The moral of the story is that you never play Cities: Skylines without a solid inventory of tea, roundabouts, and lane mathematics. Otherwise, everything goes horky-borky and choc-a-bloc. I love this channel so much,
TBH, it's become very click-baity. What I personally want to see is a progression moving beyond fixing 2% traffic to an analysis of applicable rules, traffic patterns, and perhaps even a theory of traffic flow. I'd be happy to collaborate on the endeavor.
Think about new viewers, he is trying to capture their attentions. Also yt works that way: check my new mouse pointer! (And it is the same pointer everyone has haha)
This type of clickbaiting isnt bad. Because I’m pretty sure you got what you wanted... A traffic fixing video of a city in a game....The disgusting clickbaits are the one that are literally just there to get clicks and the video is probably just some guy talking about irrelevant things
Never wondered how someone could let their traffic on the game get so bad, then I got the game for Christmas and one tiny change means gridlocks all the way to the other side of the world😂
Whenever I encounter a traffic issue, I always think what will Biffa say? "This intersection looks like really need a roundabout!!" So I build a roundabout. :D
Same! It was watching the fixing vids that I found the interest in this game and started playing it. Then there were no traffic problems thanks to Biffa.
Sleep may be able to wait, but getting up better be able to wait as well, cause if you're like me then getting up will wait wether you want it to or not 👀
I thought people were going crazy or something, how did a decade start in years that ended with the number 0? There was no year 0 CE, so the first decade in the currently agreed international calendar system literally started at the year 1 and by logic should've ended at the year 10, and AFAIK there's no missing year in the history of this calendar.
I really love the before and after shots you do at the end of these more recent videos. It's really cool to see how just a few minor changes drastically affected the traffic. I love when it looks like you just cut the car population when you actually just fixed the road. Keep the good content coming!
I love how the green truck in the final camera fly-over comparison is almost at the same spot in both the before- and after-version (starting around 20:30).
Give poor Biffa a rest people! Every like means an extra sip of tea. 3882 likes at the moment mean he had to spend the last 4 days (since this video was published) with sipping tea once a minute for 16 hours a day! If one sip is only 10ml of tea, that's still 9.6L of tea every day! Stop liking his videos, you are drowning him! ;)
One thing I've noticed when you get weird slowdown at junctions that don't have any signals/traffic signs, use the mod tool to turn restrictions (I typically just use the traffic lights on/off button) *on, then off* again. It seems to clear whatever unseen signals the traffic is getting stuck on. Hope that helps.
If you were wondering those double lorry's are called B-train's or Tandems depending on what part of NA you are from. Not sure you have them in the UK since your Lorry's have much stricter weight restrictions.
I often get that "phantom slow down" issue that you had on the highway there. I believe its caused by 2 nodes been too close together. If you stretch them apart using the move it mod, it tends to fix it. Although rebuilding the road is just as effective!
I have watched every single one of your "Fix Your City" series and this is one of my favorites because you used a variety of different fixes to give each problem just the specific little nudge it needed. No massive rebuilds here, just carefully selected tweaks and additions with major effect. I was particularly surprised and impressed by how flipping the truck prohibition on on one section of road instantly spread the busy traffic off of the busy main street and the area unclogged completely. Well done, Biffa!
Yesterday i resorted to rewatching old videos, i needed my fixing traffic fix. I should check myself into a Biffaholics Anonymous. But today is a new video!
I figured this out a while ago! When nodes are too close together, it causes the cars to slow down at the nodes for some reason! It can easily be fixed by moving the nodes apart or rebuilding the road as you did! 😁😁
11:15 I would have changed both incoming roads into two way highways, where one lane is explicitly for using the absolute next exit and the other is for every other exit. So, they need to pick their lane and just get out of the way (and, some might also drive a lot more because they don't get stuck behind cars wanting to get really on the round-about).
The city might have a lot of traffic but god damn,its the only city we have seen thats aesthetically pleasing!Kudos to the creator for making a neat and nice city!
At 18:09 I've met with this before, cars slow down this much if two nodes are too close to eachother, because they don't know how to calculate whenever they have space infront if they have to wait at the second junctions. You redid it and made the two merges more further apart and that fixed it
17:58 I've occasionally had to change the enter blocked junction setting to green in different lane situations. I think the game sometimes treats them as normal, not motorway, junctions and sets them up accordingly.
18:00 I've had a 'curious highway slowdown' myself; turned out two nodes had been placed so close together with MoveIt! it was borking the game's ability to set traffic speeds. Fixed it the same way by rebuilding the segment as a single piece.
Found your channel last month and bought the game because of you. I love it! Takes me back to when I used to play SimCity 2000 when I was a kid. Thanks for the great content!
I study data science and I want Biffa to teach all of my statistics courses. I can really imagine him excelling at it. "When you have a Spearman test instead of a Pearson, what happens is that your variables are either ordered units or continuous numbers and.. " I'll just read all of my stats in his voice in my head and it'll be glorious.
Welcome back from vacation, been binge watching old episodes waiting for your return. Definitely need to invest in this game and apply all your knowledge.
So, watched a few of your videos and got me back into playing this game again. I typically played without mods, but had to install the traffic manager mod after seeing how well it works to shape the traffic properly at your hands. Went to an old save, and managed to wrest the traffic from about 60% up to 71%... and then I disabled the despawning of traffic to see what it really was. It tanked to 2% in about five minutes. I'm a long way from your level, but then again I have less than 50 hours total in the game. It's not that I didn't enjoy it, just life got in the way and I didn't make time for it. Thanks for making the videos, and for getting me back into this game.
Highway on-ramp. Slow traffic. Reason: When 2 nodes of two seperated segments are too close to eachother the traffic will eventuallyglitch there and move very slow and u cant fix that untill u use Move it to redo that just for millimetres. Speeds are not fixing that. And a rebuild is not an option if u want eye candy things.
Can second that, nodes that are too close to each other can cause major slowdowns. Noticed it on roads (especially on prebuilt highway junctions) end also on train junctions. Move them apart a bit and it flows again. ^^
I'm not 100% sure but at 18:13 I think the cause of the cars slowing down is because there is a small road there. I say this cause the speed change option usually seen between nodes and u can see at 18:13 there is possibly a road there. Probs created because of moving nodes closer though move it.
it's "Lane switching" and the other green one in the round about you enable is "Queue across intersection". 18:22 I've had that problem with the blocking segment, sometimes MoveIt mod causes this and if the nodes are too close I found I have to stretch it or move it around a little and they suddenly work fine.annoying issue sometimes
Hi Biffa. :-) I love your videos on City Skylines. I have never played that game before but i am learning so much about it just by watching you fixing and building up cities. I just love it. :-) Thank you so much.
regarding that wierd stopping on the highway, i had same issue with prebuild junctions, just move those lines a bit further from each other and it should work just fine, this happens because inner two lines colide on that spot and game has a problem processing which is which
Just out of curiosity, have you ever looked up Skelmersdale in Lancashire on a map? It’s a town with no traffic lights and just roundabouts...but it works really well...
Biffa, please : -don’t use the subway in a city with 60,000 people. Use buses and trams -if you use the subway, don’t make 90 degree turns -(again) if you use the subway, use an undeground station with 4 platforms Thanks for making great videos
Came back to CS after years and watching some of Biffa's Videos, so my city does look like your typical noob without a plan city. But at least I thought I had done the traffic solid enough, though not great. Now noticed traffic despawn was on.... immediate death. xD Well, guess the next city will have to be better.
You know what's funny? In the city I've been playing, rotaries make things worse, and regular signals are making things better. I even put a signal on a rotary, and it fixed things. However, the best thing to do is to understand how the entirety of your traffic flows before you start messing around with things. Sure, I fluctuate around 65-75%, but I'm satisfied.
Great to see that you've returned, Biffa! 👍 I wish the creator would've not used a concrete painting around the roads. It was hard to see where the roads and roundabouts were. 🤔 You still are going to work on Teaville, right? 😁
Traffic fixing should be a challenge mode in itself. Is there a forum for cities that are built and jammed? I think I've had more satisfaction from watching traffic fixes than I did from playing the game. I've definitely watched more than I've played!
I don't play this game, I have no interest in playing the game. I somehow stumbled upon these videos a few weeks ago. Your voice is very soothing for me, so now I use these videos to relax whenever my anxiety gets a bit out of hand. So thank you, keep it up, you are helping a poor swedish girl sleep.
18:15 that must be a glitch. Happened to me last night when I was fixing my traffic, the only way to fix was to destroy and rebuild. Eventually, I managed to get my traffic down from 40% to 80% however I hate using buses. Did have a big network of underground and bus network but I redid the trains but CBA to do buses as they do my head in
11:03 that 'horrendous junction' actually exists. It is in the UK so the flows are reversed but it is a quite distinctive arrangement. www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.8324301,-0.2770354,2059a,35y,337.13h,36.98t/data=!3m1!1e3
You can make the roundabout extra lane bypass thing with the lane connectors. Use two exit lanes and let only those who enter the roundabout use the outside lane, then those on the roundabout will not get in the way of the bypassing vehicles.
That wierd slowdown on the highway is because the nodes on the asset at too close to each other or something and the game thinks there are sharp turns and slows the traffic down. I've used move it mod to kind of spread out the nodes and it goes faster.
When I make metro stops near my industry areas, I don't get much passenger usage. Lion's share of usage is, by far, stops in residential and in retail districts. I tend to use buses to get workes to work.
The moral of the story is that you never play Cities: Skylines without a solid inventory of tea, roundabouts, and lane mathematics. Otherwise, everything goes horky-borky and choc-a-bloc. I love this channel so much,
Wiser words are seldom spoken. Where would we be in 2020, if everyone followed these rules since the middle-ages?
You forgot the bish bash bosh inventory!
Biffa: "I've never seen traffic this bad"
Also Biffa: has had 2% traffic fixes
TBH, it's become very click-baity.
What I personally want to see is a progression moving beyond fixing 2% traffic to an analysis of applicable rules, traffic patterns, and perhaps even a theory of traffic flow.
I'd be happy to collaborate on the endeavor.
@@daniellewis984 well that's how UA-cam works these days and there's nothing you can do about it. No heavy click bait, it's just an exaggeration.
@@daniellewis984 the titles were clickbaiting from the beginning. ;) However, still love to watch him fixing things up. Has something meditative.
Think about new viewers, he is trying to capture their attentions. Also yt works that way: check my new mouse pointer! (And it is the same pointer everyone has haha)
This type of clickbaiting isnt bad. Because I’m pretty sure you got what you wanted... A traffic fixing video of a city in a game....The disgusting clickbaits are the one that are literally just there to get clicks and the video is probably just some guy talking about irrelevant things
Never wondered how someone could let their traffic on the game get so bad, then I got the game for Christmas and one tiny change means gridlocks all the way to the other side of the world😂
For reals lol
"It's gone worse. Fantastic!"
:-)
@@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines I've lost count of how many times you've said this LOL!
I've come to think of it like spending money to make money at this point. Haha. I'm expecting it to get worse in each video before it gets better :P
It's not a proppa Biffa video unless he says this!
@@BiffaPlaysCitiesSkylines I want a shirt that says that
Whenever I encounter a traffic issue, I always think what will Biffa say?
"This intersection looks like really need a roundabout!!"
So I build a roundabout. :D
Good job 👍😁
I do the same when I'm actually driving. I see the lane mathematics in real life and it's kinda cool. Or nerdy.
'this is a mod called traffic manager' Everytime I hear this I still start crying in PS4
I started watching your vids before I started playing the game. I never had traffic issues. Thanks Biffa!
You're welcome :-)
Same! It was watching the fixing vids that I found the interest in this game and started playing it. Then there were no traffic problems thanks to Biffa.
Same with me..get into the game because of these traffic fixing videos..but got traffic problems anyway... 😅😅
Same here
Me too and now im single 😁
*stays up to 2am*
I should sleep
*sees biffa has uploaded for the first time this decade*
Sleep can wait
:-)
Sleep may be able to wait, but getting up better be able to wait as well, cause if you're like me then getting up will wait wether you want it to or not 👀
I thought people were going crazy or something, how did a decade start in years that ended with the number 0? There was no year 0 CE, so the first decade in the currently agreed international calendar system literally started at the year 1 and by logic should've ended at the year 10, and AFAIK there's no missing year in the history of this calendar.
@@Napoleonic_S Mind Blown!
@@lickkittysplit3871 are you sure it was blown and not Swept? ;p
I really love the before and after shots you do at the end of these more recent videos. It's really cool to see how just a few minor changes drastically affected the traffic. I love when it looks like you just cut the car population when you actually just fixed the road. Keep the good content coming!
I love how the green truck in the final camera fly-over comparison is almost at the same spot in both the before- and after-version (starting around 20:30).
Give poor Biffa a rest people! Every like means an extra sip of tea. 3882 likes at the moment mean he had to spend the last 4 days (since this video was published) with sipping tea once a minute for 16 hours a day! If one sip is only 10ml of tea, that's still 9.6L of tea every day! Stop liking his videos, you are drowning him!
;)
Nobody: The world is going to pot & we're all going to die!
Biffa: Tea and Roundabouts will Save the World. (Illustrates his point.)
Is it Yorkshire tea?
"13%, its got worse. Faaantastic."
😂
One thing I've noticed when you get weird slowdown at junctions that don't have any signals/traffic signs, use the mod tool to turn restrictions (I typically just use the traffic lights on/off button) *on, then off* again. It seems to clear whatever unseen signals the traffic is getting stuck on. Hope that helps.
Sounds like fixing any problem on a Windows PC, but just the other way round
"Have you tried turn it off and on again?"
If you were wondering those double lorry's are called B-train's or Tandems depending on what part of NA you are from. Not sure you have them in the UK since your Lorry's have much stricter weight restrictions.
I often get that "phantom slow down" issue that you had on the highway there. I believe its caused by 2 nodes been too close together. If you stretch them apart using the move it mod, it tends to fix it. Although rebuilding the road is just as effective!
Looking through the comments for this one.
It can also be fixed by allowing vehicles to enter blocked intersection with tmpe
We miss you, professor Biffa, and your tea.
I have watched every single one of your "Fix Your City" series and this is one of my favorites because you used a variety of different fixes to give each problem just the specific little nudge it needed. No massive rebuilds here, just carefully selected tweaks and additions with major effect. I was particularly surprised and impressed by how flipping the truck prohibition on on one section of road instantly spread the busy traffic off of the busy main street and the area unclogged completely. Well done, Biffa!
Yesterday i resorted to rewatching old videos, i needed my fixing traffic fix.
I should check myself into a Biffaholics Anonymous.
But today is a new video!
Enjoy :-)
I figured this out a while ago!
When nodes are too close together, it causes the cars to slow down at the nodes for some reason! It can easily be fixed by moving the nodes apart or rebuilding the road as you did! 😁😁
11:15
I would have changed both incoming roads into two way highways, where one lane is explicitly for using the absolute next exit and the other is for every other exit. So, they need to pick their lane and just get out of the way (and, some might also drive a lot more because they don't get stuck behind cars wanting to get really on the round-about).
Finally.. Biffa Video
Enjoy :-)
"This is Kev City, sent by... yes, you guessed it : KEVIN!"
i thought you going to say Douglas or Jeremy, hahaha
IRL traffic was about 17% for me, this morning.
18:30 Biffa, a very short road segment makes vehicles slow down. Making it longer by moving the nodes or rebuilding solves the issue
The city might have a lot of traffic but god damn,its the only city we have seen thats aesthetically pleasing!Kudos to the creator for making a neat and nice city!
If you are annoyed by this then you truly haven't seen 'bad' cities...
16:58 Auto-save every 10 minutes [TICK]!
18:22 Probably two junctions on top each other = permanent backlog. Hiccup in Road Anarchy perhaps.
At 18:09 I've met with this before, cars slow down this much if two nodes are too close to eachother, because they don't know how to calculate whenever they have space infront if they have to wait at the second junctions. You redid it and made the two merges more further apart and that fixed it
Noone:
Biffa: *Horky Borky*
19:10 Touch it mod? New Year, new mods :). Welcome back and happy new year!
17:58 I've occasionally had to change the enter blocked junction setting to green in different lane situations. I think the game sometimes treats them as normal, not motorway, junctions and sets them up accordingly.
18:00 I've had a 'curious highway slowdown' myself; turned out two nodes had been placed so close together with MoveIt! it was borking the game's ability to set traffic speeds. Fixed it the same way by rebuilding the segment as a single piece.
13%, its got worse fAntAsTiC 6:55
:-)
Found your channel last month and bought the game because of you. I love it! Takes me back to when I used to play SimCity 2000 when I was a kid. Thanks for the great content!
I study data science and I want Biffa to teach all of my statistics courses. I can really imagine him excelling at it. "When you have a Spearman test instead of a Pearson, what happens is that your variables are either ordered units or continuous numbers and.. "
I'll just read all of my stats in his voice in my head and it'll be glorious.
Think I need some sleep. I saw the smiley faces at 2:47 and my mind thought it was Biffa making a green cartoon cloud puff where he clicked. Lol
18:00 Its the shape of the road, game does that sometimes when you build with road mods , you just have to redo it like you did and it'll work.
Welcome back from vacation, been binge watching old episodes waiting for your return. Definitely need to invest in this game and apply all your knowledge.
So, watched a few of your videos and got me back into playing this game again. I typically played without mods, but had to install the traffic manager mod after seeing how well it works to shape the traffic properly at your hands. Went to an old save, and managed to wrest the traffic from about 60% up to 71%... and then I disabled the despawning of traffic to see what it really was. It tanked to 2% in about five minutes. I'm a long way from your level, but then again I have less than 50 hours total in the game. It's not that I didn't enjoy it, just life got in the way and I didn't make time for it.
Thanks for making the videos, and for getting me back into this game.
Welcome back! I do hope you and your family had a wonderful Christmas and are off to a fantastic New Year!
Loads video. Pause. Grabs a cup of tea. Sits back. Unpause. Enjoy.
Biffa's back, thank goodness! Was beginning to think something was wrong. Hope all is well with you, Biffa. Love your videos.
Highway on-ramp. Slow traffic. Reason:
When 2 nodes of two seperated segments are too close to eachother the traffic will eventuallyglitch there and move very slow and u cant fix that untill u use Move it to redo that just for millimetres. Speeds are not fixing that. And a rebuild is not an option if u want eye candy things.
Can second that, nodes that are too close to each other can cause major slowdowns. Noticed it on roads (especially on prebuilt highway junctions) end also on train junctions. Move them apart a bit and it flows again. ^^
Literally drinking a big cup of tea while watching this. Love your vids sir Biffa!
I'm not 100% sure but at 18:13 I think the cause of the cars slowing down is because there is a small road there. I say this cause the speed change option usually seen between nodes and u can see at 18:13 there is possibly a road there. Probs created because of moving nodes closer though move it.
it's "Lane switching" and the other green one in the round about you enable is "Queue across intersection".
18:22 I've had that problem with the blocking segment, sometimes MoveIt mod causes this and if the nodes are too close I found I have to stretch it or move it around a little and they suddenly work fine.annoying issue sometimes
Welcome back, Biffa! Missed you during your break!
Happy New Year, Biffa! Thanks for another nice, relaxing video that I can watch after a long, stressful day at work.
Glad to have you back, been hankering for some city fixing! (Any chance of some ONI as well?) Keep up the great content!
Hi Biffa. :-) I love your videos on City Skylines. I have never played that game before but i am learning so much about it just by watching you fixing and building up cities. I just love it. :-) Thank you so much.
I missed you a lot man!!! Was waiting for this! Have a wonderful year
Glad to see you back this 2020!!
regarding that wierd stopping on the highway, i had same issue with prebuild junctions, just move those lines a bit further from each other and it should work just fine, this happens because inner two lines colide on that spot and game has a problem processing which is which
Biffa, you’ll never run out of tea sips from me.
Every vid ever : Lane management , lane mathematics and roundabouts...
And One-Way-Systems in industrial areas
Every vid, it works 👍
Except for cargo train terminals. Those bastards screw everything up
Yay! Ye be back! Happy New year's to you @Biffaplaysindiegames
6:30 so why are there two cargo hubs next to each other on the same road, anyway?
I think it wouldnt be that bad if there was a one-way road not a two-way road in front of the second... (the one where he did a "fix")
Just out of curiosity, have you ever looked up Skelmersdale in Lancashire on a map? It’s a town with no traffic lights and just roundabouts...but it works really well...
Biffa, please :
-don’t use the subway in a city with 60,000 people. Use buses and trams
-if you use the subway, don’t make 90 degree turns
-(again) if you use the subway, use an undeground station with 4 platforms
Thanks for making great videos
Came back to CS after years and watching some of Biffa's Videos, so my city does look like your typical noob without a plan city. But at least I thought I had done the traffic solid enough, though not great. Now noticed traffic despawn was on....
immediate death. xD
Well, guess the next city will have to be better.
Finally the legend is back
You know what's funny? In the city I've been playing, rotaries make things worse, and regular signals are making things better. I even put a signal on a rotary, and it fixed things. However, the best thing to do is to understand how the entirety of your traffic flows before you start messing around with things. Sure, I fluctuate around 65-75%, but I'm satisfied.
Yeaay biffa is back..miss your 'sip of tea'.waitted so long for your video.
Great to see that you've returned, Biffa! 👍 I wish the creator would've not used a concrete painting around the roads. It was hard to see where the roads and roundabouts were. 🤔 You still are going to work on Teaville, right? 😁
I am 😁
Happy to see this video before I sleep!! I can end the day on a good note :))
All the best for the channel ❤️
Finally new video! Keep up the good work, love your channel!
Love the editing at the end! Nice touch.
Thank you LordMortus :-)
Ooo, I really like those double-trailer trucks on the road. I hope those show up more often!
Biffa, your videos prompted me to get Cities Skylines. Nothing like starting a new adventure by proudly dropping roundabouts everywhere. :P
Traffic fixing should be a challenge mode in itself. Is there a forum for cities that are built and jammed? I think I've had more satisfaction from watching traffic fixes than I did from playing the game. I've definitely watched more than I've played!
"It's got worse! Fantastic!"
Love it.
*BIFFA'S BACK BABY!!* :-D
Indeed :-)
Woohoo!!!
I don't play this game, I have no interest in playing the game. I somehow stumbled upon these videos a few weeks ago. Your voice is very soothing for me, so now I use these videos to relax whenever my anxiety gets a bit out of hand. So thank you, keep it up, you are helping a poor swedish girl sleep.
👍
great to see u back g! keep up the good work 🇲🇾
Hapoy New Year! Glad you are back
I have never played city skylines but I love your videos
Loved the editing at the end of the vid!
Happy New Year, Biffa!
I love the after fix montages. Relaxes me a lot - almost like meditation. :D KUTGW!
New video finally ^_^ happy new year biffa
You're back! Love it; greetings from Argentina.
18:15 that must be a glitch. Happened to me last night when I was fixing my traffic, the only way to fix was to destroy and rebuild. Eventually, I managed to get my traffic down from 40% to 80% however I hate using buses. Did have a big network of underground and bus network but I redid the trains but CBA to do buses as they do my head in
Welcome back Biffa! :D
Biffa: "That's because of, yeah, things."
Me: "Yes, boss! Thank you, boss! I will remember this next time."
You're the best, dude :D
😋
11:03 that 'horrendous junction' actually exists. It is in the UK so the flows are reversed but it is a quite distinctive arrangement. www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.8324301,-0.2770354,2059a,35y,337.13h,36.98t/data=!3m1!1e3
Happy 2020 biffa missed your videos
Happy new year to you and your family, Biffa! Hope you had a wonderful holiday time. :)
i dont even play cities skylines i just find these videos fascinating!
Bring back the quicksave… sip of tea! Clearly your computer needs the tea power as much as you do!
LIFE! When I got my notification :) Happy New Year!!!
Good to see you again Biff.
So glad you're still alive! feared the worst.
You can make the roundabout extra lane bypass thing with the lane connectors. Use two exit lanes and let only those who enter the roundabout use the outside lane, then those on the roundabout will not get in the way of the bypassing vehicles.
That wierd slowdown on the highway is because the nodes on the asset at too close to each other or something and the game thinks there are sharp turns and slows the traffic down. I've used move it mod to kind of spread out the nodes and it goes faster.
You should teach courses for politicians, because in the real world, you can't easily go around fixing it, once it is build.
I don't even plan video games, but I like these videos.
When I make metro stops near my industry areas, I don't get much passenger usage. Lion's share of usage is, by far, stops in residential and in retail districts. I tend to use buses to get workes to work.
YAAAAY YOU ARE BACK!!!!!!!!❤❤❤
Biffa i was waiting your video since 2 weeks.
I am happy to see you back.
Now i can sleep in relief.
Love from nepal🇳🇵🇳🇵🇳🇵❤❤❤
Hello Biffa, I hope you are well...I don't play this game but I found your videos very enjoyable...cheers now