If it's any help to you. The end weight boxes were made from 80x80x3mm steel box section with 3mm sheet end caps welded on and mounted using angle brackets onto the existing derailing bar holes. The box at the motor end has the top and rear faces cut away (leaving about a 9mm edge) to clear the motor and its cradle. The brake cable routes into the cutout and exits through the lower 9mm lip on the box centreline to reach the brake mechanism. The tractor seat pillar (50x50x3mm steel box) is offset 50mm from the centre line to maintain balance. The bonnet top plate has to be rolled because with the big hole cut through it will no longer simply bend to shape. Place a stack of towels on a flat surface, lay the bonnet plate on the towels, and roll with a rolling pin. That way you can bend the plate to the correct curves without use of any rolls etc. I hope this info helps if you want to modify your Scamp. If not it is a really easy kit to build and a lot of fun to operate. As I wanted a load puller I used to lower end of the recommended gear sets, but it still runs at about 6 to 7 mph which is fast enough for most tracks. Have fun !
Not quite right. We are all members of our local club. I provided Scamp and the wagon, another member provided the mini digger BUT we all work to build and maintain the track so that the rest of the club can run their engines.
Sorry i think I am being dense here, does the loco kit from CMD have everything you need to get these locos running? Do you need to sorce anything else from elsewhere?
The kit from CMD includes all the special laser cut parts, and if you wish as an extra the wheels can be welded to the axles and the sprockets to the layshaft. The rest is a pretty much a nut and bolt job to assemble. The rest of the parts come from a shopping list which Chris or myself can supply, along with a fully illustrated set of instructions. Contact me on colin@colinedmondson.com
The kit I purchased was just the laser cut steel parts, but the wheels and axles were available separately from CMD. The assembly instructions included a full list of all the other parts required to complete the model (petrol engine, electric motors, gears, chains, nuts and bolts, etc.), with nearly everything being available from eBay. If you paint the model yourself you could complete it for well under £2000 (at the time I built mine). But please note that as mentioned in the video I chose to modify my kit, and I had it professionally spray painted (trying to paint outdoors in a British winter never works for me) , so my model did cost me more than £2000.
I used the parts specified on the shopping list that comes with the laser cut steel kit. Motor and generator are identical 36v 800w from Red Circles Motorcycles and cost £50 each. They are more typically used in mobility scooters. The speed control was from eBay, search for 12-50V 2000W MAX 40A PWM DC Controller and costs about £10 but you need to add a reversing switch as the speed control is only that and doesn't offer reverse.
Very, very cool! You've customized that really well! I'm hoping to build my own 7 1/4'' gauge loco soon, can I ask exactly what electric motor you used? It looks like it pulls really well, and the loco I want to build would be similar in size. Thanks for any help.
The drive motor was rated at 36 Volts 800 Watts, but because the petrol engine drove an identical motor used as a dynamo I don't know what voltage was actually being used to run the loco. I bought both motors from NOVA Products (www.novaproducts.co.uk/partsItem.aspx?PartRef=74) and the electronic controller was a 12-50V 2000W Max 40A Pulse Width Modulated DC Controller (www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12-50V-40A-DC-Motor-Speed-Control-MAX-PWM-RC-Electronic-Controller-2000W-New/264063309383?hash=item3d7b665647:g:~CEAAOSwdHpcIt0t:rk:1:pf:1&frcectupt=true) Pulling power will depend on the gear ratio you use between the drive motor and the wheels, as well as the wheel diameter. However traction is more important as a powerful loco with poor traction will pull next to nothing, and Scamp does so well because of the weight of the driver being on top of the loco. Sadly I can't give you the gear ratio used on Scamp as I never measured the parts supplied in the kit and simply purchased the axle gear the kit designer recommended for best pulling power. I hope this helps. Good luck with whatever you create.
On Scamp 29 I used a 26 tooth sprocket and found that with a train weight of over 1 ton and my 13 stone mass on the Scamp the drive wheels would start to slip on dry steel rails just before full power was reached on some of Andover's gradients. However when running "light engine" the Scamp still had a top speed that was more than fast enough, in fact I never ran on a track where full speed felt safe to use.
Thanks for your replies, SmallScaleSteam sorry I never got notified of your first reply so I've only just seen it now. I'm currently deciding between petrol-electric or petrol-hydraulic. Electric would be cheaper (and clearly has enough pulling power as you've demonstrated), but hydraulic should provide more power to the wheels, and use less space. I'm currently drawing up the loco in CAD to see what I can fit in it! I'll let you know if it eventuates to anything, thanks for your help!
The seat came from eBay and the stand was my own design. If I remember correctly it was 50x50mm steel box section (3mm wall) with webs cut from 3mm sheet mild steel that all came from my "scrap" metal stock. Having just checked my computer files I must have simply eyeballed it's construction as there are no CAD drawings in my archive. If you are building one I hope you get it built as you desire. They are a fun loco to own either for work or play.
@@secondvalveservices9856 It wasn't as loud as my lawnmower but they also sell kits for very similar electric machines. Have a look at www.miniature-trains.co.uk/product/imp-laser-cut-kit/
We need more videos of Scamp 29 doing hard work :) It looked like it took a few revs from the engine before the motor controller responded @ 3:15. I'd love to see a Scamp operate with just the clutch unloaded and loaded. The club I would visit has LONG grades that hit over 3% and dynamic braking would be nice. Or would you feel comfortable riding the brakes for several minutes at a time? Train Mountain in Oregon has over 37 miles of track, some on long grades.
Sadly I no longer own Scamp but that year working with it was amazing. I didn't use the clutch because a) I found it almost impossible to set up with it either slipping under load or dragging when it should have been disengaged, and b) because in practice it just wasn't needed. I just engaged it when the working day started and disengaged it to remove the belt tension at the end of the day for storage. The revving you noticed was how I drove Scamp. When moving those heavy loads the engine needed about half throttle before the electronic control was opened or the engine would stall. Then it was a case of balancing the engine throttle and electronic control to get the train moving, and if the wheels started to slip on a damp track you had to quickly reduce power and then reapply it once you had regained traction. On one occasion it pulled the ballast waggon half full, plus three other wagons loaded with a generator, welding gear, tools, and 5 people perched onboard. That was about it's limit, but we estimated the total train weight as around two tons. The Wherwell track also has some quite long grades and with that huge load Scamps brakes couldn't cope, so going down hill relied on a couple of the crew operating the brakes on the wagons they were riding. A real team effort ! I guess you could fit a more expensive controller to get dynamic braking but I never had heat problems with my Scamps brakes. What I learnt was that you had to anticipate what you wanted Scamp to do. So if the train weight was high and a steep descent was coming up you got the speed right down before beginning the descent and kept the speed low and under control with Scamps' brakes throughout the descent. The brakes wouldn't slow a heavy train on a descent if you started too fast. On steep climbs you needed to get the speed up before the hill and then if traction was lost very quickly reduce the power and reapply it once traction was regained. Skilful driving would get very heavy loads up quite nasty climbs. Scamp was always a delight to drive and when the driver worked in unison with Scamp it did prodigious work while rewarding the driver. An engine that like my original Gentoo is sadly much missed.
There was nothing to stop you switching into reverse but the cheap controller I used would probably have been destroyed by the induced voltage / current. I think you would need to fit a much more complex power system to use dynamic braking because the normal Scamp system works (mainly by luck) over the very wide voltage range produced by the motor used as a generator while more expensive controllers expect a pretty stable 12 or 24 volt system.
@@TevisC That would work, and there's plenty of space under the chassis to fit them. I hope you go ahead with building a Scamp as I'm sure you would enjoy owning one.
From various publications it would seem that people have already built electric only versions and CMD Engineering who sell the kit offer 24v battery electric versions with different body styles. That said part of the charm of the Scamp is the mix of petrol engine and electric drive and it gives the driver a lot more to do than just turn a control knob. I would always stick with the petrol electric version for the fun of it.
I’ve watched this vid about a hundred times in preparation for my own scamp
If it's any help to you. The end weight boxes were made from 80x80x3mm steel box section with 3mm sheet end caps welded on and mounted using angle brackets onto the existing derailing bar holes. The box at the motor end has the top and rear faces cut away (leaving about a 9mm edge) to clear the motor and its cradle. The brake cable routes into the cutout and exits through the lower 9mm lip on the box centreline to reach the brake mechanism.
The tractor seat pillar (50x50x3mm steel box) is offset 50mm from the centre line to maintain balance.
The bonnet top plate has to be rolled because with the big hole cut through it will no longer simply bend to shape. Place a stack of towels on a flat surface, lay the bonnet plate on the towels, and roll with a rolling pin. That way you can bend the plate to the correct curves without use of any rolls etc.
I hope this info helps if you want to modify your Scamp. If not it is a really easy kit to build and a lot of fun to operate. As I wanted a load puller I used to lower end of the recommended gear sets, but it still runs at about 6 to 7 mph which is fast enough for most tracks.
Have fun !
that is the coolest little thing..being a model railroader for a spell, i would love this if i had the acreage
Scamps can run in very small spaces. Have a look at this video ua-cam.com/video/VbdxEZhfP1Q/v-deo.html
I love that mini lister rail loco
Thanks Colin, an excellent video.
That is amazing id love one of those
The best part is that when you're running your train your wife will think you're out mowing the lawn. :-)
Great friends! They come over to work on track so you can ride around on your scamp. Cool!
Not quite right. We are all members of our local club. I provided Scamp and the wagon, another member provided the mini digger BUT we all work to build and maintain the track so that the rest of the club can run their engines.
I LOve Track journey;;;;
Sorry i think I am being dense here, does the loco kit from CMD have everything you need to get these locos running? Do you need to sorce anything else from elsewhere?
The kit from CMD includes all the special laser cut parts, and if you wish as an extra the wheels can be welded to the axles and the sprockets to the layshaft. The rest is a pretty much a nut and bolt job to assemble. The rest of the parts come from a shopping list which Chris or myself can supply, along with a fully illustrated set of instructions. Contact me on colin@colinedmondson.com
The kit I purchased was just the laser cut steel parts, but the wheels and axles were available separately from CMD. The assembly instructions included a full list of all the other parts required to complete the model (petrol engine, electric motors, gears, chains, nuts and bolts, etc.), with nearly everything being available from eBay. If you paint the model yourself you could complete it for well under £2000 (at the time I built mine). But please note that as mentioned in the video I chose to modify my kit, and I had it professionally spray painted (trying to paint outdoors in a British winter never works for me) , so my model did cost me more than £2000.
Just curious, what electric motors and speed control did you use in this build? Specifically, where did you find them?
I used the parts specified on the shopping list that comes with the laser cut steel kit.
Motor and generator are identical 36v 800w from Red Circles Motorcycles and cost £50 each. They are more typically used in mobility scooters.
The speed control was from eBay, search for 12-50V 2000W MAX 40A
PWM DC Controller and costs about £10 but you need to add a reversing switch as the speed control is only that and doesn't offer reverse.
Very, very cool! You've customized that really well! I'm hoping to build my own 7 1/4'' gauge loco soon, can I ask exactly what electric motor you used? It looks like it pulls really well, and the loco I want to build would be similar in size. Thanks for any help.
The drive motor was rated at 36 Volts 800 Watts, but because the petrol engine drove an identical motor used as a dynamo I don't know what voltage was actually being used to run the loco. I bought both motors from NOVA Products (www.novaproducts.co.uk/partsItem.aspx?PartRef=74) and the electronic controller was a 12-50V 2000W Max 40A
Pulse Width Modulated DC Controller (www.ebay.co.uk/itm/12-50V-40A-DC-Motor-Speed-Control-MAX-PWM-RC-Electronic-Controller-2000W-New/264063309383?hash=item3d7b665647:g:~CEAAOSwdHpcIt0t:rk:1:pf:1&frcectupt=true)
Pulling power will depend on the gear ratio you use between the drive motor and the wheels, as well as the wheel diameter. However traction is more important as a powerful loco with poor traction will pull next to nothing, and Scamp does so well because of the weight of the driver being on top of the loco. Sadly I can't give you the gear ratio used on Scamp as I never measured the parts supplied in the kit and simply purchased the axle gear the kit designer recommended for best pulling power.
I hope this helps. Good luck with whatever you create.
I recommend the drive be geared for a top speed of 5mph for maximum pulling power, or10mph for a 'Gentleman's light sporting locomotive'.
On Scamp 29 I used a 26 tooth sprocket and found that with a train weight of over 1 ton and my 13 stone mass on the Scamp the drive wheels would start to slip on dry steel rails just before full power was reached on some of Andover's gradients. However when running "light engine" the Scamp still had a top speed that was more than fast enough, in fact I never ran on a track where full speed felt safe to use.
Thanks for your replies, SmallScaleSteam sorry I never got notified of your first reply so I've only just seen it now. I'm currently deciding between petrol-electric or petrol-hydraulic. Electric would be cheaper (and clearly has enough pulling power as you've demonstrated), but hydraulic should provide more power to the wheels, and use less space. I'm currently drawing up the loco in CAD to see what I can fit in it! I'll let you know if it eventuates to anything, thanks for your help!
I want one
Beautifully functional loco, where did you find the seat stand? Makes it look even more like a mini lister
The seat came from eBay and the stand was my own design. If I remember correctly it was 50x50mm steel box section (3mm wall) with webs cut from 3mm sheet mild steel that all came from my "scrap" metal stock. Having just checked my computer files I must have simply eyeballed it's construction as there are no CAD drawings in my archive. If you are building one I hope you get it built as you desire. They are a fun loco to own either for work or play.
They do look incredibly fun, what sort of noise level does the engine give out? Residential neighbors don’t seem too fond of loud machinery
@@secondvalveservices9856 It wasn't as loud as my lawnmower but they also sell kits for very similar electric machines. Have a look at www.miniature-trains.co.uk/product/imp-laser-cut-kit/
@@SmallScaleSteam that’s good to know, thank you
I go to that train club I am in it
We need more videos of Scamp 29 doing hard work :)
It looked like it took a few revs from the engine before the motor controller responded @ 3:15. I'd love to see a Scamp operate with just the clutch unloaded and loaded. The club I would visit has LONG grades that hit over 3% and dynamic braking would be nice. Or would you feel comfortable riding the brakes for several minutes at a time? Train Mountain in Oregon has over 37 miles of track, some on long grades.
Sadly I no longer own Scamp but that year working with it was amazing.
I didn't use the clutch because a) I found it almost impossible to set up with it either slipping under load or dragging when it should have been disengaged, and b) because in practice it just wasn't needed. I just engaged it when the working day started and disengaged it to remove the belt tension at the end of the day for storage. The revving you noticed was how I drove Scamp. When moving those heavy loads the engine needed about half throttle before the electronic control was opened or the engine would stall. Then it was a case of balancing the engine throttle and electronic control to get the train moving, and if the wheels started to slip on a damp track you had to quickly reduce power and then reapply it once you had regained traction. On one occasion it pulled the ballast waggon half full, plus three other wagons loaded with a generator, welding gear, tools, and 5 people perched onboard. That was about it's limit, but we estimated the total train weight as around two tons. The Wherwell track also has some quite long grades and with that huge load Scamps brakes couldn't cope, so going down hill relied on a couple of the crew operating the brakes on the wagons they were riding. A real team effort !
I guess you could fit a more expensive controller to get dynamic braking but I never had heat problems with my Scamps brakes. What I learnt was that you had to anticipate what you wanted Scamp to do. So if the train weight was high and a steep descent was coming up you got the speed right down before beginning the descent and kept the speed low and under control with Scamps' brakes throughout the descent. The brakes wouldn't slow a heavy train on a descent if you started too fast. On steep climbs you needed to get the speed up before the hill and then if traction was lost very quickly reduce the power and reapply it once traction was regained. Skilful driving would get very heavy loads up quite nasty climbs.
Scamp was always a delight to drive and when the driver worked in unison with Scamp it did prodigious work while rewarding the driver. An engine that like my original Gentoo is sadly much missed.
@@SmallScaleSteam thank you so much for the very detailed reply. Was it an option of putting Scamp in reverse to control speed on a grade?
There was nothing to stop you switching into reverse but the cheap controller I used would probably have been destroyed by the induced voltage / current. I think you would need to fit a much more complex power system to use dynamic braking because the normal Scamp system works (mainly by luck) over the very wide voltage range produced by the motor used as a generator while more expensive controllers expect a pretty stable 12 or 24 volt system.
@@SmallScaleSteam very good points.
If building a Scamp from scratch, I could fit in 2-3 48v 300w dump loads switched in parallel for dynamic brakes.
@@TevisC That would work, and there's plenty of space under the chassis to fit them.
I hope you go ahead with building a Scamp as I'm sure you would enjoy owning one.
Hi Colin. Don’t suppose you remember what colour yellow you used on this loco?
It was RAL 1007.
I wonder how diffuclt it would be to turn this to electrinic only. as well as how powerful it would be.
From various publications it would seem that people have already built electric only versions and CMD Engineering who sell the kit offer 24v battery electric versions with different body styles. That said part of the charm of the Scamp is the mix of petrol engine and electric drive and it gives the driver a lot more to do than just turn a control knob. I would always stick with the petrol electric version for the fun of it.
Where do you actually get scamps from and how much are they?
CMD Engineering sell them, see www.miniature-trains.co.uk/product/miniature-railway-scamp/
From where can i get the layout manual to build this engine from parts on eBay
The plans, etc. are all available from CMD Engineering at www.miniature-trains.co.uk/product/scamp/
I hope your build is successful.
Wtf