can curb some of it, then I say it's better than letting them sow propaganda and disinformation freely. People are easier to control when they only care about bite-sized attention-grabbing content as it's effectively reducing their ability to understand or dissect the nuances found in longer-form content, which in turn limits their ability to express those more nuanced ideas themselves. When you only think in TikTok length, all you'll be able to express is sensational BS and incomplete, un-nuanced ideas.
People can doomsay all they want, but I, for one, am looking at this with _cautious_ optimism.
This comment is too long for the Tik Tok crowd to read :/
"I dont have data on this."
@@kirakoraawesome I, however, do have data on this! They're studying social media impact fervently in academia these days, and what OP said is pretty much spot-on.
Both liberals and conservatives fucking hate China now so this propaganda must not be working very well.
The question is whether it has curtailed short attention span or people were born with that kind of span already, that's why they are attracted to that kind of content in the first place, usually thats how it works, ADHD is a real thing, and nurture has hardly any effect over the nature in this case.
It's not about personal info, it's about influencing. There is no way China will not do it. It's incredible how effective Russian propaganda is online and China's resources and control of the internet is on a whole different level. When they'll start being serious about it it will change the world.... they don't seem to have a clear objective yet.
What’s preventing them from doing it without Tik Tok?
As a cybersecurity MA candidate, I actually think forcing its sale to a U.S. owner is a better option than banning it, but whatever the case, it's just a dealbreaker for 150 million + people to get their news from a platform that can be more easily weaponized for disinfo than Facebook, with even less accountability.
This isn't a "muh freeze peach" issue, let's not whatabout this like people did with Facebook's congressional hearings.
The issue is about the people's failure at media literacy, susceptibility to propaganda, foreign and domestic, and ultimately how financially cheap it is to cause very very expensive disruption in other countries. Ask any cybersecurity researcher working out there and in academia, and they tend to treat Tiktok with about as much weariness as the goddamn demon core.
Still remember the Singaporean TikTok guy getting done dirty with the King of the Hill bit. 'Are you Chinese or Japanese?' 'No sir, I am from Singapore.' I'd look at you crazy if you told me that happened, then I would realize yeah that could happen ༼;´༎ຶ ༎ຶ༽
@@YokaiX Fr tho, is he Chinese? Many are asking this. Curious 🤔
Depends on how you look on the race thing and how you feel about racial definitions. I only have a dutch nationality but i fully admit that racially i am chinese. Culturally i am way more dutch then Chinese. It is however kinda impossible for me to say i am not racially chinese since both my parents kinda came from China and are ethnically chinese. I do think people with Asian backgrounds and nationalities might look differently at this as racially the backgrounds are way more similar appearance wise.
Also in some asian countries the people that can trace their lineage to Chinese immigrants is rather significant as they form a rather big part of their population.
@@hanli5416the guy just straight up being racist over and over
The fact that Trump would even say we Gen Z would all switch to Facebook if Tiktok dies 😂 Really shows how much of a Boomer he is. I dont know beyond 2 people my age who seriously uses facebook beyond familial obligation. Everyone else is on insta, snap, dord, what have you. But ig I do agree with Trump on one thing, Facebook sucks
As much as amI hate Tik Tok, I don't think it should be banned.
It's not a complete ban. You didn't read the bill
what congress really needs to do is ban youtube shorts
If Musk bought TikTok he'd call in X2: Electric boogaloo
"i dont want tiktok to win. I just need Facebook to lose." Type energy.
Future voosh omgor
really securing the youth vote, huh?
They're so screwed lmao
Youth vote? 😂
Is there such a thing?
Honestly in terms of election year shenanigans and absolute insanity, this is fairly mid to at least what I was expecting from the political establishment
Is this comment section being arosturffed? Please expatiate on what you're alluding to with "election year shenanigans".
@@hadronoftheseus8829
Astroturfed? paranoid much? 😂
Election year shenanigans, pretty straightforward you know *vaguely gestures at literally everything in politics*
@@hadronoftheseus8829culture war issues flare up,Politics finaly make good on a promise or two, virtue signaling , demonizing the other side, misusing the court system against political enemies , That sort of shenanigans that happens about every year or so
@@hadronoftheseus8829I'm ameliorating all over your comment
@@hadronoftheseus8829 He means that it is 2024, we have elections this year, millions of people use TikTok, and it's easy to use it to spread political disinformation.
It seems kinda obvious.
I will gladly get my Online Data spied on by Corpos, if the alternative is a state that is authoritarian to the Core. A money-grabbing Corporation only cares that I keep consuming content. A State wants me to consume specific content.
No it's not scary. Why should a geopolitical adversary be able to manipulate what our citizens see?
Who decides who our geopolitical adversaries are? Also if you get shown Chinese, or anyone else's for that matter, propaganda, and you can't identify it, then that's on you bud. You can't regulate away stupid.
@@NatoStorm Geopolitical enemies? Do you love under a rock? It must be painful being that genuinely daft.
@@NatoStormContent doesn't have to be pro the adversary to be harmful. Just simply sowing divisions by leaning into political wedge issues and inciting divisive content and behavior could be equally, if not more destructive.
Except they are currently doing a Big Good with it (Israel footage, helping spread the BDS boycott, Ukraine footage)
That doesn't preclude them doing it at a later date of course, but either they are jumping the gun or under the thumb of AIPAC/ADL
Tiktok in america is already controlled and has a separate system that's IN AMERICA. Tiktok's algorithm is also literally just "recommend videos to people that they'll like." The content on tiktok is also all made by its users. Please explain how the Chinese government is manipulating Tiktok content?
I'm really tired of mfrs talking about Palestine like WE didn't do it to iraq and Afghanistan forever... I understand that a lot of people cared when that was happening but corporate interests never swayed in the face of any of this. Palestine has NOTHING to do with this acquisition. It's specifically a tech venture to cut off influence and make the product worthless so that an American tech billionaire can buy it cheaper than it would've been otherwise. To pretend this has anything to do with Israel Palestine is the most pigeon holed shittake ive ever heard of and flies in the face of real DATA that this channel used to care about.
Seriously. I subbed to Vaush way back because I liked how he was far more analytical than other leftist creators and paid more attention to the details of the situation than most, but now it's like he's not putting in any of the effort he used to, and just says whatever reflexive shit first comes to mind. He's starting to remind me of Hasan, and I fucking hate that.
@@luckysevenow1872Exactly. Vaush is slowing becoming a tankie Americanophobic
(I myself am not a lawyer)
Would this bill violate Bytedance's or their shareholders' due process rights under the 5th amendment of the constitution by just imposing an ultimatum? Depending on how the bill is written, it might skirt too close to the territory of being a Bill of Attainder (declaring an entity guilty/illegal by legislative fiat) or an Ex Post Facto law (declaring an action to be illegal retroactively, and imposing consequences).
"Would this bill violate Bytedance's or their shareholders' due process rights under the 5th amendment of the constitution..."
No. Full stop, no caveats. "Due process" is not a legal term of art and the constitution offers _exactly zero protections_ to non citizens, and a fortiori it offers none to foreign corporations.. Tiktok's only recourse is to whatever trade agreements apply.
I've _no_ doubt we'll be hearing plenty of sophomoric whining from the selfsame people who think (or affect to think) that the first amendment precludes private corporations from having terms of service.
I'm not a lawyer either, but I think what you just said is conjecture. The US laws are different than the Chinese laws and if you do business in the states, you must follow such laws. A company isn't a citizen btw, so I doubt the ammendents have any bearing over a Chinese business. However, I'm not really fluent in American laws so this is also conjecture probably.
All of the stuff I know about legal mumbo jumbo comes from the Ace Attorney games which is irrelevent as it's a hodge podge of Japanese and US legal systems in video game format
No. Full stop, no caveats. "Due process" is not even a legal term of art and the constitution offers _exactly zero protections_ to noncitizens_ and a fortiori it offers none to foreign corporations. No real precedent is being set here, and Tiktok's only recourse is to whatever trade agreements apply.
As a foreign company, it's not protected by the 4th (not 5th!) Amendment. Protections are given under some U.S. code I don't have my lawyer friends around to ask about, though, but last I recall there are plenty. It wouldn't be good for America as a supporter of business otherwise.
“American government is infinitely worse” okay Vaush, what’s the American counterpart for TikTok which should be collecting personal information and manipulating domestic politics in foreign countries?
All of them. They are making profits by literally selling your data to whoever pays more, so other governments as well, but not directly. Usually those are some shell companies.
Vaush has americanophobia particles
All of our social medias?
So many questions with this issue. Will it be illegal to utilize a VPN in order to use tiktok on a phone? Will the phone companies be banned from using chinese factories to produce the phones that run the app? Why don't they do something important like maybe pass a damned budget? Why is the news coming out of Congress always so stupid if we really live in a meritocracy?
no.
Banning an app's distribution does not equate to applying punitive measures to those who insist on going out of their way to gain access to it here. Especially not the way the bill is written.
@@Blackgriffonphoenixg I think that was their point - they were rhetorically pointing out how inefficient and flawed this bill is. On paper, that sounds good, but the problem is that when bills fail to do what they're supposed to, the gov't tends to pass new ones trying to "fix" it. Which all have their own problems which require fixing...
@@BlackgriffonphoenixgRepublicans have talked about using period tracking apps to go after girls that might later get an abortion. Laws an easily get twisted.
How can you be a professional news talk person and not know that Rand Paul said days ago that he would personally block it in the Senate.
Why not just ban all social media at this point? Maybe im missing something here, but all these issue stem from the existence of these platforms no matter what country its from. Its cutting a weed but not pulling the root. Something like it will take its place in due time.
Just doing it for TikTok seems so half assed. Be bold and brash.
"two for two" fucking got me lol
Vaush’s takes have only gotten worse since H3H3’s videos on him. No wonder he keeps losing subs. I legitimately have no idea what the strategy is here. Appealing to an even more radical audience? If so, guess it’s time for me to leave as well
Entering the mask off era.
Not sure if I'm misinterpreting the text if the law, or if presidential exceptions are common for these sorts of things, but I feel like with Trump expressing opposition to the law right after Biden said he would sign off on it, I would expect that this will be another issue Republicans could run on to pull Gen Z support from Biden
FWIW, TikTok is already banned in the UK, Netherlands, France, lot of other countries.
Why would they ban TikTok if the president has one?
Aren’t there other things more important? Such as rising food, rent, home prices, ???
Not American so maybe I miss some important context.
Biden wants to ban TikTok despite having one. But he also wants to lose the election despite demanding that he run again.
Those aren't problems for the lawmakers to solve, because capitalism demands an underclass to exploit and profit from. Helping with those things in any substantial way threatens business as usual.
I don’t think it’s technically Biden’s account. Also they consider it to be a national security risk which is obviously pretty important.
@@Katsi404which is why Joe Biden has an open border policy to create that second class citizen.
Unironically though I know this is an unpopular take with the zoomers but TikTok's effect on the youth has been a fucking disaster. I wish the other forms of short form content will go but this is a good step
I normally agree with Vaush, but this is an absolutely awful take.
Seriously, you think the US is going to be okay with a foreign adversary meddling with them?
Since when did Vaush become a China sympathizer?
China banned TikTok first. We're literally copying them. Your idea of how this stuff works is so wrong.
Vaush's takes have been really awful lately.
Since when did people become full-throated American nationalists? Why should the US gargle up all the data?
Btw if Trump is against it, maybe the republicans in the Senate will vote against it. I suppose he didn't have time to tell the House how to behave, hence why it passed.
I think acting like we don’t spy on china is stupid. Y’all are all so silly man
now imagine China doing the same thing like say Ford - -
Ford must divest themselves from American ownership.
They do do that. To do business in China foreign companies are required by law to partner with a Chinese company.
@@Jon-eo1lz now imagine China forcing Ford to divest ownership of their factory in Detroit to this native Chinese partner. The employees in Detroit now have a new CEO in Shanghai instead of NYC.
China could take banning on a whole another if they wanted to. Apple a trillion dollar company manufacturers in China, they could ban them easily. Amazon which is another trillion dollar company has 70% of sellers that get their products from China, they could easily destroy Amazon in a single day if they wanted. I can keep going but it will be too long, they could do serious economic damage to the US if they really wanted to.
@@peterwindhorst5775 I don't think most employees would care, as long as they keep their jobs and their pay.
@@emilchan5379 until the workers in Detroit decide to go on strike. The Chinese government has ways to deal with striking workers...."Hey, what happened to Bob from the local 247 Union?" "I don't know, he went into work today and disappeared never to be seen again."
The U.S. already has rules regarding the foreign ownership of TV stations. How is this any different?
I agree.
Tv stations arent social media. Tictoc is already wildy popularized.
More of a bad thing is bad. The previous and current bad things don't justify further or future bad things.
Not difficult, is it?
This is like saying look slander is a crime why not hate speech, I don't see a problem with foreign owned tv shows, I would have no problem with the BBC Russia today, Ai Jazeera and Fox news all being on one cable box, hell even just for verity thats good whats happening In Europe turn on the BBC whats happening in the Middle east turn on Ai Jazeera America Fox news, are these stations perfect and honest no. But its not Like Fox stands out as the most honest
@@Jorge-np3tqRegulation of foreign ownership of media companies is the norm. Norway always ranks at the top of free freedom indices and they regulate ownership.
Woah this video came with free Vaush DLC
Well we’re Americans. We stop because we’re wrong, we just keep doing the wrong thing until it turns out right!
I can't believe America went from making fun of china for banning a large chunk of the internet and now they want to do it too.
I was joking back when I said that we should ban TikTok
I wasn't.
@@hadronoftheseus8829your gonna love the new version of American tiktok and the other competing tiktok variants
The most important issue isn't them gathering our data.
The issue is handpicked presentation of viewpoints.
Based on data.
So to stop that you need the government to handpick what social medias are allowed to protect its own view points?
if you are a foreign business owner who the united states is not on good terms with your days of doing business in the united states are numbered if you don't play ball with washington and no matter where you fall on the political isle this kind of government overreach is too much.
Can we ban Facebook next
Cool can they do Facebook and Instagram next?
I would actually love TikTok being banned. It kinda ruined UA-cam. They're shoving their shorts into my face all the time.
I don't think there's really a thing of precedent here. China has been our top economic enemy for a while now. Neither of us are going to allow the other to maintain Ws like this. This is how geopolitics works unfortunately. It sucks but it's not "scary".
China is not an enemy. The government of China just does really freaky sh*t but America also does really freaky sh*t, so both countries need to stop doing freaky sh*t
China bans Tiktok
@@SerendipityChild So Move to China
@@daraghokane4236what?
What is scary is how Tik Tok is so "popular."
We should continue pushing digital supply chains to other jurisdictions. What’s the crime in that?
I am cashing in my call, TikTok ain't getting banned, nah, status quo will go on as before. If they do ban it tho, bad precedent, lol
Nothing ever happens
@@chewchewtrain Late stage capitalism does love entropy
How'd that go?
Remember: they will always choose inaction UNLESS they can make things worse!
@@OneReallyGrumpyJillhow is status quo in an extremely complex system entropy?
GQP never forgot that empty ass stadium that TikTokers delivered to Trump.
So i looked up tiktok ban. Found plenty of news.
Pretty sure the point was that it doesn't talk about the bill and only reported as a TikTok ban.
Short-form, instant gratification content is here to stay. I use tiktok to get underground music recs, but it's no skin off my ass. There are plenty of other places to find it
It would be so hilarious if TikTok gets banned 🙏🏻
We should ban Facebook as well, given that it has the same harmful consequences as TikTok but for a different demographic
@@Newton-Reuther Screw it. Ban all social media. Retvrn
@@Newton-Reuther I agree
@@Newton-ReutherDoesn’t really make sense because the reason behind the ban would be because TikTok is owned by a Chinese company while Facebook is owned by an American company.
@@DannyCalYTExcept the boomers that make up Facebook are dullards that fall for any hoax, ai image, scam, and propaganda.
If the government can force TikTok to sell the company to an American owner, would this set the precedent that the government can force CEOs and corporations to sell their businesses to their workers?
Land of the free my a$$.
I can't even watch corn in a purple state. Cornhub etc won't comply so it's blocked nor will I upload my ID to watch corn.
People will just move to something else also maybe we need to bring forums back I miss those
to be fair, the US is far off the scale of chinese concentration camps.
Vaush needs my algorithm I follow a lot of intelligent people on tiktok
Intelligence and Tik Tok is an oxymoron.
@@Aussie1964😂 Agreed
Good luck getting gen alpha on your side lmao
Yup
Who gives a shit. Gen alpha doesn’t vote.
Republicans don't plan for Gen Alpha to have voting rights by the time that generation turns 18.
They can’t vote so they don’t matter in this case.
@@YokaiX And Biden doesn't have to worry about re-election after this year.
I'm gonna be honest I had no idea you took notes on what you were planning to stream. I thought you were just winging it 100% of the time.
Now I think you're winging it like 80% of the time.
no man, your take is scary
There were some in the house who were apparently on the fence about the bill, but then TikTok started telling its users to call their representatives and complain about it... And this pissed off a ton of politicians since all of them started receiving like over a thousand calls a day... So TikTok seemingly encouraged the fence-sitters to vote against TikTok with that move...
It’s a pretty clear indication of Tiktoks ability to influence behaviour.
@@Jon-eo1lz That's not unique to TikTok tho
Just proves our politician's fear their supposed constituents.
This is good! It’s not going away. All social media needs antitrust and manipulation laws.
*Israel:* "We have a Tik Tok problem"
*Congress:* "Yessuh massa boss!! We'll ban it right away!!"
Vaush's hatred of TikTok is sure coming through here, I've seen way better political analysis of the TikTok ban on TikTok...
I wish my country would ban it.
This is not the same thing.
Yes they big rich companies and people can influence for their agenda, they arent countries that are also antagonistic.
heh. good thing I'm European.
I think the biggest atrocity here is getting a sponsored Turning Point USA ad on my favorite Bloodborne streamer's video smh
Bipartisan vote so either side you have nowhere to turn to protest vote aside from the third party
Welp rip CapCut
I don't quite recall, but didn't they have some sort of slogan back then? Something about a swamp?
Don't know why this popped up in my head right now though..
The bonus segment is at 13:50?
What did Vaush mean by this?
Good, TikTok is scary, very true.
Damn it's funny and sad how boomer Vaush and so many other huge personalities like even Penguinz0 Charlie can be about TikTok. Vaush could have such huge reach over there and the youth is much better informed and on his side than he thinks. Charlie thinks it's still a platform about dancing and only trending songs. Get with the times.
13:50 eh?…*hits cigarette* haven’t heard that name in a long time
There is a point at which cultural relativism and intellectual arrogance aren't even funny anymore.
And nothing of value was lost.